You are right. I have had enough of Bochco. It's not that he is bad, but it is the same thing over and over with a new setting and characters. I cannot even bring myself to watch his TNT legal show even though it has a great cast.
-----Original Message----- From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Kelwyn Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 10:10 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Megan Fox's Scary Box Office Problem Add to what Keith said the fact that the show's creator, Rob Lurie, was dethroned as Executive Producer (allegedly because he was overwhelmed as a "rookie" show runner and having trouble delivering shows on time - even though Lurie had run shows before) and replaced by Steven Bochco - who proceeded to Bochco up the show - which is exactly what ABC wanted but the last thing fans of the show wanted. ~(no)rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Keith Johnson <keithbjohn...@...> wrote: > > If I remember correctly, the ratings came out really high, then they fell > off. I think this was one of those shows where only a few shows were ordered > up front, which didn't help. I believe it was pre-empted and moved a couple > of times, which didn't help. And, i believe the new trend of micro-analyzing > viewer numbers hurt it. > Remember the days when new series got a whole *season* to succeed or fail? > When a show got 26 or 28 eps in a season, instead of maybe 4 - 6 as a trial > run? When ratings where averaged for an entire season, not broken down into > this new method where a show's rating's from the first to second half of one > airing are measured?! > That's what killed this show. Yeah, the ratings dipped, but with some > committment it could have found its legs. About 19 total eps were aired, but > once the ratings dipped, the network was obviously skittish about it. We've > discussed this time and time again, but think of all the great shows that > we'd never have had if networks had cancelled them after bad ratings in the > first few weeks. > > As an aside, I wonder if the show would do better now, just a few years > later? I note that Davis' character only became President because she was the > Veep and rose to office after the (male) President died. I seem to remember > some of the politicians--men--expecting her to step down. As late as 2005, it > was seen as a long shot that a woman could ascend to the White House just by > being elected, or garner respect if she did. Then came Hillary, Obama, and > Palin. Now, the thought of a woman or a person of color in the White House > isn't a fantasy (I contend, despite the way some women lost their minds in > rage at Obama defeating Clinton, that his success opens the doors for women > as well as men of color, and I don't know if the reverse would have been > true). > Now we're in a new world, a world where not only can we seriously consider a > female President, but some actually consider giving it to a dangerous, > idiotic waste like Palin. That's progress, I guess, but I think now the show > would do a bit better. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Tracey de Morsella" <tdli...@...> > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Thursday, October 8, 2009 12:42:23 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Megan Fox's Scary Box Office Problem > > > > > > > > > > You are bringing back memories and making me cry. I lived in Mexico at the > time, but had visited for two weeks during the premier. I thought it was a > hit when I left. What did ABC do to take it down? > > > > > > From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Keith Johnson > Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 8:50 PM > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Megan Fox's Scary Box Office Problem > > > > > > > > > > I was delighted to see Kyle Secor--Bayliss from the fantastic series > "Homicide"--in the role as Davis' husband. > Another underrated, underused actor... > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kelwyn" <ravena...@...> > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wednesday, October 7, 2009 9:44:35 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Megan Fox's Scary Box Office Problem > > > > > > > I loved "Commander in Chief." I also think it is criminal how ABC mishandled > it - firing the creator and original producer - and let it die. Harry Lennix > was excellent as her chief of staff. > > ~(no)rave! > > --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Martin Baxter <truthseeker013@> wrote: > > > > > > rave, don't forget that Geena played a female President in the brief series > > "Commander in Chief". > > > > "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in > > bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant > > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik > > > > > > > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > > From: ravenadal@ > > Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2009 15:05:33 +0000 > > Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Megan Fox's Scary