Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Which budget constrained DAC for SB3?
cgull;239877 Wrote: I am looking to add an external DAC as I believe the internal DAC is the weakest link in my audio chain. Belief can send you down all sorts of blind alleys. What actual evidence do you have that the SB3's DAC is the limiting factor? The DAC in the SB3 is actually pretty damn good. An obvious point to make is that your speakers will be contributing about 95% of the overall system character. Apart from that, unless your system is really high-end, chances are that the preamp is the electronic component most responsible for any shortcomings. Can you tell us what rest of your system is? That way we'd have a better chance of making more informed comments. -- cliveb Transporter - ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39892 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] self built system vs. transporter
Any thoughts would be appreciated. Squeezebox 3 to your DAC would seem sensible; any HTPC in the same room as the hi-fi will create some noise. -- amcluesent amcluesent's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10286 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39908 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Which budget constrained DAC for SB3?
cliveb;240019 Wrote: Belief can send you down all sorts of blind alleys. What actual evidence do you have that the SB3's DAC is the limiting factor? The DAC in the SB3 is actually pretty damn good. An obvious point to make is that your speakers will be contributing about 95% of the overall system character. Apart from that, unless your system is really high-end, chances are that the preamp is the electronic component most responsible for any shortcomings. I disagree with the statement that the speaekers will contribute about 95% of the system character. During my last upgrade I kept my speakers (Quad 12L) but replaced the source and amplification (Linn Creek) - the change in sound was staggering. Speaking for myself at least, the speakers did not contribute anywhere near 95% of the sonic character of my system. I have stated in a previous post that I don't think much of the SB3's analog output - I don't know if it's the DAC that's the limiting factor, or the supporting components. The bottom line is that it's bettered quite easily by a mid-range cd player. Of course one must take into account that the SB3 does cost a great deal less than a mid-range cd player, so it's unfair to expect that kind of performance. cgull, I would definitely recommend that you try an external DAC. I know exactly what you mean when you say the SB3 sounds dull and flat. Unfortunately I am not familiar with the DACs that you have listed. I'm using a cheap moodlabs Concept DAC at the moment, and I'm not really satisfied with the performance gains. Yes it does sound better than the SB3's analog out, but not by a great margin. I'm going to be auditioning a Benchmark DAC1 in a few months - it is quite expensive but I'm hoping the gains will be worthwhile. -- russelk SB3 -- Moodlab Concept DAC -- Creek Evo amp -- Quad 12L speakers russelk's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=12795 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39892 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Analog attenuation
Please give me help! my system -- source : Yamaha dvds2500 - 2 Vrsm/ impedance not known SB3 - 2.1 Vrsm/ 220 ohm connection: RCA unbalanced amplifier: image 34i integrated tube amplifier - 35w x 2/ input 150mV/ 470K ohm -- I'm a novice and do not have much knowledge of hifi. My system seems to need attenuators as long as I do not want to use the software attenuation in slimserver. I've read some threads here and googled it, but couldn't get the clear answer to my questions. 1. There is a huge difference between the output voltage of my source devices and the input sensitivity of my tube amp. So I have very limited range of volume control on my amp. What could possibly happen if I turn the volume to max? (I never tried it.) What's the correct ansewer? 1) no volume increase over a certain level because it's limited by the preamp part of the circuitry. 2) It blows the power tubes. 2. 20*log(2100/150)= - 22.9 dB It seems my system needs 20~24dB attenuator to get the full range of volume control. But I don't understand what's the impact of the difference in impedance or what I need to do if any. 3. I've read it somewhere that an attenuator between a pre-amp and a power-amp usually works better than between a source and a pre(or integrated)-amp in terms of the sound quality. Has anybody tried to compare the sound qualities among no attenuator/source-attenuator-pre/pre-attenuator-power? 4. The prices of attenuators seem to vary and it does matter since I need four attenuators. Again for the sound quality, are those expensive ones worth? I would appreciate any answer or help. Thanks. -- smarco smarco's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=12178 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36550 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] self built system vs. transporter
One other advantage to the SB3/Transporter route is that you're not limited to one stereo system. I currently have three systems in my house, and one out back in the woodworking shed, and love having complete access to my entire CD collection from all of them. Cheers, Dave -- DCtoDaylight DCtoDaylight's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7284 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39908 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Which budget constrained DAC for SB3?
