Re: [AI] Banking facilities to the visually challenged

[Satendra Singh]

Thanks for the nice blog Mr Banker. The guidelines are all there but who
will implement? On 'World Disability Day' last year, Times of India
published my RTI expose that RBI doesnot have a list of all 'accessible'
ATMs in India.

Sharing with the larger group that article below:

Few ATMs disabled-friendly
Manash Pratim Gohain, TNN Dec 3, 2012, 02.20AM IST

NEW DELHI: Despite directions from the Reserve Bank of India in 2009 and
the chief commissioner for persons with disabilities writing to the
department of banking operations and development in December 2011 to make
automated teller machines in the city disabled-friendly, not much action
seems to have taken place on the ground. RTI applications to the RBI have
revealed it has no information on the matter.

Section 46 of the Persons with Disabilities Act 1995 provides for
non-discrimination against persons with disabilities in the built
environment and the RBI, in a master circular on July 1, 2009, advised
banks to provide all ATMs with ramps so that wheelchair users and disabled
can easily access them. Arrangements should be such that the height of the
ATM is not an impediment for a wheelchair user.

According to the coordinator of the enabling unit at University College of
Medical Sciences, Delhi University, Dr Satendra Singh, India has ratified
the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities
and Article 9 (on accessibility) is legally binding. "It is the
responsibility of the RBI to implement its circular. But it does not have
any information on ATMs and their accessibility status," he said. Singh,
himself, suffers from 70% locomotor disability.

"The ATM near my workplace is inaccessible not only to disabled but also
senior citizens. A large population of the country comprises the aged who,
too, have mobility problems," Singh added.

To a query to the RBI via an RTI application filed by Singh seeking the
number of ATMs made accessible to disabled, the reply sent on October 31,
2012, states "this department has no infor -mation". To another query on
action taken by the department of banking operations and development
following the RBI's letter to the department of banking supervision in
January 2012 to ensure compliance by banks, the reply stated deputy chief
commissions, office of the chief commissioner for persons with disabilities
and ministry of social justice, government of India, have been advised to
look into the matter.

Nripendra Pathak, a disabled scholar from Jawaharlal Nehru University,
filed a complaint to the chief commissioner for persons with disabilities
on ATM inaccessibility in October 2011. The CCPD issued an order in
December 2011 to "to ensure the ATMs are made accessible to persons with
disabilities in a time-bound manner". In the RTI reply in this specific
case, no action has been cited.


Source:
http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2012-12-03/delhi/35570203_1_accessibility-status-persons-with-disabilities-act-locomotor-disability

-- 
Dr Satendra Singh, MD, FSS
Assistant Professor of Physiology
University College of Medical Sciences
& GTB Hospital, Delhi, India-110095
Coordinator, Equal Opportunity Cell
Founder, Infinite Ability
The Enablist (blog) 

Infinite Ability: exploring disAbility through
creativity
Enabling Unit, EOC, UCMS 
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[AI] Banking facilities to the visually challenged

[Mr. Banker]

Banking facilities to the visually challenged

Often persons with visual disabilities face difficulty activating
facilities such as ATM facility, Net banking facility etc. Therefore,
this blog is providing the Circular DBOD. No. Leg BC. 91
/09.07.005/2007-08 dated June 4, 2008, wherein it is clearly stated
that the visually impaired are entitled to use these facilities
without any discrimination.

http://visuallyimpairedbankers.blogspot.in/

-- 
Looking for banking material?
http://visuallyimpairedbankers.blogspot.in/

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2. AI cannot be held liable for any commission/omission based on the mails sent 
through this mailing list..

Re: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged

[Harish Kotian]

Hi

Using thumb impression can no longer be an excuse. Biometrics has advanced 
considerably and  all pervasive. In fact most of the newer lap tops have finger 
print sensor built in. CMC has also developed this technology especially 
considering our requirement in mind.

So, this excuse too holds no water.

Harish
- Original Message - 
From: "Vidya" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 11:07 PM
Subject: Re: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged


> The cases of denial by banks I have heard are mostly not because someone is 
> blind, but because one can't sign.
> I know several blind persons with all those facilities only because they 
> could sign. I think the circular should clearly state that they should allow 
> all the facilities even if the prospective client prefers thumb impression 
> over signatures.
> 
> - Original Message - 
> From: "Pamnani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: 
> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 9:06 AM
> Subject: Re: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged
> 
> 
>> Rajesh and others,
>>
>> Just like to clarify the whole matter. I met Mrs. Usha Thorat, Deputy
>> Governor and  Kaza Sudhakra, Cheif General Manager on Monday 2nd June and
>> discussed the entire matter with them in detail. It took nearly 2 
>> hours.Mrs.
>> Thorat read out the draft circular and I suggested some modifications. We
>> also discussed the problem with currency notes and coins. The RBI
>> understands our problems and is working towards resolving them one at a
>> time. This circular is just the first step. Any visually challenged person
>> can show this circular to a troublesome bank manager and demand his 
>> rights.
>> I too know that unless the procedure is spelt out the banks will still 
>> give
>> us trouble. I am drafting the details on the issues that I had raised in 
>> my
>> mail last week. I am meeting Mr. Sinor ,Chairman of Indian Banks
>> Association, on Monday 9th June and shall revert to this group after the
>> meeting. If I get a chance i will circulate the memorandum tomorrow or on
>> Monday for your comments.
>> Thanks to all who have suffered at the hands of the banks and those who 
>> have
>> given me their inputs.
>>
>> Kanchan Pamnani
>> Advocate & Solicitor
>> 9, Suleman Chambers,
>> Battery Street, Colaba,
>> Mumbai - 400 039.
>>
>>
>>
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: "Rajesh Asudani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: 
>> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 1:04 PM
>> Subject: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged
>>
>>
>>> Surely, the development is positive and we must congratulate ourselves 
>>> for
>>> it.
>>>
>>> However, I do not see any reason for jubilance for a multiplicity of
>>> reasons:
>>>
>>> firstly, it has taken long long time to come, 45 days mentioned in CCPD
>>> judgment have long since been over!
>>>
>>> Secondly, it is merely a brief circular stating perfunctorily what is
>>> contained in several petitions without delving into the spirit of matter.
>>>
>>> Thirdly, seeing the scant respect for laws and bye laws in our country, I
>>> can only hope to cite it as a source of my demands being supported on
>>> paper by the regulator! and derive moral comfort from it!!!
>>>
>>> Fourthly and importantly, it merely contains the general statement of
>>> providing all the banking facility and eschews any detailed guidelines 
>>> for
>>> various facilities, refering to IBA guidelines in pursuance of CCPD
>>> judgment which are, to say the least, archaic in nature.
>>>
>>> Fifthly, it has the potential to create contradictions between what it
>>> purpotedly gives and mode of realization for which it refers to earlier
>>> guidelines, adding to already prevalent confusion. For instance, it says
>>> that banks have to provide cheque books including third party cheques,
>>> which is explicitly [or at least interpretatively] denied in ccpd
>>> judgment.
>>>
>>> The true remedy lies inenumerating detailed guidelines for availing
>>> facilities, and we must keep on pressing for it. RBI/IBA has to issue
>>> fresh guidelines in light of present circular. The battle is far from 
>>> won.
>>>
>>> Yes, the circular must be praised for recognizing legal equality of
>>> visually impaired persons, but, alas, there is many a slip between the 
>>> cup
>>> and the

Re: [AI] Banking facilities to the visually challenged

[Ram Kumar]

Hello sir/Madam, thank you so much for immediately forwarding the copy
of the RBI'S order in response  to my request.

On 6/5/08, H P Kotian <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Date: Jun 04, 2008
>
> Banking facilities to the visually challenged
>
> RBI / 2007-08 / 358
> DBOD.No.Leg BC. 91 /09.07.005/2007-08
>
> June 4, 2008
>
> To
>
> All Scheduled Commercial Banks
> (excluding RRBs)
>
> Dear Sir,
>
> Banking facilities to the visually challenged
>
> It has been brought to our notice that visually challenged persons are
> facing problems in availing banking facilities. It may be noted that banking
> facilities
> including cheque book facility / operation of ATM / locker etc. cannot be
> denied to the visually challenged as they are legally competent to contract.
>
> 2. It may be recalled that in the Case No. 2791/2003, the Honourable Court
> of Chief Commissioner for Persons with Disabilities had passed Orders dated
> 05.09.2005
> which was forwarded by IBA to all the member banks vide their circular
> letter dated October 20, 2005. In the above Order, the Honorable Court has
> instructed
> that banks should offer all the banking facilities including cheque book
> facility, ATM facility and locker facility to the visually challenged and
> also
> assist them in withdrawal of cash. Further, in Para 14 of the above Order,
> the Honorable Court has observed that visually impaired persons cannot be
> denied
> the facility of cheque book, locker and ATM on the possibility of risk in
> operating / using the said facility, as the element of risk is involved in
> case
> of other customers as well.
>
> 3. Banks are therefore advised to ensure that all the banking facilities
> such as cheque book facility including third party cheques, ATM facility,
> Net banking
> facility, locker facility, retail loans, credit cards etc. are invariably
> offered to the visually challenged without any discrimination. Banks may
> also
> advise their branches to render all possible assistance to the visually
> challenged for availing the various banking facilities.
>
> Yours faithfully
>
> (Prashant Saran)
> Chief General Manager-in-Charge
>
> Notice: The information contained in this e-mail
> message and/or attachments to it may contain
> confidential or privileged information. If you are
> not the intended recipient, any dissemination, use,
> review, distribution, printing or copying of the
> information contained in this e-mail message
> and/or attachments to it are strictly prohibited. If
> you have received this communication in error,
> please notify us by reply e-mail or telephone and
> immediately and permanently delete the message
> and any attachments. Thank you
>
> To unsubscribe send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with
> the subject unsubscribe.
>
> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, please
> visit the list home page at
>   http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in
>


