Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
Hi Tim, Congratulations - and well said. Kind regards John Hudson. From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Tim Shirley Sent: Friday, 13 September 2013 7:36 PM To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Hmm, What I said, is that our insurers require a Competitors licence as a qualification for entry, in order to indemnify contest officials against the consequences of a claim arising from incidents at that contest. Is anyone suggesting that there should be NO insurance for contest officials? This isn’t a rule of the competition. It is there to ensure that there will actually be some officials willing to run the competition! To the best of my knowledge, the issue of a Competition Licence does not require anything beyond the CFI’s signature to say that in his or her opinion, the applicant is competent to hold the licence. There is nothing there about any specific qualification, though clearly a pilot would need a X/C rating to enter a competition. Please try to distinguish between the GFA and an Insurance company – they are not quite the same thing. And one thing more. I have yet to be paid to officiate at any gliding contest. The best I have managed is some help with expenses or some accommodation. I’ve been an official at more gliding competitions than I can remember or count. But if you guys are not willing to do at least something to help with the risks of litigation, then count me out in the future. You don’t deserve my or anyone elses help. I can handle grumpy pilots. I can deal with dusty airfields and 45C. I can make scoring systems work. I can even get around silly rulemakers. But I have serious difficulties getting my enthusiasm back when people just take it for granted that I’ll be there to run next one. Cheers Tim Tra dire e fare c’è mezzo il mare From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Colin Collum Sent: Friday, 13 September 2013 18:35 To: 'Mal Bruce'; 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Dear Mal, You seem to be offended by John’s suggestion that some of our badges are equivalent to boy scout badges, but let’s be honest—isn’t that what some of them are? You also seem to be upset by his questioning of the requirement of a 5 hour flight for competition pilots. Are our rules so perfect that there is no room to challenge them? Tim Shirley has indicated that the “5 hour flight” is an insurance requirement for competitions, but I am not aware of any evidence that this is based on anything other than someone’s theory that it is reasonable. Maybe alternative “qualifications” could be negotiated if enough people thought it was reasonable? You make a couple of interesting observations about fatigue and some industries’ responses to the admission of fatigue—I just wish when I said I felt fatigued someone would stand me down” J. But, have you never been tempted to yawn [surely a sign of fatigue or boredom or loss of concentration] while flying a glider? Did you promptly ground yourself? Will you promptly ground yourself [i.e. land at the first place it is safe to do so] if you do yawn when 300km from your destination? John raised some reasonable issues [perhaps not quite as subtlety as he might] and I think they deserve reasonable and reasoned answers. Regards, Colin From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Mal Bruce Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 10:43 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Heavy vehicle drivers can drive for 5 hours and 15 minutes with out a break I guess they are professionals we drive up to 12 - 14 hours depending on what fatigue management rules they operate under. Long hall pilots are often on duty for 16 hours. If you were working for NSW State Transit Authority to mention fatigue or say you are fatigued you would be stood down and sent off for medical checks this did does happen, from a close family member this has happened at Qantas as well. The two hours fatigue caters for the lowest common denominator, not for professional drivers. In gliding, driving and flying they make rules. The reason they are unlikely to change the rules for you is they are there for safety and liability reasons. Southern cross gliding club used to make pilots stay local at Forbes and do their five hours. Before venturing off on their 50 km flights. I suggest you do the same. I was 14 when I started gliding I have seen many pilots h
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
Hi Tim, My apologies for misquoting/misinterpreting your input. Sorry, Colin From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Tim Shirley Sent: Friday, 13 September 2013 8:06 PM To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Hmm, What I said, is that our insurers require a Competitors licence as a qualification for entry, in order to indemnify contest officials against the consequences of a claim arising from incidents at that contest. Is anyone suggesting that there should be NO insurance for contest officials? This isn’t a rule of the competition. It is there to ensure that there will actually be some officials willing to run the competition! To the best of my knowledge, the issue of a Competition Licence does not require anything beyond the CFI’s signature to say that in his or her opinion, the applicant is competent to hold the licence. There is nothing there about any specific qualification, though clearly a pilot would need a X/C rating to enter a competition. Please try to distinguish between the GFA and an Insurance company – they are not quite the same thing. And one thing more. I have yet to be paid to officiate at any gliding contest. The best I have managed is some help with expenses or some accommodation. I’ve been an official at more gliding competitions than I can remember or count. But if you guys are not willing to do at least something to help with the risks of litigation, then count me out in the future. You don’t deserve my or anyone elses help. I can handle grumpy pilots. I can deal with dusty airfields and 45C. I can make scoring systems work. I can even get around silly rulemakers. But I have serious difficulties getting my enthusiasm back when people just take it for granted that I’ll be there to run next one. Cheers Tim Tra dire e fare c’è mezzo il mare From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Colin Collum Sent: Friday, 13 September 2013 18:35 To: 'Mal Bruce'; 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Dear Mal, You seem to be offended by John’s suggestion that some of our badges are equivalent to boy scout badges, but let’s be honest—isn’t that what some of them are? You also seem to be upset by his questioning of the requirement of a 5 hour flight for competition pilots. Are our rules so perfect that there is no room to challenge them? Tim Shirley has indicated that the “5 hour flight” is an insurance requirement for competitions, but I am not aware of any evidence that this is based on anything other than someone’s theory that it is reasonable. Maybe alternative “qualifications” could be negotiated if enough people thought it was reasonable? You make a couple of interesting observations about fatigue and some industries’ responses to the admission of fatigue—I just wish when I said I felt fatigued someone would stand me down” J. But, have you never been tempted to yawn [surely a sign of fatigue or boredom or loss of concentration] while flying a glider? Did you promptly ground yourself? Will you promptly ground yourself [i.e. land at the first place it is safe to do so] if you do yawn when 300km from your destination? John raised some reasonable issues [perhaps not quite as subtlety as he might] and I think they deserve reasonable and reasoned answers. Regards, Colin From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Mal Bruce Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 10:43 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Heavy vehicle drivers can drive for 5 hours and 15 minutes with out a break I guess they are professionals we drive up to 12 - 14 hours depending on what fatigue management rules they operate under. Long hall pilots are often on duty for 16 hours. If you were working for NSW State Transit Authority to mention fatigue or say you are fatigued you would be stood down and sent off for medical checks this did does happen, from a close family member this has happened at Qantas as well. The two hours fatigue caters for the lowest common denominator, not for professional drivers. In gliding, driving and flying they make rules. The reason they are unlikely to change the rules for you is they are there for safety and liability reasons. Southern cross gliding club used to make pilots stay local at Forbes and do their five hours. Before venturing off on their 50 km flights. I suggest you do the same. I was 14 when I started gliding I have seen many pilots h
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
I’ll be at Waikerie as a competitor. Cheers Tim Tra dire e fare c’è mezzo il mare From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Catherine Conway Sent: Friday, 13 September 2013 20:12 To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Well said Tim I certainly appreciate your efforts and have seen just how much you and Joy have contributed so that I can enjoy myself. Thank you. Sincerely. I'd love to see you get the opportunity to fly a bit more yourself instead of working for the enjoyment of all of us. Cath Sent from my iPhone On 13/09/2013, at 7:35 PM, "Tim Shirley" wrote: Hmm, What I said, is that our insurers require a Competitors licence as a qualification for entry, in order to indemnify contest officials against the consequences of a claim arising from incidents at that contest. Is anyone suggesting that there should be NO insurance for contest officials? This isn’t a rule of the competition. It is there to ensure that there will actually be some officials willing to run the competition! To the best of my knowledge, the issue of a Competition Licence does not require anything beyond the CFI’s signature to say that in his or her opinion, the applicant is competent to hold the licence. There is nothing there about any specific qualification, though clearly a pilot would need a X/C rating to enter a competition. Please try to distinguish between the GFA and an Insurance company – they are not quite the same thing. And one thing more. I have yet to be paid to officiate at any gliding contest. The best I have managed is some help with expenses or some accommodation. I’ve been an official at more gliding competitions than I can remember or count. But if you guys are not willing to do at least something to help with the risks of litigation, then count me out in the future. You don’t deserve my or anyone elses help. I can handle grumpy pilots. I can deal with dusty airfields and 45C. I can make scoring systems work. I can even get around silly rulemakers. But I have serious difficulties getting my enthusiasm back when people just take it for granted that I’ll be there to run next one. Cheers Tim Tra dire e fare c’è mezzo il mare From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Colin Collum Sent: Friday, 13 September 2013 18:35 To: 'Mal Bruce'; 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Dear Mal, You seem to be offended by John’s suggestion that some of our badges are equivalent to boy scout badges, but let’s be honest—isn’t that what some of them are? You also seem to be upset by his questioning of the requirement of a 5 hour flight for competition pilots. Are our rules so perfect that there is no room to challenge them? Tim Shirley has indicated that the “5 hour flight” is an insurance requirement for competitions, but I am not aware of any evidence that this is based on anything other than someone’s theory that it is reasonable. Maybe alternative “qualifications” could be negotiated if enough people thought it was reasonable? You make a couple of interesting observations about fatigue and some industries’ responses to the admission of fatigue—I just wish when I said I felt fatigued someone would stand me down” J. But, have you never been tempted to yawn [surely a sign of fatigue or boredom or loss of concentration] while flying a glider? Did you promptly ground yourself? Will you promptly ground yourself [i.e. land at the first place it is safe to do so] if you do yawn when 300km from your destination? John raised some reasonable issues [perhaps not quite as subtlety as he might] and I think they deserve reasonable and reasoned answers. Regards, Colin From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Mal Bruce Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 10:43 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Heavy vehicle drivers can drive for 5 hours and 15 minutes with out a break I guess they are professionals we drive up to 12 - 14 hours depending on what fatigue management rules they operate under. Long hall pilots are often on duty for 16 hours. If you were working for NSW State Transit Authority to mention fatigue or say you are fatigued you would be stood down and sent off for medical checks this did does happen, from a close family member this has happened at Qantas as well. The two hours fatigue caters for the lowest common denominator, not for professional drivers. In gl
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
