Re: RE: RE: RE: RE: Bus Error (Urgent)

[bhabani s pradhan]

yes that problem is resolved
actually there are two problems:
1] Solaris Error: 12: Not enough space
sys admin killed some processes and now other client machines can 
connect and work on the db

2]tnsping and sqlplus on one particular client machine give
Bus Error (core dumped)

seems its a disk corruption error (can that be?)

 from oracle's side where else can i see for this "Bus Error (core 
dumped)" error.

Regards
---

On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 Mladen Gogala wrote :
>Then, you have a problem with the number of processes on the OS 
>level. The
>investigation should continue on the server.
>
>--
>Mladen Gogala
>Oracle DBA
>
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: bhabani s pradhan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 5:46 PM
> > To: Mladen Gogala
> > Subject: Re: RE: RE: RE: Bus Error (Urgent)
> >
> >
> > its a 2gig memory
> >
> > shmsys:shminfo_shmmax=4294967295
> > shmsys:shminfo_shmmin=1
> >
> > parameter processes = 150
> >
> > and v$process returns 25
> >
> > ---
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 Mladen Gogala wrote :
> > >You don't have enough oracle processes on the server. 
>Increase
> > >"PROCESSES"
> > >parameter.
> > >You might need to adjust SHMMAX and SEMMNS in /etc/system
> > >
> > >--
> > >Mladen Gogala
> > >Oracle DBA
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > -Original Message-
> > > > From: bhabani s pradhan 
>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 5:34 PM
> > > > To: Mladen Gogala
> > > > Subject: Re: RE: RE: Bus Error (Urgent)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > donot know much about unix
> > > > shell variables are exported
> > > >
> > > >  from the client machine it soes not return anything:
> > WW_WS> truss
> > > > -o /tmp/truss.out -af tnsping tradedb1 WW_WS>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > i got this from the listener.log
> > > >
> > > > 12-SEP-2003 11:24:45 *
> > > >
> > 
> >(CONNECT_DATA=(SERVICE_NAME=TRADEDB1)(CID=(PROGRAM=)(HOST=trad
> > > > e-host2)(USER=rubix)))
> > > > * (ADDRESS=(PROTOCOL=tcp)(HOST=10.10.8.27)(PORT=40838)) 
>*
> > establish
> > > > * TRADEDB1 * 12500
> > > > TNS-12500: TNS:listener failed to start a dedicated server 
>process
> > > >   TNS-12540: TNS:internal limit restriction exceeded
> > > >TNS-12560: TNS:protocol adapter error
> > > > TNS-00510: Internal limit restriction exceeded
> > > >  Solaris Error: 12: Not enough space
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Regards
> > > > ===
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 Mladen Gogala wrote :
> > > > >OK, this seems to have been created with netca. Are 
>your
> > >shell
> > > > >variables
> > > > >exported? You should do "truss -o /tmp/truss.out -af
> > >tnsping
> > > > >tradedb1".
> > > > >That should tell you where does the error occur. Bus 
>error
> > >means
> > > > >that the
> > > > >process cannot connect to the server. It's very similar 
>in
> > >nature
> > > > >to
> > > > >ORA-3113.
> > > > >If it was oracle process you were trying to connect, 
>you'd
> > >get an
> > > > >oracle
> > > > >error,
> > > > >but your're getting bus error, which means that the 
>problem
> > >is on
> > > > >the OS
> > > > >level.
> > > > >Turn on tracing (TRACE_LEVEL=ADMIN in sqlnet.ora on 
>both
> > >server
> > > > >and client)
> > > > >and
> > > > >see what that gives you. What else can you tell me? Is
> > >there
> > > > >anything
> > > > >unusual
> > > > >in that combination? Did it work before? What has 
>changed?
> > >How
> > > > >much
> > > > >experience
> > > > >do you have with Unix and oracle?
> > > > >
> > > > >--
> > > > >Mladen Gogala
> > > > >

Re: RE: RE: RE: RE: Bus Error (Urgent)

[Mladen Gogala]

As I've said earlier, take a look at the server. Look in the alert.log.
On 2003.09.12 19:09, bhabani s pradhan wrote:
yes that problem is resolved
actually there are two problems:
1] Solaris Error: 12: Not enough space
sys admin killed some processes and now other client machines can
connect and work on the db
2]tnsping and sqlplus on one particular client machine give
Bus Error (core dumped)
seems its a disk corruption error (can that be?)

 from oracle's side where else can i see for this "Bus Error (core
dumped)" error.
Regards
---
On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 Mladen Gogala wrote :
>Then, you have a problem with the number of processes on the OS
>level. The
>investigation should continue on the server.
>
>--
>Mladen Gogala
>Oracle DBA
>
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: bhabani s pradhan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 5:46 PM
> > To: Mladen Gogala
> > Subject: Re: RE: RE: RE: Bus Error (Urgent)
> >
> >
> > its a 2gig memory
> >
> > shmsys:shminfo_shmmax=4294967295
> > shmsys:shminfo_shmmin=1
> >
> > parameter processes = 150
> >
> > and v$process returns 25
> >
> > ---
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 Mladen Gogala wrote :
> > >You don't have enough oracle processes on the server.
>Increase
> > >"PROCESSES"
> > >parameter.
> > >You might need to adjust SHMMAX and SEMMNS in /etc/system
> > >
> > >--
> > >Mladen Gogala
> > >Oracle DBA
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > -Original Message-
> > > > From: bhabani s pradhan
>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 5:34 PM
> > > > To: Mladen Gogala
> > > > Subject: Re: RE: RE: Bus Error (Urgent)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > donot know much about unix
> > > > shell variables are exported
> > > >
> > > >  from the client machine it soes not return anything:
> > WW_WS> truss
> > > > -o /tmp/truss.out -af tnsping tradedb1 WW_WS>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > i got this from the listener.log
> > > >
> > > > 12-SEP-2003 11:24:45 *
> > > >
> >
> >(CONNECT_DATA=(SERVICE_NAME=TRADEDB1)(CID=(PROGRAM=)(HOST=trad
> > > > e-host2)(USER=rubix)))
> > > > * (ADDRESS=(PROTOCOL=tcp)(HOST=10.10.8.27)(PORT=40838))
>*
> > establish
> > > > * TRADEDB1 * 12500
> > > > TNS-12500: TNS:listener failed to start a dedicated server
>process
> > > >   TNS-12540: TNS:internal limit restriction exceeded
> > > >TNS-12560: TNS:protocol adapter error
> > > > TNS-00510: Internal limit restriction exceeded
> > > >  Solaris Error: 12: Not enough space
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Regards
> > > > ===
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 Mladen Gogala wrote :
> > > > >OK, this seems to have been created with netca. Are
>your
> > >shell
> > > > >variables
> > > > >exported? You should do "truss -o /tmp/truss.out -af
> > >tnsping
> > > > >tradedb1".
> > > > >That should tell you where does the error occur. Bus
>error
> > >means
> > > > >that the
> > > > >process cannot connect to the server. It's very similar
>in
> > >nature
> > > > >to
> > > > >ORA-3113.
> > > > >If it was oracle process you were trying to connect,
>you'd
> > >get an
> > > > >oracle
> > > > >error,
> > > > >but your're getting bus error, which means that the
>problem
> > >is on
> > > > >the OS
> > > > >level.
> > > > >Turn on tracing (TRACE_LEVEL=ADMIN in sqlnet.ora on
>both
> > >server
> > > > >and client)
> > > > >and
> > > > >see what that gives you. What else can you tell me? Is
> > >there
> > > > >anything
> > > > >unusual
> > > > >in that combination? Did it work before? What has
>changed?
> > >How
> > > > >much
> > > > >experience
> > > > >do you have with Unix and oracle?
> &g

RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam

[Mohan, Ross]

Title: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam





Wow. Talk about enforcing "foreign constraints".


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 5:01 PM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Re:RE: RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam



Ross,


    When a B-52, otherwise known as a BUFF (Big Ugly Fat F^cker), unloads 150 to
200(B-52D with wing racks) 750LB demolition bombs nothing stands.  Even
duhvelopers.  I've had Marines discribe the area where a BUFF strike landed as
"It looked like God reached down, scooped out a three mile long by half a mile
wide, by 100 foot deep piece of the earth and take it away".  I don't know about
cool, but it sure was effective!!


Dick Goulet


Reply Separator____________________
Subject:    RE: RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/20/2001 4:28 PM


BUFF bomb. That sounds cool. Will it work on developers?


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 4:18 PM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Re:RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam



Ross,


    Makes sense, Nam was BUG heaven, unless they got caught in the path of a
BUFF bomb run.  Nothing survived that. :-)


Dick Goulet


Reply Separator
Subject:    RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/20/2001 8:02 AM


Dick , 


Didn't you know? Rachel WAS in Nam. But she 
never talks about it. I think it had to do
with the bugs. 


Just a thought. 


Ross


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 8:32 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Rachel,


    If you were given one, as I was in Nam, you'd not know the difference. 
Looks like, & tastes like a crunch bar for the most part, except for the
logo on
top.  It just crunches better.


Dick Goulet


Reply Separator
Author: "Rachel Carmichael" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/19/2001 4:10 PM


but Moom, the icky bugs TOUCHED the chocolate!   :)




>From: Kimberly Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: RE: RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
>Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 13:45:29 -0800
>
>You could just lick the chocolate off.
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 10:11 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> I have a phobia about bugs...
>
>what a waste of perfectly good chocolate
>
>
> >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Subject: Re:RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
> >Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 09:11:20 -0800
> >
> >OK you chocaholics try this on for size:
> >
> >  Reuters Monday, March 19, 2001
> >
> >Chocolate-Coated Bugs Are Latest Treat
> >
> >LONDON (Reuters) - Ants, crickets and scorpions, baked, coated
> >in chocolate and promoted as a high-protein snack, are proving
> >popular among peckish Londoners.
> >
> >Designer Todd Dalton, who trained as a chef in Louisiana and
> >acquired a taste for cooked insects on his travels in Asia and
> >central America, says he has sold 5,000 chocolate-coated bugs
> >since he began marketing them in December.
> >
> >"They are very high in protein and very low in fat. They have a
> >higher percentage of protein than any meat or fish that we
> >commonly eat," he told Reuters.
> >
> >The creepy-crawly chocs sell for between three and 3.50 pounds
> >($4.30-$5.00) at upmarket London stores such as Selfridges and
> >the Conran Shop and will soon be appearingin shops in Munich
> >and Zurich.
> >--
> >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> >--
> >Author:
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> >Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
> >San Diego, California    -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
> >
> >To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> >to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> >the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> >(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> >also send the HELP command for 

RE: RE: RE:

[Kevin Kostyszyn]

Reminds me of a bad joke...

What did the farmer say when his tractor broke?

-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 12:03 PM
To: Kevin Kostyszyn; [EMAIL PROTECTED]


Just because!

Reply Separator
Author: "Kevin Kostyszyn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   5/30/2001 11:42 AM

Oh my, but why?

-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 11:48 AM
To: Kevin Kostyszyn; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Ours is not to wonder why, ours is just to do or die!!

Reply Separator
Author: "Kevin Kostyszyn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   5/30/2001 7:02 AM

This person was actually allowed to teach.  Never ask why, yes that's a
super philosophy on life.

-Original Message-
Patrice J
Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 8:31 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


That's a laugh, I went to a continuing education seminar once at Carleton
University, in Ottawa.

The seminar was called Effective Living.

The teacher was a social worker, and he emphatically told everyone NEVER to
ask why, just adapt to life and keep moving...

I had unreconcilable disagreements with him, I guess I don't know how to
live.

: )

Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)


-Original Message-
From:   Don Granaman [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent:   Tuesday, May 29, 2001 4:11 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject:Re:

when?
But, more important, WHY???

-Don Granaman
[certifiable OraSaurus]

- Original Message -
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2001 1:28 PM


> And Where.
>
> Terry
>
> "Boivin, Patrice J" wrote:
>
> > When and how
> >
> > Patrice Boivin
> > Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From:   Kevin Kostyszyn [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent:   Tuesday, May 29, 2001 1:41 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Subject:RE:
> >
> > what
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > Andrea
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2001 11:47 AM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> > who
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
http://www.orafaq.com
> > --
> > Author: Quaglio Andrea
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX:
(858)
538-5051
> > San Diego, California-- Public Internet access /
Mailing
> > Lists
>


> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an
E-Mail
message
> > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of
'ListGuru') and
in
> > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB
ORACLE-L
> > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed
from).  You
may
> > also send the HELP command for other information (like
subscribing).
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
http://www.orafaq.com
> > --
> > Author: Kevin Kostyszyn
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX:
(858)
538-5051
> > San Diego, California-- Public Internet access /
Mailing
> > Lists
>


> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an
E-Mail
message
> > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of
'ListGuru') and
in
> > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB
ORACLE-L
> > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed
from).  You
may
> > also send the HELP command for other information (like
subscribing).
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> > --
> > Author: Boivin, Patrice J
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858)
538-5051
> > San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing
Lists
> >

> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail
message
 

RE: RE: RE:

[Christopher Spence]

Actually I say:

"You know what the farmer said when the cow died?"

"Geesh, it never did that before."

"Walking on water and developing software from a specification are easy if
both are frozen."

Christopher R. Spence
Oracle DBA
Fuelspot 



-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 1:07 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Reminds me of a bad joke...

What did the farmer say when his tractor broke?

-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 12:03 PM
To: Kevin Kostyszyn; [EMAIL PROTECTED]


Just because!

Reply Separator
Author: "Kevin Kostyszyn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   5/30/2001 11:42 AM

Oh my, but why?

-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 11:48 AM
To: Kevin Kostyszyn; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Ours is not to wonder why, ours is just to do or die!!

Reply Separator
Author: "Kevin Kostyszyn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   5/30/2001 7:02 AM

This person was actually allowed to teach.  Never ask why, yes that's a
super philosophy on life.

-Original Message-
Patrice J
Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 8:31 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


That's a laugh, I went to a continuing education seminar once at Carleton
University, in Ottawa.

The seminar was called Effective Living.

The teacher was a social worker, and he emphatically told everyone NEVER to
ask why, just adapt to life and keep moving...

I had unreconcilable disagreements with him, I guess I don't know how to
live.

: )

Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)


-Original Message-
From:   Don Granaman [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent:   Tuesday, May 29, 2001 4:11 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject:Re:

when?
But, more important, WHY???

-Don Granaman
[certifiable OraSaurus]

- Original Message -
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2001 1:28 PM


> And Where.
>
> Terry
>
> "Boivin, Patrice J" wrote:
>
> > When and how
> >
> > Patrice Boivin
> > Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From:   Kevin Kostyszyn [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent:   Tuesday, May 29, 2001 1:41 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Subject:RE:
> >
> > what
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > Andrea
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2001 11:47 AM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> > who
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
http://www.orafaq.com
> > --
> > Author: Quaglio Andrea
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX:
(858)
538-5051
> > San Diego, California-- Public Internet access /
Mailing
> > Lists
>


> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an
E-Mail
message
> > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of
'ListGuru') and
in
> > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB
ORACLE-L
> > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed
from).  You
may
> > also send the HELP command for other information (like
subscribing).
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
http://www.orafaq.com
> > --
> > Author: Kevin Kostyszyn
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX:
(858)
538-5051
> > San Diego, California-- Public Internet access /
Mailing
> > Lists
>


> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an
E-Mail
message
> > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of
'ListGuru') and
in
> > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB
ORACLE-L
> > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed
from).  You
may
> > also send the HELP command for other information (like
subscribing).
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> > --
> > Author: Boivin, Patrice J
> >   INET: 

RE: RE: RE:

[Kevin Kostyszyn]

Dam_...my tractor broke.

-Original Message-
Spence
Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 1:50 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Actually I say:

"You know what the farmer said when the cow died?"

"Geesh, it never did that before."

"Walking on water and developing software from a specification are easy if
both are frozen."

Christopher R. Spence
Oracle DBA
Fuelspot



-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 1:07 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Reminds me of a bad joke...

What did the farmer say when his tractor broke?

-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 12:03 PM
To: Kevin Kostyszyn; [EMAIL PROTECTED]


Just because!

Reply Separator
Author: "Kevin Kostyszyn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   5/30/2001 11:42 AM

Oh my, but why?

-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 11:48 AM
To: Kevin Kostyszyn; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Ours is not to wonder why, ours is just to do or die!!

Reply Separator
Author: "Kevin Kostyszyn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   5/30/2001 7:02 AM

This person was actually allowed to teach.  Never ask why, yes that's a
super philosophy on life.

-Original Message-
Patrice J
Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 8:31 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


That's a laugh, I went to a continuing education seminar once at Carleton
University, in Ottawa.

The seminar was called Effective Living.

The teacher was a social worker, and he emphatically told everyone NEVER to
ask why, just adapt to life and keep moving...

I had unreconcilable disagreements with him, I guess I don't know how to
live.

: )

Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)


-Original Message-
From:   Don Granaman [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent:   Tuesday, May 29, 2001 4:11 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject:Re:

when?
But, more important, WHY???

-Don Granaman
[certifiable OraSaurus]

- Original Message -
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2001 1:28 PM


> And Where.
>
> Terry
>
> "Boivin, Patrice J" wrote:
>
> > When and how
> >
> > Patrice Boivin
> > Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From:   Kevin Kostyszyn [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent:   Tuesday, May 29, 2001 1:41 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Subject:RE:
> >
> > what
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > Andrea
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2001 11:47 AM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> > who
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
http://www.orafaq.com
> > --
> > Author: Quaglio Andrea
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX:
(858)
538-5051
> > San Diego, California-- Public Internet access /
Mailing
> > Lists
>


> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an
E-Mail
message
> > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of
'ListGuru') and
in
> > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB
ORACLE-L
> > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed
from).  You
may
> > also send the HELP command for other information (like
subscribing).
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
http://www.orafaq.com
> > --
> > Author: Kevin Kostyszyn
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX:
(858)
538-5051
> > San Diego, California-- Public Internet access /
Mailing
> > Lists
>


> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an
E-Mail
message
> > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of
'ListGuru') and
in
> > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB
ORACLE-L
> > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed
from).  You
may
> > also send the HELP command for other information (like
subscribing).
> > --
 

RE: RE: RE: RE: Bus Error (Urgent)

[Mladen Gogala]

Then, you have a problem with the number of processes on the OS level. The
investigation should continue on the server.

--
Mladen Gogala
Oracle DBA 



> -Original Message-
> From: bhabani s pradhan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 5:46 PM
> To: Mladen Gogala
> Subject: Re: RE: RE: RE: Bus Error (Urgent)
> 
> 
> its a 2gig memory
> 
> shmsys:shminfo_shmmax=4294967295
> shmsys:shminfo_shmmin=1
> 
> parameter processes = 150
> 
> and v$process returns 25
> 
> ---
> 
> 
> 
> On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 Mladen Gogala wrote :
> >You don't have enough oracle processes on the server. Increase
> >"PROCESSES"
> >parameter.
> >You might need to adjust SHMMAX and SEMMNS in /etc/system
> >
> >--
> >Mladen Gogala
> >Oracle DBA
> >
> >
> >
> > > -Original Message-----
> > > From: bhabani s pradhan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 5:34 PM
> > > To: Mladen Gogala
> > > Subject: Re: RE: RE: Bus Error (Urgent)
> > >
> > >
> > > donot know much about unix
> > > shell variables are exported
> > >
> > >  from the client machine it soes not return anything: 
> WW_WS> truss 
> > > -o /tmp/truss.out -af tnsping tradedb1 WW_WS>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > i got this from the listener.log
> > >
> > > 12-SEP-2003 11:24:45 *
> > > 
> >(CONNECT_DATA=(SERVICE_NAME=TRADEDB1)(CID=(PROGRAM=)(HOST=trad
> > > e-host2)(USER=rubix)))
> > > * (ADDRESS=(PROTOCOL=tcp)(HOST=10.10.8.27)(PORT=40838)) * 
> establish 
> > > * TRADEDB1 * 12500
> > > TNS-12500: TNS:listener failed to start a dedicated server process
> > >   TNS-12540: TNS:internal limit restriction exceeded
> > >TNS-12560: TNS:protocol adapter error
> > > TNS-00510: Internal limit restriction exceeded
> > >  Solaris Error: 12: Not enough space
> > >
> > >
> > > Regards
> > > ===
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 Mladen Gogala wrote :
> > > >OK, this seems to have been created with netca. Are your
> >shell
> > > >variables
> > > >exported? You should do "truss -o /tmp/truss.out -af
> >tnsping
> > > >tradedb1".
> > > >That should tell you where does the error occur. Bus error
> >means
> > > >that the
> > > >process cannot connect to the server. It's very similar in
> >nature
> > > >to
> > > >ORA-3113.
> > > >If it was oracle process you were trying to connect, you'd
> >get an
> > > >oracle
> > > >error,
> > > >but your're getting bus error, which means that the problem
> >is on
> > > >the OS
> > > >level.
> > > >Turn on tracing (TRACE_LEVEL=ADMIN in sqlnet.ora on both
> >server
> > > >and client)
> > > >and
> > > >see what that gives you. What else can you tell me? Is
> >there
> > > >anything
> > > >unusual
> > > >in that combination? Did it work before? What has changed?
> >How
> > > >much
> > > >experience
> > > >do you have with Unix and oracle?
> > > >
> > > >--
> > > >Mladen Gogala
> > > >Oracle DBA
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > -Original Message-
> > > > > From: bhabani s pradhan
> >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > > Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 5:03 PM
> > > > > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > > > > Cc: Mladen Gogala
> > > > > Subject: Re: RE: Bus Error (Urgent)
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > both client and server on Sun OS 5.8
> > > > >
> > > > > ORACLE_HOME and ORACLE_SID in .profile
> > > > >
> > > > > tnsnames.ora
> > > > > 
> > > > > TRADEDB1 =
> > > > >(DESCRIPTION =
> > > > >  (ADDRESS_LIST =
> > > > >(ADDRESS = (PROTOCOL = TCP)(HOST = trade-db1)(PORT
> >=
> > > > > 1521))
> > > > >  )
> > > > >  (CONNECT_DATA =
> > > > >(SERVICE_NAME = TRADEDB1)
> > > 

RE: RE: RE: Backups

[Smith, Ron L.]

SQL Backtrack and Netbackup! No manual tracking.  Restores couldn't be
simpler.

R. Smith

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 3:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Richard,

Distateful is being nice.  Try down right horrifying is a more
appriopriate
description.  Been There, Done that, now have three Unix SA's who handle it.

Life is so grand!!

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Markham; Richard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/3/2002 10:53 AM

Yes I personally run Veritas Netbackup for both cold and RMAN.  A fiber
SAN has its added benefits as well =).  I have never really explored the
implications of these other utilities.  My head filled with many
distasteful visuals. Yes, I agree with you and I realize that I am
spoiled .

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 1:38 PM
To: Markham; Richard; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I've used cpio, dd, and fbackup to do hot and cold backups before, but never
again.  With those utilities the burden of keeping track of what is on which
tape rests with you and normally a stubby pencil & pad of paper because you
know
what won't be available when you need to do a recovery.  They do work be
assured, but the administrative overhead is just not worth it anymore, even
for
a small shop.  Get a copy of Veritas or OmniBack or some other software
package
that does library management for you and preferably integrates with RMAN.
Life
can be so much easier!!

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Markham; Richard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/3/2002 10:03 AM

It would be interesting to see how you would explain how either
cp or dd (which know nothing of archive log mode, or the concept
of hot backup, itself, none the less) is going to keep things
consistent, when these utilities themselves are for point in 
time operations.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 12:18 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


This doesn't sound right.  Put the database in hot backup mode,
backup (whether using cp to a staging point like the poster here
is doing or straight to tape using dd or dump or some other utility),
come out of hot backup mode.  Why wouldn't you be able to recover? 

John P Weatherman
Database Administrator
Replacements Ltd.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 10:18 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


If you want to be able to use any OS backup for restore/recovery that
database must be closed when you do the backup.  If it is not, you won't be
able to recover.

Just a thot,
Ruth

- Original Message -
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 9:08 AM


Robyn,
 We used the DD method on pre 7.1 oracle with RAW devices. It worked
fine except that it  used a lot of tape dumping a raw device when only a
small portion was used. Using a dd command to place a copy of the data
on tape should not be a problem if a restoral is needed. The dd function
is just another OS method of copying data to a tape. I don't know for
sure but I think there might be some issues about transportability of
the dd tape.
Other users will know about the transportability issues.
Ron
 ROR mª¿ªm

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10/02/02 08:08PM >>>
Hello,

I need some info about backups.  I am working on a customer site, and
have implemented both exports and hot backups.  Both jobs copy to a
separate mount point, and a job scripted by another individual then
moves the files to tape.

Here's the problem - he's using a dd command, primarily because it
provides a succinct output he can email to non-technicals.  The file
system is built on a 12 disk A1000 array.  We've provided him with a
ufsdump script, but he's doesn't want to use it. Can the system be
recovered from this tape?  Has anyone ever relied on a dd for a daily
backup method? The system is Oracle 9i on Solaris 8.

Robyn

--
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
--
Author: Robyn Anderson Sands
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services
-
To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
--
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
--
Author: Ron Rogers
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services
-

RE: RE: RE: Backups

[Jared . Still]

Unless:

You do a point in time recovery, find out you were
given the wrong time, and try  to do it again.

Not so simple, can't be done from the SQL*Bactrack menu.

Jared






"Smith, Ron L." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 10/03/2002 01:26 PM
 Please respond to ORACLE-L

 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
cc: 
        Subject:RE: RE: RE: Backups


SQL Backtrack and Netbackup! No manual tracking.  Restores couldn't be
simpler.

R. Smith

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 3:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Richard,

Distateful is being nice.  Try down right horrifying is a more
appriopriate
description.  Been There, Done that, now have three Unix SA's who handle 
it.

Life is so grand!!

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Markham; Richard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/3/2002 10:53 AM

Yes I personally run Veritas Netbackup for both cold and RMAN.  A fiber
SAN has its added benefits as well =).  I have never really explored the
implications of these other utilities.  My head filled with many
distasteful visuals. Yes, I agree with you and I realize that I am
spoiled .

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 1:38 PM
To: Markham; Richard; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I've used cpio, dd, and fbackup to do hot and cold backups before, but 
never
again.  With those utilities the burden of keeping track of what is on 
which
tape rests with you and normally a stubby pencil & pad of paper because 
you
know
what won't be available when you need to do a recovery.  They do work be
assured, but the administrative overhead is just not worth it anymore, 
even
for
a small shop.  Get a copy of Veritas or OmniBack or some other software
package
that does library management for you and preferably integrates with RMAN.
Life
can be so much easier!!

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Markham; Richard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/3/2002 10:03 AM

It would be interesting to see how you would explain how either
cp or dd (which know nothing of archive log mode, or the concept
of hot backup, itself, none the less) is going to keep things
consistent, when these utilities themselves are for point in 
time operations.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 12:18 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


This doesn't sound right.  Put the database in hot backup mode,
backup (whether using cp to a staging point like the poster here
is doing or straight to tape using dd or dump or some other utility),
come out of hot backup mode.  Why wouldn't you be able to recover? 

John P Weatherman
Database Administrator
Replacements Ltd.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 10:18 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


If you want to be able to use any OS backup for restore/recovery that
database must be closed when you do the backup.  If it is not, you won't 
be
able to recover.

Just a thot,
Ruth

- Original Message -
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 9:08 AM


Robyn,
 We used the DD method on pre 7.1 oracle with RAW devices. It worked
fine except that it  used a lot of tape dumping a raw device when only a
small portion was used. Using a dd command to place a copy of the data
on tape should not be a problem if a restoral is needed. The dd function
is just another OS method of copying data to a tape. I don't know for
sure but I think there might be some issues about transportability of
the dd tape.
Other users will know about the transportability issues.
Ron
 ROR mª¿ªm

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10/02/02 08:08PM >>>
Hello,

I need some info about backups.  I am working on a customer site, and
have implemented both exports and hot backups.  Both jobs copy to a
separate mount point, and a job scripted by another individual then
moves the files to tape.

Here's the problem - he's using a dd command, primarily because it
provides a succinct output he can email to non-technicals.  The file
system is built on a 12 disk A1000 array.  We've provided him with a
ufsdump script, but he's doesn't want to use it. Can the system be
recovered from this tape?  Has anyone ever relied on a dd for a daily
backup method? The system is Oracle 9i on Solaris 8.

Robyn

--
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
--
Author: Robyn Anderson Sands
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services
-
To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, s

RE: RE: RE: Backups

[Smith, Ron L.]

You must be using an old version.  Been there done that.  Works!

Ron

PS: Also works on NT!

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 4:11 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Unless:

You do a point in time recovery, find out you were
given the wrong time, and try  to do it again.

Not so simple, can't be done from the SQL*Bactrack menu.

Jared






"Smith, Ron L." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 10/03/2002 01:26 PM
 Please respond to ORACLE-L

 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
cc: 
        Subject:RE: RE: RE: Backups


SQL Backtrack and Netbackup! No manual tracking.  Restores couldn't be
simpler.

R. Smith

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 3:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Richard,

Distateful is being nice.  Try down right horrifying is a more
appriopriate
description.  Been There, Done that, now have three Unix SA's who handle 
it.

Life is so grand!!

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Markham; Richard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/3/2002 10:53 AM

Yes I personally run Veritas Netbackup for both cold and RMAN.  A fiber
SAN has its added benefits as well =).  I have never really explored the
implications of these other utilities.  My head filled with many
distasteful visuals. Yes, I agree with you and I realize that I am
spoiled .

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 1:38 PM
To: Markham; Richard; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I've used cpio, dd, and fbackup to do hot and cold backups before, but 
never
again.  With those utilities the burden of keeping track of what is on 
which
tape rests with you and normally a stubby pencil & pad of paper because 
you
know
what won't be available when you need to do a recovery.  They do work be
assured, but the administrative overhead is just not worth it anymore, 
even
for
a small shop.  Get a copy of Veritas or OmniBack or some other software
package
that does library management for you and preferably integrates with RMAN.
Life
can be so much easier!!

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Markham; Richard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/3/2002 10:03 AM

It would be interesting to see how you would explain how either
cp or dd (which know nothing of archive log mode, or the concept
of hot backup, itself, none the less) is going to keep things
consistent, when these utilities themselves are for point in 
time operations.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 12:18 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


This doesn't sound right.  Put the database in hot backup mode,
backup (whether using cp to a staging point like the poster here
is doing or straight to tape using dd or dump or some other utility),
come out of hot backup mode.  Why wouldn't you be able to recover? 

John P Weatherman
Database Administrator
Replacements Ltd.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 10:18 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


If you want to be able to use any OS backup for restore/recovery that
database must be closed when you do the backup.  If it is not, you won't 
be
able to recover.

Just a thot,
Ruth

- Original Message -
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 9:08 AM


Robyn,
 We used the DD method on pre 7.1 oracle with RAW devices. It worked
fine except that it  used a lot of tape dumping a raw device when only a
small portion was used. Using a dd command to place a copy of the data
on tape should not be a problem if a restoral is needed. The dd function
is just another OS method of copying data to a tape. I don't know for
sure but I think there might be some issues about transportability of
the dd tape.
Other users will know about the transportability issues.
Ron
 ROR mª¿ªm

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10/02/02 08:08PM >>>
Hello,

I need some info about backups.  I am working on a customer site, and
have implemented both exports and hot backups.  Both jobs copy to a
separate mount point, and a job scripted by another individual then
moves the files to tape.

Here's the problem - he's using a dd command, primarily because it
provides a succinct output he can email to non-technicals.  The file
system is built on a 12 disk A1000 array.  We've provided him with a
ufsdump script, but he's doesn't want to use it. Can the system be
recovered from this tape?  Has anyone ever relied on a dd for a daily
backup method? The system is Oracle 9i on Solaris 8.

