Re: Bug or feature?

[Kirk Brooks via 4D_Tech]

 Miyako,

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 12:33 PM, Keisuke Miyako via 4D_Tech <4d
_t...@lists.4d.com> wrote:

> I don't think that actually proves that JSON Parse is throwing the
> runtime error.
>
​Agreed. But that is where it shows up so it's the place to start.​


rather than looking at the "line of code referenced in the error dialog"
> perhaps you could activate debug log recording in verbose mode (2)
> at the start of the offending method (and disable it a the end)
>
> http://doc.4d.com/4Dv16R5/4D/16-R5/SET-DATABASE-PARAMETER.
> 301-3481818.en.html
>
> source code is stripped in a 4DC, so I wouldn't completely trust the line
> of code printing in the error dialog.
>
​Again, I agree and would do this is to track down an error.

But my fundamental question is how do I validate a string as something that
can be parsed before feeding it to JSON Parse where I'll get a runtime
error?​ That's really all I'm looking for. The solutions I'm finding so far
only work interpreted.


>
> how do you looks at the string to see if it begins with "{" or "[" ?
>
​I use a case statement like:

Case of

:(length($str)<2) ` a valid string could be 2 chars: {} or []

:($str[[1]]="{")

json parse

​:($str[[1]]="[")

json parse array...

End case


Perhaps a better threshold definition would help.
The smallest valid object is, I think: {"a":1} or seven chars.
​The smallest valid array would be  [1] or three chars. So​

Case of

:(length($str)<2) ` a valid string could be 2 chars: {} or []

:($str[[1]]="{")&;(Length($str)<7)`  not possible
:($str[[1]]="{")

json parse

​:($str[[1]]="[")

json parse array...

End case



> besides, you shouldn't have to look at the string in the first place if
> you use JSON Parse with error handling.
>
​I don't understand. ​How can I not look at the strings to see if they are
valid if I'm getting an error attempting to parse them? 4D's parser is
strict - it gags on strings with an extra comma for example:

{"a":1, "b":2,}  but not​
​  {"a":1, "b":2} ​

​I don't have a problem with it being strict I'm just trying to understand
how to protect against runtime errors in this instance. Clearly it's in the
data. But without a way to log the error it's hard to know where to start
looking. Especially when it's the server that gets blocked by one. ​

​Perhaps I'm not handling this sort of problem the way most folks do. If so
it's out of ignorance and not intransigence. I'm happy to be guided
otherwise.

-- 
Kirk Brooks
San Francisco, CA
===

We go vote - they go home
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RE: Bug or feature?

[Chip Scheide via 4D_Tech]

I just today got the -20002 error in a compiled database.
The issue is/was pointers.

I was doing something "fancy", basically the pointer was not pointing to what I 
thought it was, it was actually pointing to a nonexistent variable - via Get 
Pointer.
All of this code worked perfectly interpretedly.
I had to re-wright the method to insure I actually had a pointer to valid 
variable.

So... look at the method for pointer usage.


> Arnaud,
> 
> Thank you, this led me to reinspect my code and I found a couple 
> issues with the original code. The issue I was seeing was actually 
> multiple issues compounded together that led me to think it didn’t 
> work.
> 
> You are correct, using the current Method Name for an error handler 
> does seem to work.
> 
> I still have to use a different method to handle the error because I 
> get a -20002 (accessing a parameter that does not exist) error in 
> compiled mode. I think this -20002 error is related to my usage of $0 
> in the normal context of this method ($0 is not used in the error 
> handler context).  It looks like you also return a Boolean in $0 but 
> you do not mention seeing the -20002 error; weird. Have you have 
> provoked your error handler in compiled mode?
> 
> In either case, I have updated the code on the tech tip so it works 
> in compiled mode now; using a separate method for the error handler.
> 
> -Tim
> 
> 
> 
> 
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RE: Bug or feature?

[Timothy Penner via 4D_Tech]

Arnaud,

Thank you, this led me to reinspect my code and I found a couple issues with 
the original code. The issue I was seeing was actually multiple issues 
compounded together that led me to think it didn’t work.

You are correct, using the current Method Name for an error handler does seem 
to work.

I still have to use a different method to handle the error because I get a 
-20002 (accessing a parameter that does not exist) error in compiled mode. I 
think this -20002 error is related to my usage of $0 in the normal context of 
this method ($0 is not used in the error handler context).  It looks like you 
also return a Boolean in $0 but you do not mention seeing the -20002 error; 
weird. Have you have provoked your error handler in compiled mode?

In either case, I have updated the code on the tech tip so it works in compiled 
mode now; using a separate method for the error handler.

-Tim




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Re: Bug or feature?

