Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance
In our case our upload was being impacted in a very real way. 1x - 2x where we should have had 6x - 8x connections. Once we synced up everything went back to normal. I didn't notice any throughput issues by syncing. On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 2:37 PM Bill Prince wrote: > and I do. > > bp > > > > On 2/21/2020 12:36 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote: > > That’s like saying I love all my wives equally. > > > > *From:* AF *On Behalf > Of *Steve Jones > *Sent:* Friday, February 21, 2020 2:25 PM > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance > > > > i worry about both equally > > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 2:10 PM Ken Hohhof wrote: > > By performance hit are you referring to the frame period? Which is a > tradeoff between throughput and latency, so which are you worried about > most? > > > > Or did I misunderstand the issue. > > > > *From:* AF *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones > *Sent:* Friday, February 21, 2020 1:46 PM > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance > > > > the hit is on the 450 not the LTE though to sync? > > what kind of a performance hit is it? > > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 1:29 PM Ryan Ray wrote: > > Yes sir. We do it with others running 3.65 Huawei LTE. Works great. > > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 11:11 AM Jason McKemie < > j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote: > > Is it possible to sync Cambium with LTE gear? > > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:36 PM Mike Hammett wrote: > > There's also advantage to coexistence groups, though as I understand it, > that's a SAS value add and not a requirement. > > > > As I understand it, a group of operators could form a co-existence group > to ignore each other when determining availability. This would be used when > a group of operators agreed to the same timing, uplink\downlink, etc. > settings so that they didn't interfere with each other... like how > GPS-based operators coexist today. > > > > - > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> > <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> > <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> > Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> > <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> > The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> > > > <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> > -- > > *From: *"Steve Jones" > *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" > *Sent: *Friday, February 21, 2020 12:31:28 PM > *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance > > people worry about the contiguous block issue too much. The longest you > would go with a non contiguous grant is a day. When the sas get jiggy with > each other at night the channels will be redistributed in contiguous blocks. > > > > Getting 4 channels for a 40mhz will happen for a period, but man is that a > bad business decision for the long term unless there is zero competition > > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:34 AM Ken Hohhof wrote: > > The answer is a bit complicated, for example I suspect the SAS could give > you a grant, but not at the full xmt power a 450m is capable of, so your > range and modulation is reduced. > > > > Probably nobody knows the answer. A few WISPs who participated in ICD > might have some idea. But if you are asking can you count on getting 80 > MHz out of a total 150 MHz, and also as 2 contiguous blocks, I think we > know the answer. Even if it happened initially, that seems unlikely long > term. > > > > Much advertising hype in our business is based on “could it happen” rather > than “can we count on it”. That works with 5G because they are talking > about everybody getting gigabit speeds but if everybody only gets 1/10 of > that it’s still pretty damn fast. Not sure the same applies if you talk > about everybody getting 100 meg but most of the time it’s more like 10 meg. > > > > > > *From:* AF *On Behalf Of *castarritt . > *Sent:* Friday, February 21, 2020 9:11 AM > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance > > > > The other important question is if we
Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance
and I do.
bp
On 2/21/2020 12:36 PM, Ken Hohhof
wrote:
That’s like saying I love all my wives
equally.
From: AF
On Behalf Of Steve
Jones
Sent: Friday, February 21, 2020 2:25 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max
STA performance
i worry about both equally
On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 2:10 PM Ken
Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote:
By
performance hit are you referring to the frame
period? Which is a tradeoff between throughput and
latency, so which are you worried about most?
Or
did I misunderstand the issue.
From:
AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com>
On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Friday, February 21, 2020 1:46 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in
3.5Ghz max STA performance
the
hit is on the 450 not the LTE though to sync?
what
kind of a performance hit is it?
On
Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 1:29 PM Ryan Ray <ryan...@gmail.com>
wrote:
Yes
sir. We do it with others running 3.65 Huawei
LTE. Works great.
On
Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 11:11 AM Jason McKemie
<j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com>
wrote:
Is
it possible to sync Cambium with LTE gear?
On
Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:36 PM Mike Hammett
<af...@ics-il.net>
wrote:
There's
also advantage to coexistence
groups, though as I understand it,
that's a SAS value add and not a
requirement.
