(313) mix
hey all recorded a mix recently finding inspiration in a few bottles of wine on a balmy london night... its pretty hefty weighing in at 105 mb, and downloadable here: http://www.samndang.plus.com/mixage/dang_-_emotions_electrique.mp3 tracklisting: drexcia - birth of new life - tresor sunday brunch - humla - svek florence - analogue expressions - eevolute duplex - late night cycling - clone dopplereffekt - ? - dataphysix metro area - caught up - environ morgan geist - pushed (mark broom remix) - multiplex titonton duvante and fabrice lig - sensual - seventh city john tejada and arian leviste - its only music - groovetech aril brikha - on and on - transmat rue east - monday - phont music southsiders - epic - rewired splinterfaction - ultraism - digital soul john tejada and arian leviste - sight and sound - playhouse robert hood - rumors of my doom - drama chris gray - diffused emotion - fragmented moodymann - don't you want my love - peacefrog cheers dang
Re: (313) mix
- Original Message - From: dang [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2003 12:54 AM Subject: (313) mix robert hood - rumors of my doom - drama Now *that* is a song title! Tristan === Text/Mixes/Pics: http://www.phonopsia.co.uk Music: http://www.mp313.com Contact: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: (313) Theo Parrish - Eclectic Asthetic part II CD
Hey Oh great, I got part 1 in Detroit and despite searching, there was no Part 2. ;) Can I ask, where did you get it? Cheers! Cyclone -- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) Theo Parrish - Eclectic Asthetic part II CD Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 11:55 AM I just bought this and I know as the red card insert says: Filled with minimal tech-house grooves. No artwork, No titles, Just MUSIC. but I'm curious if anyone does have a tracklisting? (don't care one way or another really as I intend on sitting back and chilling to it ASAP.) MEK
Re: RE: (313) Magda London UK
From: ian cheshire [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thu 10/07/2003 12:5 AM GMT+08:00 HI all, Just to add. I saw Stephen Brown live at House of God a few years back. He was awesome live. Don't miss that!!! I wonder if any shops still keep stock of his real time Records releases. I could not get hold of his later releases. ANy recommendations? Regards, Collin Chen To: Amanda [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) Magda London UK sorry I wasn't trying to leave out Magda on purpose as I felt there was no need to state the obvious :) -Original Message- From: ian cheshire [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 09 July 2003 17:04 To: Amanda; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) Magda London UK ohh bugger! you see another night missed because I am away:(( I really like Percy X and would love to hear Mr Brown :( you lucky people, enjoy !! -Original Message- From: Amanda [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 09 July 2003 16:43 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) Magda London UK Haywire take control in Fabric [room 2] this Saturday SATURDAY 12th JULY 22:00 - 02:00 MAGDA [Minus] 02:00 - 03:00 STEPHEN BROWN [Transmat] 03:00 - 06:00 PERCY X [Soma] more info : [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.haywire.co.uk www.fabriclondon.com --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 10/06/03 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 10/06/03 --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 10/06/03 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 10/06/03
Re: (313) track i.d.
Its chungking 'making music' which is on their album 'we travel fast' on tummy touch, and i think that track might be released as a single - its lovely isn't it? the bassist from super_collider, James Stephenson plays bass and produces chungking, That's his proper band so to speak. they are very mellow and the lead singer Jessie, is quite a performer...definitely worth checking live and I love the album too. 9/7/03 9:01 PM Grammenos, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thanks much ;)! -p -Original Message- From: Martin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2003 1:36 PM To: rebekah; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) track i.d. I've just asked Christian for you, answer to follow 9/7/03 3:53 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Can anyone identify the following track? It was the third track that Christian Vogel played in his first set at Sonar 2003, which can be heard from the Sonar website. The refrain goes like this: I feel as though I'm falling I just wanna cry Just help me along To where I belong Where I'm safe and sound .making music thanks, r
Re: (313) mix
Phonopsia wrote on Thu, 10 Jul 2003 about following: robert hood - rumors of my doom - drama Now *that* is a song title! one of those tracks i keep wondering nobody talks about; it's quite old by now, but definitely one of the best tracks by hood, up there with The Vision ep on metroplex. sakke -- Timing must be perfect now. Two-timing must be better than perfect.
(313) Omoa
Was just flicking through the Rushhour list and spotted two new Omoa music releases. an Ayro LP, and a remix 12. Has anyone heard them? I've liked the omoa stuff in the past, might buy, could do with listening, or someone telling me what they think.. Thanks! _ - End of message text This e-mail is sent by the above named in their individual, non-business capacity and is not on behalf of PricewaterhouseCoopers. PricewaterhouseCoopers may monitor outgoing and incoming e-mails and other telecommunications on its e-mail and telecommunications systems. By replying to this e-mail you give your consent to such monitoring
RE: (313) Amp Dog Knights - Vocal Sampler - Somehow, Somewhere. . .
