Re: ubuntu lacks ideas, firefox is full of ideas

[Manish Sinha]

> You're very defensive, argumentative and coming off as belligerent

I never knew reply to an aggressive mail is called defensive reply.

Anyway I hope you got all your replies and all the questions were answered.

By the way thanks for personal attacks. I won't reply back the same way.

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Re: ubuntu lacks ideas, firefox is full of ideas

[Alexander]

On Fri, Nov 18, 2011 at 6:02 PM, Manish Sinha wrote:

> >  I did not say "needs," distinct from implies.
> Okay how does it even imply heavy usage of mouse? Personal experiences
> don't make univeral truths. It just implies that the person has not tried
> finding the keyboard shortcuts
>
> > Manish you seem defensive rather than helpful.
> Sorry. I have stopped sugar coating my replies. I prefer being blunt and
> to the point.
>
> Unhelpful? Providng links to to developer.ubuntu.com is unhelpful? Or
> pointing out that the unity keyboard shortcut cheat sheet is available on
> askubuntu means being unhelpful? Then what is the meaning of helpful?
>
> > Make love not war
>
> I think the best way to make war is bringing *us* and *you* in the
> discussion. That is exactly what I opposed in my reply. Dunno which other
> war statement you referring to.
>
> -
> Manish
>
I apologize for the confusion. By unhelpful I refer to the tone of your
replies. Maybe blunt and to the point is your style, sorry. You're very
defensive, argumentative and coming off as belligerent.
Again, I'm sorry.

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Re: ubuntu lacks ideas, firefox is full of ideas

[Bryce Harrington]

On Fri, Nov 18, 2011 at 05:36:04PM -0500, Alexander wrote:
> Where can I get involved without directing me to developer.ubuntu.com
> or providing me suggestions?

Hi, this mailing list isn't really about development of Unity but more
focused on the overall desktop integration.  For Unity-specific
mailing lists and IRC channels, see:

  http://unity.ubuntu.com/contact-us/

Bryce

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Re: ubuntu lacks ideas, firefox is full of ideas

[Manish Sinha]

>  I did not say "needs," distinct from implies.
Okay how does it even imply heavy usage of mouse? Personal experiences
don't make univeral truths. It just implies that the person has not tried
finding the keyboard shortcuts

> Manish you seem defensive rather than helpful.
Sorry. I have stopped sugar coating my replies. I prefer being blunt and to
the point.

Unhelpful? Providng links to to developer.ubuntu.com is unhelpful? Or
pointing out that the unity keyboard shortcut cheat sheet is available on
askubuntu means being unhelpful? Then what is the meaning of helpful?

> Make love not war

I think the best way to make war is bringing *us* and *you* in the
discussion. That is exactly what I opposed in my reply. Dunno which other
war statement you referring to.

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CTRL+T in Gedit

[Chris Wilson]

There's a paper
cutthat's
been hanging around for a few years now which seems like a
no-brainer to fix if only a decision were to be made about what to do.
Basically, the argument is that Gedit should use CTRL + T to open a
document in a new tab, and CTRL + N to do so in a new window, as opposed to
the current behaviour where CTRL + N opens a document in a new tab, and
there is no New Window shortcut.

There's been little (visible) activity on it for the past couple of years
and I was just wondering if anyone was even aware of it.

Chris
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Re: ubuntu lacks ideas, firefox is full of ideas

[Alexander]

On Fri, Nov 18, 2011 at 4:25 PM, Manish Sinha wrote:

> > The Unity API is minimal. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/LauncherAPI I
> can't position, I can't edit, I can't remove and I can't add anything.
>
> You are comparing a very mature and years old product Firefox with a very
> recent app called Unity.
>
> I am not a Unity dev but I would personally prefer that they put more
> efforts in making Unity more stable and smooth than adding customization
> options and making the path towards breaking unity more easier.
>
> > You said you don't want customizeability (I mean, you make unity have
> unmodifiable defaults) and you said you want more apps (I mean, you put a
> huge effort in the Ubuntu Software Store), but these two things are a
> contradication, because *if we can't do anything,
>
> It isn't contradiction. Think about it, write an app which makes a
> beautiful UI for editing preferences already exposed by Unity. Put it in
> software center.
>
> Plus non customization doesn't mean it is contradiction to app
> development. If you are writing a word processor app or a media player app
> how does it matter that for that app to run Unity needs to be more
> customizable?
>
> > why should we develop apps for you*?
>
> What do you mean by we? It can be reworded as "why should *I* write apps
> for you". Plus I don't know where we are going with this *you* and *us*
> mentality.
>
> > Plus, Firefox writes tutorials that start from overview, allow to go
> in-depth, have examples and I think Ubuntu should do that too
>
> developer.ubuntu.com is aimed towards that
>
> -
> Manish
>
 I did not say "needs," distinct from *implies. *Manish you seem defensive
rather than helpful. Where can I get involved without directing me to
developer.ubuntu.com or providing me suggestions? Or ask me questions to
help you answer my questions?
Make love not war.
Alexander


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Re: ubuntu lacks ideas, firefox is full of ideas

[Manish Sinha]

> The Unity API is minimal. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/LauncherAPI I
can't position, I can't edit, I can't remove and I can't add anything.

You are comparing a very mature and years old product Firefox with a very
recent app called Unity.

I am not a Unity dev but I would personally prefer that they put more
efforts in making Unity more stable and smooth than adding customization
options and making the path towards breaking unity more easier.

