Thanks for all the recommendations, I've been reading the thread and looking some of these up online. Some are expensive, and a few harder to source in Canada. But some good options and considerations.
This morning was around 8C and I rode with a mid-weight wool l/s base layer and a thin, wind jacket. That was perfect. I know better what I'm looking for, something for around 0-5C. My winter jacket definitely too warm. My thin jacket can work with two base layers (thin + med or thick). I'm not going to spend a lot on this, but will look around based on above. On Saturday, March 7, 2026 at 2:15:52 PM UTC-5 [email protected] wrote: > Seven Mesh says to wash & dry frequently to preserve Gore & it’s unique > (?) qualities. Works for me so far. The Search & State is a different > animal. It’s a luxurious fabric for synthetic & it does breath to a point. > As it has no zippered vents it can get too hot. On the topic of possibly > adding nylon panels to a wool garment - just get a nice vest? I’ve > considered this often. But it always seems if it’s cold enough for a vest I > need the sleeves too.:) > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 7, 2026, at 9:13 AM, Robert Blunt <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > I have had great success with the Patagonia Dirt Roamer jacket, now called > the Trailcraft jacket. It has a pretty unique ability to both lock in the > right amount of heat and shed heat during more intense efforts. > Rob Blunt > Pennington, NJ > > On Sat, Mar 7, 2026 at 8:03 AM Garth <[email protected]> wrote: > >> I forgot to add, if you sweat too much with these types of wind barrier >> jackets you have too much insulation underneath. If even a thin baselayer >> is too much, then that's just not the right jacket for the conditions. >> Note, the Sportful ones I wear are made mostly with Gore Infinium, which is >> not like the windstopper of old. One is made of Polartec Neoshell. The >> barrier adds some natural water resistance, but would eventually wet out in >> prolonged rain. That's not the point of these jackets though, even if you >> get wet inside, you won't get a wind chill because the wind is not able to >> pass through. There's a delicate balance of finding what works for each >> person in terms of heat retention and vapor release. There just isn't a >> magic garment that will mimic a 75 degree sunny day with a light breeze, so >> just do the best you can. >> >> One thing of note, is my favorite types of these garments is the short >> sleeve variety. Like a wind vest, but the short sleeves. I even have a SS >> version made with the Neoshell. These are by far the most versatile >> jacket/jerseys I've ever had. They serve as both jacket and jersey. Pair >> them with arm warmers if needed. It seems Americans don't embrace these >> garments so much though, as I don't know of any manufacturers here than >> make them. It's all European companies. That Voler thermal jacket in short >> sleeves, or the wind vest with short sleeves, would be awesome. >> >> Voler also offers free return shipping even if you wear the garment, or >> they did, I'm not sure as I have not checked lately. That's pretty good to >> encourage people to try their stuff. The garments I have from them are >> stitched and finished impeccably, made by them in central CA. >> On Friday, March 6, 2026 at 9:51:00 PM UTC-5 Garth wrote: >> >>> While I don't own that particular jacket Patrick, my experience is with >>> like principled jackets from Sportful. As I mentioned earlier, these >>> jackets are more of all-in-one type garments. A out facing fabric of some >>> sort bonded to wind barrier and a thin fleece lining, with various highly >>> breathable fleece panels on the side of the torso, or on the back, or in >>> the case of Sportful even the underside of the sleeves. With these you >>> don't need to wear multiple jerseys, usually just a warm baselayer is good >>> down to freezing on the warmest jackets. Some that have the fleece back are >>> for more modest cold. This system works for me because I'm most sensitive >>> to the effect of wind blowing over sweat. What these jackets do is create a >>> relatively stable climate next to the skin without being whisked away by >>> the cold wind. I'm someone who sweats very easily, even in the coldest of >>> cold, and I also take chill easily. Some people are not however. If you're >>> unaffected by the wind blowing over sweat then you'd be better of sticking >>> with what you know. >>> >>> I had tried most every non-laminated/coated windbreaker type jacket and >>> vest with a thick jersey and baselayer over the years, but I found they let >>> in too much air or I'd overheat and had to stop and take something off, and >>> freeze while I'm doing it. Now I never have to take the jacket off. I can't >>> speak to any sweat and body oils affecting these jackets. Maybe a >>> traditional 2/3 layer Goretex fabric was prone to that, I cant say. I think >>> it's a case by case thing as there's too many variables to lump all 3-layer >>> fabrics into one box of failures. Not everyone washes their clothing >>> properly either. >>> >>> As for Voler sizing on a given garment, I'd suggest emailing them and >>> asking for the actual garment measurements, and they'll get back to you in >>> a few days with them. In general they do seem to be very regular American >>> sizing, which to me means slightly oversized. I would suspect a medium in >>> the jacket if good for you, as it's called an "adaptive fit", which for >>> them would be in between club/loose and race/form fitting. >>> On Friday, March 6, 2026 at 1:19:43 PM UTC-5 [email protected] wrote: >>> >>>> I should have said: ~160, 6-foot+ torso (5'11' Asian buld). >>>> >>>> >>>> On Fri, Mar 6, 2026 at 11:15 AM Patrick Moore <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> ... 