Well said Tim I certainly appreciate your efforts and have seen just how much you and Joy have contributed so that I can enjoy myself. Thank you. Sincerely. I'd love to see you get the opportunity to fly a bit more yourself instead of working for the enjoyment of all of us. Cath Sent from my iPhone On 13/09/2013, at 7:35 PM, "Tim Shirley" wrote: > Hmm, > > What I said, is that our insurers require a Competitors licence as a > qualification for entry, in order to indemnify contest officials against the > consequences of a claim arising from incidents at that contest. Is anyone > suggesting that there should be NO insurance for contest officials? > > This isn’t a rule of the competition. It is there to ensure that there will > actually be some officials willing to run the competition! > > To the best of my knowledge, the issue of a Competition Licence does not > require anything beyond the CFI’s signature to say that in his or her > opinion, the applicant is competent to hold the licence. There is nothing > there about any specific qualification, though clearly a pilot would need a > X/C rating to enter a competition. > > Please try to distinguish between the GFA and an Insurance company – they are > not quite the same thing. > > And one thing more. > > I have yet to be paid to officiate at any gliding contest. The best I have > managed is some help with expenses or some accommodation. I’ve been an > official at more gliding competitions than I can remember or count. But if > you guys are not willing to do at least something to help with the risks of > litigation, then count me out in the future. You don’t deserve my or anyone > elses help. > > I can handle grumpy pilots. I can deal with dusty airfields and 45C. I can > make scoring systems work. I can even get around silly rulemakers. > > But I have serious difficulties getting my enthusiasm back when people just > take it for granted that I’ll be there to run next one. > > Cheers > > Tim > Tra dire e fare c’è mezzo il mare > > From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net > [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Colin Collum > Sent: Friday, 13 September 2013 18:35 > To: 'Mal Bruce'; 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' > Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications > > Dear Mal, > > You seem to be offended by John’s suggestion that some of our badges are > equivalent to boy scout badges, but let’s be honest—isn’t that what some of > them are? > > You also seem to be upset by his questioning of the requirement of a 5 hour > flight for competition pilots. Are our rules so perfect that there is no room > to challenge them? > > Tim Shirley has indicated that the “5 hour flight” is an insurance > requirement for competitions, but I am not aware of any evidence that this is > based on anything other than someone’s theory that it is reasonable. Maybe > alternative “qualifications” could be negotiated if enough people thought it > was reasonable? > > You make a couple of interesting observations about fatigue and some > industries’ responses to the admission of fatigue—I just wish when I said I > felt fatigued someone would stand me down” J. But, have you never been > tempted to yawn [surely a sign of fatigue or boredom or loss of > concentration] while flying a glider? Did you promptly ground yourself? Will > you promptly ground yourself [i.e. land at the first place it is safe to do > so] if you do yawn when 300km from your destination? > > John raised some reasonable issues [perhaps not quite as subtlety as he > might] and I think they deserve reasonable and reasoned answers. > > Regards, > > Colin > > From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net > [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Mal Bruce > Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 10:43 PM > To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > Subject: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications > > Heavy vehicle drivers can drive for 5 hours and 15 minutes with out a break I > guess they are professionals we drive up to 12 - 14 hours depending on what > fatigue management rules they operate under. > > Long hall pilots are often on duty for 16 hours. > > If you were working for NSW State Transit Authority to mention fatigue or say > you are fatigued you would be stood down and sent off for medical checks this > did does happen, from a close family member this has happened at Qantas as > well. > > The two hours fatigue caters for the lowest common denominator, not for > professional d
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
Hmm, What I said, is that our insurers require a Competitors licence as a qualification for entry, in order to indemnify contest officials against the consequences of a claim arising from incidents at that contest. Is anyone suggesting that there should be NO insurance for contest officials? This isn’t a rule of the competition. It is there to ensure that there will actually be some officials willing to run the competition! To the best of my knowledge, the issue of a Competition Licence does not require anything beyond the CFI’s signature to say that in his or her opinion, the applicant is competent to hold the licence. There is nothing there about any specific qualification, though clearly a pilot would need a X/C rating to enter a competition. Please try to distinguish between the GFA and an Insurance company – they are not quite the same thing. And one thing more. I have yet to be paid to officiate at any gliding contest. The best I have managed is some help with expenses or some accommodation. I’ve been an official at more gliding competitions than I can remember or count. But if you guys are not willing to do at least something to help with the risks of litigation, then count me out in the future. You don’t deserve my or anyone elses help. I can handle grumpy pilots. I can deal with dusty airfields and 45C. I can make scoring systems work. I can even get around silly rulemakers. But I have serious difficulties getting my enthusiasm back when people just take it for granted that I’ll be there to run next one. Cheers Tim Tra dire e fare c’è mezzo il mare From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Colin Collum Sent: Friday, 13 September 2013 18:35 To: 'Mal Bruce'; 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Dear Mal, You seem to be offended by John’s suggestion that some of our badges are equivalent to boy scout badges, but let’s be honest—isn’t that what some of them are? You also seem to be upset by his questioning of the requirement of a 5 hour flight for competition pilots. Are our rules so perfect that there is no room to challenge them? Tim Shirley has indicated that the “5 hour flight” is an insurance requirement for competitions, but I am not aware of any evidence that this is based on anything other than someone’s theory that it is reasonable. Maybe alternative “qualifications” could be negotiated if enough people thought it was reasonable? You make a couple of interesting observations about fatigue and some industries’ responses to the admission of fatigue—I just wish when I said I felt fatigued someone would stand me down” J. But, have you never been tempted to yawn [surely a sign of fatigue or boredom or loss of concentration] while flying a glider? Did you promptly ground yourself? Will you promptly ground yourself [i.e. land at the first place it is safe to do so] if you do yawn when 300km from your destination? John raised some reasonable issues [perhaps not quite as subtlety as he might] and I think they deserve reasonable and reasoned answers. Regards, Colin From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Mal Bruce Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 10:43 