yup...daughter i believe -Original Message- From: Andrew [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 09 July 2003 23:59 To: Matthew MacQueen Cc: Allday, Andrew; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Amp Dog Knights - Vocal Sampler - Somehow, Somewhere. . . So that's not Syleena Johnson then? (Recent hit with Busta Rhymes etc.) Parent? Relation? Cheers, Andrew On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 08:35 PM, Matthew MacQueen wrote: Is It Because I'm Black - Syl Johnson which is a wicked, heavy and honest gritty soul cut.. that sample you hear in the Theo record just scratches the surface of all the emotion deep inside that track... it's pretty powerful. Cheers Matt MacQueen . --- Information in this email may be privileged, confidential and is intended exclusively for the addressee. The views expressed may not be official policy, but the personal views of the originator. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender by return e-mail and delete it from your system. You should not reproduce, distribute, store, retransmit, use or disclose its contents to anyone. Please note we reserve the right to monitor all e-mail communication through our internal and external networks. ---
(313) abstract science 2003.07.10 + etc 2003.07.12
[update] Abstract Science this Thursday night 2003.07.10th 22:00 4hours guest hosted by: m50 tune in to 88.7 fm or http://147.126.7.8:8010/listen.pls http://www.wluw.org/ http://www.abstractscience.net/ etc this Friday night 2003.07.12sa 01:00 3hours hosted by: m50 featuring live PA by: Proswell (Inpuj, Merck) featuring guest DJ set by: Gabriel Palomo (Zuvuya) tune in to 89.3 fm or http://www.wnur.org/live.ram etc's opening time is now 30minutes delayed from now on etc will run from 01:00-04:00 CST weekly [site] http://www.m50.net/ new version launching this Friday night! [upcoming] etc 2003.07.19sa 01:00 180minutes: Matt Mercer (live PA - Forte, 409) Warmdesk (live PA - Static Caravan, Deluxe, Bip_hop) collaboration solo performances etc 2003.07.26sa 01:00 180minutes: pHonaut's Headtheater etc 2003.08.02sa 01:00 180minutes: Todd Sines (Residual, Background, Planet E), Archetype (live PA - Black Nation, Theory, Sonic Mind, 21/22 Corporation, Ongaku, Speaker Attack, 77, Inkubator Akustik) Monday @ Danny's 2003.08.04mo m50, Todd Sines (live PA - Residual, Background, Planet E), Archetype (Black Nation, Theory, Sonic Mind, 21/22 Corporation, Ongaku, Speaker Attack, 77, Inkubator Akustik) see 'local' Improvlotto 2003.08.06we 21:00 Philip Von Zweck, Christopher Sorg, J Cookson, m50 see 'local' etc 2003.08.09sa 01:00 180minutes: Kee (Part Time Sucker Radio, Bass By The Pound), Cringer (Part Time Sucker Radio, Bass By The Pound), Kat_Zyie (Part Time Sucker Radio, Bass By The Pound), Jeekoos (Part Time Sucker Radio, Bass By The Pound) [playlists] m50 : etc : 2003.Jun.28 00:30 180minutes : WNUR-FM John Callaghan : The Day My Dreams Came True : You've Got Your Memories, I've Got My Dreams : WARP Metamatics : Giant Sunflowers Swaying In The Wind : MAS Confusion : !K7 / Musik Aus Strom Future Beat Alliance : Lo Tech Jazz : Audio Photos : Delsin Jeff Samuel : Kapstif : Double Yum : Trapez Dynamo : 23° pt1 : 23° / 18° : din Detroit Grand Pubahs : Sandwiches : Sandwiches : Throw Gold Chains : Nada - GC Gold Club Remix : Nada : PIAS Si Begg : Moveup - Si Begg Club Mix : Moveup : Mute Feadz : Fresh Live : Kollektiv3 : Bpitchcontrol Sutekh : Deuterotype w/Alva.Noto : Collaborations : Force Lab Bolz Bolz : Take A Walk - P Daley's Drunken Bass Full Mix : Take A Walk : Longhaul Johannes Heil : Paranoid Dancer - DJ Hell Remix : Paranoid Dancer : Kanzleramt Osborne : Bout Ready To Jak : [split] : Ghostly Duplex : Motion Blur : Ep5 : Clone Ken Ishii : Iceblink Main Mix : Shortcut : Iceblink : Exceptional The Other People Place : Eye Contact : Lifestyles Of The Laptop Cafe : WARP Translusion : [c2] : [white] : Suprenat Christian Morgenstern : Girls got rhythm : The Lydia EP : Forte Christian Morgenstern : OK, we're wrong! : The Lydia EP : Forte Christian Morgenstern : Welcome to Camp Crystal Lake : The Lydia EP : Forte Christian Morgenstern : Tonight you're mine, baby : The Lydia EP : Forte Christian Morgenstern : Christian Morgenstern Mix : Night Of The Living Deaf - The Remix EP : Forte Christian Morgenstern : Hawaii Blue - Heiko Laux Mix : Hawaii Blue EP : Forte Christian Morgenstern : pt1 : The Future Is On Fire : Kanzleramt Christian Morgenstern : Supertrance : Hawaii Blue : Forte Christian Morgenstern : pt4 : The Future Is On Fire : Kanzleramt Christian Morgenstern : Spiegelkerker - Christian Morgenstern Mix : Re:Death Before Disko : Forte Christian Morgenstern : Aux Talk Funkativity - John Tejada Mix : Re:Death Before Disko : Forte Christian Morgenstern : In Space Noone Can Hear You Scream : Hawaii Blue EP : Forte Praxis, Soultek, Matt Nee (no setlists) [thanks] rest in peace to Christian Morgenstern 1975-2003, http://www.forterecords.com Alex @ http://www.mute.com Jim @ http://www.weekendrecordsandsoap.com/ Mike @ http://www.liftpromotions.com/ Praxis @ http://www.omniscientrecords.com/ Matt Steve @ http://www.komputemusik.com/ [local] 2003.07.10th 22:00 Gramaphone Techno Showcase 30... Frankie Vega V!jay Tetric Mani Karl Meier Smartbar @ Smartbar 3730 N Clark 21+ 4$ 2003.07.11fr 22:00 Metro Area Common Factor @ Smartbar 3730 N Clark 21+ 13$ 2003.07.11fr Midwest Heavyweights Matthew Martin (Meiotic) Joe Stereo L-Tek Katsel @ Seanchai 2345 W. Belmont (belmont western) 21+ 0$ 2003.07.12sa 22:00 Colette Dan X @ Smartbar 3730 N Clark 21+ 10$ 2003.07.12sa 22:00 RJD2 @ Emptybottle 1035 N Western 21+ 12$ 2003.07.12sa 22:00-03:00 Illmeasures presents: Flow Madrid Striz @ Lava Lounge 859 N Damen 21+ ?$ 2003.07.15tu Consumers Research and Development and Someoddpilot records present: Substance DJ Shon Dervis @ Streetside Cafe 3201 W Armitage 21+ 0$ fon 773 252 9700 2003.07.16we IRQ Ghettocyb.org Lisa Sunshine Cerebral Itch @ Gladstone Hotel est 1889 1214 Queen St W Toronto, ON 19+ 5$ 2003.07.18fr 22:00 Squarepusher @ Emptybottle 1035 N Western 21+ 18$ / 15$ advance (sold out) 2003.07.19sa 22:00 µ-ziq @ Emptybottle 1035 N Western 21+ 12$ 2003.07.19sa 22:00-03:00 Illmeasures presents: Flow
(313) [313] downLow recordings website.
