Re: misc advocacy ideas
Quoting Stas Bekman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Most of the things in the docs, at least mod_perl 1.0 guide are FAQ. It > was originally written based on frequently asked questions on the list. yes, i understand that now. in a nutshell i see a FAQ as a short full stop page where one can quickly view commonly asked questions. let's take perl itself as an example. sometimes i forget how to do a directly search & replace in a file (in old perls you had to create tmp files and unlink them afterwards). this is not something i do very often so i tend to forget the syntax. but i also know that this would be a pretty common thing for people to do hence i look first in the perl FAQ. the infamous "Sometimes it Works, Sometimes it Doesn't" problem. i personally consider it a FAQ. if you were a mod_perl beginner but knew about this problem already (but couldn't remember how to solve it) how would you go about ? i see three approaches 1) look on perl.apache.org (how to find this answer is not that easy or is it ? what would you search for - how would you hyperlinnk-navigate ?) 2) ask the question on the mailing list 3) search elsewhere like google.com. horror! > Allan, may I suggest that may be you don't realize how much information > there is in our docs and how hard it's going to be to decide what should > be in the FAQ and what not? i certainly know there's a lot of information. i even think you know i know :) would you go along if i (if i can fine the time) took the task of simply compiling a small list a bit like the one i sent as an example in an earlier mail, the faq answers would then point to the real doc ? > If you really want to help with docs, the best thing you can do now is > start porting mod_perl 1 docs to mod_perl 2 docs, since that's the biggest > hole now. mod_perl 1 is going to phase out, and 99.9% of the questions in > the next year are going to be about mp2. We can't write a FAQ for that > since things are still not there. But filling the gaps in the normal docs > is what's the most important thing at the moment, if you ask me. i don't think a FAQ should be mod_perl2 og mod_perl1 specific. but i agree that getting the actual documentation right is much more important than a FAQ. but unfortuantely , im not in a position to help on that ./allan - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: FAQ (WAS: misc advocacy ideas)
Quoting Perrin Harkins <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > While I agree with Stas that I've never felt the desire to point people > to a FAQ instead of to a specific place in the docs, I do like your > selection of questions. Maybe there could be a place for this, as a > sort of "first stop" for newbies. I still think it would mostly point > to things in the docs, rather than contain new information, but that's > okay. exactly! the FAQ answers could perhaps just be the first 100 words or so followed by a hyperlink to the docs answer "..." it doesn't have to be that extensive at all. like: FAQ --- .. .. 5) Sometimes My Script Works, Sometimes It Does Not - why is that ? When you start running your scripts under mod_perl, you might find yourself in a situation where a script seems to work, but sometimes it screws up ... http://perl.apache.org/docs/1.0/guide/porting.html#Sometimes_it_Works__Som etimes_it_Doesn_t">Click here elaborate answer ./allan - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Modperl Plates
Perrin Harkins wrote: On Tue, 2004-12-14 at 09:44 -0700, Jayce^ wrote: I realized I'd never shown these off to the group. http://durnik.lug-nut.com/gallery/jayce/Plug/dsc01374.jpg http://durnik.lug-nut.com/gallery/jayce/Plug/dsc01375.jpg?width=1024 That's hilarious! We should put that pic on the site somewhere. Yeah! Someone should start a page and ask for funny mod_perl pics. Don't forget to include: http://scroogie.de/pix/data/media/2/mod_perl.jpg (though I've seen one with a higher resolution) -- __ Stas BekmanJAm_pH --> Just Another mod_perl Hacker http://stason.org/ mod_perl Guide ---> http://perl.apache.org mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://use.perl.org http://apacheweek.com http://modperlbook.org http://apache.org http://ticketmaster.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: FAQ (WAS: misc advocacy ideas)
Perrin Harkins wrote: On Tue, 2004-12-14 at 08:10 +0100, allan juul wrote: * do i need to learn perl ? * can i use mod_perl on Windows ? * can i access a MySql database via mod_perl * can i use mod_perl and PHP on the same time * does mod_perl run on MicroSoft IIS * is mod_perl faster than jsp-pages * we need a CMS - where can i download one and use * we need a search engine - where can i download one and use * we need a shoping cart - where can i download one and use * is mod_perl object orientated ? * how much converting of my cgi scripts do i need to do in order to shift to mod_perl ? * why doesn't my changes show up after i refresh my page ? * do i really have to restart apache for every single change i made ? * can i compile mod_perl with the apxs tool ? * how much does mod_perl cost ? * where can wwe get support ? * the software is broken and we can't sue anyone. what do we do ? * perl is dead, right - so why go with mod_perl ? * we heard apache is insecure - is this true ? * can we integrate mod_perl with our Economy systems While I agree with Stas that I've never felt the desire to point people to a FAQ instead of to a specific place in the docs, I do like your selection of questions. Maybe there could be a place for this, as a sort of "first stop" for newbies. I still think it would mostly point to things in the docs, rather than contain new information, but that's okay. Shouldn't this belong to: http://perl.apache.org/start/index.html It was created mainly by Bill Moseley a few years ago, who came with the same ambition as Allan today. I think if you want to extend/reshape it, that would be great. -- __ Stas BekmanJAm_pH --> Just Another mod_perl Hacker http://stason.org/ mod_perl Guide ---> http://perl.apache.org mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://use.perl.org http://apacheweek.com http://modperlbook.org http://apache.org http://ticketmaster.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: misc advocacy ideas