-- 
With wishes, D, Ramkumar PHD in English Pondicherry university-a
central university

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Re: [AI] Banking facilities to the visually challenged

[Ram Kumar]

If I could get the copy of RBI's circular for the visually challenged,
It will be helpful.

On 6/6/08, H P Kotian <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Dear Rajesh and all
>
> The highlights of the salient points emerging out of the circular are:
>
> 1 RBI recognises the reasons put forth by the banks not giving us banking
> services as a discriminatory practise.
> 2 RBI considers the problem to be widespread and not an isolated incidence
> and hence the need of  the circular
> 3 RBI considers the blind compenent enough to possess all the legal rights
> to contract
>
> These are by no means insignificant and we are now armed with a good club to
> take on the discriminatory and whimsically practises by the banks.
>
> When last year I had met officials of IBA and 2 departments at RBI, they
> were not aware that the blind persons were getting a raw deal. It was good
> that our members made complaints to the 2 departments and brought the
> realisation amongst the officials that the problem was not isolated.
>
> Kanchan's magic spell and Sam's backup support made this all this possible.
>
> Despite this circular, if the banks continue to act whimsical, we should not
> buckle and take it to its logical end. We have moved in a long way forward
> and there should and there be no looking back.
> Harish.
>
>
> Notice: The information contained in this e-mail
> message and/or attachments to it may contain
> confidential or privileged information. If you are
> not the intended recipient, any dissemination, use,
> review, distribution, printing or copying of the
> information contained in this e-mail message
> and/or attachments to it are strictly prohibited. If
> you have received this communication in error,
> please notify us by reply e-mail or telephone and
> immediately and permanently delete the message
> and any attachments. Thank you
>
> To unsubscribe send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with
> the subject unsubscribe.
>
> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, please
> visit the list home page at
>   http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in
>


-- 
With wishes, D, Ramkumar PHD in English Pondicherry university-a
central university

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Re: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged

[firoz]

WEL done ,
kanchan and co.
hope to meet you this week end at ahmedabad

firoz
- Original Message - 
From: "Rajesh Asudani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Friday, June 06, 2008 2:05 PM
Subject: Re: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged


> Sure, Kanchan, it is a work well done and you deserve full credit for it.
>
> Let me publicly attribute this initiation towards solving banking problems 
> of the VI to Kanchan and all of us who are directly or indirectly 
> supportive of the cause.
>
> Please do not take any of my criticisms personally, I am in the habit of 
> dwelling on all sides of the matter, maybe a bit more on negative ones.
>
> Let us work for guidelines which would give the circular material form.
>
> Rajesh
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Pamnani
> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 6:36 PM
> To: accessindia@accessindia.org.in
> Subject: Re: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged
>
> Rajesh and others,
>
> Just like to clarify the whole matter. I met Mrs. Usha Thorat, Deputy
> Governor and  Kaza Sudhakra, Cheif General Manager on Monday 2nd June and
> discussed the entire matter with them in detail. It took nearly 2 
> hours.Mrs.
> Thorat read out the draft circular and I suggested some modifications. We
> also discussed the problem with currency notes and coins. The RBI
> understands our problems and is working towards resolving them one at a
> time. This circular is just the first step. Any visually challenged person
> can show this circular to a troublesome bank manager and demand his 
> rights.
> I too know that unless the procedure is spelt out the banks will still 
> give
> us trouble. I am drafting the details on the issues that I had raised in 
> my
> mail last week. I am meeting Mr. Sinor ,Chairman of Indian Banks
> Association, on Monday 9th June and shall revert to this group after the
> meeting. If I get a chance i will circulate the memorandum tomorrow or on
> Monday for your comments.
> Thanks to all who have suffered at the hands of the banks and those who 
> have
> given me their inputs.
>
> Kanchan Pamnani
> Advocate & Solicitor
> 9, Suleman Chambers,
> Battery Street, Colaba,
> Mumbai - 400 039.
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -
> From: "Rajesh Asudani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: 
> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 1:04 PM
> Subject: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged
>
>
>> Surely, the development is positive and we must congratulate ourselves 
>> for
>> it.
>>
>> However, I do not see any reason for jubilance for a multiplicity of
>> reasons:
>>
>> firstly, it has taken long long time to come, 45 days mentioned in CCPD
>> judgment have long since been over!
>>
>> Secondly, it is merely a brief circular stating perfunctorily what is
>> contained in several petitions without delving into the spirit of matter.
>>
>> Thirdly, seeing the scant respect for laws and bye laws in our country, I
>> can only hope to cite it as a source of my demands being supported on
>> paper by the regulator! and derive moral comfort from it!!!
>>
>> Fourthly and importantly, it merely contains the general statement of
>> providing all the banking facility and eschews any detailed guidelines 
>> for
>> various facilities, refering to IBA guidelines in pursuance of CCPD
>> judgment which are, to say the least, archaic in nature.
>>
>> Fifthly, it has the potential to create contradictions between what it
>> purpotedly gives and mode of realization for which it refers to earlier
>> guidelines, adding to already prevalent confusion. For instance, it says
>> that banks have to provide cheque books including third party cheques,
>> which is explicitly [or at least interpretatively] denied in ccpd
>> judgment.
>>
>> The true remedy lies inenumerating detailed guidelines for availing
>> facilities, and we must keep on pressing for it. RBI/IBA has to issue
>> fresh guidelines in light of present circular. The battle is far from 
>> won.
>>
>> Yes, the circular must be praised for recognizing legal equality of
>> visually impaired persons, but, alas, there is many a slip between the 
>> cup
>> and the lip!!
>>
>> The era of individual banks following their sweet will in 
>> denying/allowing
>> their facilities to VI, has to be ended, and the present circular is a
>> small step towards it, which has to be followed to its logical 
>> conclusion.
>> I remember chairman of LIC having proclaimed a few days ago, that

Re: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged

[Rajesh Asudani]

Sure, Kanchan, it is a work well done and you deserve full credit for it.

Let me publicly attribute this initiation towards solving banking problems of 
the VI to Kanchan and all of us who are directly or indirectly supportive of 
the cause.

Please do not take any of my criticisms personally, I am in the habit of 
dwelling on all sides of the matter, maybe a bit more on negative ones.

Let us work for guidelines which would give the circular material form.

Rajesh

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Pamnani
Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 6:36 PM
To: accessindia@accessindia.org.in
Subject: Re: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged

Rajesh and others,

Just like to clarify the whole matter. I met Mrs. Usha Thorat, Deputy
Governor and  Kaza Sudhakra, Cheif General Manager on Monday 2nd June and
discussed the entire matter with them in detail. It took nearly 2 hours.Mrs.
Thorat read out the draft circular and I suggested some modifications. We
also discussed the problem with currency notes and coins. The RBI
understands our problems and is working towards resolving them one at a
time. This circular is just the first step. Any visually challenged person
can show this circular to a troublesome bank manager and demand his rights.
I too know that unless the procedure is spelt out the banks will still give
us trouble. I am drafting the details on the issues that I had raised in my
mail last week. I am meeting Mr. Sinor ,Chairman of Indian Banks
Association, on Monday 9th June and shall revert to this group after the
meeting. If I get a chance i will circulate the memorandum tomorrow or on
Monday for your comments.
Thanks to all who have suffered at the hands of the banks and those who have
given me their inputs.

Kanchan Pamnani
Advocate & Solicitor
9, Suleman Chambers,
Battery Street, Colaba,
Mumbai - 400 039.



- Original Message -
From: "Rajesh Asudani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 1:04 PM
Subject: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged


> Surely, the development is positive and we must congratulate ourselves for
> it.
>
> However, I do not see any reason for jubilance for a multiplicity of
> reasons:
>
> firstly, it has taken long long time to come, 45 days mentioned in CCPD
> judgment have long since been over!
>
> Secondly, it is merely a brief circular stating perfunctorily what is
> contained in several petitions without delving into the spirit of matter.
>
> Thirdly, seeing the scant respect for laws and bye laws in our country, I
> can only hope to cite it as a source of my demands being supported on
> paper by the regulator! and derive moral comfort from it!!!
>
> Fourthly and importantly, it merely contains the general statement of
> providing all the banking facility and eschews any detailed guidelines for
> various facilities, refering to IBA guidelines in pursuance of CCPD
> judgment which are, to say the least, archaic in nature.
>
> Fifthly, it has the potential to create contradictions between what it
> purpotedly gives and mode of realization for which it refers to earlier
> guidelines, adding to already prevalent confusion. For instance, it says
> that banks have to provide cheque books including third party cheques,
> which is explicitly [or at least interpretatively] denied in ccpd
> judgment.
>
> The true remedy lies inenumerating detailed guidelines for availing
> facilities, and we must keep on pressing for it. RBI/IBA has to issue
> fresh guidelines in light of present circular. The battle is far from won.
>
> Yes, the circular must be praised for recognizing legal equality of
> visually impaired persons, but, alas, there is many a slip between the cup
> and the lip!!
>
> The era of individual banks following their sweet will in denying/allowing
> their facilities to VI, has to be ended, and the present circular is a
> small step towards it, which has to be followed to its logical conclusion.
> I remember chairman of LIC having proclaimed a few days ago, that the
> primier insurance agency does not at all discriminate in giving insurance
> to disabled including blind May This circular  not proove to be
> one more such tentalising illusion!
>
> We must work to have it implemented and letter and spirit for which
> universal and fresh guidelines are the need of the hour!!!
>
> Forgive my cautious optimism which is often dubbed as morbid pessimism
>
> Rajesh
>
>
>
> 
> Notice: The information contained in this e-mail
> message and/or attachments to it may contain
> confidential or privileged information. If you are
> not the intended recipient, any dissemination, use,
> review, distribution, printing or copying of the
> 

[AI] Banking facilities to the visually challenged

[H P Kotian]

Dear Rajesh and all

The highlights of the salient points emerging out of the circular are:

1 RBI recognises the reasons put forth by the banks not giving us banking 
services as a discriminatory practise.
2 RBI considers the problem to be widespread and not an isolated incidence and 
hence the need of  the circular
3 RBI considers the blind compenent enough to possess all the legal rights to 
contract

These are by no means insignificant and we are now armed with a good club to 
take on the discriminatory and whimsically practises by the banks.

When last year I had met officials of IBA and 2 departments at RBI, they were 
not aware that the blind persons were getting a raw deal. It was good that our 
members made complaints to the 2 departments and brought the realisation 
amongst the officials that the problem was not isolated.

Kanchan's magic spell and Sam's backup support made this all this possible.

Despite this circular, if the banks continue to act whimsical, we should not 
buckle and take it to its logical end. We have moved in a long way forward and 
there should and there be no looking back.
Harish.


Notice: The information contained in this e-mail
message and/or attachments to it may contain
confidential or privileged information. If you are
not the intended recipient, any dissemination, use,
review, distribution, printing or copying of the
information contained in this e-mail message
and/or attachments to it are strictly prohibited. If
you have received this communication in error,
please notify us by reply e-mail or telephone and
immediately and permanently delete the message
and any attachments. Thank you

To unsubscribe send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the subject unsubscribe.

To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, please 
visit the list home page at
  http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in

Re: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged

[Vishwanathan K S]

Dear Kanchan,
At the outset i appreciate you and  other members for all your  endevours 
for taking up the cause of VH persons with RBI  to  give them all facilities 
like any other normal persons.Thanks for all the efforts and wish you good 
luck.
Best Regards,
K.s.Vishwanathan.
Tel No: 022-28738192
- Original Message - 
From: "Pamnani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged


> Rajesh and others,
>
> Just like to clarify the whole matter. I met Mrs. Usha Thorat, Deputy
> Governor and  Kaza Sudhakra, Cheif General Manager on Monday 2nd June and
> discussed the entire matter with them in detail. It took nearly 2 
> hours.Mrs.
> Thorat read out the draft circular and I suggested some modifications. We
> also discussed the problem with currency notes and coins. The RBI
> understands our problems and is working towards resolving them one at a
> time. This circular is just the first step. Any visually challenged person
> can show this circular to a troublesome bank manager and demand his 
> rights.
> I too know that unless the procedure is spelt out the banks will still 
> give
> us trouble. I am drafting the details on the issues that I had raised in 
> my
> mail last week. I am meeting Mr. Sinor ,Chairman of Indian Banks
> Association, on Monday 9th June and shall revert to this group after the
> meeting. If I get a chance i will circulate the memorandum tomorrow or on
> Monday for your comments.
> Thanks to all who have suffered at the hands of the banks and those who 
> have
> given me their inputs.
>
> Kanchan Pamnani
> Advocate & Solicitor
> 9, Suleman Chambers,
> Battery Street, Colaba,
> Mumbai - 400 039.
>
>
>
> - Original Message ----- 
> From: "Rajesh Asudani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: 
> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 1:04 PM
> Subject: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged
>
>
>> Surely, the development is positive and we must congratulate ourselves 
>> for
>> it.
>>
>> However, I do not see any reason for jubilance for a multiplicity of
>> reasons:
>>
>> firstly, it has taken long long time to come, 45 days mentioned in CCPD
>> judgment have long since been over!
>>
>> Secondly, it is merely a brief circular stating perfunctorily what is
>> contained in several petitions without delving into the spirit of matter.
>>
>> Thirdly, seeing the scant respect for laws and bye laws in our country, I
>> can only hope to cite it as a source of my demands being supported on
>> paper by the regulator! and derive moral comfort from it!!!
>>
>> Fourthly and importantly, it merely contains the general statement of
>> providing all the banking facility and eschews any detailed guidelines 
>> for
>> various facilities, refering to IBA guidelines in pursuance of CCPD
>> judgment which are, to say the least, archaic in nature.
>>
>> Fifthly, it has the potential to create contradictions between what it
>> purpotedly gives and mode of realization for which it refers to earlier
>> guidelines, adding to already prevalent confusion. For instance, it says
>> that banks have to provide cheque books including third party cheques,
>> which is explicitly [or at least interpretatively] denied in ccpd
>> judgment.
>>
>> The true remedy lies inenumerating detailed guidelines for availing
>> facilities, and we must keep on pressing for it. RBI/IBA has to issue
>> fresh guidelines in light of present circular. The battle is far from 
>> won.
>>
>> Yes, the circular must be praised for recognizing legal equality of
>> visually impaired persons, but, alas, there is many a slip between the 
>> cup
>> and the lip!!
>>
>> The era of individual banks following their sweet will in 
>> denying/allowing
>> their facilities to VI, has to be ended, and the present circular is a
>> small step towards it, which has to be followed to its logical 
>> conclusion.
>> I remember chairman of LIC having proclaimed a few days ago, that the
>> primier insurance agency does not at all discriminate in giving insurance
>> to disabled including blind May This circular  not proove to be
>> one more such tentalising illusion!
>>
>> We must work to have it implemented and letter and spirit for which
>> universal and fresh guidelines are the need of the hour!!!
>>
>> Forgive my cautious optimism which is often dubbed as morbid 
>> pessimism
>>
>> Rajesh
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> Notice: The 

Re: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged

[Vidya]

The cases of denial by banks I have heard are mostly not because someone is 
blind, but because one can't sign.
I know several blind persons with all those facilities only because they 
could sign. I think the circular should clearly state that they should allow 
all the facilities even if the prospective client prefers thumb impression 
over signatures.

- Original Message - 
From: "Pamnani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 9:06 AM
Subject: Re: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged


> Rajesh and others,
>
> Just like to clarify the whole matter. I met Mrs. Usha Thorat, Deputy
> Governor and  Kaza Sudhakra, Cheif General Manager on Monday 2nd June and
> discussed the entire matter with them in detail. It took nearly 2 
> hours.Mrs.
> Thorat read out the draft circular and I suggested some modifications. We
> also discussed the problem with currency notes and coins. The RBI
> understands our problems and is working towards resolving them one at a
> time. This circular is just the first step. Any visually challenged person
> can show this circular to a troublesome bank manager and demand his 
> rights.
> I too know that unless the procedure is spelt out the banks will still 
> give
> us trouble. I am drafting the details on the issues that I had raised in 
> my
> mail last week. I am meeting Mr. Sinor ,Chairman of Indian Banks
> Association, on Monday 9th June and shall revert to this group after the
> meeting. If I get a chance i will circulate the memorandum tomorrow or on
> Monday for your comments.
> Thanks to all who have suffered at the hands of the banks and those who 
> have
> given me their inputs.
>
> Kanchan Pamnani
> Advocate & Solicitor
> 9, Suleman Chambers,
> Battery Street, Colaba,
> Mumbai - 400 039.
>
>
>
> - Original Message - 
> From: "Rajesh Asudani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: 
> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 1:04 PM
> Subject: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged
>
>
>> Surely, the development is positive and we must congratulate ourselves 
>> for
>> it.
>>
>> However, I do not see any reason for jubilance for a multiplicity of
>> reasons:
>>
>> firstly, it has taken long long time to come, 45 days mentioned in CCPD
>> judgment have long since been over!
>>
>> Secondly, it is merely a brief circular stating perfunctorily what is
>> contained in several petitions without delving into the spirit of matter.
>>
>> Thirdly, seeing the scant respect for laws and bye laws in our country, I
>> can only hope to cite it as a source of my demands being supported on
>> paper by the regulator! and derive moral comfort from it!!!
>>
>> Fourthly and importantly, it merely contains the general statement of
>> providing all the banking facility and eschews any detailed guidelines 
>> for
>> various facilities, refering to IBA guidelines in pursuance of CCPD
>> judgment which are, to say the least, archaic in nature.
>>
>> Fifthly, it has the potential to create contradictions between what it
>> purpotedly gives and mode of realization for which it refers to earlier
>> guidelines, adding to already prevalent confusion. For instance, it says
>> that banks have to provide cheque books including third party cheques,
>> which is explicitly [or at least interpretatively] denied in ccpd
>> judgment.
>>
>> The true remedy lies inenumerating detailed guidelines for availing
>> facilities, and we must keep on pressing for it. RBI/IBA has to issue
>> fresh guidelines in light of present circular. The battle is far from 
>> won.
>>
>> Yes, the circular must be praised for recognizing legal equality of
>> visually impaired persons, but, alas, there is many a slip between the 
>> cup
>> and the lip!!
>>
>> The era of individual banks following their sweet will in 
>> denying/allowing
>> their facilities to VI, has to be ended, and the present circular is a
>> small step towards it, which has to be followed to its logical 
>> conclusion.
>> I remember chairman of LIC having proclaimed a few days ago, that the
>> primier insurance agency does not at all discriminate in giving insurance
>> to disabled including blind May This circular  not proove to be
>> one more such tentalising illusion!
>>
>> We must work to have it implemented and letter and spirit for which
>> universal and fresh guidelines are the need of the hour!!!
>>
>> Forgive my cautious optimism which is often dubbed as morbid 
>> pessimism
>>
>> Rajesh
>>
>>
>>