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Heavy vehicle drivers can drive for 5 hours and 15 minutes with out a break I guess they are professionals we drive up to 12 - 14 hours depending on what fatigue management rules they operate under. Long hall pilots are often on duty for 16 hours. If you were working for NSW State Transit Authority to mention fatigue or say you are fatigued you would be stood down and sent off for medical checks this did does happen, from a close family member this has happened at Qantas as well. The two hours fatigue caters for the lowest common denominator, not for professional drivers. In gliding, driving and flying they make rules. The reason they are unlikely to change the rules for you is they are there for safety and liability reasons. Southern cross gliding club used to make pilots stay local at Forbes and do their five hours. Before venturing off on their 50 km flights. I suggest you do the same. I was 14 when I started gliding I have seen many pilots hit fences, trees, cars, other aircraft on the ground and in the air most of them dehydrated and fatigued that’s 32 years of gliding and 600 hours when your at the NSW comps have a look at the 18 meter trophy it took 21 years to get that. Your comment about boy scout badges is so insulting the the sport of gliding maybe your RAAF culture is to blame hopefully your clubs CFI insists you
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
Dear Mal, You seem to be offended by John’s suggestion that some of our badges are equivalent to boy scout badges, but let’s be honest—isn’t that what some of them are? You also seem to be upset by his questioning of the requirement of a 5 hour flight for competition pilots. Are our rules so perfect that there is no room to challenge them? Tim Shirley has indicated that the “5 hour flight” is an insurance requirement for competitions, but I am not aware of any evidence that this is based on anything other than someone’s theory that it is reasonable. Maybe alternative “qualifications” could be negotiated if enough people thought it was reasonable? You make a couple of interesting observations about fatigue and some industries’ responses to the admission of fatigue—I just wish when I said I felt fatigued someone would stand me down” J. But, have you never been tempted to yawn [surely a sign of fatigue or boredom or loss of concentration] while flying a glider? Did you promptly ground yourself? Will you promptly ground yourself [i.e. land at the first place it is safe to do so] if you do yawn when 300km from your destination? John raised some reasonable issues [perhaps not quite as subtlety as he might] and I think they deserve reasonable and reasoned answers. Regards, Colin From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Mal Bruce Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 10:43 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Heavy vehicle drivers can drive for 5 hours and 15 minutes with out a break I guess they are professionals we drive up to 12 - 14 hours depending on what fatigue management rules they operate under. Long hall pilots are often on duty for 16 hours. If you were working for NSW State Transit Authority to mention fatigue or say you are fatigued you would be stood down and sent off for medical checks this did does happen, from a close family member this has happened at Qantas as well. The two hours fatigue caters for the lowest common denominator, not for professional drivers. In gliding, driving and flying they make rules. The reason they are unlikely to change the rules for you is they are there for safety and liability reasons. Southern cross gliding club used to make pilots stay local at Forbes and do their five hours. Before venturing off on their 50 km flights. I suggest you do the same. I was 14 when I started gliding I have seen many pilots hit fences, trees, cars, other aircraft on the ground and in the air most of them dehydrated and fatigued that’s 32 years of gliding and 600 hours when your at the NSW comps have a look at the 18 meter trophy it took 21 years to get that. Your comment about boy scout badges is so insulting the the sport of gliding maybe your RAAF culture is to blame hopefully your clubs CFI insists you do your five hours local given your public admission of fatigue. Regards The One ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
John, having flown in proximity to you in various situations, I'd challenge anyone who says that you're anything other than a safe pilot. I'm looking forward to seeing you at SpeedWeek13, which is of course a regatta format and should be good preparation for the State Comps. Most top pilots, particularly Sebastian Kawa, believe that the fastest track to attaining a high skill level is to fly in competition, whatever the level, just competition. It is the competitive/comparative element that keeps us focussed on how we're performing and helps us develop our skills and concentration. The rest will follow. All the best, Paul Mander From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Trezise Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 9:12 AM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Thanks for all the very positive comments both on forum and off-line ... well there is always one ! After obtaining the C certificate four years ago, I concentrated on developing skills to become a competent cross-county pilot. I can say this has been a lot of hard work and has involved attendance at numerous coaching camps and regattas to the point that I have now entered my first comp ... NSW Club Class where I hope not to make too much of a fool of myself. I had put the Silver C on the back-burner because I did not think this in itself achieved anything (and was not aware that it was a pre-qualification for competition). Given good conditions (ie a 10,000 ft day), the distance and height requirements are not too difficult to achieve. But the duration element seems a bit incongruous as a requirement for a "basic" cross-county qualification. G. Dale maintains the best way to develop cross country skills is through short (< 2 hour duration) racing tasks. One issue which concerns me with gliding, is the emphasis on duration and distance (through the system of awards and badges); particularly given the average age of participants. With road safety (more or less concentration required than gliding ?), the rule is have a break every two hours (fatigue kills etc ). This I do pretty religiously on the road and I think is a good rule of thumb. I found in gliding, fatigue does set in after a reasonable amount of time in the air. With good hydration and nutrition, and being focussed on a task at hand, it is possible to extend the threshold, but fatigue is still a factor. The danger is that the time you need all your wits about you is joining the circuit at the end of a flight when there can be a significant number of gliders doing the same. To be impaired in any way at this time could result in disaster ... and has. Contrary to the belief of one of the correspondents, I believe I am a very safe pilot having had an incident-free career flying with the RAAF and subsequently in 5 years gliding. I don't think it is logical to assume that because I don't have a Silver C, that I am a danger to other pilots. I can assure you I have flown safely in many stacked thermals and on task with many other gliders, and recovered to very busy airfields without incident. Against this, it is possible to achieve badges without ever having to fly in the company of other gliders. I have quite a bit of flying to do before the comp with the Cross Country Week at Warkworth next month, and Speedweek at West Wyalong in November. Maybe, as Stuart suggests, the 5 hours will just happen ! John (VH GYF ...so watch out !) ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