hi folks. anyone have any info regarding downLow's website? i was trying to get there in order to gather info about dan curtin's latest EP. (like where to get it.) hopefully the site won't be down for too long. cheers, lrh
Re: (313) Theo Parrish - Eclectic Asthetic part II CD
At 09:24 PM 7/9/2003, Cyclone Wehner wrote: Hey Oh great, I got part 1 in Detroit and despite searching, there was no Part 2. ;) Can I ask, where did you get it? Cheers! Cyclone Record Time has these off and on. jeff
Re: (313) [313] downLow recordings website.
The new 12 on Down Low by Dan Curtin is just released right now. In europe it's distributed by Rushhour and in the states by Syntax. The usual record shops should have it. The first edition is limited in clear see through yellow vinyl, so hurry up It's a superb new record. Typical Dan Curtin funky and sometimes a little bit jazzy deep techno stuff. Recommended! Arne [EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb: hi folks. anyone have any info regarding downLow's website? i was trying to get there in order to gather info about dan curtin's latest EP. (like where to get it.) hopefully the site won't be down for too long. cheers, lrh -- °°° www.arneweinberg.de HEADSPACE Rec. KEYNOTE Rec. DOWN LOW MUSIC STARBABY Rec. °°°
Re: (313) Omoa
the album really suprised me! i expected more of too soften smooth noodlings but several tracks are very raw and funky as god going towards super_collider in a way really suprising, and really good!! the twelve is more on the regular tip, pretty smooth - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2003 10:41 AM Subject: (313) Omoa Was just flicking through the Rushhour list and spotted two new Omoa music releases. an Ayro LP, and a remix 12. Has anyone heard them? I've liked the omoa stuff in the past, might buy, could do with listening, or someone telling me what they think.. Thanks! _ - End of message text This e-mail is sent by the above named in their individual, non-business capacity and is not on behalf of PricewaterhouseCoopers. PricewaterhouseCoopers may monitor outgoing and incoming e-mails and other telecommunications on its e-mail and telecommunications systems. By replying to this e-mail you give your consent to such monitoring
Re: (313) [313] downLow recordings website.
yeah, especially the first track on side a really stands out! the best I've heard from mr Curtin in a while smooth low-pitched kick with some incredilble cathy funky basslines! - Original Message - From: Arne Weinberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313 Mailing List 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2003 2:24 PM Subject: Re: (313) [313] downLow recordings website. The new 12 on Down Low by Dan Curtin is just released right now. In europe it's distributed by Rushhour and in the states by Syntax. The usual record shops should have it. The first edition is limited in clear see through yellow vinyl, so hurry up It's a superb new record. Typical Dan Curtin funky and sometimes a little bit jazzy deep techno stuff. Recommended! Arne [EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb: hi folks. anyone have any info regarding downLow's website? i was trying to get there in order to gather info about dan curtin's latest EP. (like where to get it.) hopefully the site won't be down for too long. cheers, lrh -- °°° www.arneweinberg.de HEADSPACE Rec. KEYNOTE Rec. DOWN LOW MUSIC STARBABY Rec. °°°
RE: (313) track i.d.
Thanks a lot. Yeah when christian played he used the bassline from my fav supercollider track and mixed it into the lyrics of this one, figured there was a connection. Such a warm beautiful track. Best DJ Trick goes to Christian - he played one side of a DFA record and toward the end of the song put it through an effects processor to echo the last bit of it, then flipped the record over, mid-set, while the echo was going, and played the other side. Brilliant! -Pete -Original Message- From: Martin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2003 5:14 AM To: Grammenos, Peter Cc: 313 Subject: Re: (313) track i.d. Its chungking 'making music' which is on their album 'we travel fast' on tummy touch, and i think that track might be released as a single - its lovely isn't it? the bassist from super_collider, James Stephenson plays bass and produces chungking, That's his proper band so to speak. they are very mellow and the lead singer Jessie, is quite a performer...definitely worth checking live and I love the album too. 9/7/03 9:01 PM Grammenos, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thanks much ;)! -p -Original Message- From: Martin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2003 1:36 PM To: rebekah; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) track i.d. I've just asked Christian for you, answer to follow 9/7/03 3:53 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Can anyone identify the following track? It was the third track that Christian Vogel played in his first set at Sonar 2003, which can be heard from the Sonar website. The refrain goes like this: I feel as though I'm falling I just wanna cry Just help me along To where I belong Where I'm safe and sound .making music thanks, r
RE: (313) LFO are back!