Re: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged

[Pamnani]

Rajesh and others,

Just like to clarify the whole matter. I met Mrs. Usha Thorat, Deputy 
Governor and  Kaza Sudhakra, Cheif General Manager on Monday 2nd June and 
discussed the entire matter with them in detail. It took nearly 2 hours.Mrs. 
Thorat read out the draft circular and I suggested some modifications. We 
also discussed the problem with currency notes and coins. The RBI 
understands our problems and is working towards resolving them one at a 
time. This circular is just the first step. Any visually challenged person 
can show this circular to a troublesome bank manager and demand his rights. 
I too know that unless the procedure is spelt out the banks will still give 
us trouble. I am drafting the details on the issues that I had raised in my 
mail last week. I am meeting Mr. Sinor ,Chairman of Indian Banks 
Association, on Monday 9th June and shall revert to this group after the 
meeting. If I get a chance i will circulate the memorandum tomorrow or on 
Monday for your comments.
Thanks to all who have suffered at the hands of the banks and those who have 
given me their inputs.

Kanchan Pamnani
Advocate & Solicitor
9, Suleman Chambers,
Battery Street, Colaba,
Mumbai - 400 039.



- Original Message - 
From: "Rajesh Asudani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 1:04 PM
Subject: [AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged


> Surely, the development is positive and we must congratulate ourselves for 
> it.
>
> However, I do not see any reason for jubilance for a multiplicity of 
> reasons:
>
> firstly, it has taken long long time to come, 45 days mentioned in CCPD 
> judgment have long since been over!
>
> Secondly, it is merely a brief circular stating perfunctorily what is 
> contained in several petitions without delving into the spirit of matter.
>
> Thirdly, seeing the scant respect for laws and bye laws in our country, I 
> can only hope to cite it as a source of my demands being supported on 
> paper by the regulator! and derive moral comfort from it!!!
>
> Fourthly and importantly, it merely contains the general statement of 
> providing all the banking facility and eschews any detailed guidelines for 
> various facilities, refering to IBA guidelines in pursuance of CCPD 
> judgment which are, to say the least, archaic in nature.
>
> Fifthly, it has the potential to create contradictions between what it 
> purpotedly gives and mode of realization for which it refers to earlier 
> guidelines, adding to already prevalent confusion. For instance, it says 
> that banks have to provide cheque books including third party cheques, 
> which is explicitly [or at least interpretatively] denied in ccpd 
> judgment.
>
> The true remedy lies inenumerating detailed guidelines for availing 
> facilities, and we must keep on pressing for it. RBI/IBA has to issue 
> fresh guidelines in light of present circular. The battle is far from won.
>
> Yes, the circular must be praised for recognizing legal equality of 
> visually impaired persons, but, alas, there is many a slip between the cup 
> and the lip!!
>
> The era of individual banks following their sweet will in denying/allowing 
> their facilities to VI, has to be ended, and the present circular is a 
> small step towards it, which has to be followed to its logical conclusion. 
> I remember chairman of LIC having proclaimed a few days ago, that the 
> primier insurance agency does not at all discriminate in giving insurance 
> to disabled including blind May This circular  not proove to be 
> one more such tentalising illusion!
>
> We must work to have it implemented and letter and spirit for which 
> universal and fresh guidelines are the need of the hour!!!
>
> Forgive my cautious optimism which is often dubbed as morbid pessimism
>
> Rajesh
>
>
>
> 
> Notice: The information contained in this e-mail
> message and/or attachments to it may contain
> confidential or privileged information. If you are
> not the intended recipient, any dissemination, use,
> review, distribution, printing or copying of the
> information contained in this e-mail message
> and/or attachments to it are strictly prohibited. If
> you have received this communication in error,
> please notify us by reply e-mail or telephone and
> immediately and permanently delete the message
> and any attachments. Thank you
> To unsubscribe send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> with the subject unsubscribe.
>
> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, 
> please visit the list home page at
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> 