Box Office Problem > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for the Gena Davis. Ms. Davis is strong and beautiful and her > > then husband, Renny Harlin, sought to showcase her as a kick-ass heroine in > > back-to-back movies: "Cutthroat Island" and "The Long Kiss Goodnight"). > > "The Long Kiss Goodnight" is a great movie but both it and "Cutthroat" were > > box office bombs. > > > > > > > > ~(no)rave! > > > > > > > > --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , "Tracey de Morsella" <tdlists@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > You misread my statement. While I do not discount those stats, that was > > > not what I was talking about. Women see famous beautiful women as people > > > they strive to look like and often they seek to act like the characters > > > they play. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For example, when I was younger, I saw Gena Davis with Samuel Jackson in > > > â€Å"the long kiss goodnight� She was an > > > assassin who had amnesia and became a wife, mother and school teacher. > > > She hit her head and became a mother/assassin protecting her own. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I thought she was soooooooo coooool!!!!!!!!! But I’m not > > > specifically attracted to Gena Davis. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Another example of a kick ass broad character I just Love is the Bride in > > > Kill Bill, but again, its not specifically about Uma > > > Thurman’s sexual appeal, I do not think she is aging > > > that well or that do a bad hair and make-up job on her, but I would love > > > to have that crazy eight outfit she wore when she took down the all those > > > guys with swords. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I see a trend, I think I love kiss Ass Broad Assasin’s/ > > > turned mother characters. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, I’m not discounting the sexual interest theory > > > you raised, I just not referring specifically to it. That being said, > > > I’m sure there are tons of women attracted to Megan Fox, > > > but I seriously doubt they would have been drawn to her in those promos > > > that made her ugly. They needed to let the audience in on the satire > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com ] On > > > Behalf Of Mr. Worf > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2009 4:33 PM > > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > > > > > Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Megan Fox's Scary Box Office Problem > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is starting to sound like a post on the Kinsey surveys. :) About 45% > > > of women say that they are attracted to other women but only about 25% > > > act on it. I would suspect that it is the same for men too. > > > > > > > > > > I have several female friends that love horror movies. I lost interest in > > > them a long time ago. > > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 4:59 AM, Martin Baxter <truthseeker013@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tracey, I agree with you. Many of the women I know have expressed serious > > > attractions toward women they consider to be the epitome of beauty. > > > > > > > > > > As for your wordrobe, no one's laughing. I'll wager that several of the > > > gents here are hoping for posted images. > > > > > > > > > > "If all the world's a stage and all the people merely players, who in > > > bloody hell hired the director?" -- Charles L Grant > > > > > > > > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQUxw9aUVik > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > > > > > From: tdlists@ > > > > > Date: Mon, 5 Oct 2009 22:38:38 -0700 > > > > > Subject: RE: [scifinoir2] Re: Megan Fox's Scary Box Office Problem > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What about Ann Margaret, Ava Gardner, Marilyn Monroe, Angelina Jolie ( > > > > > before the Anorexia), J-Lo, the blond from Grey's Anatomy, Katherine > > > Heigl, > > > > > Sophia Loren, Scarlett Johansson, Natalie Portman, Jessica Biel > > > > > > > > > > All of them have been in hits I believe and are considered sexy > > > > > > > > > > Are you saying women reject sexy women. I think we seek to be them. I do > > > > > not think the jealousy factor is at work here. I used to love movies with > > > > > Hot Kick Ass Broads because I wanted to be one. I was taking notes, I was > > > > > buying bustiers, leathers skirts and thigh high boots. (back in the day, > > > > > those things were in okay, so stop laughing. > > > > > > > > > > I will probably check out Jennifer's Body on DVD, but my sense is it was > > > > > poorly marketed. Fox has some image problems than include she is nothing > > > > > but a body and then she star's in a movie called Jennifer's body in which > > > > > the previews do not reveal that it is a comedy. Some decided to sell in > > > the > > > > > previews a pure slasher horror. If I had not read the reviews, I would > > > have > > > > > thought that she decided to play up that she is nothing but a