Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Sat, 2013-12-07 at 21:41 +, Richard Melville wrote: The atom has come a long way since its inauguration; the latest Silverton range featuring the Avoton processors boast up to an eight core model with a 2.6 GHz clock speed per core and a 64 bit instruction set. The L3 cache is up to 4 MB. My own humble N2800 atom is 64bit dual core with a 1.86 GHz clock speed and a 1 MB cache. It completes a build of a fairly large static kernel image in ~ 45 mins. Not fast, I'm sure, compared with a powerful processor but acceptable nonetheless. Certainly quick compared to my old netbook, which runs a first generation Atom chip. It works adequately, even runs Gnome Shell with reasonable responsiveness... but I'd never even consider doing an LFS build on it. Simon. -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
Good luck - I guess that compiling a kernel on an atom will be slow. ?en -- das eine Mal als Trag?die, dieses Mal als Farce The atom has come a long way since its inauguration; the latest Silverton range featuring the Avoton processors boast up to an eight core model with a 2.6 GHz clock speed per core and a 64 bit instruction set. The L3 cache is up to 4 MB. My own humble N2800 atom is 64bit dual core with a 1.86 GHz clock speed and a 1 MB cache. It completes a build of a fairly large static kernel image in ~ 45 mins. Not fast, I'm sure, compared with a powerful processor but acceptable nonetheless. Richard -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Fri, Dec 6, 2013 at 1:04 AM, Ken Moffat zarniwh...@ntlworld.com wrote: Forgot to attach it the first time, and when I did it bounced (too big, whoops!). So here's the third attempt, using xz to compress it from 177K to 7K. sigh/ Thanks and sorry for confusion! I had no Unicode initially, but added it after initial comments. However adding Unicode font didn't help. I'll try your suggestions tomorrow. Anyway I've already found troubling news re. my Intel Atom GPU: Intel D2550 Cedarview (GMA3600) has PowerVR 545 graphics core. And its problem is described here: https://gist.github.com/Aissen/2925633 Now I understand why I can't get grub and kernel to get a higher resolution... At least it explains a difference in behaviour between 2 different Atom motherboards (old one has D510). That's very old news and I think you're getting side-tracked. As I've already mentioned I have a Cedar Trail motherboard and it's now working OK for me; the crappy graphics chip shouldn't be an issue on the console. Richard -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Thu, Dec 5, 2013 at 11:01 PM, Ken Moffat zarniwh...@ntlworld.com wrote: I still think my suggestion of checking every key will identify if any of the keys are being garbled in the kernel, and therefore if this is a kernel _input_ problem. But here is an alternative train of thought : When you trigger the garbage, is it really there, or only in the screen output ? Start a command with '#' so that it is treated as a comment, type, do whatever you need to so that the spurious garbage appears, then press enter. And make a written note of exactly what you typed, and a guide to what appeared and where it was on the line, so that you can repeat the test. 1. Typed: # k kk 2. Then deleted 2 speces between kkk-s with BS 3. white blocks appeared on the same line till the end of the screen Then key enter again : does the garbage scroll up, so that the current line is empty apart from the prompt ? It does scroll up Then key the up-arrow once to see the last line of history - is the garbage there in the history ? No, it's not there (not in bash history) If the garbage is only on the screen then I guess it _is_ a kernel problem, but in the _video_ driver (i915 I suppose, but maybe you compiled in vga). I will rebuild kernel Your LatArCyrHeb font has two, possibly three, characters which match a white square. If you manage to prove that it is a kernel video problem, can you please loadkeys LatGrkCyr-8x16 and repeat the test. I'm guessing you will get a capital T with a comma below it (either U+021A or, in that font, U+0162), or a capital U with an acute accent (U+00DA), or else a capital U with a breve (U+016C). Knowing what appears might be useful if this is a bug in a video driver. I'll attach the text listing of that font - I'm guessing it is one of character positions 210, 212, or 216. Do you mean setfont instead of loadkeys? Screen font changed, but white block is still the same while using LatGrkCyr-8x16. If I select viscii10-8x16 I can see blinking white letter U with diacritics on a grey background. It is a last letter in showconsolefont. If Iset lat1-16 I see y (U+00FF) If it is a video-driver problem, please attach the relevant part of your kernel config I will recompile with: Graphics support --- * Intel GMA5/600 KMS Framebuffer [*] Intel GMA3600/3650 support (Experimental) And, which kernel is this ? I'm going to build a latest stable from kernel.org 3.10.22 /alexey -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Fri, Dec 06, 2013 at 02:26:24PM +0100, Alexey Orishko wrote: On Thu, Dec 5, 2013 at 11:01 PM, Ken Moffat zarniwh...