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[AI] banking facilities to the visually challenged

[Rajesh Asudani]

Surely, the development is positive and we must congratulate ourselves for it.

However, I do not see any reason for jubilance for a multiplicity of reasons:

firstly, it has taken long long time to come, 45 days mentioned in CCPD 
judgment have long since been over!

Secondly, it is merely a brief circular stating perfunctorily what is contained 
in several petitions without delving into the spirit of matter.

Thirdly, seeing the scant respect for laws and bye laws in our country, I can 
only hope to cite it as a source of my demands being supported on paper by the 
regulator! and derive moral comfort from it!!!

Fourthly and importantly, it merely contains the general statement of providing 
all the banking facility and eschews any detailed guidelines for various 
facilities, refering to IBA guidelines in pursuance of CCPD judgment which are, 
to say the least, archaic in nature.

Fifthly, it has the potential to create contradictions between what it 
purpotedly gives and mode of realization for which it refers to earlier 
guidelines, adding to already prevalent confusion. For instance, it says that 
banks have to provide cheque books including third party cheques, which is 
explicitly [or at least interpretatively] denied in ccpd judgment.

The true remedy lies inenumerating detailed guidelines for availing facilities, 
and we must keep on pressing for it. RBI/IBA has to issue fresh guidelines in 
light of present circular. The battle is far from won.

Yes, the circular must be praised for recognizing legal equality of visually 
impaired persons, but, alas, there is many a slip between the cup and the 
lip!!

The era of individual banks following their sweet will in denying/allowing 
their facilities to VI, has to be ended, and the present circular is a small 
step towards it, which has to be followed to its logical conclusion. I remember 
chairman of LIC having proclaimed a few days ago, that the primier insurance 
agency does not at all discriminate in giving insurance to disabled including 
blind May This circular  not proove to be one more such tentalising 
illusion!

We must work to have it implemented and letter and spirit for which universal 
and fresh guidelines are the need of the hour!!!

Forgive my cautious optimism which is often dubbed as morbid pessimism

Rajesh




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[AI] Banking facilities to the visually challenged

[H P Kotian]

Date: Jun 04, 2008

Banking facilities to the visually challenged

RBI / 2007-08 / 358
DBOD.No.Leg BC. 91 /09.07.005/2007-08

June 4, 2008

To

All Scheduled Commercial Banks
(excluding RRBs)

Dear Sir,

Banking facilities to the visually challenged

It has been brought to our notice that visually challenged persons are facing 
problems in availing banking facilities. It may be noted that banking facilities
including cheque book facility / operation of ATM / locker etc. cannot be 
denied to the visually challenged as they are legally competent to contract.

2. It may be recalled that in the Case No. 2791/2003, the Honourable Court of 
Chief Commissioner for Persons with Disabilities had passed Orders dated 
05.09.2005
which was forwarded by IBA to all the member banks vide their circular letter 
dated October 20, 2005. In the above Order, the Honorable Court has instructed
that banks should offer all the banking facilities including cheque book 
facility, ATM facility and locker facility to the visually challenged and also
assist them in withdrawal of cash. Further, in Para 14 of the above Order, the 
Honorable Court has observed that visually impaired persons cannot be denied
the facility of cheque book, locker and ATM on the possibility of risk in 
operating / using the said facility, as the element of risk is involved in case
of other customers as well.

3. Banks are therefore advised to ensure that all the banking facilities such 
as cheque book facility including third party cheques, ATM facility, Net banking
facility, locker facility, retail loans, credit cards etc. are invariably 
offered to the visually challenged without any discrimination. Banks may also
advise their branches to render all possible assistance to the visually 
challenged for availing the various banking facilities.

Yours faithfully

(Prashant Saran)
Chief General Manager-in-Charge

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