[Finale] Next Question
Another question: Let's say I want to back up data, and I want to use a CDR Disk. Can I use a CDR Music Disk, because when I insert one of those, I get a window with the following message: You inserted a blank CD. Choose an action from the popup menu or click ignore. Actions Include: Open Folder Open iTunes Open disk utility open another application And there is a box to click for Make this action the default So, if that disk can be used for backing up, say, a Fin folder, what path does one take? Dean ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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At 01:46 PM 08/06/2005, Dean M. Estabrook wrote: Let's say I want to back up data, and I want to use a CDR Disk. Can I use a CDR Music Disk, No. All CDRs start out the same, what we call a data CDR. If you use a blank CDR to make an audio CD (one that will play back like a regular CD, not a CD with WAV or AIFF files), there's some kind of switch that gets set which marks it as an audio CD. If you buy preformatted audio CDRs or music CDRs, these are data CDRs which *already* have this switch set, and there's no way to unset it. The only thing these CDRs are good for is making audio CDs to be played on a CD player. You cannot use them to back up any kind of data files, including Finale files. Aaron. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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Hey, thanks. That's kind of what I thought. I assume a CDRW would suffice for my purpose, however, once I select Burn, I can neither add or delete any data from it, right? Dean On Aug 6, 2005, at 11:23 AM, Aaron Sherber wrote: At 01:46 PM 08/06/2005, Dean M. Estabrook wrote: Let's say I want to back up data, and I want to use a CDR Disk. Can I use a CDR Music Disk, No. All CDRs start out the same, what we call a data CDR. If you use a blank CDR to make an audio CD (one that will play back like a regular CD, not a CD with WAV or AIFF files), there's some kind of switch that gets set which marks it as an audio CD. If you buy preformatted audio CDRs or music CDRs, these are data CDRs which *already* have this switch set, and there's no way to unset it. The only thing these CDRs are good for is making audio CDs to be played on a CD player. You cannot use them to back up any kind of data files, including Finale files. Aaron. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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At 02:29 PM 08/06/2005, Dean M. Estabrook wrote: I assume a CDRW would suffice for my purpose, however, once I select Burn, I can neither add or delete any data from it, right? No, that's backwards. CDRW (Re-Writeable) can be used just like a giant floppy. You can put files on, and delete them, and rename them, etc. But you don't burn anything to a CDRW -- you just save or move files as though it were any other kind of disk. But my understanding is that there are all kinds of potential problems with CDRW (David Fenton was talking about this a little while ago). I believe they are more error and corruption-prone, and I believe also that the drivers which allow reading and writing are not native to the OS. This means that a CDRW you write on your computer may only be readable on another computer if they're using the same packet writing software. CDR, on the other hand, is essentially a write-once medium. It is possible to burn to a CDR multiple times -- called different sessions -- and then close the disk at the end, but you can only add new data in a session, not delete existing. Speaking personally, I have had difficulties with some CD drives not being able to read multisession CDRs. It's entirely possible that these were older drives and that this problem doesn't exist anymore -- but with blank CDRs going for about $0.25 each, I've never worried about burning once and then throwing it away and burning a new one when I wanted to add things. Aaron. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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Hmmm ... it seems to me that a few days ago, when I copied a folder to a CDRW, that the only way I got it to accept the data and eject, was to select the Burn function. I may not be remembering correctly. I can always try another one. Dean On Aug 6, 2005, at 11:45 AM, Aaron Sherber wrote: No, that's backwards. CDRW (Re-Writeable) can be used just like a giant floppy. You can put files on, and delete them, and rename them, etc. But you don't burn anything to a CDRW -- you just save or move files as though it were any other kind of disk. But my understanding is that there are all kinds of potential problems with CDRW (David Fenton was talking about this a little while ago). I believe they are more error