@ntlworld.com wrote: I still think my suggestion of checking every key will identify if any of the keys are being garbled in the kernel, and therefore if this is a kernel _input_ problem. But here is an alternative train of thought : When you trigger the garbage, is it really there, or only in the screen output ? Start a command with '#' so that it is treated as a comment, type, do whatever you need to so that the spurious garbage appears, then press enter. And make a written note of exactly what you typed, and a guide to what appeared and where it was on the line, so that you can repeat the test. 1. Typed: # k kk 2. Then deleted 2 speces between kkk-s with BS 3. white blocks appeared on the same line till the end of the screen Then key enter again : does the garbage scroll up, so that the current line is empty apart from the prompt ? It does scroll up Then key the up-arrow once to see the last line of history - is the garbage there in the history ? No, it's not there (not in bash history) If the garbage is only on the screen then I guess it _is_ a kernel problem, but in the _video_ driver (i915 I suppose, but maybe you compiled in vga). I will rebuild kernel Yes, based on what you said about gma500 then I guess that should fix it. Your LatArCyrHeb font has two, possibly three, characters which match a white square. If you manage to prove that it is a kernel video problem, can you please loadkeys LatGrkCyr-8x16 and repeat the test. I'm guessing you will get a capital T with a comma below it (either U+021A or, in that font, U+0162), or a capital U with an acute accent (U+00DA), or else a capital U with a breve (U+016C). Knowing what appears might be useful if this is a bug in a video driver. I'll attach the text listing of that font - I'm guessing it is one of character positions 210, 212, or 216. Do you mean setfont instead of loadkeys? Screen font changed, but white block is still the same while using LatGrkCyr-8x16. If I select viscii10-8x16 I can see blinking white letter U with diacritics on a grey background. It is a last letter in showconsolefont. If Iset lat1-16 I see y (U+00FF) Yes, I did mean setfont - sorry. If you change to the gma500 driver, I hope it will fix this. If it is a video-driver problem, please attach the relevant part of your kernel config I will recompile with: Graphics support --- * Intel GMA5/600 KMS Framebuffer [*] Intel GMA3600/3650 support (Experimental) And, which kernel is this ? I'm going to build a latest stable from kernel.org 3.10.22 /alexey Good luck - I guess that compiling a kernel on an atom will be slow. ĸen -- das eine Mal als Tragödie, dieses Mal als Farce -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Dec 6, 2013, at 10:51 AM, Ken Moffat wrote: Good luck - I guess that compiling a kernel on an atom will be slow. ĸen All hail the power of cross compilers with faster machines! Hopefully it does get fixed so this thread will help someone. Lots of information here. Sincerely, William Harrington -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Fri, Dec 6, 2013 at 7:02 PM, William Harrington kb0...@berzerkula.org wrote: Good luck - I guess that compiling a kernel on an atom will be slow. ĸen All hail the power of cross compilers with faster machines! I'll give it a try. Hopefully it does get fixed so this thread will help someone. Lots of information here. Finally, folks! I've recompiled and installed a new kernel with Graphics support --- * Intel GMA5/600 KMS Framebuffer [*] Intel GMA3600/3650 support (Experimental) and even got nice penguins during kernel boot :-) Screen resolution is also increased from vga. I don't see any garbage on the screen while deleting symbols with BS/DEL. Next time I would know to check hw thoroughly instead of trusting Intel with gpus :-) Thanks everyone for pointing me in the right direction cheers, alexey -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 7:27 PM, Ken Moffat zarniwh...