Robyn

--
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
--
Author: Robyn Anderson Sands
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 htt

RE: RE: RE: Backups

[Jared . Still]

Not using any version of it now.

Veritas Net Backup and RMAN.

When BMC purchased DataTools, the support for SQL*Backtrack
really went down the tubes.  I don't know if it's improved or not, but
I don't really miss it now.

Jared





"Smith, Ron L." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 10/03/2002 02:38 PM
 Please respond to ORACLE-L

 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
        cc: 
Subject:RE: RE: RE: Backups


You must be using an old version.  Been there done that.  Works!

Ron

PS: Also works on NT!

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 4:11 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Unless:

You do a point in time recovery, find out you were
given the wrong time, and try  to do it again.

Not so simple, can't be done from the SQL*Bactrack menu.

Jared






"Smith, Ron L." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 10/03/2002 01:26 PM
 Please respond to ORACLE-L

 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
cc: 
Subject:RE: RE: RE: Backups


SQL Backtrack and Netbackup! No manual tracking.  Restores couldn't be
simpler.

R. Smith

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 3:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Richard,

Distateful is being nice.  Try down right horrifying is a more
appriopriate
description.  Been There, Done that, now have three Unix SA's who handle 
it.

Life is so grand!!

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Markham; Richard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/3/2002 10:53 AM

Yes I personally run Veritas Netbackup for both cold and RMAN.  A fiber
SAN has its added benefits as well =).  I have never really explored the
implications of these other utilities.  My head filled with many
distasteful visuals. Yes, I agree with you and I realize that I am
spoiled .

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 1:38 PM
To: Markham; Richard; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I've used cpio, dd, and fbackup to do hot and cold backups before, but 
never
again.  With those utilities the burden of keeping track of what is on 
which
tape rests with you and normally a stubby pencil & pad of paper because 
you
know
what won't be available when you need to do a recovery.  They do work be
assured, but the administrative overhead is just not worth it anymore, 
even
for
a small shop.  Get a copy of Veritas or OmniBack or some other software
package
that does library management for you and preferably integrates with RMAN.
Life
can be so much easier!!

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Markham; Richard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/3/2002 10:03 AM

It would be interesting to see how you would explain how either
cp or dd (which know nothing of archive log mode, or the concept
of hot backup, itself, none the less) is going to keep things
consistent, when these utilities themselves are for point in 
time operations.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 12:18 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


This doesn't sound right.  Put the database in hot backup mode,
backup (whether using cp to a staging point like the poster here
is doing or straight to tape using dd or dump or some other utility),
come out of hot backup mode.  Why wouldn't you be able to recover? 

John P Weatherman
Database Administrator
Replacements Ltd.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 10:18 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


If you want to be able to use any OS backup for restore/recovery that
database must be closed when you do the backup.  If it is not, you won't 
be
able to recover.

Just a thot,
Ruth

- Original Message -
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 9:08 AM


Robyn,
 We used the DD method on pre 7.1 oracle with RAW devices. It worked
fine except that it  used a lot of tape dumping a raw device when only a
small portion was used. Using a dd command to place a copy of the data
on tape should not be a problem if a restoral is needed. The dd function
is just another OS method of copying data to a tape. I don't know for
sure but I think there might be some issues about transportability of
the dd tape.
Other users will know about the transportability issues.
Ron
 ROR mª¿ªm

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10/02/02 08:08PM >>>
Hello,

I need some info about backups.  I am working on a customer site, and
have implemented both exports and hot backups.  Both jobs copy to a
separate mount point, and a job scripted by another individual then
moves the files to tape.

Here's the problem - he's using a dd command, primarily because it
p

RE: Re: Re: Migration

[Stephane Faroult]

Tanel,

  Any idea about speed and temporary storage requirements? Especially for 32G+ 
datafiles ;-) ?
  Wondering if it will really be useful in practice, compared to what is available 
today. Well, it may do for simpler operations, but not necessarily faster.

SF

>- --- Original Message --- -
>From: "Tanel Poder" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 07:49:26
>
>You can't just copy over the files with os commands
>and hope that Oracle
>will somehow recognize them.
>You have to use RMANs new convert tablespace
>command to do the byte order
>conversion.
>
>Tanel.
>
>- Original Message - 
>To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L"
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Monday, November 10, 2003 4:54 PM
>
>
>> It raises an interesting question. As of today,
>we have datafiles which
>are OS dependent and _not_ binary compatible from
>one system to another. We
>upgrade to 10g and it will become magically binary
>compatible. Which means
>that the upgrade process will do more intimate
>things than updating some
>file header block, creating a couple of new tables
>in the data dictionary
>and recreating view.
>>
>> Has anybody tried to upgrade from 9.x to 10g yet,
>on some database of
>decent size ?
>>
>> SF
>>
>> >- --- Original Message --- -
>> >From: "Yechiel Adar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >Sent: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 05:54:25
>> >
>> >Wait for 10g. They say that you could just copy
>the
>> >datafiles and them plug
>> >them in to he new database, even across
>platforms.
>> >
>> >Yechiel Adar
>> >Mehish
>> >- Original Message -
>> >To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L"
>> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >Sent: Monday, November 10, 2003 12:24 AM
>> >
>> >
>> >> Hi List,
>> >>
>> >> Could someone please help me?
>> >>
>> >> Assumption situation - Platform migration of
>> >Oracle DW on Oracle DB (data
>> >> volume 3.5 TB) from HP-UX to IBM-AIX
>> >>
>> >>   1.. DB migration; it is correct to use
>> >Export/Import technique/method in
>> >> the above assumption?
>> >>   2..  Witch is the time frame in a worst case
>
>> >for this (how many hours,
>> >> days or weeks!!)?
>> >>   3.. It is possible to apply the mentioned
>> >technique or some other (witch
>> >> one?) in uptime, totally or partially?
>> >>   4.. Witches are the main tasks to consider
>in a
>> >planning schedule?
>> >>   5.. Witches are the time frames associated
>to
>> >these tasks?
>> >> Thanks
>> >> Arm>o Teles
>> >>
>> >>
>> -- 
-- 
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-- 
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Re: Re: Re: Migration

[Tanel Poder]

Well, I don't know about it's performance, but I think this conversion
doesn't require any temporary space, because the byte values of some
structures in blocks have to be swapped, and this a trivial operation.

I think it may still be faster, especially if we are dealing with huge
amounts of data, swapping bytes in blocks is faster than reading and parsing
data through buffer cache, transferring it over sqlnet and formatting +
writing it back to datablocks...

Tanel.

- Original Message - 
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, November 10, 2003 6:14 PM


> Tanel,
>
>   Any idea about speed and temporary storage requirements? Especially for
32G+ datafiles ;-) ?
>   Wondering if it will really be useful in practice, compared to what is
available today. Well, it may do for simpler operations, but not necessarily
faster.
>
> SF
>
> >- --- Original Message --- -
> >From: "Tanel Poder" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Sent: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 07:49:26
> >
> >You can't just copy over the files with os commands
> >and hope that Oracle
> >will somehow recognize them.
> >You have to use RMANs new convert tablespace
> >command to do the byte order
> >conversion.
> >
> >Tanel.
> >
> >- Original Message - 
> >To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L"
> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Sent: Monday, November 10, 2003 4:54 PM
> >
> >
> >> It raises an interesting question. As of today,
> >we have datafiles which
> >are OS dependent and _not_ binary compatible from
> >one system to another. We
> >upgrade to 10g and it will become magically binary
> >compatible. Which means
> >that the upgrade process will do more intimate
> >things than updating some
> >file header block, creating a couple of new tables
> >in the data dictionary
> >and recreating view.
> >>
> >> Has anybody tried to upgrade from 9.x to 10g yet,
> >on some database of
> >decent size ?
> >>
> >> SF
> >>
> >> >- --- Original Message --- -
> >> >From: "Yechiel Adar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> >Sent: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 05:54:25
> >> >
> >> >Wait for 10g. They say that you could just copy
> >the
> >> >datafiles and them plug
> >> >them in to he new database, even across
> >platforms.
> >> >
> >> >Yechiel Adar
> >> >Mehish
> >> >- Original Message -
> >> >To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L"
> >> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> >Sent: Monday, November 10, 2003 12:24 AM
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >> Hi List,
> >> >>
> >> >> Could someone please help me?
> >> >>
> >> >> Assumption situation - Platform migration of
> >> >Oracle DW on Oracle DB (data
> >> >> volume 3.5 TB) from HP-UX to IBM-AIX
> >> >>
> >> >> 1.. DB migration; it is correct to use
> >> >Export/Import technique/method in
> >> >> the above assumption?
> >> >> 2..  Witch is the time frame in a worst case
> >
> >> >for this (how many hours,
> >> >> days or weeks!!)?
> >> >> 3.. It is possible to apply the mentioned
> >> >technique or some other (witch
> >> >> one?) in uptime, totally or partially?
> >> >> 4.. Witches are the main tasks to consider
> >in a
> >> >planning schedule?
> >> >> 5.. Witches are the time frames associated
> >to
> >> >these tasks?
> >> >> Thanks
> >> >> Arm>o Teles
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> -- 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> -- 
> Author: Stephane Faroult
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
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> also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
>


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Author: Tanel Poder
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: RE: RE: Rant

[Gogala, Mladen]

Do you believe them? 

Mladen Gogala
Oracle DBA
Phone: (203) 459-6855
Email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]



> -Original Message-
> From: ltiu [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 6:02 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject: Re:RE: RE: Rant
> 
> 
> IBM's latest DB2 claims to do this. Self monitoring, self healing.
> 
> ltiu
> 
> Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
> 
> > Right and the database will tell the end user where to park 
> his/her stupid
> > cartesian product sql statement!!
> > 
> > Sometime after I'm dead and buried I'm sure.
> > 
> > Dick Goulet
> > 
> > Reply Separator
> > Author: "Gogala; Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Date:   7/22/2002 12:14 PM
> > 
> > What happened to the dream about the database that doesn't need 
> > a DBA? Something like that was announced for the version 27i.
> > You know, everything will tune itself, database engine will
> > tap directly into the user's mind and, based on that, define the 
> > best possible access path. Of course, the instance would spread 
> > iself ideally accross the available disks, allocate the optimum 
> > amount of memory, tune its parameters and deinstall any MS Office 
> > products from the machine. Sort of Larry Ellison's version of
> > "I have a dream" speach.
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: ltiu
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
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> also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> 
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RE: RE: RE: Rant

[Sunil_Nookala]

what about self destruction??

Sunil
> -Original Message-
> From: ltiu [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 6:02 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject: Re:RE: RE: Rant
> 
> 
> IBM's latest DB2 claims to do this. Self monitoring, self healing.
> 
> ltiu
> 
> Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
> 
> > Right and the database will tell the end user where to park 
> his/her stupid
> > cartesian product sql statement!!
> > 
> > Sometime after I'm dead and buried I'm sure.
> > 
> > Dick Goulet
> > 
> > Reply Separator
> > Author: "Gogala; Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Date:   7/22/2002 12:14 PM
> > 
> > What happened to the dream about the database that doesn't need 
> > a DBA? Something like that was announced for the version 27i.
> > You know, everything will tune itself, database engine will
> > tap directly into the user's mind and, based on that, define the 
> > best possible access path. Of course, the instance would spread 
> > iself ideally accross the available disks, allocate the optimum 
> > amount of memory, tune its parameters and deinstall any MS Office 
> > products from the machine. Sort of Larry Ellison's version of
> > "I have a dream" speach.
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: ltiu
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
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> also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
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Author: Gogala, Mladen
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Author: 
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RE: RE: RE: Rant

[Orr, Steve]

Sounds like a movie I watched this weekend... "Species." It's all science
fiction to me.


-Original Message-
Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 4:02 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


IBM's latest DB2 claims to do this. Self monitoring, self healing.

ltiu

Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

> Right and the database will tell the end user where to park his/her stupid
> cartesian product sql statement!!
> 
> Sometime after I'm dead and buried I'm sure.
> 
> Dick Goulet
> 
> Reply Separator
> Author: "Gogala; Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date:   7/22/2002 12:14 PM
> 
> What happened to the dream about the database that doesn't need 
> a DBA? Something like that was announced for the version 27i.
> You know, everything will tune itself, database engine will
> tap directly into the user's mind and, based on that, define the 
> best possible access path. Of course, the instance would spread 
> iself ideally accross the available disks, allocate the optimum 
> amount of memory, tune its parameters and deinstall any MS Office 
> products from the machine. Sort of Larry Ellison's version of
> "I have a dream" speach.
> 
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Orr, Steve
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: RE: RE: Rant

[ltiu]

Yes. I do. Because they're IBM.

Quoting "Gogala, Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> Do you believe them? 
> 
> Mladen Gogala
> Oracle DBA
> Phone: (203) 459-6855
> Email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> 
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: ltiu [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 6:02 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Subject: Re:RE: RE: Rant
> > 
> > 
> > IBM's latest DB2 claims to do this. Self monitoring, self healing.
> > 
> > ltiu
> > 
> > Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
> > 
> > > Right and the database will tell the end user where to park 
> > his/her stupid
> > > cartesian product sql statement!!
> > > 
> > > Sometime after I'm dead and buried I'm sure.
> > > 
> > > Dick Goulet
> > > 
> > > Reply Separator
> > > Author: "Gogala; Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > Date:   7/22/2002 12:14 PM
> > > 
> > > What happened to the dream about the database that doesn't need 
> > > a DBA? Something like that was announced for the version 27i.
> > > You know, everything will tune itself, database engine will
> > > tap directly into the user's mind and, based on that, define the 
> > > best possible access path. Of course, the instance would spread 
> > > iself ideally accross the available disks, allocate the optimum 
> > > amount of memory, tune its parameters and deinstall any MS Office 
> > > products from the machine. Sort of Larry Ellison's version of
> > > "I have a dream" speach.
> > > 
> > 
> > -- 
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> > -- 
> > Author: ltiu
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > 
> > Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
> > San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
> > 
> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> > 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: Gogala, Mladen
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
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> 




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Author: ltiu
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RE: RE: RE: Rant

[Boivin, Patrice J]

Self-healing... did it have gaping wounds before?

Regards,
Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)

-Original Message-
Sent:   Monday, July 22, 2002 8:02 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject:RE: RE: RE: Rant

Yes. I do. Because they're IBM.

Quoting "Gogala, Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> Do you believe them? 
> 
> Mladen Gogala
> Oracle DBA
> Phone: (203) 459-6855
> Email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> 
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: ltiu [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 6:02 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Subject: Re:RE: RE: Rant
> > 
> > 
> > IBM's latest DB2 claims to do this. Self monitoring, self healing.
> > 
> > ltiu
> > 
> > Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
> > 
> > > Right and the database will tell the end user where to park 
> > his/her stupid
> > > cartesian product sql statement!!
> > > 
> > > Sometime after I'm dead and buried I'm sure.
> > > 
> > > Dick Goulet
> > > 
> > > Reply Separator
> > > Author: "Gogala; Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > Date:   7/22/2002 12:14 PM
> > > 
> > > What happened to the dream about the database that doesn't need 
> > > a DBA? Something like that was announced for the version 27i.
> > > You know, everything will tune itself, database engine will
> > > tap directly into the user's mind and, based on that, define the 
> > > best possible access path. Of course, the instance would spread 
> > > iself ideally accross the available disks, allocate the optimum 
> > > amount of memory, tune its parameters and deinstall any MS Office 
> > > products from the machine. Sort of Larry Ellison's version of
> > > "I have a dream" speach.
> > > 
> > 
> > -- 
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> > -- 
> > Author: ltiu
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > 
> > Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
> > San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
> > 
> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> > 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: Gogala, Mladen
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
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> (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> 




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Author: ltiu
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: RE: RE: Rant

[ltiu]

Yes, of course. Because they are not Oracle.

On Monday 22 July 2002 19:08, you wrote:
> Self-healing... did it have gaping wounds before?
>
> Regards,
> Patrice Boivin
> Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
>
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 8:02 PM
> To:   Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject:  RE: RE: RE: Rant
>
> Yes. I do. Because they're IBM.
>
> Quoting "Gogala, Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> > Do you believe them?
> >
> > Mladen Gogala
> > Oracle DBA
> > Phone: (203) 459-6855
> > Email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: ltiu [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > > Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 6:02 PM
> > > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > > Subject: Re:RE: RE: Rant
> > >
> > >
> > > IBM's latest DB2 claims to do this. Self monitoring, self healing.
> > >
> > > ltiu
> > >
> > > Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
> > > > Right and the database will tell the end user where to park
> > >
> > > his/her stupid
> > >
> > > > cartesian product sql statement!!
> > > >
> > > > Sometime after I'm dead and buried I'm sure.
> > > >
> > > > Dick Goulet
> > > >
> > > > Reply Separator
> > > > Author: "Gogala; Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > > Date:   7/22/2002 12:14 PM
> > > >
> > > > What happened to the dream about the database that doesn't need
> > > > a DBA? Something like that was announced for the version 27i.
> > > > You know, everything will tune itself, database engine will
> > > > tap directly into the user's mind and, based on that, define the
> > > > best possible access path. Of course, the instance would spread
> > > > iself ideally accross the available disks, allocate the optimum
> > > > amount of memory, tune its parameters and deinstall any MS Office
> > > > products from the machine. Sort of Larry Ellison's version of
> > > > "I have a dream" speach.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> > > --
> > > Author: ltiu
> > >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >
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> > > 
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> > > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> > > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> >
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
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> > Author: Gogala, Mladen
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
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-- 
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RE: RE: RE: Siebel.

[Mohan, Ross]

Dick, 

question for yaif you "owned" Siebel, lock, stock and barrel,
what would you do?

1) Fix and switch ALL RI to the database ( oracle and ms and ibm and others)
2) Just fix it where it is broken, but leave it in the app itself
3) leave it out but publish a tech spec document telling users/DBAs how
and where to implement RI constraints.
4) something else. 

I am curious how you would solve Tom Siebel's problem of shipping an app
across, say, four or five major different dbms platforms while
simultaneously
keeping bugs, development costs , requiring consulting and document costs
down, 
and upgrade schedules and bug fixes in place. 

In other words...if you were "god" how would you fix this problem you see?

curious, 

Ross

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2001 4:30 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Dennis,

You ought to be a sales droid!  That was a perfectly worded reply and in
MANY instances I'll agree with you.  The ease or of lack thereof in
administering an application is very often decided on by damagement by
whether
or not they need a dedicated/specialized resource to handle it.  Therefore
sales
droids will constantly downplay that requirement, until the check is in
hand. 
Actually sales droids downplay a lot of requirements for their software
until
the deal is in the bank.  Then they drop the bomb.  And then people like us
are
left to clean up.

Dick Goulet

-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Mohan, Ross
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: RE: RE: Siebel.

[Linda . Miller-Coker]

You'd almost have to be God to fix it.it consists of 1000s of tables.
It took me 2 weeks to reverse into Designer.  My customer is not welling to
pay for the time to fix the design.




"Mohan, Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>@fatcity.com on 11/29/2001 04:17:58 PM

Please respond to [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Sent by:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]


To:   Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
cc:


Dick,

question for yaif you "owned" Siebel, lock, stock and barrel,
what would you do?

1) Fix and switch ALL RI to the database ( oracle and ms and ibm and
others)
2) Just fix it where it is broken, but leave it in the app itself
3) leave it out but publish a tech spec document telling users/DBAs how
 and where to implement RI constraints.
4) something else.

I am curious how you would solve Tom Siebel's problem of shipping an app
across, say, four or five major different dbms platforms while
simultaneously
keeping bugs, development costs , requiring consulting and document costs
down,
and upgrade schedules and bug fixes in place.

In other words...if you were "god" how would you fix this problem you see?

curious,

Ross

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2001 4:30 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Dennis,

You ought to be a sales droid!  That was a perfectly worded reply and
in
MANY instances I'll agree with you.  The ease or of lack thereof in
administering an application is very often decided on by damagement by
whether
or not they need a dedicated/specialized resource to handle it.  Therefore
sales
droids will constantly downplay that requirement, until the check is in
hand.
Actually sales droids downplay a lot of requirements for their software
until
the deal is in the bank.  Then they drop the bomb.  And then people like us
are
left to clean up.

Dick Goulet

--
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
--
Author: Mohan, Ross
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: RE: Re: NYOUG

[Jim Hawkins]

Rachel,

SLOUG would definitely pay your travel expenses, and since our meetings run from 1PM 
to 5PM, it could really amount to just a day trip for you if you want.  You could fly 
in that morning, have some lunch, deliver your topic, then take off (unless you wanted 
to see the city of St. Louis or something).  We meet every other month, and the next 
meeting is in April (the third Thursday).  I realize this could be too soon, so maybe 
the June or August meeting.  Or, I totally understand if you've decided to give up the 
speaking gig altogether, so don't feel bad saying "NO!"

And also, thanks for the other information about finding speakers.

Jim

P.S.  Our website is www.sloug.org in case you are interested.

Rachel Carmichael <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>Jim,
>
>I might be interested in speaking, depends on dates and if the user
>group pays expenses :)  I am  supposedly cutting back on doing
>presentations.
>
>Meanwhile, NYOUG doesn't pay expenses, but unlike most other user
>groups I've been to, we have a significant number of speakers. Most
>others have 2-3 speakers for the day and we have 11 speakers each
>meeting.  We are changing this for our September meeting and going
>forward, we will continue to have a keynote but will have 4
>presentation time slots rather than 5, giving speakers a few more
>minutes for questions, and to allow the next speaker to set up while
>the prior speaker is still answering questions.
>
>As to how I get speakers... we post a call for papers on our website
>and I've gotten some excellent speakers that way. I go to conferences
>and buttonhole people there who are good speakers. NYOUG has an
>excellent member base and they on occasion ask to present. I beg and
>plead and grovel before my friends as well :)  The other members of the
>board also beat up (er, persuade) people they meet to get in touch with
>me for possible presentations.
>
>Rachel
>
>
>--- Jim Hawkins <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Rachel,
>> 
>> On a related note, I am now on the St. Louis OUG board, and have the
>> same responsibilities of arranging speakers.  May I ask what your
>> methodology is for this, as well as if you would be interested in
>> speaking?
>> 
>> :)
>> 
>> Jim
>> 
>> Rachel Carmichael <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> 
>> >well, I'll be there, I sorta kinda have to, since I organize the
>> >speakers and chair the DBA SIG
>> >
>> >it will be a very good meeting.. all authors, Kevin Loney, Rich
>> >Niemiec, John Beresniewicz, Douglas Scherer, Gaja Krishna
>> Vaidyanatha,
>> >Ulka Rodgers, Paul Dorsey (I don't think I've left anyone out, this
>> is
>> >from memory!)
>> >
>> >check the website... www.nyoug.org
>> >
>> >
>> >--- "Sakthi , Raj" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >> Listers,
>> >> Talking about IOUG, I was wondering who are all
>> >> attending NYOUG (damagement won't spansor me to attend
>> >> IOUG ;( )
>> >> 
>> >> Cheers,
>> >> RS 
>> >> 
>> >> __
>> >> Do You Yahoo!?
>> >> Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!
>> >> http://mail.yahoo.com/
>> >> -- 
>> >> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
>> >> -- 
>> >> Author: Sakthi , Raj
>> >>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >> 
>> >> Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858)
>> 538-5051
>> >> San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing
>> >> Lists
>> >>
>> 
>> >> To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
>> >> to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and
>> in
>> >> the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
>> >> (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You
>> may
>> >> also send the HELP command for other information (like
>> subscribing).
>> >
>> >
>> >__
>> >Do You Yahoo!?
>> >Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!
>> >http://mail.yahoo.com/
>> >-- 
>> >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
>> >-- 
>> >Author: Rachel Carmichael
>> >  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >
>> >Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
>> >San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing
>> Lists
>> >
>> >To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
>> >to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
>> >the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
>> >(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
>> >also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
>> >
>> -- 
>> _
>> Jim Hawkins
>> Oracle Database Administrator
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> St. Louis, MO  USA
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> __
>> Your favorite stores, helpful shopping tools and

RE: RE: Re: Jobs

[Jon Walthour]

Jenny, et. al.

I'm right there with you on this. I don't have a problem with
someone announcing, "Hey, I'm looking for a job. Anybody know
of positions in blah-blah?" What I don't care for the resume
attachments and would just ask if it could be discontinued in
the future.

Jon Walthour

>--- Original Message ---
>From: Jenny Jacobson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date: 7/23/01 10:30:52 AM
>

>IMHO: If recruiters can post jobs, each of us can post our need
for a job.
>
>However, sending a resume is unnecessary.  If someone is interestered,
>they can contact the poster privately and request a resume.
>
>Jenny Jacobson
>www.oracle-dba-consulting.com
>
>
>On Mon, 23 Jul 2001, Jon Walthour wrote:
>
>> 
>> 
>> Listers:
>> 
>> Is it appropriate to be sending one's resume to the mailing
list
>> (especially as an attachment)? I don't think so, but have
not
>> heard much to that effect thus far. So, maybe it is. Can someone
>> please enlighten me?
>> 
>> Jon Walthour
>> 
>> >--- Original Message ---
>> >From: "C.S.Venkata Subramanian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >Date: 7/23/01 8:30:27 AM
>> >
>> Hello,
>> >I'm currently working in India as Oracle DBA. I'm willing
to
>> relocate to UK or Europe for a descent salary. I'm attaching
>> my resume with this mail. 
>> >
>> >Expecting to hear from you
>> >
>> >Regards
>> >Venkata Subramanian C.S.
>> >--
>> >
>> >On Mon, 16 Jul 2001 11:30:50  
>> > Culum Slater wrote:
>> >>Hello Oracle professionals,
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>Are there any Oracle DBA's currently looking for work in
and
>> around London, England.
>> >>
>> >>If so, send me a copy of your cv and I will do my best to
find
>> you the right job.
>> >>
>> >>We are an Oracle specialist recruitment consultancy.
>> >>
>> >>Regards
>> >>
>> >>Culum Slater
>> >>Managing Director
>> >>CMS Global Ltd
>> >>
>> >>D/L: 01923 233196
>> >>
>> >>M/N: 07960 113 738
>> >>
>> >>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >>
>> >>CMS Global Ltd, 39 Elizabeth House, Watford, Herts, WD24
4RE
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >Get 250 color business cards for FREE!
>> >http://businesscards.lycos.com/vp/fastpath/
>> >
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
>> -- 
>> Author: Jon Walthour
>>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> 
>> Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858)
538-5051
>> San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing
Lists
>> 
>> To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail
message
>> to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru')
and in
>> the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
>> (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).
 You may
>> also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
>> 
>
>-- 
>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
>-- 
>Author: Jenny Jacobson
>  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
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Lists
>
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and in
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>(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). 
You may
>also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
>


-- 
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  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: RE: RE: Bulkcopy

[Weaver, Walt]

Darn. Thanks for the info, Dick.

--Walt

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2001 11:41 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Walt,

I'm going to refrain from sendign teh enire thread as it's getting BIG.

Ahyhow, No it will not be retrofitted to Oracle 8/8I.  And it may or may
not
be totally functional in 9.0.

Dick Goulet
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
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-- 
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-- 
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  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam

[Mohan, Ross]

Title: RE: RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam





BUFF bomb. That sounds cool. Will it work on developers?


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 4:18 PM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Re:RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam



Ross,


    Makes sense, Nam was BUG heaven, unless they got caught in the path of a
BUFF bomb run.  Nothing survived that. :-)


Dick Goulet


Reply Separator
Subject:    RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/20/2001 8:02 AM


Dick , 


Didn't you know? Rachel WAS in Nam. But she 
never talks about it. I think it had to do
with the bugs. 


Just a thought. 


Ross


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 8:32 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Rachel,


    If you were given one, as I was in Nam, you'd not know the difference. 
Looks like, & tastes like a crunch bar for the most part, except for the
logo on
top.  It just crunches better.


Dick Goulet


Reply Separator
Author: "Rachel Carmichael" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/19/2001 4:10 PM


but Moom, the icky bugs TOUCHED the chocolate!   :)




>From: Kimberly Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: RE: RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
>Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 13:45:29 -0800
>
>You could just lick the chocolate off.
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 10:11 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> I have a phobia about bugs...
>
>what a waste of perfectly good chocolate
>
>
> >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Subject: Re:RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
> >Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 09:11:20 -0800
> >
> >OK you chocaholics try this on for size:
> >
> >  Reuters Monday, March 19, 2001
> >
> >Chocolate-Coated Bugs Are Latest Treat
> >
> >LONDON (Reuters) - Ants, crickets and scorpions, baked, coated
> >in chocolate and promoted as a high-protein snack, are proving
> >popular among peckish Londoners.
> >
> >Designer Todd Dalton, who trained as a chef in Louisiana and
> >acquired a taste for cooked insects on his travels in Asia and
> >central America, says he has sold 5,000 chocolate-coated bugs
> >since he began marketing them in December.
> >
> >"They are very high in protein and very low in fat. They have a
> >higher percentage of protein than any meat or fish that we
> >commonly eat," he told Reuters.
> >
> >The creepy-crawly chocs sell for between three and 3.50 pounds
> >($4.30-$5.00) at upmarket London stores such as Selfridges and
> >the Conran Shop and will soon be appearingin shops in Munich
> >and Zurich.
> >--
> >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> >--
> >Author:
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> >Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
> >San Diego, California    -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
> >
> >To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> >to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> >the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> >(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> >also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
>
>_
>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
>
>--
>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
>--
>Author: Rachel Carmichael
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
>San Diego, California    -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
>
>To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
>to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
>the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
>(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
>also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
>--
>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
>--
>Au

Re: Re: Re: RE: image storage confusion ?? --> UUDECODE

[oraora oraora]

Thanx Chao.
Still under confusion , whether to store 20,000,000 images of 5k 
each either in
-oracle 8.1.6 on win2k ( BLOB or BFILE ) 
OR
-   just on plain linux file system -
OR
- any file server like NetApp on linux ---

which will be better ?
how do people usually handle data of such volume ?
plz let me know how it is done normally.

TIA.
Jp.


