Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 8/17/10 08:20 , nexbug wrote: Face it, This is just a ploy by msft and apl to distract android devs from writing code And make them spend all the time speculating and starting flame wars. So, as I said, we'd just keep on writing code and improve our apps! Right? - -- Fabrizio Giudici - Java Architect, Project Manager Tidalwave s.a.s. - We make Java work. Everywhere. java.net/blog/fabriziogiudici - www.tidalwave.it/people fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.0.14 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkxqQAIACgkQeDweFqgUGxdrhQCggTw57DvV4M5bYDqibHP8NyyD uK0AnRLvHHX29U8t/LHJCHg1VLTUuWeq =tPeG -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
RE: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
Wow--the thought that Larry Ellison would do something at the request of Ballmer and/or Jobs is just well, the acronym ROFLMAO just doesn't do it justice. Of course, the TRUTH that they don't want you to know is that the whole show worldwide is a deep conspiracy orchestrated by a secret cabal owned by the Girl Scouts, the Screen Actors' Guild and the Illuminati anyway, so In all honesty, I think the author of the article is right--Oracle wants Google to acknowledge that Oracle has ownership over Java and thus deserves to be cut in to the Android licensing deal somehow. It might even be that Oracle counsel felt that they had to take this step to prevent any other companies from doing something similar or even more infringing on the Java name/brand/IP. Remember, if you don't defend your ownership of IP, the courts look at that as an active surrender of that IP to the public domain. Ted Neward Java, .NET, XML Services Consulting, Teaching, Speaking, Writing http://www.tedneward.com -Original Message- From: android-developers@googlegroups.com [mailto:android- develop...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of nexbug Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 11:20 PM To: Android Developers Subject: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android Face it, This is just a ploy by msft and apl to distract android devs from writing code And make them spend all the time speculating and starting flame wars. On Aug 16, 1:30 pm, Frank Weiss fewe...@gmail.com wrote: Fabrizio, thanks for sharing that Forbes article (http://blogs.forbes.com/taylorbuley/2010/08/13/android-lawsuit-is- rea...). It confirmed some of my thinking, but added the interesting bear hug angle. I wonder if that is really the case. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 8/16/10 05:07 , DanH wrote: Having written 13 software patents, I'm well aware that many are very weak, or, if not weak, very narrow. But proving all that in a court of law is the trick -- the presumption is that the patent, having been cleared by the patent office, is valid. (I'd have several more patents if it weren't for the ones the PO rejected because of supposed prior art, even though the quoted prior art had no relation to the area of my applications.) Exactly. I don't think that Oracle made such an obvious mistake, even though the patents might be actually weak. They can anyway cause harm to Google with the trial thing. This only consolidates the idea that Oracle doesn't want to shut down Android, but come to a deal (maybe I'm wrong, but note that even though Oracle officially asked to withdraw and destroy Android, they didn't ask for a temporary suspension of Android activities until the trial is finished). If the deal is only money, it won't affect us in any way. If the deal is also about changes in the way Android is, it will affect us. I think there are both positive and negative outcomes - but until they come to a deal, we really can't know. - -- Fabrizio Giudici - Java Architect, Project Manager Tidalwave s.a.s. - We make Java work. Everywhere. java.net/blog/fabriziogiudici - www.tidalwave.it/people fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.0.14 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkxo7g0ACgkQeDweFqgUGxdKiACdEHWE9jpxcpbONq9SttNgs3tP xZ4AnRyE3V5sQD2k5ASP4L3S9pLn2icg =Y+xk -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Suggested read: http://blogs.forbes.com/taylorbuley/2010/08/13/android-lawsuit-is-really-just-oracle-flirting-with-google/ - -- Fabrizio Giudici - Java Architect, Project Manager Tidalwave s.a.s. - We make Java work. Everywhere. java.net/blog/fabriziogiudici - www.tidalwave.it/people fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.0.14 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkxo8dwACgkQeDweFqgUGxcXuQCcCiFY+IC2kXMsWzbejUXOtRqb qjMAmQHJBRWpCQTOoCfjd00bLwMh+aMZ =m91m -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