[arnaud--- via 4D_Tech]

> Le 2 févr. 2018 à 00:30, Timothy Penner  a écrit :
> 
> Arnaud,
> 
>> Most of the time I do this at beginning:
>> $cmn_t:=Current method name
>> then I use $cmn_t.
>> I don't remember of problems in compiled.
> 
> But do you use the current method to handle errors?
> Either: ON ERR CALL(Current method name)
> Or as you wrote:ON ERR CALL($cmn_t)

Second option:

//IC_here -> bool
//true if 4D Internet Commands is available
C_BOOLEAN($0)
C_TEXT($1)

C_TEXT($nmc_t)
C_TEXT($oldErreur_t)
C_TEXT($error_t)

If (False)
C_BOOLEAN(IC_here ;$0)
C_TEXT(IC_here ;$1)
End if
//_
$nmc_t:=Current method name
Case of
: (Method called on error=$nmc_t)
error_l:=error
Else
error_l:=0
ARRAY LONGINT($num_al;0x)
ARRAY TEXT($nom_at;0x)
PLUGIN LIST($num_al;$nom_at)
If (Find in array($nom_at;"4D Internet Commands")>0)
$oldErreur_t:=Method called on error
ON ERR CALL($nmc_t)
$error_t:=IT_ErrorText (0)  //test IC command
$0:=(error_l=0)
ON ERR CALL($oldErreur_t)
End if
End case
//_

--
Arnaud de Montard 
(sorry, wrong address in previous)




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Re: what version(s) work with which version(s)

[Arnaud de Montard via 4D_Tech]

> Le 1 févr. 2018 à 22:34, Chip Scheide via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> a 
> écrit :
> 
> Given a component, compiled in v13, besides v13, which version(s) will 
> component work with?
> Repeat for v14, v15
> 
> The component contains nothing but 4D code.

I use a the same v12 component with v12 to v15, but all 32b. 

-- 
Arnaud de motard 




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Re: what version(s) work with which version(s)

[Chip Scheide via 4D_Tech]

Thanks!

On Thu, 1 Feb 2018 23:20:28 +, Keisuke Miyako via 4D_Tech wrote:
> in principle (that is, if we just focus on the version number)
> then a v13 compiled component will work in v14 all the way up to v16.
> 
> but there are other factors to consider.
> 
> if you intend to also compile your host application, you need to be 
> aware that
> non-unicode mode is not available in 64-bit (if the component is 
> non-unicode)
> and Mac 64-bit compilation requires the new (14R3 or above) compiler.
> 
> 
http://doc.4d.com/4Dv16R4/4D/16-R4/Architecture-of-64-bit-applications.300-3330499.en.html
> 
> and the standard distribution of 4D v16 on Mac is now 64-bit.
> 
> a v13/14 compiled component would be limited to 32-bit on Mac.
> 
> 
http://doc.4d.com/4Dv15/4D/15.4/Component-installation-and-compatibility.300-3285444.en.html
> 
> so to fully target v15, you should compile with the 64-bit option on v15.
> 
> --
> 
> you might also want to consider that v15 pointers have a different 
> internal representation,
> which is mostly handled transparently, but does alter the behaviour 
> of some functions:
> 
> http://doc.4d.com/4Dv15/4D/15/Unicode-mode-for-methods.300-2018652.en.html
> 
> 2018/02/02 6:34、Chip Scheide via 4D_Tech 
> <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> のメール：
> Given a component, compiled in v13, besides v13, which version(s) will
> component work with?
> Repeat for v14, v15
> 
> 
> 
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RE: Bug or feature?

[Timothy Penner via 4D_Tech]

Arnaud,

> Most of the time I do this at beginning:
>   $cmn_t:=Current method name
> then I use $cmn_t.
> I don't remember of problems in compiled.

But do you use the current method to handle errors?
Either: ON ERR CALL(Current method name)
Or as you wrote:ON ERR CALL($cmn_t)

-Tim




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Re: Where is the client's preferences file

[Arnaud de Montard via 4D_Tech]

> Le 1 févr. 2018 à 22:23, Timothy Penner via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> a 
> écrit :
> 
> Rather than guessing or trying to remember, I find it so much easier to just 
> use this set of commands:
> 
> SHOW ON DISK(Get 4D folder(4D Client database folder);*)

... not in debugger  ;-) 

-- 
Arnaud de Montard 



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Re: Bug or feature?

[Arnaud de Montard via 4D_Tech]

> Le 1 févr. 2018 à 22:14, Timothy Penner via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> a 
> écrit :
> 
>> besides, you shouldn't have to look at the string in the first place if you 
>> use JSON Parse with error handling.
> 
> So it seems that the problem here is that you cannot use the current method 
> name (neither the command nor the string value) to handle errors...

I do like Current method name… 
Most of the time I do this at beginning:
  $cmn_t:=Current method name
then I use $cmn_t. 
I don't remember of problems in compiled. 

-- 
Arnaud de Montard 




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Re: what version(s) work with which version(s)

[Keisuke Miyako via 4D_Tech]

in principle (that is, if we just focus on the version number)
then a v13 compiled component will work in v14 all the way up to v16.

but there are other factors to consider.

if you intend to also compile your host application, you need to be aware that
non-unicode mode is not available in 64-bit (if the component is non-unicode)
and Mac 64-bit compilation requires the new (14R3 or above) compiler.

http://doc.4d.com/4Dv16R4/4D/16-R4/Architecture-of-64-bit-applications.300-3330499.en.html

and the standard distribution of 4D v16 on Mac is now 64-bit.

a v13/14 compiled component would be limited to 32-bit on Mac.

http://doc.4d.com/4Dv15/4D/15.4/Component-installation-and-compatibility.300-3285444.en.html

so to fully target v15, you should compile with the 64-bit option on v15.