On Tue, 10 Dec 2002 chao_ping wrote :
>oraora  oraora,
>   For blob, it is ok, since it is all in the database, while for 
>bfile, you actually store them in filesystem, so you have to 
>backup those files indivudually.
>
>
>
>
>
>Regards
>zhu chao
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>www.happyit.net
>www.cnoug.org(Chinese Oracle User Group)
>
>=== 2002-12-09 17:23:00 ,you wrote£º===
>
> >Guys,
> >
> >Suppose I store the images (~100G)in DB ( either as BLOB or 
>BFILE
> >).
> >I want to have a standby DB for this Prod. DB.
> >Will there be any problem ? any known issues ?
> >what are the things to be taken care of ???
> >
> >Kindly let me know Guys.
> >
> >TIA.
> >Jp.
> >
> >
> >On Wed, 04 Dec 2002 Connor McDonald wrote :
> >>As Cary as mentioned, there's some new goodies in v9.
> >>
> >>In our case, the controlling of attachments etc is
> >>done before processing into the db.  I can't remember
> >>the specifics (read: I'm no longer at that site) but
> >>we found some shareware (mimencode? + a few other
> >>little things) we separated encoded emails into
> >>separate files which then got processed into separate
> >>lobs.
> >>
> >>Cheers
> >>Connor
> >>
> >>  --- "MacGregor, Ian A." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >>wrote: > Were doing the same thing with mail between
> >> > collaborators on one of our physics projects.  But
> >> > the volume is small, just unDer 250,000 so far.  Did
> >> > the mail ou were saving contain attachments, and if
> >> > so did you write any code to break off the
> >> > attachment uudecode it and place it in a blob?  If
> >> > so, I am keenly interested in that code.
> >> >
> >> > Is there a publicly available package to do uuencode
> >> > and uudecode?
> >> >
> >> > Ian MacGregor
> >> > Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
> >> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >> >
> >> > -Original Message-
> >> > Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 11:44 AM
> >> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Exactly.
> >> >
> >> > We had a system that used to drag emails (from qmail
> >> > so each mail was a file) into clobs in the database.
> >> >
> >> > After a year or so we had about 15 million emails in
> >> > the database - no problems at all.
> >> >
> >> > Then one day the some idiot (aka me) put a new
> >> > version
> >> > of the program in which successfully loaded the clob
> >> > but (to cut a long story short) started replicating
> >> > the email files left, right and centre...It took
> >> > literally days to clean up millions of (zero byte
> >> > size) files...after which point that file system
> >> > needed to be rebuilt anyway, the directory structure
> >> > was in such a mess
> >> >
> >> > Cheers
> >> > Connor
> >> >
> >> >  --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Arup,
> >> > >
> >> > > What Connor may have been referring to is the
> >> > > inefficiency
> >> > > of managing 20 million files in a filesystem.
> >> > >
> >> > > That's a lot of inodes ( assuming unix ).  It's a
> >> > > bit much
> >> > > for a filesystem to deal with.
> >> > >
> >> > > Jared
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > "Arup Nanda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> > > Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >> > >  12/03/2002 07:14 AM
> >> > >  Please respond to ORACLE-L
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > To: Multiple recipients of list
> >> > ORACLE-L
> >> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> > > cc:
> >> > > Subject:Re: image storage
> >> > confusion
> >> > > ??
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Connor,
> >> > >
> >> > > I seem to think otherwise. Storing 100 GB of image
> >> > > is not necessarily a
> >> > > pretty proposition either when you consider hot
> >> > > backups and archived log
> >> > > generation, etc. I presume you are concerned about
> >> > > the management of the
> >> > > image files considering the sheer volume of it.
> >> > But
> >> > > that's precisely what
> >> > > BFILE is expected to help with. The images are in
> >> > a
> >> > > file ssytem and the
> >> > > pointers are in the database and that's managed
> >> > > pretty well.
> >> > >
> >> > > However I do concede tht this might pose a problem
> >> > > on two fronts -
> >> > > (1) Security - beign on filesystem anyone can
> >> > > potentially see these.
> >> > > However
> >> > > this is not necesarily a concern at all sites.
> >> > Good
> >> > > OS security can
> >> > > prevent
> >> > > this.
> >> > > (2) Backup - the ssy admin has to explicitly
> >> > backup
> >> > > all these files. This,
> >> > > again, may not be that bad when you store your
> >> > files
> >> > > on a single

Re: Re: Re: RE: image storage confusion ?? --> UUDECODE

[Yechiel Adar]

On NTFS there is an allocation unit and the Os gives space in multiple of
allocations units which is 4k or 8k.
So if you use bfile you will waste 3k for each file, increasing your disk
space by 60%.

I am not sure about the size of the allocation unit.
Please verify this with your sysadmin.

Yechiel Adar
Mehish
- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2002 8:03 AM


> Thanx Chao.
> Still under confusion , whether to store 20,000,000 images of 5k
> each either in
> -oracle 8.1.6 on win2k ( BLOB or BFILE ) 
> OR
> -   just on plain linux file system -
> OR
> - any file server like NetApp on linux ---
>
> which will be better ?
> how do people usually handle data of such volume ?
> plz let me know how it is done normally.
>
> TIA.
> Jp.
>
>
> On Tue, 10 Dec 2002 chao_ping wrote :
> >oraora  oraora,
> > For blob, it is ok, since it is all in the database, while for
> >bfile, you actually store them in filesystem, so you have to
> >backup those files indivudually.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Regards
> >zhu chao
> >[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >www.happyit.net
> >www.cnoug.org(Chinese Oracle User Group)
> >
> >=== 2002-12-09 17:23:00 ,you wrote£º===
> >
> > >Guys,
> > >
> > >Suppose I store the images (~100G)in DB ( either as BLOB or
> >BFILE
> > >).
> > >I want to have a standby DB for this Prod. DB.
> > >Will there be any problem ? any known issues ?
> > >what are the things to be taken care of ???
> > >
> > >Kindly let me know Guys.
> > >
> > >TIA.
> > >Jp.
> > >
> > >
> > >On Wed, 04 Dec 2002 Connor McDonald wrote :
> > >>As Cary as mentioned, there's some new goodies in v9.
> > >>
> > >>In our case, the controlling of attachments etc is
> > >>done before processing into the db.  I can't remember
> > >>the specifics (read: I'm no longer at that site) but
> > >>we found some shareware (mimencode? + a few other
> > >>little things) we separated encoded emails into
> > >>separate files which then got processed into separate
> > >>lobs.
> > >>
> > >>Cheers
> > >>Connor
> > >>
> > >>  --- "MacGregor, Ian A." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >>wrote: > Were doing the same thing with mail between
> > >> > collaborators on one of our physics projects.  But
> > >> > the volume is small, just unDer 250,000 so far.  Did
> > >> > the mail ou were saving contain attachments, and if
> > >> > so did you write any code to break off the
> > >> > attachment uudecode it and place it in a blob?  If
> > >> > so, I am keenly interested in that code.
> > >> >
> > >> > Is there a publicly available package to do uuencode
> > >> > and uudecode?
> > >> >
> > >> > Ian MacGregor
> > >> > Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
> > >> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >> >
> > >> > -Original Message-
> > >> > Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 11:44 AM
> > >> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > Exactly.
> > >> >
> > >> > We had a system that used to drag emails (from qmail
> > >> > so each mail was a file) into clobs in the database.
> > >> >
> > >> > After a year or so we had about 15 million emails in
> > >> > the database - no problems at all.
> > >> >
> > >> > Then one day the some idiot (aka me) put a new
> > >> > version
> > >> > of the program in which successfully loaded the clob
> > >> > but (to cut a long story short) started replicating
> > >> > the email files left, right and centre...It took
> > >> > literally days to clean up millions of (zero byte
> > >> > size) files...after which point that file system
> > >> > needed to be rebuilt anyway, the directory structure
> > >> > was in such a mess
> > >> >
> > >> > Cheers
> > >> > Connor
> > >> >
> > >> >  --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Arup,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > What Connor may have been referring to is the
> > >> > > inefficiency
> > >> > > of managing 20 million files in a filesystem.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > That's a lot of inodes ( assuming unix ).  It's a
> > >> > > bit much
> > >> > > for a filesystem to deal with.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Jared
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > "Arup Nanda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >> > > Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >> > >  12/03/2002 07:14 AM
> > >> > >  Please respond to ORACLE-L
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > To: Multiple recipients of list
> > >> > ORACLE-L
> > >> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >> > > cc:
> > >> > > Subject:Re: image storage
> > >> > confusion
> > >> > > ??
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Connor,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > I seem to think otherwise. Storing 100 GB of image
> > >> > > is not necessarily a
> > >> > > pretty proposition either when you consider hot
> > >> > > backups and archived log
> > >> > > generation, etc. I presume you are concerned about
> > >> > > the management of the
> > >> > > image files considering the sheer volume of it.
> > >> > But

Re: Re: RE: Re: Stop using SYS, SYSTEM?

[Nuno Pinto do Souto]

> Arup Nanda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'm not sure that's what the OP wanted. He wanted to know if stopping
> use of
> SYS and SYSTEM on a regular basis will be acceptable, not "disable"
> them. It
> sure is.
> Besides, how does one disable the account? Lock it? SYSTEM can be
> locked but
> SYS can't be; hence the whole concept of disabling does not make
> sense.


I hear what you're saying, but define "acceptable".  And how do you stop 
someone from using a given userid other than disabling it?  How do you 
disable is of course dependent on what the software maker provides you.

In the case of SYS, probably change passwords is the only way.
In the case of SYSTEM I think it can be disabled, although I'm not
sure of the impact of that on tools that may need it.  I'd rather use the 
password method, that way all I need do to "enable" it is change
the password again.


> I feel the auditors merely wanted the OP to stop using SYS and SYSTEM
> on a
> regular basis in operations that require a DBA access - such as full
> exports
> and selecting from disctionary tables. IMHO this is a very valid
> advisory
> and not difficult to follow.


Stopping someone from using a given set of accounts achieves preciously 
nothing in terms of security (or auditing) IF the functionality of those accounts 
is then replicated to other accounts.


Fact is a DBA needs to be able to exp/imp (debatable, but let's ignore that).  
And manage rights.  And manage space.  And manage allocations,
And monitor the system.  And a myriad of other tasks immaterial to the 
point I'm trying to make.


Those are conveniently provided for by Oracle on a default install using
the SYSTEM account.  This is what it is for, this is the work of a DBA,
this is WHY that account has been given those access rights.  SYS is
debatable and Oracle may now want to discourage people from using
it.  Fair enough.  But SYSTEM is the DBA account par excellence,
the same that root is also a sysadmin account.


Now you may take away the accounts, but you MUST provide the
functionality (or a subset) SOMEHOW, or else the DBA (or the sysadmin) 
can NOT do his/her work.


If you provide the function through another account, then EFFECTIVELY,
all you have achievced is change the name of the account that does that
function.  Security wise, you are back exactly where you started!
And all you have achieved is create a whole lot of risks for the next
person that comes along and installs some software.


The auditors should be defining a set of functions that must be audited
and to what level, and the DBA (and Oracle!) should look at how to 
implement those.  If they are executed by logonid  A, B or MXYZPTLK
is essentially just spurious information (other than of course knowing
WHO has the password for that ID!).  Does Oracle provide a facility
to properly audit all this?  IMHO, far from it.  But it's getting better.


I don't want to know that SYSTEM or SOUTON with a subset
of its rights stuffed up my database or exported my main accounts
and clients tables.  What I want to know is WHY, WHEN, HOW and 
by WHOM.  So that I can reconstruct the events, and hopefully prevent 
the problem from ever happening again.


Changing the login names DBAs use doesn't cut it for this, other than 
look good in "auditor's reports". If there is one thing that the military are 
good at (!) is in defining precisely what security and auditing consists
of.  

Have a look at a secure military installation and you'll find it's not about 
stopping people from using this or that, it's about KNOWING who
did what, how and when.

Cheers
Nuno Souto
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
-- 
Author: Nuno Pinto do Souto
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: Re: RE: Re: Stop using SYS, SYSTEM?

[Cupp Michael E Contr Det 1 AFRL/WSI]

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2003 10:49 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


>Stopping someone from using a given set of accounts achieves preciously 
>nothing in terms of security (or auditing) IF the functionality of those >accounts 
>is then replicated to other accounts.


Not if someone (I.e. an 'operator') is only using a portion of the access (COMPLETE) 
that is given to sys and/or system.


>Fact is a DBA needs to be able to exp/imp (debatable, but let's ignore >that).  
>And manage rights.  And manage space.  And manage allocations,
>And monitor the system.  And a myriad of other tasks immaterial to the 
>point I'm trying to make.

But a user account for Joe DBA and another user account for Jane DBA, etc, etc will 
provide accountability and tracability, vs a 'public' account does not.


Just my $0.02
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
-- 
Author: Cupp Michael E Contr Det 1 AFRL/WSI
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RE: Re: RE: Re: Stop using SYS, SYSTEM?

[Jacques Kilchoer]

> -Original Message-
> Nuno Pinto do Souto
> 
> I don't want to know that SYSTEM or SOUTON with a subset
> of its rights stuffed up my database or exported my main accounts
> and clients tables.  What I want to know is WHY, WHEN, HOW and 
> by WHOM.

What I was saying is that having a different username for each DBA helps you identify 
the WHOM. Of course a hacker could always cut knock the DBA unconscious and prop up 
his head to fool an eye retina scan, à la James Bond, but by that argument any 
username or IP address or whatever else you use is meaningless.
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
-- 
Author: Jacques Kilchoer
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Re: Re: RE: Re: Stop using SYS, SYSTEM?

[Nuno Souto]

Facetious, but correct. What you need
is auditing. Not clipping userids.
Achieves nothing.

Cheers
Nuno Souto
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
- Original Message - 

> What I was saying is that having a different username for each DBA helps you 
> identify the WHOM. Of course a hacker
could always cut knock the DBA unconscious and prop up his head to fool an eye retina 
scan, à la James Bond, but by that
argument any username or IP address or whatever else you use is meaningless.
> -- 

-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
-- 
Author: Nuno Souto
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Re:RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam

[dgoulet]

Sure, why not.  The BRICK-BAT method.

Reply Separator
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/20/2001 5:08 PM

Wow. Talk about enforcing "foreign constraints".

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 5:01 PM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Ross,

When a B-52, otherwise known as a BUFF (Big Ugly Fat F^cker), unloads
150 to
200(B-52D with wing racks) 750LB demolition bombs nothing stands.  Even
duhvelopers.  I've had Marines discribe the area where a BUFF strike landed
as
"It looked like God reached down, scooped out a three mile long by half a
mile
wide, by 100 foot deep piece of the earth and take it away".  I don't know
about
cool, but it sure was effective!!

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/20/2001 4:28 PM

BUFF bomb. That sounds cool. Will it work on developers?

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 4:18 PM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Ross,

Makes sense, Nam was BUG heaven, unless they got caught in the path of a
BUFF bomb run.  Nothing survived that. :-)

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/20/2001 8:02 AM

Dick , 

Didn't you know? Rachel WAS in Nam. But she 
never talks about it. I think it had to do
with the bugs. 

Just a thought. 

Ross

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 8:32 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Rachel,

If you were given one, as I was in Nam, you'd not know the difference. 
Looks like, & tastes like a crunch bar for the most part, except for the
logo on
top.  It just crunches better.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Rachel Carmichael" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/19/2001 4:10 PM

but Moom, the icky bugs TOUCHED the chocolate!   :)



>From: Kimberly Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: RE: RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
>Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 13:45:29 -0800
>
>You could just lick the chocolate off.
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 10:11 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> I have a phobia about bugs...
>
>what a waste of perfectly good chocolate
>
>
> >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Subject: Re:RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
> >Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 09:11:20 -0800
> >
> >OK you chocaholics try this on for size:
> >
> >  Reuters Monday, March 19, 2001
> >
> >Chocolate-Coated Bugs Are Latest Treat
> >
> >LONDON (Reuters) - Ants, crickets and scorpions, baked, coated
> >in chocolate and promoted as a high-protein snack, are proving
> >popular among peckish Londoners.
> >
> >Designer Todd Dalton, who trained as a chef in Louisiana and
> >acquired a taste for cooked insects on his travels in Asia and
> >central America, says he has sold 5,000 chocolate-coated bugs
> >since he began marketing them in December.
> >
> >"They are very high in protein and very low in fat. They have a
> >higher percentage of protein than any meat or fish that we
> >commonly eat," he told Reuters.
> >
> >The creepy-crawly chocs sell for between three and 3.50 pounds
> >($4.30-$5.00) at upmarket London stores such as Selfridges and
> >the Conran Shop and will soon be appearingin shops in Munich
> >and Zurich.
> >--
> >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> >--
> >Author:
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> >Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
> >San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
> >
> >To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> >to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> >the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> >(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> >also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
>
>_
>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
>
>--
>Please see the officia

Re:RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam

[Peter Barnett]

It did not work that wel.  Just gave the bad guys really good cover 
after the noise stopped.  Probably don't want to give developers that 
many places to hide.


Pete Barnett
Oracle Database Administrator
Regence BlueCross BlueShield
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


On Tue, 20 Mar 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> Sure, why not.  The BRICK-BAT method.
> 
> Reply Separator
> Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date:   3/20/2001 5:08 PM
> 
> Wow. Talk about enforcing "foreign constraints".
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 5:01 PM
> To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Ross,
> 
> When a B-52, otherwise known as a BUFF (Big Ugly Fat F^cker), unloads
> 150 to
> 200(B-52D with wing racks) 750LB demolition bombs nothing stands.  Even
> duhvelopers.  I've had Marines discribe the area where a BUFF strike landed
> as
> "It looked like God reached down, scooped out a three mile long by half a
> mile
> wide, by 100 foot deep piece of the earth and take it away".  I don't know
> about
> cool, but it sure was effective!!
> 
> Dick Goulet
> 
> Reply Separator
> Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date:   3/20/2001 4:28 PM
> 
> BUFF bomb. That sounds cool. Will it work on developers?
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 4:18 PM
> To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Ross,
> 
> Makes sense, Nam was BUG heaven, unless they got caught in the path of a
> BUFF bomb run.  Nothing survived that. :-)
> 
> Dick Goulet
> 
> Reply Separator
> Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date:   3/20/2001 8:02 AM
> 
> Dick , 
> 
> Didn't you know? Rachel WAS in Nam. But she 
> never talks about it. I think it had to do
> with the bugs. 
> 
> Just a thought. 
> 
> Ross
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 8:32 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Rachel,
> 
> If you were given one, as I was in Nam, you'd not know the difference. 
> Looks like, & tastes like a crunch bar for the most part, except for the
> logo on
> top.  It just crunches better.
> 
> Dick Goulet
> 
> Reply Separator________
> Author: "Rachel Carmichael" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date:   3/19/2001 4:10 PM
> 
> but Moom, the icky bugs TOUCHED the chocolate!   :)
> 
> 
> 
> >From: Kimberly Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Subject: RE: RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
> >Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 13:45:29 -0800
> >
> >You could just lick the chocolate off.
> >
> >-Original Message-
> >Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 10:11 AM
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> > I have a phobia about bugs...
> >
> >what a waste of perfectly good chocolate
> >
> >
> > >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >Subject: Re:RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
> > >Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 09:11:20 -0800
> > >
> > >OK you chocaholics try this on for size:
> > >
> > >  Reuters Monday, March 19, 2001
> > >
> > >Chocolate-Coated Bugs Are Latest Treat
> > >
> > >LONDON (Reuters) - Ants, crickets and scorpions, baked, coated
> > >in chocolate and promoted as a high-protein snack, are proving
> > >popular among peckish Londoners.
> > >
> > >Designer Todd Dalton, who trained as a chef in Louisiana and
> > >acquired a taste for cooked insects on his travels in Asia and
> > >central America, says he has sold 5,000 chocolate-coated bugs
> > >since he began marketing them in December.
> > >
> > >"They are very high in protein and very low in fat. They have a
> > >higher percentage of protein than any meat or fish that we
> > >commonly eat," he told Reuters.
> > >
> > >The creepy-crawly chocs sell for between three and 3.50 pounds
> > >($4.30-$5.00) at upmarket London stores such as Selfridges and
> > >the Conran Shop and will soon be app

RE: RE: RE: RE: 24 x 7 on NT?

[Christopher Spence]

Ross Mohan for president!

"Walking on water and developing software from a specification are easy if
both are frozen."

Christopher R. Spence
Oracle DBA
Fuelspot 



-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 12:27 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I am hearing such amazing stories"running for seven years"
"no failures in 4 years"."never any failures except when
the NT administrator brought down the power grid", etc. 

I am not an old hand, nor am I a greenhorn, but in my experience, 
"real, live production systems" ( e.g. more than 100 users, round 
the clock availability, frequent software updates...hardware adds 
to account for growth, etc. ) just don't run for four years without 
any downtime.  I have never seen this. New systems have bugs shaken
outold systems have legacy MTBF hiccupsall systems need 
occasional hw/sw tweaks to accomodate unplanned business needs. 

Now, if you factor OUT *scheduled* maintenance, then, hell, ANY
system can stay up for months...years...decades.  And, guess what?
If you're NOT upgrading application or system software, or patching
firmware or doing OS upgrades, it's not what I'd call a live
production system. Hell, my HP calculator has been running whenever 
I want it, nonstop, since 1987. 

As for running Nuclear stuff, I would NEVER run Oracle or Unix or NT
for ANYTHING to do with Nuclear stuff ( missiles or power ). Oh My God.
Please don't tell me any more about that. Even Oracle Corp says "don't
use our stuff in places where people's lives are directly at stake."

(But that's just me.)

Lastly, this business about "being down for one minute costs us 12 Million
dollars" is bohunk is most every case. There just isn't the data to support
that. Yea, sure, maybe the a site's average intake is 12 Million during a 
typical one hour outage (that one site out of a million) but how many of 
those spurned customers come back?  Most of them! Me, I can't get my book 
at Amazon, I just do something else and come back. ditto for my memory 
upgrade at Micron, or my tech info at Metalink. This "lost business"
argument 
is weak or NONEXISTENT in EVERY instantiation I have seen of it. 

Also, a site being down can be anything...network...front line web
servers...'
back end databasesintermediate LDAP serversand the user ( that's you
and I ) have NO WAY OF KNOWING for sure what failed. Ok...Ebay went down, 
repeatedly. They have IIS front end servers (which have not failed) and 
backend oracle databases on Sun E10K (which did). NASDAQ's reconciliation
system just went down a few weeks ago ( Unix ) But that is a case where
I have a mix of good press and backend information. As you note, most
sites won't fess up. 

I happen to work for a government client where we have aging Unix database 
servers of about five or six different flavors ( Siemens, DEC, Sun, Sequent,
etc.) 
that are pushed to their limits, feebly configured, and poorly maintained
(due to 
damagement "downtime" procedures) but very tightly maintained NT servers
(due to 
my company's downtime procedures ) and know what?   My desktop has gone down
ONCE
in two years. The mail servers for a 1000 user exchange system with 50
Mbytes per 
user mailboxes has NEVER gone down in two years.  The unix boxes have
hiccuped on 
disk...on memory...on oracle bugs.

It's just too easy ( and too wrong ) to say "NT Sucks" or "Solaris Rules"
or somesuch. (Not that you are, butsadly, many do)

Bottomline, I agree with you: If Management REALLY wants "24x7", then I just
smile, and explain the costs to them. Before you know it, there are
scheduled
hardware maintenance windows, oracle tuning/patching downtime, etc. 

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 9:58 AM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Well, I guess so if that was the only occurrence.  I'll never know and I
doubt
that they will fess-up.  

At any rate, If one wants to use NT or any other OS for that matter in a
24x7
guaranteed manner then one should look into making as much as possible
redundant.  Back in my Blue Suit days we did a lot of cause and effect
analysis,
particularly on Nuclear stuff, to insure that if one component failed there
was
a redundant part to take over the tasks of the failed unit.  We also did
analysis to determine what the likelihood of the failure was and what the
cost/benefit of having the redundant part was.  Basically, if you can expect
say
1 failure every 8544 hours and it will take less than 1 hour to correct the
failure, is it worth the expense to have redundant hardware for that
failure? 
It's one of those things that needs to be evaluated on a case by case basis.
In
the case of NT, you'd need a separate server and be running OPS.  What is
the
cost, what is the expected frequency, and is the loss >= the cost??

Good questions, but only you can provide the answers.  In the case we have
here,
out HP's fail once every 4 years on average over the 10+ years of

RE: RE: RE: RE: 24 x 7 on NT?

[Mohan, Ross]

I am hearing such amazing stories"running for seven years"
"no failures in 4 years"."never any failures except when
the NT administrator brought down the power grid", etc. 

I am not an old hand, nor am I a greenhorn, but in my experience, 
"real, live production systems" ( e.g. more than 100 users, round 
the clock availability, frequent software updates...hardware adds 
to account for growth, etc. ) just don't run for four years without 
any downtime.  I have never seen this. New systems have bugs shaken
outold systems have legacy MTBF hiccupsall systems need 
occasional hw/sw tweaks to accomodate unplanned business needs. 

Now, if you factor OUT *scheduled* maintenance, then, hell, ANY
system can stay up for months...years...decades.  And, guess what?
If you're NOT upgrading application or system software, or patching
firmware or doing OS upgrades, it's not what I'd call a live
production system. Hell, my HP calculator has been running whenever 
I want it, nonstop, since 1987. 

As for running Nuclear stuff, I would NEVER run Oracle or Unix or NT
for ANYTHING to do with Nuclear stuff ( missiles or power ). Oh My God.
Please don't tell me any more about that. Even Oracle Corp says "don't
use our stuff in places where people's lives are directly at stake."

(But that's just me.)

Lastly, this business about "being down for one minute costs us 12 Million
dollars" is bohunk is most every case. There just isn't the data to support
that. Yea, sure, maybe the a site's average intake is 12 Million during a 
typical one hour outage (that one site out of a million) but how many of 
those spurned customers come back?  Most of them! Me, I can't get my book 
at Amazon, I just do something else and come back. ditto for my memory 
upgrade at Micron, or my tech info at Metalink. This "lost business"
argument 
is weak or NONEXISTENT in EVERY instantiation I have seen of it. 

Also, a site being down can be anything...network...front line web
servers...'
back end databasesintermediate LDAP serversand the user ( that's you
and I ) have NO WAY OF KNOWING for sure what failed. Ok...Ebay went down, 
repeatedly. They have IIS front end servers (which have not failed) and 
backend oracle databases on Sun E10K (which did). NASDAQ's reconciliation
system just went down a few weeks ago ( Unix ) But that is a case where
I have a mix of good press and backend information. As you note, most
sites won't fess up. 

I happen to work for a government client where we have aging Unix database 
servers of about five or six different flavors ( Siemens, DEC, Sun, Sequent,
etc.) 
that are pushed to their limits, feebly configured, and poorly maintained
(due to 
damagement "downtime" procedures) but very tightly maintained NT servers
(due to 
my company's downtime procedures ) and know what?   My desktop has gone down
ONCE
in two years. The mail servers for a 1000 user exchange system with 50
Mbytes per 
user mailboxes has NEVER gone down in two years.  The unix boxes have
hiccuped on 
disk...on memory...on oracle bugs.

It's just too easy ( and too wrong ) to say "NT Sucks" or "Solaris Rules"
or somesuch. (Not that you are, butsadly, many do)

Bottomline, I agree with you: If Management REALLY wants "24x7", then I just
smile, and explain the costs to them. Before you know it, there are
scheduled
hardware maintenance windows, oracle tuning/patching downtime, etc. 

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 9:58 AM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Well, I guess so if that was the only occurrence.  I'll never know and I
doubt
that they will fess-up.  

At any rate, If one wants to use NT or any other OS for that matter in a
24x7
guaranteed manner then one should look into making as much as possible
redundant.  Back in my Blue Suit days we did a lot of cause and effect
analysis,
particularly on Nuclear stuff, to insure that if one component failed there
was
a redundant part to take over the tasks of the failed unit.  We also did
analysis to determine what the likelihood of the failure was and what the
cost/benefit of having the redundant part was.  Basically, if you can expect
say
1 failure every 8544 hours and it will take less than 1 hour to correct the
failure, is it worth the expense to have redundant hardware for that
failure? 
It's one of those things that needs to be evaluated on a case by case basis.
In
the case of NT, you'd need a separate server and be running OPS.  What is
the
cost, what is the expected frequency, and is the loss >= the cost??

Good questions, but only you can provide the answers.  In the case we have
here,
out HP's fail once every 4 years on average over the 10+ years of history we
have with HP.  And each failure takes about 2 hours to fix.  Now at $1000
per
minute of lost revenue that comes to $120,000.  A dual server and OPS
architecture would cost $190,000 just to acquire the  hardware and software.

Definitely not worth the expense sinc

RE: RE: RE: RE: 24 x 7 on NT?

[Kevin Kostyszyn]

GOOD LORD ROSS!!!  I second it.
KK

-Original Message-
Spence
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 1:31 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Ross Mohan for president!

"Walking on water and developing software from a specification are easy if
both are frozen."

Christopher R. Spence
Oracle DBA
Fuelspot



-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 12:27 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I am hearing such amazing stories"running for seven years"
"no failures in 4 years"."never any failures except when
the NT administrator brought down the power grid", etc.

I am not an old hand, nor am I a greenhorn, but in my experience,
"real, live production systems" ( e.g. more than 100 users, round
the clock availability, frequent software updates...hardware adds
to account for growth, etc. ) just don't run for four years without
any downtime.  I have never seen this. New systems have bugs shaken
outold systems have legacy MTBF hiccupsall systems need
occasional hw/sw tweaks to accomodate unplanned business needs.

Now, if you factor OUT *scheduled* maintenance, then, hell, ANY
system can stay up for months...years...decades.  And, guess what?
If you're NOT upgrading application or system software, or patching
firmware or doing OS upgrades, it's not what I'd call a live
production system. Hell, my HP calculator has been running whenever
I want it, nonstop, since 1987.

As for running Nuclear stuff, I would NEVER run Oracle or Unix or NT
for ANYTHING to do with Nuclear stuff ( missiles or power ). Oh My God.
Please don't tell me any more about that. Even Oracle Corp says "don't
use our stuff in places where people's lives are directly at stake."

(But that's just me.)

Lastly, this business about "being down for one minute costs us 12 Million
dollars" is bohunk is most every case. There just isn't the data to support
that. Yea, sure, maybe the a site's average intake is 12 Million during a
typical one hour outage (that one site out of a million) but how many of
those spurned customers come back?  Most of them! Me, I can't get my book
at Amazon, I just do something else and come back. ditto for my memory
upgrade at Micron, or my tech info at Metalink. This "lost business"
argument
is weak or NONEXISTENT in EVERY instantiation I have seen of it.

Also, a site being down can be anything...network...front line web
servers...'
back end databasesintermediate LDAP serversand the user ( that's you
and I ) have NO WAY OF KNOWING for sure what failed. Ok...Ebay went down,
repeatedly. They have IIS front end servers (which have not failed) and
backend oracle databases on Sun E10K (which did). NASDAQ's reconciliation
system just went down a few weeks ago ( Unix ) But that is a case where
I have a mix of good press and backend information. As you note, most
sites won't fess up.

I happen to work for a government client where we have aging Unix database
servers of about five or six different flavors ( Siemens, DEC, Sun, Sequent,
etc.)
that are pushed to their limits, feebly configured, and poorly maintained
(due to
damagement "downtime" procedures) but very tightly maintained NT servers
(due to
my company's downtime procedures ) and know what?   My desktop has gone down
ONCE
in two years. The mail servers for a 1000 user exchange system with 50
Mbytes per
user mailboxes has NEVER gone down in two years.  The unix boxes have
hiccuped on
disk...on memory...on oracle bugs.

It's just too easy ( and too wrong ) to say "NT Sucks" or "Solaris Rules"
or somesuch. (Not that you are, butsadly, many do)

Bottomline, I agree with you: If Management REALLY wants "24x7", then I just
smile, and explain the costs to them. Before you know it, there are
scheduled
hardware maintenance windows, oracle tuning/patching downtime, etc.

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 9:58 AM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Well, I guess so if that was the only occurrence.  I'll never know and I
doubt
that they will fess-up.

At any rate, If one wants to use NT or any other OS for that matter in a
24x7
guaranteed manner then one should look into making as much as possible
redundant.  Back in my Blue Suit days we did a lot of cause and effect
analysis,
particularly on Nuclear stuff, to insure that if one component failed there
was
a redundant part to take over the tasks of the failed unit.  We also did
analysis to determine what the likelihood of the failure was and what the
cost/benefit of having the redundant part was.  Basically, if you can expect
say
1 failure every 8544 hours and it will take less than 1 hour to correct the
failure, is it worth the expense to have redundant hardware for that
failure?
It's one of those things that needs to be evaluated on a case by case basis.
In
the case of NT, you'd need a separate server and be running OPS.  What is
the
cost, what is the expected frequency, and is the loss >= the cost??

Good questions, but only 

RE: RE: RE: RE: 24 x 7 on NT?

[Mohan, Ross]

My life would be hanging by a pregnant chad. 

That would be hard to explain to my Mum. 

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 3:53 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


GOOD LORD ROSS!!!  I second it.
KK

-Original Message-
Spence
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 1:31 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Ross Mohan for president!

"Walking on water and developing software from a specification are easy if
both are frozen."

Christopher R. Spence
Oracle DBA
Fuelspot



-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 12:27 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I am hearing such amazing stories"running for seven years"
"no failures in 4 years"."never any failures except when
the NT administrator brought down the power grid", etc.

