[sage-devel] Re: of Google Groups and spam
On Sun, Nov 1, 2009 at 3:34 PM, David Joyner wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 1, 2009 at 3:09 PM, Peter Jeremy wrote: >> On 2009-Oct-31 19:58:21 -0700, Ondrej Certik wrote: >>>through. Let me know if you know something better than google groups. >> >> Why not host the mailing list "in house"? We have a domain name and >> access to decent infrastructure. IMHO, a set of mailing lists in the >> form sage-x...@sagemath.org looks good. As for suitable software, I >> recommend Mailman: www.list.org. It's quite widely used and mostly >> built on Python. >> >> Paraphrasing the website (and copying the FreeBSD port's description): >> Mailman is a mailing list manager (MLM); that is, software to help manage > > > GAP (which Sage includes) has its own email lists which use an > "in-house" Mailman and the GAP lists still gets about the same or > more spam than Sage. Moreover, GAP routes all email through > gmail first, to take advantage of gmail's spam filter. Despite this, spam > still > occasionally gets through. Thus IMHO Mailman is not the solution. I will change sage-devel and sage-support back so that all new subscribers have to answer a puzzle first. Moderators -- take note -- you'll see the person's answer to the question when deciding whether or not to approve the new member. Incidentally, I think that the blog post that started this discussion may be exaggerated, as it was written by one person in a moment of frustration. In particular, that person seems to think that it is trivial for anybody to forge emails from any gmail account to the mailing lists. I manage 30 lists, and I've never seen anything like this. If it did happen, it's the sort of thing that might have been possible for a few days, and which could have been then fixed by Google -- it's not a reason to migrate thousands of users over to another mailing list system. Changing this list so that every new member has to sensibly answer a question about Sage should dramatically reduce the amount spam we have to filter through as moderators. We moderators see spam because spammers create accounts, sign up, then submit an email to the list for us to either approve or deny... every once in a while we moderators mess up and approve (or deny) something we shouldn't. -- William --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ To post to this group, send an email to sage-devel@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to sage-devel-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sage-devel URL: http://www.sagemath.org -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[sage-devel] Re: of Google Groups and spam
On Sun, Nov 1, 2009 at 3:09 PM, Peter Jeremy wrote: > On 2009-Oct-31 19:58:21 -0700, Ondrej Certik wrote: >>through. Let me know if you know something better than google groups. > > Why not host the mailing list "in house"? We have a domain name and > access to decent infrastructure. IMHO, a set of mailing lists in the > form sage-x...@sagemath.org looks good. As for suitable software, I > recommend Mailman: www.list.org. It's quite widely used and mostly > built on Python. > > Paraphrasing the website (and copying the FreeBSD port's description): > Mailman is a mailing list manager (MLM); that is, software to help manage GAP (which Sage includes) has its own email lists which use an "in-house" Mailman and the GAP lists still gets about the same or more spam than Sage. Moreover, GAP routes all email through gmail first, to take advantage of gmail's spam filter. Despite this, spam still occasionally gets through. Thus IMHO Mailman is not the solution. > email discussion lists, much like Majordomo, LISTSERV, and the like. > Unlike most similar products, Mailman gives each mailing list a web page > and allows users to subscribe, unsubscribe, and change their preferences > via the web. Even a list manager can administer his or her list(s) > entirely via the web. Mailman integrates many common MLM features, > including web-based archiving (though it also has hooks for external > archivers), mail-to-news gateways, bounce handling, spam prevention, > Majordomo-style email-based list administration, direct SMTP delivery (with > fast bulk mailing), digest delivery, virtual domain support, and more. > > -- > Peter Jeremy > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ To post to this group, send an email to sage-devel@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to sage-devel-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sage-devel URL: http://www.sagemath.org -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[sage-devel] Re: of Google Groups and spam
On 2009-Oct-31 19:58:21 -0700, Ondrej Certik wrote: >through. Let me know if you know something better than google groups. Why not host the mailing list "in house"? We have a domain name and access to decent infrastructure. IMHO, a set of mailing lists in the form sage-x...@sagemath.org looks good. As for suitable software, I recommend Mailman: www.list.org. It's quite widely used and mostly built on Python. Paraphrasing the website (and copying the FreeBSD port's description): Mailman is a mailing list manager (MLM); that is, software to help manage email discussion lists, much like Majordomo, LISTSERV, and the like. Unlike most similar products, Mailman gives each mailing list a web page and allows users to subscribe, unsubscribe, and change their preferences via the web. Even a list manager can administer his or her list(s) entirely via the web. Mailman integrates many common MLM features, including web-based archiving (though it also has hooks for external archivers), mail-to-news gateways, bounce handling, spam prevention, Majordomo-style email-based list administration, direct SMTP delivery (with fast bulk mailing), digest delivery, virtual domain support, and more. -- Peter Jeremy pgpIOlXfpOpn0.pgp Description: PGP signature
[sage-devel] Re: of Google Groups and spam
On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 3:09 AM, Minh Nguyen wrote: > > Hi folks, > > Just in case you're wondering why spam mails got through occasionally, > here are some stories that present the moderator's side: > > http://www.webmonkey.com/blog/Google_Groups_Fail%3A_JQuery_Dumps_Google_Over_Spam__Interface_Problems > > http://ejohn.org/blog/google-groups-is-dead/ I can only second that --- the admin interface is terrible. Sometimes the spam goes through even though both me and Mateusz who are moderators of the sympy list think that we *didn't* let it through. Once I accidentally clicked always allow instead of spam, so it went through. Let me know if you know something better than google groups. Ondrej --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ To post to this group, send an email to sage-devel@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to sage-devel-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sage-devel URL: http://www.sagemath.org -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[sage-devel] Re: of Google Groups and spam
On 30-Oct-09, at 3:09 AM, Minh Nguyen wrote: > > Hi folks, > > Just in case you're wondering why spam mails got through occasionally, > here are some stories that present the moderator's side: As a frequent denigrator of Google Groups, I read these, followed some links, and found a potential answer to our search problems. Try Markmail at http://markmail.org/search/?q=list%3Acom.googlegroups.sage-devel -- it seems to, you know, use Google-style search algorithms to comb our beloved mailing list. Nick --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ To post to this group, send an email to sage-devel@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to sage-devel-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sage-devel URL: http://www.sagemath.org -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[sage-devel] Re: of Google Groups and spam
Thanks for posting these. Very interesting, IMHO. On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 6:09 AM, Minh Nguyen wrote: > > Hi folks, > > Just in case you're wondering why spam mails got through occasionally, > here are some stories that present the moderator's side: > > http://www.webmonkey.com/blog/Google_Groups_Fail%3A_JQuery_Dumps_Google_Over_Spam__Interface_Problems > > http://ejohn.org/blog/google-groups-is-dead/ > > -- > Regards > Minh Van Nguyen > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ To post to this group, send an email to sage-devel@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to sage-devel-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sage-devel URL: http://www.sagemath.org -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
