Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband (again)

[Frank Nordberg]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

I spent an hour or so exploring Folkband the other day. It's
entrancing.


Glad to hear :-)

>

The flute division in "English Country Garden" is a
particular inspiration.


Actually that's one of the few things I kept more or less unchanged from 
the *old* Folkband!


 >Just email me and I'll give you a permanent username and
 >password.

Please. Lemme have it!


Sent offlist.


Frank Nordberg
http://www.musicaviva.com



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[abcusers] Re: Folkband (again)

[DavBarnert]

I spent an hour or so exploring Folkband the other day. It's
entrancing. The flute division in "English Country Garden" is a
particular inspiration.

 >Just email me and I'll give you a permanent username and
 >password.

Please. Lemme have it!

David Barnert
Albany, NY
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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[John Walsh]

Jack Campin writes:

>"Gilderoy" gets around... there's probably no other tune in the British
>Isles with so many descendants.  "Gilderoy" *means* "red haired boy".
>

Unless, of course, it dates all the way back to Gilles de Rais, in
which case it means "Bluebeard".

Cheers,
John Walsh

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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[Frank Nordberg]

Laurie Griffiths wrote:
> 
> Frank wrote "... (BTW, I thought everybody in Britain was force fed
> Shakespeare during
> elemntary school the same way us poor Norwegians are force fed Ibsen!)"
> 
> Yes, indeed.  In an education that was about as far biased towards sciences
> as it could be I was nevertheless force-fed Henry IV, Henry V, Lear and
> Macbeth, there may have been others too, but if we did 12th Night then I
> have forgotten it.  Also I was young and pitifully innocent and missed
> almost all of the dirty jokes.

So, basically what you're saying is that you were forced to read all the
heavy stuff, but that they skipped all the fun plays Shakespeare wrote?
Sad, but not too uncommon a story :-(

Frank
http://www.musicaviva.com
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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[Frank Nordberg]

Laura Conrad wrote:
> 
> That was my problem; we did read 12th night, but I missed the dirty
> jokes.  As well as all the stuff about dancing.

Speaking of jokes (and returning to the original topic): I just added a
new piece to the folkband site; a reel called "Johnny with the queer
thing". Does anybody have *any* idea what that title might mean?


Frank
http://www.musicaviva.com


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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[Laura Conrad]

> "Laurie" == Laurie Griffiths <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:


Laurie> Also I was young and pitifully innocent and missed almost
Laurie> all of the dirty jokes.

That was my problem; we did read 12th night, but I missed the dirty
jokes.  As well as all the stuff about dancing.

-- 
Laura (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] , http://www.laymusic.org/ )
(617) 661-8097  fax: (801) 365-6574 
233 Broadway, Cambridge, MA 02139

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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[Laurie Griffiths]

Frank wrote "... (BTW, I thought everybody in Britain was force fed
Shakespeare during
elemntary school the same way us poor Norwegians are force fed Ibsen!)"

Yes, indeed.  In an education that was about as far biased towards sciences
as it could be I was nevertheless force-fed Henry IV, Henry V, Lear and
Macbeth, there may have been others too, but if we did 12th Night then I
have forgotten it.  Also I was young and pitifully innocent and missed
almost all of the dirty jokes.

L.

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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[Frank Nordberg]

Laurie Griffiths wrote:
> 
> Frank asked "A rant? Is there actually a dance called that???
> (Reminds me of what Shakespeare says about the branle, btw...)..."
> 
> And what did Shakespeare say about the branle? (I know that one meaning of
> the French verb "branler" is not polite to mention here).

Twelfth night.
Just some silly pun on "dancing the French brawl" and "brawling in
French" to pick up girls.

(BTW, I thought everybody in Britain was force fed Shakespeare during
elemntary school the same way us poor Norwegians are force fed Ibsen!)

Frank
http://www.musicaviva.com

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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[Laurie Griffiths]

Frank asked "A rant? Is there actually a dance called that???
(Reminds me of what Shakespeare says about the branle, btw...)..."

And what did Shakespeare say about the branle? (I know that one meaning of
the French verb "branler" is not polite to mention here).

A rant is danced in syncopated 3 time like a polka is the rhythm goes
1 - 2 - 3 - - - 1 - 2 - 3 - - -
the steps vary, here's a sample.

1 step onto your right toe to the left of your left toe (legs crossed)
2 step onto your left foot (start uncrossing)
3 step on right foot back in normal position
(4) hop on right foot before ...
1 step onto your left toe to the right of your left toe (legs crossed other
way)
2 step onto your right foot (start uncrossing)
3 step on left foot back in normal position
(4) hop on left foot before repeating the whole thing.

