[css-d] Serving universal ie6 stylesheet to IE5, IE5.5 and IE Mac
Hello all, I'm starting work on a new look for a large site that I did a number of years ago. This time, it's HTML5 for the semantics, and a bit of CSS3 or -moz and -webkit stuff. I develop on a Mac using Firefox, but test everything in Safari, Chrome and Opera (for Mac). On Windows (WMWare fusion virtual machines), I have IE6, IE7 and IE8. For IE I'm using conditional comments. Actually, the design is, at this point, quite simple and I haven't needed many lines in the IE specific stylesheets up to now, even for IE6. The previous version of the site was done in 2003 and 2004. I used the usual hacks when needed and tested at the time for IEWin 5, 5.5. Now, I don't have IE5 or 5.5 anymore and don't want to spend time doing fixes for them. However, I checked the logs and there are still a (very) few visitors using these browsers. I'm thinking of using the universal ie6 stylesheet from http://forabeautifulweb.com/blog/about/universal_internet_explorer_6_css/, but only for IE5 and 5.5 for Windows. Since I can't check it out, could somebody please confirm that this stylesheet (ie6.1.0.css) will do the job, as it's intended for IE6. For IE Mac, I don't know what to do. I would like to serve it the same simplified stylesheet but it seems conditional comments don't work for IE Mac. What would be the best alternative that will leave the smallest footprint in my html? Thanks, Ellen Herzfeld __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Serving universal ie6 stylesheet to IE5, IE5.5 and IE Mac
On May 21, 2010, at 8:33 PM, Ellen Herzfeld wrote: For IE Mac, I don't know what to do. I would like to serve it the same simplified stylesheet but it seems conditional comments don't work for IE Mac. What would be the best alternative that will leave the smallest footprint in my html? I you absolutely feel the need to support IE5 Mac, this old page of mines has some possible solutions: http://l-c-n.com/IE5tests/hiding/ Philippe --- Philippe Wittenbergh http://l-c-n.com/ __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Serving universal ie6 stylesheet to IE5, IE5.5 and IE Mac
Ignore it. IE5.x/Mac is dead. J. Am 21.05.10 13:33, schrieb Ellen Herzfeld: For IE Mac, I don't know what to do. I would like to serve it the same simplified stylesheet but it seems conditional comments don't work for IE Mac. What would be the best alternative that will leave the smallest footprint in my html? __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Serving universal ie6 stylesheet to IE5, IE5.5 and IE Mac
At 3:54 PM +0200 5/21/10, Joergen W. Lang wrote: Ignore it. IE5.x/Mac is dead. So, some would say, is IE5.0/Win, and yet just last year I had a client whose user traffic was 14% IE5.0/Win. That translated to approximately one million users per month. Based on what I know of their business, I would guess that in the meantime that percentage has not much dropped, and the raw number may well have gone up. My point being that we cannot know Ellen's (or anyone's besides our own) users' needs and browsers, and rather than dismiss her attempts to serve them, it's better to help her figure out how to do so. Ellen, I second the recommendation for Phillipe's IE5/Mac page at http://l-c-n.com/IE5tests/hiding/. I've seen none better. -- Eric A. Meyer (http://meyerweb.com/eric/), List Chaperone CSS is much too interesting and elegant to be not taken seriously. -- Martina Kosloff (http://mako4css.com/) __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Serving universal ie6 stylesheet to IE5, IE5.5 and IE Mac
For IE I'm using conditional comments. Actually, the design is, at this
point, quite simple and I haven't needed many lines in the IE specific
stylesheets up to now, even for IE6.
The previous version of the site was done in 2003 and 2004. I used the
usual hacks when needed and tested at the time for IEWin 5, 5.5. Now, I
don't have IE5 or 5.5 anymore and don't want to spend time doing fixes
for them. However, I checked the logs and there are still a (very) few
visitors using these browsers.
I'm thinking of using the universal ie6 stylesheet from
http://forabeautifulweb.com/blog/about/universal_internet_explorer_6_c
ss/, but only for IE5 and 5.5 for Windows. Since I can't check it out,
could somebody please confirm that this stylesheet (ie6.1.0.css) will
do the job, as it's intended for IE6.
For IE Mac, I don't know what to do. I would like to serve it the same
simplified stylesheet but it seems conditional comments don't work for
IE Mac. What would be the best alternative that will leave the smallest
footprint in my html?
Bravo for trying to support as many browsers as possible, and for *not*
considering the universal ie6 styles sheet for IE6.
And when using it for IE5, you may want to remove/ignore some of the rules
in there: the CSS expression, all the elements that you know would not be
part of your documents, or rules you do not think are necessary.
For example this rule:
h1 img, h2 img, h3 img, h4 img, h5 img, h6 img { margin : 0; }
that follows this one:
img { margin : 0; }
Or rules like these:
blockquote:before, blockquote:after, q:before, q:after { content : ; }
blockquote, q {quotes : ; }
abbr { border-bottom : 1px dotted #666; }
Or am I missing something?
