While obsessing over tubing thickness I came across this amazing resource linked in the archived message below: Bay Area: Measuring frame tubing at the Box Dog Bikes party on Saturday! (google.com) <https://groups.google.com/g/rbw-owners-bunch/c/Q2ibCKM5_Ns/m/cYdoi5ugCAAJ>
It even has the 1972 Bottecchia listed! Wow, Reed you are my hero! This is fascinating!! On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 3:07:31 PM UTC-4 Yankeebird wrote: > It's not that I don't absolutely love my Cheviot, I do! But those guys at > WC are so good it came out of the box absolutely perfect with no tinkering > required. I didn't even have to change the stem. They nailed it. I kind of > liked messing around with my Cross Check and swapping things and out. Also, > the Cheviot rides like a steamship, so smooth, so quiet, so stately. I > wouldn't mind a bike with some zip, I can lean into a carve and put the > hammer down and feel the steed leap away out from under me. That would be > fun too, and messing around with parts and stuff. > > I'm not even a big bike guy, I get my hands plenty filthy in other > hobbies, but there's just something about it. > > On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 3:03:23 PM UTC-4 Yankeebird wrote: > >> Oh man another rabbit hole for me to get lost in. >> >> This thread has really gone above and beyond expectations. I have gone >> done so many slippery slopes into endless possibilities! >> >> So many beautiful bikes too! >> >> On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 1:27:54 PM UTC-4 Dave S wrote: >> >>> >>> How about the early 80's Schwinn Super Sport SP? They're not easy to >>> find but it has some pretty decent clearances and is also fairly light(ish). >>> >>> Dave in NJ >>> >>> On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 1:09:36 PM UTC-4 Mike Godwin wrote: >>> >>>> Hi Kurt >>>> >>>> I guess you can shrink the herd by sending me the smidge too large >>>> Bottechia. >>>> >>>> Mike SLO CA >>>> On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 7:30:19 AM UTC-7 Paul Brodek wrote: >>>> >>>>> "Old is Good" >>>>> http://bikeretrogrouch.blogspot.com/2014/01/classic-tubes-columbus.html >>>>> >>>>> Paul Brodek >>>>> Hillsdale, NJ USA >>>>> On Mon, Oct 4, 2021 at 9:52 AM Benjamin Park <benjami...@gmail.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Kurt, can you educate me as to the "rifling" in the steerer tube- >>>>>> what is it, and is this characteristic of Columbus tubing? Also, what is >>>>>> "SP"? >>>>>> >>>>>> On Friday, October 1, 2021 at 10:33:12 PM UTC-4 Kurt Henry wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I'm very late to the game, as I can't seem to reply from my phone in >>>>>>> the current version of google groups. I had to drag out my laptop. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I've attached a lousy picture of my Bottecchia from shortly before I >>>>>>> finished putting it together. I bought it as a frame and fork from >>>>>>> Dale >>>>>>> over on CR. He thought it was a Giro d'Italia or Professional, though >>>>>>> possibly a different year than the catalog. I can feel the rifling in >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> steerer so will buy the Columbus tubing. But it's a taller frame (for >>>>>>> me) >>>>>>> at 60cm ctt and uses a 27.0 seatpost, so presumably some SP mixed in. >>>>>>> It's >>>>>>> a great ride, and an answer to a question I posed to the list a few >>>>>>> years >>>>>>> ago about the rarity of Columbus tubed bikes with clearance for sizable >>>>>>> tires plus eyelets for fenders. Yes, they exist! I have Challenge >>>>>>> Strada >>>>>>> Biancas (700X30) on it with plenty of room. I don't ride it that much, >>>>>>> though, as it's just a smidge big for me. If someone runs across a way >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> shrink frames, please feel free to call me. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Kurt Henry >>>>>>> Lancaster, PA >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Monday, September 20, 2021 at 1:53:59 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Oh! Please post photos of your Bottechia. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mon, Sep 20, 2021 at 11:52 AM Patrick Moore <bert...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Come to think of it, I temporarily resolved the too-small frame >>>>>>>>> with a custom Salsa upjutter quill stem. Wonder where that stem went. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mon, Sep 20, 2021 at 11:51 AM Patrick Moore <bert...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> A Bottechia Fellow Traveller! Yes, now that you mention it, my >>>>>>>>>> 1966 felt smooth, and I daresay this was a result of (1) the >>>>>>>>>> standard-gauge >>>>>>>>>> tubing, (2) non-excessively-thick tube walls, and (3) the relatively >>>>>>>>>> (relative to post-1980s-crit-geom frames) lax and loose geometry. I >>>>>>>>>> road >>>>>>>>>> it, IIRC, with Ritchey 700C X 28 or 30 tires, nothing special, and >>>>>>>>>> still, >>>>>>>>>> it felt smooth. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Model-non-specific Columbus tubing, and I forget what the rear OL >>>>>>>>>> was, but I built mine as a ss fixed, so the OL could have been >>>>>>>>>> anything >>>>>>>>>> from 116 to 120. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I build mine with the original moustache bar and used it as a >>>>>>>>>> beater commuter, albeit as a very *nice* beater commuter. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> But alas! it was a size or so too small -- 56 c-c st and tt, >>>>>>>>>> where I should have a 60X56 c-c, so I sold it on. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Sep 20, 2021 at 11:39 AM Benjamin Park < >>>>>>>>>> benjami...