Yes missed that one spotted the other after I posted is so insulting the the sport should read to. “Long hall pilots” A spelling error that is very apt. Hauling with laughter. From: Mal Bruce Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2013 10:43 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Heavy vehicle drivers can drive for 5 hours and 15 minutes with out a break I guess they are professionals we drive up to 12 - 14 hours depending on what fatigue management rules they operate under. Long hall pilots are often on duty for 16 hours. If you were working for NSW State Transit Authority to mention fatigue or say you are fatigued you would be stood down and sent off for medical checks this did does happen, from a close family member this has happened at Qantas as well. The two hours fatigue caters for the lowest common denominator, not for professional drivers. In gliding, driving and flying they make rules. The reason they are unlikely to change the rules for you is they are there for safety and liability reasons. Southern cross gliding club used to make pilots stay local at Forbes and do their five hours. Before venturing off on their 50 km flights. I suggest you do the same. I was 14 when I started gliding I have seen many pilots hit fences, trees, cars, other aircraft on the ground and in the air most of them dehydrated and fatigued that’s 32 years of gliding and 600 hours when your at the NSW comps have a look at the 18 meter trophy it took 21 years to get that. Your comment about boy scout badges is so insulting the the sport of gliding maybe your RAAF culture is to blame hopefully your clubs CFI insists you do your five hours local given your public admission of fatigue. Regards The One ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring<>___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
“Long hall pilots” A spelling error that is very apt. From: Mal Bruce Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2013 10:43 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Heavy vehicle drivers can drive for 5 hours and 15 minutes with out a break I guess they are professionals we drive up to 12 - 14 hours depending on what fatigue management rules they operate under. Long hall pilots are often on duty for 16 hours. If you were working for NSW State Transit Authority to mention fatigue or say you are fatigued you would be stood down and sent off for medical checks this did does happen, from a close family member this has happened at Qantas as well. The two hours fatigue caters for the lowest common denominator, not for professional drivers. In gliding, driving and flying they make rules. The reason they are unlikely to change the rules for you is they are there for safety and liability reasons. Southern cross gliding club used to make pilots stay local at Forbes and do their five hours. Before venturing off on their 50 km flights. I suggest you do the same. I was 14 when I started gliding I have seen many pilots hit fences, trees, cars, other aircraft on the ground and in the air most of them dehydrated and fatigued that’s 32 years of gliding and 600 hours when your at the NSW comps have a look at the 18 meter trophy it took 21 years to get that. Your comment about boy scout badges is so insulting the the sport of gliding maybe your RAAF culture is to blame hopefully your clubs CFI insists you do your five hours local given your public admission of fatigue. Regards The One ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring<>___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
Heavy vehicle drivers can drive for 5 hours and 15 minutes with out a break I guess they are professionals we drive up to 12 - 14 hours depending on what fatigue management rules they operate under. Long hall pilots are often on duty for 16 hours. If you were working for NSW State Transit Authority to mention fatigue or say you are fatigued you would be stood down and sent off for medical checks this did does happen, from a close family member this has happened at Qantas as well. The two hours fatigue caters for the lowest common denominator, not for professional drivers. In gliding, driving and flying they make rules. The reason they are unlikely to change the rules for you is they are there for safety and liability reasons. Southern cross gliding club used to make pilots stay local at Forbes and do their five hours. Before venturing off on their 50 km flights. I suggest you do the same. I was 14 when I started gliding I have seen many pilots hit fences, trees, cars, other aircraft on the ground and in the air most of them dehydrated and fatigued that’s 32 years of gliding and 600 hours when your at the NSW comps have a look at the 18 meter trophy it took 21 years to get that. Your comment about boy scout badges is so insulting the the sport of gliding maybe your RAAF culture is to blame hopefully your clubs CFI insists you do your five hours local given your public admission of fatigue. Regards The One ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
Hi John, A method used by a well known pilot to aid in maintaining concentration and avoiding fatigue on a long flight was once every hour to consciously relax for about a minute by making sure the grip on the control column was loose, and go through all muscles from the shoulders down one by one and ensure they were relaxed. Might be difficult if you are low, hot and struggling but perhaps that is the time you would get the most benefit. I rather fancy our best pilots have this state of relaxation most of the time. I know that improvement as a pilot is sometimes difficult to recognise in one self as it happens in small increments, but you are doing just fine, Harry Medlicott From: Trezise Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2013 9:11 AM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Thanks for all the very positive comments both on forum and off-line ... well there is always one ! After obtaining the C certificate four years ago, I concentrated on developing skills to become a competent cross-county pilot. I can say this has been a lot of hard work and has involved attendance at numerous coaching camps and regattas to the point that I have now entered my first comp ... NSW Club Class where I hope not to