@ntlworld.com wrote: In my previous reply I included an invalid-unicode symbol, code U+FFFD displaying as reverse-video question mark : � : if you read the mail on the LFS-7.4 machine (or copy this paragraph to a file, scp that file to the LFS machine, and then read it), does the resulting glyph appear correctly, and if not, does it match the white squares you had [ you need to revert the LANG and UNICODE settings ] ? I can see reverse-video question mark on LFS box, but reverse area is square in firefox/gmail and oval in lfs (I assume due to different font) There are (at least) three things to be done when moving from non-unicode to unicode: (i.) set the environment to use the unicode versions such as en_US.UTF-8. (ii.) use a unicode console font. (iii.) adjust environment or other settings for individual applications, e.g. in the distant past I used to use LESSCHARSET but that is now redundant. I now wonder if you are using a non-unicode console font ? My console file: # Begin /etc/sysconfig/console UNICODE=1 KEYMAP=no-latin1 KEYMAP_CORRECTIONS=euro2 LEGACY_CHARSET=iso-8859-15 FONT=LatArCyrHeb-16 -m 8859-15 # End /etc/sysconfig/console # Begin /etc/profile export LANG=en_US.UTF-8 # End /etc/profile - inputrc exactly as in the book - rc.site has no console parameters set Well, I've decided to look out of the box and changed keyboard from usb to ps/2 type - no difference. However when I tried to boot from exactly the same HDD on another motherboard from different vendor - everything works fine! It doesn't work on recent Atom D2550 motherboard and works on old D510 and on HP desktop with Core2. New Atom board has Intel ICH10R chipset and NUVOTON NTC6776D SuperIO, while old one has Intel ICH9R chipset and Winbond 83627DHG-P SuperIO. Does it mean the problem might be with some kernel drivers? /alexey -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Thu, Dec 05, 2013 at 03:06:01PM +0100, Alexey Orishko wrote: On Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 7:27 PM, Ken Moffat zarniwh...@ntlworld.com wrote: In my previous reply I included an invalid-unicode symbol, code U+FFFD displaying as reverse-video question mark : � : if you read the mail on the LFS-7.4 machine (or copy this paragraph to a file, scp that file to the LFS machine, and then read it), does the resulting glyph appear correctly, and if not, does it match the white squares you had [ you need to revert the LANG and UNICODE settings ] ? I can see reverse-video question mark on LFS box, but reverse area is square in firefox/gmail and oval in lfs (I assume due to different font) Good, you are displaying UTF-8. That unfortunately doesn't help explain why you were getting white squares after deleting. Yes, different fonts display things differently (e.g. serif and sans-serif). However when I tried to boot from exactly the same HDD on another motherboard from different vendor - everything works fine! It doesn't work on recent Atom D2550 motherboard and works on old D510 and on HP desktop with Core2. New Atom board has Intel ICH10R chipset and NUVOTON NTC6776D SuperIO, while old one has Intel ICH9R chipset and Winbond 83627DHG-P SuperIO. Does it mean the problem might be with some kernel drivers? /alexey This gets weirder and weirder. Most of us don't have a stock of different motherboards to play with, and I've no experience in this area. I think you said that showkey and dumpkeys reported the keyboard was giving the expected values for the BS and DEL keys even though they were giving white squares when you deleted, so in theory the kernel drivers are ok. Perhaps make a list of the values for _every_ key you use (with showkey) with this drive on a good motherboard, and then put it back on the bad motherboard and repeat the exercise just in case one or more _other_ keys are somehow corrupted. To be absolutely clear - you haven't installed xorg on the LFS-7.4 system, this is all about a problem in the console terminals (the ttys), right ? -- das eine Mal als Tragödie, dieses Mal als Farce -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Thu, Dec 5, 2013 at 4:40 PM, Ken Moffat zarniwh...@ntlworld.com wrote: This gets weirder and weirder. Most of us don't have a stock of different motherboards to play with, and I've no experience in this area. I think you said that showkey and dumpkeys reported the keyboard was giving the expected values for the BS and DEL keys even though they were giving white squares when you deleted, so in theory the kernel drivers are ok. Perhaps make a list of the values for _every_ key you use (with showkey) with this drive on a good motherboard, and then put it back on the bad motherboard and repeat the exercise just in case one or more _other_ keys are somehow corrupted. Well, I only need to type english letter k and space to get into problems.. While changing fonts I've noticed that white square boxes have inverted y with two dots over it.. Anyway, they appear on empty position of the command line (where no text was typed in). To be absolutely clear - you haven't installed xorg on the LFS-7.4 system, this is all about a problem in the console terminals (the ttys), right ? I don't have any X-related stuff, just plain LFS and I login on local console. On other HDD disk I've added a few BLFS packages with profile.d, dircolors, sudo, mc, etc. to support non-root users. Both plain LFS and one with some BLFS packages works ok on the old motherboard. /alexey -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Thu, Dec 05, 2013 at 05:43:28PM +0100, Alexey Orishko wrote: On Thu, Dec 5, 2013 at 4:40 PM, Ken Moffat zarniwh...