I recall a dance a Sidmouth where the first movement of the dance was a 3
person hey, so you had to move in a figure of 8 and you had 16 bars to do it
in.  Of course when you are ranting you tend to go very slowly (you *can*
move quickly but it's tricky with the leg crossing).  At the last moment,
just before the music started, the caller said "Oh, and it's a rant!".  Most
of the dancers began ranting.  Those who didn't know finished the move in
about 6 bars (12 steps will do it) and then wondered what on earth everyone
else was doing!

It can be done to a waltz (in fact a group of dancers that I play for do
this occasionally) by taking the hop out.

Some other variants:
1. Touch right toe on ground either to left of left or in front
2. touch  right toe on ground out to the right
3. right foot to normal position
(4) hop on right or just wait
then same again, opposite feet.

Back-rant: essentially the same as any of the above, but reversed
front-to-back.

I'm not sure whether the term "ranting and raging" meaning very angry refers
to the dance or vice versa, but the ranting dance definitely involves much
hopping about!

A couple of well known rant tunes are "Soldier's Joy", "Morpeth rant".
They all have places where the tune definitely goes BUMP BUMP BUMP.

Laurie Griffiths
(Fiddler for "Southern Lights" dance team).

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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[Jack Campin]

>> > King of the Fairies English?!
>> I thought it was Irish, but it's a variant of an older tune, "Gilderoy",
>> which is first documented from Scotland but could equally well be English.
> Hold on, Jack! Last time we had this folkband discussion, you said that
> *Red-haired boy* was the same tune as Gilderoy!

"Gilderoy" gets around... there's probably no other tune in the British
Isles with so many descendants.  "Gilderoy" *means* "red haired boy".

Its origins are pretty mystifying.  The original text is in English, but
written in a style that exactly mirrors a Gaelic lament genre used for
other MacGregors (the McGregors specialized in very long and very vague
poems in an archaic mediaeval manner).  But the tune has no older Gaelic
parallel.  So it looks like whoever put it together was an impressively
skilled bilingual scholar.  There are no other examples I can think of
where Gaelic content has crossed over into English or Scots folksong -
generally if a Gaelic tune gets used for a Scots song, the Scots text
has no relation at all to the Gaelic.


-
Jack Campin  *   11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU, Scotland
tel 0131 660 4760  *  fax 0870 055 4975  *  http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/jack/
food intolerance data & recipes, freeware Mac logic fonts, and Scottish music


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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[John Chambers]

Anselm writes:
| John Chambers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
| > Part of the story was that if you played  the  King's  tune
| > three  times,  he  would  appear.   He  would usually be in
| > disguise, of course, so you wouldn't necessarily realize he
| > was  present.  And summoning the Fairy King isn't something
| > that one does frivolously.  If he doesn't enjoy your event,
| > he  has  ways of making you sorry you summoned him.
|
| Of course this doesn't apply to practising the tune; the Fairy King
| likes his music played properly and looks benevolently on those who
| apply the necessary diligence ...

Of course. In fact, there are a lot of stories about people
learning  tunes from the wee folk.  They must enjoy hearing
humans play their music.

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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[Frank Nordberg]

Jack Campin wrote:
> 
> > King of the Fairies English?!
> 
> I thought it was Irish, but it's a variant of an older tune, "Gilderoy",
> which is first documented from Scotland but could equally well be English.

Hold on, Jack! Last time we had this folkband discussion, you said that
*Red-haired boy* was the same tune as Gilderoy!


Frank

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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[Anselm Lingnau]

John Chambers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Part of the story was that if you played  the  King's  tune
> three  times,  he  would  appear.   He  would usually be in
> disguise, of course, so you wouldn't necessarily realize he
> was  present.  And summoning the Fairy King isn't something
> that one does frivolously.  If he doesn't enjoy your event,
> he  has  ways of making you sorry you summoned him.

Of course this doesn't apply to practising the tune; the Fairy King
likes his music played properly and looks benevolently on those who
apply the necessary diligence ...

Anselm
-- 
Anselm Lingnau .. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
The basis of all excellence is truth: he that professes love ought to feel its
power.  -- Samuel Johnson, _Lives of the Poets_


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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[joe mc cool]

John Chambers writes:

 > Well, the Irish definitely claim it,  and  there's  a  step

It also _sounds_ Irish.

Great tune, irrespective.

Joe Mc Cool
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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[John Chambers]

Frank writes:
| [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
| > King of the Fairies English?!
|
| Is it Irish? I know the book I got the tune from is wrong about the
| nationalitie of some tunes.

