Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Taylor, Grant
> It looks like a number of people are offering sites -
> IMHO, a "distributed" wiki (ie: you can edit at any of
> the sites) or a master/mirror setup would be good, as
> that would help prevent problems if site maintainers
> get kidnapped by aliens, sites get slashdotted, etc.

I think the Wiki, if that route is chosen, should be on the www.lartc.org 
domain name.  This means that we will have to find and contact the 
administrators of that domain / DNS servers.  As far as the distributed web 
site goes I think it is a good idea.  To pull off the distributed site we would 
need to have the DNS records resolve to multiple boxen across the net.  I have 
considered a self replicating set up for some of my servers and at present I'm 
looking at using Coda or AFS as a replicating  / caching local copies of the 
remote file system content.  I've never dealt with Wikis other than and end 
user (and I say that the ones that I've looked at have been slow) so I don't 
know what they take to set up.  I suspect that they use a database and thus we 
would want to set up the Wiki to use a database that has real time replication 
between the two (or more) web servers that the wiki points to.  I would be more 
than happy to help with such an endeavor.  I can not host it at my 
office (bosses will not let me) but I can help provide content and / or convert 
stuff.

> It would also be good if at least one site offered
> multiple ways to connect - eg: via an IPSec tunnel or
> via IPv6 - as this would give people a simple way of
> testing what they're trying.

Again I am not able to do this, but I think it could be relatively easily done 
by offering a host with multiple IPs bound to it and give people a UML that 
they can test things in.  Much of the routing / firewalling work that I have 
done can easily be done in side of a UML.  This would mean that a system would 
need to be fairly capable and running a UML it's self to be a router in to the 
UML farm / UML switch backplane.  Again I would be more than willing to help 
set up such a system (and enjoy it at that).  I think it would be interesting 
to do this with multiple distributions and possibly versions there of.  To pull 
this off the box would need to be fairly powerful though to support many people 
at one time.  I'd say that you could get away with a dual multi GHz proc box 
with at least 2 - 4 GB of RAM.  I would expect that this could support 10+ 
concurrent users in side of UML doing some compiling or more if they are just 
using recompiled binaries.



Grant. . . .
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Re: [LARTC] Hardware Configuration Ideas

2005-08-17 Thread Peter Surda
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 14:18:47 -0500 "Taylor, Grant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:


>Um, the DFE-530TX+ is a (rebranded) Realtek8139 chipset card so I would expect
>that the performance would be comparable to the Realtek cards.
I don't have one here, but I vaguely remember they use a different kernel module
(8139too vs. via-rhine) so I think it's a different chipset. I only mentioned
them because some time in distant past I solved some performance problems by
switching from from 8139 to the dlink, and the dlink costs less than a half of
entry-level 3com.

>Grant. . . .

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Re: [LARTC] Hardware Configuration Ideas

2005-08-17 Thread Carl-Daniel Hailfinger
Taylor, Grant schrieb:
>>Yes, this is indeed a problem. Cards based on this chipset don't scale well. 
>>Try
>>3coms or intels. If you're short on money, dlink dfe-530tx might do too.
> 
> Um, the DFE-530TX+ is a (rebranded) Realtek8139 chipset card so I would
> expect that the performance would be comparable to the Realtek cards.
> I personally have not used them but I have heard wonderful things about
> DEC Tulip cards.

Some of the DFE-5..TX cards are indeed tulip based and have very good
performance for a reasonable price. Unfortunately sources on the net
disagree which cards have which chipset, so I recommend looking at them
(I bought a new tulip based card here in Germany for 7 Euros). It pays
to request a look at the chipsets of the cheaper cards, they might not
even advertise their chipsets as tulip.


Regards,
Carl-Daniel
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Re: [LARTC] Hardware Configuration Ideas

2005-08-17 Thread Taylor, Grant
> Yes, this is indeed a problem. Cards based on this chipset don't scale well. 
> Try
> 3coms or intels. If you're short on money, dlink dfe-530tx might do too.

Um, the DFE-530TX+ is a (rebranded) Realtek8139 chipset card so I would expect 
that the performance would be comparable to the Realtek cards.  I personally 
have not used them but I have heard wonderful things about DEC Tulup cards.  If 
you are interested I have some 3Com 905 cards I'd be willing to part with for a 
very reasonable price.  (Please email me off the list if you are interested in 
the NICs.)