@ntlworld.com wrote: This gets weirder and weirder. Most of us don't have a stock of different motherboards to play with, and I've no experience in this area. I think you said that showkey and dumpkeys reported the keyboard was giving the expected values for the BS and DEL keys even though they were giving white squares when you deleted, so in theory the kernel drivers are ok. Perhaps make a list of the values for _every_ key you use (with showkey) with this drive on a good motherboard, and then put it back on the bad motherboard and repeat the exercise just in case one or more _other_ keys are somehow corrupted. Well, I only need to type english letter k and space to get into problems.. While changing fonts I've noticed that white square boxes have inverted y with two dots over it.. Anyway, they appear on empty position of the command line (where no text was typed in). From memory, you said that k was involved when you specified that you were NOT using unicode in the setup, so I'm inclined to ignore that. I thought your problem was that *deleting* characters on the commandline caused spurious garbage to appear after it ? If that is wrong, ignore the rest of this reply and instead please restate the problem. I still think my suggestion of checking every key will identify if any of the keys are being garbled in the kernel, and therefore if this is a kernel _input_ problem. But here is an alternative train of thought : When you trigger the garbage, is it really there, or only in the screen output ? Start a command with '#' so that it is treated as a comment, type, do whatever you need to so that the spurious garbage appears, then press enter. And make a written note of exactly what you typed, and a guide to what appeared and where it was on the line, so that you can repeat the test. Then key enter again : does the garbage scroll up, so that the current line is empty apart from the prompt ? Then key the up-arrow once to see the last line of history - is the garbage there in the history ? If the garbage is only on the screen then I guess it _is_ a kernel problem, but in the _video_ driver (i915 I suppose, but maybe you compiled in vga). Conversely, if the garbage appears in the history then ignore the rest of this mail. Your LatArCyrHeb font has two, possibly three, characters which match a white square. If you manage to prove that it is a kernel video problem, can you please loadkeys LatGrkCyr-8x16 and repeat the test. I'm guessing you will get a capital T with a comma below it (either U+021A or, in that font, U+0162), or a capital U with an acute accent (U+00DA), or else a capital U with a breve (U+016C). Knowing what appears might be useful if this is a bug in a video driver. I'll attach the text listing of that font - I'm guessing it is one of character positions 210, 212, or 216. I base that paragraph on what 'showconsolefont' shows me. If you get a different character, or more than one, please attempt to identify them against that listing. You mentioned a different character appeared when you tried other fonts, but there is no rule about where any particular character is stored _within_ a console font. If it is a video-driver problem, please attach the relevant part of your kernel config (Graphics support, I2C encoder or helper chips (in mine that is actually Direct Rendering Manager, possibly because the I2C stuff is disabled and DRM doesn't have a heading), Frame buffer hardware drivers and Console display driver support - cut at CONFIG_SOUND which is the start of the sound drivers - they don't have a neat heading comment. And, which kernel is this ? At this point (for a video problem) you should have a reliable and simple testcase to show if the system has a problem. Either I will suggest that you change the .config (it is unfortunately very easy to create a config which doesn't work properly) or else to try building older and newer released kernels. ĸen -- das eine Mal als Tragödie, dieses Mal als Farce -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Thu, Dec 05, 2013 at 10:01:00PM +, Ken Moffat wrote: Your LatArCyrHeb font has two, possibly three, characters which match a white square. If you manage to prove that it is a kernel video problem, can you please loadkeys LatGrkCyr-8x16 and repeat the test. I'm guessing you will get a capital T with a comma below it (either U+021A or, in that font, U+0162), or a capital U with an acute accent (U+00DA), or else a capital U with a breve (U+016C). Knowing what appears might be useful if this is a bug in a video driver. I'll attach the text listing of that font - I'm guessing it is one of character positions 210, 212, or 216. Forgot to attach it the first time, and when I did it bounced (too big, whoops!). So here's the third attempt, using xz to compress it from 177K to 7K. sigh/ ĸen -- das eine Mal als Tragödie, dieses Mal als Farce LatGrkCyr-8x16.psfu.txt.xz Description: Binary data -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Fri, Dec 6, 2013 at 1:04 AM, Ken Moffat zarniwh...