--
Regards,
Thierry
www.tjkdesign.com | www.ez-css.org | @thierrykoblentz
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Re: [css-d] Serving universal ie6 stylesheet to IE5, IE5.5 and IE Mac
On 21 May 2010, at 15:00, Philippe Wittenbergh wrote: On May 21, 2010, at 8:33 PM, Ellen Herzfeld wrote: For IE Mac, I don't know what to do. I would like to serve it the same simplified stylesheet but it seems conditional comments don't work for IE Mac. What would be the best alternative that will leave the smallest footprint in my html? I you absolutely feel the need to support IE5 Mac, this old page of mines has some possible solutions: http://l-c-n.com/IE5tests/hiding/ I still have an old Mac here with system 9 with EI5.1 and the first page I have done is really awful in it. Previously, I tweaked every rule until I was satisfied, but now, I would just like to present a page that does not look completely chaotic. As I said, I checked the recent log files of the site and I know as a fact that there are still a few visitors using IE Mac. I'm sure the very few people who are still using such an old system do so because they have no choice so I'm just trying to be polite. Anyway, I think, that your (Philippe) page has given me a step towards a solution with this: === /*\*//*/ @import ie5mac.css; /**/ === Unless I'm mistaken, this will direct IE Mac (and only IE Mac) to a specific stylesheet. However, I didn't see any way to prevent IE Mac from reading the other stylesheets that are linked in the head (I'm not using @import). I would like to avoid using IE Mac specific hacks in the normal stylesheets. But if I have to, so be it. Thanks, Ellen P.S. To see the old site: http://www.quarante-deux.org/ To see the first new page on the test server : http://ansible.xlii.org/quarante-deux/index5.html __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Serving universal ie6 stylesheet to IE5, IE5.5 and IE Mac
On 21 May 2010, at 17:09, Thierry Koblentz wrote:
Bravo for trying to support as many browsers as possible, and for *not*
considering the universal ie6 styles sheet for IE6.
And when using it for IE5, you may want to remove/ignore some of the rules
in there: the CSS expression, all the elements that you know would not be
part of your documents, or rules you do not think are necessary.
For example this rule:
h1 img, h2 img, h3 img, h4 img, h5 img, h6 img { margin : 0; }
that follows this one:
img { margin : 0; }
Or rules like these:
blockquote:before, blockquote:after, q:before, q:after { content : ; }
blockquote, q {quotes : ; }
abbr { border-bottom : 1px dotted #666; }
I assumed that any rules having no target in my documents would be ignored so
there was no reason not to leave them there. Am I wrong?
The problem is that I assumed (again) that the creators of the universal ie6
stylesheet had also tested it for IE lt 6 and any changes I made would NOT be
tested.
Ellen
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Re: [css-d] Serving universal ie6 stylesheet to IE5, IE5.5 and IE Mac
Ellen Herzfeld wrote: Ellen P.S. To see the old site: http://www.quarante-deux.org/ To see the first new page on the test server : http://ansible.xlii.org/quarante-deux/index5.html Ellen, Fwiw in your first new page the background-image is a no-show in the current versions of Camino, Opera, SeaMonkey, and Mac IE/5.2. I did not look at the page in a PC. Best, ~d -- desktop http://chelseacreekstudio.com/ mobile http://chelseacreekstudio.mobi/ __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] how do i center this /?
Your right. My bad I should have tested before posting. I assumed the vert position was meant from the top of page not top of nav. Thank you David. Have a great weekend. Sincerely, Matthew P. Johnson | Eco I.T. 320 Warwick Avenue Oakland CA 94610 | 415.254.1563 | ecoitsf.com Sent from my iPhone On May 20, 2010, at 9:25 PM, David Hucklesby huckle...@gmail.com wrote: Hello again Matthew, It seems to me that adding the Kalsey tabs to your site as is should do what you want. You can check out the effect here: http://webwiz.robinshosting.com/temp/css-tabs/ecoitsf.html The only thing I added to the original code is a margin-top to the menu to give some room below the header. Otherwise it butts up against the bottom-- at all sizes of the header. Cordially, David -- On 5/18/10 5:00 PM, you wrote: So I have another question regarding this menu I am using for my girlfriends site. I am thinking of using it for my business site as well which I have been redesigning. The issue is how do I make the sub nave move as the height of my header graphic resizes when the browser is resized??? You can see my site at http://ecoitsf.com/ to get an idea of what I am talking about. It would be great if I/yous can figure out how to accomplish this. __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Serving universal ie6 stylesheet to IE5, IE5.5 and IE Mac
David Laakso wrote: Fwiw in your first new page the background-image is a no-show in the current versions of Camino, Opera, SeaMonkey, and Mac IE/5.2. I did not look at the page in a PC. If the background image is http://ansible.xlii.org/quarante-deux/img/dev/flyingbooksmall25tr.png I see it just to the left of Quarante-Deux Quelques pages sur la Science-Fiction on a PC (Win/XP PRO) in Seamonkey 2.0.4 Philip Taylor __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Serving universal ie6 stylesheet to IE5, IE5.5 and IE Mac
David Laakso wrote:
Ellen Herzfeld wrote:
Ellen
P.S. To see the old site: http://www.quarante-deux.org/
To see the first new page on the test server :
http://ansible.xlii.org/quarante-deux/index5.html
Ellen,
Fwiw in your first new page the background-image is a no-show in the
current versions of Camino, Opera, SeaMonkey, and Mac IE/5.2. I did not
look at the page in a PC.