--

you might also want to consider that v15 pointers have a different internal 
representation,
which is mostly handled transparently, but does alter the behaviour of some 
functions:

http://doc.4d.com/4Dv15/4D/15/Unicode-mode-for-methods.300-2018652.en.html

2018/02/02 6:34、Chip Scheide via 4D_Tech 
<4d_tech@lists.4d.com> のメール：
Given a component, compiled in v13, besides v13, which version(s) will
component work with?
Repeat for v14, v15



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Re: "Goodbye 4D Write" email

[Tim Nevels via 4D_Tech]

On Feb 1, 2018, at 4:17 PM, Chip Scheide wrote:

> In principle, it should be possible to create a text editor in 4D 
> itself.
> 
> I believe that the 4D design interface is built in/with 4D.  If this is 
> true, you should be able to build a tailorable text editor inside 4D. 
> The Method editor while not perfect, is a usable text editor.
> 
> IF that is true (creating a text editor in 4D) then adding the ability 
> to reference 4D data should not be too hard, not that I am about to do 
> either of these projects :)
> 
> I have no idea about creating anything compatible with Word...


I’ll chime in on this topic because I have 2 clients that make extensive use of 
4D Write. They have “Letter Template” tables with hundreds of 4D Write 
documents they have created over many, many years that are used for all sorts 
of mail merge type things. Exactly what 4D Write was designed to be used for.

For one client, I’ve also done some extensive 4D Write programming using the 
plugin commands to do very complex document creation. I also implemented a 
“print preview” option that allows the user to do a “mail merge” and have it 
create a single, new 4D Write document from all the individual 4D Write 
documents combined so the user can review/edit them before doing the actual 
print. 

This may sound easy, but it’s not when you have to deal with complex 4D Write 
documents that have headers and footers and multiple imbedded images in the 4D 
Write documents. It can be done, but it is a lot of work and makes extensive 
use of many 4D Write Plugin command most have probably never needed to use. But 
they are there to allow doing this kind of complex document manipulation. Will 
4D Write Pro have the same extensive programming capabilities? We don’t know 
yet. 

Of course, some day I will upgrade these clients to use 4D Write Pro. There 
current licenses will work, so no extra expense there. But there will be 
signification expense for the one client that I’ve done the extensive 4D Write 
work for. All my existing code will have to be rewritten. ALL. Every single 
line. And that’s over 50 methods and some with literally hundreds of lines of 
code. Totally new logic too. Just just swapping out old plugin commands with 
equivalent new commands. This will be a big, big job.

Of course, I’m looking forward to rewriting all this code and getting paid $$$ 
for doing it. 

My client is absolutely not looking forward to paying for this. Mainly because 
they will receive no obvious benefits from all the reprogramming. Everything is 
working fine now. After the rewrite to use 4D Write Pro everything should work 
exactly the same and produce documents that look exactly the same. Everyone 
understand this. Nobody likes it. But it’s one of those things that must be 
done at some point in the future when we MUST move to a pure 64bit 4D version. 
That’s the only sales point for this client. It must be done to be 64bit 
compliant. 

I’ve been waiting for 4D Write Pro to mature and provide all the features and 
capabilities in the language to do all the things the current 4D Write plugin 
can do. I have to continue waiting because it is still missing some features. 
Only in the last few months did they finally add command to allow 
programmatically manipulating headers and footers. And placing images on the 
background only appeared recently. 

I remember vividly when 4D Write Pro was first announced at a 4D Summit several 
years ago that one of the bullet points put up on the big screen was “4D Write 
Pro will have ALL THE FEATURES the current 4D Write plugin provides.”  I 
emphasized “all the features” because they made a point of saying that and me 
and several other developers specifically asked about it. FULL FEATURE PARITY 
was the goal. You would be able to open any existing 4D Write document and 
nothing would be lost or changed. Full backwards compatibility if you will. 

We all knew that 4D Write Pro would be released incrementally. As features are 
added and ready they would be released. That’s the new 4D way. Don’t wait 
forever until something is done. Deliver what you can when you can and build on 
it until it is done. 

I have no problem with this type of deployment. In fact, that is exactly how I 
deploy my database applications to clients. Why wait 6 months and get nothing? 
They get something every month for 6 months. Always something new each month 
until the project is done.

I’m guessing that the 4D engineers made a list of every single 4D Write feature 
and plugin command. Then they decided what they would implement first. What was 
required, in their mind. What was needed, in their minds. What was easy. And 
the work began.

The big question now is, what is still on that list of things the 4D Write 
Plugin can do that 4D Write Pro still cannot do? If there is a feature that is 
super hard to implement, and nobody uses or asked for it, why would they want 
to spend time implementing it? So I’m expecting there to be

USB Communication

[Jim Medlen via 4D_Tech]

Is there a way to communicate via USB directly from 4D v15 ?

We have Serial communication set up with traditional serial port COM2
for an external scale.  Most scales now com with USB and I have been
asked to see if I can update our 4D application to communicate with
the scale via USB.


Thanks,

Jim Medlen
Computer & Information Systems
Functional Devices, Inc.
j.med...@functionaldevices.com
phone (765) 883-5538 x 428
fax (765) 883-4262
http://www.functionaldevices.com

This email was transmitted on 100 percent recycled electrons



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what version(s) work with which version(s)

[Chip Scheide via 4D_Tech]

Given a component, compiled in v13, besides v13, which version(s) will 
component work with?
Repeat for v14, v15

The component contains nothing but 4D code.