and corruption-prone, and I believe also that the drivers which allow reading and writing are not native to the OS. This means that a CDRW you write on your computer may only be readable on another computer if they're using the same packet writing software. CDR, on the other hand, is essentially a write-once medium. It is possible to burn to a CDR multiple times -- called different sessions -- and then close the disk at the end, but you can only add new data in a session, not delete existing. Speaking personally, I have had difficulties with some CD drives not being able to read multisession CDRs. It's entirely possible that these were older drives and that this problem doesn't exist anymore -- but with blank CDRs going for about $0.25 each, I've never worried about burning once and then throwing it away and burning a new one when I wanted to add things. Aaron. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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On 06 Aug 2005, at 2:45 PM, Aaron Sherber wrote: CDRW (Re-Writeable) can be used just like a giant floppy. You can put files on, and delete them, and rename them, etc. But you don't burn anything to a CDRW Yes you do. It's just that you can un-burn it afterwards. - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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On 6 Aug 2005 at 14:23, Aaron Sherber wrote: At 01:46 PM 08/06/2005, Dean M. Estabrook wrote: Let's say I want to back up data, and I want to use a CDR Disk. Can I use a CDR Music Disk, No. All CDRs start out the same, what we call a data CDR. If you use a blank CDR to make an audio CD (one that will play back like a regular CD, not a CD with WAV or AIFF files), there's some kind of switch that gets set which marks it as an audio CD. If you buy preformatted audio CDRs or music CDRs, these are data CDRs which *already* have this switch set, and there's no way to unset it. The only thing these CDRs are good for is making audio CDs to be played on a CD player. You cannot use them to back up any kind of data files, including Finale files. This is not true. A music CD is simply a completely unformatted CD. A data CD, on the other hand, has been formatted with a particular file system. A client of mine needed a CD-R and the store nearby had only pre- formatted music disks. Those worked just fine used as data CDs. The other difference, I believe, is that you pay extra for music disks because there are royalties paid on those that are divided up between musicians/performers, on the theory that the disks will be used to make copies that will take away from sales of original music. I have never seen preformatted data disks, though. -- David W. Fentonhttp://www.bway.net/~dfenton David Fenton Associateshttp://www.bway.net/~dfassoc ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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On 6 Aug 2005 at 14:45, Aaron Sherber wrote: At 02:29 PM 08/06/2005, Dean M. Estabrook wrote: I assume a CDRW would suffice for my purpose, however, once I select Burn, I can neither add or delete any data from it, right? No, that's backwards. CDRW (Re-Writeable) can be used just like a giant floppy. You can put files on, and delete them, and rename them, etc. But you don't burn anything to a CDRW -- you just save or move files as though it were any other kind of disk. But my understanding is that there are all kinds of potential problems with CDRW (David Fenton was talking about this a little while ago). . . . The problems I was talking about were limited to Windows XP, and were with both CD-RW and CD-R, but whether or not you ran into the problem depended on what programs you used to write to the CD, and how you did it. There is nothing wrong with having multiple write sessions to a CD-R over time before closing the disk, as long as you realize you are only ever adding more files to the CD. However, that is one of the scenarios on WinXP that can lead to problems (e.g., if you leave the open-session CD in the drive, on some hardware, you'll get a blue- screen STOP error on attempted reboot; never fear, it goes away once you eject the disk). . . . I believe they are more error and corruption-prone, and I believe also that the drivers which allow reading and writing are not native to the OS. This means that a CDRW you write on your computer may only be readable on another computer if they're using the same packet writing software. CD-RWs are less reliably readable on drives other than the one that created them. I hardly ever use CD-RW at all any longer -- I just use a new CD-R (they are that cheap). CDR, on the other hand, is essentially a write-once medium. It is possible to burn to a CDR multiple times -- called different sessions -- and then