Fabrizio, thanks for sharing that Forbes article (http://blogs.forbes.com/taylorbuley/2010/08/13/android-lawsuit-is-really-just-oracle-flirting-with-google/). It confirmed some of my thinking, but added the interesting bear hug angle. I wonder if that is really the case. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 8/14/10 23:04 , Sebastián Treu wrote: The problem it's not if Oracle wants to shutdown Android. The problem is how this will *affect* the android platform both acceptance and distribution. Android is new and it's making his way in the market. With this issue on the horizon, how will affect Android to be the choice of phone makers? Will you risk, as a phone maker, to continue supporting Android and distributing it in your phone without knowing what is happening behind the scenes? Good points, but Android has already made its way in the market. The same day Oracle filed the complaint (not a coincidence IMHO) there was the news that Android has passed iPhone in the USA and it's #2 on the USA market. So, it's well consolidated. The Oracle legal issue might certainly make some damage, but it largely depends on how long the trial will go on. I suppose that time is precisely one of the cards that Oracle is playing. If they settle down to an agreement in a relatively short time, we won't be affected by any major problem. So, there are still some months before one should be worried, I think. - -- Fabrizio Giudici - Java Architect, Project Manager Tidalwave s.a.s. - We make Java work. Everywhere. java.net/blog/fabriziogiudici - www.tidalwave.it/people fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.0.14 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkxnpDcACgkQeDweFqgUGxcgagCgj82bwFlhqpq0BuyUC2cB9ohp HW8An2zqzHyjRX1inXC8VbBAW1g7qdo2 =bTFY -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
James Gozlin was saying that during discussions with Oracle prior to them taking over Sun that they knew the kind of situation Google was in, and their lawyers' eyes sparkled at the thought of suing Google. Check out the full blog article and the discussion it sparked: http://nighthacks.com/roller/jag/entry/the_shit_finally_hits_the Llies +44(0)7766541551 - Reply message - From: Fabrizio Giudici fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it Date: Sat, Aug 14, 2010 15:34 Subject: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android To: android-developers@googlegroups.com Cc: netlander merid...@gmail.com -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 8/14/10 12:27 , netlander wrote: Now! can anyone (Google guys?) enlighten us on what's the lawsuit about? You can bet that none of Google will talk about this in the mailing lists :-) I suppose only lawyers, spokesmen and some executives will be allowed to talk in the next weeks. My point is that we developers should not be much worried about that. I don't think that Oracle has any real intention to shut down Android, since it's a pot of money. You usually want to have a part of it, or be part of the game, not to destroy it. My principal concerns about Android are the same as one week ago, that is to make my app work at best. - -- Fabrizio Giudici - Java Architect, Project Manager Tidalwave s.a.s. - We make Java work. Everywhere. java.net/blog/fabriziogiudici - www.tidalwave.it/people fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.0.14 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkxmqYYACgkQeDweFqgUGxeQQQCgssZ5EBXd5lQQqfC0ZuLNVGZO L6QAoIEWRNQgxbg8mErHgb9Ed23d9ux8 =XOxW -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 8/14/10 12:27 , netlander wrote: Now! can anyone (Google guys?) enlighten us on what's the lawsuit about? You can bet that none of Google will talk about this in the mailing lists :-) I suppose only lawyers, spokesmen and some executives will be allowed to talk in the next weeks. My point is that we developers should not be much worried about that. I don't think that Oracle has any real intention to shut down Android, since it's a pot of money. You usually want to have a part of it, or be part of the game, not to destroy it. My principal concerns about Android are the same as one week ago, that is to make my app work at best. - -- Fabrizio Giudici - Java Architect, Project Manager Tidalwave s.a.s. - We make Java work. Everywhere. java.net/blog/fabriziogiudici - www.tidalwave.it/people fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.0.14 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkxmqYYACgkQeDweFqgUGxeQQQCgssZ5EBXd5lQQqfC0ZuLNVGZO L6QAoIEWRNQgxbg8mErHgb9Ed23d9ux8 =XOxW -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