Thanks

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RE: Where is the client's preferences file

[Timothy Penner via 4D_Tech]

Rather than guessing or trying to remember, I find it so much easier to just 
use this set of commands:

SHOW ON DISK(Get 4D folder(4D Client database folder);*)

This is actually much better because the actual path depends on the name of the 
database and the ip address (or dns name) of the server...

-Tim







-Original Message-
From: 4D_Tech [mailto:4d_tech-boun...@lists.4d.com] On Behalf Of John Baughman 
via 4D_Tech
Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2018 1:18 PM
To: B.Bippus via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com>
Cc: John Baughman 
Subject: Where is the client's preferences file

My  brain is not working this morning. Can’t remember where the preferences for 
a v16 client server client is located. Need to tell someone to throw it out to 
resolve their inability to log in to server because of inability to save the 
preference file.

Thanks,

John


John Baughman
Kailua, Hawaii
(808) 262-0328
john...@hawaii.rr.com





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Where is the client's preferences file

[John Baughman via 4D_Tech]

My  brain is not working this morning. Can’t remember where the preferences for 
a v16 client server client is located. Need to tell someone to throw it out to 
resolve their inability to log in to server because of inability to save the 
preference file. 

Thanks,

John


John Baughman
Kailua, Hawaii
(808) 262-0328
john...@hawaii.rr.com





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RE: Bug or feature?

[Timothy Penner via 4D_Tech]

> besides, you shouldn't have to look at the string in the first place if you 
> use JSON Parse with error handling.

Hmmm, this does seem to work in compiled mode:

C_OBJECT($ob)
C_TEXT($text)
ON ERR CALL("handler")
$text:="{\"OK\": True}" // The JSON is invalid because True should be written 
as true.
$ob:=JSON Parse($text;Is object)
ON ERR CALL("")

But this tech tip doesn't work in compiled mode:
http://kb.4d.com/assetid=77555

However, it seems to be linked to this line in the utility method:
   ON ERR CALL(Current method name)

If I replace that line and have it call a different method for the error 
handler, it seems to work:
   ON ERR CALL("handler")

So it seems that the problem here is that you cannot use the current method 
name (neither the command nor the string value) to handle errors... I now 
wonder if this line of code (ON ERR CALL(Current method name)) ever worked in 
compiled mode - I thought I was being clever when I wrote it but maybe that is 
the source of this issue.

I can update the tech tip to be more clear about this as it does appear to work 
once that change is made.

-Tim



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Re: Intermittent 4D Server / System crashes

[B.Bippus via 4D_Tech]

>
> I have been having  intermittent system crashes. These happen every 2-5
> days.. Never when the system is in use. (8-21:00) Usually  early in the
> morning long after Retrospect has run. Retrospect Client takes about 15-30
> to back up to our main Server.
>

We had a similar issue but with Server on  Windows and Mac Clients. No
Problem on v13. But after Upgrade to v16.1 the 4D Server.exe starts
crashing in the Morning. At last 2 to 3 times a week. Nothing found in the
Logfile, nothing in the info-reports. Nothing that has a relation in the
bug lists. Server is fine since update to 4Dv16.3

Good Luck!
Bernd

2018-01-29 2:50 GMT+01:00 Mitchell Shiller via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com
>:

> Hi,
>
> 4D Server 16.2
> Mac OS  10.13.2 running on a MacMini (Late 2014) 8GB RAM
> External RAID 0+1 Samsung SSD. Using SoftRaid XT
>
> Only applications running are:
> 4D Server (no stored procedures), 15 users
> Carbon Copy Cloner 5.05 (latest) scheduled to run every hour except from
> 22:00 - 6:00 when there are no users logged in)
> Retrospect Client (14.6.0.127 latest) (which backs up a second attached
> drive that contains the 4D backup files at 23:00)
>
> I have been having  intermittent system crashes. These happen every 2-5
> days.. Never when the system is in use. (8-21:00) Usually  early in the
> morning long after Retrospect has run. Retrospect Client takes about 15-30
> to back up to our main Server.
> I get the spinning beach ball of death. So it is not just a 4D crash.
> Nothing is responsive. The computer requires a hard reboot to get going
> again and then I am fine for 2-5 days.
> Usually no users are logged in at the time.
>
> In the console I get the following information from the most recent 2
> crashes;
>
> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/2xejz2dehwqf3wu/AADcablM2L7vzu8uLRxY0-Hxa?dl=0
>
> I have tested the disk integrity, RAM integrity. All OK. I changed to a
> new computer with no change.
> The previous computer was running 10.12
> I contacted the SoftRaid support who downloaded  a crash report and stated
> that the crash is not happening with a disk access to the RAID system.
>
>
> Any idea what the next step should be?
>
> Thanks
>
> Mitch
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Re: ImageCaptureCore - to Variable?

