RE: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition
Sorry to hear you're running SCO. My sincerest sympathies. As for Unix books, the O'Reilly Unix in a Nutshell is a good book. I don't consider it quite as indispensible as Essential System Administration, but that book assumes you're a little more fluent in Unix. So if you're a user on the system, I'd think Unix in a Nutshell would be fine. If you're administering it you might want both books, or maybe the Unix CD Bookshelf, which has both in it. *Note: I'm not an O'Reilly salesman, I just really like their books. Tony -Original Message- From: Paul Kraus [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, November 28, 2003 2:01 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition I need to beef up on my UNIX skills. Are major server is running Sco Open server. Will this book benefit me or is there another I should look at. Not on topic and I apologize but beyond perl the list seems to have many UNIX enthusiasts. Paul -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition
I'm sorry, small correction. The Unix CD Bookshelf does not contain Essential System Administration. It has: Unix Power Tools, 3rd Edition Learning the Unix Operating System, 5th Edition Learning the vi Editor, 6th Edition Mac OS X for Unix Geeks Learning the Korn Shell, 2nd Edition sed awk, 2nd Edition Unix in a Nutshell, 3rd Edition -Original Message- From: Akens, Anthony Sent: Friday, November 28, 2003 2:43 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition Sorry to hear you're running SCO. My sincerest sympathies. As for Unix books, the O'Reilly Unix in a Nutshell is a good book. I don't consider it quite as indispensible as Essential System Administration, but that book assumes you're a little more fluent in Unix. So if you're a user on the system, I'd think Unix in a Nutshell would be fine. If you're administering it you might want both books, or maybe the Unix CD Bookshelf, which has both in it. *Note: I'm not an O'Reilly salesman, I just really like their books. Tony -Original Message- From: Paul Kraus [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, November 28, 2003 2:01 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition I need to beef up on my UNIX skills. Are major server is running Sco Open server. Will this book benefit me or is there another I should look at. Not on topic and I apologize but beyond perl the list seems to have many UNIX enthusiasts. Paul -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition
On Friday, Nov 28, 2003, at 11:01 US/Pacific, Paul Kraus wrote:
[..]
I need to beef up on my UNIX skills. Are major server is running Sco
Open server.
Will this book benefit me or is there another I should look at.
[..]
as a general over-view it is a reasonable work.
The question of course is 'which unix skills'?
if it is shell level, then you will also want
to get the sed and awk books, to go backwards
so that you can read basic shells script tricks.
As tony noted the essential admin is a must for
the generic unix work.
and then there is 'man man' to start into the
general man pages. Most of what the user will
want is in section 1, section 3 is the traditional
place for caching all of the 'code level' manual pages.
{ in much the same way as Perl sorts out man pages - 8-) }
If you are not getting down into the Kernel Layer
then you will do well to have both books, as well
as going over the perl power tools: cf
http://www.perl.com/language/ppt/
which will give you a pleasant review of how many
of those commands mostly work, and in perl to boot.
ciao
drieux
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Re: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition
Paul Kraus wrote: I need to beef up on my UNIX skills. Are major server is running Sco Open server. Will this book benefit me or is there another I should look at. Not on topic and I apologize but beyond perl the list seems to have many UNIX enthusiasts. I would echo the comments about the Essential Sys Admin book from ORA, but would also suggest the Practical Unix and Internet Security book depending on your needs and current level of comfort. http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/puis3/ Aside from diving into the books for a sleeping aid I would highly suggest getting some spare hardware and downloading a distro of Linux and firing it up. Best way for many (most?) people to learn is by actually doing, while I won't suggest trying stuff out on your major server having a box to break is an important asset. Of course we all know how SCO will feel about that, you will of course then owe them hordes of money because you are dastardly evil IP thefter ;-) For me the nutshell books rank as decent quick references but not much better, I prefer ORA's other efforts. http://danconia.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition
Paul Kraus wrote: I need to beef up on my UNIX skills. I would love to know of a description of the Unix /philosophy/. Once sucked in to the surrounding ideas everything seems obvious, but I know of no book that explains stuff like processes, forking, signals and so on that underly the basic ideas of Unix. In essence it is a much more simple system than something like MS Windows, but perhaps it seems so simple to those who know that it doesn't need any explanation? Rob -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition
Rob said: I would love to know of a description of the Unix /philosophy/. Once sucked in to the surrounding ideas everything seems obvious, but I know of no book that explains stuff like processes, forking, signals and so on that underly the basic ideas of Unix. In essence it is a much more simple system than something like MS Windows, but perhaps it seems so simple to those who know that it doesn't need any explanation? Have fun with this one: http://research.microsoft.com/~daniel/unix-haters.html Saskia -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition
check out the O'Reilly Unix Bookshelf, you get a in a nutshell hard copy and 6 books in HTML on a cd. Makes a really great quick reference. I have the Perl and Linux/Webserver bookshelves as well. You can carry ~18 books around with you in your laptop case! -Tom Kinzer 714.404.9362 -Original Message- From: Paul Kraus [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, November 28, 2003 11:01 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition I need to beef up on my UNIX skills. Are major server is running Sco Open server. Will this book benefit me or is there another I should look at. Not on topic and I apologize but beyond perl the list seems to have many UNIX enthusiasts. Paul -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition
Rob Dixon wrote: Paul Kraus wrote: I need to beef up on my UNIX skills. I would love to know of a description of the Unix /philosophy/. The UNIX Philosophy by Mike Gancarz Linux and the Unix Philosophy by Mike Gancarz The UNIX Programming Environment by Brian W. Kernighan and Rob Pike Once sucked in to the surrounding ideas everything seems obvious, but I know of no book that explains stuff like processes, forking, signals and so on that underly the basic ideas of Unix. Advanced Programming in the UNIX Environment by W. Richard Stevens John -- use Perl; program fulfillment -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition
On Saturday, Nov 29, 2003, at 15:10 US/Pacific, Saskia van der Elst
wrote:
Rob said:
I would love to know of a description of the Unix
/philosophy/. Once sucked in to the surrounding ideas
everything seems obvious, but I know of no book that
explains stuff like processes, forking, signals and
so on that underly the basic ideas of Unix.
