Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
Didn't you know that the radios are free? We bury the cost in service charges. besides, we've never had a radio killed by lighning. bp On 10/6/2015 5:02 PM, Eric Kuhnke wrote: You were OK with voiding the warranty from day one on something as expensive as a PMP450 radio? On 10/6/15 4:51 PM, Bill Prince wrote: We opened up all the ground lug equipped radios we got and removed the ground lug. Filled the hole with RTV and moved on. bp On 10/6/2015 4:50 PM, George Skorup wrote: We had a bunch of SecurAlign MAX and LT-18 dishes and had to replaced them all with KP's because of the stupid ground lug on the early 2.4 and 5GHz 450 SMs. And of course the 3.6 SM is a completely different case. On 10/6/2015 6:47 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: I may be thinking of something different. I recall one product needing a different arm to work efficiently. Maybe it was epmp. I will shut up now. -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 4:34 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster Why? -Original Message- From: SmarterBroadband Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 6:20 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I think you may need a different arm on the reflector for 450? -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 12:35 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: - operating in 5.7 GHz - 19 dBm xmt power on AP - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP xmt) - straight down the middle of the sector - downtilt properly adjusted on sector - no multipath or rain fading At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
You were OK with voiding the warranty from day one on something as expensive as a PMP450 radio? On 10/6/15 4:51 PM, Bill Prince wrote: We opened up all the ground lug equipped radios we got and removed the ground lug. Filled the hole with RTV and moved on. bp On 10/6/2015 4:50 PM, George Skorup wrote: We had a bunch of SecurAlign MAX and LT-18 dishes and had to replaced them all with KP's because of the stupid ground lug on the early 2.4 and 5GHz 450 SMs. And of course the 3.6 SM is a completely different case. On 10/6/2015 6:47 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: I may be thinking of something different. I recall one product needing a different arm to work efficiently. Maybe it was epmp. I will shut up now. -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 4:34 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster Why? -Original Message- From: SmarterBroadband Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 6:20 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I think you may need a different arm on the reflector for 450? -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 12:35 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: - operating in 5.7 GHz - 19 dBm xmt power on AP - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP xmt) - straight down the middle of the sector - downtilt properly adjusted on sector - no multipath or rain fading At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
That sounds more likely. We have swapped out a lot of 5 GHz FSK for 450 on the same dishes (27RD or KPP) and it works fine. I would have to ask the guy who did them whether the alignment ever needs touching up. I don't think so, but I think we always check it. If the FSK was 2.4, I would definitely check the alignment if only because aligning 2.4 FSK was imprecise due to wide beam and tendency to max out the alignment tone. -Original Message- From: SmarterBroadband Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 6:47 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I may be thinking of something different. I recall one product needing a different arm to work efficiently. Maybe it was epmp. I will shut up now. -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 4:34 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster Why? -Original Message- From: SmarterBroadband Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 6:20 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I think you may need a different arm on the reflector for 450? -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 12:35 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: - operating in 5.7 GHz - 19 dBm xmt power on AP - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP xmt) - straight down the middle of the sector - downtilt properly adjusted on sector - no multipath or rain fading At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
WB has a different arm/reflector for ePMP to get it to work best I think. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 7:47 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: > I may be thinking of something different. I recall one product needing a > different arm to work efficiently. > Maybe it was epmp. > I will shut up now. > > -Original Message- > From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof > Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 4:34 PM > To: af@afmug.com > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster > > Why? > > -Original Message- > From: SmarterBroadband > Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 6:20 PM > To: af@afmug.com > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster > > I think you may need a different arm on the reflector for 450? > > > > -Original Message- > From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt > Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 12:35 PM > To: af@afmug.com > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster > > > I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: > > > > - operating in 5.7 GHz > > - 19 dBm xmt power on AP > > - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 > > EIRP > > xmt) > > - straight down the middle of the sector > > - downtilt properly adjusted on sector > > - no multipath or rain fading > > > > At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. > > Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am > about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. > AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps > downlink test. > > Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty > old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back > from when PMP450 line first started shipping. > > This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping > to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of > higher tier users that had LOS. > > > I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. > > I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What > > kind of signal should I have at this range? > > > > >
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