--- Matthew MacQueen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: To you. So that is an excuse for LFO to keep making the same tracks over and over? I don't buy it. While diehard fans might want an artist to stay in their personal favorite period (to your ears 'the best' period) forever, the vanguard artists will always want (for better or worse) to push a sound forward, especially in a genre like techno that rewards innovation. You can't freeze a musical time period and put it in a bottle and expect to keep progress at the same time. Get over it. Well not so much making the same tracks just using some of the ideas in LFO's first album such as the sub basslines. What artist like Dave Clarke and Neil Landstrum were doing in the mid 90's are good examples of people using concepts of the older techno sound. Who said his new material is trying to be something else? If it doesn't sound like old LFO and you're going to be unhappy, well start get disappointed now because it probably doesn't. You could take it up with the artist, see how far you get. Ha ha The stupid labels you mention are just words that became labels for artists pushing things in different directions, thus they got named to separate or highlight them. If they didn't move in different directions, we'd all be stuck in a rut and all electronic dance music (or whatever) would sound much more similar even than it does today. Things change, morph, take in old and new influences and move where the artist wants to take things next, get over it. Techno will never go back to the way it was 10-15 years ago, nor does it need to. Techno is basically a late 80's early 90's music genre, it's like electro. Based in drum machine and synthesizer music. Comparing today's music to techno from 10 or 15 years ago is like comparing the original Star Wars Trilogy to the newer movies like Episode 1. Is newer better? well no because in this case newer technology was not utilized correctly to improve on an old concept which had room for some improvement. =
Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video
the main flaw in your reasoning which is a bit idol worshiping in my opinion is why didn't we hear more of that sound when they played live in the late 80's, early 90's, or eve mid 90's? They are obviously influenced by todays dance trends, I don't see their music as being really that original, they were pioneers in a natural evolution of electronic music 30 years ago, when drum machines started to make the scene it wasn't hard to make very similar sounding music. The man machine concept = mechanical sounding drum machines = synthesizers. --- MM [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i will agree with the fact that the basic channel sound has been imitated by many...but at the same time i have a hard time believing that kraftwerk is trying to sound like anyonethey are kraftwerkthey don't need to try to sound like anythingthey are who they are and their sounds are there ownlets not forget its easy to judge them now 20 years later knowing what we all know about soundbut it was kraftwerk along with others who taught us about alot of those sounds we judge, and listen too...i just think its hard to compare any of kraftwerks new music with new music todaycause kraftwerk is thinking far beyond most people making music today.i mean it seems like electronic music has just caught up recently with where kraftwerk was 20 years ago but none of this means they are not past there prime...i guess we will have too see. my 2 cents.. michael www.renegaderhythms.com =
Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video
I don't see their music as being really that original? er. so who else sounds like them then? And who did they copy? Or is this another classic spw wind-up? I can see what you are saying about them being around at the same time as electronic music and equipment began to make up a head of steam as it were, but to say that they were'nt original is way off the mark. - Original Message - From: spw [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2003 2:50 PM Subject: Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video the main flaw in your reasoning which is a bit idol worshiping in my opinion is why didn't we hear more of that sound when they played live in the late 80's, early 90's, or eve mid 90's? They are obviously influenced by todays dance trends, I don't see their music as being really that original, they were pioneers in a natural evolution of electronic music 30 years ago, when drum machines started to make the scene it wasn't hard to make very similar sounding music. The man machine concept = mechanical sounding drum machines = synthesizers. --- MM [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i will agree with the fact that the basic channel sound has been imitated by many...but at the same time i have a hard time believing that kraftwerk is trying to sound like anyonethey are kraftwerkthey don't need to try to sound like anythingthey are who they are and their sounds are there ownlets not forget its easy to judge them now 20 years later knowing what we all know about soundbut it was kraftwerk along with others who taught us about alot of those sounds we judge, and listen too...i just think its hard to compare any of kraftwerks new music with new music todaycause kraftwerk is thinking far beyond most people making music today.i mean it seems like electronic music has just caught up recently with where kraftwerk was 20 years ago but none of this means they are not past there prime...i guess we will have too see. my 2 cents.. michael www.renegaderhythms.com =
Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video
make that + synthesizers. That's the premise of all electro and techno music: look I can make futuristic sci-fi sounding music with this mechanical sounding drum machine and electronic sounding on synthesizer which does a poor job imitating acoustic sounds --- spw [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The man machine concept = mechanical sounding drum machines = synthesizers. =
RE: (313) Tour de France 03 video
So today's revelation, broadly speaking, is that electronic music is made with electronic equipment? You know, 313 isn't just informative and entertaining - it's *educational* too! -Original Message- From: spw [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 10 July 2003 15:00 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video make that + synthesizers. That's the premise of all electro and techno music: look I can make futuristic sci-fi sounding music with this mechanical sounding drum machine and electronic sounding on synthesizer which does a poor job imitating acoustic sounds --- spw [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The man machine concept = mechanical sounding drum machines = synthesizers. =
RE: (313) Tour de France 03 video
A stunning observation! -Original Message- From: spw [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2003 2:00 PM To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video make that + synthesizers. That's the premise of all electro and techno music: look I can make futuristic sci-fi sounding music with this mechanical sounding drum machine and electronic sounding on synthesizer which does a poor job imitating acoustic sounds --- spw [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The man machine concept = mechanical sounding drum machines = synthesizers. = # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. #
RE: (313) Tour de France 03 video
Just because Kraftwerk came out with music using the same instruments, does not mean that it _sounded_ the same. If all music created with like instruments sounded exactly the same, than Jimi Hendrix should have never even picked up a guitar... Spw, you have good devil's advocates thoughts and comparisons (and that type of thinking is usually condusive to broader horizons), but you really do put your foot in your mouth alot... Dennis -Original Message- From: spw [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2003 10:00 AM To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video make that + synthesizers. That's the premise of all electro and techno music: look I can make futuristic sci-fi sounding music with this mechanical sounding drum machine and electronic sounding on synthesizer which does a poor job imitating acoustic sounds --- spw [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The man machine concept = mechanical sounding drum machines = synthesizers. =
Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video
That's the premise of all electro and techno music: look I can make futuristic sci-fi sounding music with this mechanical sounding drum machine and electronic sounding on synthesizer which does a poor job imitating acoustic sounds now, thats what i call CLASSIC ;) fab
Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video
--- Bleep43 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't see their music as being really that original? er. so who else sounds like them then? And who did they copy? Or is this another classic spw wind-up? I can see what you are saying about them being around at the same time as electronic music and equipment began to make up a head of steam as it were, but to say that they were'nt original is way off the mark. I just made my point with the man machine concept, which is a conventional way of interpreting technology at the time. Their music was not unconventional and abstract like say a Mortin Subotnick. This is why Juan Atkins came up with a similar sound with out even hearing of Kraftwerk. =
RE: (313) Tour de France 03 video
rock is just the sound of electrified strings, plucked, and acoustic drums hmmm i know i shouldn't rise to it but i can't help meself robin... So today's revelation, broadly speaking, is that electronic music is made with electronic equipment? You know, 313 isn't just informative and entertaining - it's *educational* too! -Original Message- From: spw [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 10 July 2003 15:00 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video make that + synthesizers. That's the premise of all electro and techno music: look I can make futuristic sci-fi sounding music with this mechanical sounding drum machine and electronic sounding on synthesizer which does a poor job imitating acoustic sounds --- spw [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The man machine concept = mechanical sounding drum machines = synthesizers.