cliveb;240019 Wrote: Belief can send you down all sorts of blind alleys. What actual evidence do you have that the SB3's DAC is the limiting factor? The DAC in the SB3 is actually pretty damn good. An obvious point to make is that your speakers will be contributing about 95% of the overall system character. Apart from that, unless your system is really high-end, chances are that the preamp is the electronic component most responsible for any shortcomings. Can you tell us what rest of your system is? That way we'd have a better chance of making more informed comments. I have a Melody SP-7 Tube Amp (http://www.melodyhifi.com/SP7.html) driving a pair of Onix Reference 1 Monitor's. (http://www.av123.com/products_product.php?section=speakersproduct=23.1). Last night I did a test of a Toshiba SD4700/standard cd vs SB3/flac. The Toshiba sounded significantly better, no question about it. So I know that my amp/speaks are capable of producing a sound that is good to my ears. This is whats leading me down the DAC path. -- cgull cgull SB3 Melody SP7 Onix Ref-1 cgull's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13453 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39892 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] self built system vs. transporter
I wasn't even thinking of the Squeezebox. This just might be the perfect solution. I can always just keep burning my dvds to disc since there isn't too many of them anyway. Thank you very much for the suggestions. -- walstib walstib's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13857 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39908 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Which budget constrained DAC for SB3?
cgull;240075 Wrote: Last night I did a test of a Toshiba SD4700/standard cd vs SB3/flac. The Toshiba sounded significantly better, no question about it. So I know that my amp/speaks are capable of producing a sound that is good to my ears. This is whats leading me down the DAC path. OK, fair enough. You've done a comparison and decided you prefer the sound of the Toshiba DVD player to the SB3. But before spending any money, be sure to check that you're not accidentally bitrate limiting the feed to the SB3, and also make sure your comparison of DVD player to SB3 is level matched. -- cliveb Transporter - ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39892 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Setting Transporter to Slave for World Clock Input
mofuv;239487 Wrote: thanks Mark, it is easy to change the setting that way, but difficult to get the transporter really running (with an external clock as master). First it did not have any output at all, but setting it back to master, then again to slave, then switching it off and on showed positive results. Now it's working fine and the sound quality has distinctly improved with the DAC as master. Wow, someone actually has a Scarlatti! (Do you work for dCS?) I use this setup with the dCS Delius. Don't forget to set the Scarlatti to MS:Mastr as well as setting the Transporter to World Clock Input. I also find this the best setup, though very occasionally they seem to drop sync and there is a pause in the music. I guess you will be needing Scarlatti master clock now!! -- anselld anselld's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11703 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39770 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] HD Music Downloads from iTrax
The site is finally open for business. Still early and selection is limited to 30+ titles with new material added daily. Register and get a free sample download (sounds fabulous). There is also a free test download in the help section. I started a thread there that has evolved in to Tagging issues. All files at present seem to be only tagged/titled with the song title. This is cumbersome as if you dump a few cuts from different artists into a temporary folder you end up with a folder full of nothing but song titles. The administrator has asked for suggestions...so everyone's help/input is needed. www.itrax.com RG - Transporter PS Audio GCC-100 Martin Logan Aeon I -- RGibran RGibran's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10220 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=34870 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB+ info please
tomjtx;239949 Wrote: One of those interventions was from the founder of SD and designer of the SB and TP. And your point is? tomjtx;239949 Wrote: It was a humorous observation on the foibles of some audiofools. Sorry but did not see anything even remotely humorous. Do you give classes of humour? -- Vic Vic's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13795 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39815 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Which budget constrained DAC for SB3?
