Richard, Of course it's silly. But it has absolutely no impact upon my life, city, county, state or country. It's the private affair of a family I don't know in a distant foreign country. I've no idea in the world why Travis posts such things and comes to the absurd conclusion that the entire country of Sweden is somehow a "laughing stock". i think it's simply because his perception of Sweden is that it's a very liberal country and he finds that reason enough to criticize it any way he can think of. Quite bizzare really.
Only thing that counts in my book is whether or not Michael & Amy live happy and productive lives w/o hurting anyone else. On Jun 26, 1:13 pm, RICHARD BROWN <[email protected]> wrote: > Decades ago there was a small book about a child the parents simply > named "X" and they kept the gender secret. The same thing as the > article described happened. At the end they had another child they > named, "Y". It made the point, but the parents were still silly in > the book as well as in this case. But it would be as foolish to judge > the Swedish people for the actions of these parents as it would to > judge Americans because the book was written, published and promoted > in America. > My oldest son was very well behaved and quite good looking. He looks > a lot like Kevin Klien. He did not fight as he had been taught that > violence was not the solution to any problem. He was constantly > mistaken as a female. My youngest daughter was a tom-boy and wore her > hair short and was constantly mistaken as a male. When we visited > Mexico on a trip through a garden, our guide handed out flowers to all > the females. Michael got one but Amy didn't. :-) > Dik > > On Jun 25, 11:56 am, Hollywood <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > Travis, > > > So? > > > On Jun 25, 10:36 am, Travis <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > 2-year old doesn't know if it is a boy or girl. > > > > From: *Travis* > > > Date: Wed, Jun 24, 2009 > > > Subject: Sweden is Laughing-stock > > > > 1. Sweden's welfare state, supported by tax rates of 60+ percent on > > > those > > > of its citizens who actually work, has halted all economic innovation 2. > > > Its > > > immigration policies, coupled with the extremely low fertility rates of > > > Swedish women, have begun to transform drastically Swedish society and > > > culture 3. Immigrant crime rates, particularly in Sweden's third-largest > > > city, Malmö, are staggeringly high. > > > See:http://fjordman.blogspot.com/2005/02/muslim-rape-epidemic-in-sweden-a.... > > > But it's good to see that folks like those described below are raising > > > their > > > children in ways that will help address such public crises Swedish > > > parents > > > keep 2-year-old's gender secret > > > > Published: 23 Jun 09 16:24 CET > > > Online:http://www.thelocal.se/20232/20090623/ > > > > Dictionary tool Double click on a word to get a translation > > > >http://www.thelocal.se/article.php?ID=20232&print=true > > > > Meet Pop, a two-and-a-half-year-old Swedish child whose parents are > > > refusing > > > to say whether the apple of their eye is a boy or a girl. > > > Pop’s parents, both 24, made a decision when their baby was born to keep > > > Pop’s sex a secret. Aside from a select few – those who have changed the > > > child’s diaper – nobody knows Pop’s gender; if anyone enquires, Pop’s > > > parents simply say they don’t disclose this information. > > > > In an interview with newspaper Svenska Dagbladet in March, the parents > > > were > > > quoted saying their decision was rooted in the feminist philosophy that > > > gender is a social construction. > > > > “We want Pop to grow up more freely and avoid being forced into a specific > > > gender mould from the outset,” Pop’s mother said. “It's cruel to bring a > > > child into the world with a blue or pink stamp on their forehead.” > > > > The child's parents said so long as they keep Pop’s gender a secret, he or > > > she will be able to avoid preconceived notions of how people should be > > > treated if male or female. > > > > Pop's wardrobe includes everything from dresses to trousers and Pop's > > > hairstyle changes on a regular basis. And Pop usually decides how Pop is > > > going to dress on a given morning. > > > > Although Pop knows that there are physical differences between a boy and a > > > girl, Pop's parents never use personal pronouns when referring to the > > > child > > > – they just say Pop. > > > > "I believe that the self-confidence and personality that Pop has shaped > > > will > > > remain for a lifetime," said Pop's mother. > > > > But while Pop’s parents say they have received supportive feedback from > > > many > > > of their peers, not everyone agrees that their chosen course of action > > > will > > > have a positive outcome. > > > > “Ignoring children's natures simply doesn’t work,” says Susan Pinker, a > > > psychologist and newspaper columnist from Toronto, Canada, who wrote the > > > book The Sexual Paradox, which focuses on sex differences in the > > > workplace. > > > > “Child-rearing