@ntlworld.com wrote: Forgot to attach it the first time, and when I did it bounced (too big, whoops!). So here's the third attempt, using xz to compress it from 177K to 7K. sigh/ Thanks and sorry for confusion! I had no Unicode initially, but added it after initial comments. However adding Unicode font didn't help. I'll try your suggestions tomorrow. Anyway I've already found troubling news re. my Intel Atom GPU: Intel D2550 Cedarview (GMA3600) has PowerVR 545 graphics core. And its problem is described here: https://gist.github.com/Aissen/2925633 Now I understand why I can't get grub and kernel to get a higher resolution... At least it explains a difference in behaviour between 2 different Atom motherboards (old one has D510). Found some suggestion online: - Upstream kernel from 3.2 should have cedarview support with 'gma500' driver maintained by Alan Cox. It provides basic KMS support for LVDS/VGA/HDMI but without graphics acceleration. - make sure CONFIG_DRM_GMA500 and CONFIG_DRM_GMA3600 is on in kernel config. I use LFS-7.4 with kernel 3.10.10 and I've tried 3.10.22 but apparently with wrong driver. /alexey -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 10:53 PM, Ken Moffat zarniwh...@ntlworld.com wrote: On Tue, Dec 03, 2013 at 08:29:42PM +, Ken Moffat wrote: What are the locales (LC_ALL or similar) in BOTH systems ? Neither has LC_ALL set Ubuntu and LFS-7.4 had this set: LANG=en_US.UTF-8 My old LFS-6.3 has LANG=en_US.ISO-8859-1 Using 'showkey' [ in a tty ], find the values for the Backspace and Del keys - on a regular 102-key keyboard mine are 14 and 111 - then use 'dumpkeys | less' to find what is output for those keys - mine are 'Delete' and 'Remove' : for no-latin1 the latter is corrected in the patch. I _think_ ubuntu has versions of both those commands (from console-tools), so you could compare them. On all systems showkey output is: BS - keycode 14 and DEL -keycode 111 dumpkeys has 'Delete' and 'Remove' Also, check what you have in /etc/inputrc [ LFS section 7.14 ], content is exactly as in the book After deeper investigation I got really confused BS/DEL problem exists in en_US layout and appearing while I'm deleting SPACE symbol with BS within a string like k . I've changed LANG to LANG=en_US.ISO-8859-1 and UNICODE=0 and problem is still there, however on old LFS-6.3 everything works fine with LANG=en_US.ISO-8859-1 and even with loadkeys no-latin1. Problem looks like described in BLFS Chapter 2. Important Information, Locale Related Issues: The Program Breaks Multibyte Characters or Doesn't Count Character Cells Correctly Since issue is present even with US keyboard layout, I wonder if ALFS build did something funny during build (or didn't do something right). I've tried to rebuild kbd with a patch, but didn't help. If I log via ssh everyhting looks ok. Is it because I use other pc facilities in this case? /alexey -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Wed, Dec 04, 2013 at 01:11:00PM +0100, Alexey Orishko wrote: On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 10:53 PM, Ken Moffat zarniwh...@ntlworld.com wrote: On Tue, Dec 03, 2013 at 08:29:42PM +, Ken Moffat wrote: What are the locales (LC_ALL or similar) in BOTH systems ? Neither has LC_ALL set Ubuntu and LFS-7.4 had this set: LANG=en_US.UTF-8 My old LFS-6.3 has LANG=en_US.ISO-8859-1 Oh. I had misunderstood that you were a norwegian. Anyway, you are using UTF-8 in both ubuntu and LFS-7.4. Using 'showkey' [ in a tty ], find the values for the Backspace and Del keys - on a regular 102-key keyboard mine are 14 and 111 - then use 'dumpkeys | less' to find what is output for those keys - mine are 'Delete' and 'Remove' : for no-latin1 the latter is corrected in the patch. I _think_ ubuntu has versions of both those commands (from console-tools), so you could compare them. On all systems showkey output is: BS - keycode 14 and DEL -keycode 111 dumpkeys has 'Delete' and 'Remove' So the keymap is ok. Also, check what you have in /etc/inputrc [ LFS section 7.14 ], content is exactly as in the book Good. After deeper investigation I got really confused BS/DEL problem exists in en_US layout and appearing while I'm deleting SPACE