I started this thread with some trepidation, especially the chilling part. But it looks like we got to share our thoughts, if maybe a little OT at times. Fabrizio Giudici wote: My point is that we developers should not be much worried about that. I don't think that Oracle has any real intention to shut down Android, since it's a pot of money. You usually want to have a part of it, or be part of the game, not to destroy it. My principal concerns about Android are the same as one week ago, that is to make my app work at best. Yeah, I don't think this is going to affect Android. My guess is that they'll settle before it goes to a jury. I suppose it would be fair that Oracle monetize the Java IP it got when it bought Sun, but isn't Oracle rich enough? I think Oracle is going to have to tread lightly to avoid alienating the open source community. I wonder what deal they have or would strike with IBM, which has a pretty deep stake in Java? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 12:34 PM, Fabrizio Giudici My point is that we developers should not be much worried about that. I don't think that Oracle has any real intention to shut down Android, since it's a pot of money. You usually want to have a part of it, or be part of the game, not to destroy it. My principal concerns about Android are the same as one week ago, that is to make my app work at best. The problem it's not if Oracle wants to shutdown Android. The problem is how this will *affect* the android platform both acceptance and distribution. Android is new and it's making his way in the market. With this issue on the horizon, how will affect Android to be the choice of phone makers? Will you risk, as a phone maker, to continue supporting Android and distributing it in your phone without knowing what is happening behind the scenes? It's a PITA and I'm worried about it. I was creating myself big expectations with this. I'm new making my way as a developer and as an android developer (4 months), and now I'm a little worried. Regards, -- If you want freedom, compile the source. Sebastián Treu http://labombiya.com.ar -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
I'm sure not all of us have the cash to pay for the amount of servers the app engine requires. Also, they pretty much use jetty for the frontend, they use an rpc system to communicate with whatever their backend is coded in. (at least from briefly scanning the the gae docs) 2010/8/13 François Masurel fm2...@mably.com: What about the Google App Engine for Java platform ? It's powered by Jetty though, not Tomcat. François On 13 août, 11:28, Miguel Morales therevolti...@gmail.com wrote: Do you know that most of the web sites, services and whatever on the internet are powered by Java and by a good percentage by Tomcat? Java = slow is bullishit at least since five years, so please don't spread FUD any longer. Yes, I know. I used to be a sysadmin for a few datacenters. I know how tomcat applications behave. Like I said, in server environments the jvm is really good. I use it myself. It's fast enough, but by itself, doesn't scale very well. What popular website runs on pure java code? The VM as-is doesn't do well in slower/older hardware. The amount of ram required for each instance is ridiculous. Run a decent amount instances of your app and your server is toast. Or if your app scales in one vm instance, it's still not worth it. You're stuck with the usual perils of multi-threaded programming, without any gains in efficiency or grace of scalability. Locked hashmaps are cool, so are queues, but for anything real world you'd most likely connect to a network database. At that point you might as well code your app in a scripting language and increase your productivity maintaining a relative performance. Then, what about scaling your app server wise? You're again network bound over communicating between the instances. Might as well skip all those optimizations and use something more expressive and code faster. This is meaningless given some context. There are plenty of benchmarks around that demonstrates than Java or C are faster. The JIT technology, BTW, allows for higher optimization than C, since it can only optimize statically. Of course, single benchmarks aren't meaningful, since in a real world project one have to do some trade-offs. There are many real-world examples that can be done, just the first one that is public and comes to my mind has been recently presented at Jazoon. See http://jazoon.com/Conference/Thursday/OMullane, slide #40, which I'm copying: I don't know of any popular fast java applications, despite all these features. Again, Java is ok, great for what it does. But -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- http://developingthedream.blogspot.com/, http://diastrofunk.com, http://www.youtube.com/user/revoltingx, ~Isaiah 55:8-9 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 8/13/10 14:05 , DanH wrote: Acually, SUN has one of the worst JVMs available, and that's probably a big part of what's got Oracle upset about Android. (That and the money, of course.) I would assume that Google got one of the standard development licenses from Sun, where they could do pretty much whatever they wanted -- it just had to pass the JCK tests if they used the name Java. I'm assuming that Android Java passes the JCK somehow. You're assuming wrong. Google took the runtime from Harmony, which is a willing-to-be-Java implementation made by the Apache Software Foundation and that never got the permission by Sun to be tested against the JCK (thus it can't be named as Java). It's a well known debate between Sun and the Apache that has been going for years. When we use the Android SDK we're using the Java compiler from Sun/Oracle, we're having an intermediate passage through Sun/Oracle bytecode, but we end with bytecode made by Google and with a runtime that has nothing to do with Java. I've read previously discussions about the topic that seemed to miss completely this fact. Google has never claimed that it's compatible with Java(TM) and I think there's not a single bit of Sun code in Android - in fact, Oracle filed the sue not about a license violation concerning its own SDK, but mentioning more general patents, as you can read here: http://www.scribd.com/doc/35815632/Oracle-Google-Complaint ?Protection Domains To Provide Security In A Computer System? ?Controlling Access To A Resource ?Method And Apparatus For Preprocessing And Packaging Class Files? ?System And Method For Dynamic Preloading Of Classes Through Memory Space Cloning Of A Master Runtime System Process? ?Method And Apparatus For Resolving Data References In Generate Code? ?Interpreting Functions Utilizing A Hybrid Of Virtual And Native Machine Instructions? ?Method And System for Performing Static Initialization? In other words, this is the classic patent-based war that often occurs among large corporates and that, thanks to the currently flawed patent bills, allows every corporate to sue any other one. - -- Fabrizio Giudici - Java Architect, Project Manager Tidalwave s.a.s. - We make Java work. Everywhere. java.net/blog/fabriziogiudici - www.tidalwave.it/people fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.0.14 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkxlO3IACgkQeDweFqgUGxeVLQCfbMoRpUswnloeo/EpCI86/7Ye lVYAoJGlV2fHi8BXHzNymsaJpFjQ+olZ =p/8D -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 8/13/10 19:08 , DanH wrote: Yeah, I saw the list of patents, and commented above that from the titles they likely were pretty narrow. This is going to be an angels- on-the-head-of a-pin battle. To complete the scenario, I've been pointed to that in the complaint there's also a copyright violation allegation, regarding Java itself. It is not clear to what it refers to and I still believe that there are not Sun bits in Android. In any case, it is cited after the seven patents, so I think that the last ones are the real core of the case. - -- Fabrizio Giudici - Java Architect, Project Manager Tidalwave s.a.s. - We make Java work. Everywhere. java.net/blog/fabriziogiudici - www.tidalwave.it/people fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.0.14 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkxljGYACgkQeDweFqgUGxeG3ACfUTWGMGoaaXaIlTLRyBzkKO8l vZgAoIG/tPMa12OEydov+FzsM4p6Ml7w =Jlky -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
Sun would never have freely licensed their mobile JVM/KVM, they made way too much money for that. The problem for Oracle now is the emergence of iPhone and Android is seriously chipping away at Java ME distribution on handsets. Now you have countries intending to ban blackberry service (which uses Java ME for it's applications). Android devices are a likely replacement for blackberry users who are outside of the US. Sun did realize the potential threat of Android early; but Sun's solution was to do more market research and study before acting, while Google charged forward and executed. It was really sad to see Sun go like it did. They did so many good things for various communities. They created the JCP to get industry involvement in numerous specs, including mobile; but in many ways the JSR groups could be dysfunctional, slow and ineffective (imagine having ego driven techies from numerous handset manufactures in the same room). In the end, Sun was like a deer in the headlights, unable to adapt to rapid industry changes. Google kept tight control of the technology and didn't need to build consensuses for it's mobile technologies. On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 11:46 AM, DanH danhi...