make too much of a fool of myself. I had put the Silver C on the back-burner because I did not think this in itself achieved anything (and was not aware that it was a pre-qualification for competition). Given good conditions (ie a 10,000 ft day), the distance and height requirements are not too difficult to achieve. But the duration element seems a bit incongruous as a requirement for a “basic” cross-county qualification. G. Dale maintains the best way to develop cross country skills is through short (< 2 hour duration) racing tasks. One issue which concerns me with gliding, is the emphasis on duration and distance (through the system of awards and badges); particularly given the average age of participants. With road safety (more or less concentration required than gliding ?), the rule is have a break every two hours (fatigue kills etc ). This I do pretty religiously on the road and I think is a good rule of thumb. I found in gliding, fatigue does set in after a reasonable amount of time in the air. With good hydration and nutrition, and being focussed on a task at hand, it is possible to extend the threshold, but fatigue is still a factor. The danger is that the time you need all your wits about you is joining the circuit at the end of a flight when there can be a significant number of gliders doing the same. To be impaired in any way at this time could result in disaster ... and has. Contrary to the belief of one of the correspondents, I believe I am a very safe pilot having had an incident-free career flying with the RAAF and subsequently in 5 years gliding. I don’t think it is logical to assume that because I don’t have a Silver C, that I am a danger to other pilots. I can assure you I have flown safely in many stacked thermals and on task with many other gliders, and recovered to very busy airfields without incident. Against this, it is possible to achieve badges without ever having to fly in the company of other gliders. I have quite a bit of flying to do before the comp with the Cross Country Week at Warkworth next month, and Speedweek at West Wyalong in November. Maybe, as Stuart suggests, the 5 hours will just happen ! John (VH GYF ...so watch out !) ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
Thanks for all the very positive comments both on forum and off-line ... well there is always one ! After obtaining the C certificate four years ago, I concentrated on developing skills to become a competent cross-county pilot. I can say this has been a lot of hard work and has involved attendance at numerous coaching camps and regattas to the point that I have now entered my first comp ... NSW Club Class where I hope not to make too much of a fool of myself. I had put the Silver C on the back-burner because I did not think this in itself achieved anything (and was not aware that it was a pre-qualification for competition). Given good conditions (ie a 10,000 ft day), the distance and height requirements are not too difficult to achieve. But the duration element seems a bit incongruous as a requirement for a "basic" cross-county qualification. G. Dale maintains the best way to develop cross country skills is through short (< 2 hour duration) racing tasks. One issue which concerns me with gliding, is the emphasis on duration and distance (through the system of awards and badges); particularly given the average age of participants. With road safety (more or less concentration required than gliding ?), the rule is have a break every two hours (fatigue kills etc ). This I do pretty religiously on the road and I think is a good rule of thumb. I found in gliding, fatigue does set in after a reasonable amount of time in the air. With good hydration and nutrition, and being focussed on a task at hand, it is possible to extend the threshold, but fatigue is still a factor. The danger is that the time you need all your wits about you is joining the circuit at the end of a flight when there can be a significant number of gliders doing the same. To be impaired in any way at this time could result in disaster ... and has. Contrary to the belief of one of the correspondents, I believe I am a very safe pilot having had an incident-free career flying with the RAAF and subsequently in 5 years gliding. I don't think it is logical to assume that because I don't have a Silver C, that I am a danger to other pilots. I can assure you I have flown safely in many stacked thermals and on task with many other gliders, and recovered to very busy airfields without incident. Against this, it is possible to achieve badges without ever having to fly in the company of other gliders. I have quite a bit of flying to do before the comp with the Cross Country Week at Warkworth next month, and Speedweek at West Wyalong in November. Maybe, as Stuart suggests, the 5 hours will just happen ! John (VH GYF ...so watch out !) ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
Dear boy scout badge VH:BSB Many people have worked long and hard to achieve their FAI badges some are still trying for their diamond height after 20 years of attempts. I suggest you do you five hours your 500 km gold and diamond height. You post reminded me of a line from top gun. "your ego is writing checks your body can't cash" Please post were you are flying so I can keep a extra good lookout. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
The rules are on the GFA website in Sports Documents The 2013 Version is V2.5 Document 10 https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0BzvOakkAvohCbDl4ZTgzQnI5SnM <https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0BzvOakkAvohCbDl4ZTgzQnI5SnM&usp=sha ring&tid=0BzvOakkAvohCZGozSnRsQlNGeHM> &usp=sharing&tid=0BzvOakkAvohCZGozSnRsQlNGeHM Mandy From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Ron Sanders Sent: Wednesday, 11 September 2013 8:57 PM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications And when are we going to get the rules and the turnpoints for the Nats at Kingaroy?? On 11 September 2013 18:41, Ian Mc Phee wrote: John T - it really is crap. Surely several 300km flights would out weigh the 5hr requirement. Can remember doing 8 3/4 hrs in a skylark4 trying for my 500km so come 2days before comps and try for 500km . The important thing is in a state comps you are not going to get shot down day after day. I would suggest you put in a case and ask the powers that be. Actually I can tell you there are several pilots in comps that have not claimed badges yet are flying comps regularly. I best not name them. Just get a comp licence - it means nothing but makes you look good Why does the GFA system totally ignore your airforce experience and airforce really learn lookout unlike many glider pilots unfortunately. I hate this sort of crap. I will see you there John OK Ian McPhee On 11 September 2013 10:12, Tim Shirley wrote: Rules (and local rules) for State Competitions are set by State Associations. It has been usual for State Associations in recent times to adopt Nationals Rules, but to make some local rules in regard to things like entry requirements so