symbol with BS within a string like k . I've changed LANG to LANG=en_US.ISO-8859-1 and UNICODE=0 and problem is still there, however on old LFS-6.3 everything works fine with LANG=en_US.ISO-8859-1 and even with loadkeys no-latin1. Problem looks like described in BLFS Chapter 2. Important Information, Locale Related Issues: The Program Breaks Multibyte Characters or Doesn't Count Character Cells Correctly Using 8859-1 instead of unicode will cause the reverse of that problem - any non-ASCII unicode text will probably be converted to garbage, e.g. some common Norwegian letters - ae æ o-slashø a-ring å Since issue is present even with US keyboard layout, I wonder if ALFS build did something funny during build (or didn't do something right). I've tried to rebuild kbd with a patch, but didn't help. The patch fixed up the BS and DEL keycodes in the keymap, but your problem is different. If I log via ssh everyhting looks ok. Is it because I use other pc facilities in this case? /alexey You are using at least some of the settings from the machine where you are typing, e.g. the font (whether in a tty or a desktop term) comes from that machine. I think you need to fix the problem on the LFS machine - and then you might have to adjust the terminal or environment on the other box where you use ssh. First, you have to make sure that your 7.4 system is correctly set up for UTF-8. Your ubuntu system appears to be ok for UTF-8 (as expected), your antiquated LFS-6.3 is a historical curiosity from the days before UTF-8 was the norm. In my previous reply I included an invalid-unicode symbol, code U+FFFD displaying as reverse-video question mark : � : if you read the mail on the LFS-7.4 machine (or copy this paragraph to a file, scp that file to the LFS machine, and then read it), does the resulting glyph appear correctly, and if not, does it match the white squares you had [ you need to revert the LANG and UNICODE settings ] ? There are (at least) three things to be done when moving from non-unicode to unicode: (i.) set the environment to use the unicode versions such as en_US.UTF-8. (ii.) use a unicode console font. (iii.) adjust environment or other settings for individual applications, e.g. in the distant past I used to use LESSCHARSET but that is now redundant. I now wonder if you are using a non-unicode console font ? ĸen -- das eine Mal als Tragödie, dieses Mal als Farce -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 7:27 PM, Ken Moffat zarniwh...@ntlworld.com wrote: I now wonder if you are using a non-unicode console font ? I've built LFS using ALFS scripts and didn't change anything regarding fonts... should I? I'll check the rest tomorrow. /alexey -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Wed, Dec 04, 2013 at 08:38:12PM +0100, Alexey Orishko wrote: On Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 7:27 PM, Ken Moffat zarniwh...@ntlworld.com wrote: I now wonder if you are using a non-unicode console font ? I've built LFS using ALFS scripts and didn't change anything regarding fonts... should I? I'll check the rest tomorrow. /alexey No idea - I use my own scripts (/sources is an nfs mount for all my machines and I do not want to work in it), but in general configuring the linux console is user-specific. Any console font which is .psfu (instead of .psf) _ought_ to understand enough unicode to understand _where_ the characters begin and end. No font can display everything (there are too few _available_ codepoints) and some representations are subjectively ugly or easy to confuse). Also, one font _size_ doesn't suit everyone - of my own[¹] fonts, I still use the 8x16 on one machine but otherwise I use 12x22, even on the netbook because its pixels are tiny :-) [¹] LatGrkCyr - the two sizes look very different from each other. ĸen -- das eine Mal als Tragödie, dieses Mal als Farce -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On 12/04/2013 08:38 PM, Alexey Orishko wrote: On Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 7:27 PM, Ken Moffat zarniwh...@ntlworld.com wrote: I now wonder if you are using a non-unicode console font ? I've built LFS using ALFS scripts and didn't change anything regarding fonts... should I? What does your /etc/sysconfig/console look like? I for example use: UNICODE=1 KEYMAP=croat FONT=lat2-16 -- Igor Živković http://www.slashtime.net/ -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Dec 3, 2013, at 10:14 AM, Alexey Orishko wrote: At least LANG=en_US.UTF-8 and non-us keyboard are working file with Ubuntu... I wonder what's wrong with my LFS setup... utf-8 (Unicode ), iso-8859-1, iso-8859-15 (with euro symbol) For norwegian you need to load the no keymap There is also no-latin1 keymap. You may want no-latin1 rather than the no keymap. For the console