[Keisuke Miyako via 4D_Tech]

the callback signature, as explained the sample DB, is

 $1 C_LONGINT: param_scan_type
 $2 C_TEXT: param_scan_path
 $3 C_BLOB: param_scan_data
 $4 C_TEXT: param_scan_context_info

$4 contains parameters such as

dataSize
dataNumRows
dataStartRow
bytesPerRow
numComponents
bitsPerComponent
bitsPerPixel
fullImageHeight
fullImageWidth
isBigEndian
pixelDataType
colorSyncProfilePath

procedurally creating a picture from these parameters in not impossible,
but it's so much easier to just let the driver create it for you.

> 2018/02/02 0:50、Keith Culotta via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> のメール：
> maybe another time, if I find where it starts.




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Re: Bug or feature?

[Keisuke Miyako via 4D_Tech]

I don't think that actually proves that JSON Parse is throwing the runtime 
error.

rather than looking at the "line of code referenced in the error dialog"
perhaps you could activate debug log recording in verbose mode (2)
at the start of the offending method (and disable it a the end)

http://doc.4d.com/4Dv16R5/4D/16-R5/SET-DATABASE-PARAMETER.301-3481818.en.html

source code is stripped in a 4DC, so I wouldn't completely trust the line of 
code printing in the error dialog.

how do you looks at the string to see if it begins with "{" or "[" ?

you can't look at $json[[1]] because the string could be length 0 (instant 
runtime error).

besides, you shouldn't have to look at the string in the first place if you use 
JSON Parse with error handling.

2018/02/02 1:09、Kirk Brooks via 4D_Tech 
<4d_tech@lists.4d.com> のメール：
​I got a runtime error on the server (v15.5) from a component. The source
of the error is probably attempting to call PARSE Json on a malformed
string (that's the line of code referenced in the error dialog). The method
looks at the string to see if it begins with "{" or "[" but that's all the
validating it does.



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Re: "Goodbye 4D Write" email

[Chip Scheide via 4D_Tech]

In principle, it should be possible to create a text editor in 4D 
itself.

I believe that the 4D design interface is built in/with 4D.  If this is 
true, you should be able to build a tailorable text editor inside 4D. 
The Method editor while not perfect, is a usable text editor.

IF that is true (creating a text editor in 4D) then adding the ability 
to reference 4D data should not be too hard, not that I am about to do 
either of these projects :)

I have no idea about creating anything compatible with Word...

On Thu, 1 Feb 2018 21:18:36 +0100, Peter Bozek via 4D_Tech wrote:
> On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 3:53 PM, Herr Alexander Heintz via 4D_Tech <
> 4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:
> 
>> Come on you plugin developers, give us a real Word processing Plugin and
>> there will be a market for it.
>> Sadly this kind of development is out of my league, or i’d do it.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
> Definitely, do not do it. 4D plugins are currently cut out of system
> interaction. 4D assumes that external area will receive all events - mouse,
> keyboard etc - from 4D.
> 
> On other hand, it is not possible to write a decent text editor that does
> not heavily depend on system services - from measuring text, multi language
> support, font replacement, cursor placement and behaviour etc.. With modern
> operating systems, it means providing system with callback that are called
> as needed. That is extremely difficult, if not outright impossible, with 4D.
> 
> --
> 
> Peter Bozek
> **
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Re: "Goodbye 4D Write" email

[Peter Bozek via 4D_Tech]

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 3:53 PM, Herr Alexander Heintz via 4D_Tech <
4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:

> Come on you plugin developers, give us a real Word processing Plugin and
> there will be a market for it.
> Sadly this kind of development is out of my league, or i’d do it.
>
>
>
>
Definitely, do not do it. 4D plugins are currently cut out of system
interaction. 4D assumes that external area will receive all events - mouse,
keyboard etc - from 4D.

On other hand, it is not possible to write a decent text editor that does
not heavily depend on system services - from measuring text, multi language
support, font replacement, cursor placement and behaviour etc.. With modern
operating systems, it means providing system with callback that are called
as needed. That is extremely difficult, if not outright impossible, with 4D.

--

Peter Bozek
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Re: "Goodbye 4D Write" email

[Alan Chan via 4D_Tech]

Omnis is still around and very alive.

Alan Chan

4D iNug Technical <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> writes:
>How many of you
>used to work using Foxbase, dBase, Omnis, to name a few. Just be greatful
>that the company has been able to keep up with the times and is still a
>viable product.

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Re: Bug or feature?

[John DeSoi via 4D_Tech]

There are no work-arounds for runtime errors. 4D throws up an error dialog and 
allows the end user to decide what to do, even if executing on 4D Server or in 
a web process. 

See feature request and discussion here:

http://forums.4d.com/Post/EN/17994245/1/19128922

John DeSoi, Ph.D.


> On Feb 1, 2018, at 10:09 AM, Kirk Brooks via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> So in a compiled app I don't see how I get to the point of using tools like
> Ob is defined or OK because I don't get past the runtime parsing error. And
> I'm not able to readily determine where the offending string comes from
> because there's no way to log the error. (This particular method is reading
> JSON data coming from outside 4D.)
> 
> I hope I've missed something along the way because I'm not coming up with
> any good workarounds.

