Re: Phone enhancements
On Tue, 30 Jan 2007, Al Johnson wrote: On Tuesday 30 January 2007 17:03, Christopher Heiny wrote: On Saturday 27 January 2007 08:31, ROB scribbled in crayon on the back of a kid's menu: I would like a blender and a toaster (for small toast... I realize that including a full size toaster would make the phone a lot less portable.) If the phone could also work as an electric razor and nose hair trimmer, that would be great too. A beer tap. That's what it really needs. But we might have to wait for V2, since the BPS (Beverage Pouring System) isn't ready yet. Would that make it the first BoIP ready handset? Beer over IP seems too good to be true... Would the beer be free, as in ... beer? :-) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
On Tuesday 30 January 2007 17:03, Christopher Heiny wrote: > On Saturday 27 January 2007 08:31, ROB scribbled in crayon on the back of a > > kid's menu: > > I would like a blender and a toaster (for small toast... I realize > > that including a full size toaster would make the phone a lot less > > portable.) > > > > > > If the phone could also work as an electric razor and nose hair > > trimmer, that would be great too. > > A beer tap. That's what it really needs. But we might have to wait for > V2, since the BPS (Beverage Pouring System) isn't ready yet. Would that make it the first BoIP ready handset? Beer over IP seems too good to be true... ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
On Saturday 27 January 2007 08:31, ROB scribbled in crayon on the back of a kid's menu: > I would like a blender and a toaster (for small toast... I realize > that including a full size toaster would make the phone a lot less > portable.) > > > If the phone could also work as an electric razor and nose hair > trimmer, that would be great too. A beer tap. That's what it really needs. But we might have to wait for V2, since the BPS (Beverage Pouring System) isn't ready yet. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
Jose Ildefonso Camargo Tolosa wrote: Hi! On 1/29/07, Graham Auld <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bryce Leo Sent: 29 January 2007 14:31 To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Re: Phone enhancements > You'd have to be doing some serious zigzagging: resolution of GPS at I'd have to agree on this one, I use GPS systems in several areas and generally see resolutions between 2 and 10 meters on average with 5-6 sats in use. Granted to detect zig zags you'd need to be quite careful with how you used the data, telling the difference between weaving and dodging pot holes... Maybe I should light the touch paper and suggest this be a use for the famous accelerometer that's been mentioned so much ;-) Yes, the accelerometer :) . And, now that we are at it, why we just To do inertial guidance, you need to know your initial speed/direction, and the accellerations after that time. However, with a 2 or even 3 axis accellerometer in the neo, you can't reliably do this, as there is no way of determining which direction the neo faces. The constant accelleration of gravity helps with long term disambiguation, somewhat, though it's possible in a plane for example to fly into the ground, ending up inverted pulling 1G towards the ground, without the water in a glass of water on the console ever moving. The phone can't tell between you spinning round horizontally with the phone in your outstretched arm, from you braking from high speed. To do this it needs an orientation reference of some sort, a 3-axis compass, or gyros. Micromachined gyros these days are not very expensive, neither are accellerometers, but you're still looking at maybe $30 in volume, and the resultant position rapidly gets inaccurate, drifting a few degrees a minute, and a meter a second a so a minute. (for an uncertainty of maybe 30m radius after 1m, 3Km after 10m. (there is significant tradeoff of accuracy vs cost, you can get maybe 10 times better than this, more gets into the range that you need to go to fiber optic gyros, which will not fit in any reasonable phone) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
Hi! On 1/29/07, Graham Auld <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bryce Leo Sent: 29 January 2007 14:31 To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Re: Phone enhancements > You'd have to be doing some serious zigzagging: resolution of GPS at > street level is about 50 meters... Exactly the point!! if you're zig zaggin that much you definately need to have the cops get called! But on a serious note, how could it be 50 meters? That's about 165 feet... in certain cases about 3 different roads... Most of the Garmin products are at 1m/3feet resolution. I'm sure that most consumer devices are within about 2m/6ft. Do you have numbers that I don't in this case? Bryce Leo I'd have to agree on this one, I use GPS systems in several areas and generally see resolutions between 2 and 10 meters on average with 5-6 sats in use. Granted to detect zig zags you'd need to be quite careful with how you used the data, telling the difference between weaving and dodging pot holes... Maybe I should light the touch paper and suggest this be a use for the famous accelerometer that's been mentioned so much ;-) Yes, the accelerometer :) . And, now that we are at it, why we just don't add: pressure sensor (atmosferic), temperature sensor, relative humidity It would just be under US$50 all of these well, plus about 2-3 hours programmer time (more or less, depending on the skill), and about 2 hours of the electronic engenieer (to implant the thing into the device's design). Graham ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