allan juul wrote: Quoting Stas Bekman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: the FAQ should then reply in two sentences or less: "the reason for that behaviour is this blah blah ... click here to read more URL/TO/GUIDE" -1, it's already hard to maintain the vast amount of information. Trying to keep in sync yet another layer of indirection is an overkill. Instead an effort should be put at improving the existing information. And the search engine should be useful at finding it. i can see it's another layer but it is perhaps also fewer mails in your inbox :) isn't it very normal for the people who ask questions to go to a FAQ just before they send their question ? Most of the things in the docs, at least mod_perl 1.0 guide are FAQ. It was originally written based on frequently asked questions on the list. about searching. i also like the FAQ to be in the downloadble pdf - there's no quality search engine in my pdf reader. im sitting in the train having printed the whole documentaion and ask myself "does apache require a restart if i'm doing a change in this bit of code". If you agree that the docs are already a FAQ, you have the pdf version of all docs. also the very fact that you bring up the "search" step, cries for FAQ. a user have to type a searchword, enter submit, and read through 70 Results for [cache] for example. Allan, may I suggest that may be you don't realize how much information there is in our docs and how hard it's going to be to decide what should be in the FAQ and what not? If you really want to help with docs, the best thing you can do now is start porting mod_perl 1 docs to mod_perl 2 docs, since that's the biggest hole now. mod_perl 1 is going to phase out, and 99.9% of the questions in the next year are going to be about mp2. We can't write a FAQ for that since things are still not there. But filling the gaps in the normal docs is what's the most important thing at the moment, if you ask me. -- __ Stas BekmanJAm_pH --> Just Another mod_perl Hacker http://stason.org/ mod_perl Guide ---> http://perl.apache.org mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://use.perl.org http://apacheweek.com http://modperlbook.org http://apache.org http://ticketmaster.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: FAQ (WAS: misc advocacy ideas)
>> * how much does mod_perl cost ? >> * where can wwe get support ? >> * the software is broken and we can't sue anyone. what do we do ? >> * perl is dead, right - so why go with mod_perl ? >> * we heard apache is insecure - is this true ? >> * can we integrate mod_perl with our Economy systems > > While I agree with Stas that I've never felt the desire to point people > to a FAQ instead of to a specific place in the docs, I do like your > selection of questions. Maybe there could be a place for this, as a > sort of "first stop" for newbies. I still think it would mostly point > to things in the docs, rather than contain new information, but that's > okay. Sounds like a Wiki might be useful for this type of content. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: FAQ (WAS: misc advocacy ideas)
On Tue, 2004-12-14 at 08:10 +0100, allan juul wrote: > * do i need to learn perl ? > * can i use mod_perl on Windows ? > * can i access a MySql database via mod_perl > * can i use mod_perl and PHP on the same time > * does mod_perl run on MicroSoft IIS > * is mod_perl faster than jsp-pages > * we need a CMS - where can i download one and use > * we need a search engine - where can i download one and use > * we need a shoping cart - where can i download one and use > * is mod_perl object orientated ? > > * how much converting of my cgi scripts do i need to do in order to shift to > mod_perl ? > * why doesn't my changes show up after i refresh my page ? > * do i really have to restart apache for every single change i made ? > * can i compile mod_perl with the apxs tool ? > > * how much does mod_perl cost ? > * where can wwe get support ? > * the software is broken and we can't sue anyone. what do we do ? > * perl is dead, right - so why go with mod_perl ? > * we heard apache is insecure - is this true ? > * can we integrate mod_perl with our Economy systems While I agree with Stas that I've never felt the desire to point people to a FAQ instead of to a specific place in the docs, I do like your selection of questions. Maybe there could be a place for this, as a sort of "first stop" for newbies. I still think it would mostly point to things in the docs, rather than contain new information, but that's okay. - Perrin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Modperl Plates
On Tue, 2004-12-14 at 09:44 -0700, Jayce^ wrote: > I realized I'd never shown these off to the group. > > http://durnik.lug-nut.com/gallery/jayce/Plug/dsc01374.jpg > http://durnik.lug-nut.com/gallery/jayce/Plug/dsc01375.jpg?width=1024 That's hilarious! We should put that pic on the site somewhere. - Perrin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Modperl Plates
I realized I'd never shown these off to the group. http://durnik.lug-nut.com/gallery/jayce/Plug/dsc01374.jpg http://durnik.lug-nut.com/gallery/jayce/Plug/dsc01375.jpg?width=1024 -- Jayce^ pgpGC45oPKjWe.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: posting news on perl.apache.org
On Tue, 2004-12-14 at 10:22 -0500, Adam Prime wrote: > Didn't take23.org attempt to do this a couple of years ago? What ever > happened to that? It was Matt's personal project, hosted on a DSL line. My idea is that anyone with access to the docs repository can update the news, and that we pull news from the list, assuming that the target audience for news is not on it. - Perrin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: misc advocacy ideas
Quoting Stas Bekman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > the FAQ should then reply in two sentences or less: "the reason for that > > behaviour is this blah blah ... click here to read more URL/TO/GUIDE" > > -1, it's already hard to maintain the vast amount of information. Trying > to keep in sync yet another layer of indirection is an overkill. Instead > an effort should be put at improving the existing information. And the > search engine should be useful at finding it. i can see it's another layer but it is perhaps also fewer mails in your inbox :) isn't it very normal for the people who ask questions to go to a FAQ just before they send their question ? about searching. i also like the FAQ to be in the downloadble pdf - there's no quality search engine in my pdf reader. im sitting in the train having printed the whole documentaion and ask myself "does apache require a restart if i'm doing a change in this bit of code". also the very fact that you bring up the "search" step, cries for FAQ. a user have to type a searchword, enter submit, and read through 70 Results for [cache] for example. ./a - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