Grant. . . .
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Carl-Daniel Hailfinger
Andreas Klauer schrieb:
> On Wednesday 17 August 2005 19:05, Jonathan Day wrote:
> 
>>It would also be good if at least one site offered
>>multiple ways to connect - eg: via an IPSec tunnel or
>>via IPv6 - as this would give people a simple way of
>>testing what they're trying.
> 
> There are sites that let you run a connection speed test and stuff. 
> However, this does not have to do anything with the Wiki per se.

Yes, a way to test certain setups would be cool, but you
have to be aware that there might be security bugs in the
services you offer. Your risk would be higher than for
usual setups because people might also be able to use
post-authentication bugs. A person setting up such a test
system should also be aware that people might use more
bandwidth than anticipated.


Regards,
Carl-Daniel
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RE: [LARTC] Hardware Configuration Ideas

2005-08-17 Thread Peter Surda
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 18:46:35 +0300 "Mihai Vlad" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

>The reason why I asked for your help was because I had the following
>problem:
[cut]

>Realtek 8139 NIC
Yes, this is indeed a problem. Cards based on this chipset don't scale well. Try
3coms or intels. If you're short on money, dlink dfe-530tx might do too.

(I work for none of the mentioned companies :-)).

>Mihai
Yours sincerely,
Peter

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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Carl-Daniel Hailfinger
Jonathan Day schrieb:
> It seems strange that astronomers discovered a whole
> set of Black Holes at about the time the maintainers
> vanished...
> 
> It looks like a number of people are offering sites -
> IMHO, a "distributed" wiki (ie: you can edit at any of
> the sites) or a master/mirror setup would be good, as
> that would help prevent problems if site maintainers
> get kidnapped by aliens, sites get slashdotted, etc.

Or some big organization like SUSE/RedHat/etc. who are
unlikely to vanish could offer hosting a wiki. That
makes alien abduction and slashdotting really unlikely.

Using multiple sites is always a problem because invariably
people will lose interest, sites will get out of sync, the
question which site should be linked from external sites
and all of the sites stealing google ranking from each
other.

If people feel comfortable with SUSE hosting such a wiki,
I could ask them.


Regards,
Carl-Daniel
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Andreas Klauer
On Wednesday 17 August 2005 19:05, Jonathan Day wrote:
> It looks like a number of people are offering sites -
> IMHO, a "distributed" wiki (ie: you can edit at any of
> the sites) or a master/mirror setup would be good, as
> that would help prevent problems if site maintainers
> get kidnapped by aliens, sites get slashdotted, etc.

I'd prefer if we could keep the central site www.lartc.org since that 
location is already more than well known. If the owner just doesn't have 
the time to maintain the Howto anymore, it would be best to put the wiki 
directly there, since that can be self-maintained by the users then. So I 
suggest we at least try to contact the original maintainer / domain owner 
before putting a Wiki just anywhere.

If that's not possible, I think I'd prefer one central, but reliable 
long-term host over a distributed solution. Mirrors are fine, though.

> It would also be good if at least one site offered
> multiple ways to connect - eg: via an IPSec tunnel or
> via IPv6 - as this would give people a simple way of
> testing what they're trying.

There are sites that let you run a connection speed test and stuff. 
However, this does not have to do anything with the Wiki per se.

Regards
Andreas Klauer
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Jonathan Day
It seems strange that astronomers discovered a whole
set of Black Holes at about the time the maintainers
vanished...

It looks like a number of people are offering sites -
IMHO, a "distributed" wiki (ie: you can edit at any of
the sites) or a master/mirror setup would be good, as
that would help prevent problems if site maintainers
get kidnapped by aliens, sites get slashdotted, etc.

It would also be good if at least one site offered
multiple ways to connect - eg: via an IPSec tunnel or
via IPv6 - as this would give people a simple way of
testing what they're trying.

--- Kenneth Kalmer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> On 8/17/05, Ed W <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > 
> > >I guess the obvious question then is: How do we
> get it maintained?
> > >
> > >Does anyone know where the current maintainers
> have disappeared?
> > >
> > >Is anyone willing to take over that job?
> > >
> > >
> > 
> > I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and
> consider uploading the
> > documentation there.  This would make it easier
> for people to
> > contribute, and I think it shold be fairly easy to
> convert from it's
> > current format to a wiki
> > 
> > Just a thought
> > 
> 
> And a great one I might add. Does anybody know how
> busy the current
> site is? If not too busy (i.e.< 10GB a month) I'd
> gladly put up a wiki
> on my server for it. If it get's busier I'll just
> have to move it to
> another server in due course.
> 
> I've also gotten very frustrated with some old
> outdated information,
> and especially the lack of information regarding the
> 2.6.x kernel.
> 
> All in favour...?
> 
> Regards
> 
> -- 
> 
> Kenneth Kalmer
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] stats
>
http://vspx27.stanford.edu/cgi-bin/main.py?qtype=userpage&username=kenneth%2Ekalmer
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Dariusz Dwornikowski