1. Sizing. For for someone who has a long torso and weighs ~160 >>>>> ... >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Fri, Mar 6, 2026 at 11:15 AM Patrick Moore <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Garth: Would you mind answering a couple of questions about that Voler >>>>> jacket? (Richard Rose and others, please chime in too.) >>>>> >>>>> https://store.voler.com/products/1010p12?variant=45399184703678 >>>>> >>>>> 1. Sizing. For for someone who has a long torso and weighs ~160, the >>>>> chart would indicate the Med, but if you want to wear it over 1 or 2 >>>>> normal >>>>> weight wool jerseys (I wear Wabi Sports jerseys) without things getting >>>>> too >>>>> tight, would a L or even XL be better? For the record, for cold weather >>>>> LS >>>>> jerseys I wear Wabi Large Longs, which are snug but not tight, and for >>>>> summer where I want a looser fit, I have a Wabi XL but standard and not >>>>> Long cut. >>>>> >>>>> 2. Wind blocking and breathing: does the fabric really breath >>>>> effectively, as wool does, while still acting as a wind barrier? >>>>> >>>>> 3. Durability: does the breathing performance last the life of the >>>>> garment? I've read that pretty quickly Gore and other breathable fabrics >>>>> get "blocked" by bodily residues left by transpiration. >>>>> >>>>> One reason that I like the old knit wool + nylon panels is that wool >>>>> breaths very well and nylon panels in the right places block wind very >>>>> well >>>>> and the right combination prevents sweating while also blocking heat loss >>>>> from wind on torso and arms, and there's no delicate technology to make >>>>> things stop working after a few years. >>>>> >>>>> I have a wonderful heavy knit merino wool sweater, high zip-up neck, >>>>> extended tail, very long arms, from Varusteleka. Perhaps I should have a >>>>> tailor sew nylon panels onto front torso and arms. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2026 at 6:12 AM Garth <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Having tried all sort of combos of wind jacket/vests and various >>>>>> layers underneath, I now much prefer wearing the modern cycling jackets >>>>>> that are really a hybrid jacket/jersey in one garment. While my needs >>>>>> are >>>>>> served by Sportful and their brilliant Fiandre line that use highly >>>>>> breathable Gore Infinium proprietary fabrics, I otherwise would try a >>>>>> Voler >>>>>> Thermal and/or Wind jacket/vests. These these have a combo of wind >>>>>> resistant panels(w/bonded fleece on the thermal) and stretchy highly >>>>>> breathable panels. Plus 2-way zippers. They have a 30 day wear and try >>>>>> return policy also. The thermal is a fitted jacket, meaning it's meant >>>>>> to >>>>>> drape over you without being too tight or baggy, room for some layering >>>>>> underneath if needed. I find though with such jackets though a single >>>>>> baselayer shirt of varying warmths work best to maintain a constant core >>>>>> temp without overheating. Even if you do briefly, unzip it just a little >>>>>> for a brief stint. This is where 2-way zippers are awesome ! I would say >>>>>> the thermal jacket is for about freezing to about 60F, depending on >>>>>> what's >>>>>> underneath. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> https://store.voler.com/products/1010p11? >>>>>> On Monday, March 2, 2026 at 1:15:40 AM UTC-5 Robert Tilley wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Mission Workshop sold something like that called the Mission >>>>>>> Cardigan. It was merino wool and had a windproof front on the torso. It >>>>>>> was >>>>>>> disappointing that the sleeves were all merino and had no windproofing >>>>>>> on >>>>>>> them. This shows what it looked like: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> milled.com >>>>>>> <https://milled.com/mission-workshop/new-mission-cardigan-mission-workshop-z1A2jzSauYv0GyK9> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> <https://milled.com/mission-workshop/new-mission-cardigan-mission-workshop-z1A2jzSauYv0GyK9> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> <https://milled.com/mission-workshop/new-mission-cardigan-mission-workshop-z1A2jzSauYv0GyK9> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The pre-resurrection Ibex had the Breakaway jacket which was >>>>>>> perfect. Decently heavy merino with windproof front. I have two still. >>>>>>> One >>>>>>> in use and one in the stash. My favorite cycling jacket of all time. >>>>>>> Arc’Teryx made a similar jacket in their commuter line which was close >>>>>>> but >>>>>>> not quite as nice. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Robert Tilley >>>>>>> San Diego, CA >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 1, 2026, at 2:37 PM, Patrick Moore <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I generally layer wool under a wind shell of greater or less >>>>>>> thickness depending on the temp, wind, and presence of absence of the >>>>>>> sun >>>>>>> (35* air temp on shaded front porch at 8:30 am and shirt sleeves on >>>>>>> back >>>>>>> porch in full morning sun at 5K feet), and with my very lightly lined >>>>>>> Leatt >>>>>>> shell I had pit zips installed so that it’s good over layers from 18*F >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> (remove layers to single wool jersey) 60*F with neck and pits open. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> But what I’d really like to find is one of those old-fashioned heavy >>>>>>> knit wool zip up jackets with nylon wind panels on the front and the >>>>>>> front >>>>>>> of the arms, leaving the backs open for ventilation through the wool >>>>>>> fabric. Those are IME truly the best of both worlds: very warm, but >>>>>>> very >>>>>>> breathable. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Someone very kindly gave me an Italian one that he’d bought in the >>>>>>> 1980s, but it’s too short — I have a 6’2” torso on a 5’8” width, and >>>>>>> this >>>>>>> is cut for a fat Italian. Does anyone know where to find such >>>>>>> old-fashioned >>>>>>> wool knit + nylon wind panel jackets? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Sat, Feb 28, 2026 at 5:21 PM Jay <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> In anticipation of spring, or at least riding in above 0C >>>>>>>> temperatures, I'm looking for a new mid-weight jacket. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> My winter jacket is Gore, it's very warm. My current mid-weight >>>>>>>> jacket is screaming-yellow, some Italian brand I can't recall, but it >>>>>>>> has >>>>>>>> zero breathability. It's good for single-digit (Celsius) temps, but I >>>>>>>> sweat a lot inside the jacket and eventually get cold. I have a thin >>>>>>>> wind >>>>>>>> jacket I can wear around 5C+ with sufficient base layers, and it >>>>>>>> breathes >>>>>>>> better. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I'm looking for something between the warm Gore jacket and the wind >>>>>>>> jacket. Would like some wind resistance (on the front) and some >>>>>>>> breathability. Not racing-tight fit, but not baggie either. I don't >>>>>>>> have >>>>>>>> any non-cycling jackets that fit the bill. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>>> To view this discussion visit >>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/e07be37b-a426-413c-a85d-0c791b9c967an%40googlegroups.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/e07be37b-a426-413c-a85d-0c791b9c967an%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Patrick Moore >>>>>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other >>>>>>> writing services >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>> >>>>>>> *When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,* >>>>>>> >>>>>>> *But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,* >>>>>>> >>>>>>> *I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.* >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> To view this discussion visit >>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CALuTfguM7j7HdP-3mUnEcm8fbd_f0kVCJZpsBDpQkgpQwUMdXQ%40mail.gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CALuTfguM7j7HdP-3mUnEcm8fbd_f0kVCJZpsBDpQkgpQwUMdXQ%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>> . >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>> To view this discussion visit >>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/e7c3674e-1a5e-4bea-8972-e5e3e14e0640n%40googlegroups.com >>>>>> >>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/e7c3674e-1a5e-4bea-8972-e5e3e14e0640n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>> . >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> >>>>> Patrick Moore >>>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> >>>>> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other >>>>> writing services >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> >>>>> *When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,* >>>>> >>>>> *But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,* >>>>> >>>>> *I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.* >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> >>>> Patrick Moore >>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing >>>> services >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> *When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,* >>>> >>>> *But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,* >>>> >>>> *I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.* >>>> >>> -- >> You received this message because 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