body. > > > > > Regarding young guys.. none of the previews showed her looking appealing, > > > > > but instead as an exaggerated terrifying her that looked like she might > > > > > bite off a guys important part. I knew someone who edited a > > > forum/penthouse > > > > > letters publication once, and stuff like was considered a no-no when it > > > came > > > > > to targeting mainstream males. She did not look sexy in the previews, and > > > > > the previews is what people use to determine whether to go see it. If I > > > > > were a young guy who thought she was hot, I would have popped in a > > > > > transformers DVD instead, based on those previews > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com ] On > > > > > Behalf Of Kelwyn > > > > > Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 9:32 PM > > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > > > > > Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Megan Fox's Scary Box Office Problem > > > > > > > > > > I defy you to name a Racquel Welch helmed hit (excluding her first, "One > > > > > Million Years B.C."). Pam Grier was used and abused (raped and beaten > > > up)in > > > > > all her movies before she was allowed to kick triumphant butt. Liz Taylor > > > > > is perhaps the exception that proves the rule but she, too, was slapped > > > > > around in a number of her iconic roles and the films where she exuded > > > pure > > > > > female sexual power ("Cleopatra") were not box office hits. > > > > > > > > > > And, to be clear about this, the article stated females rejected Fox not > > > for > > > > > being "too sexy and beautiful" but because of her "pure, raw sexuality," > > > > > which is something else altogether. Barbie is "too sexy and beautiful." > > > > > Fox is no Barbie doll. > > > > > > > > > > There is an ongoing dynamic going on but you may ignore it if it suits > > > you. > > > > > > > > > > ~rave! > > > > > > > > > > --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson <KeithBJohnson@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Did I fall asleep? Since when is the pure horror genre driven by female > > > > > audiences? > > > > > > And as for women not responding to Fox, is it that she's too sexy and > > > > > beautiful for them, or (more likely) that she hasn't displayed a range > > > and > > > > > depth that makes them interested in anything she has to say on screen? I > > > > > mean, there have been untold numbers of actresses over the years who've > > > been > > > > > classified as beautiful and sexy in the extreme, from Liz Taylor to > > > Racquel > > > > > Welch, from Pam Grier to Halle Berry. Such women have always found a > > > female > > > > > audience, depending on the roles they play. > > > > > > I think this is more the script and Fox's one-note facial expressions. > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > From: "Kelwyn" <ravenadal@> > > > > > > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > Sent: Monday, October 5, 2009 1:39:45 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > > > > > > Subject: [scifinoir2] Megan Fox's Scary Box Office Problem > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From Entertainment Weekly, October 9, 2009: > > > > > > > > > > > > "Jennifer's Body" deadly $6.8 million debut is attributed to Megan > > > > Fox's > > > > > "sexy-beast" persona proving off-putting to women, without whom a horror > > > > > movie don't stand a chance. "The genre is driven by the female audience, > > > and > > > > > I don't know that girls relate to her," says the executive. "Megan leads > > > > > with pure, raw sexuality, and for girls it's a turnoff." > > > > > > > > > > > > Fox's drawing power will be tested again with next summer's western > > > > "Jonah > > > > > Hex," aimed at her core: young guys. > > > > > > > > > > > > "If I were cutting the "Hex" trailer," says a studio strategist, "I'd > > > > make > > > > > sure she was in as much of it as possible - in compromising positions." > > > > > > > > > > > > I imagine it would do even better if she could be raped during the > > > > movie. > > > > > > > > > > > > ~(no)rave! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > Post your SciFiNoir Profile at > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/scifinoir2/app/peoplemap2/entry/add?fmvn=mapYa > > > > > > > > hoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service. Get it now. < > > > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/171222984/direct/01/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Bringing diversity to perversity for 9 years! > > > > > Mahogany at: > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mahogany_pleasures_of_darkness/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________ > > Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. > > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/171222985/direct/01/ > > > ------------------------------------ Post your SciFiNoir Profile at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/scifinoir2/app/peoplemap2/entry/add?fmvn=mapYahoo! Groups Links