> Aye/puts hand up in agreement.
> 
> A wiki would be great. The problem right now is there is little, and usually 
> not very good, documentation on how to setup queue's and other advanced 
> routing.
> 
> The end result this list is full of people asking questions and very few who 
> answer.

i am totally pro refreshing the lartc howto. and wiki is a great idea


-- 
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Stephen Hemminger
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 12:28:10 +0100
Ed W <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> 
> >I guess the obvious question then is: How do we get it maintained?
> >
> >Does anyone know where the current maintainers have disappeared?
> >
> >Is anyone willing to take over that job?
> >  
> >
> 
> I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and consider uploading the 
> documentation there.  This would make it easier for people to 
> contribute, and I think it shold be fairly easy to convert from it's 
> current format to a wiki
> 

Good idea, I'll see if the OSDL will put up a wiki for it
on developer.osdl.org, stay tuned.
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RE: [LARTC] Hardware Configuration Ideas

2005-08-17 Thread Mihai Vlad
Thank you all for your help!

The reason why I asked for your help was because I had the following
problem:

Router:
1.4 GHZ AMD
256 RAM
Realtek 8139 NIC
Slackware
2.6 kernel

No iptables rules just iproute2 routing.
I have 2 sub-networks and the router is configured as a "router on a stick".
I tested a simple routing from one sub-network to another (FTP transfer)
(the traffic enters and leaves the router using the same NIC) and the
maximum transfer rate is 50 Mbit (instead of 100 Mbit as expected).

I wonder how am I able to route a Gigabit network ... Someone told me that
he solved the problem using FreeBSD as it has a better performance on this
field...

I am bound to Linux as it has a superb implementation of QoS. You have
nothing like this in BSD.

I want to ask you: what is the maximum transfer rate that you can obtain on
your configurations (with and without heavy firewalling / marking / tc).

Thanks again for your input!

Mihai




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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Andre D. Correa


Hi, I got frustrated with it several months ago when I tried to update 
IMQ information and never got a response.


I can host a WiKi too, maybe we can mirror content and share the task. 
I'm not sure if any WiKi has a mirroring functionality but we can figure 
this out.



Andre D. Correa, CISSP |  Visite meus projetos pessoais:
andre.correa (at) pobox.com|  Visit my personal projects:
http://andre.hiperlinks.com.br |  -http://malware.hiperlinks.com.br
Sao Paulo / SP / Brazil|  -http://www.linuximq.net/




Kenneth Kalmer wrote:

On 8/17/05, Ed W <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


I guess the obvious question then is: How do we get it maintained?

Does anyone know where the current maintainers have disappeared?

Is anyone willing to take over that job?




I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and consider uploading the
documentation there.  This would make it easier for people to
contribute, and I think it shold be fairly easy to convert from it's
current format to a wiki

Just a thought




And a great one I might add. Does anybody know how busy the current
site is? If not too busy (i.e.< 10GB a month) I'd gladly put up a wiki
on my server for it. If it get's busier I'll just have to move it to
another server in due course.

I've also gotten very frustrated with some old outdated information,
and especially the lack of information regarding the 2.6.x kernel.

All in favour...?

Regards


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Re: [LARTC] HTB and Prio

2005-08-17 Thread panca sorin

> I am not that among the siblings, the excess
bandwidth > is shared on 
> basis of priority ie . 1:3 will get a higher share
than > 1:4.
 The quantum of borrowed bandwidth is proportional
with the rate you specified for each class.
 The prio control is for controlling who gets the
excess bandwith first (if exists).




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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Lee Sanders
Hi Kenneth,

Aye/puts hand up in agreement.

A wiki would be great. The problem right now is there is little, and usually 
not very good, documentation on how to setup queue's and other advanced 
routing.

The end result this list is full of people asking questions and very few who 
answer.