I've tried a couple high-quality DAC's and was shocked at the level of improvement over the SB3's analog outputs. This might be over your budget but I've been very pleased with the $599 CIAudio VDA-2: http://www.ciaudio.com/vda2.html -- USAudio SB3 CIAudio VDA-2/VAC-1 CIAudio PLC-1 CIAudio D-200 Revel Concerta F12 + SVS SB12-Plus USAudio's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=8580 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39892 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Setting Transporter to Slave for World Clock Input
I am not working for dcs nor do I have any affiliation with them. But they make great products. The sound I get with the transporter and the scarlatti is the best I have ever heard. I am running in parallel a Linn Akurate CD player. EAC ripped CD's in my system can fully compare to the same discs played with their SACD side on the Linn. I have no drop outs when the scarlatti DAC is set to master and the transporter to slave, everything works perfectly well. The only issue is that the DAC can only be switched to master when the transporter is sending the information on the sampling frequency usually 44.1. But the transporter does this only when he receives a clock signal. When that happens I have to set the transporter back to master (internal clock), switch the DAC then to master and after this the transporter back to slave. Since I have connected the transporter to the QNAP directly not linked through my router (to avoid interferences from the router) I must disconnect it every time from the router and connect it to the computer. This is time consuming. The world clock setting should be possible directly at the transport and not only through the slimserver webinterface. -- mofuv mofuv's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13768 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39770 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Setting Transporter to Slave for World Clock Input
mofuv;240184 Wrote: Since I have connected the transporter to the QNAP directly not linked through my router (to avoid interferences from the router) I must disconnect it every time from the router and connect it to the computer. What sort of interferences? -- Mark Lanctot Mark Lanctot's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2071 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39770 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] welborne power supply for sale
i have decided to go with channel audio gear so i am going to use their power supply so that everything looks matchy-matchy with my system (all is vanity...). so i will be selling my welborne power supply. in absolutely perfect condition, i've only had it a month or so. it can be seen on their web page, i have the black one so it will match any system with a blue led. i got it assembled, cost with shipping was $315, so first $200 paypal takes it. PM me please. add $15 for insurance and shipping to lower 48 states, u.s. only. all sales final. and hey while i'm at it, i feel kind of bad selling this on this forum, but i honestly wanted to give you guys a shot at it before putting it up on ebay. how about a for sale area in these forums? -- ratso THE ULTIMATE 2 CH. BUDGET SYSTEM? BOLDER ANALOG MOD SB3 WELBORNE LABS POWER SUPPLY BURSON BUFFER EMOTIVA BPA-1 MONOBLOCKS x4 PROMITHEUS TVC PASSIVE PREAMP GALLO REF. 3.1 MONSTER CABLE POWER CONDITIONER BLUE JEANS CABLES ratso's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11493 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39941 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB+ info please
Vic wrote: tomjtx;239949 Wrote: One of those interventions was from the founder of SD and designer of the SB and TP. And your point is? tomjtx;239949 Wrote: It was a humorous observation on the foibles of some audiofools. Sorry but did not see anything even remotely humorous. Do you give classes of humour? Vic, You're out of order - this is not a SB+ support forum. Sean's response was humorous, and in good humour. tomjtx's post was also humorous and in good humour. Don't burn your bridges. R. ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Which budget constrained DAC for SB3?
cliveb;240105 Wrote: OK, fair enough. You've done a comparison and decided you prefer the sound of the Toshiba DVD player to the SB3. But before spending any money, be sure to check that you're not accidentally bitrate limiting the feed to the SB3, and also make sure your comparison of DVD player to SB3 is level matched. Bitrate is great. I have a bunch of 24/48000 flacs to test with. I just installed the Inguz EQ plugin and it vastly improved sound. Gonna look into the room correction stuff now. This may temporarily cure my upgradeitis. Still on the fence for a dac. -- cgull cgull SB3 Melody SP7 Onix Ref-1 cgull's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13453 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39892 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Arcam A70 or Arcam AVR250?