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Re: "Goodbye 4D Write" email

[Charles Miller via 4D_Tech]

The more things change the more they stay the same. 4D like any company
makes decision on how to spend money. There are probably not enough users
of 4D write to warrant the cost associated with porting to 64 bit. While
this hurts at one of my customers, think of it this way. How many of you
used to work using Foxbase, dBase, Omnis, to name a few. Just be greatful
that the company has been able to keep up with the times and is still a
viable product.

Just my 2 cents

Regards
Chuck

On Thu, Feb 1, 2018 at 9:53 AM, Herr Alexander Heintz via 4D_Tech <
4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:

> I have been using 4D Write Pro for quite some time now as an editor for
> E-Mails.
> Porting the functionality I had before using 4d Write (mostly dynamic
> access to data) was quite simple.
> Nevertheless, there is quite a lot missing for it to replace 4D Write for
> those who need a „real“ text editor.
> 4D Write has been ignored by 4D for ages and the new 4D Write Pro falls
> short on a lot of things.
> On the other hand, functionality like 4D Write is used only ba a small
> percentage of developers, and I am quite baffled, that it is the only
> special functionality where no plugin developer has come up with something
> optional (OK, 4D Chart qualifies as well).
> Could developing a Plugin like 4D Write with modern functionality really
> bee so difficult as not to be commercially viable?
> I mean there are (huge) plugins for
> - Reporting
> - Drawing
> - Scheduling
> - GridTools
> - Graphics
> - etc
> - etc
>
> Come on you plugin developers, give us a real Word processing Plugin and
> there will be a market for it.
> Sadly this kind of development is out of my league, or i’d do it.
>
> My 2ct
>
> Cheers
> Alex
> **
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Re: Bug or feature?

[Kirk Brooks via 4D_Tech]

Hi Miyako,

On Wed, Jan 31, 2018 at 9:55 PM, Keisuke Miyako via 4D_Tech <
4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:

> JSON Parse error can be handled with ON ERR CALL, because it is not a
> runtime error.
>
> "Current method name" requires range checking (see docs), but that is
> unrelated.
>
> you just have to be aware that OK isn't updated,
> you can consult "OB Is defined" instead.
>

Let me take a step back.

​I got a runtime error on the server (v15.5) from a component. The source
of the error is probably attempting to call PARSE Json on a malformed
string (that's the line of code referenced in the error dialog). The method
looks at the string to see if it begins with "{" or "[" but that's all the
validating it does. And there is an error handler installed to catch and
ignore errors so the server doesn't get blocked.

The docs suggest using JSON Parse in just such a way to validate JSON
strings but don't mention it won't work compiled.

So in a compiled app I don't see how I get to the point of using tools like
Ob is defined or OK because I don't get past the runtime parsing error. And
I'm not able to readily determine where the offending string comes from
because there's no way to log the error. (This particular method is reading
JSON data coming from outside 4D.)

I hope I've missed something along the way because I'm not coming up with
any good workarounds.

-- 
Kirk Brooks
San Francisco, CA
===

*We go vote - they go home*
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Re: Intermittent 4D Server / System crashes

[Mitchell Shiller via 4D_Tech]

Thanks for the suggestions:

1) Upgrading to 16.3 HF1. I will do this but none of the reported bug fixes 
seems to address the problem.
2) This is a 32 bit application
2) Memory setting. Since this is 32 bit on OSX my understanding is that the 
memory allocation is fixed by the OS at around 2 GB. I usually just keep the 
default settings.
3) I have looked at the Console at Errors and Faults and there is nothing 
reported.

Plan.
I am going to run a non production clone of the server on a mac mini running 
10.11 and see if that works.
I will report back.

Mitch
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Re: ImageCaptureCore - to Variable?

[Keith Culotta via 4D_Tech]

maybe another time, if I find where it starts.

> On Jan 31, 2018, at 6:46 PM, Keisuke Miyako via 4D_Tech 
> <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:
> 
> but you receive binary RGB data in chunks,
> and you have to build your own JPG, PNG, TIFF, whatever, by code.
> 
> do you really want to go down that path?

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Re: Styled text to clipboard - v16

[Jeremy Roussak via 4D_Tech]

Miyako, you are (as ever) a mine of valuable information. Thanks.

Jeremy


Jeremy Roussak
j...@mac.com



> On 1 Feb 2018, at 09:29, Keisuke Miyako via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> that would be INVOKE ACTION
> 
> http://doc.4d.com/4Dv16R4/4D/16-R4/INVOKE-ACTION.301-3316995.en.html
> 
> see also:
> 
> https://blog.4d.com/discover-and-use-standard-actions/
> 
> https://blog.4d.com/more-standard-actions-for-styled-text/
> 
> https://blog.4d.com/create-your-own-interface-for-4d-write-pro/
> 
> 2018/02/01 19:32、Jeremy Roussak via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> のメール：
> Does Write Pro have an equivalent of WR EXECUTE COMMAND? Have I just missed 
> something easy?
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Re: "Goodbye 4D Write" email

[Herr Alexander Heintz via 4D_Tech]

I have been using 4D Write Pro for quite some time now as an editor for E-Mails.
Porting the functionality I had before using 4d Write (mostly dynamic access to 
data) was quite simple.
Nevertheless, there is quite a lot missing for it to replace 4D Write for those 
who need a „real“ text editor.
4D Write has been ignored by 4D for ages and the new 4D Write Pro falls short 
on a lot of things.
On the other hand, functionality like 4D Write is used only ba a small 
percentage of developers, and I am quite baffled, that it is the only special 
functionality where no plugin developer has come up with something optional 
(OK, 4D Chart qualifies as well).
Could developing a Plugin like 4D Write with modern functionality really bee so 
difficult as not to be commercially viable?
I mean there are (huge) plugins for
- Reporting
- Drawing
- Scheduling
- GridTools
- Graphics
- etc
- etc

Come on you plugin developers, give us a real Word processing Plugin and there 
will be a market for it.
Sadly this kind of development is out of my league, or i’d do it.