RE: (313) LFO are back!
Techno is basically a late 80's early 90's music genre, it's like electro. ahh you're one of those people who encapsulates music to a specific time period. like, jazz is a 1920's genre. rock is 1950's. techno, 1980's. but then you talk about progress, innovation and improvement - -i dont see how these two attitudes fit! you've got such a closemeninded view of when and what this music is, i dont see that you would know progress when you hear it..no offense, but music doesnt exist in a static time frame like that as long as people are still making it -- even when it is consciously harking back to an earlier time. Comparing today's music to techno from 10 or 15 years ago is like comparing the original Star Wars Trilogy to the newer movies like Episode 1. umm, so like a completely relevant comparison, you mean? Is newer better? well no because in this case newer technology was not utilized correctly to improve on an old concept which had room for some improvement. correctly? well la-di-da!! thats awfull rigid. i would say not utilized to its full potential...but then this falls into the mindframe of thinking that if music is innovative, its better. like innovation first, worry about whether its actually aesthetically pleasing second :P what was the correct use of technology? techno might seem like it has an inherent connection to technology, but i disagree with that assumption. techno doesnt need new technology to progress, just ideas. but then i think there are two groups of listeners in techno, those who are more into sound design (technology is important) and those who are into songwriting (technology is irrelevant). i lean towards the latter obviously but i'm a big fan of the first as well...dont think sound design means anything without the songwriting. hmm yeah ok. techno is dead! next: cd's vs vinyl :P jt _ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
RE: (313) Tour de France 03 video
I have been considering the matter further, and have managed to frown my way to a second conclusion: that the premise of all music is look, I can make various melodic and rhythmic sounds with either my voice or with certain physical objects. From that we can deduce that music isn't really all that original. -Original Message- From: robin pinning [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 10 July 2003 15:07 To: Brendan Nelson Cc: spw; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) Tour de France 03 video rock is just the sound of electrified strings, plucked, and acoustic drums hmmm i know i shouldn't rise to it but i can't help meself robin... So today's revelation, broadly speaking, is that electronic music is made with electronic equipment? You know, 313 isn't just informative and entertaining - it's *educational* too! -Original Message- From: spw [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 10 July 2003 15:00 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video make that + synthesizers. That's the premise of all electro and techno music: look I can make futuristic sci-fi sounding music with this mechanical sounding drum machine and electronic sounding on synthesizer which does a poor job imitating acoustic sounds --- spw [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The man machine concept = mechanical sounding drum machines = synthesizers.
Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video
I just made my point with the man machine concept, which is a conventional way of interpreting technology at the time. Their music was not unconventional and abstract like say a Mortin Subotnick. I don't know your age or which particular era of Kraftwerk you're referencing (there is pre-Autobahn material), but just because it wasn't like Subotnick doesn't mean it wasn't unconventional. I was there. It was INDEED unconventional. There were but a very few bands which had any notoriety doing more than dabbling with electronic stuff back then - like Tangerine Dream and Nektar (remember them?) and NOBODY was doing what Kraftwerk was doing, which was quite unconventional whether you were taking the pulse of electronic music, rock music or pop music of the day. I would go as far as saying that there probably wouldn't be a 313 list (or it would have a different shape if there were one) had there been no Kraftwerk. We can speculate endlessly about what might or might not have happened in terms of someone else coming up with their sound - but nobody did and THEY accomplished it. And just because Juan wasn't into Kraftwerk (?) doesn't mean their influence (which is too large to gauge, really) hadn't seeped into the landscape sufficiently to be highly influential. Being my age, I can safely say that their influence is incredible. jeff
RE: (313) LFO are back!