as to allow less experienced pilots to enter. Its the F in the GFA J Cheers Tim Tra dire e fare cè mezzo il mare From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Trezise Sent: Wednesday, 11 September 2013 09:36 To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Can anyone tell me why the pilot qualifications for State Championships are different between Queensland and NSW ? Some of the differences are pretty minor, but is there any reason they should not be the same ? Issues: Qld: 20 hrs solo vs NSW: 25 hrs solo. Qld Silver C distance vs NSW Silver C plus one 300km flight. Qld 10 aerotows vs NSW no requirement. Cant see any significant differences between Warwick and Lake Keepit which would justify different requirements for each site. Personally, its the second one which causes me a problem because, although I have done a number of 300km plus flights, total time has not exceeded 5 hours, and I see little point in just hanging around for 5 hours to get a boy scout badge. John _ No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2013.0.3392 / Virus Database: 3211/6601 - Release Date: 08/23/13 Internal Virus Database is out of date. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
Hey Ron, you attending?? Pete Ron Sanders wrote: = And when are we going to get the rules and the turnpoints for the Nats at Kingaroy?? On 11 September 2013 18:41, Ian Mc Phee wrote: > John T - it really is crap. Surely several 300km flights would out weigh > the 5hr requirement. Can remember doing 8 3/4 hrs in a skylark4 trying for > my 500km so come 2days before comps and try for 500km . The important > thing is in a state comps you are not going to get shot down day after day. > I would suggest you put in a case and ask the powers that be. > > Actually I can tell you there are several pilots in comps that have not > claimed badges yet are flying comps regularly. I best not name them. Just > get a comp licence - it means nothing but makes you look good > > Why does the GFA system totally ignore your airforce experience and > airforce really learn lookout unlike many glider pilots unfortunately. I > hate this sort of crap. > > I will see you there John OK > > Ian McPhee > > > On 11 September 2013 10:12, Tim Shirley wrote: > >> Rules (and local rules) for State Competitions are set by State >> Associations. >> >> ** ** >> >> It has been usual for State Associations in recent times to adopt >> Nationals Rules, but to make some local rules in regard to things like >> entry requirements so as to allow less experienced pilots to enter. >> >> ** ** >> >> It’s the F in the GFA…… >> >> ** ** >> >> J >> >> ** ** >> >> Cheers >> >> ** ** >> >> *Tim* >> >> *Tra dire e fare c’è mezzo il mare* >> >> ** ** >> >> *From:* aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto: >> aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] *On Behalf Of *Trezise >> *Sent:* Wednesday, 11 September 2013 09:36 >> *To:* aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net >> *Subject:* [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications >> >> ** ** >> >> Can anyone tell me why the pilot qualifications for State Championships >> are different between Queensland and NSW ? Some of the differences are >> pretty minor, but is there any reason they should not be the same ? >> >> ** ** >> >> Issues: Qld: 20 hrs solo vs NSW: 25 hrs solo. Qld Silver C distance vs >> NSW Silver C plus one 300km flight. Qld 10 aerotows vs NSW no requirement. >> >> >> ** ** >> >> Can’t see any significant differences between Warwick and Lake Keepit >> which would justify different requirements for each site. >> >> ** ** >> >> Personally, it’s the second one which causes me a problem because, >> although I have done a number of 300km plus flights, total time has not >> exceeded 5 hours, and I see little point in just hanging around for 5 hours >> to get a boy scout badge. >> >> ** ** >> >> John >> -- >> >> No virus found in this message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 2013.0.3392 / Virus Database: 3211/6601 - Release Date: 08/23/13 >> Internal Virus Database is out of date. >> >> ___ >> Aus-soaring mailing list >> Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net >> To check or change subscription details, visit: >> http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring >> > > > ___ > Aus-soaring mailing list > Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > To check or change subscription details, visit: > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring > ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
And when are we going to get the rules and the turnpoints for the Nats at Kingaroy?? On 11 September 2013 18:41, Ian Mc Phee wrote: > John T - it really is crap. Surely several 300km flights would out weigh > the 5hr requirement. Can remember doing 8 3/4 hrs in a skylark4 trying for > my 500km so come 2days before comps and try for 500km . The important > thing is in a state comps you are not going to get shot down day after day. > I would suggest you put in a case and ask the powers that be. > > Actually I can tell you there are several pilots in comps that have not > claimed badges yet are flying comps regularly. I best not name them. Just > get a comp licence - it means nothing but makes you look good > > Why does the GFA system totally ignore your airforce experience and > airforce really learn lookout unlike many glider pilots unfortunately. I > hate this sort of crap. > > I will see you there John OK > > Ian McPhee > > > On 11 September 2013 10:12, Tim Shirley wrote: > >> Rules (and local rules) for State Competitions are set by State >> Associations. >> >> ** ** >> >> It has been usual for State Associations in recent times to adopt >> Nationals Rules, but to make some local rules in regard to things like >> entry requirements so as to allow less experienced pilots to enter. >> >> ** ** >> >> It’s the F in the GFA…… >> >> ** ** >> >> J >> >> ** ** >> >> Cheers >> >> ** ** >> >> *Tim* >> >> *Tra dire e fare c’è mezzo il mare* >> >> ** ** >> >> *From:* aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto: >> aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] *On Behalf Of *Trezise >> *Sent:* Wednesday, 11 September 2013 09:36 >> *To:* aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net >> *Subject:* [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications >> >> ** ** >> >> Can anyone tell me why the pilot qualifications for State Championships >> are different between Queensland and NSW ? Some of the differences are >> pretty minor, but is there any reason they should not be the same ? >> >> ** ** >> >> Issues: Qld: 20 hrs solo vs NSW: 25 hrs solo. Qld Silver C distance vs >> NSW Silver C plus one 300km flight. Qld 10 aerotows vs NSW no requirement. >> >> >> ** ** >> >> Can’t see any significant differences between Warwick and Lake Keepit >> which would justify different requirements for each site. >> >> ** ** >> >> Personally, it’s the second one which causes me a problem because, >> although I have done a number of 300km plus flights, total time has not >> exceeded 5 hours, and I see little point in just hanging around for 5 hours >> to get a boy scout badge. >> >> ** ** >> >> John >> -- >> >> No virus found in this message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 2013.0.3392 / Virus Database: 3211/6601 - Release Date: 08/23/13 >> Internal Virus Database is out of date. >> >> ___ >> Aus-soaring mailing list >> Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net >> To check or change subscription details, visit: >> http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring >> > > > ___ > Aus-soaring mailing list > Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > To check or change subscription details, visit: > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring > ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
