Hi Bartoz,
I can understand what you mean, but in my experience if people have more
tools they actually tend to learn different things and solve
higher-level problems rather than cease to be challenged.
I used to love programming in assembly code, directly manipulating
registers in the CPU and peripheral chips, and I have great nostalgia
for those days, but why would I re-invent so many superb tools anymore
when other people have done a much better job than I could in so many
areas? I don't stop learning; I just move on to learning more complex
things that might have been too difficult for me before.
There will always be a place for low-level programming. That's one of
the great things, for example, with the Raspberry Pi -- it gets people
back in touch with experimenting again (especially when coupled with
things like pygame), but I think that's a result of exposing the inner
workings. (The big mistake I believe a lot of developers make,
especially in proprietary systems, is hiding the guts so people can't
fiddle with them, and are forced to use only a simplified glossy exterior.)
If people have tools to handle physics, manipulate sprites and tiles,
and to buffer sounds then I don't believe they necessarily become lazy;
it can free them up to tackle more complex problems that previously were
too hard.
Perhaps some people who have a low threshold of frustration will be
attracted to use pygame where before they might have thought it too much
effort for too little result. That encouragement can help to instill
patience in those people.
Best wishes,
- Miriam
On 30/09/14 20:50, Bartosz Debski wrote:
HI Guys,
Please don't get me wrong here but if Pygame will include PyTMX it will
also endorse Tiled as a supported tool ?
I personally I'm slightly against putting such things into Pygame.
Reason being is that peoples (new or not in pygame community) will not
try develop own things or stop to innovate in this field. I'm not saying
those tools are bad in any way but giving more and more tools will make
peoples use the tools and not to come up with own solutions. This leads
long term to attitude and mindset for game creations like Game Maker
style or Unity where eventually there will be no need for any dev skills
to create a game. Creating abstraction layers for peoples to use is
great if you have little development skills but also harms as you are
not trying to understand the mechanics of how stuff works.
Apologies for this random rant and please do not take this personally
but would leave it outside Pygame package.
Cheers
Bart
On Tue, Sep 30, 2014 at 7:17 AM, diliup gabadamudalige
<dili...@gmail.com <mailto:dili...@gmail.com>> wrote:
This is great! There should be more people like you.
I sincerely hope that the maintainers will take the initiative and
do the needful.
Looking forward to a new version of Pygame!
On Tue, Sep 30, 2014 at 12:30 AM, Leif Theden <leif.the...@gmail.com
<mailto:leif.the...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Thanks for the replay. Sorry we weren't able to chat before the
game jam, but I'm in #pygame pretty often, under the nickname
bitcraft.
There are a few projects already using pytmx/pyscroll, and I'll
include a few that I know about.
https://github.com/justinmeister/PyTMX-Examples
http://www.reddit.com/r/pygame/comments/27yzex/getting_started_with_pytmx_making_collideable/
https://github.com/bitcraft/pyscroll/tree/master/tutorial/code
http://www.ludumdare.com/compo/ludum-dare-29/?action=preview&uid=7968
https://github.com/justinmeister/The-Stolen-Crown-RPG
https://github.com/wkmanire/Platakart
https://github.com/wkmanire/PyMunkTMX
https://github.com/bitcraft/pyweek18
https://github.com/fish-face/door-restorer
https://github.com/jamesalbert/FinalTrigger
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HK8Mf-pE1gU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74q1t8UPAes
The quadtree functions might be useful as a part of the sprite
module. It offers reasonably quick collision checking for rects
and rect like objects.
I can contact the people who have used pytmx/pyscroll in the
past and see if the api is adequate.
I realize that pygame hasn't had a release in a while. If the
maintainers of pygame would be willing to include these
libraries, that alone should be enough to publish another
official release. If I could get positive feedback and the
backing of the maintainers, then I don't really mind putting in
the extra effort for documentation and testing.
Pygame is being embraced by the rasberrypi community, and I
think it would reflect well on pygame if that community had more
options for making games on that platform.
On Wed, Sep 24, 2014 at 4:59 AM, René Dudfield <ren...@gmail.com
<mailto:ren...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hello,
Very cool. This has been something many people have asked
for before :)
* Do you know of any other games or examples that are
using them? We'll need at least one example to include
with pygame, and it would be nice if other people can
try out the API and give feedback.