Comparing today's music to techno from 10 or 15 years ago is like comparing the original Star Wars Trilogy to the newer movies like Episode 1. Is newer better? well no because in this case newer technology was not utilized correctly to improve on an old concept which had room for some improvement. ohh wait i think i mistook how you meant this the first time, that you were drawing a metaphor..i kinda dig it, that comparison..over-reliance on technology while missing the things that really made the first ones good...too much process not enough substance etc etc _ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video
look, I'm not starting anything, and this is not a sarcastic question. But, This is why Juan Atkins came up with a similar sound with out even hearing of Kraftwerk. Is this true? just interested to know. Thanks. Alex _ - End of message text This e-mail is sent by the above named in their individual, non-business capacity and is not on behalf of PricewaterhouseCoopers. PricewaterhouseCoopers may monitor outgoing and incoming e-mails and other telecommunications on its e-mail and telecommunications systems. By replying to this e-mail you give your consent to such monitoring
RE: (313) Tour de France 03 video
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 10 July 2003 15:23 look, I'm not starting anything, and this is not a sarcastic question. But, This is why Juan Atkins came up with a similar sound with out even hearing of Kraftwerk. Is this true? just interested to know. I was wondering the same thing. But as jeff pointed out, even if this was actually true, I'd find it *very* doubtful that the influence of Kraftwerk would not have invaded Juan's consciousness in *some* way or another - he must have heard music by other people who had heard Kraftwerk, for example... Brendan
(313) track i.d/LFO/KRAftywerk
No Problem, always happy to help and keep the list On Topic Best DJ Trick goes to Christian - he played one side of a DFA record and toward the end of the song put it through an effects processor to echo the last bit of it, then flipped the record over, mid-set, while the echo was going, and played the other side. Brilliant! I used to do something like this with an old ST when I played live, at the end of the track I'd turn the effects up to allow me to load the next song, god bless working with 512K LFO I've heard a few of the tracks from the new album, nothing like back in the day I'd say, that time has gone and IMHO LFO have moved with the times and are very techno, LFO still makes noises I dream off and continue to push with fantastic arrangements. Kraftwerk We'll looking through my notes, 26yrs ago I got my first Kraftwerk 12 Autobahn, man - that thing change my life and that of many others. As for Juan hearing them, not sure but people like the Human League and Cabs where doing stuff in 74 that isn't too far away. It was more to do with what the equipment could do I believe... MD
RE: (313) Tour de France 03 video
look, I'm not starting anything, and this is not a sarcastic question. But, This is why Juan Atkins came up with a similar sound with out even hearing of Kraftwerk. Is this true? just interested to know. -- This taken from: http://www.jahsonic.com/DetroitTechno.html quote I've always been a music lover, says Juan Atkins. Everything has a subconscious effect on what I do. In the 1970s I was into Parliament, Funkadelic; as far back as '69 they were making records like Maggot Brain, America Eats Its Young. But if you want the reason why that happened in Detroit, you have to look at a DJ called Electrifying Mojo: he had five hours every night, with no format restrictions. It was on his show that I first heard Kraftwerk. /quote He admits that Mojo was the reason for what happened in Detroit, and attributes that to the fact that he first heard Kraftwerk on that show...
RE: (313) Tour de France 03 video
Alex Bond: look, I'm not starting anything, and this is not a sarcastic question. But, This is why Juan Atkins came up with a similar sound with out even hearing of Kraftwerk. Is this true? I think this was eloquently answered by JT just now Alex - something about their influence seeping into the collective unconcious (those latter two are my words, but I think - *think*) that's what JT meant. So we all have no need to exhume any argument about who did what first! ;-) k -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2003 3:23 PM To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video just interested to know. Thanks. Alex _ - End of message text This e-mail is sent by the above named in their individual, non-business capacity and is not on behalf of PricewaterhouseCoopers. PricewaterhouseCoopers may monitor outgoing and incoming e-mails and other telecommunications on its e-mail and telecommunications systems. By replying to this e-mail you give your consent to such monitoring
(313) re: Tour de France 03 video
This is why Juan Atkins came up with a similar sound with out even hearing of Kraftwerk. Is this true? Nope it's not. I remember Atkins quoting where he first heard Kraftwerk (I think it was the Electrifying Mojo show), but it's obvious anyway from the Model 500 releases that he was influenced. Glenn
RE: (313) Tour de France 03 video
I think this was eloquently answered by JT just now Alex - something about their influence seeping into the collective unconcious (those latter two are my words, but I think - *think*) that's what JT meant. So we all have no need to exhume any argument about who did what first! ;-) Indeed - a laundry list could easily be provided of bands who milked what Kraftwerk did. Keep in mind when Autobahn was released. Even if you fast-fwd MANY years after that to the booty dance (Channel 62 anyone? The New Dance Show, e.g.) television shows in Detroit which often played what seemed like endless variations of Numbers, etc. or Mojo himself. New Wave (I hate that term!) was undeniably a big influence on many techno innovators and certainly Kraftwerk loomed large in that musical closet. Bowie, Eno, Byrne, etc. - who all went on to shape the more traditional rock/pop gardens. jeff
RE: (313) Tour de France 03 video