I am not an old hand, nor am I a greenhorn, but in my experience,
"real, live production systems" ( e.g. more than 100 users, round
the clock availability, frequent software updates...hardware adds
to account for growth, etc. ) just don't run for four years without
any downtime.  I have never seen this. New systems have bugs shaken
outold systems have legacy MTBF hiccupsall systems need
occasional hw/sw tweaks to accomodate unplanned business needs.

Now, if you factor OUT *scheduled* maintenance, then, hell, ANY
system can stay up for months...years...decades.  And, guess what?
If you're NOT upgrading application or system software, or patching
firmware or doing OS upgrades, it's not what I'd call a live
production system. Hell, my HP calculator has been running whenever
I want it, nonstop, since 1987.

As for running Nuclear stuff, I would NEVER run Oracle or Unix or NT
for ANYTHING to do with Nuclear stuff ( missiles or power ). Oh My God.
Please don't tell me any more about that. Even Oracle Corp says "don't
use our stuff in places where people's lives are directly at stake."

(But that's just me.)

Lastly, this business about "being down for one minute costs us 12 Million
dollars" is bohunk is most every case. There just isn't the data to support
that. Yea, sure, maybe the a site's average intake is 12 Million during a
typical one hour outage (that one site out of a million) but how many of
those spurned customers come back?  Most of them! Me, I can't get my book
at Amazon, I just do something else and come back. ditto for my memory
upgrade at Micron, or my tech info at Metalink. This "lost business"
argument
is weak or NONEXISTENT in EVERY instantiation I have seen of it.

Also, a site being down can be anything...network...front line web
servers...'
back end databasesintermediate LDAP serversand the user ( that's you
and I ) have NO WAY OF KNOWING for sure what failed. Ok...Ebay went down,
repeatedly. They have IIS front end servers (which have not failed) and
backend oracle databases on Sun E10K (which did). NASDAQ's reconciliation
system just went down a few weeks ago ( Unix ) But that is a case where
I have a mix of good press and backend information. As you note, most
sites won't fess up.

I happen to work for a government client where we have aging Unix database
servers of about five or six different flavors ( Siemens, DEC, Sun, Sequent,
etc.)
that are pushed to their limits, feebly configured, and poorly maintained
(due to
damagement "downtime" procedures) but very tightly maintained NT servers
(due to
my company's downtime procedures ) and know what?   My desktop has gone down
ONCE
in two years. The mail servers for a 1000 user exchange system with 50
Mbytes per
user mailboxes has NEVER gone down in two years.  The unix boxes have
hiccuped on
disk...on memory...on oracle bugs.

It's just too easy ( and too wrong ) to say "NT Sucks" or "Solaris Rules"
or somesuch. (Not that you are, butsadly, many do)

Bottomline, I agree with you: If Management REALLY wants "24x7", then I just
smile, and explain the costs to them. Before you know it, there are
scheduled
hardware maintenance windows, oracle tuning/patching downtime, etc.

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 9:58 AM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Well, I guess so if that was the only occurrence.  I'll never know and I
doubt
that they will fess-up.

At any rate, If one wants to use NT or any other OS for that matter in a
24x7
guaranteed manner then one should look into making as much as possible
redundant.  Back in my Blue Suit days we did a lot of cause and effect
analysis,
particularly on Nuclear stuff, to insure that if one component failed there
was
a redundant part to take over the tasks of the failed unit.  We also did
analysis to determine what the likelihood of the failure was and what the
cost/benefit of having the redundant part was.  Basically, if you can expect
say
1 failure every 8544 hours and it will take less than 1 hour to correct the
failure, is it worth the expense to have redundant hardware for that
failure?
It's one of those things that needs to be evaluated on 

RE: RE: RE: RE: 24 x 7 on NT?

[Kevin Kostyszyn]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA!

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 5:12 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


My life would be hanging by a pregnant chad.

That would be hard to explain to my Mum.

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 3:53 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


GOOD LORD ROSS!!!  I second it.
KK

-Original Message-
Spence
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 1:31 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Ross Mohan for president!

"Walking on water and developing software from a specification are easy if
both are frozen."

Christopher R. Spence
Oracle DBA
Fuelspot



-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 12:27 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I am hearing such amazing stories"running for seven years"
"no failures in 4 years"."never any failures except when
the NT administrator brought down the power grid", etc.

I am not an old hand, nor am I a greenhorn, but in my experience,
"real, live production systems" ( e.g. more than 100 users, round
the clock availability, frequent software updates...hardware adds
to account for growth, etc. ) just don't run for four years without
any downtime.  I have never seen this. New systems have bugs shaken
outold systems have legacy MTBF hiccupsall systems need
occasional hw/sw tweaks to accomodate unplanned business needs.

Now, if you factor OUT *scheduled* maintenance, then, hell, ANY
system can stay up for months...years...decades.  And, guess what?
If you're NOT upgrading application or system software, or patching
firmware or doing OS upgrades, it's not what I'd call a live
production system. Hell, my HP calculator has been running whenever
I want it, nonstop, since 1987.

As for running Nuclear stuff, I would NEVER run Oracle or Unix or NT
for ANYTHING to do with Nuclear stuff ( missiles or power ). Oh My God.
Please don't tell me any more about that. Even Oracle Corp says "don't
use our stuff in places where people's lives are directly at stake."

(But that's just me.)

Lastly, this business about "being down for one minute costs us 12 Million
dollars" is bohunk is most every case. There just isn't the data to support
that. Yea, sure, maybe the a site's average intake is 12 Million during a
typical one hour outage (that one site out of a million) but how many of
those spurned customers come back?  Most of them! Me, I can't get my book
at Amazon, I just do something else and come back. ditto for my memory
upgrade at Micron, or my tech info at Metalink. This "lost business"
argument
is weak or NONEXISTENT in EVERY instantiation I have seen of it.

Also, a site being down can be anything...network...front line web
servers...'
back end databasesintermediate LDAP serversand the user ( that's you
and I ) have NO WAY OF KNOWING for sure what failed. Ok...Ebay went down,
repeatedly. They have IIS front end servers (which have not failed) and
backend oracle databases on Sun E10K (which did). NASDAQ's reconciliation
system just went down a few weeks ago ( Unix ) But that is a case where
I have a mix of good press and backend information. As you note, most
sites won't fess up.

I happen to work for a government client where we have aging Unix database
servers of about five or six different flavors ( Siemens, DEC, Sun, Sequent,
etc.)
that are pushed to their limits, feebly configured, and poorly maintained
(due to
damagement "downtime" procedures) but very tightly maintained NT servers
(due to
my company's downtime procedures ) and know what?   My desktop has gone down
ONCE
in two years. The mail servers for a 1000 user exchange system with 50
Mbytes per
user mailboxes has NEVER gone down in two years.  The unix boxes have
hiccuped on
disk...on memory...on oracle bugs.

It's just too easy ( and too wrong ) to say "NT Sucks" or "Solaris Rules"
or somesuch. (Not that you are, butsadly, many do)

Bottomline, I agree with you: If Management REALLY wants "24x7", then I just
smile, and explain the costs to them. Before you know it, there are
scheduled
hardware maintenance windows, oracle tuning/patching downtime, etc.

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 9:58 AM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Well, I guess so if that was the only occurrence.  I'll never know and I
doubt
that they will fess-up.

At any rate, If one wants to use NT or any other OS for that matter in a
24x7
guaranteed manner then one should look into making as much as possible
redundant.  Back in my Blue Suit days we did a lot of cause and effect
analysis,
particularly on Nuclear stuff, to insure that if one component failed there
was
a redundant part to take over the tasks of the failed unit.  We also did
analysis to determine what the likelihood of the failure was and what the
cost/benefit of having the redundant part was.  Basically, if you can expect
say
1 failure every 8544 hours and it will take less than 1 hour to correct the
failure,

RE: RE: RE: RE: 24 x 7 on NT?

[Henry Poras]

Yeah. Check out
http://www.ucomics.com/tomthedancingbug/viewtd.cfm?uc_fn=1&uc_full_date=2001
0609&uc_daction=P&uc_comic=td
I think there is room to add a pony-tailed Hannibal.

Henry

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 1:31 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Ross Mohan for president!

"Walking on water and developing software from a specification are easy if
both are frozen."

Christopher R. Spence
Oracle DBA
Fuelspot 



-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 12:27 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I am hearing such amazing stories"running for seven years"
"no failures in 4 years"."never any failures except when
the NT administrator brought down the power grid", etc. 

I am not an old hand, nor am I a greenhorn, but in my experience, 
"real, live production systems" ( e.g. more than 100 users, round 
the clock availability, frequent software updates...hardware adds 
to account for growth, etc. ) just don't run for four years without 
any downtime.  I have never seen this. New systems have bugs shaken
outold systems have legacy MTBF hiccupsall systems need 
occasional hw/sw tweaks to accomodate unplanned business needs. 

Now, if you factor OUT *scheduled* maintenance, then, hell, ANY
system can stay up for months...years...decades.  And, guess what?
If you're NOT upgrading application or system software, or patching
firmware or doing OS upgrades, it's not what I'd call a live
production system. Hell, my HP calculator has been running whenever 
I want it, nonstop, since 1987. 

As for running Nuclear stuff, I would NEVER run Oracle or Unix or NT
for ANYTHING to do with Nuclear stuff ( missiles or power ). Oh My God.
Please don't tell me any more about that. Even Oracle Corp says "don't
use our stuff in places where people's lives are directly at stake."

(But that's just me.)

Lastly, this business about "being down for one minute costs us 12 Million
dollars" is bohunk is most every case. There just isn't the data to support
that. Yea, sure, maybe the a site's average intake is 12 Million during a 
typical one hour outage (that one site out of a million) but how many of 
those spurned customers come back?  Most of them! Me, I can't get my book 
at Amazon, I just do something else and come back. ditto for my memory 
upgrade at Micron, or my tech info at Metalink. This "lost business"
argument 
is weak or NONEXISTENT in EVERY instantiation I have seen of it. 

Also, a site being down can be anything...network...front line web
servers...'
back end databasesintermediate LDAP serversand the user ( that's you
and I ) have NO WAY OF KNOWING for sure what failed. Ok...Ebay went down, 
repeatedly. They have IIS front end servers (which have not failed) and 
backend oracle databases on Sun E10K (which did). NASDAQ's reconciliation
system just went down a few weeks ago ( Unix ) But that is a case where
I have a mix of good press and backend information. As you note, most
sites won't fess up. 

I happen to work for a government client where we have aging Unix database 
servers of about five or six different flavors ( Siemens, DEC, Sun, Sequent,
etc.) 
that are pushed to their limits, feebly configured, and poorly maintained
(due to 
damagement "downtime" procedures) but very tightly maintained NT servers
(due to 
my company's downtime procedures ) and know what?   My desktop has gone down
ONCE
in two years. The mail servers for a 1000 user exchange system with 50
Mbytes per 
user mailboxes has NEVER gone down in two years.  The unix boxes have
hiccuped on 
disk...on memory...on oracle bugs.

It's just too easy ( and too wrong ) to say "NT Sucks" or "Solaris Rules"
or somesuch. (Not that you are, butsadly, many do)

Bottomline, I agree with you: If Management REALLY wants "24x7", then I just
smile, and explain the costs to them. Before you know it, there are
scheduled
hardware maintenance windows, oracle tuning/patching downtime, etc. 

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2001 9:58 AM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Well, I guess so if that was the only occurrence.  I'll never know and I
doubt
that they will fess-up.  

At any rate, If one wants to use NT or any other OS for that matter in a
24x7
guaranteed manner then one should look into making as much as possible
redundant.  Back in my Blue Suit days we did a lot of cause and effect
analysis,
particularly on Nuclear stuff, to insure that if one component failed there
was
a redundant part to take over the tasks of the failed unit.  We also did
analysis to determine what the likelihood of the failure was and what the
cost/benefit of having the redundant part was.  Basically, if you can expect
say
1 failure every 8544 hours and it will take less than 1 hour to correct the
failure, is it worth the expense to have redundant hardware for that
failure? 
It's one of those things that needs to be evaluated on a case by case basis.
In
th

Re: RE: RE: Data Modeling

[bhabani s pradhan]

Thanks for the information. The thumb rule and all will definitely help me in 
modelling.

Thanks a Lot




Best Regards
B S Pradhan







On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 Michael Milligan wrote :
>Hi Again,
>
>What I do when a model is going to change is try to make it as flexible as
>possible from the start. Build more abstraction into the model than you
>normally would. Normalization is even more important here, even going to 4th
>or 5th form, or at least Boyce-Codd 3rd. You want to design it so that when
>someone wants to change the structure, it may be facilitated by the addition
>of a new record instead of a new column. A very simplistic example would be
>to have a separate address entity allowing for the possibility of multiple
>addresses per customer, instead of building the address attributes right
>into the customer entity. A good rule of thumb: whatever will change should
>be changeable by addition or subtraction of a row. Whatever won't change is
>a candidate for a column. That's a generalization, but a good rule
>nonetheless.
>
>Data Architect from Sybase, ER/Studio from Embarcadero, Erwin from Computer
>Associates are all good tools and easy to learn. QDesigner is the Data
>Architect physical modeler repackaged by Quest and sold for less. Excellent
>tool.
>
>Michael
>
>
>This e-mail, including attachments, may include confidential and/or
>proprietary information, and may be used only by the person or entity to
>which it is addressed. If the reader of this e-mail is not the intended
>recipient or his or her authorized agent, the reader is hereby notified that
>any dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is prohibited. If
>you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by replying
>to this message and delete this e-mail immediately.
>--
>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
>--
>Author: Michael Milligan
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
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>To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
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>(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
>also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).

RE: RE: RE: CONSISTANT GETS

[Jared . Still]

Jerry,

I suspect that the improvments are more likely due to your
rewriting the WHERE clause rather than the use of NOT EXISTS.

Especially if the database were 9i, where NOT IN actually
seems get a better execution path than NOT EXISTS.

That original WHERE clause is really a piece of work.

Jared





"Whittle Jerome Contr NCI" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 11/15/2002 08:21 AM
 Please respond to ORACLE-L

 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
cc: 
        Subject:RE: RE: RE: CONSISTANT GETS


I've seen worse. My programmers don't know how to use NOT EXISTS even 
though I've explained it many times. And that's the least of my problems. 
Look at this mess:
   SELECT * 
 FROM sar.pax_header_suspense_err_temp 
WHEREmanifest_type 
  || manifesting_station 
  || fiscal_year 
  || manifest_serial_number NOT IN ( 
 SELECTmanifest_type 
|| manifesting_station 
|| fiscal_year 
|| manifest_serial_number 
   FROM manifest_serial_number_history) 
Takes over an hour to run. I rewrote it as such: 
SELECT * 
  FROM sar.pax_header_suspense_err_temp t 
 WHERE NOT EXISTS 
(SELECT 'X' 
 FROM manifest_serial_number_history h 
 WHERE 
 t.manifest_type = h.manifest_type and 
 t.manifesting_station = h.manifesting_station and 
 t.fiscal_year = h.fiscal_year and 
   t.manifest_serial_number = h.manifest_serial_number ) 
Under a second. 
Jerry Whittle 
ACIFICS DBA 
NCI Information Systems Inc. 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
618-622-4145 
-Original Message- 
Raj, 
I needed a 12 pack adter this one, it's from PeopleSlop: 
SELECT 0001560265,OPL.BUSINESS_UNIT,OPL.PRODUCTION_ID,OPL.OP_SEQUENCE, 
PID.INV_ITEM_ID,TMP.COST_ELEMENT,'04',0,0,0,0,0,0,PID.ORIG_UOM,PID.PRDN_AREA_COD 
E, 
PID.PRODUCTION_TYPE,OPL.QTY_SCRAPPED,OPL.PERCENT_COMP,' ',1,0,' ',' 
',00 
FROM PS_BU_ITEMS_INV INV,PS_SF_PRDNID_HEADR PID,PS_CE_OP_LIST_COPY OPL, 
PS_CE_OP_LIST_VW OPLIST,PS_SF_COMP_LIST CMP,PS_CE_ITEMVAR_TMP TMP 
WHERE INV.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 
AND PID.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 
AND OPL.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 
AND OPLIST.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 
AND CMP.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 
AND TMP.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 
AND TMP.PROCESS_INSTANCE=0001560265 
AND OPL.PROCESS_INSTANCE=0001560265 
AND OPLIST.PROCESS_INSTANCE=0001560265 
AND OPL.PRODUCTION_ID= PID.PRODUCTION_ID 
AND OPL.PRODUCTION_ID= CMP.PRODUCTION_ID 
AND OPL.PRODUCTION_ID= OPLIST.PRODUCTION_ID 
AND INV.INV_ITEM_ID= PID.INV_ITEM_ID 
AND ( OPL.OP_SEQUENCE= CMP.OP_SEQUENCE OR (CMP.OP_SEQUENCE = 0 AND 
OPL.OP_SEQUENCE =  OPLIST.OP_SEQUENCE)) 
AND PID.PROD_STATUS BETWEEN   '30'  AND  '60' 
AND TMP.INV_ITEM_ID= CMP.COMPONENT_ID 
AND TMP.CONFIG_CODE= CMP.CONFIG_CODE 
AND CMP.SOURCE_CODE <> '5' 
AND CMP.NON_OWN_FLAG = 'N' 
AND NOT EXISTS (SELECT 'X' FROM PS_CE_SCRAPCST_TMP TMP2 
   WHERE TMP2.PROCESS_INSTANCE=0001560265 
   AND TMP2.BUSINESS_UNIT = OPL.BUSINESS_UNIT 
   AND TMP2.PRODUCTION_ID = OPL.PRODUCTION_ID 
   AND TMP2.OP_SEQUENCE = OPL.OP_SEQUENCE 
   AND TMP2.COST_ELEMENT= TMP.COST_ELEMENT) 
GROUP BY 
OPL.BUSINESS_UNIT,OPL.PRODUCTION_ID,OPL.OP_SEQUENCE,PID.INV_ITEM_ID, 
TMP.COST_ELEMENT,PID.ORIG_UOM,PID.PRDN_AREA_CODE,PID.PRODUCTION_TYPE, 
OPL.PERCENT_COMP,OPL.QTY_SCRAPPED 



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RE: RE: RE: CONSISTANT GETS

[Post, Ethan]

Hold the press.  NOT IN better than NOT EXISTS?  Is this theory or fact?  If
so is there any supporting evidence out there?  This is the first I have
heard of this.

Thanks!

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 15, 2002 11:35 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Jerry,

I suspect that the improvments are more likely due to your
rewriting the WHERE clause rather than the use of NOT EXISTS.

Especially if the database were 9i, where NOT IN actually
seems get a better execution path than NOT EXISTS.

That original WHERE clause is really a piece of work.

Jared



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Re: RE: RE: CONSISTANT GETS

[Greg Moore]

> Hold the press.  NOT IN better than NOT EXISTS?
> If so is there any supporting evidence out there?

I think you're joking, but if not there's a nice comparison chart of several
tests in Harrison, p. 268.

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RE: RE: RE: CONSISTANT GETS

[Jared . Still]

Ethan,

A NOT EXISTS can be very expensive if returning large numbers
of rows from the driving table.  It's a correlated subquery as 
Stephane F. pointed out in another post.

Jared







"Post, Ethan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 11/15/2002 10:32 AM
 Please respond to ORACLE-L

 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
cc: 
        Subject:RE: RE: RE: CONSISTANT GETS


Hold the press.  NOT IN better than NOT EXISTS?  Is this theory or fact? 
If
so is there any supporting evidence out there?  This is the first I have
heard of this.

Thanks!

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 15, 2002 11:35 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Jerry,

I suspect that the improvments are more likely due to your
rewriting the WHERE clause rather than the use of NOT EXISTS.

Especially if the database were 9i, where NOT IN actually
seems get a better execution path than NOT EXISTS.

That original WHERE clause is really a piece of work.

Jared



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-- 
Author: Post, Ethan
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).



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RE: RE: RE: CONSISTANT GETS

[Connor McDonald]

In some cases, NOT IN is better than NOT EXISTS.  In
other cases, the opposite is true.

Moral: It never pays to discount an option out of hand
- eg, NOT IN often works very very nicely for
uncorrelated subqueries

hth
connor

 --- "Post, Ethan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hold
the press.  NOT IN better than NOT EXISTS?  Is
> this theory or fact?  If
> so is there any supporting evidence out there?  This
> is the first I have
> heard of this.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Friday, November 15, 2002 11:35 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Jerry,
> 
> I suspect that the improvments are more likely due
> to your
> rewriting the WHERE clause rather than the use of
> NOT EXISTS.
> 
> Especially if the database were 9i, where NOT IN
> actually
> seems get a better execution path than NOT EXISTS.
> 
> That original WHERE clause is really a piece of
> work.
> 
> Jared
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
> http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: Post, Ethan
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051
> http://www.fatcity.com
> San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web
> hosting services
>
-
> To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an
> E-Mail message
> to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of
> 'ListGuru') and in
> the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB
> ORACLE-L
> (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed
> from).  You may
> also send the HELP command for other information
> (like subscribing). 

=
Connor McDonald
http://www.oracledba.co.uk
http://www.oaktable.net

"GIVE a man a fish and he will eat for a day. But TEACH him how to fish, and...he will 
sit in a boat and drink beer all day"

__
Do You Yahoo!?
Everything you'll ever need on one web page
from News and Sport to Email and Music Charts
http://uk.my.yahoo.com
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RE: RE: RE: CONSISTANT GETS

[Mercadante, Thomas F]

Dick,

it's a beauty thing...

Tom Mercadante
Oracle Certified Professional


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 15, 2002 10:34 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Raj,

I needed a 12 pack adter this one, it's from PeopleSlop:

SELECT 0001560265,OPL.BUSINESS_UNIT,OPL.PRODUCTION_ID,OPL.OP_SEQUENCE,
PID.INV_ITEM_ID,TMP.COST_ELEMENT,'04',0,0,0,0,0,0,PID.ORIG_UOM,PID.PRDN_AREA
_COD
E,
PID.PRODUCTION_TYPE,OPL.QTY_SCRAPPED,OPL.PERCENT_COMP,' ',1,0,'  ','
',00 
FROM PS_BU_ITEMS_INV INV,PS_SF_PRDNID_HEADR PID,PS_CE_OP_LIST_COPY OPL,
PS_CE_OP_LIST_VW OPLIST,PS_SF_COMP_LIST CMP,PS_CE_ITEMVAR_TMP TMP 
WHERE INV.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 
AND PID.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 
AND OPL.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 
AND OPLIST.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 
AND CMP.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 
AND TMP.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 
AND TMP.PROCESS_INSTANCE=0001560265 
AND OPL.PROCESS_INSTANCE=0001560265 
AND OPLIST.PROCESS_INSTANCE=0001560265 
AND OPL.PRODUCTION_ID= PID.PRODUCTION_ID 
AND OPL.PRODUCTION_ID= CMP.PRODUCTION_ID 
AND OPL.PRODUCTION_ID= OPLIST.PRODUCTION_ID 
AND INV.INV_ITEM_ID= PID.INV_ITEM_ID 
AND ( OPL.OP_SEQUENCE= CMP.OP_SEQUENCE OR (CMP.OP_SEQUENCE = 0 AND
OPL.OP_SEQUENCE =  OPLIST.OP_SEQUENCE)) 
AND PID.PROD_STATUS BETWEEN   '30'  AND  '60'  
AND TMP.INV_ITEM_ID= CMP.COMPONENT_ID 
AND TMP.CONFIG_CODE= CMP.CONFIG_CODE 
AND CMP.SOURCE_CODE <> '5' 
AND CMP.NON_OWN_FLAG = 'N' 
AND NOT EXISTS (SELECT 'X' FROM PS_CE_SCRAPCST_TMP TMP2 
   WHERE TMP2.PROCESS_INSTANCE=0001560265 
   AND TMP2.BUSINESS_UNIT = OPL.BUSINESS_UNIT 
   AND TMP2.PRODUCTION_ID = OPL.PRODUCTION_ID 
   AND TMP2.OP_SEQUENCE = OPL.OP_SEQUENCE 
   AND TMP2.COST_ELEMENT= TMP.COST_ELEMENT) 
GROUP BY
OPL.BUSINESS_UNIT,OPL.PRODUCTION_ID,OPL.OP_SEQUENCE,PID.INV_ITEM_ID,
TMP.COST_ELEMENT,PID.ORIG_UOM,PID.PRDN_AREA_CODE,PID.PRODUCTION_TYPE,
OPL.PERCENT_COMP,OPL.QTY_SCRAPPED 


Reply Separator
Author: "Jamadagni; Rajendra" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   11/15/2002 5:33 AM

Funny ... that Cary mentioned it 

Some developers here think that by setting some magic instance parameters we
can make all RBO tuned code run well under CBO ... (I just bought a 6 pack
of Mylanta yesterday ...)

Raj
__
Rajendra Jamadagni  MIS, ESPN Inc.
Rajendra dot Jamadagni at ESPN dot com
Any opinion expressed here is personal and doesn't reflect that of ESPN Inc.

QOTD: Any clod can have facts, but having an opinion is an art!

Reply Separator
Author: "Cary Millsap" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   11/14/2002 10:34 AM

Hamid,

I'm sorry: Unless your SQL returns fewer than about 800,000 rows to the
calling application (or an aggregation of 800,000 rows), then the
statement "we have done all the necessary tuning on all the SQL queries"
is not yet true.

If your SQL does actually return about 800,000 rows, then it is time to
begin thinking about the mismatch between business processing
requirements and the logical structure of your data.

The answer to your problem is not in your instance parameters.


Cary Millsap
Hotsos Enterprises, Ltd.
http://www.hotsos.com







RE: RE: CONSISTANT GETS



Funny ... that Cary mentioned it 


Some developers here think that by setting some magic
instance
parameters we can make all RBO tuned code run well under CBO ... (I just
bought
a 6 pack of Mylanta yesterday ...)

Raj
__
Rajendra Jamadagni 
    MIS, ESPN Inc.
Rajendra dot Jamadagni at ESPN dot com
Any opinion expressed here is personal and doesn't reflect
that
of ESPN Inc. 
QOTD: Any clod can have facts, but having an opinion is an
art!


Reply
Separator
Author: "Cary Millsap"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   11/14/2002 10:34
AM


Hamid,


I'm sorry: Unless your SQL returns fewer than about 800,000
rows
to the
calling application (or an aggregation of 800,000 rows),
then
the
statement "we have done all the necessary tuning on
all
the SQL queries"
is not yet true.


If your SQL does actually return about 800,000 rows, then it
is
time to
begin thinking about the mismatch between business
processing
requirements and the logical structure of your data.


The answer to your problem is not in your instance
parameters.



Cary Millsap
Hotsos Enterprises, Ltd.
http://www.hotsos.com";
TARGET="_blank">http://www.hotsos.com




 
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Mercadante, Thomas F
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
Sa

RE: RE: RE: CONSISTANT GETS

[Whittle Jerome Contr NCI]

Title: RE: RE: RE: CONSISTANT GETS






I've seen worse. My programmers don't know how to use NOT EXISTS even though I've explained it many times. And that's the least of my problems. Look at this mess:

   SELECT *

 FROM sar.pax_header_suspense_err_temp

    WHERE    manifest_type

  || manifesting_station

  || fiscal_year

  || manifest_serial_number NOT IN (

 SELECT    manifest_type

    || manifesting_station

    || fiscal_year

    || manifest_serial_number

   FROM manifest_serial_number_history)


Takes over an hour to run. I rewrote it as such:


SELECT *

  FROM sar.pax_header_suspense_err_temp t

 WHERE NOT EXISTS 

(SELECT 'X' 

 FROM manifest_serial_number_history h

 WHERE

 t.manifest_type = h.manifest_type and 

 t.manifesting_station = h.manifesting_station and 

 t.fiscal_year = h.fiscal_year and

   t.manifest_serial_number = h.manifest_serial_number )


Under a second.


Jerry Whittle

ACIFICS DBA

NCI Information Systems Inc.

[EMAIL PROTECTED]

618-622-4145


-Original Message-

From:   [EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]


Raj,


    I needed a 12 pack adter this one, it's from PeopleSlop:


SELECT 0001560265,OPL.BUSINESS_UNIT,OPL.PRODUCTION_ID,OPL.OP_SEQUENCE,

PID.INV_ITEM_ID,TMP.COST_ELEMENT,'04',0,0,0,0,0,0,PID.ORIG_UOM,PID.PRDN_AREA_COD

E,

PID.PRODUCTION_TYPE,OPL.QTY_SCRAPPED,OPL.PERCENT_COMP,' ',1,0,'  ','

',00 

FROM PS_BU_ITEMS_INV INV,PS_SF_PRDNID_HEADR PID,PS_CE_OP_LIST_COPY OPL,

PS_CE_OP_LIST_VW OPLIST,PS_SF_COMP_LIST CMP,PS_CE_ITEMVAR_TMP TMP 

WHERE INV.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 

AND PID.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 

AND OPL.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 

AND OPLIST.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 

AND CMP.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 

AND TMP.BUSINESS_UNIT='VICOR' 

AND TMP.PROCESS_INSTANCE=0001560265 

AND OPL.PROCESS_INSTANCE=0001560265 

AND OPLIST.PROCESS_INSTANCE=0001560265 

AND OPL.PRODUCTION_ID= PID.PRODUCTION_ID 

AND OPL.PRODUCTION_ID= CMP.PRODUCTION_ID 

AND OPL.PRODUCTION_ID= OPLIST.PRODUCTION_ID 

AND INV.INV_ITEM_ID= PID.INV_ITEM_ID 

AND ( OPL.OP_SEQUENCE= CMP.OP_SEQUENCE OR (CMP.OP_SEQUENCE = 0 AND

OPL.OP_SEQUENCE =  OPLIST.OP_SEQUENCE)) 

AND PID.PROD_STATUS BETWEEN   '30'  AND  '60'  

AND TMP.INV_ITEM_ID= CMP.COMPONENT_ID 

AND TMP.CONFIG_CODE= CMP.CONFIG_CODE 

AND CMP.SOURCE_CODE <> '5' 

AND CMP.NON_OWN_FLAG = 'N' 

AND NOT EXISTS (SELECT 'X' FROM PS_CE_SCRAPCST_TMP TMP2 

   WHERE TMP2.PROCESS_INSTANCE=0001560265 

   AND TMP2.BUSINESS_UNIT = OPL.BUSINESS_UNIT 

   AND TMP2.PRODUCTION_ID = OPL.PRODUCTION_ID 

   AND TMP2.OP_SEQUENCE = OPL.OP_SEQUENCE 

   AND TMP2.COST_ELEMENT= TMP.COST_ELEMENT) 

GROUP BY OPL.BUSINESS_UNIT,OPL.PRODUCTION_ID,OPL.OP_SEQUENCE,PID.INV_ITEM_ID,

TMP.COST_ELEMENT,PID.ORIG_UOM,PID.PRDN_AREA_CODE,PID.PRODUCTION_TYPE,

OPL.PERCENT_COMP,OPL.QTY_SCRAPPED 

Re: Re: RE: Index behavior

[Saminathan]

Hi Wolfgang

Thanks  for your valuable information. But still I could not understand how the 
cardinality will be calculated in EXPLAIN PLAN?

In my query 
(1)AB% returns (220 rows selected) but (card=2)
(2)ABC% returns (207 rows selected) but (card=12607 )

Could someone please explain to me?