> You said you don't want customizeability (I mean, you make unity have
unmodifiable defaults) and you said you want more apps (I mean, you put a
huge effort in the Ubuntu Software Store), but these two things are a
contradication, because *if we can't do anything,

It isn't contradiction. Think about it, write an app which makes a
beautiful UI for editing preferences already exposed by Unity. Put it in
software center.

Plus non customization doesn't mean it is contradiction to app development.
If you are writing a word processor app or a media player app how does it
matter that for that app to run Unity needs to be more customizable?

> why should we develop apps for you*?

What do you mean by we? It can be reworded as "why should *I* write apps
for you". Plus I don't know where we are going with this *you* and *us*
mentality.

> Plus, Firefox writes tutorials that start from overview, allow to go
in-depth, have examples and I think Ubuntu should do that too

developer.ubuntu.com is aimed towards that

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Re: ubuntu lacks ideas, firefox is full of ideas

[Manish Sinha]

> I am glad I found this email. I can relate to it in many ways. I've tried
to get involved in developing Ubuntu, but nobody has reached out. 11.10 is
so bad on my machine I reverted to 10.04. I never liked Unity, it's silly
and implies heavy use of the mouse. I want to use the keyboard to navigate
everything.

I use Unity only with keyboard and not with mouse and it is more keyboard
friendly than the old gnome panel.

You probably need to learn the keyboard shortcuts before making such
statements like unity usage needs heavy use of mouse.
The keyboard cheat sheet is available on askubuntu

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Re: ubuntu lacks ideas, firefox is full of ideas

[Alexander Etter]

On Nov 18, 2011, at 14:45, Pedro Bessa  wrote:

> Hi Ubuntu-desktop,
> I can change Firefox in any way. I can position, edit, remove and add any 
> interface element however I think is useful to the others. So I created two 
> add-ons. 
> https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/addon-tools-in-app-button/ and 
> https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/ubiquity-in-awesomebar/
> 
> I reported many bugs to Ubuntu.
> To make you patch them, I need to convince you that the bug is so important 
> that you need to work, which is very hard.
> To make me patch them, I need to convince you that the bug is important, 
> otherwise the patch won't be approved, which is hard, then I need to patch 
> the bug, which is hard, then I need you to approve the code, which is hard, 
> so it's triple hard.
> To develop an app, I need to code my work and others will see my name, rate 
> it high, install it lots, congratulate me by e-mail, recognize my work, which 
> it's fun, then I need your approval to the Ubuntu Software Store and you put 
> a huge effort in it, you want more apps, which it's fun, then I show you 
> since the app's popular, the bug is important and according to xkcd, I'm 
> correcting a person on the internet, it's an important task, which it's fun, 
> so it's triple fun.
> 
> The Unity API is minimal. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/LauncherAPI I can't 
> position, I can't edit, I can't remove and I can't add anything.
> You said you don't want customizeability (I mean, you make unity have 
> unmodifiable defaults) and you said you want more apps (I mean, you put a 
> huge effort in the Ubuntu Software Store), but these two things are a 
> contradication, because *if we can't do anything, why should we develop apps 
> for you*?
> 
> Plus, Firefox writes tutorials that start from overview, allow to go 
> in-depth, have examples and I think Ubuntu should do that too.
> Best regards,
> Pedro Bessa
> 
I am glad I found this email. I can relate to it in many ways. I've tried to 
get involved in developing Ubuntu, but nobody has reached out. 11.10 is so bad 
on my machine I reverted to 10.04. I never liked Unity, it's silly and implies 
heavy use of the mouse. I want to use the keyboard to navigate everything. 
And I like firefox too.
Just my thoughts on this matter; I don't intend to start a war but a thoughtful 
discussion if anything.
Alexander
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ubuntu lacks ideas, firefox is full of ideas

[Pedro Bessa]

Hi Ubuntu-desktop,

I can change Firefox in any way. I can position, edit, remove and add 
any interface element however I think is useful to the others. So I 
created two 
add-ons.https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/addon-tools-in-app-button/ 
andhttps://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/ubiquity-in-awesomebar/ 



I reported many bugs to Ubuntu.
To make you patch them, I need to convince you that the bug is so 
important that you need to work, which is very hard.
To make me patch them, I need to convince you that the bug is important, 
otherwise the patch won't be approved, which is hard, then I need to 
patch the bug, which is hard, then I need you to approve the code, which 
is hard, so it's triple hard.
To develop an app, I need to code my work and others will see my name, 
rate it high, install it lots, congratulate me by e-mail, recognize my 
work, which it's fun, then I need your approval to the Ubuntu Software 
Store and you put a huge effort in it, you want more apps, which it's 
fun, then I show you since the app's popular, the bug is important and 
according to xkcd, I'm correcting a person on the internet, it's an 
important task, which it's fun, so it's triple fun.


The Unity API is minimal.https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/LauncherAPI 
I can't position, I can't 
edit, I can't remove and I can't add anything.
You said you don't want customizeability (I mean, you make unity have 
unmodifiable defaults) and you said you want more apps (I mean, you put 
a huge effort in the Ubuntu Software Store), but these two things are a 
contradication, because *if we can't do anything, why should we develop 
apps for you*?


Plus, Firefox writes tutorials that start from overview, allow to go 
in-depth, have examples and I think Ubuntu should do that too.


Best regards,
Pedro Bessa

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