subject:"\"Wallpaper\""

Re: Wallpaper

2009-05-08 Thread Paul W. Frields

On Thu, May 07, 2009 at 07:09:35PM +0200, Max Spevack wrote:
> On Wed, 6 May 2009, Máirín Duffy wrote:
>
>> This is an extremely open design team. We openly discuss our methods  
>> and our decisions, and we make our source artwork available in open  
>> formats using open licenses so anyone who wants to participate, extend, 
>> or build on our work can easily. If you been participating in the list 
>> when we received complaints on this particular issue and when we made 
>> the final call on how to handle it, you could have spoken up just as 
>> anyone else could have. Even if you were not paying attention to the 
>> list at the time, it doesn't mean the issue wasn't discussed openly.
>
> Rodrigo, I recognize your passion, but I must disagree with you.
>
> Mo has said it correctly.
>
> The purpose of Fedora is not to vote on all sorts of things.  The purpose 
> of Fedora is to provide a leadership model for individual teams to take 
> ownership of tasks, and work those tasks to completion in an open, 
> inclusive way.

And I think it's worth pointing out that the whole reason we have a
different theme now, as opposed to the landscape originally being
worked for F11, is precisely *because* the open process allowed
someone to bring in a new idea.  Did it occur late in the process?
Yes.  But people committed to working on many of the design pieces
needed, which created a clear consensus.

> Discussing which of several options is "most right" is perfectly fine,  
> but in the end decisions are made by the people in the teams who are  
> directly doing the work, or those who are active participants.
>
> To speak directly: I am a lurker on fedora-art-list.  Sometimes I say "I  
> like this one!" but I don't expect that my voice will have any more than  
> a minor impact, because I'm not the one designing the artwork.
>
> I think the fact that the lion is being shipped as an alternative and is  
> default in dual-monitor settings is a good compromise of all the various  
> ideas.

Absolutely.  As someone who observed for himself the issues with
interaction between desktop icons and the lion design, I think it was
the correct decision.

I would also like everyone here to remember that the decisions we make
always have ramifications.  It is impossible to lead, in any pursuit,
and expect to make every single person happy all the time, no matter
how much we'd like it if that was the case.  I try to expect that
reaction, listen thoughtfully, and do the best I can to at least
achieve understanding.  Where that isn't possible, I leave the
conversation knowing that I've done the best I can, and accept that I
cannot provide perfect happiness to everyone -- it's out of my
control.

Mo, Nicu, Samuele, Paolo, and many other people (please forgive me if
I didn't list all names, it's only because of my imperfect, human,
aging brain) continue to do an exceptional job making Fedora look
BEAUTIFUL, working as a team.  Art never pleases everyone, and we can
continue to look for ways to improve while peacefully accepting that.

-- 
Paul W. Frieldshttp://paul.frields.org/
  gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233  5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717
  http://redhat.com/   -  -  -  -   http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/
  irc.freenode.net: stickster @ #fedora-docs, #fedora-devel, #fredlug

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Re: Wallpaper

2009-05-07 Thread Max Spevack


On Wed, 6 May 2009, Máirín Duffy wrote:

This is an extremely open design team. We openly discuss our methods 
and our decisions, and we make our source artwork available in open 
formats using open licenses so anyone who wants to participate, 
extend, or build on our work can easily. If you been participating in 
the list when we received complaints on this particular issue and when 
we made the final call on how to handle it, you could have spoken up 
just as anyone else could have. Even if you were not paying attention 
to the list at the time, it doesn't mean the issue wasn't discussed 
openly.


Rodrigo, I recognize your passion, but I must disagree with you.

Mo has said it correctly.

The purpose of Fedora is not to vote on all sorts of things.  The 
purpose of Fedora is to provide a leadership model for individual teams 
to take ownership of tasks, and work those tasks to completion in an 
open, inclusive way.


Discussing which of several options is "most right" is perfectly fine, 
but in the end decisions are made by the people in the teams who are 
directly doing the work, or those who are active participants.


To speak directly: I am a lurker on fedora-art-list.  Sometimes I say "I 
like this one!" but I don't expect that my voice will have any more than 
a minor impact, because I'm not the one designing the artwork.


I think the fact that the lion is being shipped as an alternative and is 
default in dual-monitor settings is a good compromise of all the various 
ideas.


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Re: Wallpaper

2009-05-07 Thread Martin Sourada

On Thu, 2009-05-07 at 10:22 +0200, Samuele Storari wrote:
> Hi all!
Hi,

> As for the wallpaper problem, here is my proposed solution, hope the 
> schedule still allow it: include the right screen (the lion head) in the 
> default package, so those wanting it don't have to download additional 
> stuff, have only to click on "Change Desktop Background" (as we had with 
> the temple image).
> 
Given my recent time constraints this is totally down at my priority
list, but yes, I am still planing on adding the right version to the
package. Unless someone other do this though, I don't think I'll be able
to make it in time for release.

> Samuele 
Martin


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Re: Wallpaper

2009-05-07 Thread Jayme Ayres

2009/5/7 Nicu Buculei :
> On 05/07/2009 12:26 AM, Máirín Duffy wrote:
>>
>> If anyone would like to step up as art team leader, please let me know, as
>> I no longer wish to hold the position.
>
> Mo, I understand why you feel like this at times, but honestly I don't know
> anyone who would be able to assume this position and also be recognized as
> such *inside* or *outside* of the team.
>
> So please, have a walk in the park, have some fun time and maybe you will
> find enough new energy.
>

+1

> As for the wallpaper problem, here is my proposed solution, hope the
> schedule still allow it: include the right screen (the lion head) in the
> default package, so those wanting it don't have to download additional
> stuff, have only to click on "Change Desktop Background" (as we had with the
> temple image).

I agree with your idea Nicu, and going beyond, we can apply an opacity
in the head of the lion, for there is no such confusion in the desktop
as well as Paul has mentioned in another email.
I think there's a misunderstanding of thoughts in the discussion, ONLY
now Rodrigo was clear in your question: Why did the lion was removed
if the concept is the lion (or king whatever)?
I particularly like the concept King and this is my personal opinion
unfortunately, for lack of time, I couldn't participate in the
discussion on whether or not the theme and still did not know that the
lion had been removed.

Cheers

J

>
> --
> nicu :: http://nicubunu.ro :: http://nicubunu.blogspot.com/
> photography: http://photoblog.nicubunu.ro/
> my Fedora stuff: http://fedora.nicubunu.ro/
>
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Re: Wallpaper

2009-05-07 Thread Charlie Brej

Samuele Storari wrote:

+1 I think this solution will works! Great idea, so users can just "click and
change".

Afte that I think mo your doing a great job managing the art team, and please
don't take my words as an attempt to make a new-useless arguments.
And thanks a lot Rodrigo for defend my concept as a piece of you, I really appreciate it, but you
know as Rolling Stone sings: "You can't always get what you want...", next time maybe we
can try to work and say our objection in the right time and in the right place as the
"team" decided it.

I think having the default as the simple background is probably the better
option, but I agree. I think we are targeting two types of users.

The "I just want things to work" users who want nothing more than a working
system. I sympathise with them as when I deploy a new installation on 40 user's
machines, the last thing I want is someone complaining about not being able to
find their icons.

But we also have the "shiny shiny shiny" users who want the wow factor.

Unfortunately reviewers are in the later category and all they look for is new
"shinies". The number one complaint they usually have is that each distro is
just like the another one. I think it is important to allow them to pimp out
their desktop very easily and make each release look and feel new and unique.

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