Thanks in advance
-Sami


-Original Message-
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 06 Nov 2003 07:19:24 -0800

Actually, it has nothing to do with any of the table or index statistics.
OK, almost nothing. I suppose if Jonathan (Lewis) can get the optimizer to 
do a FTS on an umpteen billion row table to retrieve a single row by its 
prime key, one can concoct a scenario of statistics values, aided by init 
or session parameters, that would cause the CBO to use a full table scan to 
resolve "where name like 'AB%".
Back to the topic. I did a test and the situation is easily reproduceable. 
What happens is that as the like comparison string gets short, the 
selectivity of the predicate decreases ( if you look at the 10053 trace, 
the TBSEL value increases but that is the same paradoxon as with 
performance: if something gets faster, did its performance decrease? ) as 
one would expect. The TBSEL selectivity value and the rate of its increase 
depends on the length of the like comparison string and the average column 
length. When it gets down to the transition from ABC% to AB%, that trend 
breaks sharply and suddenly the selectivity increases by orders of 
magnitude ( TBSEL decreases by a huge factor ). for "like A%" it decreases 
again, but is still lower (depends on avg col length) than the selectivity 
of "like ABC%".
You can see that in the following test. The cardinality reflects the 
changes in the tbsel value (cardinality = tbsel * num_rows, which was 
10,000 for the test).

select id from sam where name like 'ABCDEFGHI%';
  card operation
- --
 1 SELECT STATEMENT
 1   TABLE ACCESS BY INDEX ROWID SAM
 1 INDEX RANGE SCAN SAM_IX

select id from sam where name like 'ABCDEFGH%';
  card operation
- ---
 1 SELECT STATEMENT
 1   TABLE ACCESS BY INDEX ROWID SAM
 1 INDEX RANGE SCAN SAM_IX

select id from sam where name like 'ABCDEFG%';
  card operation
- ---
57 SELECT STATEMENT
57   TABLE ACCESS FULL SAM

select id from sam where name like 'ABCDEF%';
  card operation
- ---
   100 SELECT STATEMENT
   100   TABLE ACCESS FULL SAM

select id from sam where name like 'ABCDE%';
  card operation
- ---
   178 SELECT STATEMENT
   178   TABLE ACCESS FULL SAM

select id from sam where name like 'ABCD%';
  card operation
- ---
   317 SELECT STATEMENT
   317   TABLE ACCESS FULL SAM

select id from sam where name like 'ABC%';
  card operation
- ---
   563 SELECT STATEMENT
   563   TABLE ACCESS FULL SAM

select id from sam where name like 'AB%';
  card operation
- ---
 2 SELECT STATEMENT
 2   TABLE ACCESS BY INDEX ROWID SAM
 2 INDEX RANGE SCAN SAM_IX

select id from sam where name like 'A%';
  card operation
- ---
   297 SELECT STATEMENT
   297   TABLE ACCESS FULL SAM

At 04:29 PM 11/5/2003, you wrote:
>Hi Goulet,
>
>The clustering factor on the index=37930
>number of distinct keys=38357
>number of leaf blocks=1075

Wolfgang Breitling
Oracle7, 8, 8i, 9i OCP DBA
Centrex Consulting Corporation
http://www.centrexcc.com 


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Re: RE: RE: orbitz fiasco

[Tanel Poder]

Nope, TRU64

Tanel.


> Was this on AIX by any chance ??
> 
> Raj
> --
> --
> 
> Rajendra dot Jamadagni at nospamespn dot com
> All Views expressed in this email are strictly personal.
> QOTD: Any clod can have facts, having an opinion is an art !
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 11:20 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Btw, my colleague was working on a 9.0.1.3 RAC project where hang of
> one
> node caused hang of all other ones. Now that's high availability ;)
> 
> Tanel.
> 
> 
> **
> **
> **
> This e-mail message is confidential, intended only for the named
> recipient(s) above and may contain information that is privileged,
> attorney
> work product or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you
> have
> received this message in error, or are not the named recipient(s),
> please
> immediately notify corporate MIS at (860) 766-2000 and delete this
> e-mail
> message from your computer, Thank you.
> **
> **
> **5
> --
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> --
> Author: Jamadagni, Rajendra
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
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> 

Re: Re: Re: Index usage

[bhabani s pradhan]

Thanks.

Regards,
B S Pradhan

-


On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 zhu chao wrote :
>Hi,
> To see why oracle choose FTS, alter session set events '10053 trace name context 
> forever,level 2';
> You can do alter session to change index_adj and optimizer_index_caching  to 
> change only your session, or using hint.
>
>Regards
>Zhu Chao.
>
>- Original Message -
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2003 8:09 PM
>
>
>
>
>Hi All,
>
>Agreed.. and it should behave that way i.e
>
>if (cost of ind1 scan + then based on c1's selection table access for c3) > (direct 
>table access for c1 and c1) then oracle will use FTS with cost based optimization.
>So, w/o a hint that is expected.
>
>But why it is not picking the index in my case i donot know.
>
>Also, can optimizer_index_cost_adj help? Its 100 now. Also that affects the whole DB, 
>so is there any way to set it for this particular query ?
>
>
>Thanks for all the inputs.
>
>
>Regards,
>B S Pradhan
>
>
>
>
>
>On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 Mike Spalinger wrote :
> >The difference is that the first query never has to go to the table (because you're 
> >selecting a constant 'x').  The second query has to go to the table to filter on c3.
> >
> >Mike
> >
> >anu wrote:
> >>No.
> >>  The index should get used. The query result for query 2 is a subset of  rows 
> >> with ta.c1='val1' will get selected. Subset of query 1.
> >>  So there is no need for a full table scan. The index can be used in the 
> >> following way :
> >>  1) Use index ind1 to get rows with ta.c1='val1' (which is query 1). This can 
> >> definitely use an index.
> >>2) Further filter using ta.c3 = 'val2'
> >>  Now may be the index is not very selective and the optimizer is going in for a 
> >> full table scan. What is the cardinality like? It is strange that  RULE or index 
> >> hint is not taking it. Can you try a simple index(ta) hint or send your hint 
> >> syntax.  Can you try the hint on another table to make sure hint is working. I do 
> >> not know why hint should not work.
> >>  Good luck.
> >>
> >>"Daniel W. Fink" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >>
> >>You answered your own question.
> >>
> >>ta.c3 is a nonindexed column, this means that the only way to
> >>satisfy the
> >>predicate is to perform a full table scan. Since this predicate
> >>condition forces
> >>a full table scan on ta, which will retrieve the ta.c1 column values
> >>at the same
> >>time, there is no need to use an index. In fact, an additional index
> >>access
> >>would decrease the query performance.
> >>
> >>Daniel Fink
> >>
> >>bhabani s pradhan wrote:
> >>
> >>  > Hi All,
> >>  >
> >>  > Merry Christmas to all
> >>  >
> >>  > I have this interesting problem..
> >>  >
> >>  > For this query index ind1 on (c1,c2) columns is getting used.
> >>  > SELECT 'x'
> >>  > FROM tab ta
> >>  > WHERE ta.c1='val1';
> >>  > (gives index ind1 range scan)
> >>  >
> >>  > But for
> >>  >
> >>  > SELECT 'x'
> >>  > FROM tab ta
> >>  > WHERE ta.c1='val1'
> >>  > AND ta.c3 = 'val2';
> >>  > (gives FTS)
> >>  > index ind1 is not being used. c3 is a nonindexed column.
> >>  >
> >>  > I have already tried index(ta ind1) , RULE hints.
> >>  >
> >>  > The table and the index are analyzed.
> >>  >
> >>  > What cud be the reason for that?
> >>  >
> >>  > Regards,
> >>  > B S Pradhan
> >>
> >>--Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> >>--Author: Daniel W. Fink
> >>INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >>
> >>Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
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> >>(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may
> >>also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> >>
> >>!
> >>
> >>
> >>Do you Yahoo!?
> >>Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now 
> >>
> >
> >
> >-- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> >-- Author: Mike Spalinger
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RE: RE: RE: historical data

[Christopher Spence]

Oh, yes agreed 110%.

But on another note, import/export is not fast.  That is the only reason I
mention these other options.
But I agree 100%.  The other difficulty is if you want to import that data
into a different format, exports do not help much as you have to import
(Perhaps a big table) then convert it.


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2001 2:59 PM
To: Christopher Spence; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Chris,

Humm, did not think that was clear, but!!  We started using export to
extract data from our operational data store back in 92 with Oracle Version
5 to
tape.  These files, copied now to CD's are still usable with Oracle 8i.
That's
10 years and no problems.  If I can depend on something with Oracle, they
maintain a backwards compatibility with the import tool that I haven't found
the
end of yet.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: Christopher Spence <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   5/22/2001 2:20 PM

I am not sure what you are saying here, but ok sure.


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2001 1:31 PM
To: Christopher Spence; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Chris,

I've been exporting data in a similar way as you since V5.  The 8i
version
of import still reads them without trouble.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: Christopher Spence <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   5/22/2001 7:13 AM

Take a look at Thomas's Kytes utility "Data Unloadder" on his website.

Also look at Oriole's PDQ OUT.  Both products will avoid the need to
recreate the wheel.
Also, toad can do this.


-Original Message-
Sent: Monday, May 21, 2001 6:17 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


We have to role off partitions of data every week and I am writing a script
to 
write the data to comma separated files using utl_file. What I was wondering
is
does anyone have an alternative that is better? I thought about using export
but
thought it wouldn't be fun trying to import an export file into the latest
version
of Oracle 10 years down the road. 

Thanks, Dave
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RE: RE: RE: salary advise

[Mohan, Ross]

Title: RE: RE: RE: salary advise





Amen, but you may get flamed hard for this from the Neo-zealotry!


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 1:47 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Re:RE: RE: salary advise



Well at least here in the US, our women are smart enough to stay out of the
presidential meat grinder.  But given the last twenty years of bone heads we've
elected, from RayGun to Bush Jr., I think I'll vote for a women even if she just
declares.  I think we've had enough of guys who have their heads so far up in
the clouds they need "fortune tellers" to tell them when to breath, to those who
don't have the guts to finish what they started, to guys who can't keep their
brains in their pants, to this weirdo who wants to turn the government over to
the NRA, the Baptist Convention and the oil companies.  Sheesh what a mess! 
Only in America!!


Dick Goulet



Reply Separator
Author: lerobe - Lee Robertson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   1/30/2001 9:10 AM


and the UK.but she lasted bloody ages. G !!! 


> Lee Robertson
> Acxiom
> Tel:  0191 525 7344
> Fax:  0191 525 7007
> Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 



-Original Message-
Sent: 30 January 2001 16:26
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Canada had a woman prime minister as well.  She did
not last long but she was there.


-Original Message-
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2001 9:15 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Free country..largest democracy in the world..had a
woman prime minister..i grew up there..great people...


My 2 cents!!


--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> u-huh.. I wanted to add.. and women are respected
> like men alike..
> 
> Also India is different as I have not seen _ANY_
> foreign nationals work in
> India (except at US embassy etc.).. this can be due
> to reasons:
> 
> 1. The pay is no where near Iraq.. If you make
> $20K/year  in India.. you
> are perhaps in the richest crowd.. the cost of
> living is much cheaper so it
> works great..
> 2. India has a huge surplus of brain power ...
> willing to export the brains
> worldwide.. why would we import ?
> 
> -regards, bruce
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]@fatcity.com on 01/29/2001
> 09:15:57 AM
> 
> Please respond to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> Sent by:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> 
> To:   Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> cc:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For the record.. India and Iraq are worlds apart..
> women work in all
> fields.. doctors, engineers.. etc.. unlike what I am
> reading about Iraq..
> Just my personal opnion..
> Bruce Taneja, made and bred in India.. :)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Weaver, Walt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>@fatcity.com on
> 01/26/2001 10:25:22 PM
> 
> Please respond to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> Sent by:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> 
> To:   Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> cc:
> 
> 
> Hey, you Arab guys better stay away from the U.S. 
> :>)
> 
> I live with three females (one wife, two daughters)
> and they definitely
> rule
> the roost.
> 
> Fortunately for me, I still have my cojones.
> 
> BUT, I tread softly, and wear a veil whenever I
> venture into the Female
> Area, otherwise known as the Whole House.
> 
> Here in the U.S., the veil is also known as The Cup.
> 
> Woo-hooh! I snow ski, fly fish, read books, and just
> enjoy life with my
> daughters every day. Would I be allowed to do this
> in Bahrain?
> 
> There's a good chance that my 11-year-old daughter
> will be flying F-22's in
> 10 years. She can already fly a Piper Tomahawk with
> no problem.
> 
> No wonder everyone's immigrating to the US. Not too
> many people immigrating
> to India or Iraq, eh?
> 
> :>)
> 
> --Walt Weaver
>   Bozeman, Montana, USA
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Sent: 1/26/2001 3:45 PM
> 
> I have previous officemates who are now in Dubai.
> They say...the women there is assumed not to be
> professionally
> good as men. An Arab interviewer went to my town to
> interview
>  some prospective employees and he was surprised
> that
> the women in my country are also professionally
> working like men.
> So if you are a woman they already expect you not to
> succeed
> in almost anything.
> 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >
> >
> >  Yes Ratchel, your friend is right. I visited
> Baharain briefly, it
> appears to
> > be the case that they t

RE: RE: RE: RE: Manager decrees "his" data warehouse design.

[Cunningham, Gerald]

Actually, they're different.

SAN = faster, more $$$ (e.g. EMC)
NAS = slower, less $$$ (e.g. Network Appliance)


-JC

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 9:38 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Patrice,

They are synonyms for each other as far as I understand.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Boivin; Patrice J" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   2/28/2002 3:38 AM

I guess the reverse of SAME is EMAS, where Everything Makes Absolute Sense.

: )

NAS, is that the same thing as a SAN? 
Network - Attached Storage
Storage Area Network

Here we have a couple of "SANs", but I think they also fit the description
you gave of an NAS.

Regards,
Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)


 -Original Message-
Sent:   Wednesday, February 27, 2002 6:53 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

S.A.M.E, Stripe And Mirror Everything.  It's a concept that came from an
individual at Oracle with a significant pile of alphabet soup after his name
who has lost most of his credibility anywhere.

  He was speaking though of Network Attached Storage (NAS) stuff where you
really don't have to worry about the mount point/drive letter where you put
the datafile(s).  These neato devices do make some of the DBA's tasks of IO
balancing meaningless since they do stripe data across multiple disks and
run hardware mirroring in the background.  In turn they retrieve your data
from the most efficient place possible & buffer your writes in cache memory
that 'guarantees' that it will absolutely make it to disk.

  What I think has happen is that some of his idea was taken out of context,
though not out of quote, and made meaningless.  You should still have
logical database design and multiple tablespaces/datafiles.  It's just that
you really don't care is everything is on drive H.

Dick Goulet
PS: I've not implemented such an idea & have no intention thereof in the
near future.  Reason, NAS storage is not here.

Reply Separator
Author: "Michael Cupp" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   2/27/2002 1:20 PM

S.A.M.E.?

-- 
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-- 
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RE: RE: RE: RE: Manager decrees "his" data warehouse design.

[Michael Cupp]

What is the avg rate for a NAS?  Where is a good place to buy?

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 12:03 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Actually, they're different.

SAN = faster, more $$$ (e.g. EMC)
NAS = slower, less $$$ (e.g. Network Appliance)


-JC

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 9:38 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Patrice,

They are synonyms for each other as far as I understand.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Boivin; Patrice J" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   2/28/2002 3:38 AM

I guess the reverse of SAME is EMAS, where Everything Makes Absolute Sense.

: )

NAS, is that the same thing as a SAN? 
Network - Attached Storage
Storage Area Network

Here we have a couple of "SANs", but I think they also fit the description you gave of 
an NAS.

Regards,
Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)


 -Original Message-
Sent:   Wednesday, February 27, 2002 6:53 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

S.A.M.E, Stripe And Mirror Everything.  It's a concept that came from an individual at 
Oracle with a significant pile of alphabet soup after his name who has lost most of 
his credibility anywhere.

  He was speaking though of Network Attached Storage (NAS) stuff where you really 
don't have to worry about the mount point/drive letter where you put the datafile(s).  
These neato devices do make some of the DBA's tasks of IO balancing meaningless since 
they do stripe data across multiple disks and run hardware mirroring in the 
background.  In turn they retrieve your data from the most efficient place possible & 
buffer your writes in cache memory that 'guarantees' that it will absolutely make it 
to disk.

  What I think has happen is that some of his idea was taken out of context, though 
not out of quote, and made meaningless.  You should still have logical database design 
and multiple tablespaces/datafiles.  It's just that you really don't care is 
everything is on drive H.

Dick Goulet
PS: I've not implemented such an idea & have no intention thereof in the near future.  
Reason, NAS storage is not here.

Reply Separator
Author: "Michael Cupp" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   2/27/2002 1:20 PM

S.A.M.E.?

-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Boivin, Patrice J
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Re: Re: Re: bFILES & Recovery Manager

[Cyril Thankappan]

hi

thanx
- Original Message --
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
To:Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date:Wed, 04 Apr 2001 13:24:12 -0800
Subject:Re: Re: bFILES & Recovery Manager 


On 4 Apr 2001, Cyril  Thankappan wrote:

> Hello!
>
>  Does recovery MANAGER support bfiles?
>   if so any idea when Oracle plans to support them?
>
>  THanx
>

I don't know, but I doubt it.

Jared


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_
Chat with your friends as soon as they come online. Get Rediff Bol at
http://bol.rediff.com




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Re: RE: RE: dumping microsoft desktop?

[Ray Stell]

On Fri, Nov 15, 2002 at 05:59:06AM -0800, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> OH, talk about cruel and unusual punishment!!  For the fish that is.


It is interesting that so many people feel this way and yet the topic
is reduced to joking, as if it is not possible (or really desirable) to
replace technology.  MVS systems programmers couldn't envision life
without an IBM mainframe a few years ago.  I asked the desktop question
because we are exploring this path due to huge budget issues and the
million dollar invoice to M$ is due.  I wanted to see if the Oracle
world had anything going on the topic.  Guess not.

Star and Open Office advances seem to be milestones in this arena.
I believe we will move some % of our admin desktops to linux this 
year as a pilot.  Departments can't afford the price of upgrading
their office software, they will try the open versions to see
what happens.

Interesting bullets:

The EU is studying the conversion of member goverment desktops:

www.globetechnology.com/servlet/ArticleNews/einsider/RTGAM/20021104/gtopenms/einsider/

 The European Union awarded on Thursday a $249,000 (U.S.) contract to
 U.K.-based system-integrator Netproject to study the feasibility of
 moving the information systems of several member countries'
 governments to the Linux operating system from Microsoft's Windows
 OS.

www.netproject.co.uk/opendesktop.html

 "The USA National Security Agency's white paper 'The Inevitability of
 Failure: The Flawed Assumption of Security in Modern Computing
 Environments' should be read by all who are concernd with achieving
 secure systems that enable e-business. This is at
 www.nsa.gov/selinux/inevit-abs.html."


...waiting for the 9.2.0.2 patch to finish on my Mandrake 9 desktop (see, 
it's not off topic! ;)







> Dick Goulet
> 
> Reply Separator
> Author: "Gogala; Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date:   11/14/2002 1:38 PM
> 
> Well, once upon a time there was an event called Boston Tea Party
> which dealt with too expensive product of low quality delivered by 
> a monopoly. I wonder whether we can expect Seattle Windows Party?
> Would that be too cruel to the fish in Seattle harbor?
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:dgoulet@;vicr.com]
> > Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2002 3:44 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Subject: Re:RE: dumping microsoft desktop?
> > 
> > 
> > David,
> > 
> > Just like beauty, winning or loosing in a lawsuit is in 
> > the eye of the
> > beholder.  Actually in MicroSlop's case it was the justice 
> > department that
> > bailed and more than likely King George who sat on the judge. 
> >  You got to love
> > those political action committees and their BIG donors!!  In 
> > politics money
> > talks louder than anything else.
> > 
> > Dick Goulet
> > 
> > Reply Separator
> > Author: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Date:   11/14/2002 12:15 PM
> > 
> > 
> > > Both answers a are expected to be "No". The lawsuit is
> > > expected to be dropped. But who knows. They won
> > > antitrust case after all.
> > > 
> > > Nick
> > > 
> > 
> > I know it *seems* like they won, but Microsoft actually lost 
> > the antitrust
> > case. :-(
> > 
> > Dave
> > -- 
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> > -- 
> > Author: 
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > 
> > Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> > San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services
> > -
> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> > -- 
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> > -- 
> > Author: 
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > 
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> > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> > 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: Gogala, Mladen
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
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> 

RE: RE: Re[2]: sequence numbers

[Deshpande, Kirti]

I wanted to take a picture with him. 
.. and take him out to lunch to learn from his experience ... ;-) 
but it turned out he lasted only for less than a week... ;) 
(Some developers he was working with knew a bit more Oracle than him)

- Kirti  



-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 11:49 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Let's see, 1 table with 700+ columns that can grow to ~1GB that you want to
iot
and have in the keep pool.  What are you smoking!  That's one consultant
that
I'd HAVE to laugh in his/her face.  And he/she would NOT get away with it.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: Rachel Carmichael <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/11/2002 7:19 AM

it's all in the buzzwords, obviously :)


--- "Deshpande, Kirti" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> We were asked, not too long ago, to create one Oracle8i database with
> only
> *one* table with some 700+ columns. While at it, the consultant
> (hired by
> end user dept) also suggested that we make it an IOT using an LMT,
> and since
> the table will never grow over 1GB, asked if there was a way to put
> it in
> KEEP buffer pool. He was helping re-write/enhance some MS Access
> Apps.
> 
> Talk about knowing all the right lingo... ;) 
> 
> - Kirti
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 8:59 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> April,
> 
> What can I say?  Ouch!  I feel your pain.  I've been trapped in some
> pretty ridiculous situations too.  (Though, I think you have me beat!
>  A
> 37 column primary key?? Really??)  Well, you at least seem to have
> the
> proper attitude. ;-)  Without a sense of humor, I'm afraid you'd go
> insane in short order!  ;-)
> 
> The only other thing I can think of when people shut you down like
> that
> is: document.  "At meeting X, on such and such a date, I identified
> this
> problem, and Mr. Z told me to not to worry about it."  It may not
> help,
> but from a sanity point of view, there is a certain amount of
> satisfaction in "I told you so!", even if you never verbalize
> it;-)
> 
> Hang in there,
> 
> -Mark
> 
> On Fri, 2002-10-11 at 08:43, April Wells wrote:
> > Mark...
> > 
> > If this were the MOST serious design flaw in the whole mess, I
> wouldn't
> care
> > so much.  There is a point where you just shut up (gee, I have been
> TOLD
> to
> > do that in meetings) and wait till it breaks (or worse, one of our
> clients
> > buys it and we have to TRY to implement).  I am the funny one...
> the one
> to
> > laugh at and make fun of because I keep trying to tell them that
> you can't
> > do things.  You can't have a totally denormalized Oracle table if
> there
> 1500
> > columns in it... yes queries will fly on a table that can't be
> built.  You
> > can't have 37 columns in a primary key.  Date really isn't an
> acceptable
> > name for a column.
> > 
> > April Wells
> > Oracle DBA 
> > Keep yourself well oiled with life, laughter, new ideas and action.
> > Otherwise you will rust out.  _Anonymous
> > 
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, October 10, 2002 7:34 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > 
> > 
> > Hi Dick,
> > 
> > I have to disagree with you here.  Particularly in the case where
> this
> > sequence will see any sort of concurrency, from multiple concurrent
> > sessions accessing it.  This is due to the serialization on the SQ
> > enqueue.  This will cause far worse scalability issues than any
> I/O. 
> > Not that I/O is insignificant, but in this situation, serialization
> on
> > the enqueue will be the real showstopper for scalability.
> > 
> > As to losing the cached values, well, so what?  If your design is
> such
> > that it's important to have an unbroken contiguous sequence of
> numbers
> > with no gaps, then I would argue that is a serious design flaw. 
> Also,
> > if that's your requirement, then a sequence is not appropriate,
> since it
> > can and will end up causing gaps, the first time you roll back a
> > transaction.
> > 
> > Finally, as to sequences losing cached values, unless your instance
> > crashes or does a shutdown abort, Oracle should not loose any
> sequence
> > values.
> > 
> > -Mark
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > On Thu, 2002-10-10 at 18:18, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > > Actually there is no IO penalty since Oracle has to treat the
> sequence
> > just like
> > > any table with the old LRU algorithm.  I have several sequences
> with a
> > cache of
> > > 0 and they perform as well as those with a cache value.  The big
> > difference is
> > > when you shut down the database and all of those cached values
> end up in
> > the
> > > trash.
> > > 
> > > Dick Goulet
> > > 
> > > Reply Separator
> > > Author: "Yechiel Adar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > Date:   10/10/2002 1:38 PM
> > > 
> > > I think that you will have an update to the sequence number EVERY
> time
> > instead
> > > of every 20 times. That's mean

RE: RE: Re: Logical StandBy question

[Stephane Faroult]

I tried it on 9.2.0.3.0 running on two Linux machines. I doubt all bugs were fixed in 
9.2.0.4. I currently consider LSB to be a prototype, an interesting foretaste of 
things to come, but hardly more.
It of course depends on the size of the database, but couldn't you consider doing 
reporting on a Day - 1 database?
Might be simpler to use your hot backups and recreate a backup database every night. 
Or perhaps use snaphots (sorry, materialized views) - traditional replication (you 
don't need the 'advanced' stuff). If the production database can bear the overhead.
Anyway, if you are as lucky as I was, this is (rebuilding the database from your 
backups) what you may well end doing with LSB (plus the 26 step process each time - 
well, I wrote scripts to help).

HTH,

SF
>- --- Original Message --- -
>From: "Juan Miranda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Thu, 13 Nov 2003 00:34:25
>
>
>I am just planning a LOGICAL data guard
>installation in an important client.
>They need it for reporting and backup (primary is
>24x7x365 and we have hot
>backup.)
>
>I didn?t kwon that LSB are so bad.
>
>So do you think It is so bad that you don?t put it
>into production ???
>
>Do you try 9.2.0.4 ??
>
>
>I need to take a decision
>
>I thank your previous answers.
>(I read doc, of course, but It is not explicity say
>that)
>  -Mensaje original-
>  De: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] nombre de
>Carel-Jan Engel
>  Enviado el: miercoles, 12 de noviembre de 2003
>19:59
>  Para: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>  Asunto: RE: Re: Logical StandBy question
>
>
>  Walt, drop me your email-address, and I send you
>the handouts of a special
>I presented about DG for Oracle University in
>Stockholm.
>
>  I'm going out now for a few hours (it's 19.30
>over here), but I'll respond
>later this evening.
>
>  regards, Carel-Jan
>  At 09:19 12-11-03 -0800, you wrote:
>
>Stephane,
>
>What sort of problems can one expect from
>logical standby?
>
>I'm toying with the idea of using it as a
>replication database -- no
>additional schema objects will be created, but
>users will have read-only
>access to it. It's one of the options I'm
>looking at.
>
>Seems to me like there was a thread on this a
>few months ago, but I'm
>not sure...
>
>--Walt
>
>On Wed, 2003-11-12 at 09:49, Stephane Faroult
>wrote:
>> Jose Luis,
>>
>>   What you say refers to the physical standby
>database (which works
>well),
>> not to the logical standby database (which on
>the paper looks great,
>allows you to open the database, create additional
>tablespaces, create
>additional indexes on replicated objects etc) but
>which in practice still
>has a lot of teething troubles. Wouldn't use it in
>production on Oracle 9.2.
>>
>> HTH,
>>
>> SF
>>
>> >- --- Original Message --- -
>
>> >From: Jose Luis Delgado
>> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >Sent: Wed, 12 Nov 2003 08:09:27
>> >
>> >Hmm...
>> >
>> >I'd like to know where in the manuals... :-)
>
>> >
>> >I do not think so since the standby database
>stay
>> >in
>> >permanent recovery mode.
>> >
>> >JL
>> >
>> >--- Rachel Carmichael
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >wrote:
>> >> yes. Well documented in the manuals
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --- Juan Miranda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Hi
>> >> >
>> >> > It is posible to create other schemas on
>a
>> >logical
>> >> stand by database
>> >> > ?
>> >> >
>> >> > I mean, schemas that don?t exist in the
>primary
>> >
>> >> database.
>> >> > --
>> >> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
>> >> http://www.orafaq.net
>> >> > --
>> >> > Author: Juan Miranda
>> >> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> --
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
-- 
Author: Stephane Faroult
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: RE: RE: Oracle TEMPORARY SEGMENT

[chao_ping]

Whittle Jerome Contr NCI,
1.Temporary tablespace in oracle8i+ does not need coalesce, and Oracle do not 
deallocate used sort extents. This is a feature.
2.There is no pctincrease parameter in TEMPORARY tablespace.
SQL> /
 create temporary tablespace test_tmp tempfile '/home/oracle/temp.dd' size 10m default 
storage(pctincrease 0)
   *
ERROR at line 1:
ORA-25139: invalid option for CREATE TEMPORARY TABLESPACE


Elapsed: 00:00:00.04


[oracle@ish3 oracle]$ sql

SQL*Plus: Release 8.1.7.0.0 - Production on Tue Feb 11 23:31:50 2003

(c) Copyright 2000 Oracle Corporation.  All rights reserved.


Connected to:
Oracle8i Enterprise Edition Release 8.1.7.0.0 - Production
With the Partitioning option
JServer Release 8.1.7.0.0 - Production

SQL> alter tablespace temp default storage(pctincrease 0);
alter tablespace temp default storage(pctincrease 0)
*
ERROR at line 1:
ORA-03217: invalid option for alter of TEMPORARY TABLESPACE






Regards
zhu chao
msn:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.happyit.net
www.cnoug.org(China Oracle User Group)

=== 2003-02-11 08:39:00 ,you wrote£º===

>Hi,
>
>It does work on temporary (that are truly temporary and not permanent) tablespaces in 
>7.3.4 and 8.1.7. I use it when I don't want to wait for SMON to clean things up. Just 
>yesterday one our 'power users' ran SQL that selected from two tables with no join 
>between them. The resulting Cartesian set would have been over 3 billion records. The 
>same SQL also had a complex group by clause to eliminate all the duplicate records he 
>just created. It locked up after many hours because it filled the 1.2 GB TEMP 
>tablespace. I killed the process and ran my SQL to clean out the temp tablespace 
>quickly. BTW: I rewrote his SQL properly and it took less than a minute to return the 
>1036 records. 
>
>Jerry Whittle
>ASIFICS DBA
>NCI Information Systems Inc.
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>618-622-4145
>
>> -Original Message-
>> From:chao_ping [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
>> 
>> Whittle Jerome Contr NCI,
>>  I think your sql should not work on a really TEMPORARY tablespace, and 
>temporary tablespace do not need to be cleaned either.
>> 
>> Regards
>> zhu chao
>> msn:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> www.happyit.net
>> www.cnoug.org(China Oracle User Group)
>> 
>> === 2003-02-11 06:49:00 ,you wrote£º===
>> 
>> >Hi,
>> >
>> >This is what I use to clean up a temp tablespace. The tablespace is named 'temp' 
>and it is normally set to PCTINCREASE of 10. You will need to insert the correct 
>values for your temp tablespace. Altering the tablespace a little wakes us SMON which 
>will clean things up if it can.
>> >
>> >alter tablespace temp default storage(pctincrease 0);
>> >alter tablespace temp default storage(pctincrease 10);
>> >
>> >50Mb seems rather small for a temp tablespace.
>> >
>> >Jerry Whittle
>> >ASIFICS DBA
>> >NCI Information Systems Inc.
>> >[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >618-622-4145
>> >
>> >> -Original Message-
>> >> From: Zabair Ahmed [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
>> >> 
>> >> Is their any way of identifying which user/process is holding onto a temporary 
>segment. I've got a 50Mb temporary tablespace and there is a temporary segment which 
>is 47Mb which is not being freed up by SMON.
>> >> 
>> >> And, if i can't identify who is holding onto this TEMP segment, is their a way 
>in which I can delete it and stop the alert log being flooded with ORA-1652.
>> >> 
>> >> As I say the SMON is failing to clean up this TEMP segment and it's been 
>on-going for a number of days and I don't have the option of bouncing the database.
>> >> 
>> >> Oracle 8.1.7.3 on HP-UX 11.
>> >> 
>> >> TIA 
>> 

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =




-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
-- 
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  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: RE: RE: World's largest database...