My 2ct

Cheers
Alex
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Re: "Goodbye 4D Write" email

[Richard Wright via 4D_Tech]

If 4D Write Pro doesn’t, and won’t, have all the features of 4D Write then 4D 
should give it a different name instead of pretending that it’s a replacement. 
I’ve been totally baffled by this seemingly endless piecemeal rollout of a 
“pro” product. I remember getting an email a couple years ago announcing the 
spectacular ability of 4D Write Pro to save documents!! What’s the point? 
Why not finalize it and then announce it? Eventually 32 bit support is going 
away and that means 4D Write is going away and if 4D Write Pro isn’t going to 
have all the features then we ought to be told the details now so we can make 
the appropriate plans. Here’s my feature request: I want 4D Write Pro to have 
all the features of 4D Write.


Richard Wright
DataDomain
rwri...@datadomainsoftware.com


> Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2018 22:49:11 +
> From: Brian Young 
> 
> Hi Don,
> 
> If you haven’t already, please add your concern about "Export to MS Word" to 
> the 4D Forum where the Product team can see it and respond. Here is a feature 
> request you can up-vote:
> 
> http://forums.4d.com/Post/EN/20813501/1/20814772#20814772
> 
> Among the posts linked in the email today is one that gives example code to 
> build a toolbar similar to the one in 4D Write:
> 
> https://blog.4d.com/4d-write-like-toolbar-example-for-4d-write-pro/
> 
> We are working to make sure you and the 4D community are aware of the 
> resources already available by bundling 4D Write Pro related info together.
> 
> my very best
> 
> -Brian



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Re: Styled text to clipboard - v16

[Keisuke Miyako via 4D_Tech]

that would be INVOKE ACTION

http://doc.4d.com/4Dv16R4/4D/16-R4/INVOKE-ACTION.301-3316995.en.html

see also:

https://blog.4d.com/discover-and-use-standard-actions/

https://blog.4d.com/more-standard-actions-for-styled-text/

https://blog.4d.com/create-your-own-interface-for-4d-write-pro/

2018/02/01 19:32、Jeremy Roussak via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> のメール：
Does Write Pro have an equivalent of WR EXECUTE COMMAND? Have I just missed 
something easy?



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Re: Styled text to clipboard - v16

[Jeremy Roussak via 4D_Tech]

Pat,

Thanks, but I tried that. I ended up pasting plain text with style tags in it. 
I’m obviously doing something wrong.

Jeremy

Jeremy Roussak
j...@mac.com



> On 1 Feb 2018, at 07:35, Pat Bensky via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:
> 
> Jeremy,
> Maybe *ST Get Text* does what you need?
> 
> Pat
> 
> On 1 February 2018 at 10:32, Jeremy Roussak via 4D_Tech <
> 4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:
> 
>> I want to put styled text (nothing complex: just some in italic and some
>> in bold) onto the clipboard so that I can paste it into Word or Mail or
>> some such. I used to do it by using Write: make an offscreen area, put the
>> text in it, style it and then do
>> 
>> WR EXECUTE COMMAND ($area;wr cmd copy)
>> 
>> to get it onto the clipboard.
>> 
>> Does Write Pro have an equivalent of WR EXECUTE COMMAND? Have I just
>> missed something easy?
>> 
>> Jeremy
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Re: Styled text to clipboard - v16

[Pat Bensky via 4D_Tech]

Jeremy,
Maybe *ST Get Text* does what you need?

Pat

On 1 February 2018 at 10:32, Jeremy Roussak via 4D_Tech <
4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:

> I want to put styled text (nothing complex: just some in italic and some
> in bold) onto the clipboard so that I can paste it into Word or Mail or
> some such. I used to do it by using Write: make an offscreen area, put the
> text in it, style it and then do
>
> WR EXECUTE COMMAND ($area;wr cmd copy)
>
> to get it onto the clipboard.
>
> Does Write Pro have an equivalent of WR EXECUTE COMMAND? Have I just
> missed something easy?
>
> Jeremy
>
>
>
> Jeremy Roussak
> j...@mac.com
>
>
>
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-- 
*
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Styled text to clipboard - v16

[Jeremy Roussak via 4D_Tech]

I want to put styled text (nothing complex: just some in italic and some in 
bold) onto the clipboard so that I can paste it into Word or Mail or some such. 
I used to do it by using Write: make an offscreen area, put the text in it, 
style it and then do

WR EXECUTE COMMAND ($area;wr cmd copy)

to get it onto the clipboard.

Does Write Pro have an equivalent of WR EXECUTE COMMAND? Have I just missed 
something easy?