As
I understand it, a group of
operators could form a
co-existence group to ignore each
other when determining
availability. This would be used
when a group of operators agreed
to the same timing,
uplink\downlink, etc. settings so
that they didn't interfere with
each other... like how GPS-based
operators coexist today.
-
Mike
Hammett
Intelligent
Computing Solutions
Midwest
Internet Exchange
The
Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance
That’s like saying I love all my wives equally. From: AF On Behalf Of Steve Jones Sent: Friday, February 21, 2020 2:25 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance i worry about both equally On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 2:10 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote: By performance hit are you referring to the frame period? Which is a tradeoff between throughput and latency, so which are you worried about most? Or did I misunderstand the issue. From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf Of Steve Jones Sent: Friday, February 21, 2020 1:46 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance the hit is on the 450 not the LTE though to sync? what kind of a performance hit is it? On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 1:29 PM Ryan Ray mailto:ryan...@gmail.com> > wrote: Yes sir. We do it with others running 3.65 Huawei LTE. Works great. On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 11:11 AM Jason McKemie mailto:j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> > wrote: Is it possible to sync Cambium with LTE gear? On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:36 PM Mike Hammett mailto:af...@ics-il.net> > wrote: There's also advantage to coexistence groups, though as I understand it, that's a SAS value add and not a requirement. As I understand it, a group of operators could form a co-existence group to ignore each other when determining availability. This would be used when a group of operators agreed to the same timing, uplink\downlink, etc. settings so that they didn't interfere with each other... like how GPS-based operators coexist today. - Mike Hammett <http://www.ics-il.com/> Intelligent Computing Solutions <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> Midwest Internet Exchange <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> The Brothers WISP <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> _ From: "Steve Jones" mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> > To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > Sent: Friday, February 21, 2020 12:31:28 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance people worry about the contiguous block issue too much. The longest you would go with a non contiguous grant is a day. When the sas get jiggy with each other at night the channels will be redistributed in contiguous blocks. Getting 4 channels for a 40mhz will happen for a period, but man is that a bad business decision for the long term unless there is zero competition On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:34 AM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote: The answer is a bit complicated, for example I suspect the SAS could give you a grant, but not at the full xmt power a 450m is capable of, so your range and modulation is reduced. Probably nobody knows the answer. A few WISPs who participated in ICD might have some idea. But if you are asking can you count on getting 80 MHz out of a total 150 MHz, and also as 2 contiguous blocks, I think we know the answer. Even if it happened initially, that seems unlikely long term. Much advertising hype in our business is based on “could it happen” rather than “can we count on it”. That works with 5G because they are talking about everybody getting gigabit speeds but if everybody only gets 1/10 of that it’s still pretty damn fast. Not sure the same applies if you talk about everybody getting 100 meg but most of the time it’s more like 10 meg. From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf Of castarritt . Sent: Friday, February 21, 2020 9:11 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance The other important question is if we can count on getting a contiguous 40mhz channel from the SAS, much less two of them to run a full cluster of 450m in ABAB. On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:59 AM Matt Mangriotis via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > wrote: Using 450i or 450b on the SM (client) side, a real world aggregate speed test can be as high as 250 Mbps. If you have cnMeudsa (450m AP) for the sector, you can achieve >750 Mbps (theoretically up to 1 Gbps, but I would be lying to tell you I have ever seen this kind of efficiency in the real world) sector capacity due to the Multi-User MIMO capabilities (i.e. simultaneous transmissions to up to 4 cl
Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance
i worry about both equally On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 2:10 PM Ken Hohhof wrote: > By performance hit are you referring to the frame period? Which is a > tradeoff between throughput and latency, so which are you worried about > most? > > > > Or did I misunderstand the issue. > > > > *From:* AF *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones > *Sent:* Friday, February 21, 2020 1:46 PM > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance > > > > the hit is on the 450 not the LTE though to sync? > > what kind of a performance hit is it? > > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 1:29 PM Ryan Ray wrote: > > Yes sir. We do it with others running 3.65 Huawei LTE. Works great. > > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 11:11 AM Jason McKemie < > j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote: > > Is it possible to sync Cambium with LTE gear? > > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:36 PM Mike Hammett wrote: > > There's also advantage to coexistence groups, though as I understand it, > that's a SAS value add and not a requirement. > > > > As I understand it, a group of operators could form a co-existence group > to ignore each other when determining availability. This would be used when > a group of operators agreed to the same timing, uplink\downlink, etc. > settings so that they didn't interfere with each other... like how > GPS-based operators coexist today. > > > > - > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> > <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> > <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> > Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> > <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> > The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> > > > <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> > -- > > *From: *"Steve Jones" > *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" > *Sent: *Friday, February 21, 2020 12:31:28 PM > *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance > > people worry about the contiguous block issue too much. The longest you > would go with a non contiguous grant is a day. When the sas get jiggy with > each other at night the channels will be redistributed in contiguous blocks. > > > > Getting 4 channels for a 40mhz will happen for a period, but man is that a > bad business decision for the long term unless there is zero competition > > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:34 AM Ken Hohhof wrote: > > The answer is a bit complicated, for example I suspect the SAS could give > you a grant, but not at the full xmt power a 450m is capable of, so your > range and modulation is reduced. > > > > Probably nobody knows the answer. A few WISPs who participated in ICD > might have some idea. But if you are asking can you count on getting 80 > MHz out of a total 150 MHz, and also as 2 contiguous blocks, I think we > know the answer. Even if it happened initially, that seems unlikely long > term. > > > > Much advertising hype in our business is based on “could it happen” rather > than “can we count on it”. That works with 5G because they are talking > about everybody getting gigabit speeds but if everybody only gets 1/10 of > that it’s still pretty damn fast. Not sure the same applies if you talk > about everybody getting 100 meg but most of the time it’s more like 10 meg. > > > > > > *From:* AF *On Behalf Of *castarritt . > *Sent:* Friday, February 21, 2020 9:11 AM > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance > > > > The other important question is if we can count on getting a > contiguous 40mhz channel from the SAS, much less two of them to run a full > cluster of 450m in ABAB. > > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:59 AM Matt Mangriotis via AF > wrote: > > Using 450i or 450b on the SM (client) side, a real world aggregate speed > test can be as high as 250 Mbps. If you have cnMeudsa (450m AP) for the > sector, you can achieve >750 Mbps (theoretically up to 1 Gbps, but I would > be lying to tell you I have ever seen this kind of efficiency in the real > world) sector capacity due to the Multi-User MIMO capabilities (i.e. > simultaneous transmissions to up to 4 clients in the same time slot). >
Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance
By performance hit are you referring to the frame period? Which is a tradeoff between throughput and latency, so which are you worried about most? Or did I misunderstand the issue. From: AF On Behalf Of Steve Jones Sent: Friday, February 21, 2020 1:46 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance the hit is on the 450 not the LTE though to sync? what kind of a performance hit is it? On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 1:29 PM Ryan Ray mailto:ryan...@gmail.com> > wrote: Yes sir. We do it with others running 3.65 Huawei LTE. Works great. On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 11:11 AM Jason McKemie mailto:j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> > wrote: Is it possible to sync Cambium with LTE gear? On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:36 PM Mike Hammett mailto:af...@ics-il.net> > wrote: There's also advantage to coexistence groups, though as I understand it, that's a SAS value add and not a requirement. As I understand it, a group of operators could form a co-existence group to ignore each other when determining availability. This would be used when a group of operators agreed to the same timing, uplink\downlink, etc. settings so that they didn't interfere with each other... like how GPS-based operators coexist today. - Mike Hammett <http://www.ics-il.com/> Intelligent Computing Solutions <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> Midwest Internet Exchange <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> The Brothers WISP <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> _ From: "Steve Jones" mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> > To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > Sent: Friday, February 21, 2020 12:31:28 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance people worry about the contiguous block issue too much. The longest you would go with a non contiguous grant is a day. When the sas get jiggy with each other at night the channels