:L

> And a great one I might add. Does anybody know how busy the current
> site is? If not too busy (i.e.< 10GB a month) I'd gladly put up a wiki
> on my server for it. If it get's busier I'll just have to move it to
> another server in due course.
>
> I've also gotten very frustrated with some old outdated information,
> and especially the lack of information regarding the 2.6.x kernel.
>
> All in favour...?
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Re: [LARTC] Unsubsription impossible

2005-08-17 Thread Mailing List Account

Thomas Heinz wrote:

Hi

Several times, I unsuccessfully tried to unsubscribe from lartc via the web 
interface and mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] I 
also contacted the mailing list admin but got no reply. Even resubscribing 
did not work.


I have posted here since I am running out of options. This posting is 
addressed to the list admin in charge:

Please remove my email address from the lartc mailing list.

If all else fails, just start bouncing the messages. After a few bounces 
it'll unsubscribe you. I kept getting unsubscribed because my system was 
rejecting the sentrisystem virus stuff.


Dave
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[LARTC] HTB and Prio

2005-08-17 Thread Vinod Chandran

Hi ,

I wanted some clarification on the PRIO value of HTB.
I have a parent class 1:1 with ceil and rate 1000Kbit.
Further I have three classes
   1. 1:2 with rate 500Kbit ceil 1000Kbit prio 1
   2. 1:3 with rate 300Kbit ceil 1000Kbit prio 2
   3. 1:4 with rate 200Kbit ceil 1000Kbit prio 3

Also there is a child class of 1:2 , 1:22, with rate 100Kbit ceil 
1000Kbit prio 4.


I am not that among the siblings, the excess bandwidth is shared on 
basis of priority ie . 1:3 will get a higher share than 1:4.
What I am not sure is will 1:22 class(being a child of 1:2) get a 
greater share than 1:3  or for that matter 1:4.


Thanks,
Vinod C

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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Mike O
I don't even think this is list is being maintained. Several people have 
tried to unsubscribe.




From: Ed W <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Georg C. F. Greve" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: Andreas Klauer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,lartc@mailman.ds9a.nl
Subject: Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 12:28:10 +0100



I guess the obvious question then is: How do we get it maintained?

Does anyone know where the current maintainers have disappeared?

Is anyone willing to take over that job?




I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and consider uploading the 
documentation there.  This would make it easier for people to contribute, 
and I think it shold be fairly easy to convert from it's current format to 
a wiki


Just a thought

Ed W
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Kenneth Kalmer
On 8/17/05, Ed W <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> >I guess the obvious question then is: How do we get it maintained?
> >
> >Does anyone know where the current maintainers have disappeared?
> >
> >Is anyone willing to take over that job?
> >
> >
> 
> I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and consider uploading the
> documentation there.  This would make it easier for people to
> contribute, and I think it shold be fairly easy to convert from it's
> current format to a wiki
> 
> Just a thought
> 

And a great one I might add. Does anybody know how busy the current
site is? If not too busy (i.e.< 10GB a month) I'd gladly put up a wiki
on my server for it. If it get's busier I'll just have to move it to
another server in due course.

I've also gotten very frustrated with some old outdated information,
and especially the lack of information regarding the 2.6.x kernel.

All in favour...?

Regards

-- 

Kenneth Kalmer
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] stats
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Ed W



I guess the obvious question then is: How do we get it maintained?

Does anyone know where the current maintainers have disappeared?

Is anyone willing to take over that job?
 



I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and consider uploading the 
documentation there.  This would make it easier for people to 
contribute, and I think it shold be fairly easy to convert from it's 
current format to a wiki


Just a thought

Ed W
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Georg C. F. Greve
 || On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 12:19:54 +0200
 || Andreas Klauer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: 

 ak> www.lartc.org says:

 ak> "Linux Advanced Routing & Traffic Control HOWTO Current version
 ak> is 1.0.0 Files were last updated at 2004-03-31 00:11 CET (ie,
 ak> about 12108.1 hours ago)."

 ak> So yes, I'd guess it's not actively maintained.

Thanks for that quick reply.

I guess the obvious question then is: How do we get it maintained?

Does anyone know where the current maintainers have disappeared?

Is anyone willing to take over that job?

Regards,
Georg

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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Andreas Klauer
On Wednesday 17 August 2005 10:04, Georg C. F. Greve wrote:
> I never received any reaction from the HOWTO maintainers, not even
> when addressing them directly (see mail below).
>
> Given that a month has gone by: Is the HOWTO currently unmaintained?

www.lartc.org says:
"Linux Advanced Routing & Traffic Control HOWTO Current version is 1.0.0 
Files were last updated at 2004-03-31 00:11 CET (ie, about 12108.1 hours 
ago)."