[Jim Hawkins]

Ian,

Thanks for the info.  Very interesting.

Jim

"MacGregor, Ian A." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>The  0.5 petabyte database at SLAC does not use Oracle;  it uses Objectivity.   
>Objectivity is a small company which makes an OODB.  When the project started there 
>was no way that Oracle could possibly handle this.  It is still doubtful: Oracle does 
>not truly support Hierarchical Storage Systems;  using one huge RAC ties limits your 
>machine vendors; some limits such as 64,000 partitions probably need to be increased.
>
>CERN is however very interested in using Oracle for their Large Hadronic Collider, 
>but that's about seven years off.  That database will surpass BABAR's which as of 
>00:01:13 this morning (April 18 2002) was storing 549.6 TB has been stored in 324603 
>files.  CERN's possible use of Oracle is not due to failures in Objectivity, but due 
> to that company's inability to capture market share.  They are hoping the problems 
>which prevent Oracle from handling large databases can be fixed by then.    I am also 
>hoping for this, but I fear Oracle may prove to be an uncooperative prohibitedly 
>expensive partner.
>
>
>Here we have plans to turn up the luminosity.  If approved the database will reach 
>one exabyte by the end of the experiment.
>
>I don't believe the genealogy databases are even close to 500 TB.
>
>
>Ian MacGregor
>Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>-Original Message-
>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
>Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2002 8:29 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>I can believe that - I think they are the group that offers all the geneaology 
>services to track family histories.  I'll bet that's one heck of database too!
>
>Jim
>
>"Boivin, Patrice J" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>>At the Oracle Technology Day here they mentioned that one of the largest
>>databases belongs to the Church Of Latter Day Saints, if you can believe it.
>>
>>They mentioned it in a seminar which also talked about iFS, I don't know
>>they were implying that it relies on iFS.
>>
>>Regards,
>>Patrice Boivin
>>Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>>Sent:   Thursday, April 18, 2002 11:03 AM
>>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>>Subject:    World's largest database...
>>
>>http://www.computerworld.com/storyba/0,4125,NAV47_STO70250,00.html
>>
>>I thought we had someone on this list from this group, and was just
>>wondering if this particular database was in Oracle or not.
>>
>>Jim
>>
>>--
>>_
>>Jim Hawkins
>>Oracle Database Administrator
>>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>St. Louis, MO  USA
>>--
>>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
>>--
>>Author: Boivin, Patrice J
>>  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>
>>Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
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>>
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>Jim Hawkins
>Oracle Database Administrator
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>St. Louis, MO  USA
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RE: RE: RE: Oracle Browser 2

[Kevin Lange]

Discoverer did what it was supposed to do .  but it did it in a VERY
UGLY MANNER.

You should have seen the Crap SQL it returned for its queries...  I would
have expected a product written BY ORALCE FOR ORACLE to be written in such a
way that it returned the best SQL that could be generated.

This was pure unadulterated Crap.

And that is not just my opinion  its the unadulterated truth !

Kevin

-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2001 3:12 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


David,

In it's current incarnation I'd recommend against it.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: David Wagoner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/31/2001 12:05 PM

Wow.  Thanks for your effort here Dick.  Sounds like quite an ordeal.  At
least I'll know some problems to look for if my company decides to try
Discoverer!


David B. Wagoner
Database Administrator
Arsenal Digital Solutions Worldwide Inc.
4815 Emperor Blvd., Suite 110
Durham, NC 27703
Tel. (919) 941-4645
Fax (919) 474-0735
Email mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web http://www.arsenaldigital.com/

 
***  NOTICE  ***
This e-mail message is confidential, intended only for the named
recipient(s) above and may contain information that is privileged, work
product or exempt from disclosure under applicable law.  If you have
received this message in error, or are not the named recipient(s), please
immediately notify the sender at (919) 941-4645 and delete this e-mail
message from your computer.  Thank you.



-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2001 9:55 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

David,

OK, first off the Oracle sales droid and pre-sales droid came in to do
the
install of the product (9iAS Enterprise Edition which BTW, you HAVE to have
the
Enterprise edition or else you don't get the WEB based tool).  The install
manual said it would need 6GB of HP-UX disk to install properly, BULL it was
much closer to 9GB (OK, 8.75 to be exact).  You end up installing WEB forms,
graphics, reports, and the cache DB even though your not going to use them.
We
were told the install and initial configuration would only take half a day,
it
took that long just to read in the CD's and in actually took the better part
of
16 hours with configuration going on into a third 8 hour time period. What a
pile of BLOATware, YUCK!!

Next the locator process intermittently died for no apparent reason.
There
was no core dump, or other indication that something odd had happen & the
log
file was less than helpful it turns out.  Actually pointed us in the WRONG
direction.  According to the log we were having a semaphore problem when in
truth it turned into a semaphore set problem.  This thing LOVES doing IPC's.


Next we had a problem with browsers.  The company 'standard' is
MicroSlop IE
5.0.  Suppose to work, WRONG!!  The only machine that would run Discoverer
was a
brand new one with ME and IE 5.51 or something like that, and then it wasn't
exactly sure it wanted to go!!  This one appears to be a JVM issue (MS does
not
like SUN on which Oracle's Java implementations is based), but MetaLink has
a
pointer to an article on 'How to use JInitiator with IE 5.x', but for some
reason it has not been 'published' yet so you get an 'document is
unavailable'
message.  The product did work with Netscape 4.61 and beyond but it was SLOW
to
startup.  After that the interface being a 'navigation tree' was so foreign
to
our users that they were totally disenchanted.  The 'last straw' was the
admin
edition where you had to map all of the tables, etc.. into the end user
layer.
Doing certain common tasks, although possible, was not intuitive (like sub
queries).  The great part was that it did use the referential integrity to
self
join tables, warned when you created a Cartesian query but let you run it
anyway, and it has a damn good query predictor that gets smarter as time
(read
than as number of executions of the query) passes.

What Oracle needs to do here is:

1) Support the MicroSlop browsers most likely by getting that article
published.
2) Train their sales folks, they were going through the first install
right
along with us!!
3) Cut out the bloat.  There is no reason for all the other stuff if all
you
want is Discoverer.
4) Figure out what the 'real' numbers are for disk and semaphore sets
and
publish them.
5) Put back that ability to use the native dictionary as well as the
EUL.
That was the way it was in Discoverer 2000, why the change?
6) Get rid of that 'navigation tree' in favor of the graphical table
layout
diagram.
7) Let end users edit their SQL.  Easiest way to insert sub queries
there
ever was.
8) Improve the graphics capabilities, their a little primitive in the
current version.

In the end, when we told them we had decided against Discoverer 3000 they
were
"not suprised".

Dick Goulet
Reply Separator
Author: David 

RE: RE: final frontier / RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.

[Mohan, Ross]

Title: RE: RE: final frontier / RE: RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix.





I think Larry sent a message to the list about it. ;-)


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 4:17 PM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Re:RE: final frontier / RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.



Who's the manufacturer?  will it run from a trolling motor's 12 volt battery?? 
Lord, maybe I can combine work and fishing after all!!!  Hooray, I'll move my
office to Lake Sunapee during the summer!


Dick Goulet


Reply Separator
Subject:    RE: final frontier / RE: RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix.
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   2/6/2001 12:24 PM


I love it. 


You WILL be assimilated.


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 2:35 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Ross & Dick,


The lead network field engineer at this campus looks a bit
like "Mr. Spock" on Star Trek. He has a wearable PC. It was
totally cost-justified (hands free operations). It is really
a trip seeing him go in/out of the wiring closets with all 
the stuff on. freaks out the users big time. :)


ep


On 6 Feb 2001, at 9:56, Mohan, Ross wrote:


Date sent:  Tue, 06 Feb 2001 09:56:30 -0800
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


> It exists!
> 
> I even see "anti RF" clothing for sale!
> 
> 
> Amazing world.
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:49 PM
> To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Hey, I'm waiting for the wearable computer with the wireless link into the
> network.  Especially if it comes with voice command.  


...



-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Eric D. Pierce
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).





RE: final frontier / RE: RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix.




I love it. 



You WILL be assimilated.



-Original Message-
From: Eric D. Pierce [
HREF="mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 2:35 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: OT: final frontier / RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs
Unix.




Ross & Dick,



The lead network field engineer at this campus looks a
bit
like "Mr. Spock" on Star Trek. He has a wearable PC.
It was
totally cost-justified (hands free operations). It is
really
a trip seeing him go in/out of the wiring closets with all

the stuff on. freaks out the users big time. :)



ep



On 6 Feb 2001, at 9:56, Mohan, Ross wrote:



Date sent: 
    Tue, 06 Feb 2001 09:56:30
-0800

SIZE=2>To:   &nbs
p;     Multiple recipients of list
ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>



> It exists!
> 
> I even see "anti RF" clothing for sale!
> 
> 
> Amazing world.
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:49 PM
> To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list
ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Hey, I'm waiting for the wearable computer with the
wireless link into the
> network.  Especially if it comes with voice
command.  



...




-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: 
HREF="http://www.orafaq.com" TARGET="_blank">http://www.orafaq.com
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Author: Eric D. Pierce
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]



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SIZE=2>
T>
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subscribing).

RE: RE: STOMACH WRENCHINGLY OFFTOPIC RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs

[Boivin, Patrice J]

I think I will add stomach to my e-mail exclude list.

: )

Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)



-Original Message-
From:   [EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent:   Wednesday, February 07, 2001 10:11 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject:Re:RE: STOMACH WRENCHINGLY OFFTOPIC RE: RE: RE: OT
NT2K vs 

Okay, Someone pass the 40 ft pole!!

Reply Separator
Author: "Kevin Kostyszyn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   2/6/2001 1:56 PM

    RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.i wasn't gonna say it, I knew someone
would and
it wasn't me...whoo h
  -Original Message-
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
Mohan, Ross
  Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 4:28 PM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
  Subject: STOMACH WRENCHINGLY OFFTOPIC RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.


  You can do ALOT of things in bed with your palm.

  ( nyuk nyuk nyuk )
-Original Message-
From: Kevin Kostyszyn [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 3:31 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
        Subject: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.


NO WAY  You can do stuff to your DB from bed with a Palm???
  -Original Message-
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
Richard
Ji
  Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 2:57 PM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
          Subject: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.


  How about the DBA tool that runs on a Palm VII, I forgot what
is it
called.  No voice command but at least you don't have to get out of
the bed.
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
Mohan,
Ross
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:57 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
    Subject: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.


It exists!

I even see "anti RF" clothing for sale!



Amazing world.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:49 PM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Re:RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.



Hey, I'm waiting for the wearable computer with the wireless
link
into the
network.  Especially if it comes with voice command.  That
way when
a "middle of
the night" problem occurs all I'll have to do is roll over,
fix the
problem, and
then fall back asleep.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Subject:RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix.
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   2/6/2001 6:26 AM

Pithy as hell and twice as true.

I agree
totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI...

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



The future of computers, look at the games of today.




 Brian L. Anderson
 Flunky/SA/DBA
 Darton College
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]


> -Original Message-

> are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't be
surprised
> if the code
> for some database query optimizers trace back to some
gaming
> AI code.   :)
>
--
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
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RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam

[Mohan, Ross]

Title: RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam





Dick , 


Didn't you know? Rachel WAS in Nam. But she 
never talks about it. I think it had to do
with the bugs. 


Just a thought. 


Ross


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 8:32 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Re:RE: RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Re



Rachel,


    If you were given one, as I was in Nam, you'd not know the difference. 
Looks like, & tastes like a crunch bar for the most part, except for the logo on
top.  It just crunches better.


Dick Goulet


Reply Separator
Author: "Rachel Carmichael" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/19/2001 4:10 PM


but Moom, the icky bugs TOUCHED the chocolate!   :)




>From: Kimberly Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: RE: RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
>Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 13:45:29 -0800
>
>You could just lick the chocolate off.
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 10:11 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> I have a phobia about bugs...
>
>what a waste of perfectly good chocolate
>
>
> >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Subject: Re:RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
> >Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 09:11:20 -0800
> >
> >OK you chocaholics try this on for size:
> >
> >  Reuters Monday, March 19, 2001
> >
> >Chocolate-Coated Bugs Are Latest Treat
> >
> >LONDON (Reuters) - Ants, crickets and scorpions, baked, coated
> >in chocolate and promoted as a high-protein snack, are proving
> >popular among peckish Londoners.
> >
> >Designer Todd Dalton, who trained as a chef in Louisiana and
> >acquired a taste for cooked insects on his travels in Asia and
> >central America, says he has sold 5,000 chocolate-coated bugs
> >since he began marketing them in December.
> >
> >"They are very high in protein and very low in fat. They have a
> >higher percentage of protein than any meat or fish that we
> >commonly eat," he told Reuters.
> >
> >The creepy-crawly chocs sell for between three and 3.50 pounds
> >($4.30-$5.00) at upmarket London stores such as Selfridges and
> >the Conran Shop and will soon be appearingin shops in Munich
> >and Zurich.
> >--
> >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> >--
> >Author:
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> >Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
> >San Diego, California    -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
> >
> >To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
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> >(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> >also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
>
>_
>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
>
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>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
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>Author: Rachel Carmichael
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
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>(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
>also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
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>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam

[Rachel Carmichael]

I'm old but not THAT old :)  would not have been draftable even at the end 
of the war (even if I were male!)


>From: "Mohan, Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam
>Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 08:02:26 -0800
>
>Dick ,
>
>Didn't you know? Rachel WAS in Nam. But she
>never talks about it. I think it had to do
>with the bugs.
>
>Just a thought.
>
>Ross
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 8:32 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>Rachel,
>
> If you were given one, as I was in Nam, you'd not know the difference.
>Looks like, & tastes like a crunch bar for the most part, except for the
>logo on
>top.  It just crunches better.
>
>Dick Goulet
>
>Reply Separator
>Author: "Rachel Carmichael" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date:   3/19/2001 4:10 PM
>
>but Moom, the icky bugs TOUCHED the chocolate!   :)
>
>
>
> >From: Kimberly Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Subject: RE: RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
> >Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 13:45:29 -0800
> >
> >You could just lick the chocolate off.
> >
> >-Original Message-
> >Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 10:11 AM
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> > I have a phobia about bugs...
> >
> >what a waste of perfectly good chocolate
> >
> >
> > >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >Subject: Re:RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
> > >Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 09:11:20 -0800
> > >
> > >OK you chocaholics try this on for size:
> > >
> > >  Reuters Monday, March 19, 2001
> > >
> > >Chocolate-Coated Bugs Are Latest Treat
> > >
> > >LONDON (Reuters) - Ants, crickets and scorpions, baked, coated
> > >in chocolate and promoted as a high-protein snack, are proving
> > >popular among peckish Londoners.
> > >
> > >Designer Todd Dalton, who trained as a chef in Louisiana and
> > >acquired a taste for cooked insects on his travels in Asia and
> > >central America, says he has sold 5,000 chocolate-coated bugs
> > >since he began marketing them in December.
> > >
> > >"They are very high in protein and very low in fat. They have a
> > >higher percentage of protein than any meat or fish that we
> > >commonly eat," he told Reuters.
> > >
> > >The creepy-crawly chocs sell for between three and 3.50 pounds
> > >($4.30-$5.00) at upmarket London stores such as Selfridges and
> > >the Conran Shop and will soon be appearingin shops in Munich
> > >and Zurich.
> > >--
> > >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> > >--
> > >Author:
> > >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >
> > >Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
> > >San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
> > >
> > >To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> > >to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> > >the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> > >(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> > >also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> >
> >_
> >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
> >
> >--
> >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> >--
> >Author: Rachel Carmichael
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
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> >(or 

CORRECTION RE: RE: Re: SQL help needed

[Stephane Faroult]

create viex xdual
as select rownum ID
from sys.col$;

Cannot have a column named rownum ... Going to be a difficult day. And we are only 
half-week.

Regards,

Stephane Faroult
Oriole
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Author: Stephane Faroult
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: Re: RE: tuning a massive delete

[Stephane Faroult]

Roy,

   NOT EXISTS is to be avoided when it is the only criterion - the subquery is 
executed for each row in the outer query. The way the CBO behaves varies wildly 
between 8.1.7 and 9.x. Richard's suggestion is quite correct and a fairly safe way to 
get a 'right' behaviour with most versions is to use an external join and test for 
NULL, as in

 select b.*
 from ani_prx b,
  bo_owner_stage.ani_prx a
 where a.cusip = b.cusip (+)
   and a.fund_no = b.fund_no (+)
   and a.add_cymd = b.add_cymd (+)
   and nvl(b.reccode, 'X') != 'V'
   and b.cusip is null

or something similar. Worth trying an explain. Even if the cost is not necessarily to 
be believed. MINUS would also be something I'd contemplate.

HTH,

SF

>- --- Original Message --- -
>From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 08:24:44
>
>i explain planned it and it was much worse than not
>exists.
>
>my understanding is hash_aj is faster when the
>table in the sub-query returns results that are
>significantly less than the one in the outer table.
>
>
>ill try it, but i think exists is faster. we dont
>want to do an index scan here and my hash_area_size
>isnt real big. 
>> 
>> From: "Richard Ji" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> Date: 2003/09/17 Wed PM 12:04:56 EDT
>> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> Subject: RE: tuning a massive delete
>> 
>> Try anti hash join.
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 11:45 AM
>> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>> 
>> 
>> i have a table with 27 million records that is
>about 1.2 GB in size. I have a 'staging table' with
>18 million records. 16 million records have a
>'delete' flag. I have indexed the column in staging
>with a delete flag. both tables have indexed
>primary keys. Is the following my fastest option or
>would an 'IN' be faster? Im concerned because this
>has been running for a while and have alot of
>consistent gets but no 'writes' yet which tells me
>its still building the join. Our sort_area_size is
>rather small and Im not allowed to change it which
>tells me we are swapping to the temp tablespace. 
>> 
>> anyway to speed this up? or is this the fastest
>we got? 
>> 
>> 
>> create table ani_prx_new parallel (degree 5)
>nologging
>> as select *
>> from ani_prx b
>> where not exists (select 1 from
>bo_owner_stage.ani_prx a where ba_reccode = 'V' and
>a.cusip = b.cusip
>> and a.fund_no = b.fund_no and a.add_cymd =
>b.add_cymd)
>> 
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
-- 
Author: Stephane Faroult
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
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also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).

Re: Re: RE: image storage confusion ?? --> UUDECODE

[chao_ping]

oraora  oraora,
For blob, it is ok, since it is all in the database, while for bfile, 
you actually store them in filesystem, so you have to backup those files indivudually.





Regards
zhu chao
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.happyit.net
www.cnoug.org(Chinese Oracle User Group)

=== 2002-12-09 17:23:00 ,you wrote£º===

>Guys,
>
>Suppose I store the images (~100G)in DB ( either as BLOB or BFILE 
>).
>I want to have a standby DB for this Prod. DB.
>Will there be any problem ? any known issues ?
>what are the things to be taken care of ???
>
>Kindly let me know Guys.
>
>TIA.
>Jp.
>
>
>On Wed, 04 Dec 2002 Connor McDonald wrote :
>>As Cary as mentioned, there's some new goodies in v9.
>>
>>In our case, the controlling of attachments etc is
>>done before processing into the db.  I can't remember
>>the specifics (read: I'm no longer at that site) but
>>we found some shareware (mimencode? + a few other
>>little things) we separated encoded emails into
>>separate files which then got processed into separate
>>lobs.
>>
>>Cheers
>>Connor
>>
>>  --- "MacGregor, Ian A." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>wrote: > Were doing the same thing with mail between
>> > collaborators on one of our physics projects.  But
>> > the volume is small, just unDer 250,000 so far.  Did
>> > the mail ou were saving contain attachments, and if
>> > so did you write any code to break off the
>> > attachment uudecode it and place it in a blob?  If
>> > so, I am keenly interested in that code.
>> >
>> > Is there a publicly available package to do uuencode
>> > and uudecode?
>> >
>> > Ian MacGregor
>> > Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
>> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >
>> > -Original Message-
>> > Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 11:44 AM
>> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>> >
>> >
>> > Exactly.
>> >
>> > We had a system that used to drag emails (from qmail
>> > so each mail was a file) into clobs in the database.
>> >
>> > After a year or so we had about 15 million emails in
>> > the database - no problems at all.
>> >
>> > Then one day the some idiot (aka me) put a new
>> > version
>> > of the program in which successfully loaded the clob
>> > but (to cut a long story short) started replicating
>> > the email files left, right and centre...It took
>> > literally days to clean up millions of (zero byte
>> > size) files...after which point that file system
>> > needed to be rebuilt anyway, the directory structure
>> > was in such a mess
>> >
>> > Cheers
>> > Connor
>> >
>> >  --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Arup,
>> > >
>> > > What Connor may have been referring to is the
>> > > inefficiency
>> > > of managing 20 million files in a filesystem.
>> > >
>> > > That's a lot of inodes ( assuming unix ).  It's a
>> > > bit much
>> > > for a filesystem to deal with.
>> > >
>> > > Jared
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > "Arup Nanda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> > > Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > >  12/03/2002 07:14 AM
>> > >  Please respond to ORACLE-L
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > To: Multiple recipients of list
>> > ORACLE-L
>> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> > > cc:
>> > > Subject:Re: image storage
>> > confusion
>> > > ??
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Connor,
>> > >
>> > > I seem to think otherwise. Storing 100 GB of image
>> > > is not necessarily a
>> > > pretty proposition either when you consider hot
>> > > backups and archived log
>> > > generation, etc. I presume you are concerned about
>> > > the management of the
>> > > image files considering the sheer volume of it.
>> > But
>> > > that's precisely what
>> > > BFILE is expected to help with. The images are in
>> > a
>> > > file ssytem and the
>> > > pointers are in the database and that's managed
>> > > pretty well.
>> > >
>> > > However I do concede tht this might pose a problem
>> > > on two fronts -
>> > > (1) Security - beign on filesystem anyone can
>> > > potentially see these.
>> > > However
>> > > this is not necesarily a concern at all sites.
>> > Good
>> > > OS security can
>> > > prevent
>> > > this.
>> > > (2) Backup - the ssy admin has to explicitly
>> > backup
>> > > all these files. This,
>> > > again, may not be that bad when you store your
>> > files
>> > > on a single
>> > > filesystem
>> > > and a backup software can be easily programmed to
>> > > check only the changed
>> > > files,  based on timestamp.
>> > >
>> > > Just my two cents.
>> > >
>> > > Arup Nanda
>> > >
>> > > - Original Message -
>> > > To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L"
>> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> > > Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 7:39 AM
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > > Managing 20mil of anything (images/text/etc) in
>> > a
>> > > file
>> > > > system isn't a nice proposition.  Go with the
>> > > database
>> > > >
>> > > > hth
>> > > > connor
>> > > >
>> > > >  --- oraora  oraora <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> > > wrote:
>> > > > > Guys , i posted this already and this time my
>> > > > > question is a bit
>> > > > > different .
>> > > > >
>> > > > > I  have to

RE: RE: RE: Double Take and Oracle

[Denham Eva]

Title: RE: RE: RE: Double Take and Oracle





Dick,


Thank you, atleast you have given me something to work with. I had already began making plans of approaching management for some serious downtime. I have been holding back as I am awaiting response from Double-Take's Source - Sunbelt Software on this issue, I have logged a call with them about 8hrs ago already!

But you have given me alot to chew on until I do that - Many Thanks!!!


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2002 6:44 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Re:RE: RE: Double Take and Oracle



Eva,


    First things first, Oracle gets to be a bear when your trying to move a
database as you are while it's running.  The first point to settle is that
Double Take is not doing something that is incompatible with Oracle, like making
an ASCII vs. BINARY copy of the datafiles.  To determine that you need to do a
move with the source/production database shutdown.  Yeah, I know that can be
hard to schedule but it's necessary.  If the copy won't start at that point then
Double Take is completely incompatible with Oracle and you can't go much
further.  Now if that passes, allow Double Take to copy the production DB to the
backup server and while it's doing so check the hotbackup status of the database
using the following:


    SELECT COUNT(*)
    FROM DBA_DATA_FILES DF, SYS.V_$BACKUP B
    WHERE FILE_ID = FILE#
    AND DF.STATUS = 'AVAILABLE'
    AND B.STATUS = 'ACTIVE';


The number you get back should equal the number of datafiles in your database. 
If it comes back as 0 then the database has not switched and the backup is
worthless.  You may have to do this manually before running Double Take.  Also
your production/source DB has to be in archive log mode or else hotbackup does
not work.


The reasons for this are wrapped around Oracle's "write as little as needed and
do so as seldomly as possible" idea.  With this idea data block changes are not
sent to the datafiles until there is a need to.  MicroSlop and Exchange work on
the exact opposite idea which makes them IO hogs, although Oracle can be the
same.  In your case I would suspect that the hotbackup is the problem.


Dick Goulet


Reply Separator
Author: Denham Eva <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/15/2002 7:08 AM


Thanks for the input so far. Double-Take works real time so the database is
never down.
I also followed their setup direction to the letter. Problem on our site is
that this product is being used for SQL Server and Exchange (Appears to work
fine there, but Oracle is a beast of another color compared to these "Access
on Steroids" databases), management are insisting for the sake of conformity
that this must work. At ever attempted startup another file gives an error,
most frustrating of all is that there is almost no consistency to the
errors.


Denham Eva 


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2002 4:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Lewis,


    I can understand where Eva is coming from.  I had a demo of a similar
product some time ago.  Their BIG selling point is that you have a
production
server and a backup that is close in time with your production server at
half
(or less) the cost of a hot standby.  Their reasoning is that you don't have
Oracle running on the standby and consequently don't have to pay Oracle a
license fee for the second server since only one server is running at any
point
in time.  Logically their point is well taken.  Regrettably and
understandably
that is NOT Oracle's point of view.


Dick Goulet


Reply Separator


Author: Bishop Lewis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/15/2002 2:23 AM


I'm always dubious of these types of products (especially when there are no
reference sites available) and would opt for a batched up standby database
solution (syncing every 5/10/15 minutes or so) myself. I'm not saying
Double-Take is not good - I've got no experience of it and am sorry it's not
any help but you have an option should Double-Take not work correctly.


Lewis Bishop
---
Barclays Enable - ISS - E-NTRUST/Bexleyheath NT
Oracle Database Consultant
Watling Street, Bexleyheath, Kent, DA6 7RR (Mail Van R)
Phone : 020 8298 3418
Mobile: 07950 380857
Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
"Enabling Competitive Advantage for Barclays in IT and Business Processing"
 
-Original Message-
Sent: 15 October 2002 08:28
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


This header confirms that this email message has been swept for the
presence of computer viruses. 


Corporate IT
THE WOOLWICH
--
Hello Esteemed Gurus 
Pls advise... 
We are trying to ge

RE: RE: RE: Double Take and Oracle

[Nick Wagner]

Title: RE: RE: RE: Double Take and Oracle





A little clarification


---cut---
The reasons for this are wrapped around Oracle's "write as little as needed and
do so as seldomly as possible" idea.
---end cut---


is not really true.  


When a tablespace is placed into hot backup mode, Oracle does not delay any writes to the datafiles.  It continues to write to them like nothing changed.  However, the major change (and performance hit) occurs because Oracle write more info to the redo logs.  Instead of just writing the changes for that row to the redo log, it will now write the entire database block to the redo log.  This is a reason why a lot of hot backup scripts, place only the tablespaces your are currently copying into hot backup mode.    




-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2002 9:44 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Re:RE: RE: Double Take and Oracle



Eva,


    First things first, Oracle gets to be a bear when your trying to move a
database as you are while it's running.  The first point to settle is that
Double Take is not doing something that is incompatible with Oracle, like making
an ASCII vs. BINARY copy of the datafiles.  To determine that you need to do a
move with the source/production database shutdown.  Yeah, I know that can be
hard to schedule but it's necessary.  If the copy won't start at that point then
Double Take is completely incompatible with Oracle and you can't go much
further.  Now if that passes, allow Double Take to copy the production DB to the
backup server and while it's doing so check the hotbackup status of the database
using the following:


    SELECT COUNT(*)
    FROM DBA_DATA_FILES DF, SYS.V_$BACKUP B
    WHERE FILE_ID = FILE#
    AND DF.STATUS = 'AVAILABLE'
    AND B.STATUS = 'ACTIVE';


The number you get back should equal the number of datafiles in your database. 
If it comes back as 0 then the database has not switched and the backup is
worthless.  You may have to do this manually before running Double Take.  Also
your production/source DB has to be in archive log mode or else hotbackup does
not work.


The reasons for this are wrapped around Oracle's "write as little as needed and
do so as seldomly as possible" idea.  With this idea data block changes are not
sent to the datafiles until there is a need to.  MicroSlop and Exchange work on
the exact opposite idea which makes them IO hogs, although Oracle can be the
same.  In your case I would suspect that the hotbackup is the problem.


Dick Goulet


Reply Separator
Author: Denham Eva <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/15/2002 7:08 AM


Thanks for the input so far. Double-Take works real time so the database is
never down.
I also followed their setup direction to the letter. Problem on our site is
that this product is being used for SQL Server and Exchange (Appears to work
fine there, but Oracle is a beast of another color compared to these "Access
on Steroids" databases), management are insisting for the sake of conformity
that this must work. At ever attempted startup another file gives an error,
most frustrating of all is that there is almost no consistency to the
errors.


Denham Eva 


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2002 4:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Lewis,


    I can understand where Eva is coming from.  I had a demo of a similar
product some time ago.  Their BIG selling point is that you have a
production
server and a backup that is close in time with your production server at
half
(or less) the cost of a hot standby.  Their reasoning is that you don't have
Oracle running on the standby and consequently don't have to pay Oracle a
license fee for the second server since only one server is running at any
point
in time.  Logically their point is well taken.  Regrettably and
understandably
that is NOT Oracle's point of view.


Dick Goulet


Reply Separator


Author: Bishop Lewis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   10/15/2002 2:23 AM


I'm always dubious of these types of products (especially when there are no
reference sites available) and would opt for a batched up standby database
solution (syncing every 5/10/15 minutes or so) myself. I'm not saying
Double-Take is not good - I've got no experience of it and am sorry it's not
any help but you have an option should Double-Take not work correctly.


Lewis Bishop
---
Barclays Enable - ISS - E-NTRUST/Bexleyheath NT
Oracle Database Consultant
Watling Street, Bexleyheath, Kent, DA6 7RR (Mail Van R)
Phone : 020 8298 3418
Mobile: 07950 380857
Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
"Enabling Competitive Advantage for Barclays in IT and Business Processing"
 
-Original Message--

Re: RE: Re: Stop using SYS, SYSTEM?

[Nuno Pinto do Souto]

> Jacques Kilchoer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> In my case I also enforce the "don't sign on as SYS/SYSTEM" rule. The
> reasons I do that:
> - The default tablespace for SYS is SYSTEM, and I don't like to
> change that. There are probably reasons why you wouldn't want to
> change that. But when I sign on to do my DBA work to try something I
> don't want to have to specify a tablespace name every time I create a
> test object like CREATE TABLE TEST (X NUMBER) STORAGE (INITIAL 1000M)

It has nothing to do with the dba role itself and its security.  
Oracle just happens to associate user SYS with the SYSTEM tablespace.  
Fair enough that you may not want that association by default.

> - If each DBA has a named account, it's easy to tell who's logged in
> to the database by saying
> SELECT USERNAME FROM V$SESSION ;
> otherwise I would have to figure out who could be logged on as SYSTEM
> to call them and ask them if it's OK to shutdown the database.

That is a pure audit requirement: you want to know who is using
DBA access.  Nothing to do with SYSTEM.  If you remove SYS and SYSTEM,
there is nothing in USERNAME in V$SESSION that will tell you username 
BLOGGSJ is using DBA rights.  Other than your own prior knowledge that
is the case.  In a way, you're worse off.