Detroit, you have to look at a DJ called Electrifying Mojo: he had five hours every night, with no format restrictions. It was on his show that I first heard Kraftwerk. Right, cool. Thanks for that. I was interested because I couldn't believe it! It's just well, I dunno, out of the 'belleville 3' I always felt that Juan's music always sounded most overtly european (out of those 3 anyway). so I was double surprised to hear that he hadn't heard Kraftwerk before he started making music. In fact, I would be extremely surprised to hear that people who were into music around that time in the US HADN'T heard Kraftwerk. Especially Trans Europe Express and what the heads in NYC were doing with it. So, I say coughcoughBULLS**Tcough to that statement. erm, I think anyway. _ - End of message text This e-mail is sent by the above named in their individual, non-business capacity and is not on behalf of PricewaterhouseCoopers. PricewaterhouseCoopers may monitor outgoing and incoming e-mails and other telecommunications on its e-mail and telecommunications systems. By replying to this e-mail you give your consent to such monitoring
Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video
On 7/10/03 10:30 AM, Dave Parsons [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Did Juan also hear 'Planet Rock'? as this was relased around the same time as 'Alley's Of Your Mind' on Deep Space... I don't know which one was first. I believe Planet Rock was 1982, shortly after Alleys. A better inspiration for Alleys can be found in Ultravox's Mr. X from 1980. As I hear it, Afrika Bambaataa took inspiration more directly from Kraftwerk, and spawned dozens of imitators, defining the classic electro sound. Pardon the pun, but it's influence may have even cycled back to Kraftwerk for Tour de France. Everyone of a certain age and an interest in dance music heard Planet Rock. It was inescapable in 1982/83. -- im
(313) .mp3 mix
Hi all, Here's a mix I did. Hope the long link doesn't break. If it does you can reach it through the site anyway. Mix: http://www.arcart.org/audio/mixes/Max_Duley_-_Learning_Process_section_3_.mp3 Tracklist: TERRACE - INTO DEEP SPACE (ORLANDO VOORN mix) (EEVO LUTE) LIKE A TIM - GROANING (DJAX-UP-BEATS) MODEL 500 - STARLIGHT (RS) RICK WADE - PRIME TIME (FUNKY CHOCOLATE) HIROAKI IIZUKA - PHYS (CODA) ULTRAHIGH - DO IT TWICE (FORCE INC.) SURGEON - untitled (COUNTERBALANCE) UR - THE ILLUMINATOR (UNDERGROUND RESISTANCE) ROBERT HOOD - SEARCH (HARDWAX) PSI PERFORMER - 1992 (KANZLERAMT) PETER BENISCH - FASTER THAN LIGHT (EEVO LUTE) BANDULU - DOWNWARD GLANCE (INFONET) AIR LIQUIDE - LIQUIDE AIR (XENON remix) (BLUE) GEOFF WHITE / MATHIAS SCHAFFHAUSER - SCUIGL RE. (EDIT) PENINSULA - MY LITTLE FILTERSHOP (EEVO LUTE) STEWART WALKER - OCEAN DRIVE (FORCE INC.) FLORENCE - A TOUCH OF HEAVEN (EEVO LUTE) THE MARTIAN - SEASON OF THE SOLAR WIND (RED PLANET) JOSH ONE - CONTEMPLATION (KING BRITT mix) (ELECTROMATRIX) BALLET MECHANIQUE - VINYL VOYAGE (EEVO LUTE) As with all the other mixes I post, there are better quality 192kbps versions available from me on soulseek and now also soulseek isle. This method allows you to both get a higher quality sound and allows me to keep transfers under my limit. Of course it also means you have to wait longer to get it but if you're patient it's OK. Up to you, I don't mind. Cheers, Max -- http://www.ARCart.org -- -- XS2Mail: Check your mail anywhere http://www.xs2mail.com/
RE: (313) LFO are back!
Comparing today's music to techno from 10 or 15 years ago is like comparing the original Star Wars Trilogy to the newer movies like Episode 1. Is newer better? well no because in this case newer technology was not utilized correctly to improve on an old concept which had room for some improvement. sorry but that's a bad analogy - the new Star Wars suck, not because the technology wasn't used properly (it was), but because the director though he could write the story (and dialogue) as good as the professionals he hired for the first films (he can't). Visually it was cool - substance wise it sucked because the content was bd. So, how does that connect to music? it doesn't If you're saying that LFO should keep working with sub-basses because you think the sound hasn't been fully explored then do it yourself. You seem to know quite a bit about their music so then go there yourself - take the old LFO blueprint and push it further. Maybe you'll write the tune that saves techno. maybe LFO is tired of the sound because everyone at one point in time started doing bleep and bass stuff and it sort of ran its course and then MORPHED into other forms of music - THINGS CHANGE STEVE - GET USED TO IT. If you want to hear sub-basses in new music then check out Nu-School Breaks, drum bass, electronic dub music, stuff like Monolake/Toytronic/Neil Landstrumm/Si Begg/Polmo Polpo/etc. There is plenty of music in a similar vein (albeit updated) to LFO's original sound. Techno is basically a late 80's early 90's music genre, it's like electro. Based in drum machine and synthesizer music so did like an alien from outerspace give you some kind of new technology that allows you to make music from your ass or something? yeah - techno and electro are retro and s, like, 1992 - now we're all into that new ass music - it's really cool because just like the TB303, our asses weren't designed for making those types of noises. Some sub-basses there, wot? MEK spw [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: 313@hyperreal.org gy.net cc: Subject: RE: (313) LFO are back! 07/10/03 08:37 AM --- Matthew MacQueen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: To you. So that is an excuse for LFO to keep making the same tracks over and over? I don't buy it. While diehard fans might want an artist to stay in their personal favorite period (to your ears 'the best' period) forever, the vanguard artists will always want (for better or worse) to push a sound forward, especially in a genre like techno that rewards innovation. You can't freeze a musical time period and put it in a bottle and expect to keep progress at the same time. Get over it. Well not so much making the same tracks just using some of the ideas in LFO's first album such as the sub basslines. What artist like Dave Clarke and Neil Landstrum were doing in the mid 90's are good examples of people using concepts of the older techno sound. Who said his new material is trying to be something else? If it doesn't sound like old LFO and you're going to be unhappy, well start get disappointed now because it probably doesn't. You could take it up with the artist, see how far you get. Ha ha The stupid labels you mention are just words that became labels for artists pushing things in different directions, thus they got named to separate or highlight them. If they didn't move in different directions, we'd all be stuck in a rut and all electronic dance music (or whatever) would sound much more similar even than it does today. Things change, morph, take in old and new influences and move where the artist wants to take things next, get over it. Techno will never go back to the way it was 10-15 years ago, nor does it need to. Techno is basically a late 80's early 90's music genre, it's like electro. Based in drum machine and synthesizer music. Comparing today's music to techno from 10 or 15 years ago is like comparing the original Star Wars Trilogy to the newer movies like Episode 1. Is newer better? well no because in this case newer technology was not utilized correctly to improve on an old concept which had room for
