On 2010-07-21 11:16 AM, Gordan Bobic <gor...@bobich.net> wrote: >> If you want that level of service, upgrade to a service that >> provides it, and that will be at least minimally monitored for >> abuse (it is in the ISPs best interest to avoid getting their IP >> addresses on blacklists).
> Absolute nonsense. There are a lot of people who prefer to run their > own mail servers, and they do so legitimately on residential-grade > lines because they are cheaper than business ones. Ok, so by that argument, if I sign up for entry level cable service, I should then be able to 'demand' their fastest level of service at the same price, or get Pay-Per-View movies for free, just because? Ludicrous... SLAs were created for a reason - and no, just because you have a bicycle does not give you the 'right' to demand unfettered access to the autobahn. > Either way, what you're wishing for isn't going to happen any time soon, > and it's getting off topic. Well, we agree on one thing at least... ;) On 2010-07-21 11:21 AM, Jonathan Tripathy <jon...@abpni.co.uk> wrote: > I pay for a connection to the internet. Provided I don't do anything > illegal, I should be allowed to pass whatever traffic I want on it - > even SMTP traffic. That would depend on the terms of the contract you signed, now wouldn't it. > Blocking outgoing port 25 is not a solution. It completely eliminates the possibility of the connected PC from being an active bot, even if it is compromised. So, you are wrong, it is an incredibly simple and powerful solution to that particular problem. > An example: what if I own an SMTP server somewhere else, and want to > test it from my home one evening? Silly question... what if I have an entry level cable TV account, and want to watch something on Pay-Per-View? By your argument, I should be able to watch it without paying? Sorry, port 25 access should be controlled, this is the only sane solution to the problem of botnets, and as long as ISPs *don't* control it, botnets will continue to be a plague on the internet. > Why should I be forced to use an ISP's mail server to send an email? You aren't. You have the option of paying for port 25 access, or finding an ISP that allows residential customers to individually request and get said access at no extra charge. > But this is getting a bit OT for this list I think. Again, agreed, and this will be my last list post... > Bottom line, ISPs should not block any traffic or any ports. I could say something like 'spoken like a true spammer', but that would be rude - and likely not apply to you anyway, even though it does sound like something a spammer would say. > That doesn't mean they should guarantee any level of uptime or speed Why not? If you believe you have the right to force them to not block any ports, why should the speed or uptime be any different? The bottom line is, internet access is determined by contract, so it all depends on the terms of the contract. > but the actual contents that is passed should not be touched. For 'allowed' traffic, and with the exception of passive monitoring for abusive behavior, I agree completely. > Also, ISP should *never* monitor traffic. Depending on what you mean by 'monitor', I emphatically disagree. > This is a violation of privacy rights, Not according to my definition of 'monitor' - I'm only talking about monitoring behavior and looking for abusive patterns, not examining content. > net neutrality, Irrelevant... > If they monitor traffic, they become liable for everything illegal > that is passed. I think they *should* be liable for all of the botnets spewing filth from their networks - and since I agree they shouldn't be examining *content*, as long as they aren't they wouldn't be liable for it. > At the very least, if an ISP blocks port 25, then a simple phone call > should allow this to be unblocked. If they want to place you in the 'commercial' (for lack of a better word) subnet for free, I have no problem with that. But the *default* for residential service should be to block port 25. Anyway, enough said on the subject, I don't imagine the above will change anyone's mind...