My recollection was a little out of date. Units without WAAS correction seem to get something like 10 to 25 meters resolution... Units with correction do better... See http://www.doylesdartden.com/gis/gpstest.htm On 1/29/07 6:57 AM, "Graham Auld" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bryce Leo > Sent: 29 January 2007 14:31 > To: community@lists.openmoko.org > Subject: Re: Phone enhancements > >> You'd have to be doing some serious zigzagging: resolution of GPS at >> street level is about 50 meters... > > Exactly the point!! if you're zig zaggin that much you definately need to > have the cops get called! > > But on a serious note, how could it be 50 meters? That's about 165 feet... > in certain cases about 3 different roads... Most of the Garmin products are > at 1m/3feet resolution. I'm sure that most consumer devices are within about > 2m/6ft. Do you have numbers that I don't in this case? > > Bryce Leo > > I'd have to agree on this one, I use GPS systems in several areas and > generally see resolutions between 2 and 10 meters on average with 5-6 sats > in use. > > Granted to detect zig zags you'd need to be quite careful with how you used > the data, telling the difference between weaving and dodging pot holes... > > Maybe I should light the touch paper and suggest this be a use for the > famous accelerometer that's been mentioned so much ;-) > > Graham > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
Bryce Leo wrote: You'd have to be doing some serious zigzagging: resolution of GPS at street level is about 50 meters... Exactly the point!! if you're zig zaggin that much you definately need to have the cops get called! But on a serious note, how could it be 50 meters? That's about 165 feet... in certain cases about 3 different roads... Most of the Garmin products are at 1m/3feet resolution. I'm sure that most consumer devices are within about 2m/6ft. Do you have numbers that I don't in this case? Unless the GPS in the neo is terrible. Some numbers I did back when GPS SA got turned off, using a Garmin GPS12 at a fixed basepoint, http://www.mauve.demon.co.uk/gps-average.gif 10s averages are red dots, green 100 second, magenta circles 1 hour, cyan squares 6 hours, and black 24h. Percentages are percent that fall inside the circle of given radius of 10s averages. Some data I've later gotten from driving around with it indicate that picking which lane you are in (4-5m) is not particualarly hard. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Phone enhancements
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bryce Leo Sent: 29 January 2007 14:31 To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Re: Phone enhancements > You'd have to be doing some serious zigzagging: resolution of GPS at > street level is about 50 meters... Exactly the point!! if you're zig zaggin that much you definately need to have the cops get called! But on a serious note, how could it be 50 meters? That's about 165 feet... in certain cases about 3 different roads... Most of the Garmin products are at 1m/3feet resolution. I'm sure that most consumer devices are within about 2m/6ft. Do you have numbers that I don't in this case? Bryce Leo I'd have to agree on this one, I use GPS systems in several areas and generally see resolutions between 2 and 10 meters on average with 5-6 sats in use. Granted to detect zig zags you'd need to be quite careful with how you used the data, telling the difference between weaving and dodging pot holes... Maybe I should light the touch paper and suggest this be a use for the famous accelerometer that's been mentioned so much ;-) Graham ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
You'd have to be doing some serious zigzagging: resolution of GPS at street level is about 50 meters... Exactly the point!! if you're zig zaggin that much you definately need to have the cops get called! But on a serious note, how could it be 50 meters? That's about 165 feet... in certain cases about 3 different roads... Most of the Garmin products are at 1m/3feet resolution. I'm sure that most consumer devices are within about 2m/6ft. Do you have numbers that I don't in this case? Bryce Leo ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
On 1/29/07 3:44 AM, "Jan Van Vlaenderen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >When the GPS senses you are zigzagging on a street, the phone could shutdown >> your engine too :-) >> >Even people that are not able to drive a car can be stopped. >> >A lot less problems in my town on sunday morning ;-) > You¹d have to be doing some serious zigzagging: resolution of GPS at street level is about 50 meters... ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
When the GPS senses you are zigzagging on a street, the phone could shutdown your engine too :-) Even people that are not able to drive a car can be stopped. A lot less problems in my town on sunday morning ;-) On 1/28/07, Declan Naughton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 1/28/07, Tehn Yit Chin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I know, couple the breathalyser with the GPS, the phone could detect > you are driving while drunk and call the cops! ;-) lol! > That would be a really neat selling point for the next version, gps > and a breathalyser the ultimate college student phone, then when you > wake up dazed and confused you'll know weather you should drive back > home and also know how to get there. :-D ha, I think we can emulate this feature with no sensor at all: if (saturday-morning && student) intoxicated(); -- Declan Naughton ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change your attitude. Don't complain. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
