Re: [Ifeffit] Two analysts, one spectrum, similar outcome?

2019-08-14 Thread Matthew Marcus
Dear Carlo. Regarding yours of Tue, 13 Aug 2019 21:59:18 -0500 (CDT): The way I like to put it is that EXAFS works best if you already know most of the answer. You need to have a specific question, such as 'is there antisite disorder?' or 'Are there edge-sharing octahedra?', or 'Which of

Re: [Ifeffit] Two analysts, one spectrum, similar outcome?

2019-08-13 Thread Mike Massey
This is a great example, Scott! Thanks for sharing your experience. Hopefully ours will be similarly positive and the results will be in the ballpark of each other. It's at least comforting to know there's a chance. Mike > On Aug 13, 2019, at 8:18 PM, Scott Calvin wrote: > > Yes, I

Re: [Ifeffit] Two analysts, one spectrum, similar outcome?

2019-08-13 Thread Carlo Segre
Hi Mike: What I mean by "what question you are trying to answer" is that if you are interested in a specific fitting parameter, you might wish to make some assumptions and put constraints on other parameters so that you can extract the trend that you are interested in. Carlo On Tue, 13

Re: [Ifeffit] Two analysts, one spectrum, similar outcome?

2019-08-13 Thread Mike Massey
It is true that we both have background information regarding the samples, and similar goals in terms of the questions we are looking to answer. "You also need to think about what question you are trying to answer. If you have a specific goal in mind, then you may choose a different model than

Re: [Ifeffit] Two analysts, one spectrum, similar outcome?

2019-08-13 Thread Scott Calvin
Yes, I did. I set up a double-blind experiment with mixtures of various iron standards and an “unknown” iron-containing compound. This was years ago, so I may have a few details wrong, but it will get the gist: I used undergraduates to make the mixtures with random amounts of random selections

Re: [Ifeffit] Two analysts, one spectrum, similar outcome?

2019-08-13 Thread Carlo Segre
The answer you get will depend somewhat on the assumptions you make. if you are truly provided with data and no other information about the sample, then the job is challenging. If you know something about the sample that can help you start in a particular direction then the two analyses

Re: [Ifeffit] Two analysts, one spectrum, similar outcome?

2019-08-13 Thread Mike Massey
I'm the dumb one. But it's an interesting question, and gets perhaps to the heart of the issue: to what extent does the smartness of the analyst, or their experience, or the fitting procedures used, or a butterfly flapping its wings in Micronesia, impact the results? For the sake of argument,

Re: [Ifeffit] Two analysts, one spectrum, similar outcome?

2019-08-13 Thread Anatoly Frenkel
Are they equally smart? Anatoly > On Aug 13, 2019, at 9:39 PM, Mike Massey wrote: > > Hi Everyone, > > > I'm curious, has anyone ever tried turning two analysts loose on the same > unknown EXAFS spectrum to see if their fits come out with similar > conclusions? If you have tried it, how

[Ifeffit] Two analysts, one spectrum, similar outcome?

2019-08-13 Thread Mike Massey
Hi Everyone, I'm curious, has anyone ever tried turning two analysts loose on the same unknown EXAFS spectrum to see if their fits come out with similar conclusions? If you have tried it, how did it work out? Were the conclusions indeed similar? If not, why not, and what did you end up doing