* I think 2.7+ is fine at this point, but it's usually
easy to port to 2.4/2.6+.
* We'll need to figure out where internal parts like
Quadtree go. Do we keep them private or make them
publicly available?
* For testing, it would be good if at least every method
is tested. 100% coverage tested is not necessary but nice.
* There needs to be documentation for every public method.
* The other documentation that would be good is a tutorial
in how to use it.
Maybe we could organise a mini sprint to discuss things?
Otherwise we can go over each part on the mailing list.
I'll be at this game jam thing on Saturday doing pygame
things, and perhaps we can meet then on irc to discuss? If
you want to do this, then I could work on a little game
using your libraries to get a feel for them then too.
http://www.berlinminijam.de/2014/09/next-game-jam-announcement-september.html
It's probably a good idea to discuss the API, and get
feedback with a few people on how it could be made more
usable before we go ahead and write lots of
documentation/tests/etc for it.
Of course, pygame hasn't done a release for a while. So you
may want to take that into consideration before embarking on
all this work.
cu.
On Fri, Sep 19, 2014 at 6:10 PM, Leif Theden
<leif.the...@gmail.com <mailto:leif.the...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Any specific reason for targeting python 2.4?... It's
ten years old. Currently, it is tested again 2.7 and
3.3, but I can't think of any reasons why 2.6 wouldn't
work. As for 2.4, there might be some issues with the
generator syntax. Its been a long time since I've used 2.4.
On Fri, Sep 19, 2014 at 6:06 AM, Jason Marshall
<j...@yahoo.com <mailto:j...@yahoo.com>> wrote:
How difficult would it be to make the code
compatible with Python 2.4+?
Jason
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From: * Jason Marshall <j...@yahoo.com
<mailto:j...@yahoo.com>>;
*To: * pygame-users@seul.org
<mailto:pygame-users@seul.org>
<pygame-users@seul.org <mailto:pygame-users@seul.org>>;
*Subject: * Re: [pygame] TMX support in pygame
*Sent: * Thu, Sep 18, 2014 11:48:26 AM
I haven't used your tools myself, but if they really
work well and have a tutorial and good
documentation, then I'm in favor of adding them.
Batteries included!
Thanks,
Jason
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* Leif Theden <leif.the...@gmail.com
<mailto:leif.the...@gmail.com>>
*To:* pygame-users@seul.org
<mailto:pygame-users@seul.org>
*Sent:* Monday, September 15, 2014 11:51 AM
*Subject:* [pygame] TMX support in pygame
Hello everyone!
I'm a long time user of pygame and active member of
#pygame under the handle bitcraft. I help many
people who stumble into the channel to build their
first game in pygame. I've also released and
maintain a couple small libraries PyTMX and Pyscroll
to help new users develop using the Tiled Map Editor.
https://github.com/bitcraft/PyTMX
https://github.com/bitcraft/pyscroll
The Tiled Map Editor is widely known in the indie
game community and many popular game development
ecosystems include out-of-the-box support for it,
including pyglet, cocos2d-x, allegro5, libgdx, and
many others.
I am confident that PyGame will benefit from a TMX
loader that it is integrated into the core and
documented on pygame.org <http://pygame.org/>.
As maintainer of PyTMX and pyscroll, I would like to
nominate these projects to be integrated into the
pygame core. They both support python 2.7 and 3.3+
and I have tried to make them feel like native
pygame libraries; and they even work well with the
spite/group concept. The only library that it
depends on outside of the python standard lib is the
six module.
There are of other loaders available as well, and I
will list them as well for the consideration of the
pygame core developers. My apologies if I have
overlooked another tiled TMX map format project.
http://www.pygame.org/project/1158/
http://pytmxlib.readthedocs.org/en/v0.1.0/
https://bitbucket.org/r1chardj0n3s/pygame-tutorial/src/a383dd24790d/tmx.py
https://github.com/renfredxh/tmx
Thank you everyone and I look forward to hearing
your comments.
--
Diliup Gabadamudalige
http://www.diliupg.com
http://soft.diliupg.com/
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--
If you don't have any failures then you're not trying hard enough.
- Dr. Charles Elachi, director of NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory
-----
Website: http://miriam-english.org
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