Jeremy



Jeremy Roussak
j...@mac.com



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Re: Re(2): "Goodbye 4D Write" email

[Arnaud de Montard via 4D_Tech]

> Le 1 févr. 2018 à 02:28, Don Lapin via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> a écrit 
> :
> 
> Hi Brian,
> 
> You did not answer the question regarding whether 4D will continue to work 
> with 4D Write (the regular version, not the Pro). That's my primary concern 
> at the moment. 

Hi Don, 
I heard that in last summit in Paris (on stage, sounds "official"): there will 
never be a 4d write 64bits, 4d write is no longer supported, go to WP, we do 
our best to make it better every day. 
So the response to your question is in another: "how many time can I still use 
32b 4D apps". Apple said next MacOS won't.  

-- 
Arnaud de Montard 




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Re(2): "Goodbye 4D Write" email

[Don Lapin via 4D_Tech]

Hi Alfonso,

I agree with most of what you state here. My customers for this application are 
on Windows, so I'm not as concerned about the 64-bit thing. Apple's always 
dropping "last year's" technology, but Windows maintains good compatibility, 
even with their 64-bit systems.

Because the Write Pro product suffers from such a paucity of usefulness, I am 
hoping that they will at least allow plain 4D Write to run as a 32-bit plug in. 
Under present circumstances a "Goodbye 4D Write" email today seemed a bit 
off-key.

Thanks for responding,
Don


>Hi Don,
>
>I agree with you that 4D Write PRO can't replace today 4D Write.
>But, forget trying that 4D mantain 4D Write. Because MacOs High Sierra 
>is the last Mac Os working compatible 32 bits. So, all applications must 
>be 64 bits, in the future.
>4D Write PRO borned 64 bits for that reason.
>We have to ask 4D to get 4D Write PRO as close to 4D Write (commands), 
>as soon as possible.
>There are great commands in 4D Write like "WR Direct find" . Would it be 
>on 4D Write PRO ?
>
>Idemsoft
>Alfonso

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Re: "Goodbye 4D Write" email

[Bernd Fröhlich via 4D_Tech]

Don Lapin:

> You did not answer the question regarding whether 4D will continue to work 
> with 4D Write (the regular version, not the Pro). That's my primary concern 
> at the moment.

From my understanding the "old" 4D Write will continue working in 32Bit 
versions of 4D. There will be no 64Bit versions of 4D Write.

I sincerely hope that V17 and maybe V18 will still be available in 32Bit 
versions so we can continue using Write until WritePro will offer all the 
features of the old Write.

One thing that is missing for me is freely placing pictures on a page.

Rewriting all the old code will be a PITA for sure, but I guess it will have to 
be done sometimes in the next few years.
Fine with me, but I can only rewrite my code if the new version covers all the 
options that exist in the old version.
My users rightfully would complain if a new version would miss some features 
that have been there for decades.

Greetings from Germany,
Bernd Fröhlich
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Re: "Goodbye 4D Write" email

[Alfonso Zafon via 4D_Tech]

Hi Don,

I agree with you that 4D Write PRO can't replace today 4D Write.
But, forget trying that 4D mantain 4D Write. Because MacOs High Sierra 
is the last Mac Os working compatible 32 bits. So, all applications must 
be 64 bits, in the future.

4D Write PRO borned 64 bits for that reason.
We have to ask 4D to get 4D Write PRO as close to 4D Write (commands), 
as soon as possible.
There are great commands in 4D Write like "WR Direct find" . Would it be 
on 4D Write PRO ?


Idemsoft
Alfonso

El 01/02/2018 a las 2:28, Don Lapin via 4D_Tech escribió:

Hi Brian,

You did not answer the question regarding whether 4D will continue to work with 
4D Write (the regular version, not the Pro). That's my primary concern at the 
moment.

Since my rep told me that it would continue to work at the last developer event in San 
Jose, I don't understand why I would be getting a "Goodbye" email at this 
point. Was he wrong? Did I understand him incorrectly? This product is based on the 
functionality and capability of 4D Write, as painful as it was to write those lines of 
code.

With regard to Pro, last I looked it had a ruler which blocks a much larger 
amount of the writing area (*thick* vertically), making the writing area too 
small on detailed forms.

The existing 4D Write menus and toolbar use about 2.5 cm on the form, leaving 
about 8.5 cm of useful area (before zoom) for composing. The example you linked 
to, of a 4D Write Pro toolbar and menu combination, is about twice as thick. I 
think I have seen that example before.

How would someone be able to use a word processing area over half of which is 
taken over by those thick elements?

Fold in:
  
- the apparent absence of the rich command set available in 4D Write, particularly commands involving procedural generation of forms and style sheets;

- the absence of control for placing graphics on forms;
- the absence of Word-compatible style sheets;
- the absence of a Word export;

...what is left that's of any utility?

Given how intuitive the existing 4D Write interface is for the average, 
word-processing-type user, why would 4D abandon that? Why do the 4D developers, 
rather than the developers of 4D, need to spend hours trying to reproduce a 
detailed, compact interface that was already in the product?

Please find some answers if you can. A negative answer to the first one would 
make a product that I have spent most of my time working on since early 2015 
become useless in new versions of 4d. These are all Windows users, so I have no 
interest in 64-bit stuff.


Thank you for responding,
Don




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