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I have that same Bottecchia (albeit I think mine is a bit newer, >>>>>>>>>>> probably 1972). I ride it all the time- it makes a great road bike! >>>>>>>>>>> Columbus tubing is so smooth. I put a front rack and it's my little >>>>>>>>>>> rando >>>>>>>>>>> bike. Actually does ok with the weight of a front bag. I have some >>>>>>>>>>> RH 32s >>>>>>>>>>> on it but agree it could take 35s. 116mm rear spacing is a bummer >>>>>>>>>>> though! >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Thursday, September 16, 2021 at 3:08:48 PM UTC-4 Patrick >>>>>>>>>>> Moore wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> If you want road bike fit and handling with big tire clearance, >>>>>>>>>>>> look for some of the old road racing frames from the 1970s and >>>>>>>>>>>> even 1960s, >>>>>>>>>>>> if you can find any. My former 1973 Motobecane Grand Record was >>>>>>>>>>>> very light >>>>>>>>>>>> (much lighter tubing than Rivendells, except perhaps the Roadeo >>>>>>>>>>>> and the >>>>>>>>>>>> Legolas; all 531) yet had clearance for 35s at least without >>>>>>>>>>>> fenders. Ditto >>>>>>>>>>>> for the 1966 Bottechia Campione del Mondo that I owned earlier: >>>>>>>>>>>> easily room >>>>>>>>>>>> for 35s at least and probably 37s. There's one on Ebay now; see >>>>>>>>>>>> attached >>>>>>>>>>>> photo. (300 Euros, but alas in Italy.) >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> The early 1970s Libertas frame that is now hanging on the wall >>>>>>>>>>>> waiting for a build is even lighter and has more clearance; my >>>>>>>>>>>> brother said >>>>>>>>>>>> he got 37s-38s in his; and mine -- 60 X 56 c-c -- weighs**5.9 lb** >>>>>>>>>>>> in this >>>>>>>>>>>> large size; that's frame and fork *and* steel Campy headset. >>>>>>>>>>>> (The Libertas has a reputation for nice handling, too.) My brother >>>>>>>>>>>> (last >>>>>>>>>>>> count 26 bikes -- that he remembers, and this after divesting >>>>>>>>>>>> himself of >>>>>>>>>>>> many others -- has owned many ~50 year old steel road frames that >>>>>>>>>>>> took >>>>>>>>>>>> 35-38 mm tires, >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> My former blue-edition Rambouillet took 32s (about 31 mm actual >>>>>>>>>>>> IIRC) with fenders, and could probably have taken 35s without >>>>>>>>>>>> under normal >>>>>>>>>>>> reach single pivots. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Sep 16, 2021 at 12:41 PM st nick <trueg...@att.net> >>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I recently let a 1986 Schwinn Passage go to a new owner after >>>>>>>>>>>>> enjoying a lot for around 3 years. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> The only reason I did sell it was because I bought a Sam >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hillbourne about a year ago and have been riding it more. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I think the Columbus Tenax tubing of which the Passage is made >>>>>>>>>>>>> is pretty good stuff. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On my 23" Passage frame I squeezed in 700x40 tires with >>>>>>>>>>>>> perhaps 2 mm clearance on each side in the rear with no problems >>>>>>>>>>>>> with true >>>>>>>>>>>>> wheels. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> The other touring bikes mentioned also might suit your needs. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I've had a Specialized Expedition, >>>>>>>>>>>>> Miyata 610, Miyata 1000, Nishiki Cresta, Nishiki >>>>>>>>>>>>> International, and a custom touring bike. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't think from my experience the Passage gave up much to >>>>>>>>>>>>> them in riding performance or feel or whatever. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> It had fewer braze on bosses than some touring models but >>>>>>>>>>>>> rode terrific. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> The cantilever posts are a bit more narrow and would not >>>>>>>>>>>>> accept some cantilever brakes but I just used the Dia Compe >>>>>>>>>>>>> original >>>>>>>>>>>>> cantilevers with higher quality pads and I thought they stopped >>>>>>>>>>>>> quite >>>>>>>>>>>>> adequately. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Good luck with your search. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> The past two weeks I've been tinkering with a 1982, I think, >>>>>>>>>>>>> 24" Puch Austro Daimler Vent Noir Reynolds 531 frame with the >>>>>>>>>>>>> smoked chrome finish. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I can fit Jack Brown 700x 33.3 in the rear no problem. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Non original fork , I don't care for, >>>>>>>>>>>>> however will only take a 32. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm searching for a chrome replacement fork. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Good luck with your search. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Paul in Dallas >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>>>>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from >>>>>>>>>>>>> it, send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/871769148.1269629.1631817690897%40mail.yahoo.com >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/871769148.1269629.1631817690897%40mail.yahoo.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>>> Patrick Moore >>>>>>>>>>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis >>>>>>>>>>>> Terrarum >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from >>>>>>>>>>> it, send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/0eb096a4-0024-496f-bfcb-ae9b31835279n%40googlegroups.com >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/0eb096a4-0024-496f-bfcb-ae9b31835279n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>> Patrick Moore >>>>>>>>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>> Patrick Moore >>>>>>>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>> Patrick Moore >>>>>>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>> >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the >>>>>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/YK4oqKcC83c/unsubscribe >>>>>> . >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >>>>>> rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/c3553fb7-c620-4f9b-8dc4-870b3dd70f6fn%40googlegroups.com >>>>>> >>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/c3553fb7-c620-4f9b-8dc4-870b3dd70f6fn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>> . >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Paul Brodek >>>>> Hillsdale, NJ USA >>>>> >>>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/4a5416b8-05fd-476d-8134-97a96b13eecfn%40googlegroups.com.