Stop being so... logical. On 10/6/2015 6:51 PM, Bill Prince wrote: We opened up all the ground lug equipped radios we got and removed the ground lug. Filled the hole with RTV and moved on. bp On 10/6/2015 4:50 PM, George Skorup wrote: We had a bunch of SecurAlign MAX and LT-18 dishes and had to replaced them all with KP's because of the stupid ground lug on the early 2.4 and 5GHz 450 SMs. And of course the 3.6 SM is a completely different case. On 10/6/2015 6:47 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: I may be thinking of something different. I recall one product needing a different arm to work efficiently. Maybe it was epmp. I will shut up now. -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 4:34 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster Why? -Original Message- From: SmarterBroadband Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 6:20 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I think you may need a different arm on the reflector for 450? -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 12:35 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: - operating in 5.7 GHz - 19 dBm xmt power on AP - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP xmt) - straight down the middle of the sector - downtilt properly adjusted on sector - no multipath or rain fading At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
We opened up all the ground lug equipped radios we got and removed the ground lug. Filled the hole with RTV and moved on. bp On 10/6/2015 4:50 PM, George Skorup wrote: We had a bunch of SecurAlign MAX and LT-18 dishes and had to replaced them all with KP's because of the stupid ground lug on the early 2.4 and 5GHz 450 SMs. And of course the 3.6 SM is a completely different case. On 10/6/2015 6:47 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: I may be thinking of something different. I recall one product needing a different arm to work efficiently. Maybe it was epmp. I will shut up now. -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 4:34 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster Why? -Original Message- From: SmarterBroadband Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 6:20 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I think you may need a different arm on the reflector for 450? -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 12:35 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: - operating in 5.7 GHz - 19 dBm xmt power on AP - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP xmt) - straight down the middle of the sector - downtilt properly adjusted on sector - no multipath or rain fading At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
We had a bunch of SecurAlign MAX and LT-18 dishes and had to replaced them all with KP's because of the stupid ground lug on the early 2.4 and 5GHz 450 SMs. And of course the 3.6 SM is a completely different case. On 10/6/2015 6:47 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: I may be thinking of something different. I recall one product needing a different arm to work efficiently. Maybe it was epmp. I will shut up now. -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 4:34 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster Why? -Original Message- From: SmarterBroadband Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 6:20 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I think you may need a different arm on the reflector for 450? -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 12:35 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: - operating in 5.7 GHz - 19 dBm xmt power on AP - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP xmt) - straight down the middle of the sector - downtilt properly adjusted on sector - no multipath or rain fading At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
I may be thinking of something different. I recall one product needing a different arm to work efficiently. Maybe it was epmp. I will shut up now. -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 4:34 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster Why? -Original Message- From: SmarterBroadband Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 6:20 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I think you may need a different arm on the reflector for 450? -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 12:35 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster > I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: > > - operating in 5.7 GHz > - 19 dBm xmt power on AP > - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 > EIRP > xmt) > - straight down the middle of the sector > - downtilt properly adjusted on sector > - no multipath or rain fading > > At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. > I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. > I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What > kind of signal should I have at this range? >
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
Why? -Original Message- From: SmarterBroadband Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 6:20 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I think you may need a different arm on the reflector for 450? -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 12:35 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: - operating in 5.7 GHz - 19 dBm xmt power on AP - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP xmt) - straight down the middle of the sector - downtilt properly adjusted on sector - no multipath or rain fading At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
I think you may need a different arm on the reflector for 450? -Original Message- From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 12:35 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster > I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: > > - operating in 5.7 GHz > - 19 dBm xmt power on AP > - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 > EIRP > xmt) > - straight down the middle of the sector > - downtilt properly adjusted on sector > - no multipath or rain fading > > At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. > I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. > I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What > kind of signal should I have at this range? >
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