In essence it is a much more simple system than
something like MS Windows, but perhaps it seems so simple
to those who know that it doesn't need any explanation?
Have fun with this one:
http://research.microsoft.com/~daniel/unix-haters.html
My complements to Saskia for the well placed comedy.
Anything that has 'the scream' associated with it
and computing stuff is a good place to start.
But to step back for moment to Rob's question, I
think he is jumping in a bit 'late' in the core
cult of unix. Folks might want to look at one
of the classic FAQ's about it:
http://www.faqs.org/docs/artu/ch01s06.html
The root cause of Unix is that
it is very hard to code in Machine Language, and
only slightly better to code in Assembler, a point
that is unpleasantly known to those who have been
on the 'kernel' side of the OS, and/or have been
obliged to be EXTREMELY CLEAR about what exactly
the chunk of code is suppose to do.
So one of the first things out the door is that
unix was hacked by folks who wanted to simplify
their collective lives. What this meant was separating
the 'responsibility' of who did what how, and thus
we get the first break between
the kernel and user_space
allow me to illustrate with our pet favorite types
of commands
open()
read()
write()
close()
Most folks really do not like to have to read all of
the specifications for all of the types of devices
out there that can be fobbed off as 'file systems',
so it is nice to leave that stuff 'in the kernel' and
buy the overhead of making a kernel call. { check on
the number of scsi, ide, eide, atapi, etc, etc, devices
there are out there, then marry in some raid smack that
can between you and your 'logical filesystem' and the
actual thing that retains the persistent data.
This of course will help you understand one of those
witty unix mantra,
in the dark all things are just fd's ( file descriptors )
since it was not too much of a leap to notice that the
same things that 'work' with regards to 'real things'
like file systems, happen to be the same sorts of
commands that work for less real things, like network
connections, and interprocess connections. If you
will step back, you notice that the four basic commands
are what you will be using with things like ipc's
as well as 'networking code'.
So for some the start was that Unix lifted the users
off the 'file system' and the need to know all of the
painful minutia about how to write some 'bunch of memory'
onto a spinning disk. The gory details are things we
leave to divice driver freaks. They like reading tech
specs and converting it into painfully arcane device drivers.
This of course also means that distinction between
just a 'regular piece of application layer programme'
and 'the kernel' - a notion that would take the DOS
folks a while to sort out - since it took them a
while to understand that not everything can or should
be run as 'privileged' - and how to actually implement
the idea of having more than one thing that is queued
up to access the CPU. When one does the comparison of
how many 'instructions' a CPU can move, vice the number
of 'blocks of data' that can be done in I/O one notices
that the average CPU spends most of it's time waiting
for some I/O stuff. When even the best primates average
on the order of say 30 'words per minute' - or about
150 characters - that is still on 2.5 char per second.
NOT what I would call a viable I/O subsystem. Nothing
against Primates, some of my best friends are Primates.
So we now have a CPU on the edge of angst and ennui,
and need a way to keep it amused. It is at this point
in the process that 'processes' become 'useful' as a
mental construct. Depending upon *nix implementation
either the kernel is the first programme loaded, and
hence is PID 0, or we will see it in other ways, but
as a general rule of thumb 'init' will be running
as PID 1, and it will 'initialize' all things that
are not the kernel itself - hence why, as the process
of last resort, eveything sooner or later traces it's
ancestry back to PID 1.
Layer into this the idea of differenciated 'users'
where there is the 'privileged user' root, and
the rest of the folks, and the basic 'process table'
becomes a bit more readable - and it really is basically
little more than that - a Freaking Table, and it is
indexed by 'PID' - and has some other junk that gets
associated with it. But unless the Kernel Crashes
or Hangs, all the rest of the processes can go and
choke themselves as far as the system is concerned.
When one does not have a system where there is this
distinction, any one piece of running code can wedge it all.
What many know
Re: OFF TOPIC: Unix in a Nutshell Orielly 3rd edition
On Nov 28, 2003, at 4:09 PM, John W. Krahn wrote: [..] Advanced Programming in the UNIX Environment by W. Richard Stevens [..] I should note that, as myFascistHousemate just whined at moi, that we need to make sure that we are clear about the distinctions between unix philosophy unix architecture since these two get merged, just as many of us tend to *GLOB the kernel/shell/application stuff into 'that unix stuff'. for those interested they might want to go back, pull out their copies of the BSTJ ( Bell System Technical Journal ) and review the core architectural abstractions, things that are also at the core of the litigation in re Linux. for your amusement, cf http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/dmr/cacm.html and chant What a Long Strange Trip it has been! then be happy that as yet, no one asks perl coders so where is that ioctl() call cf man ioctl ciao drieux --- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