will be redistributed in contiguous blocks. Getting 4 channels for a 40mhz will happen for a period, but man is that a bad business decision for the long term unless there is zero competition On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:34 AM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote: The answer is a bit complicated, for example I suspect the SAS could give you a grant, but not at the full xmt power a 450m is capable of, so your range and modulation is reduced. Probably nobody knows the answer. A few WISPs who participated in ICD might have some idea. But if you are asking can you count on getting 80 MHz out of a total 150 MHz, and also as 2 contiguous blocks, I think we know the answer. Even if it happened initially, that seems unlikely long term. Much advertising hype in our business is based on “could it happen” rather than “can we count on it”. That works with 5G because they are talking about everybody getting gigabit speeds but if everybody only gets 1/10 of that it’s still pretty damn fast. Not sure the same applies if you talk about everybody getting 100 meg but most of the time it’s more like 10 meg. From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf Of castarritt . Sent: Friday, February 21, 2020 9:11 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance The other important question is if we can count on getting a contiguous 40mhz channel from the SAS, much less two of them to run a full cluster of 450m in ABAB. On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:59 AM Matt Mangriotis via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > wrote: Using 450i or 450b on the SM (client) side, a real world aggregate speed test can be as high as 250 Mbps. If you have cnMeudsa (450m AP) for the sector, you can achieve >750 Mbps (theoretically up to 1 Gbps, but I would be lying to tell you I have ever seen this kind of efficiency in the real world) sector capacity due to the Multi-User MIMO capabilities (i.e. simultaneous transmissions to up to 4 clients in the same time slot). Running under Part 90 or Part 96 does not affect the system performance (provided the channel size is the same, of course). Matt From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf Of Peter Kranz via AF Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2020 6:31 PM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > Cc: Peter Kranz mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com> &g
Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance
the hit is on the 450 not the LTE though to sync? what kind of a performance hit is it? On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 1:29 PM Ryan Ray wrote: > Yes sir. We do it with others running 3.65 Huawei LTE. Works great. > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 11:11 AM Jason McKemie < > j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote: > >> Is it possible to sync Cambium with LTE gear? >> >> On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:36 PM Mike Hammett wrote: >> >>> There's also advantage to coexistence groups, though as I understand it, >>> that's a SAS value add and not a requirement. >>> >>> As I understand it, a group of operators could form a co-existence group >>> to ignore each other when determining availability. This would be used when >>> a group of operators agreed to the same timing, uplink\downlink, etc. >>> settings so that they didn't interfere with each other... like how >>> GPS-based operators coexist today. >>> >>> >>> >>> - >>> Mike Hammett >>> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> >>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> >>> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> >>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> >>> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> >>> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> >>> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> >>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> >>> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> >>> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> >>> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> >>> >>> >>> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> >>> -- >>> *From: *"Steve Jones" >>> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" >>> *Sent: *Friday, February 21, 2020 12:31:28 PM >>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance >>> >>> people worry about the contiguous block issue too much. The longest you >>> would go with a non contiguous grant is a day. When the sas get jiggy with >>> each other at night the channels will be redistributed in contiguous blocks. >>> >>> Getting 4 channels for a 40mhz will happen for a period, but man is that >>> a bad business decision for the long term unless there is zero competition >>> >>> On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:34 AM Ken Hohhof wrote: >>> >>>> The answer is a bit complicated, for example I suspect the SAS could >>>> give you a grant, but not at the full xmt power a 450m is capable of, so >>>> your range and modulation is reduced. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Probably nobody knows the answer. A few WISPs who participated in ICD >>>> might have some idea. But if you are asking can you count on getting 80 >>>> MHz out of a total 150 MHz, and also as 2 contiguous blocks, I think we >>>> know the answer. Even if it happened initially, that seems unlikely long >>>> term. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Much advertising hype in our business is based on “could it happen” >>>> rather than “can we count on it”. That works with 5G because they are >>>> talking about everybody getting gigabit speeds but if everybody only gets >>>> 1/10 of that it’s still pretty damn fast. Not sure the same applies if you >>>> talk about everybody getting 100 meg but most of the time it’s more like 10 >>>> meg. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> *From:* AF *On Behalf Of *castarritt . >>>> *Sent:* Friday, February 21, 2020 9:11 AM >>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group >>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> The other important question is if we can count on getting a >>>> contiguous 40mhz channel from the SAS, much less two of them to run a full >>>> cluster of 450m in ABAB. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:59 AM Matt Mangriotis via AF >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Using 450i or 450b on the SM (client) side, a real world aggregate >>>> speed test can be as high as 250 Mbps. If you have cnMeudsa (450m AP) for >>>> the sector, you can achieve >750 Mbps (theoretica
Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance
Yes sir. We do it with others running 3.65 Huawei LTE. Works great. On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 11:11 AM Jason McKemie < j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote: > Is it possible to sync Cambium with LTE gear? > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:36 PM Mike Hammett wrote: > >> There's also advantage to coexistence groups, though as I understand it, >> that's a SAS value add and not a requirement. >> >> As I understand it, a group of operators could form a co-existence group >> to ignore each other when determining availability. This would be used when >> a group of operators agreed to the same timing, uplink\downlink, etc. >> settings so that they didn't interfere with each other... like how >> GPS-based operators coexist today. >> >> >> >> - >> Mike Hammett >> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> >> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> >> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> >> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> >> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> >> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> >> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> >> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> >> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> >> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> >> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> >> >> >> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> >> -- >> *From: *"Steve Jones" >> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" >> *Sent: *Friday, February 21, 2020 12:31:28 PM >> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance >> >> people worry about the contiguous block issue too much. The longest you >> would go with a non contiguous grant is a day. When the sas get jiggy with >> each other at night the channels will be redistributed in contiguous blocks. >> >> Getting 4 channels for a 40mhz will happen for a period, but man is that >> a bad business decision for the long term unless there is zero competition >> >> On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:34 AM Ken Hohhof wrote: >> >>> The answer is a bit complicated, for example I suspect the SAS could >>> give you a grant, but not at the full xmt power a 450m is capable of, so >>> your range and modulation is reduced. >>> >>> >>> >>> Probably nobody knows the answer. A few WISPs who participated in ICD >>> might have some idea. But if you are asking can you count on getting 80 >>> MHz out of a total 150 MHz, and also as 2 contiguous blocks, I think we >>> know the answer. Even if it happened initially, that seems unlikely long >>> term. >>> >>> >>> >>> Much advertising hype in our business is based on “could it happen” >>> rather than “can we count on it”. That works with 5G because they are >>> talking about everybody getting gigabit speeds but if everybody only gets >>> 1/10 of that it’s still pretty damn fast. Not sure the same applies if you >>> talk about everybody getting 100 meg but most of the time it’s more like 10 >>> meg. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> *From:* AF *On Behalf Of *castarritt . >>> *Sent:* Friday, February 21, 2020 9:11 AM >>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group >>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance >>> >>> >>> >>> The other important question is if we can count on getting a >>> contiguous 40mhz channel from the SAS, much less two of them to run a full >>> cluster of 450m in ABAB. >>> >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:59 AM Matt Mangriotis via AF >>> wrote: >>> >>> Using 450i or 450b on the SM (client) side, a real world aggregate speed >>> test can be as high as 250 Mbps. If you have cnMeudsa (450m AP) for the >>> sector, you can achieve >750 Mbps (theoretically up to 1 Gbps, but I would >>> be lying to tell you I have ever seen this kind of efficiency in the real >>> world) sector capacity due to the Multi-User MIMO capabilities (i.e. >>> simultaneous transmissions to up to 4 clients in the same time slot). >>> >>> >>> >>> Running under Part 90 or Part 96 does not affect the system performance >>> (provided the channel size is the same, of course). >>> >>> >>> >>> Matt
Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance
Is it possible to sync Cambium with LTE gear? On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:36 PM Mike Hammett wrote: > There's also advantage to coexistence groups, though as I understand it, > that's a SAS value add and not a requirement. > > As I understand it, a group of operators could form a co-existence group > to ignore each other when determining availability. This would be used when > a group of operators agreed to the same timing, uplink\downlink, etc. > settings so that they didn't interfere with each other... like how > GPS-based operators coexist today. > > > > - > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> > <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> > <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> > Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> > <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> > The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> > > > <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> > ------ > *From: *"Steve Jones" > *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" > *Sent: *Friday, February 21, 2020 12:31:28 PM > *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance > > people worry about the contiguous block issue too much. The longest you > would go with a non contiguous grant is a day. When the sas get jiggy with > each other at night the channels will be redistributed in contiguous blocks. > > Getting 4 channels for a 40mhz will happen for a period, but man is that a > bad business decision for the long term unless there is zero competition > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:34 AM Ken Hohhof wrote: > >> The answer is a bit complicated, for example I suspect the SAS could give >> you a grant, but not at the full xmt power a 450m is capable of, so your >> range and modulation is reduced. >> >> >> >> Probably nobody knows the answer. A few WISPs who participated in ICD >> might have some idea. But if you are asking can you count on getting 80 >> MHz out of a total 150 MHz, and also as 2 contiguous blocks, I think we >> know the answer. Even if it happened initially, that seems unlikely long >> term. >> >> >> >> Much advertising hype in our business is based on “could it happen” >> rather than “can we count on it”. That works with 5G because they are >> talking about everybody getting gigabit speeds but if everybody only gets >> 1/10 of that it’s still pretty damn fast. Not sure the same applies if you >> talk about everybody getting 100 meg but most of the time it’s more like 10 >> meg. >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* AF *On Behalf Of *castarritt . >> *Sent:* Friday, February 21, 2020 9:11 AM >> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance >> >> >> >> The other important question is if we can count on getting a >> contiguous 40mhz channel from the SAS, much less two of them to run a full >> cluster of 450m in ABAB. >> >> >> >> On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:59 AM Matt Mangriotis via AF >> wrote: >> >> Using 450i or 450b on the SM (client) side, a real world aggregate speed >> test can be as high as 250 Mbps. If you have cnMeudsa (450m AP) for the >> sector, you can achieve >750 Mbps (theoretically up to 1 Gbps, but I would >> be lying to tell you I have ever seen this kind of efficiency in the real >> world) sector capacity due to the Multi-User MIMO capabilities (i.e. >> simultaneous transmissions to up to 4 clients in the same time slot). >> >> >> >> Running under Part 90 or Part 96 does not affect the system performance >> (provided the channel size is the same, of course). >> >> >> >> Matt >> >> >> >> *From:* AF *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz via AF >> *Sent:* Thursday, February 20, 2020 6:31 PM >> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' >> *Cc:* Peter Kranz >> *Subject:* [ External ] [AFMUG] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance >> >> >> >> What is the real world expected station performance in a TCP speedtest >> running a 40Mhz channel with a 450m running the CBRS software? >> >> >> >> >> *Peter Kranz*www.UnwiredLtd.com >> <https://nam05.safe
Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance
There's also advantage to coexistence groups, though as I understand it, that's a SAS value add and not a requirement. As I understand it, a group of operators could form a co-existence group to ignore each other when determining availability. This would be used when a group of operators agreed to the same timing, uplink\downlink, etc. settings so that they didn't interfere with each other... like how GPS-based operators coexist today. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions Midwest Internet Exchange The Brothers WISP - Original Message - From: "Steve Jones" To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" Sent: Friday, February 21, 2020 12:31:28 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance people worry about the contiguous block issue too much. The longest you would go with a non contiguous grant is a day. When the sas get jiggy with each other at night the channels will be redistributed in contiguous blocks. Getting 4 channels for a 40mhz will happen for a period, but man is that a bad business decision for the long term unless there is zero competition On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:34 AM Ken Hohhof < af...