The Cambium/Laird antennas also have null-fill. We install them level at anywhere between 120 and 235 feet and it seems to work fine. I would second the suggestion for running your SM links in LinkPlanner or RadioMobile. On 10/6/2015 3:21 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote: That is a good idea, but that said, we have achieved the expected results with a digital level on the back of the sector and setting for either 0 or 1.5 degrees mechanical downtilt depending on the site. -Original Message- From: Bill Prince Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 3:15 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster The dual-polarity sectors have a pretty narrow vertical beam width. We've found it useful to select the subs at the edges of the sector, and adjust the vertical/horizontal on the AP until we get optimum results. bp On 10/6/2015 1:10 PM, Matt wrote: This CPE has all new cable, new KP dish and aligned when the 450 went in. I was told that the top 75 percent of 300 foot tower is visible from dish mount as well. Sectors mounted near the top of tower and no shadows either. The signal seems to be about this or bit worse whenever I check actually. I wanted to overlay a number of sites like this so quite frustrating. Not going to go well if I only have 22mbps downstream to share at 6 miles. Wandering if these old ap's are bit flaky. I will likely go back up and check sectors aiming etc again but everything looked good last time. Was thinking of purchasing another new 450 lite AP to try swapping it out. Well, you're losing about 10 dB somewhere. You should be losing less than 3 dB at 30 degrees since it's a 65 degree sector at the 3 dB points. If you are reusing dishes, what kind of dish? Are these Cambium/KPP dishes? Did you tweak up the alignment after replacing the 2.4 SM? Any chance the sector downtilt is off? Are you graphing the signal? Does it stay steady, or vary throughout the day like maybe you have some multipath? The numbers I quoted are based on actual deployment, although they line up with path calcs. So you should be able to achieve them. -Original Message- From: Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 2:35 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: - operating in 5.7 GHz - 19 dBm xmt power on AP - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP xmt) - straight down the middle of the sector - downtilt properly adjusted on sector - no multipath or rain fading At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
That is a good idea, but that said, we have achieved the expected results with a digital level on the back of the sector and setting for either 0 or 1.5 degrees mechanical downtilt depending on the site. -Original Message- From: Bill Prince Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 3:15 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster The dual-polarity sectors have a pretty narrow vertical beam width. We've found it useful to select the subs at the edges of the sector, and adjust the vertical/horizontal on the AP until we get optimum results. bp On 10/6/2015 1:10 PM, Matt wrote: This CPE has all new cable, new KP dish and aligned when the 450 went in. I was told that the top 75 percent of 300 foot tower is visible from dish mount as well. Sectors mounted near the top of tower and no shadows either. The signal seems to be about this or bit worse whenever I check actually. I wanted to overlay a number of sites like this so quite frustrating. Not going to go well if I only have 22mbps downstream to share at 6 miles. Wandering if these old ap's are bit flaky. I will likely go back up and check sectors aiming etc again but everything looked good last time. Was thinking of purchasing another new 450 lite AP to try swapping it out. Well, you're losing about 10 dB somewhere. You should be losing less than 3 dB at 30 degrees since it's a 65 degree sector at the 3 dB points. If you are reusing dishes, what kind of dish? Are these Cambium/KPP dishes? Did you tweak up the alignment after replacing the 2.4 SM? Any chance the sector downtilt is off? Are you graphing the signal? Does it stay steady, or vary throughout the day like maybe you have some multipath? The numbers I quoted are based on actual deployment, although they line up with path calcs. So you should be able to achieve them. -Original Message- From: Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 2:35 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: - operating in 5.7 GHz - 19 dBm xmt power on AP - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP xmt) - straight down the middle of the sector - downtilt properly adjusted on sector - no multipath or rain fading At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
The dual-polarity sectors have a pretty narrow vertical beam width. We've found it useful to select the subs at the edges of the sector, and adjust the vertical/horizontal on the AP until we get optimum results. bp On 10/6/2015 1:10 PM, Matt wrote: This CPE has all new cable, new KP dish and aligned when the 450 went in. I was told that the top 75 percent of 300 foot tower is visible from dish mount as well. Sectors mounted near the top of tower and no shadows either. The signal seems to be about this or bit worse whenever I check actually. I wanted to overlay a number of sites like this so quite frustrating. Not going to go well if I only have 22mbps downstream to share at 6 miles. Wandering if these old ap's are bit flaky. I will likely go back up and check sectors aiming etc again but everything looked good last time. Was thinking of purchasing another new 450 lite AP to try swapping it out. Well, you're losing about 10 dB somewhere. You should be losing less than 3 dB at 30 degrees since it's a 65 degree sector at the 3 dB points. If you are reusing dishes, what kind of dish? Are these Cambium/KPP dishes? Did you tweak up the alignment after replacing the 2.4 SM? Any chance the sector downtilt is off? Are you graphing the signal? Does it stay steady, or vary throughout the day like maybe you have some multipath? The numbers I quoted are based on actual deployment, although they line up with path calcs. So you should be able to achieve them. -Original Message- From: Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 2:35 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: - operating in 5.7 GHz - 19 dBm xmt power on AP - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP xmt) - straight down the middle of the sector - downtilt properly adjusted on sector - no multipath or rain fading At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