On 1/28/07, Tehn Yit Chin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I know, couple the breathalyser with the GPS, the phone could detect you are driving while drunk and call the cops! ;-) lol! That would be a really neat selling point for the next version, gps and a breathalyser the ultimate college student phone, then when you wake up dazed and confused you'll know weather you should drive back home and also know how to get there. :-D ha, I think we can emulate this feature with no sensor at all: if (saturday-morning && student) intoxicated(); -- Declan Naughton ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
I know, couple the breathalyser with the GPS, the phone could detect you are driving while drunk and call the cops! ;-) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
"I just saw you use your phone while driving!" "No, officer, I was only checking my blood alcohol level!" Great... :D Also, I wonder what the German law has to say about using a breathalyzer while driving... On 1/28/07, Bryce Leo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Oh don't get me wrong I completely agree with you and I would whole heartedly buy a usb add on if one were created, i'm just saying that it would be really cool but currently is cost prohibitive for the first version. That would be a really neat selling point for the next version, gps and a breathalyser the ultimate college student phone, then when you wake up dazed and confused you'll know weather you should drive back home and also know how to get there. :-D ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
Oh don't get me wrong I completely agree with you and I would whole heartedly buy a usb add on if one were created, i'm just saying that it would be really cool but currently is cost prohibitive for the first version. That would be a really neat selling point for the next version, gps and a breathalyser the ultimate college student phone, then when you wake up dazed and confused you'll know weather you should drive back home and also know how to get there. :-D ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
Ok, that's expensive. Would be cool to play with though. On 1/27/07, Bryce Leo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Seriously.. a breathalizer embedded in the mic, I know I'd love that! > Can't see it happening though, but it probably wouldn't be all that > expensive. Still, most people won't be interested in it. ... I don't know if you've looked at the cost of a stand alone breathalyzer however it ends up being 70 bucks (cheapest i've found) so if you just get the sensor with no software and add in the additional discout of bulk buying you're probably looking at an additional 20-50 on the phone depending on the supplying company. Not a bad increase in price really but for the first gen device i personally wouldn't include it. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Declan Naughton ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
Seriously.. a breathalizer embedded in the mic, I know I'd love that! Can't see it happening though, but it probably wouldn't be all that expensive. Still, most people won't be interested in it. ... I don't know if you've looked at the cost of a stand alone breathalyzer however it ends up being 70 bucks (cheapest i've found) so if you just get the sensor with no software and add in the additional discout of bulk buying you're probably looking at an additional 20-50 on the phone depending on the supplying company. Not a bad increase in price really but for the first gen device i personally wouldn't include it. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
We should use an innovative flap to protect the user from dangerous blades when they're not in use. When the phone starts ringing, or they answer it, the flap closes. Seriously.. a breathalizer embedded in the mic, I know I'd love that! Can't see it happening though, but it probably wouldn't be all that expensive. Still, most people won't be interested in it. On 1/27/07, tony <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: ROB wrote: > I would like a blender and a toaster (for small toast... I realize > that including a full size toaster would make the phone a lot less > portable.) > > > If the phone could also work as an electric razor and nose hair > trimmer, that would be great too. > Don't let's be silly. Every time you answer your phone, you'd shred, broil, and defoliate your ear. You'd be easy to identify as an OpenMoko user, though. - Tony ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Declan Naughton ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
ROB wrote: I would like a blender and a toaster (for small toast... I realize that including a full size toaster would make the phone a lot less portable.) If the phone could also work as an electric razor and nose hair trimmer, that would be great too. Don't let's be silly. Every time you answer your phone, you'd shred, broil, and defoliate your ear. You'd be easy to identify as an OpenMoko user, though. - Tony ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone enhancements
I would like a blender and a toaster (for small toast... I realize that including a full size toaster would make the phone a lot less portable.) If the phone could also work as an electric razor and nose hair trimmer, that would be great too. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Phone enhancements
Forget the camera. Forget the WiFi. What *I* want is a breathalizer (alcohol sensor) embedded with the microphone. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