@kwisp.com > wrote: The answer is a bit complicated, for example I suspect the SAS could give you a grant, but not at the full xmt power a 450m is capable of, so your range and modulation is reduced. Probably nobody knows the answer. A few WISPs who participated in ICD might have some idea. But if you are asking can you count on getting 80 MHz out of a total 150 MHz, and also as 2 contiguous blocks, I think we know the answer. Even if it happened initially, that seems unlikely long term. Much advertising hype in our business is based on “could it happen” rather than “can we count on it”. That works with 5G because they are talking about everybody getting gigabit speeds but if everybody only gets 1/10 of that it’s still pretty damn fast. Not sure the same applies if you talk about everybody getting 100 meg but most of the time it’s more like 10 meg. From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of castarritt . Sent: Friday, February 21, 2020 9:11 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance The other important question is if we can count on getting a contiguous 40mhz channel from the SAS, much less two of them to run a full cluster of 450m in ABAB. On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:59 AM Matt Mangriotis via AF < af@af.afmug.com > wrote: Using 450i or 450b on the SM (client) side, a real world aggregate speed test can be as high as 250 Mbps. If you have cnMeudsa (450m AP) for the sector, you can achieve >750 Mbps (theoretically up to 1 Gbps, but I would be lying to tell you I have ever seen this kind of efficiency in the real world) sector capacity due to the Multi-User MIMO capabilities (i.e. simultaneous transmissions to up to 4 clients in the same time slot). Running under Part 90 or Part 96 does not affect the system performance (provided the channel size is the same, of course). Matt From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Peter Kranz via AF Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2020 6:31 PM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' < af@af.afmug.com > Cc: Peter Kranz < pkr...@unwiredltd.com > Subject: [ External ] [AFMUG] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance What is the real world expected station performance in a TCP speedtest running a 40Mhz channel with a 450m running the CBRS software? Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance
people worry about the contiguous block issue too much. The longest you would go with a non contiguous grant is a day. When the sas get jiggy with each other at night the channels will be redistributed in contiguous blocks. Getting 4 channels for a 40mhz will happen for a period, but man is that a bad business decision for the long term unless there is zero competition On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 10:34 AM Ken Hohhof wrote: > The answer is a bit complicated, for example I suspect the SAS could give > you a grant, but not at the full xmt power a 450m is capable of, so your > range and modulation is reduced. > > > > Probably nobody knows the answer. A few WISPs who participated in ICD > might have some idea. But if you are asking can you count on getting 80 > MHz out of a total 150 MHz, and also as 2 contiguous blocks, I think we > know the answer. Even if it happened initially, that seems unlikely long > term. > > > > Much advertising hype in our business is based on “could it happen” rather > than “can we count on it”. That works with 5G because they are talking > about everybody getting gigabit speeds but if everybody only gets 1/10 of > that it’s still pretty damn fast. Not sure the same applies if you talk > about everybody getting 100 meg but most of the time it’s more like 10 meg. > > > > > > *From:* AF *On Behalf Of *castarritt . > *Sent:* Friday, February 21, 2020 9:11 AM > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance > > > > The other important question is if we can count on getting a > contiguous 40mhz channel from the SAS, much less two of them to run a full > cluster of 450m in ABAB. > > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:59 AM Matt Mangriotis via AF > wrote: > > Using 450i or 450b on the SM (client) side, a real world aggregate speed > test can be as high as 250 Mbps. If you have cnMeudsa (450m AP) for the > sector, you can achieve >750 Mbps (theoretically up to 1 Gbps, but I would > be lying to tell you I have ever seen this kind of efficiency in the real > world) sector capacity due to the Multi-User MIMO capabilities (i.e. > simultaneous transmissions to up to 4 clients in the same time slot). > > > > Running under Part 90 or Part 96 does not affect the system performance > (provided the channel size is the same, of course). > > > > Matt > > > > *From:* AF *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz via AF > *Sent:* Thursday, February 20, 2020 6:31 PM > *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' > *Cc:* Peter Kranz > *Subject:* [ External ] [AFMUG] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance > > > > What is the real world expected station performance in a TCP speedtest > running a 40Mhz channel with a 450m running the CBRS software? > > > > > *Peter Kranz*www.UnwiredLtd.com > <https://nam05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.unwiredltd.com%2F=02%7C01%7Cmatt.mangriotis%40cambiumnetworks.com%7C754d6b42c39f4416aded08d7b6657af6%7C0e263e36340946228ac818d993e76eb6%7C0%7C0%7C637178419289348066=OPw7empnbwc2kPgGzH90j1T5uzlyjAdoA6mlfONSX5g%3D=0> > Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 > Mobile: 510-207- > pkr...@unwiredltd.com > > > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance
The answer is a bit complicated, for example I suspect the SAS could give you a grant, but not at the full xmt power a 450m is capable of, so your range and modulation is reduced. Probably nobody knows the answer. A few WISPs who participated in ICD might have some idea. But if you are asking can you count on getting 80 MHz out of a total 150 MHz, and also as 2 contiguous blocks, I think we know the answer. Even if it happened initially, that seems unlikely long term. Much advertising hype in our business is based on “could it happen” rather than “can we count on it”. That works with 5G because they are talking about everybody getting gigabit speeds but if everybody only gets 1/10 of that it’s still pretty damn fast. Not sure the same applies if you talk about everybody getting 100 meg but most of the time it’s more like 10 meg. From: AF On Behalf Of castarritt . Sent: Friday, February 21, 2020 9:11 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance The other important question is if we can count on getting a contiguous 40mhz channel from the SAS, much less two of them to run a full cluster of 450m in ABAB. On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:59 AM Matt Mangriotis via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > wrote: Using 450i or 450b on the SM (client) side, a real world aggregate speed test can be as high as 250 Mbps. If you have cnMeudsa (450m AP) for the sector, you can achieve >750 Mbps (theoretically up to 1 Gbps, but I would be lying to tell you I have ever seen this kind of efficiency in the real world) sector capacity due to the Multi-User MIMO capabilities (i.e. simultaneous transmissions to up to 4 clients in the same time slot). Running under Part 90 or Part 96 does not affect the system performance (provided the channel size is the same, of course). Matt From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf Of Peter Kranz via AF Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2020 6:31 PM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > Cc: Peter Kranz mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com> > Subject: [ External ] [AFMUG] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance What is the real world expected station performance in a TCP speedtest running a 40Mhz channel with a 450m running the CBRS software? Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com <https://nam05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.unwiredltd.com%2F=02%7C01%7Cmatt.mangriotis%40cambiumnetworks.com%7C754d6b42c39f4416aded08d7b6657af6%7C0e263e36340946228ac818d993e76eb6%7C0%7C0%7C637178419289348066=OPw7empnbwc2kPgGzH90j1T5uzlyjAdoA6mlfONSX5g%3D=0> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com <mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com> -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance
The other important question is if we can count on getting a contiguous 40mhz channel from the SAS, much less two of them to run a full cluster of 450m in ABAB. On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:59 AM Matt Mangriotis via AF wrote: > Using 450i or 450b on the SM (client) side, a real world aggregate speed > test can be as high as 250 Mbps. If you have cnMeudsa (450m AP) for the > sector, you can achieve >750 Mbps (theoretically up to 1 Gbps, but I would > be lying to tell you I have ever seen this kind of efficiency in the real > world) sector capacity due to the Multi-User MIMO capabilities (i.e. > simultaneous transmissions to up to 4 clients in the same time slot). > > > > Running under Part 90 or Part 96 does not affect the system performance > (provided the channel size is the same, of course). > > > > Matt > > > > *From:* AF *On Behalf Of * Peter Kranz via AF > *Sent:* Thursday, February 20, 2020 6:31 PM > *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' > *Cc:* Peter Kranz > *Subject:* [ External ] [AFMUG] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance > > > > What is the real world expected station performance in a TCP speedtest > running a 40Mhz channel with a 450m running the CBRS software? > > > > > *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com > <https://nam05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.unwiredltd.com%2F=02%7C01%7Cmatt.mangriotis%40cambiumnetworks.com%7C754d6b42c39f4416aded08d7b6657af6%7C0e263e36340946228ac818d993e76eb6%7C0%7C0%7C637178419289348066=OPw7empnbwc2kPgGzH90j1T5uzlyjAdoA6mlfONSX5g%3D=0> > Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 > Mobile: 510-207- > pkr...@unwiredltd.com > > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance
Using 450i or 450b on the SM (client) side, a real world aggregate speed test can be as high as 250 Mbps. If you have cnMeudsa (450m AP) for the sector, you can achieve >750 Mbps (theoretically up to 1 Gbps, but I would be lying to tell you I have ever seen this kind of efficiency in the real world) sector capacity due to the Multi-User MIMO capabilities (i.e. simultaneous transmissions to up to 4 clients in the same time slot). Running under Part 90 or Part 96 does not affect the system performance (provided the channel size is the same, of course). Matt From: AF On Behalf Of Peter Kranz via AF Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2020 6:31 PM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' Cc: Peter Kranz Subject: [ External ] [AFMUG] 450m in 3.5Ghz max STA performance What is the real world expected station performance in a TCP speedtest running a 40Mhz channel with a 450m running the CBRS software? Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com<https://nam05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.unwiredltd.com%2F=02%7C01%7Cmatt.mangriotis%40cambiumnetworks.com%7C754d6b42c39f4416aded08d7b6657af6%7C0e263e36340946228ac818d993e76eb6%7C0%7C0%7C637178419289348066=OPw7empnbwc2kPgGzH90j1T5uzlyjAdoA6mlfONSX5g%3D=0> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com<mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com> -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