close the disk at the end, but you can only add new data in a session, not delete existing. Speaking personally, I have had difficulties with some CD drives not being able to read multisession CDRs. It's entirely possible that these were older drives and that this problem doesn't exist anymore -- but with blank CDRs going for about $0.25 each, I've never worried about burning once and then throwing it away and burning a new one when I wanted to add things. Drives that have problems with multi-session CD-Rs will likely have problems with any CD-RW, in my experience. -- David W. Fentonhttp://www.bway.net/~dfenton David Fenton Associateshttp://www.bway.net/~dfassoc ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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ok, Thanks David Dean On Aug 6, 2005, at 12:11 PM, David W. Fenton wrote: On 6 Aug 2005 at 14:23, Aaron Sherber wrote: At 01:46 PM 08/06/2005, Dean M. Estabrook wrote: Let's say I want to back up data, and I want to use a CDR Disk. Can I use a CDR Music Disk, No. All CDRs start out the same, what we call a data CDR. If you use a blank CDR to make an audio CD (one that will play back like a regular CD, not a CD with WAV or AIFF files), there's some kind of switch that gets set which marks it as an audio CD. If you buy preformatted audio CDRs or music CDRs, these are data CDRs which *already* have this switch set, and there's no way to unset it. The only thing these CDRs are good for is making audio CDs to be played on a CD player. You cannot use them to back up any kind of data files, including Finale files. This is not true. A music CD is simply a completely unformatted CD. A data CD, on the other hand, has been formatted with a particular file system. A client of mine needed a CD-R and the store nearby had only pre- formatted music disks. Those worked just fine used as data CDs. The other difference, I believe, is that you pay extra for music disks because there are royalties paid on those that are divided up between musicians/performers, on the theory that the disks will be used to make copies that will take away from sales of original music. I have never seen preformatted data disks, though. -- David W. Fentonhttp://www.bway.net/~dfenton David Fenton Associateshttp://www.bway.net/~dfassoc ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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On 06 Aug 2005, at 2:50 PM, Dean M. Estabrook wrote: Hmmm ... it seems to me that a few days ago, when I copied a folder to a CDRW, that the only way I got it to accept the data and eject, was to select the Burn function. That's correct. - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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At 01:46 PM 08/06/2005, Dean M. Estabrook wrote: Let's say I want to back up data, and I want to use a CDR Disk. Can I use a CDR Music Disk, No. All CDRs start out the same, what we call a data CDR. If you use a blank CDR to make an audio CD (one that will play back like a regular CD, not a CD with WAV or AIFF files), there's some kind of switch that gets set which marks it as an audio CD. If you buy preformatted audio CDRs or music CDRs, these are data CDRs which *already* have this switch set, and there's no way to unset it. The only thing these CDRs are good for is making audio CDs to be played on a CD player. You cannot use them to back up any kind of data files, including Finale files. Aaron. Almost. As you say, the distinguishing feature of Music CD-Rs is that they contain a permanent piece of data on the non-recordable part of the disk identifying them as music blanks, which allows them to be burned on stand-alone consumer CD recorders (it's a bit of a stretch to call them preformatted). Professional CD recorders and PC burners ignore that data and can burn on any type of CD-R. Otherwise, data and music CD-Rs are physically identical, and should be equally compatible in all types of players. If anything, music blanks may be lower quality than data blanks, based on some manufacturers' assumption that a few bit errors in music will be unnoticeable (unlike data). The music blanks do cost more, however, as some portion of the price goes to the RIAA (in the US). Bottom line: the only reason to buy CD-Rs specifically labeled as for music is if you're going to use them in a stand-alone consumer CD recorder. But if you already have them, they are usable as data CD-Rs, given that you're willing to accept the possibility of a higher error rate. Lee Actor Composer-in-Residence and Assistant Conductor, Palo Alto Philharmonic http://www.leeactor.