@ieee.org wrote: Hard to say. I don't know if the tendency in lawsuits is to list the most significant first, or the least significant. Can't speak to the possibility of copyright infringement. If the developers of the Android environment have good documentation for using cleanroom procedures that's a big help, but doesn't get them out of the woods. Without that documentation it could be a bit rough. I do wish that Sun had fully opensourced and open licensed Java like they were planning to several years back. I'm guessing the plan was killed when Oracle began negotiating with them. On Aug 13, 1:18 pm, Fabrizio Giudici fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 8/13/10 19:08 , DanH wrote: Yeah, I saw the list of patents, and commented above that from the titles they likely were pretty narrow. This is going to be an angels- on-the-head-of a-pin battle. To complete the scenario, I've been pointed to that in the complaint there's also a copyright violation allegation, regarding Java itself. It is not clear to what it refers to and I still believe that there are not Sun bits in Android. In any case, it is cited after the seven patents, so I think that the last ones are the real core of the case. - -- Fabrizio Giudici - Java Architect, Project Manager Tidalwave s.a.s. - We make Java work. Everywhere. java.net/blog/fabriziogiudici -www.tidalwave.it/people fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.0.14 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla -http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkxljGYACgkQeDweFqgUGxeG3ACfUTWGMGoaaXaIlTLRyBzkKO8l vZgAoIG/tPMa12OEydov+FzsM4p6Ml7w =Jlky -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.comandroid-developers%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- Shane Isbell (Founder of ZappMarket) http://apps.facebook.com/zappmarket/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 11:46 AM, DanH danhi...@ieee.org mailto:danhi...@ieee.org wrote: I do wish that Sun had fully opensourced and open licensed Java like they were planning to several years back. I'm guessing the plan was killed when Oracle began negotiating with them. Java Standard Edition _is_ fully open sourced under the GPL+CPE license (Java Micro Edition is a different thing, but it's not related with Android). As fas as I understand, even though you open source a product, there's still the patent thing. Usually these are handled by having the license to grant users a perpetual right to use the technology guaranteeing that they won't be accused of breaking a patent. But this clearly applies only to people using the plain open Java made by Sun / Oracle. Back to the license thing, I suppose that Oracle might refer to the Java specifications and namespaces (the java.* thing). Probably, even though Google has never claimed that Android is Java and their implementation doesn't derive from Sun, the weak point could be the fact that Android uses a subset of the runtime specifications and namespaces. - -- Fabrizio Giudici - Java Architect, Project Manager Tidalwave s.a.s. - We make Java work. Everywhere. java.net/blog/fabriziogiudici - www.tidalwave.it/people fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.0.14 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkxlqJEACgkQeDweFqgUGxd7LQCgkq+uB04uYEOgtnRlDBpTuXIr oxwAn2pPRrHaRWHa6TkeU+/Mo+YdrRAQ =ZvTF -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Chilling news: Oracle sues Google over Android
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 8/13/10 22:38 , François Masurel wrote: That's what I was asking to myself : what if Google simply infringed Oracle copyrights by using Java specifications and namespaces ? Can APIs be copyrighted ? Of course they can and specs can be licensed independently of an implementation. It's a complex thing and today I've read opposite opinions on many blogs by people who should have a knowledge on the matter. I suppose we'd better to wait some days for a better analysis of the problem. - -- Fabrizio Giudici - Java Architect, Project Manager Tidalwave s.a.s. - We make Java work. Everywhere. java.net/blog/fabriziogiudici - www.tidalwave.it/people fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.0.14 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkxluJgACgkQeDweFqgUGxd/fgCfX2LSyhtTzLygHUBYGanDE+kY RXIAmwafjkrF5X4+HQPsQGNbZl3A5aA2 =Mboi -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