(313) Radio Show - Friday 6pm - 8pm - www.wbar.org
My weekly radio show at WBAR 87.9 FM Barnard College radio, NYC is tomorrow and every Friday night from 6pm to 8pm. Last week I took off due to the holiday. The show can be accessed online at www.wbar.org. I haven't decided what I will be playing tomorrow - maybe disco house or techno. It will be a surprise. You can email me with feedback to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or AIM me at the station at wbarrequest. MP3s from all past shows are available at www.skooch.com and MP3s from this show will be available on Monday. Thanks, Eric
RE: (313) Tour de France 03 video
Apologies if you get this twice, because I recieved it through 313, but it appears no one else did... -Original Message- From: Dennis Donohue [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2003 10:29 AM To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) Tour de France 03 video Alex said: look, I'm not starting anything, and this is not a sarcastic question. But, This is why Juan Atkins came up with a similar sound with out even hearing of Kraftwerk. Is this true? just interested to know. -- Dennis: This taken from: http://www.jahsonic.com/DetroitTechno.html quote I've always been a music lover, says Juan Atkins. Everything has a subconscious effect on what I do. In the 1970s I was into Parliament, Funkadelic; as far back as '69 they were making records like Maggot Brain, America Eats Its Young. But if you want the reason why that happened in Detroit, you have to look at a DJ called Electrifying Mojo: he had five hours every night, with no format restrictions. It was on his show that I first heard Kraftwerk. /quote He admits that Mojo was the reason for what happened in Detroit, and attributes that to the fact that he first heard Kraftwerk on that show...
(313) tonight @ spiral : lansing, mi
come on down to spiral. George Rahme, Ross Katz, Charle George, Scotto and a few more will be playing some records in the main room and bar area.
(313) Ben Wu @ Necto TONIGHT!!
My boy Ben is leaving for San Diego soon, and this is will be his last gig before he leaves. Come check it out! NECTO 516 E. Liberty, Ann Arbor (734)994-5436 http://www.thenecto.com Lust Ben Wu's Farewell Party GUESTS: *Ben Wu (Club246/Detroit - techno,house,breaks) *DJ Teddie (Aquafresh/Detroit - breaks) -18+, 9pm-2am, $5/$8
Re: (313) Tour de France LP
whats up everyone. first of all i want to say the new kraftwerk 03 is amazing! who ever said it sounded likelame basic channel and should get slaped in the face :) my question is the Kraftwerk LP thats comming out going to be reworks of older tracks. has anyone heard the whole LP??? or is there going to be some new goddies on it??? ryan burns From: Ian [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Dave Parsons [EMAIL PROTECTED], Brendan Nelson [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], The Music Institute 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 11:00:04 -0400 On 7/10/03 10:30 AM, Dave Parsons [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Did Juan also hear 'Planet Rock'? as this was relased around the same time as 'Alley's Of Your Mind' on Deep Space... I don't know which one was first. I believe Planet Rock was 1982, shortly after Alleys. A better inspiration for Alleys can be found in Ultravox's Mr. X from 1980. As I hear it, Afrika Bambaataa took inspiration more directly from Kraftwerk, and spawned dozens of imitators, defining the classic electro sound. Pardon the pun, but it's influence may have even cycled back to Kraftwerk for Tour de France. Everyone of a certain age and an interest in dance music heard Planet Rock. It was inescapable in 1982/83. -- im _ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
(313) [313] down Low EP 010.
hey, that dan curtin release is living up to all the praise it's received. it's nice to hear that early poff/metamorphic sound again. by the way... that photo on the EP label reminds me of pictures that some of the replicants in BladeRunner used to carry with them. hmmm. cheers, lrh
Re: (313) Tour de France LP
there are indeed going to be new tracks: from Astralwerks http://www.astralwerks.com/kraftwerk/default.html The album Tour de France Soundtracks will be released on August 19th and features all-new recordings of the single Tour de Fance 2003 alongside brand new compositions as well as a new version of their seminal electro masterpiece Tour de France from 1983. by the way - has anyone else had trouble trying to watch the TdF 03 video today? did they take it down or has there just been that much traffic that it won't download from the Kraftwerk website? MEK ryan burns [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], ail.com [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org cc: 07/10/03 04:24 PMSubject: Re: (313) Tour de France LP whats up everyone. first of all i want to say the new kraftwerk 03 is amazing! who ever said it sounded likelame basic channel and should get slaped in the face :) my question is the Kraftwerk LP thats comming out going to be reworks of older tracks. has anyone heard the whole LP??? or is there going to be some new goddies on it??? ryan burns From: Ian [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Dave Parsons [EMAIL PROTECTED], Brendan Nelson [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], The Music Institute 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Tour de France 03 video Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 11:00:04 -0400 On 7/10/03 10:30 AM, Dave Parsons [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Did Juan also hear 'Planet Rock'? as this was relased around the same time as 'Alley's Of Your Mind' on Deep Space... I don't know which one was first. I believe Planet Rock was 1982, shortly after Alleys. A better inspiration for Alleys can be found in Ultravox's Mr. X from 1980. As I hear it, Afrika Bambaataa took inspiration more directly from Kraftwerk, and spawned dozens of imitators, defining the classic electro sound. Pardon the pun, but it's influence may have even cycled back to Kraftwerk for Tour de France. Everyone of a certain age and an interest in dance music heard Planet Rock. It was inescapable in 1982/83. -- im _ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