Best,
~d
Whoops. Sorry, about that... (smacks self).
div#page {
position: relative;
padding-top: 2em;
background-color: #FF;
background-image: -moz-linear-gradient(top, #AC6E39, #ff);
background-image: -webkit-gradient(linear, left top, left
bottom,color-stop(0, #AC6E39),color-stop(1, #ff));
}
~d
--
desktop
http://chelseacreekstudio.com/
mobile
http://chelseacreekstudio.mobi/
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Re: [css-d] Serving universal ie6 stylesheet to IE5, IE5.5 and IE Mac
On 21 May 2010, at 19:34, David Laakso wrote: Ellen, Fwiw in your first new page the background-image is a no-show in the current versions of Camino, Opera, SeaMonkey, and Mac IE/5.2. I did not look at the page in a PC. If by background-image you mean the .png to the left of the header, I'm surprised as I see it in Camino and Opera. But if you mean the colored background gradient styled with experimental -moz and -webkit stuff, I consider it eye candy and progressive enhancement. For Win IE 7 and 8, I used the proprietary filters (which seem to work) and for IE6 I just put a normal light brown non gradient background. I might do this for Camino and Opera too but I figure they'll catch up soon enough. And why not IEMac. Seamonkey I don't have. Should I? Ellen __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Serving universal ie6 stylesheet to IE5, IE5.5 and IE Mac
Ellen Herzfeld wrote: Seamonkey I don't have. Should I? Well, I never use anything else, being a reluctant migrant from Netscape 4. It's based on the same rendering engine as Firefox (i.e., Gecko) but includes an integrated e-mail client without which I simply could not live ... Philip Taylor __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
[css-d] IE Problem has been killing my social life...
Hi List, I have a page that seems to have a has layout bug in IE, and for the life of me I can't figure out how to track down the problem child. The page is www.neptac.org/employment and you can see that the page has a horizontal scrollbar showing up in IE7. It's not there in Firefox. It must have something to do with my table and it might be buried in the tinytable javascript library I'm using to format the table, but for the life of me I can't see what is going wrong. If I shorten the width of the table in style.css the width of the page becomes smaller so my thinking is that I must be banging into an IE has layout issue. Help! Jan __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] IE Problem has been killing my social life...
Jan West wrote:
The page is
www.neptac.org/employment and you can see that the page has a horizontal
scrollbar showing up in IE7.
Jan
Checked only on a local file, try:
*:first-child+html #tablefooter {overflow-x: hidden;}
Best,
~d
--
desktop
http://chelseacreekstudio.com/
mobile
http://chelseacreekstudio.mobi/
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Re: [css-d] Serving universal ie6 stylesheet to IE5, IE5.5 and IE Mac
Bravo for trying to support as many browsers as possible, and for
*not*
considering the universal ie6 styles sheet for IE6.
And when using it for IE5, you may want to remove/ignore some of the
rules
in there: the CSS expression, all the elements that you know would
not be
part of your documents, or rules you do not think are necessary.
For example this rule:
h1 img, h2 img, h3 img, h4 img, h5 img, h6 img { margin : 0; }
that follows this one:
img { margin : 0; }
Or rules like these:
blockquote:before, blockquote:after, q:before, q:after { content :
; }
blockquote, q {quotes : ; }
abbr { border-bottom : 1px dotted #666; }
I assumed that any rules having no target in my documents would be
ignored so there was no reason not to leave them there. Am I wrong?
Actually, it is the opposite, there is no reason to leave them in.
If you know that some rules will serve no purpose, then why would you want
to keep them in?
http://carsonified.com/blog/design/setting-rather-than-resetting-default-sty
ling/
The problem is that I assumed (again) that the creators of the
universal ie6 stylesheet had also tested it for IE lt 6 and any
changes I made would NOT be tested.
I don't think the author tested these rules in IE lte 6, because as far as I
know these rules are *ignored* by IE.
Also you'd be removing declarations or rules, not adding anything, so I'd
say the testing part is irrelevant.
--
Regards,
Thierry
www.tjkdesign.com | www.ez-css.org | @thierrykoblentz
__
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