Deaf Cat siad I would definatly have to listen to the two set ups to see if the pre/amp section of the stereo amp SB dac, would out way the AVR dac and AVR pre section... yup...that's the $1000 question... The local Totem/Arcam dealer doesn't carry the Squeezebox and although I could bring mine in I think I'd be limited to low-quality Internet radio. Even if I brought in a laptop, can I connect the two with a network cable and expect it to work or do I need a real network? What I don't want to do is fork out $1000 for an integrated amp and not have much of an improvement in sound quality without having to spend a few hundred more on an external DAC. At the same time investing in three year old A/V receiver technology for two-channel sound doesn't strike me as the right thing to do either. I'm leaning towards trying out the Outlaw RR2150 at $650 (or $500 for B-stock) for their 30-day trial. If I'm happy with the sound of that combination at least I could still add an external DAC down the road and keep the cost around $1000. -S -- SlimSmitty SlimSmitty's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13818 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39856 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Arcam A70 or Arcam AVR250?
SlimSmitty wrote: Even if I brought in a laptop, can I connect the two with a network cable and expect it to work or do I need a real network? You don't need a real network just a laptop, SqueezeBox and either a cross over cable or a small hub. just test it at home. You'll probably have to setup static IP addresses for the ethernet connection to your laptop, and tell the SB to use a static IP as well. Something like 172.16.1.5 for the laptop and 172.16.1.10 for the SB will work fine. What I don't want to do is fork out $1000 for an integrated amp and not have much of an improvement in sound quality without having to spend a few hundred more on an external DAC. At the same time investing in three year old A/V receiver technology for two-channel sound doesn't strike me as the right thing to do either. I'd be amazed if a $1000 integrated amp is night and day better. Could be, but unless something is wrong (like the old one is grossly underpowered, or flat out failing) I would expect the difference to be subtle. Of course, that's what tests and listening are for. ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Arcam A70 or Arcam AVR250?
Thanks for the suggestion on using the SB without a network, I'll have to try that out. Pat Farrell;240227 Wrote: What I don't want to do is fork out $1000 for an integrated amp and not have much of an improvement in sound quality without having to spend a few hundred more on an external DAC. At the same time investing in three year old A/V receiver technology for two-channel sound doesn't strike me as the right thing to do either. I'd be amazed if a $1000 integrated amp is night and day better. Could be, but unless something is wrong (like the old one is grossly underpowered, or flat out failing) I would expect the difference to be subtle. Of course, that's what tests and listening are for. Well, it's mainly the belief that my existing receiver ($600 NAD L53 50wpc DVD-combo receiver) doesn't have a great analog path (no direct mode and I'm sure providing a decent analog path probably wasn't high on the design priority for this unit). CDs played in the unit's DVD player sound noticably better than the SB playing the same songs via the coax or analog connection. In general, the NAD seems underpowered for the Arros as well, it just doesn't sound that good above moderate listening levels. -P -- SlimSmitty SlimSmitty's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13818 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39856 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB+ info please
Vic;240133 Wrote: And your point is? Sorry but did not see anything even remotely humorous. Do you give classes of humour? Some people might be unteachable. -- tomjtx tomjtx's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7449 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39815 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Which budget constrained DAC for SB3?
cgull;240224 Wrote: Bitrate is great. I have a bunch of 24/48000 flacs to test with. I just installed the Inguz EQ plugin and it vastly improved sound. Gonna look into the room correction stuff now. This may temporarily cure my upgradeitis. Still on the fence for a dac. Hi cgull (clever name, btw). In response to your original post, I can recommend the Beresford TC-7510 external DAC, providing it has the 'Class A' output mod. At around 140 UK pound sterling, it was better than the modded Channel Islands VAC-1 I tried previously and (from memory) about as revealing as a Benchmark 1. I can't comment on the Inguz plugin as I don't have a server with enough horsepower to run it, but I can say that room treatments (at least the DIY absorption panels I've installed so far) make a HUGE improvement to the sound quality. -- westernboy Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted. Albert Einstein westernboy's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=12768 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39892 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Which budget constrained DAC for SB3?
I have the Zhaolu D3.0. For me it's an enormous improvement over the SB3 internal DAC. Shane -- swhite58 Clark Connect Linux file server-SB3-Zhaolu D3 DAC-NAD C320BEE-Polk Monitor 4.5 speakers/Sennheiser headphones swhite58's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=5038 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=39892 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
