Re: [OSM-talk-be] naming tramlines
That's exactly what was my first posting about. I just noticed the result on the Poznan map and it looked nice and usefull. Though I 'know' that relations exist and what they are used for, I am quite unfamiliar with them so that was the reason why I didn't think about those in the first place. But they are quite new, let's give the people that work on the rendering the time to implement it, and save us the effort of putting in a lot of redundant information in the tags. Luc / Speedy On Thu, 2009-04-23 at 15:03 +0200, Martijn van Exel wrote: > -1. This would indeed be satisfying the wish for nice line labeling on > tram lines in the short term. However, implementing this one-time > might encourage others to just tag tram lines in this fashion and not > even bother about the relations. You know how these things go, as soon > as you start doing this at any serious scale, people will adapt it as > best practice and we will end up doing renderer-driven tagging, to > which I am quite vehemently opposed. > > Cross posting to talk. > > martijn van exel -+- mve...@gmail.com -+- http://www.schaaltreinen.nl/ > > > On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 13:54, Maarten Deen wrote: > l...@xs4all.nl wrote: > >> ah yes. Once again didn't think about the info that's > included - but > >> invisible - already. > > > > But which would need some work to be available to the > renderer. osm2pgsql > > should take the info from the relations and 'flatten' it > into the physical > > tramline data. For bonus points: preserve an existing name, > and append the > > tramline numbers. For extra bonus points: keep the tramline > numbers > > ordered. > > > What a renderer should do is take a key from the way and the > relation and > concatenate them using a separator character. > Both the key name and the separator character should be > specified in the > rendering rules. And if a namerendering like this is required > of course. And > if and how they should be sorted. > > But for as long as such a rendering is not made, I would not > object to putting > the linenumbers in the name tag of the way. It is very useful > information, and > can be weeded out quite easily if a future render can use the > relations. > > Maarten > > > > > ___ > Talk-be mailing list > Talk-be@openstreetmap.org > http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be > > > ___ > Talk-be mailing list > Talk-be@openstreetmap.org > http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] naming tramlines
-1. This would indeed be satisfying the wish for nice line labeling on tram lines in the short term. However, implementing this one-time might encourage others to just tag tram lines in this fashion and not even bother about the relations. You know how these things go, as soon as you start doing this at any serious scale, people will adapt it as best practice and we will end up doing renderer-driven tagging, to which I am quite vehemently opposed. Cross posting to talk. martijn van exel -+- mve...@gmail.com -+- http://www.schaaltreinen.nl/ On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 13:54, Maarten Deen wrote: > l...@xs4all.nl wrote: > >> ah yes. Once again didn't think about the info that's included - but > >> invisible - already. > > > > But which would need some work to be available to the renderer. osm2pgsql > > should take the info from the relations and 'flatten' it into the > physical > > tramline data. For bonus points: preserve an existing name, and append > the > > tramline numbers. For extra bonus points: keep the tramline numbers > > ordered. > > What a renderer should do is take a key from the way and the relation and > concatenate them using a separator character. > Both the key name and the separator character should be specified in the > rendering rules. And if a namerendering like this is required of course. > And > if and how they should be sorted. > > But for as long as such a rendering is not made, I would not object to > putting > the linenumbers in the name tag of the way. It is very useful information, > and > can be weeded out quite easily if a future render can use the relations. > > Maarten > > > > ___ > Talk-be mailing list > Talk-be@openstreetmap.org > http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be > ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] naming tramlines
On Thursday 23 April 2009, Maarten Deen wrote: > l...@xs4all.nl wrote: > >> ah yes. Once again didn't think about the info that's included - > >> but invisible - already. > > > > But which would need some work to be available to the renderer. > > osm2pgsql should take the info from the relations and 'flatten' it > > into the physical tramline data. For bonus points: preserve an > > existing name, and append the tramline numbers. For extra bonus > > points: keep the tramline numbers ordered. > > What a renderer should do is take a key from the way and the relation > and concatenate them using a separator character. > Both the key name and the separator character should be specified in > the rendering rules. And if a namerendering like this is required of > course. And if and how they should be sorted. > > But for as long as such a rendering is not made, I would not object > to putting the linenumbers in the name tag of the way. It is very > useful information, and can be weeded out quite easily if a future > render can use the relations. -1. Improve the renderers, period. And if some rendering doesn't want to show the tram numbers, then we shouldn't force them by using tags that weren't meant for it. We're also not adding the bus numbers on street names or train numbers on railway tracks just because they might be useful, right? Ben ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] naming tramlines