> Telling all the DBAs "sign on as SYSTEM" would be (IMHO) like telling
> all the programmers "You can all sign on as user 'coder'" and all
> users "you can all sign on in the database as user
> 'data_entry_person'".

Don't they always?  

Quite frankly, the problem as I see it is that I want to know WHO
"dropped the tablespace" and WHEN and from WHERE.  
That whoever did it had DBA access rights is a given, I don't need it 
clarified!

It's the who, when and where that is the province of auditing.  And have 
nothing to do with SYS, SYSTEM or whatever, other than as information.  
Using or not using SYS or SYSTEM adds nothing to this knowledge or 
its implicit security.  

And that's why I feel disabling SYS or SYSTEM purely on "security" grounds 
makes no sense whatsoever.  Of course, one may want to reduce the 
risk of accidents and therefore lock those out.  Even then, debatable if that is
the best way of doing it: accidentaly "dropping the tablespace" produces 
the same chaotic results regardless of what account one does it from.


Cheers
Nuno Souto
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
-- 
Author: Nuno Pinto do Souto
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
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Re: RE: Re: Stop using SYS, SYSTEM?

[Arup Nanda]

Nuno Pinto do Souto" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> And that's why I feel disabling SYS or SYSTEM purely on
> "security" grounds makes no sense whatsoever

I'm not sure that's what the OP wanted. He wanted to know if stopping use of
SYS and SYSTEM on a regular basis will be acceptable, not "disable" them. It
sure is.

Besides, how does one disable the account? Lock it? SYSTEM can be locked but
SYS can't be; hence the whole concept of disabling does not make sense.

I feel the auditors merely wanted the OP to stop using SYS and SYSTEM on a
regular basis in operations that require a DBA access - such as full exports
and selecting from disctionary tables. IMHO this is a very valid advisory
and not difficult to follow.

Arup


- Original Message - 
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2003 12:49 AM


> > Jacques Kilchoer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > In my case I also enforce the "don't sign on as SYS/SYSTEM" rule. The
> > reasons I do that:
> > - The default tablespace for SYS is SYSTEM, and I don't like to
> > change that. There are probably reasons why you wouldn't want to
> > change that. But when I sign on to do my DBA work to try something I
> > don't want to have to specify a tablespace name every time I create a
> > test object like CREATE TABLE TEST (X NUMBER) STORAGE (INITIAL 1000M)
>
> It has nothing to do with the dba role itself and its security.
> Oracle just happens to associate user SYS with the SYSTEM tablespace.
> Fair enough that you may not want that association by default.
>
> > - If each DBA has a named account, it's easy to tell who's logged in
> > to the database by saying
> > SELECT USERNAME FROM V$SESSION ;
> > otherwise I would have to figure out who could be logged on as SYSTEM
> > to call them and ask them if it's OK to shutdown the database.
>
> That is a pure audit requirement: you want to know who is using
> DBA access.  Nothing to do with SYSTEM.  If you remove SYS and SYSTEM,
> there is nothing in USERNAME in V$SESSION that will tell you username
> BLOGGSJ is using DBA rights.  Other than your own prior knowledge that
> is the case.  In a way, you're worse off.
>
> > Telling all the DBAs "sign on as SYSTEM" would be (IMHO) like telling
> > all the programmers "You can all sign on as user 'coder'" and all
> > users "you can all sign on in the database as user
> > 'data_entry_person'".
>
> Don't they always?  
>
> Quite frankly, the problem as I see it is that I want to know WHO
> "dropped the tablespace" and WHEN and from WHERE.
> That whoever did it had DBA access rights is a given, I don't need it
> clarified!
>
> It's the who, when and where that is the province of auditing.  And have
> nothing to do with SYS, SYSTEM or whatever, other than as information.
> Using or not using SYS or SYSTEM adds nothing to this knowledge or
> its implicit security.
>
> And that's why I feel disabling SYS or SYSTEM purely on "security" grounds
> makes no sense whatsoever.  Of course, one may want to reduce the
> risk of accidents and therefore lock those out.  Even then, debatable if
that is
> the best way of doing it: accidentaly "dropping the tablespace" produces
> the same chaotic results regardless of what account one does it from.
>
>
> Cheers
> Nuno Souto
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> -- 
> Author: Nuno Pinto do Souto
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services
> -
> To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
>
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
-- 
Author: Arup Nanda
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
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also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).

RE: Re: Re[2]: Oracle vs Mysql

[Stephane Faroult]

[snip]
> 120 col. punch cards?

 You had a high-density model. Mine only had 80 cols, of which 72 were usable for my 
goto-happy Fortran statements.

SF


>No hard drives?
>
>My $0.02 worth,
>
>Ken Janusz, CPIM
>
>
>- Original Message -
>To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L"
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2004 8:39 AM
>
>
>> Careful Mladen,  your revealing your age!!  Bet
>you remember RPT & RPF as
>well!!
>>
>> Dick Goulet
>> Senior Oracle DBA
>> Oracle Certified 8i DBA
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2004 2:04 AM
>> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2004.01.19 23:39, Jonathan Gennick wrote:
>>
>> > I used to use a SQL Module compiler. Not with
>Oracle though.
>> > It's rare for me to run into someone else who
>likes that
>> > approach. Actually, it's rare for me to
>encounter someone
>> > who's even heard of it...
>>
>> Jonathan, I've been around for a long time. I've
>seen things like
>> DataLens for Lotus123, SQL*Calc, Easy*SQL, then
>there was an Oracle
>> version of then popular DB2 tool, which looked
>like an IBM 3874 terminal
>on top
>> of VT320, SQL*Graph does deserve a honorable
>mention, then there was
>PRO*Pascal,
>> and a myriad of other exotic stuff that I cannot
>remember now.  I was
>laughing when
>> I saw "UNDO TABLESPACES" in 9i. What exactly is a
>difference between a
>specialized
>> undo tablespace and a file that was just laying
>around and couldn't be
>touched and
>> was named "Before Image file" or "BI file". 
>Logical names (another
>concept that many
>> youngsters are probably unfamiliar with) were
>usually VAX$BI or ORACLE$BI.
>> Unfortunately, discussions like that are not part
>of OCP curriculum.
>> The file is not really part of the database, you
>can't create any objects
>in it, it manages
>> itself and it stores the old values of oracle
>blocks, in case rollback is
>needed.  I could
>> be talking about "BI" file or "UNDO TABLESPACE",
>there is no difference
>whatsoever.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Mladen Gogala
>> Oracle DBA
>> --
>> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
>http://www.orafaq.net
>> --
>> Author: Mladen Gogala
>>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>
>> Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051
>http://www.fatcity.com
>> San Diego, California-- Mailing list and
>web hosting services
>>
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>an E-Mail message
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>'ListGuru') and in
>> the message BODY, include a line containing:
>UNSUB ORACLE-L
>> (or the name of mailing list you want to be
>removed from).  You may
>> also send the HELP command for other information
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>> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
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>> also send the HELP command for other information
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>
>-- 
>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
>http://www.orafaq.net
>-- 
>Author: KENNETH JANUSZ
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Stephane Faroult
Oriole
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Re: Re: Re[2]: Oracle vs Mysql

[KENNETH JANUSZ]

The old IBM System3 machines used 120 col. punch cards.  And initially they
had no HD's.  Everything was done with cards and a reader/sorter.  To
compile a program you took the code you wrote, punched it into cards and
then put it behind a stack of cards that was the compiler.  The machine read
the cards and generated another pile cards that was the compiled code.  No
matter how big the code you were compiling it took about 30 minutes to do a
compile.  All data was stored on cards - lots and lots of cards.

Ken


- Original Message -
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2004 9:34 AM


> [snip]
> > 120 col. punch cards?
>
>  You had a high-density model. Mine only had 80 cols, of which 72 were
usable for my goto-happy Fortran statements.
>
> SF
>
>
> >No hard drives?
> >
> >My $0.02 worth,
> >
> >Ken Janusz, CPIM
> >
> >
> >- Original Message -
> >To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L"
> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2004 8:39 AM
> >
> >
> >> Careful Mladen,  your revealing your age!!  Bet
> >you remember RPT & RPF as
> >well!!
> >>
> >> Dick Goulet
> >> Senior Oracle DBA
> >> Oracle Certified 8i DBA
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2004 2:04 AM
> >> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 2004.01.19 23:39, Jonathan Gennick wrote:
> >>
> >> > I used to use a SQL Module compiler. Not with
> >Oracle though.
> >> > It's rare for me to run into someone else who
> >likes that
> >> > approach. Actually, it's rare for me to
> >encounter someone
> >> > who's even heard of it...
> >>
> >> Jonathan, I've been around for a long time. I've
> >seen things like
> >> DataLens for Lotus123, SQL*Calc, Easy*SQL, then
> >there was an Oracle
> >> version of then popular DB2 tool, which looked
> >like an IBM 3874 terminal
> >on top
> >> of VT320, SQL*Graph does deserve a honorable
> >mention, then there was
> >PRO*Pascal,
> >> and a myriad of other exotic stuff that I cannot
> >remember now. I was
> >laughing when
> >> I saw "UNDO TABLESPACES" in 9i. What exactly is a
> >difference between a
> >specialized
> >> undo tablespace and a file that was just laying
> >around and couldn't be
> >touched and
> >> was named "Before Image file" or "BI file".
> >Logical names (another
> >concept that many
> >> youngsters are probably unfamiliar with) were
> >usually VAX$BI or ORACLE$BI.
> >> Unfortunately, discussions like that are not part
> >of OCP curriculum.
> >> The file is not really part of the database, you
> >can't create any objects
> >in it, it manages
> >> itself and it stores the old values of oracle
> >blocks, in case rollback is
> >needed.  I could
> >> be talking about "BI" file or "UNDO TABLESPACE",
> >there is no difference
> >whatsoever.
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Mladen Gogala
> >> Oracle DBA
> >> --
> >> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
> >http://www.orafaq.net
> >> --
> >> Author: Mladen Gogala
> >>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >>
> >> Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051
> >http://www.fatcity.com
> >> San Diego, California -- Mailing list and
> >web hosting services
> >>
> >> To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send
> >an E-Mail message
> >> to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of
> >'ListGuru') and in
> >> the message BODY, include a line containing:
> >UNSUB ORACLE-L
> >> (or the name of mailing list you want to be
> >removed from).  You may
> >> also send the HELP command for other information
> >(like subscribing).
> >> --
> >> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
> >http://www.orafaq.net
> >> --
> >> Author: Goulet, Dick
> >>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >>
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> >http://www.fatcity.com
> >> San Diego, California -- Mailing list and
> >web hosting services
> >>
> >> To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send
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> >> to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of
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> >> (or the name of mailing list you want to be
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> >> also send the HELP command for other information
> >(like subscribing).
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RE: RE: RE: Online vs offline backups

[Shine_DBA]

Hi, guys,
We have discussed this topic many times on this list. Actually a good DBA
should design a good backup and restore strategy instead of "online or
offline" according to business situation.

>From my opinion, both "online" and "offline" are necessary, for example, I
do monthly offline line cold backup and daily online hot backup on my
production db. The only thing you need to know is that if you do offline
backup, you should backup every thing, include online redo logs, otherwise,
you may lost some data; if you do online hot backup, the online redo logs
are useless when you do restore.

Cheers!

Shine Sha
Snr. Oracle DBA
iGINE Pte. Ltd.

-Original Message-
Thomas F
Sent: Thursday, June 20, 2002 12:44 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

chaos,

if you believe everything you read in the oracle docs, then your are NOT a
thinking DBA.  just because they failed to mention that you should backup
the log files does NOT mean you should not back them up.

as everyone who knows anything has stated in this thread, this is a very bad
idea.  never mind the "what if" scenario you mentioned.  anyone who is
performing a database restore had better know exactly what and where they
are restoring to (what point in time), and the condition of all of the
database files on the disk before they begin.  if they don't, they are in
for trouble.

Tom Mercadante
Oracle Certified Professional


-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2002 11:43 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


hi, Mercadante, Thomas F£¬ÄúºÃ£¡
But according to Oracle Document(which i believe), oracle backup and
recovery guide (version 8.1.6)page 4-4: it said:

   Use operating system commands or a backup utility to make backups of all
datafiles and all control files specified by the CONTROL_FILES parameter of
the initialization parameter file. Also back up the initialization parameter
file
and other Oracle product initialization files. To find them, do a search for
*.ora starting in your Oracle home directory and recursively search all of
its
subdirectories.
You can see, oracle mentions everything it need, but it does not
mention the online redo log.
And:
Is the online redo log useful in recovery since you do a full  clean
cold backup? Just do a clear logfile group 1,2,3 and you cleanly opened your
database when you Just restore the datafile,controlfiles.If you want to make
full recovery, the online redo log is also totally USELESS. And if you
carelessly overlay the old online redo log, the CURRENT ACTIVE ONLINE REDO
LOG WILL BE DESTROYED! so , you cannot do complete recovery.
This is my opinions.Though i also do not do coldbackup.

Good luck!

chaos
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

zhu chao
DBA of Eachnet.com
86-021-32174588-667


ÔÚ 2002-06-19 06:43:00 You wrote:
>chal_ping
>
>What?  Makes no sense.  Why NOT backup everything if you are taking a Cold
>Backup.  Why make yourself perform an open reset logs upon a recovery?
>
>This is bad advice.
>
>Personally, I use Rman performing hot backups all the time.  My database is
>*always* open to the world.
>
>Tom Mercadante
>Oracle Certified Professional
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2002 8:38 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>Ferenc Mantfeld£¬
>
>>The same person that advocated a cold backup
>>did not back up the online redo logs, so what use was it anyway, since the
>>only way they would force open their DB is with a resetlogs option anyway.
>   For cold backup, oracle does not recommend backup the online redo
>log. And if you restore the whole cold backup, why need the online redo
log?
>I am sure people doing cold backup will do shutdown normal/immediate, not
>shutdown abort.So there is no need to backup the online redo log at all!
>Backup the online redo log also take the risk of damage the current online
>redo log when you want to do full recovery.
>   So, never backup the online redo log when doing cold backup.
>
>ÖÂ
>Àñ£¡
>
>chal_ping
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>--
>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
>--
>Author: chal_ping
>  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
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>also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
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>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
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>
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>San Diego, California

Re: Re Re: Due apologies for DDLs

[Stephane Faroult]

Cyril Thankappan wrote:
> 
> U r right ..I still dunno 'much' about perl..
> 
> as for dbms_metadata
> 
> it is a built in pl/sql package
> 
> saying
> 
> 'select dbms_metadata.get_ddl(object_type,object_name,schema_name) from dual;
> 
> gives the entire ddl creation script.
> 
> However, 'interestingly'
> execute dbms_metadata.get_ddl does not work
> as well!
> 

Everything which works as select blahblah() from dual cannot work as
execute blahblah() (and vice versa). One is for functions (which return
something, in that case a string) and the other for procedures, which
return nothing. Do not get confused by the use of
dbms_output.put_line().
-- 
Regards,

Stephane Faroult
Oriole Ltd
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Re: Re Re: Due apologies for DDLs

[Rachel Carmichael]

Okay, I stillthink I like my own scripts to extract ddl better :)



--- Cyril  Thankappan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> 
> U r right ..I still dunno 'much' about perl..
> 
> as for dbms_metadata
> 
> it is a built in pl/sql package
> 
> saying 
> 
> 'select dbms_metadata.get_ddl(object_type,object_name,schema_name)
> from dual;
> 
> gives the entire ddl creation script.
> 
> However, 'interestingly' 
> execute dbms_metadata.get_ddl does not work
> as well!
> 
> More interestingly metalink does not have much on it either..
> I guess it works too well
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Cyril 
> 
> --
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> --
> Author: Cyril  Thankappan
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
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__
Do You Yahoo!?
Send your FREE holiday greetings online!
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RE: RE: RE: Time for a reorg?

[Mark Leith]

other information (like subscribing).

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RE: RE: Time for a reorg?



Thanks Dick,
I think what you are saying ties in exactly with my post on
the
matter 


John


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]";>mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: 13 March 2002 13:53
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Re:RE: Time for a reorg?



Yes, I think databases still get reorg'd today.  It is
just
that our definition
of a reorg and a database I think are changing.  In
the
past if you said you
were going to reorg a database that a full export, possibly
a
rebuild and an
import.  Way too time consuming for today's 24x7
requirements.  Today I think we
reorg at the object or schema level, not the entire
instance.  BTW, I think our
definition of a database is also changing from the entire
instance to a single
schema.


Dick Goulet


Reply
Separator
Author: "Mark Leith"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/13/2002 3:38
AM


Wow - does nobody reorg databases anymore? ;P


Thanks for all your help guys.. I'll take that as a cue to
put
some time
aside..;0P


-Original Message-
Sent: 12 March 2002 11:43
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Does anyone have any "set limits" to know when it
would be time for object
reorgs?


Firstly, I *know* that the reorg issue is viciously guarded
on
two sides -
those that say reorgs should be done, and those that argue
that
they are
unnecessary in todays environments. I agree with both sides
;P
And don't
intend this to break out the debate for the nth
time..


What I am really after is guidelines from people to their
own
views of when
a reorg is deemed necessary. Things such as percentage of
rows
that are
chained/migrated, or number of extents, or number of
extents as
a percentage
of maxextents or whatever..


Anybody come up with a really cool script that evaluates
this -
instead of
me re-inventing the wheel? I could do this - I just don't
really have the
time at the moment - so your input is greatly
appreciated!


Thanks in advance


Mark


===
 Mark
Leith
; |
T: +44 (0)1905 330 281
 Sales & Marketing  |
F:
+44 (0)870 127 5283
 Cool Tools UK Ltd  | E:
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===
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TARGET="_blank">http://www.cool-tools.co.uk
   Maximising throughput
& performance



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RE: Re[2]: RE: RE: historical data

[Christopher Spence]

 I would hate to have to say it would take 7 days to do a restore.

-Original Message-
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Sent: 5/22/01 10:15 PM

 Well when you advertise that it can take 7 business days to restore the

data fast is not a consideration.

Dick Goulet
-- Reply Separator --
Author: Christopher Spence <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 5/22/01 3:09 PM

Oh, yes agreed 110%.

But on another note, import/export is not fast.  That is the only reason

I
mention these other options.
But I agree 100%.  The other difficulty is if you want to import that 
data
into a different format, exports do not help much as you have to import
(Perhaps a big table) then convert it.


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2001 2:59 PM
To: Christopher Spence; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Chris,

Humm, did not think that was clear, but!!  We started using export 
to
extract data from our operational data store back in 92 with Oracle 
Version
5 to
tape.  These files, copied now to CD's are still usable with Oracle 8i.
That's
10 years and no problems.  If I can depend on something with Oracle, 
they
maintain a backwards compatibility with the import tool that I haven't 
found
the
end of yet.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: Christopher Spence <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   5/22/2001 2:20 PM

I am not sure what you are saying here, but ok sure.


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2001 1:31 PM
To: Christopher Spence; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Chris,

I've been exporting data in a similar way as you since V5.  The 8i
version
of import still reads them without trouble.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: Christopher Spence <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   5/22/2001 7:13 AM

Take a look at Thomas's Kytes utility "Data Unloadder" on his website.

Also look at Oriole's PDQ OUT.  Both products will avoid the need to
recreate the wheel.
Also, toad can do this.


-Original Message-
Sent: Monday, May 21, 2001 6:17 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


We have to role off partitions of data every week and I am writing a 
script
to 
write the data to comma separated files using utl_file. What I was 
wondering
is
does anyone have an alternative that is better? I thought about using 
export
but
thought it wouldn't be fun trying to import an export file into the 
latest
version
of Oracle 10 years down the road. 

Thanks, Dave
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Re: Re: RE: OPS instalation - pretty urgent

[Cyril Thankappan]

Hi

 I am sorry if my question was not put across 'well'..

 Let me try figuress

  Frame 1frame2


 node1node1

 node2node2

Question is can I take node1 from frame1 and
 node1 from frame 2 
and have OPS running on node1 from frame1 and
node1 from frame2 .

Thanks a lot




 



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Author: Cyril  Thankappan
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RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.

[Kevin Kostyszyn]

my apologies, I think I might have slipped up and had some fun for a second.
Guess that's the end of that.
Have a good weekend.

-Original Message-
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, February 02, 2001 3:37 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Jared,

Wish I could say the same thing.  Anyone know of a fast way to get rid
of a
resident young adult???

But, if you all let me return this thread back to a real discussion.  How
many
of you out there are using Linux, particularly RedHat, in a production
environment preferably with Oracle?  The boss(s) around here are looking for
a
more "cost efficient" (read that as $0.00) operating system for some of our
DB
stuff.  We may even decide on a more "cost efficient" (same translation)
rdbms,
otherwise known as PostGreSQL.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: Jeffery Stevenson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   2/2/2001 12:16 PM

  You'd probably notice...advances in software would probably slow down
because not too many software teams out there can push the envelope of what
can be done on a computer as well as game development can (although there
are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if the code
for some database query optimizers trace back to some gaming AI code.   :)

Jeffery Stevenson
Chief Databeast Tamer
Medical Present Value, Inc.
Austin, TX

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, February 02, 2001 10:19 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


On Thu, 1 Feb 2001, Kevin Kostyszyn wrote:

> What about Mechwarrior or Quake II, can I run that on Unix and will it run
> smoothly?  This is a fun debate, but I do agree there will never be a
> winner.

If all gaming software disappeared tomorrow, I would never notice.

Jared

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RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.

[jkstill]

No, we just have different definitions of fun.

Writing a great piece of code, designing a database
that I feel good about, solving a sticky problem; I
find those things fun.

My friends say I'm wierd.

But I get paid for having fun, and I make
more than they do. ;)

Jared

On Fri, 2 Feb 2001, Kevin Kostyszyn wrote:

> my apologies, I think I might have slipped up and had some fun for a second.
> Guess that's the end of that.
> Have a good weekend.
>
> -Original Message-
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Friday, February 02, 2001 3:37 PM
>  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> Jared,
>
> Wish I could say the same thing.  Anyone know of a fast way to get rid
> of a
> resident young adult???
>
> But, if you all let me return this thread back to a real discussion.  How
> many
> of you out there are using Linux, particularly RedHat, in a production
> environment preferably with Oracle?  The boss(s) around here are looking for
> a
> more "cost efficient" (read that as $0.00) operating system for some of our
> DB
> stuff.  We may even decide on a more "cost efficient" (same translation)
> rdbms,
> otherwise known as PostGreSQL.
>
> Dick Goulet
>
> Reply Separator
> Author: Jeffery Stevenson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>  Date:   2/2/2001 12:16 PM
>
>   You'd probably notice...advances in software would probably slow down
> because not too many software teams out there can push the envelope of what
> can be done on a computer as well as game development can (although there
> are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if the code
> for some database query optimizers trace back to some gaming AI code.   :)
>
> Jeffery Stevenson
> Chief Databeast Tamer
> Medical Present Value, Inc.
> Austin, TX
>
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Friday, February 02, 2001 10:19 AM
>  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> On Thu, 1 Feb 2001, Kevin Kostyszyn wrote:
>
> > What about Mechwarrior or Quake II, can I run that on Unix and will it run
> > smoothly?  This is a fun debate, but I do agree there will never be a
> > winner.
>
> If all gaming software disappeared tomorrow, I would never notice.
>
> Jared
>
> --
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> --
> Author:
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
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> also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> --
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> --
> Author: Jeffery Stevenson
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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> Author:
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> --
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> --
> Author: Kevin Kostyszyn
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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> also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
>

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Author: 
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RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.

[Mohan, Ross]

Title: RE: RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix.





It exists!


I even see "anti RF" clothing for sale!



Amazing world.


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:49 PM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Re:RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.



Hey, I'm waiting for the wearable computer with the wireless link into the
network.  Especially if it comes with voice command.  That way when a "middle of
the night" problem occurs all I'll have to do is roll over, fix the problem, and
then fall back asleep.


Dick Goulet


Reply Separator____________
Subject:    RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix.
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   2/6/2001 6:26 AM


Pithy as hell and twice as true. 


I agree totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI...


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



The future of computers, look at the games of today.




 Brian L. Anderson
 Flunky/SA/DBA
 Darton College
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]



> -Original Message-


> are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't be surprised 
> if the code
> for some database query optimizers trace back to some gaming 
> AI code.   :)
> 
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Anderson, Brian
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix.




Pithy as hell and twice as true. 



I agree
totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI...



-Original Message-
From: Anderson, Brian [
HREF="mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
achnet.edu]
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.




The future of computers, look at the games of today.





 Brian L. Anderson
 Flunky/SA/DBA
 Darton College
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]




> -Original Message-



> are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't be
surprised 
> if the code
> for some database query optimizers trace back to some
gaming 
> AI code.   :)
> 
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: 
HREF="http://www.orafaq.com" TARGET="_blank">http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Anderson, Brian
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]



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RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.

[Richard Ji]

Title: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.



How 
about the DBA tool that runs on a Palm VII, I forgot what is it called.  No 
voice command but at least you don't have to get out of the 
bed.

  -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Mohan, RossSent: 
  Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:57 PMTo: Multiple recipients of list 
  ORACLE-LSubject: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.
  It exists! 
  I even see "anti RF" clothing for sale! 
  Amazing world. 
  -Original Message- From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:49 PM To: 
  Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Subject: Re:RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix. 
  Hey, I'm waiting for the wearable computer with the wireless 
  link into the network.  Especially if it comes 
  with voice command.  That way when a "middle of the night" problem occurs all I'll have to do is roll over, fix the 
  problem, and then fall back asleep. 
  Dick Goulet 
  Reply Separator________ 
  Subject:    RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs 
  Unix. Author: "Mohan; Ross" 
  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date:   2/6/2001 6:26 AM 
  Pithy as hell and twice as true. 
  I agree 
  totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI... 
  -Original Message- Sent: 
  Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 AM To: Multiple 
  recipients of list ORACLE-L 
  The future of computers, look at the games of today. 
  
    Brian L. Anderson  Flunky/SA/DBA  Darton College 
   [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
  > -Original Message- 
  > are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't be 
  surprised > if the code > for some database query optimizers trace back to some gaming 
  > AI code.   :) > -- Please see the 
  official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- 
  Author: Anderson, Brian   
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
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  538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, 
  California    -- Public Internet access 
  / Mailing Lists  
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  list you want to be removed from).  You may also 
  send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). 
   
  RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs 
  Unix.   
  Pithy as hell and twice as true. 

  I agree totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI... 
   
  -Original 
  Message- From: Anderson, Brian [ HREF="mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  achnet.edu] Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 
  AM To: 
  Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Subject: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs 
  Unix.   
  The future of computers, look at 
  the games of today.  
   
   
   Brian L. 
  Anderson  Flunky/SA/DBA  Darton 
  College  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
   
   
  > -Original 
  Message-  
  > are some that I can think 
  of).  Heck, I wouldn't be surprised 
   > if 
  the code > for some database query optimizers trace back to 
  some gaming  > AI code.   
  :) > 
   -- 
   Please see 
  the official ORACLE-L FAQ:  HREF="http://www.orafaq.com" 
  TARGET="_blank">http://www.orafaq.com 
  --  
  Author: Anderson, 
  Brian   INET: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
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RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.

[Mohan, Ross]

Title: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.



"PocketDBA"   and the idea of not having to get out of bed to 
refresh the hard drive is quite appealing. 

  -Original Message-From: Richard Ji 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 2:57 
  PMTo: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-LSubject: RE: 
  RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.
  How 
  about the DBA tool that runs on a Palm VII, I forgot what is it called.  
  No voice command but at least you don't have to get out of the 
  bed.
  
-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Mohan, RossSent: 
Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:57 PMTo: Multiple recipients of 
list ORACLE-LSubject: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs 
Unix.
It exists! 
I even see "anti RF" clothing for sale! 
Amazing world. 
-Original Message- From: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:49 PM To: 
Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Subject: Re:RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix. 
Hey, I'm waiting for the wearable computer with the wireless 
link into the network.  Especially if it comes 
with voice command.  That way when a "middle of the night" problem occurs all I'll have to do is roll over, fix the 
problem, and then fall back asleep. 
Dick Goulet 
Reply 
    Separator Subject:    RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix. 
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Date:   2/6/2001 6:26 
AM 
Pithy as hell and twice as true. 
I agree 
totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI... 
-Original Message- Sent: 
Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 AM To: Multiple 
recipients of list ORACLE-L 
The future of computers, look at the games of today. 

  Brian L. Anderson  Flunky/SA/DBA  Darton 
College  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
> -Original Message- 
> are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't 
be surprised > if the code > for some database query optimizers trace back to some gaming 
> AI code.   :) > -- Please see 
the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Anderson, Brian   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 
538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, 
California    -- Public Internet 
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also send the HELP command for other information (like 
subscribing). 
 RE: RE: 
OT  NT2K vs Unix.   
Pithy as hell and twice as true. 
  
I agree totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI... 
 
-Original 
Message- From: Anderson, Brian [ HREF="mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
achnet.edu] Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 
AM To: 
Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Subject: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs 
Unix.   
The future of computers, look at 
the games of today.  
 
 
 Brian L. 
Anderson  Flunky/SA/DBA  Darton 
College  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 
 
> -Original 
Message-  
> are some that I can 
think of).  Heck, I wouldn't be surprised 
 > 
if the code > for some database query optimizers trace back to 
some gaming  > AI code.   
:) >  --  Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:  HREF="http://www.orafaq.com" 
TARGET="_blank">http://www.orafaq.com 
--  
Author: Anderson, 
Brian   INET: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  
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California    
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Lists  
SIZE=2> 
T> To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail 
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RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.

[Kevin Kostyszyn]

Title: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.



NO 
WAY  You can do stuff to your DB from bed with a 
Palm???

  -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Richard JiSent: 
  Tuesday, February 06, 2001 2:57 PMTo: Multiple recipients of list 
  ORACLE-LSubject: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.
  How 
  about the DBA tool that runs on a Palm VII, I forgot what is it called.  
  No voice command but at least you don't have to get out of the 
  bed.
  
-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Mohan, RossSent: 
Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:57 PMTo: Multiple recipients of 
list ORACLE-LSubject: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs 
Unix.
It exists! 
I even see "anti RF" clothing for sale! 
Amazing world. 
-Original Message- From: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:49 PM To: 
Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Subject: Re:RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix. 
Hey, I'm waiting for the wearable computer with the wireless 
link into the network.  Especially if it comes 
with voice command.  That way when a "middle of the night" problem occurs all I'll have to do is roll over, fix the 
problem, and then fall back asleep. 
Dick Goulet 
Reply 
Separator____ Subject:    RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix. 
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Date:   2/6/2001 6:26 
AM 
Pithy as hell and twice as true. 
I agree 
totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI... 
-Original Message- Sent: 
Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 AM To: Multiple 
recipients of list ORACLE-L 
The future of computers, look at the games of today. 

  Brian L. Anderson  Flunky/SA/DBA  Darton 
College  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
> -Original Message- 
> are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't 
be surprised > if the code > for some database query optimizers trace back to some gaming 
> AI code.   :) > -- Please see 
the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Anderson, Brian   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 
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 RE: RE: 
OT  NT2K vs Unix.   
Pithy as hell and twice as true. 
  
I agree totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI... 
 
-Original 
Message- From: Anderson, Brian [ HREF="mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
achnet.edu] Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 
AM To: 
Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Subject: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs 
Unix.   
The future of computers, look at 
the games of today.  
 
 
 Brian L. 
Anderson  Flunky/SA/DBA  Darton 
College  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 
 
> -Original 
Message-  
> are some that I can 
think of).  Heck, I wouldn't be surprised 
 > 
if the code > for some database query optimizers trace back to 
some gaming  > AI code.   
:) >  --  Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:  HREF="http://www.orafaq.com" 
TARGET="_blank">http://www.orafaq.com 
--  
Author: Anderson, 
Brian   INET: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  
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may also 
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RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.