Well, the Irish definitely claim it,  and  there's  a  step
dance  to  it that is part of the Standard Repertoire among
Irish step dancers.  Of course, this says little about what
its actual origin might be. It could have been brought back
by some sailor from Greece or Java 400 years ago.

| > And so jolly.
|
| I'd like to play it a bit slower too, but it's a hornpipe, isn't it?

The Irish step dance is a hornpipe.

Some years back, in a place I used  to  live,  I  sometimes
played  whistle  as  backup to an Irish storyteller sort of
fellow.  One of his stories  was  about  the  King  of  the
Fairies, so of course we used the obvious tune. I played it
as a slow air first, then as a march, and then as a  bouncy
hornpipe.   This fit the story, and the tune sounds good in
all three rhythms.

Part of the story was that if you played  the  King's  tune
three  times,  he  would  appear.   He  would usually be in
disguise, of course, so you wouldn't necessarily realize he
was  present.  And summoning the Fairy King isn't something
that one does frivolously.  If he doesn't enjoy your event,
he  has  ways of making you sorry you summoned him.  During
the course of the story, I did play the tune  three  times,
and  presumably this fact was not lost on the audience.  So
if there was anyone there that you didn't know,  maybe  you
should make sure that he (she?) has a good time.  And since
the King is known to enjoy good music and dance parties ...

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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[Jack Campin]

> The up tempo feel of The Girl I Left Behind Me (known as Brighton Camp
> around here, I live ten miles from Brighton) is anticipation -
>And if the night be ever so dark
>Or ever so wet and windy
>I must return to the Brighton Camp
>And the girl I left behind me.
> Adjust windy to rhyme. That was the pronunciation in Shakespeares time.

It's a good bit later than that - Seven Years War, I think.  See
Lewis Winstock, "Songs and Music of the Redcoats", for the story.
OED says the modern pronunciation of "wind" dates to the eighteenth
century, which would fit.

> King of the Fairies English?!

I thought it was Irish, but it's a variant of an older tune, "Gilderoy",
which is first documented from Scotland but could equally well be English.

There are stacks of variants in the same family: "The Cuckoo's Nest"
(a.k.a. "Come Ashore Jolly Tar With Your Trousers On") is another one,
which if I remember right is traceable back to Elizabethan England.
More recent ones are "Dinky's Reel" and "Loch Torridon".


> I played this last night along  with about twenty other people in a
> warm friendly pub and I still felt shivers down my spine.  This is
> a tune you do not play at midnight in a churchyard under a full moon
> for fear of who (or what) you might summon up.

I'd never thought of it like that (usually played pretty fast round
here); it's a conception that adds quite a bit to the tune.  Will try
playing it slower and more reflectively in future.

===  ===


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Re: [abcusers] Re: Folkband

[Frank Nordberg]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> Nice work Frank.

Thanks, Bryan :-)

[The Girl I Left Behind Me]

OK. Seems I misunderstand the whole story, then.

> 
> Technical point.  Morpeth Rant isn't a hornpipe.  It's a rant,

A rant? Is there actually a dance called that???

(Reminds me of what Shakespeare says about the branle, btw...)

> 
> King of the Fairies English?!

Is it Irish? I know the book I got the tune from is wrong about the
nationalitie of some tunes. 

>
> And so jolly.

I'd like to play it a bit slower too, but it's a hornpipe, isn't it?

---

I forgot to mention one slight detail in my last posting, btw:

For the sake of your own reputation as a musician and mine as an
arranger, *never* play the Amazing grace arrangement in public unless:

  a) everybody in the audience are well and truly drunk.

  *or:*

  b) you're a bunch of really 'dorable children and the audience
 consists mainlky of parents and old aunties.



Frank
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[abcusers] Re: Folkband

[Bryancreer]

Nice work Frank.

The up tempo feel of The Girl I Left Behind Me (known as Brighton Camp around 
here, I live ten miles from Brighton) is anticipation -

And if the night be ever so dark
Or ever so wet and windy
I must return to the Brighton Camp
And the girl I left behind me.

Adjust windy to rhyme. That was the pronunciation in Shakespeares time.

Technical point.  Morpeth Rant isn't a hornpipe.  It's a rant, more like a 
reel.

King of the Fairies English?!  And so jolly.  I played this last night along 
with about twenty other people in a warm friendly pub and I still felt 
shivers down my spine.  This is a tune you do not play at midnight in a 
churchyard under a full moon for fear of who (or what) you might summon up.

Bryan

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