should not be about providing an opportunity to prove an > > > ideological point, but about responding to each child’s needs as an > > > individual,” Pinker tells The Local. > > > > “It’s unlikely that they’ll be able to keep this a secret for long. > > > Children > > > are curious about their own identity, and are likely to gravitate towards > > > others of the same sex during free play time in early childhood.” > > > > Pinker says there are many ways that males and females differ from birth; > > > even if gender is kept ‘secret,’ prenatal hormones developed in the second > > > trimester of pregnancy already alter the way the child behaves and feels. > > > > She says once children can speak, males tell aggressive stories 87 per > > > cent > > > of the time, while females only 17 per cent. In a study, children aged two > > > to four were given a task to work together for a reward, and boys used > > > physical tactics 50 times more than girls, she says. > > > > But Swedish gender equality consultant Kristina Henkel says Pop’s parents' > > > experiment might have positive results. > > > > “If the parents are doing this because they want to create a discussion > > > with > > > other adults about why gender is important, then I think they can make a > > > point of it,” Henkel says in a telephone interview with The Local. > > > > “You can talk about there being a non-stereotypical gender; if you are a > > > girl you can do the same as a boy, and if you’re a boy you can do the same > > > as a girl.” > > > > Henkel also says a child's sex can deeply affect how they are treated > > > growing up, and distract them from simply being a human being. > > > > “If the child is dressed up as a girl or boy, it affects them because > > > people > > > see and treat them in a more gender-typical way,” Henkel explains. > > > > “Girls are told they are cute in their dresses, and boys are told they are > > > cool with their car toys. But if you give them no gender they will be seen > > > more as a human or not a stereotype as a boy or girl.” > > > > She says that without these gender stereotypes, children can build > > > character > > > as individuals, not hindered by preconceived notions of what they should > > > be > > > as males or females. > > > > “I think that can make these kids stronger,” Henkel says. > > > > Anna Nordenström, a paediatric endocrinologist at Karolinska Institutet, > > > says it’s hard to know what effects the parents' decision will have on > > > Pop. > > > > “It will affect the child, but it’s hard to say if it will hurt the > > > child,” > > > says Nordenström, who studies hormonal influences on gender development. > > > > “I don’t know what they are trying to achieve. It’s going to make the > > > child > > > different, make them very special.” > > > > She says if Pop is still ‘genderless’ by the time he or she starts school, > > > Pop will certainly receive a lot of attention from classmates. > > > > “We don’t know exactly what determines sexual identity, but it’s not only > > > sexual upbringing,” says Nordenström. “Gender-typical behaviour, sexual > > > preferences and sexual identity usually go together. There are hormonal > > > and > > > other influences that we don’t know that will determine the gender of the > > > child.” > > > > Both Nordenström and Pinker refer to a controversial case from 1967 when a > > > circumcision left one of two twin brothers without a penis. Dr. John > > > Money, > > > who asserted that gender was learned rather than innate, convinced the > > > parents to raise 'David' as 'Brenda' and the child had cosmetic genitalia > > > reconstruction surgery. > > > > She was raised as a female, with girls’ clothes, games and codes of > > > behaviour. The parents never told Brenda the secret until she was a > > > teenager > > > and rebelled against femininity. She then started receiving testosterone > > > injections and underwent another genetic reconstruction process to become > > > David again. David Reimer denounced the experiment as a crushing failure > > > before committing suicide at the age of 38. > > > > “I don’t think that trying to keep a child’s sex a secret will fool > > > anyone, > > > nor do I think it’s wise or ethical,” says Pinker. “As with any family > > > secret, when we try to keep an elemental truth from children, it usually > > > blows up in the parent’s face, via psychosomatic illness or rebellious > > > behaviour.” > > > > But with a second child on the way, Pop's parents have no plans to change > > > what they see as a winning formula. As for Pop, they say they will only > > > reveal the child's sex when Pop thinks it's time. > > > > *Footnote: Pop is not the child's real name but is the name used in > > > Svenska > > > Dagbladet's interview with the child's parents from March 6th.* > > > > Lydia Parafianowicz ([email protected]) > > > > __,_._,___ > > > > -- > > > *~@):~{> > > > > -- > > > *~@):~{>- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. * Read the latest breaking news, and more. -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