This CPE has all new cable, new KP dish and aligned when the 450 went in. I was told that the top 75 percent of 300 foot tower is visible from dish mount as well. Sectors mounted near the top of tower and no shadows either. The signal seems to be about this or bit worse whenever I check actually. I wanted to overlay a number of sites like this so quite frustrating. Not going to go well if I only have 22mbps downstream to share at 6 miles. Wandering if these old ap's are bit flaky. I will likely go back up and check sectors aiming etc again but everything looked good last time. Was thinking of purchasing another new 450 lite AP to try swapping it out. > Well, you're losing about 10 dB somewhere. You should be losing less than 3 > dB at 30 degrees since it's a 65 degree sector at the 3 dB points. > > If you are reusing dishes, what kind of dish? Are these Cambium/KPP dishes? > Did you tweak up the alignment after replacing the 2.4 SM? Any chance the > sector downtilt is off? > > Are you graphing the signal? Does it stay steady, or vary throughout the > day like maybe you have some multipath? > > The numbers I quoted are based on actual deployment, although they line up > with path calcs. So you should be able to achieve them. > > > -Original Message- From: Matt > Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 2:35 PM > To: af@afmug.com > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster > >> I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: >> >> - operating in 5.7 GHz >> - 19 dBm xmt power on AP >> - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP >> xmt) >> - straight down the middle of the sector >> - downtilt properly adjusted on sector >> - no multipath or rain fading >> >> At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. > > > Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I > am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link > status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) > with 22mbps downlink test. > > Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are > pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they > are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. > > This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was > hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing > reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. > >> I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. >> I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What >> kind of signal should I have at this range? >> > >
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
FYI the 90* antennas are actually ~60* antennas at the 3db roll off point. The 90* is at the 6db roll off point. So if you want a full 360* coverage I'd recommend 6 APs Also down tilt matters a lot since the antennas only have 6* vertical beam unlike PMP100 that has a 60* vertical beam. I'd leave the SM in place an go to the tower and tune the AP. Lastly as someone mentioned you can use link planner (from the cambium site) to very accurately predict the signal level. -Sean On Tuesday, October 6, 2015, Matt wrote: > I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. > I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What > kind of signal should I have at this range? >
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
Want to know for sure try running this in link planner and this should give you a real good idea of what to look for On 10/06/2015 01:13 PM, Matt wrote: I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
Well, you're losing about 10 dB somewhere. You should be losing less than 3 dB at 30 degrees since it's a 65 degree sector at the 3 dB points. If you are reusing dishes, what kind of dish? Are these Cambium/KPP dishes? Did you tweak up the alignment after replacing the 2.4 SM? Any chance the sector downtilt is off? Are you graphing the signal? Does it stay steady, or vary throughout the day like maybe you have some multipath? The numbers I quoted are based on actual deployment, although they line up with path calcs. So you should be able to achieve them. -Original Message- From: Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 2:35 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: - operating in 5.7 GHz - 19 dBm xmt power on AP - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP xmt) - straight down the middle of the sector - downtilt properly adjusted on sector - no multipath or rain fading At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
> I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: > > - operating in 5.7 GHz > - 19 dBm xmt power on AP > - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP > xmt) > - straight down the middle of the sector > - downtilt properly adjusted on sector > - no multipath or rain fading > > At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. Your assumptions are pretty well right on my system setup. Except I am about 30 degrees from center of sector on this SM. This is my link status. AP -76.0 (-79.6 V / -78.5 H) SM -80.5 (-83.0 V / -84.0 H) with 22mbps downlink test. Expected more. The cambium 90 sector antennas are new but AP's are pretty old pulls from a deployment that never panned out. Think they are back from when PMP450 line first started shipping. This site has a PMP100 2.4 cluster running out of capacity. Was hopping to overlay with 5.8 450 and just drop the SM's in existing reflectors of higher tier users that had LOS. > I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. > I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What > kind of signal should I have at this range? >
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
Probably about -69 at the SM. That's free space loss with no other factors. On 10/6/2015 1:13 PM, Matt wrote: I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
OK, nevermind, Ken explained it better. On 10/6/2015 1:28 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote: I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: - operating in 5.7 GHz - 19 dBm xmt power on AP - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP xmt) - straight down the middle of the sector - downtilt properly adjusted on sector - no multipath or rain fading At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. -Original Message- From: Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 1:13 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
I would expect -67 to -70 under the following assumptions: - operating in 5.7 GHz - 19 dBm xmt power on AP - measuring rcv signal at SM (higher at AP because SM can exceed +36 EIRP xmt) - straight down the middle of the sector - downtilt properly adjusted on sector - no multipath or rain fading At the edge of a sector (+/- 45 degrees azimuth) expect to lose 5-6 dB. -Original Message- From: Matt Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2015 1:13 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What kind of signal should I have at this range?
Re: [AFMUG] Cambium PMP 450 5GHZ Cluster
What sectors? What TX power/band? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 2:13 PM, Matt wrote: > I just deployed 4 90 degree Cambium 450 sectors on a 300 foot tower. > I have a very clear LOS CPE at 6 miles with a reflector dish. What > kind of signal should I have at this range? >