So yes, I'd guess it's not actively maintained.

Andreas
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[LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Georg C. F. Greve
Hi,

more than a month ago I proposed an addition to the HOWTO to address a
certain packet classification problem/bug and how to fix it (see
http://mailman.ds9a.nl/pipermail/lartc/2005q3/016728.html).

I never received any reaction from the HOWTO maintainers, not even
when addressing them directly (see mail below).

Given that a month has gone by: Is the HOWTO currently unmaintained?

Regards,
Georg


--- Begin Message ---
--20050723180350+0200-4600352811890471214323957
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi,

some days ago, I encountered what turned out to be either a problem of
the HOWTO or the QDISC code itself. The start of the thread is:

 http://mailman.ds9a.nl/pipermail/lartc/2005q3/016716.html

and I came up with a short draft for the HOWTO that explains the
problem and gives the workaround, which you can find at

 http://mailman.ds9a.nl/pipermail/lartc/2005q3/016728.html

Could you please include this in the HOWTO?

Thanks,
Georg

=2D-=20
Georg C. F. Greve <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Free Software Foundation Europe  (http://fsfeurope.org)
Join the Fellowship and protect your freedom! (http://www.fsfe.org)

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-- 
Georg C. F. Greve <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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Re: [LARTC] (yet another) HTB question(s)

2005-08-17 Thread panca sorin

> 4) related to 3), I've tried to use a syntax like
this: > "tc
> clas add dev $ETH parent 1:0 classid 1:1 htb rate
$RATE
> ceil $CEIL", where CEIL > RATE , but the  max speed
I
> achieved was the RATE speed.

try to add 2-level root class:
tc qdisc add dev $ETH root handle 1: htb default FF
tc class add dev $ETH parent 1: classid 1:1 htb rate
$MAXRATE ceil $MAXRATE
tc class add dev $ETH parent 1:1 classid 1:2 htb rate
$MINRATE ceil $MAXRATE
tc class add ... [your child classes]

I don't know if it'll work but worth trying.




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Re: [LARTC] Plotting graphs ??WHAT TO PLOT?

2005-08-17 Thread Dmytro O. Redchuk
On Wed, Aug 17, 2005 at 04:10:28AM +0200, Alberto Torres wrote:
> Hello, i am writing a GUI for the tc. I am almost there, but i need
> some guideness...
> 
> For every class/qdisc i have the bytes sents, dropped, borrowed,
> overlimits data for statistics, and i want to plot them on a graph.
packets too
lended

tokens, ctokens

:-)

I like http://www2.ldc.net/~dor/py-htbstat/ though :)

> 
> What data and how would yuu find it usefull to see plotted on a graph?
> 
> I need you answers ;) I will post my GUI soon :)

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Re: [LARTC] (yet another) HTB question(s)

2005-08-17 Thread Dmytro O. Redchuk
On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 12:37:48PM -0700, Gabriel wrote:
> 1) when used on a router for shaping traffic done by
> clients connected to it, shaping is done on the interface
> connected to the cable/dsl modem. If I wanted to create
> classes for every client on the network, I would have to
> use iptables to mark packets (using -j MARK) and not
> filters because, according to
> http://www.docum.org/docum.org/kptd/ the shaping is done
> after the SNAT, so all the clients would have the src
> address rewritten with the public IP. Am I getting this
> right?
This page:
http://mailman.ds9a.nl/pipermail/lartc/2005q1/014656.html
(LARTC archive) contains a lot of useful links, one of them:
http://ebtables.sourceforge.net/br_fw_ia/PacketFlow.png

Note right bottom corner of that picture.

> 4) related to 3), I've tried to use a syntax like this: "tc
> clas add dev $ETH parent 1:0 classid 1:1 htb rate $RATE
> ceil $CEIL", where CEIL > RATE , but the  max speed I
> achieved was the RATE speed. After further reading, I found
> out that you can't (well, you can, there's no syntax error,
> but it's useless) specify CEIL for the class attached to
> the root qdisc because it doesn't have a parent to borrow
> from. So is there a way to simulate a variable bandwidth
> link or should I just set RATE to the highest possible
> value the bandwidth can reach?
http://luxik.cdi.cz/~devik/qos/htb/manual/userg.htm (6. Priorizing
bandwidth share) answers this question. Use qdisc inside qdisc.

> That's about it for now. :) Thanks
Thank you,

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