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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Mein Gott ... did I actually get something right? This is a huge step. Dean On Aug 6, 2005, at 12:17 PM, Darcy James Argue wrote: On 06 Aug 2005, at 2:50 PM, Dean M. Estabrook wrote: Hmmm ... it seems to me that a few days ago, when I copied a folder to a CDRW, that the only way I got it to accept the data and eject, was to select the Burn function. That's correct. - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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On 6 Aug 2005 at 11:29, Dean M. Estabrook wrote: Hey, thanks. That's kind of what I thought. I assume a CDRW would suffice for my purpose, however, once I select Burn, I can neither add or delete any data from it, right? Use CD-RW only when you know you need to write to the CD over multiple sessions and are unlikely to want to use it in non-up-to- date devices that often have trouble reading closed CD-RWs. -- David W. Fentonhttp://www.bway.net/~dfenton David Fenton Associateshttp://www.bway.net/~dfassoc ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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Dean M. Estabrook / 2005/08/06 / 01:46 PM wrote: You inserted a blank CD. Choose an action from the popup menu or click ignore. Actions Include: Open Folder Open iTunes Open disk utility open another application And there is a box to click for Make this action the default So, if that disk can be used for backing up, say, a Fin folder, what path does one take? Finder, which should be one of the options you might missed. By the way, like David said, I too highly discourage the use of CDRW. In order to be re-writable, the data also needs to be burnt lighter, which makes it somewhat unreliable. I do against wasting CD media which material is environment hazardous, but I am planning to create a Christmas tree out of them just like Columbian president did :-) -- - Hiro Hiroaki Honshuku, A-NO-NE Music, Boston, MA http://a-no-ne.com http://anonemusic.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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At 03:17 PM 08/06/2005, Darcy James Argue wrote: On 06 Aug 2005, at 2:45 PM, Aaron Sherber wrote: CDRW (Re-Writeable) can be used just like a giant floppy. You can put files on, and delete them, and rename them, etc. But you don't burn anything to a CDRW Yes you do. It's just that you can un-burn it afterwards. Okay. I tend not to use the term burn for CD-RW, but maybe that's just me. Aaron. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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At 03:11 PM 08/06/2005, David W. Fenton wrote: This is not true. A music CD is simply a completely unformatted CD. A data CD, on the other hand, has been formatted with a particular file system. There's a slight semantic issue here, but CDRs which are sold as music CDR do have something which plain CDR blanks don't. But as Lee Actor pointed out, this switch only means something to consumer (i.e., non-PC-based) burners. When I said data CD, I misspoke -- I meant just plain old CDR blanks. Technically you're right that a data CD implies that there's data on it, but we were discussing blanks. A client of mine needed a CD-R and the store nearby had only pre- formatted music disks. Those worked just fine used as data CDs. As Lee pointed out, this is because whatever flag is set on music CDRs is only meaningful to consumer decks. See also http://cdrfaq.org/faq01.html#S1-13 Aaron. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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At 03:20 PM 08/06/2005, Lee Actor wrote: Almost. As you say, the distinguishing feature of Music CD-Rs is that they contain a permanent piece of data on the non-recordable part of the disk identifying them as music blanks, which allows them to be burned on stand-alone consumer CD recorders Ah, yes, that's it. Thanks for the correction. preformatted). Professional CD recorders and PC burners ignore that data and can burn on any type of CD-R. I didn't realize that. Aaron. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
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On 06 Aug 2005, at 5:06 PM, A-NO-NE Music wrote: Aaron Sherber / 2005/08/06 / 04:54 PM wrote: Okay. I tend not to use the term burn for CD-RW, but maybe that's just me. You are correct. CDR laster does burn holes on the media, while CDRW won't. Fercrissakes, guys, that's *not* what Dean was asking about. From a UI perspective, in Mac OS X, you still have to burn a CDRW. The command in OS X is still called burn disc. Whether it's technically correct or not is completely beside the point. Dean was just wondering how to write data to a CDRW under OS X, and the answer is: the same way you write data to a CDR -- use the 'burn disc' command. - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