John T - it really is crap. Surely several 300km flights would out weigh the 5hr requirement. Can remember doing 8 3/4 hrs in a skylark4 trying for my 500km so come 2days before comps and try for 500km . The important thing is in a state comps you are not going to get shot down day after day. I would suggest you put in a case and ask the powers that be. Actually I can tell you there are several pilots in comps that have not claimed badges yet are flying comps regularly. I best not name them. Just get a comp licence - it means nothing but makes you look good Why does the GFA system totally ignore your airforce experience and airforce really learn lookout unlike many glider pilots unfortunately. I hate this sort of crap. I will see you there John OK Ian McPhee On 11 September 2013 10:12, Tim Shirley wrote: > Rules (and local rules) for State Competitions are set by State > Associations. > > ** ** > > It has been usual for State Associations in recent times to adopt > Nationals Rules, but to make some local rules in regard to things like > entry requirements so as to allow less experienced pilots to enter. > > ** ** > > It’s the F in the GFA…… > > ** ** > > J > > ** ** > > Cheers > > ** ** > > *Tim* > > *Tra dire e fare c’è mezzo il mare* > > ** ** > > *From:* aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto: > aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] *On Behalf Of *Trezise > *Sent:* Wednesday, 11 September 2013 09:36 > *To:* aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > *Subject:* [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications > > ** ** > > Can anyone tell me why the pilot qualifications for State Championships > are different between Queensland and NSW ? Some of the differences are > pretty minor, but is there any reason they should not be the same ? > > ** ** > > Issues: Qld: 20 hrs solo vs NSW: 25 hrs solo. Qld Silver C distance vs > NSW Silver C plus one 300km flight. Qld 10 aerotows vs NSW no requirement. > > > ** ** > > Can’t see any significant differences between Warwick and Lake Keepit > which would justify different requirements for each site. > > ** ** > > Personally, it’s the second one which causes me a problem because, > although I have done a number of 300km plus flights, total time has not > exceeded 5 hours, and I see little point in just hanging around for 5 hours > to get a boy scout badge. > > ** ** > > John > -- > > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 2013.0.3392 / Virus Database: 3211/6601 - Release Date: 08/23/13 > Internal Virus Database is out of date. > > ___ > Aus-soaring mailing list > Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > To check or change subscription details, visit: > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring > ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
John, do a 500km flight; 5 hours guaranteed unless you pick one of those mind blowing memorable days we all dream of. Stuart FERGUSON Phone - 0419 797508 On 11/09/2013, at 9:35, "Trezise" wrote: > Can anyone tell me why the pilot qualifications for State Championships are > different between Queensland and NSW ? Some of the differences are pretty > minor, but is there any reason they should not be the same ? > > Issues: Qld: 20 hrs solo vs NSW: 25 hrs solo. Qld Silver C distance vs NSW > Silver C plus one 300km flight. Qld 10 aerotows vs NSW no requirement. > > Can’t see any significant differences between Warwick and Lake Keepit which > would justify different requirements for each site. > > Personally, it’s the second one which causes me a problem because, although I > have done a number of 300km plus flights, total time has not exceeded 5 > hours, and I see little point in just hanging around for 5 hours to get a boy > scout badge. > > John > ___ > Aus-soaring mailing list > Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > To check or change subscription details, visit: > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
Rules (and local rules) for State Competitions are set by State Associations. It has been usual for State Associations in recent times to adopt Nationals Rules, but to make some local rules in regard to things like entry requirements so as to allow less experienced pilots to enter. Its the F in the GFA J Cheers Tim Tra dire e fare cè mezzo il mare From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Trezise Sent: Wednesday, 11 September 2013 09:36 To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications Can anyone tell me why the pilot qualifications for State Championships are different between Queensland and NSW ? Some of the differences are pretty minor, but is there any reason they should not be the same ? Issues: Qld: 20 hrs solo vs NSW: 25 hrs solo. Qld Silver C distance vs NSW Silver C plus one 300km flight. Qld 10 aerotows vs NSW no requirement. Cant see any significant differences between Warwick and Lake Keepit which would justify different requirements for each site. Personally, its the second one which causes me a problem because, although I have done a number of 300km plus flights, total time has not exceeded 5 hours, and I see little point in just hanging around for 5 hours to get a boy scout badge. John _ No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2013.0.3392 / Virus Database: 3211/6601 - Release Date: 08/23/13 Internal Virus Database is out of date. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] State Comp Required Pilot Qualifications
Can anyone tell me why the pilot qualifications for State Championships are different between Queensland and NSW ? Some of the differences are pretty minor, but is there any reason they should not be the same ? Issues: Qld: 20 hrs solo vs NSW: 25 hrs solo. Qld Silver C distance vs NSW Silver C plus one 300km flight. Qld 10 aerotows vs NSW no requirement. Can't see any significant differences between Warwick and Lake Keepit which would justify different requirements for each site. Personally, it's the second one which causes me a problem because, although I have done a number of 300km plus flights, total time has not exceeded 5 hours, and I see little point in just hanging around for 5 hours to get a boy scout badge. John ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