l...@xs4all.nl wrote: >> ah yes. Once again didn't think about the info that's included - but >> invisible - already. > > But which would need some work to be available to the renderer. osm2pgsql > should take the info from the relations and 'flatten' it into the physical > tramline data. For bonus points: preserve an existing name, and append the > tramline numbers. For extra bonus points: keep the tramline numbers > ordered. What a renderer should do is take a key from the way and the relation and concatenate them using a separator character. Both the key name and the separator character should be specified in the rendering rules. And if a namerendering like this is required of course. And if and how they should be sorted. But for as long as such a rendering is not made, I would not object to putting the linenumbers in the name tag of the way. It is very useful information, and can be weeded out quite easily if a future render can use the relations. Maarten ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] naming tramlines
> ah yes. Once again didn't think about the info that's included - but > invisible - already. But which would need some work to be available to the renderer. osm2pgsql should take the info from the relations and 'flatten' it into the physical tramline data. For bonus points: preserve an existing name, and append the tramline numbers. For extra bonus points: keep the tramline numbers ordered. > Guess one could start a 'shopping list' with rendering issues, like > invisible tunnels, oversized fonts in some zoom levels,... Please do. Don't hold back. You can file trac tickets for things you think are wrong in the 'mapnik' and 'osmarender' maps. -- Lennard ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] naming tramlines
ah yes. Once again didn't think about the info that's included - but invisible - already. Guess one could start a 'shopping list' with rendering issues, like invisible tunnels, oversized fonts in some zoom levels,... Luc On Thu, 2009-04-23 at 09:20 +0200, Martijn van Exel wrote: > I think the rendering is nice, but it would be better if it would be > solved at rendering rather than at tagging level. The labels should > reflect the Relations the segment is part of. If you were going to add > the relations to the name tags as well, you would end up with > something that is quite hard to maintain. > > martijn van exel -+- mve...@gmail.com -+- http://www.schaaltreinen.nl/ > > > On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 09:15, Luc Van den Troost > wrote: > Hi, > > > Bounced on an interesting implementation of 'railway naming' > in Poznan, > Poland. > > > http://www.informationfreeway.org/?lat=52.408509010619674&lon=16.924490285423634&zoom=16&layers=0F0B0F > > Aparently they have 'named' the tramlines with the line > numbers passing > there. The result looks very usefull if one wants to get > somewhere by > tram. > > Perhaps we should do the same implementation in Belgium? > > Anyone can think of bad consequenses or problems with it? > > > Luc / Speedy > > > ___ > Talk-be mailing list > Talk-be@openstreetmap.org > http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be > > ___ > Talk-be mailing list > Talk-be@openstreetmap.org > http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] naming tramlines
I think the rendering is nice, but it would be better if it would be solved at rendering rather than at tagging level. The labels should reflect the Relations the segment is part of. If you were going to add the relations to the name tags as well, you would end up with something that is quite hard to maintain. martijn van exel -+- mve...@gmail.com -+- http://www.schaaltreinen.nl/ On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 09:15, Luc Van den Troost wrote: > Hi, > > > Bounced on an interesting implementation of 'railway naming' in Poznan, > Poland. > > > http://www.informationfreeway.org/?lat=52.408509010619674&lon=16.924490285423634&zoom=16&layers=0F0B0F > > Aparently they have 'named' the tramlines with the line numbers passing > there. The result looks very usefull if one wants to get somewhere by > tram. > > Perhaps we should do the same implementation in Belgium? > > Anyone can think of bad consequenses or problems with it? > > > Luc / Speedy > > > ___ > Talk-be mailing list > Talk-be@openstreetmap.org > http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be > ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
[OSM-talk-be] naming tramlines
Hi, Bounced on an interesting implementation of 'railway naming' in Poznan, Poland. http://www.informationfreeway.org/?lat=52.408509010619674&lon=16.924490285423634&zoom=16&layers=0F0B0F Aparently they have 'named' the tramlines with the line numbers passing there. The result looks very usefull if one wants to get somewhere by tram. Perhaps we should do the same implementation in Belgium? Anyone can think of bad consequenses or problems with it? Luc / Speedy ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