[Richard Ji]

Title: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.



It's 
called Palm DBA and it's made by TUSC.  They also have a Celluar 
DBA.

  -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Kevin KostyszynSent: 
  Tuesday, February 06, 2001 3:31 PMTo: Multiple recipients of list 
  ORACLE-LSubject: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.
  NO 
  WAY  You can do stuff to your DB from bed with a 
  Palm???
  
-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Richard JiSent: 
Tuesday, February 06, 2001 2:57 PMTo: Multiple recipients of list 
ORACLE-LSubject: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs 
Unix.
How about the DBA tool that runs on a Palm VII, I 
forgot what is it called.  No voice command but at least you don't have 
to get out of the bed.

  -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Mohan, RossSent: 
  Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:57 PMTo: Multiple recipients of 
  list ORACLE-LSubject: RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs 
  Unix.
  It exists! 
  I even see "anti RF" clothing for sale! 
  Amazing world. 
  -Original Message- From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] 
  Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:49 PM 
  To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list 
  ORACLE-L Subject: Re:RE: RE: OT NT2K vs 
  Unix. 
  Hey, I'm waiting for the wearable computer with the 
  wireless link into the network.  Especially 
  if it comes with voice command.  That way when a "middle of 
  the night" problem occurs all I'll have to do is roll 
  over, fix the problem, and then fall back 
  asleep. 
  Dick Goulet 
  Reply 
      Separator Subject:    RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix. 
  Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
  Date:   2/6/2001 6:26 
  AM 
  Pithy as hell and twice as true. 
  I agree 
  totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI... 
  -Original Message- Sent: 
  Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 AM To: Multiple 
  recipients of list ORACLE-L 
  The future of computers, look at the games of 
  today. 
    Brian L. Anderson  Flunky/SA/DBA  Darton 
  College  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
  > -Original Message- 
  > are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't 
  be surprised > if the code > for some database query optimizers trace back to some gaming 
  > AI code.   :) > -- Please see 
  the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- 
  Author: Anderson, Brian   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 
  538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, 
  California    -- Public Internet 
  access / Mailing Lists  
  To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail 
  message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT 
  spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, 
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  name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may 
      also send the HELP command for other information (like 
  subscribing).   
 RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix. 

  
  Pithy as hell and twice as 
  true.   
  I agree totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI... 
   
  -Original 
  Message- From: Anderson, Brian [ HREF="mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  achnet.edu] Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 
  AM To: 
  Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Subject: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs 
  Unix.   
  The future of computers, look 
  at the games of today.   
   
   Brian L. 
  Anderson  Flunky/SA/DBA  Darton 
  College  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
   
   
  > -Original 
  Message-  
  > are some that I can 
  think of).  Heck, I wouldn't be surprised 
   > if the code > for some database query 
  optimizers trace back to some gaming 
   > AI code.   :) 
  > 
   -- 
   Please 
  see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:  HREF="http://www.orafaq.com" 
  TARGET="_blank">http://www.orafaq.com 
  --  
  Author: Anderson, 
  Brian   INET: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
  Fat City Network 
  Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051 
  San Diego, 
  California    
  -- Public Internet access / Mailing 
  Lists  
  SIZE=2>---

RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.

[Gogala, Mladen]

It's called "PocketDBA". That would be cute if someone picks your pocket, he
will
gain access to the full extent of your company's data. Do you remember when
a 
notebook belonging to a general was stolen during the  Desert Storm? It has
generated a full fledged panic among the Pentagon brass. In my opinion, a
little thingy like that should not be allowed into my database with anything
more then
"CREATE SESSION" privilege and it's hard to query V$ and DBA_ tables with
that kind of privilege level.

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 3:31 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


NO WAY  You can do stuff to your DB from bed with a Palm???

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 2:57 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


How about the DBA tool that runs on a Palm VII, I forgot what is it called.
No voice command but at least you don't have to get out of the bed.

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:57 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



It exists! 

I even see "anti RF" clothing for sale! 


Amazing world. 

-Original Message- 

Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:49 PM 
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 


Hey, I'm waiting for the wearable computer with the wireless link into the 
network.  Especially if it comes with voice command.  That way when a
"middle of 
the night" problem occurs all I'll have to do is roll over, fix the problem,
and 
then fall back asleep. 

Dick Goulet 

Reply Separator 
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Date:   2/6/2001 6:26 AM 

Pithy as hell and twice as true. 

I agree totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI... 

-Original Message- 
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 AM 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 


The future of computers, look at the games of today. 


 
 Brian L. Anderson 
 Flunky/SA/DBA 
 Darton College 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

> -Original Message- 

> are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't be surprised 
> if the code 
> for some database query optimizers trace back to some gaming 
> AI code.   :) 
> 
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
<http://www.orafaq.com>  
-- 
Author: Anderson, Brian 
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051 
San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists 
 
To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message 
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also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). 
 
 
 
 
 
RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix. 
 
 

Pithy as hell and twice as true.  
 

I agree 
totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI... 
 

-Original Message- 
From: Anderson, Brian [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ">
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  
achnet.edu] 
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 AM 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
Subject: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix. 
 
 

The future of computers, look at the games of today. 
 
 

 
 Brian L. Anderson 
 Flunky/SA/DBA 
 Darton College 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 
 

> -Original Message- 
 

> are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't
be 
surprised  
> if the code 
> for some database query optimizers trace back to some 
gaming  
> AI code.   :) 
>  
--  
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com <http://www.orafaq.com> " TARGET="_blank">
http://www.orafaq.com <http://www.orafaq.com>  
--  
Author: Anderson, Brian 
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 
538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051 
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California    
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<
/FON 
T> 
To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail 
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subscribing). 
 

 
 

-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Gogala, Mladen
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Fat City Network Services-- (85

RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.

[Suhen Pather]

There is a tool called PocketDBA that allows you to do wireless database
management from a PALM OS.
Visit www.pocketdba.com <http://www.pocketdba.com> 
Founded by Ari Kaplan, who is one of the list members.
 
 
Suhen
 
 
 

 
How about the DBA tool that runs on a Palm VII, I forgot what is it called.
No voice command but at least you don't have to get out of the bed.

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:57 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



It exists! 

I even see "anti RF" clothing for sale! 


Amazing world. 

-Original Message- 

Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:49 PM 
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 


Hey, I'm waiting for the wearable computer with the wireless link into the 
network.  Especially if it comes with voice command.  That way when a
"middle of 
the night" problem occurs all I'll have to do is roll over, fix the problem,
and 
then fall back asleep. 

Dick Goulet 

Reply Separator 
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Date:   2/6/2001 6:26 AM 

Pithy as hell and twice as true. 

I agree totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI... 

-Original Message- 
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 AM 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 


The future of computers, look at the games of today. 


 
 Brian L. Anderson 
 Flunky/SA/DBA 
 Darton College 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

> -Original Message- 

> are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't be surprised 
> if the code 
> for some database query optimizers trace back to some gaming 
> AI code.   :) 
> 
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
<http://www.orafaq.com>  
-- 
Author: Anderson, Brian 
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051 
San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists 
 
To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message 
to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in 
the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L 
(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may 
also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). 
 
 
 
 
 
RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix. 
 
 

Pithy as hell and twice as true.  
 

I agree 
totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI... 
 

-Original Message- 
From: Anderson, Brian [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ">
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  
achnet.edu] 
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 AM 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
Subject: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix. 
 
 

The future of computers, look at the games of today. 
 
 

 
 Brian L. Anderson 
 Flunky/SA/DBA 
 Darton College 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 
 

> -Original Message- 
 

> are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't
be 
surprised  
> if the code 
> for some database query optimizers trace back to some 
gaming  
> AI code.   :) 
>  
--  
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com <http://www.orafaq.com> " TARGET="_blank">
http://www.orafaq.com <http://www.orafaq.com>  
--  
Author: Anderson, Brian 
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 
538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051 
San Diego,
California    
-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists 
<
/FON 
T> 
To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail 
message 
to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of
'ListGuru') 
and in 
the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB 
ORACLE-L 
(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed 
from).  You may 
also send the HELP command for other information (like 
subscribing). 
 

 
 

-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Suhen Pather
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.

[Rachel Carmichael]

and Ari Kaplan of this list is the CEO :)


>From: "Gogala, Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: RE: RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix.
>Date: Tue, 06 Feb 2001 13:11:52 -0800
>
>It's called "PocketDBA". That would be cute if someone picks your pocket, 
>he
>will
>gain access to the full extent of your company's data. Do you remember when
>a
>notebook belonging to a general was stolen during the  Desert Storm? It has
>generated a full fledged panic among the Pentagon brass. In my opinion, a
>little thingy like that should not be allowed into my database with 
>anything
>more then
>"CREATE SESSION" privilege and it's hard to query V$ and DBA_ tables with
>that kind of privilege level.
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 3:31 PM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>NO WAY  You can do stuff to your DB from bed with a Palm???
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 2:57 PM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>How about the DBA tool that runs on a Palm VII, I forgot what is it called.
>No voice command but at least you don't have to get out of the bed.
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:57 PM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>
>It exists!
>
>I even see "anti RF" clothing for sale!
>
>
>Amazing world.
>
>-Original Message-
>
>Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 12:49 PM
>To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>Hey, I'm waiting for the wearable computer with the wireless link into the
>network.  Especially if it comes with voice command.  That way when a
>"middle of
>the night" problem occurs all I'll have to do is roll over, fix the 
>problem,
>and
>then fall back asleep.
>
>Dick Goulet
>
>Reply Separator
>Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date:   2/6/2001 6:26 AM
>
>Pithy as hell and twice as true.
>
>I agree totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI...
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>The future of computers, look at the games of today.
>
>
>
>  Brian L. Anderson
>  Flunky/SA/DBA
>  Darton College
>  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> > -Original Message-
>
> > are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't be surprised
> > if the code
> > for some database query optimizers trace back to some gaming
> > AI code.   :)
> >
>--
>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
><http://www.orafaq.com>
>--
>Author: Anderson, Brian
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
>San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
>
>To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
>to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
>the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
>(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
>also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
>
>
>
>
>
>RE: RE: OT  NT2K vs Unix.
>
>
>
>Pithy as hell and twice as true. 
>
>
>I agree
>totally..agents...interfacesgraphicsAI...
>
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Anderson, Brian [HREF=" mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
><mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ">
>mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>achnet.edu]
>Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2001 8:31 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>Subject: RE: RE: OT NT2K vs Unix.
>
>
>
>The future of computers, look at the games of today.
>
>
>
>
> Brian L. Anderson
> Flunky/SA/DBA
> Darton College
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>
>> -Original Message-
>
>
>> are some that I can think of).  Heck, I wouldn't
>be
>surprised 
>> if the code
>> for some database query optimizers trace back to some
>gaming 
>> AI code.   :)
>> 
>-- 
>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: HREF=" http://www.orafaq.com <http://www.orafaq.com> " TAR

RE: RE:

[Stephane Faroult]

Mark,

  All right, I see it better. If I were you I would try arithmetic methods. To take 
your example, when you start with
10110011 
it means
power(2,7) + power(2,5) + power(2,4) + power(2,1)
   + power(2,0)

What you want is nothing else than
3 * power(4,7) + 3 * power(4,5) + 3 * power(4, 4)
+ 3 * power(4, 1) + 3 * power(4,0)

... if I don't err.
In other words, if you consider your 1s to mark powers of 4 instead of 2 and multiply 
by 3 instead of 1 each time, you have your expansion.
  I let you write the PL/SQL function ;-).

HTH

SF

>- --- Original Message --- -
>From: "Bobak, Mark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 02:34:27
>
>Hi Stephane,
>
>I of course simplified the problem a bit.  However,
>the bitmaps are actually
>artificial entities which I'm building up from some
>underlying tables and
>some clever indexing schemes.  The problem is, I
>don't have total data model
>control, and the permissions and storage info are
>stored in two different
>tables.  Through some clever indexing and views,
>I'm presenting two different
>bitmap views.  The idea is I can do a unique lookup
>on storage, a unique
>lookup on permissions, and then AND them together
>and provide a resultant
>bitmap, availability.  The front-end app will then
>use that availability
>bitmap to decide what options to present to the
>end-user.  The problem is
>the heterogeneous nature of the two bitmaps.
>
>Finally, I'm fully utilizing the bitspace I have,
>because the 2 bits for
>permission represent two different (and
>independent) pieces of info.  In
>the example you provide below, there is no way to
>express P1 AND P2 with
>storage.  In other words, my permissions matrix
>looks like:
>00 - No permissions
>01 - Permission for user to acquire doc via email
>10 - Permission for user to acquire doc via on-line
>viewing
>11 - Permission for user to acquire doc via email
>or on-line
>
>Note that the bitmap is full, and storage has not
>entered into the
>picture yet.  So, Storage will say either 0, not
>stored or 1, stored.
>
>I need to AND the permissions and the storage. 
>But, I need to AND the
>single bit storage with two bits of permissions.
>
>Does that make more sense?
>
>-Mark
>
>
>-Original Message-
>From:   Stephane Faroult
>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Sent:   Tue 1/6/2004 5:13 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>Cc: 
>Subject:RE: 
>Mark,
>
>   This is what spontaneously comes to my mind and
>may not make a lot of sense in your case, but why
>do you need TWO bitmaps in the first place? Your
>second (Permission) bitmap uses 2 bits to store
>three states (no permission/P1/P2). This is enough
>to hold the STORAGE information as well,
>  eg
>  00  Not stored
>  01  Stored with no permission
>  10  Stored with P1
>  11  Stored with P2
> I of course assume, and may be wrong on this
>account, that storage is a pre-requisite for
>permission. Otherwise I would use 24 bits.
>I presume that your bitmaps don't appear as such,
>and therefore whether you have one or two fields is
>pretty irrelevant to the end-user. It looks to me
>easier to understand and maintain that some
>Rubik-cube-like bit-twiddling.
>
>HTH,
>
>SF
>
>>- --- Original Message --- -
>>From: "Bobak, Mark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>Sent: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 01:39:25
>>
>>Hi,
>>
>>Well, since I can't sleep, I may as well try
>>solving a problem.
>>
>>This is a bit odd, and I'm trying to think of the
>>most efficient way to do
>>it.  I've set up some bitmaps in my app.  Consider
>
>>we have documents that
>>we want to sell.  In order to be able to sell a
>>given doc, we need to have it
>>stored in the vault and we also need to have
>>negotiated the proper contract
>>w/ the publisher.  So, I've got two bitmaps,
>>STORAGE and PERMISSIONS.
>>
>>But, here's the hook.  There are 8 different types
>
>>of storage, so I have
>>an 8 bit mask.  However, for every storage type,
>>there are two types of
>>permission.  So, I have a 16 bit permissions mask.
>
>>
>>What I'd like to do is take my 8-bit STORAGE mask,
>
>>say it's 10110011
>>and convert it to 1100.  Note that all
>
>>I did there was take
>>each bit in the input mask, and make the same
>value
>>repeat.  So, 0 would
>>become 00, 1 would become 11, 10 would become
>1100.
>> Does that make sense?
>>Once I've done that, I can take my STORAGE mask
>>that's now stretched to 16
>>bits, and directly AND it with my PERMISSIONS
>mask.
>>
>>
>>So, my question is:  Is there a nice, scalable way
>
>>to take my 8 bits and
>>expand them into 16 bits, in the way that I'm
>>describing?  A clever bit
>>twiddling expression would be perfect, but
>anything
>>that's efficient and
>>scalable will do.  (The end product will be hidden
>
>>behind a view or stored
>>procedure.)
>>
>>Any thoughts, anyone?
>>
>

RE: RE:

[Mohan, Ross]

Jaysus, note the date and time. It's a freaking miracle. 

;-)

-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2001 10:54 AM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


OOPS! sorry, your right

Reply Separator
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   11/21/2001 7:40 AM

"cascade"?  probably more abject ignorance on my part, but wasn't it
"including contents"?

-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2001 10:15 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Startup mount
alter database datafile '/data/db/database/core.dbf' offline drop;
alter database open;
drop tablespace  cascade;


Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: =?iso-8859-2?q?Mou=E8ka=20Otakar?= <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   11/21/2001 5:40 AM

 Hello
I need a help with one problem. In the Oracle version 8.1.7 I've deleted
a "tablespace" in the Linux, but before this I did't use a function "
Drop".
 After reboot a database, there was a error:
ERROR at line 1:
ORA-01116: error in opening database file 7
ORA-01110: data file 7: '/data/db/database/core.dbf'
ORA-27041: unable to open file
Linux Error: 2: No such file or directory
Additional information: 3
Is there a some re-step to drop "tablespace" and then regulary delete
this object and restart the database ?
  Thanx a lot for your answer.

Ota Moucka
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Re: RE:

[Moucka otakar]

I have next problem , syntax its ok.

SQL> Startup mount
alter database datafile '/data/db/database/core.dbf' offline drop;
alter database open;
drop tablespace  including content;
ORACLE instance started.
 
Total System Global Area  178213024 bytes
Fixed Size73888 bytes
Variable Size 161189888 bytes
Database Buffers   16777216 bytes
Redo Buffers 172032 bytes
Database mounted.
SQL>
Database altered.
 
SQL>
Database altered.
 
SQL> drop tablespace  including content
*
ERROR at line 1:
ORA-02216: tablespace name expected



Dne st 21. listopad 2001 17:03 jste napsal(a):
> Jaysus, note the date and time. It's a freaking miracle.
>
> ;-)
>
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2001 10:54 AM
> To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> OOPS! sorry, your right
>
> Reply Separator
> Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date:   11/21/2001 7:40 AM
>
> "cascade"?  probably more abject ignorance on my part, but wasn't it
> "including contents"?
>
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2001 10:15 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> Startup mount
> alter database datafile '/data/db/database/core.dbf' offline drop;
> alter database open;
> drop tablespace  cascade;
>
>
> Dick Goulet
>
> Reply Separator
> Author: =?iso-8859-2?q?Mou=E8ka=20Otakar?= <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date:   11/21/2001 5:40 AM
>
>  Hello
> I need a help with one problem. In the Oracle version 8.1.7 I've deleted
> a "tablespace" in the Linux, but before this I did't use a function "
> Drop".
>  After reboot a database, there was a error:
> ERROR at line 1:
> ORA-01116: error in opening database file 7
> ORA-01110: data file 7: '/data/db/database/core.dbf'
> ORA-27041: unable to open file
> Linux Error: 2: No such file or directory
> Additional information: 3
> Is there a some re-step to drop "tablespace" and then regulary delete
> this object and restart the database ?
>   Thanx a lot for your answer.
>
> Ota Moucka
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Re: Re:

[novicedba]

thanks rachel
waiting for it
coz
I am a
novice
Oracle Certifiable DBBS
- Original Message -
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2001 8:28 PM


> You didn't read the paper, just the slide presentation.
>
> If a slide presentation is done properly, then no, you can't get
everything
> from it. Otherwise why bother to a) stand in front of the room and present
> it, the attendees can just read the slides  and b) write the paper backing
> it up. My opinion only, but a presentation that is too filled with
> words/lines on the screen is not understandable when being presented..
it's
> distracting from the speaker.
>
> In fact, this presentation was deliberately written without explanations,
as
> our goal was to make people wonder if the statement was a myth or not. We
> then started our discussion of each bullet point, and got the audience to
> participate, giving their own interpretations. Marlene and I designed that
> presentation as an all day workshop, and it was meant first and foremost
to
> be educational AND entertaining.
>
> The paper will be on the NYOUG website in a few days.
>
> Rachel
>
>
> >From: "novicedba" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 03:36:54 -0800
> >
> >Hi Rachel,
> >read your paper 'exploding the myths' , but felt that explanation was
> >necessary atleast for some of them if not all. All along I felt the first
> >few slides were introduction and you will discuss each of the points in
> >detail, and was totally fooled when in the last slide you said " really
the
> >end. Honest. No, really. Really truly, no fingers crossed! "   as I was
> >waiting to see the explanations for all the statements.
> >Will be waiting for your response
> >please help
> >coz
> >I am a
> >novice
> >Oracle Certifiable DBBS
>
> _
> Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
>
> --
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> --
> Author: Rachel Carmichael
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
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Re: RE:

[Greg Moore]

And then there's always...

SELECT
 s.study_id,
 s.status, 
 decode(sp.status,  'A',  sp.status,  ' ')
FROM study s, site_placement sp
WHERE s.study_id = 5014
AND   s.study_id = sp.study_id(+)
AND   s.status   = 'A'
/


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Re:RE: RE: RE: RE: OT: Rachel in Vietnam

[dgoulet]

Ross,

When a B-52, otherwise known as a BUFF (Big Ugly Fat F^cker), unloads 150 to
200(B-52D with wing racks) 750LB demolition bombs nothing stands.  Even
duhvelopers.  I've had Marines discribe the area where a BUFF strike landed as
"It looked like God reached down, scooped out a three mile long by half a mile
wide, by 100 foot deep piece of the earth and take it away".  I don't know about
cool, but it sure was effective!!

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/20/2001 4:28 PM

BUFF bomb. That sounds cool. Will it work on developers?

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 4:18 PM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Ross,

Makes sense, Nam was BUG heaven, unless they got caught in the path of a
BUFF bomb run.  Nothing survived that. :-)

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/20/2001 8:02 AM

Dick , 

Didn't you know? Rachel WAS in Nam. But she 
never talks about it. I think it had to do
with the bugs. 

Just a thought. 

Ross

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 8:32 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Rachel,

If you were given one, as I was in Nam, you'd not know the difference. 
Looks like, & tastes like a crunch bar for the most part, except for the
logo on
top.  It just crunches better.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Rachel Carmichael" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   3/19/2001 4:10 PM

but Moom, the icky bugs TOUCHED the chocolate!   :)



>From: Kimberly Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: RE: RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
>Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 13:45:29 -0800
>
>You could just lick the chocolate off.
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 10:11 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> I have a phobia about bugs...
>
>what a waste of perfectly good chocolate
>
>
> >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Subject: Re:RE: OT: Oracle *Chocolate* Monitoring Tools/Friday Recipe
> >Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 09:11:20 -0800
> >
> >OK you chocaholics try this on for size:
> >
> >  Reuters Monday, March 19, 2001
> >
> >Chocolate-Coated Bugs Are Latest Treat
> >
> >LONDON (Reuters) - Ants, crickets and scorpions, baked, coated
> >in chocolate and promoted as a high-protein snack, are proving
> >popular among peckish Londoners.
> >
> >Designer Todd Dalton, who trained as a chef in Louisiana and
> >acquired a taste for cooked insects on his travels in Asia and
> >central America, says he has sold 5,000 chocolate-coated bugs
> >since he began marketing them in December.
> >
> >"They are very high in protein and very low in fat. They have a
> >higher percentage of protein than any meat or fish that we
> >commonly eat," he told Reuters.
> >
> >The creepy-crawly chocs sell for between three and 3.50 pounds
> >($4.30-$5.00) at upmarket London stores such as Selfridges and
> >the Conran Shop and will soon be appearingin shops in Munich
> >and Zurich.
> >--
> >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> >--
> >Author:
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
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> >also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
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>_
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Re: CORRECTION RE: RE: Re: SQL help needed

[Guido Konsolke]

Hi Stephane,

I commiserate with you 8-)

Regards,
Guido

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17.09.2003  10.44 Uhr >>>

create viex xdual
as select rownum ID
from sys.col$;

Cannot have a column named rownum ... Going to be a difficult day. And we are only 
half-week.

Regards,

Stephane Faroult
Oriole
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-- 
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  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 


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Re: RE: RE: Upgrade from 7.3.4 to 8.0.6

[Cyril Thankappan]

Thanks for your reply.

Now I know whom to contact..for upgrades :)

Cyril

On Thu, 23 Jan 2003 Bowes, Chris wrote :
>A valid question.  With a pseudo-valid answer, which is: Because 
>there is no
>8i for hp-ux 10.20.  We have been asking for upgrades and all for 
>the last
>4+ years and the management answer is "do nothing until SAP is 
>completed".
>SAP was started in 1996 and is still not complete and will 
>probably not be
>until February of 2039.  I only received permission for the 8.0 
>upgrade
>because 8i requires 2 upgrades: hpux (since "sap may replace the 
>hp-ux
>boxes" I cannot get that conversion done) and oracle.  8.0.6 only 
>requires
>oracle.  Right now, I only have permission to convert 2 bases.  
>The other 6
>have to stay on 7.3.4, because "SAP may do away with that system, 
>so don't
>do any requests on it or spend any real time on it..."
>
>"They don't call this place the resume stain for nothing"  
>(Dilbert).
>
>--Chris
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 3:14 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>
>sorry for not being 'directly relevant'
>
>But I was just wondering why
>you were upgrading from 7.3.4 to 8.0.6
>(and then having to upgrade to 9.2)
>when Oracle has provided for an upgrade path
>  from 7.3.4 to 9.2
>
>Can you please let me know your reason
>for upgrading to 8.0.6
>
>Thanks
>
>Cyril
>On Wed, 22 Jan 2003 Hemant K Chitale wrote :
> >
> >So, did you have Replication setup in Oracle7 ?
> >Reading Note:51119.1 "Performing Command Line Migration with
> >MIG80 (Version 7 to 8.0)" ..
> >after opening the database OPEN RESETLOGS and running
> >CAT8000.sql, CATREP8M.sql is to be run ONLY if you
> >previously ran CATREP.sql under Oracle7.
> >
> >If you did not have the Replication Tabes setup in Oracle7,
> >DO NOT run CATREP8M.sql.  If you are planning to setup
> >Replication in Oracle8, run CATREP.sql after completing
> >the migration.  Of course, Replication setup should be
> >first done and tested in a test environment.
> >Hemant
> >
> >--- "Bowes, Chris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Hemant,
> > >
> > >  Thank you for your response.  I am calling it 
>directly.
> >I do
> > > the
> > > startup nomount, alter database convert, alter database 
>open
> > > resetlogs.
> > > Then I fire off the cat8000 and then the catrep8m from
> >svrmgrl.
> > >
> > > I think this is a problem in my dictionary in 7.3.4 as 
>when
> >I
> > > recreate the
> > > test base and do an export/import and convert the base, it
> >goes
> > > flawlessly.
> > > This base has limited downtime available, so I cannot do 
>that
> >to the
> > > live
> > > base.
> > >
> > > Oracle support has told me to look at offline datafiles, 
>but
> >this is
> > > in the
> > > system tablespace, so if that file was offline or needed
> >recovery,
> > > the base
> > > would be dead.
> > >
> > > Any thoughts?
> > >
> > > Thank you again,
> > >
> > > --Chris
> > >
> > >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2003 8:55 AM
> > > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Are you calling the catrep8m script directly ?  Or is it
> >being
> > > called
> > > from some other script [eg catproc.sql ?].
> > > Are you using Advanced Replication ?
> > > Hemant
> > > At 02:28 PM 20-01-03 -0800, you wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi everyone!
> > >
> > >  Has anyone seen this and know a solution?  I am 
>upgrading
> >a
> > > base from
> > > 7.3.4 to 8.0.6.  Everything appears to go fine until the
> >catrep8m
> > > script.
> > > In that script I get several errors:
> > >
> > > Statement processed.
> > > (P.delivery_order < C.cscn)
> > >*
> > > ORA-00904: invalid column name
> > > grant select on defcalldest to select_catalog_role
> > > *
> > > ORA-00942: table or view does not exist
> > > comment on table DEFCALLDEST is
> > >  *
> > > ORA-00942: table or view does not exist
> > > comment on column DEFCALLDEST.CALLNO is
> > >   *
> > > ORA-00942: table or view does not exist
> > > comment on column DEFCALLDEST.DEFERRED_TRAN_ID is
> > >   *
> > > ORA-00942: table or view does not exist
> > > comment on column DEFCALLDEST.DBLINK is
> > >   *
> > > ORA-00942: table or view does not exist
> > > DROP PUBLIC SYNONYM defcalldest
> > > *
> > > ORA-01432: public synonym to be dropped does not exist
> > > Statement processed.
> > >   OR (P.delivery_order <
> >C.cscn
> > > *
> > > ORA-00904: invalid column name
> > > Statement processed.
> > > Statement processed.
> > > Statement processed.
> > >
> > > This then forces several dictionary packages invalid and 
>they
> >wont'
> > > recompile.
> > >
> > > I have tried rebuilding the dictionary before I upgrade 
>and
> > > rebuilding after
> > > I upgrade.   Neither one seems to work

RE: RE: RE: 24 x 7 on NT?

[Mohan, Ross]

Wow. They must have known it
was you, Dick!  

so"last April"proceeding
scientifically, that's less than
one crash a year...better than 
five nines, right?  

;->

-Original Message-
Sent: Monday, June 25, 2001 4:47 PM
To: Mohan; Ross; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Ross,

I've had Dell's site crash on me before, last April right in the middle
of
customizing a system.  They apologized, but I went with Gateway anyway.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Mohan; Ross" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   6/25/2001 1:12 PM

Somebody should let Dell know. www.dell.com

They run on NT. When's the last time you heard
about their site being out?

A $40 Billion company can't be all wrong about NT, can it?

-Original Message-
Sent: Monday, June 25, 2001 4:58 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


OK, after my vacation, I'll wade back into the fray!!

Ron,

To start with I do not believe it possible to guarantee that NT will be
up
24x7, never mind Oracle.  That is the main reason that we use Oracle ONLY on
Unix (in one flavor or another) here.  All of our NT servers require a
periodic
unscheduled reboot, otherwise they do the unscheduled crash under Murphy's
rules.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Kevin Kostyszyn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   6/25/2001 12:31 PM

Wow what a can of worms that has just been opened!!!
KK:)

-Original Message-
L.
Sent: Monday, June 25, 2001 4:07 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I have a treasury application that needs to be up 24 x 7 except for
scheduled downtime.  Is there any way to guarantee an app will be available
24 x 7 on NT?  Is anyone faced with this?

Ron Smith
Database Administration
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: RE: RE: controlfile schema global enqueue lock

[Joan Hsieh]

Dick,
Thanks, so what you suggest? That's why the other day I asked the list about
the asyn i/o on os. If asyn is enabled, is it ok to set dbwr_io_slaves? I am
not sure for that part. For checkpoint, You see, before I made the change,
we have 8 log switch per hr plus every 30 min and every 3200 block (raw disk
is 512b /block) do the checkpoint. I think that's too much. I forgot to set
log_checkpoint_to_alert to true. Right now, after the change. the checkpoint
just occur at log switch time. I am wondering maybe we still hold the lock
too long to finished the checkpoint. Should I increased the redo log size to
500m? What's the impact if we have very large size redo log. I remember
Steve said 500m is a good number.(please correct me if I am wrong) The
principle dba just won't buy it. he think it might cause other problems.

Thanks again

Joan

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 11:44 AM
To: Joan Hsieh; Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Joan,

I doubt this will be the "silver bullet", but it did reduce this
particular
problem on our Operational Data Store where testers are constantly writing
data.
 Set DBWR_IO_SLAVES = number_of_drives_with_datafiles/2.  This ups the
number of
processes that are busy writing data to the datafiles thereby reducing the
amount of time it takes to complete a checkpoint & thereby releasing the
lock
sooner.  You may also want to set LGWR_IO_SLAVES in a similar manner.

Your basic problem is that there is one and only one enqueue lock for
the
control files.  Let's face it we really don't want two processes trying to
change data therein at the same time.  What a mess that would be.  And when
a
checkpoint does occur we need to update the datafiles and control files as a
set.  This is where the enqueue lock comes into play.  If you can speed up
the
time it takes to flush out all of the dirty blocks from the sga &
log_buffers to
the redo log files then the checkpoint gets completed faster.  Right now it
looks like you've got a checkpoint happening only at log switches since
log_checkpoint_interval is set larger than your logfile size.

Dick Goulet


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