font you may want: lat0-16 Sincerely, William Harrington -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Tue, Dec 03, 2013 at 12:41:26PM -0600, William Harrington wrote: On Dec 3, 2013, at 10:14 AM, Alexey Orishko wrote: At least LANG=en_US.UTF-8 and non-us keyboard are working file with Ubuntu... I wonder what's wrong with my LFS setup... utf-8 (Unicode ), iso-8859-1, iso-8859-15 (with euro symbol) For norwegian you need to load the no keymap There is also no-latin1 keymap. You may want no-latin1 rather than the no keymap. For the console font you may want: lat0-16 Sincerely, William Harrington I'm still having difficulty envisioning what is happening on Alexey's system, but I guess it might be down to an invalid unicode character (assuming he is using UTF-8), and that his chosen font doesn't display those sanely [ U+FFFD should be generated for this in a unicode locale, preferably as a reverse-video question mark � ]. Other things to consider: What are the locales (LC_ALL or similar) in BOTH systems ? Using 'showkey' [ in a tty ], find the values for the Backspace and Del keys - on a regular 102-key keyboard mine are 14 and 111 - then use 'dumpkeys | less' to find what is output for those keys - mine are 'Delete' and 'Remove' : for no-latin1 the latter is corrected in the patch. I _think_ ubuntu has versions of both those commands (from console-tools), so you could compare them. The backspace and delete keys are sufficiently common that the LEGACY_CHARSET variable (LFS section 7.10) probably doesn't come into play - but it might be needed to fix up other symbols if you are using UTF-8 and the keymap is iso-8859-something. ĸen -- das eine Mal als Tragödie, dieses Mal als Farce -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
On Tue, Dec 03, 2013 at 08:29:42PM +, Ken Moffat wrote: Other things to consider: What are the locales (LC_ALL or similar) in BOTH systems ? Using 'showkey' [ in a tty ], find the values for the Backspace and Del keys - on a regular 102-key keyboard mine are 14 and 111 - then use 'dumpkeys | less' to find what is output for those keys - mine are 'Delete' and 'Remove' : for no-latin1 the latter is corrected in the patch. I _think_ ubuntu has versions of both those commands (from console-tools), so you could compare them. The backspace and delete keys are sufficiently common that the LEGACY_CHARSET variable (LFS section 7.10) probably doesn't come into play - but it might be needed to fix up other symbols if you are using UTF-8 and the keymap is iso-8859-something. Also, check what you have in /etc/inputrc [ LFS section 7.14 ], particularly the for linux console part [ one sequence is for delete-char ], and specifically for mc the section Configuring MC on the MC page in BLFS. ĸen -- das eine Mal als Tragödie, dieses Mal als Farce -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
Re: [blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
Hi folks, I wonder if anyone could guess what's wrong with my text terminal. I've recently built LFS-7.4 (32bit) and most of BLFS (I'm not using X Windows, just text terminals only) on Atom D2550 motherboard, VGA display resolution. When I logged in if I try to edit bash command line by deleting symbol with BS rest of the text line became solid white blocks. The same happens if I edit in mcedit (editing in midnight commander). If I scroll text garbage symbols scroll as well). Same happens if I use DEL key, but not every time. I also use loadkeys with no-latin1 (dunno if it might cause any trouble or not). Any hint, what might be wrong? Regards, Alexey This sounds very much like the problem that I had just under a year ago. Have a look in the archives for keyboard-1.15.3 errors on backspace with UK keymap dated 15/12/2012. Coincidently, it was on a similar Atom-based board -- DN2800MT. Richard -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
[blfs-support] problem using BS or DEL key
Hi folks, I wonder if anyone could guess what's wrong with my text terminal. I've recently built LFS-7.4 (32bit) and most of BLFS (I'm not using X Windows, just text terminals only) on Atom D2550 motherboard, VGA display resolution. When I logged in if I try to edit bash command line by deleting symbol with BS rest of the text line became solid white blocks. The same happens if I edit in mcedit (editing in midnight commander). If I scroll text garbage symbols scroll as well). Same happens if I use DEL key, but not every time. I also use loadkeys with no-latin1 (dunno if it might cause any trouble or not). Any hint, what might be wrong? Regards, Alexey -- http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/blfs-support FAQ: http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/blfs/faq.html Unsubscribe: See the above information page
