Re: CXY08 and DELQA compatible with 2.11bsd?

[Glen Slick via cctalk]

On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 12:14 PM, Eric Smith via cctalk
 wrote:
> On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Glen Slick via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
>
>> Are there any hardware differences between the M7516 non-turbo and the
>> M7516-YM turbo versions of the DELQA, or only firmware differences?
>> Can you convert a non-turbo version into a turbo version just be
>> replacing the firmware EPROM?
>>
>
> The non-turbo I've seen use an AMD Lance ethernet chip (Am7990), while the
> turbo I've seen use a DEC chip in its place. Could be important, or could
> be coincidence.

I just took another look at the two M3127 DESQA I have handy. The
M3127-PA Rev B02 with 23-334E5 / 23-335E5 firmware EPROMs and the
M3127-PA Rev D03 with 23-365E5 / 23-366E5 firmware EPROMs both have
AM7990DC/80 chips, with DEC 21-21672-09 part numbers.

(The main obvious difference between the B02 and D03 revisions is
header block jumpers vs push-button switch transceiver selection).

Found this thread on the subject from back in 2011. Doesn't seem to
include actual results of attempting a firmware only swap.
http://www.vcfed.org/forum/showthread.php?27062-DELQA-vs-DELQA-YM-(Turbo)

Re: CXY08 and DELQA compatible with 2.11bsd?

[Eric Smith via cctalk]

On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Glen Slick via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> Are there any hardware differences between the M7516 non-turbo and the
> M7516-YM turbo versions of the DELQA, or only firmware differences?
> Can you convert a non-turbo version into a turbo version just be
> replacing the firmware EPROM?
>

The non-turbo I've seen use an AMD Lance ethernet chip (Am7990), while the
turbo I've seen use a DEC chip in its place. Could be important, or could
be coincidence.

Re: CXY08 and DELQA compatible with 2.11bsd?

[Glen Slick via cctalk]

On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 7:25 AM, Robert Armstrong via cctalk
 wrote:
>
>   The qt driver, however only works if you have the very late model DELQA 
> that has "turbo" mode.  I think that was called the DETQA, but I'm not sure 
> about that.  If you have an earlier DELQA then the qt driver simply says 
> "qt0: !Turbo" and quits.  Gotta love those terse Un*x error messages!
>
>   The older non-turbo DELQAs and the DESQA (M3127, which is what I have) only 
> seem to work with the qe driver.  It correctly recognizes and identifies them 
> as a DELQA.  I believe the DESQA was identical to the DELQA but with S-box 
> handles and a built in thinwire transceiver.
>
> Bob
>

Are there any hardware differences between the M7516 non-turbo and the
M7516-YM turbo versions of the DELQA, or only firmware differences?
Can you convert a non-turbo version into a turbo version just be
replacing the firmware EPROM?


I just checked and I have at least two M3127 DESQA. The M3127-PA Rev
B02 has 23-334E5 / 23-335E5 firmware EPROMs, the M3127-PA Rev D03 has
23-365E5 / 23-366E5 EPROMs.

Pete's DECROMs collection says the 23-365E5 / 23-366E5 set is the
DELQA-Plus aka Turbo DELQA Ver.2.0.0 set which replaces the 23-334E5 /
23-335E5 set.

If you have some spare 27C128 EPROMs you could try burning a 23-365E5
/ 23-366E5 set to install in your M3127 DESQA and see if the qt driver
is happy with it. I might try that myself eventually when time
permits.


For the curious about the 2.11BSD "qt0: !Turbo" error message:
src\sys\pdpif\if_qt.c:

qtturbo(sc)
register struct qt_softc *sc;
{
register int i;
register struct qtdevice *addr = sc->addr;
struct  qt_init *iniblk = (struct qt_init *)SEG5;
segmseg5;

/*
 * Issue the software reset.  Delay 150us.  The board should now be in
 * DELQA-Normal mode.  Set ITB and DEQTA select.  If both bits do not
 * stay turned on then the board is not a DELQA-YM.
*/
addr->arqr = ARQR_SR;
addr->arqr = 0;
delay(150L);

addr->srr = 0x8001; /* MS | ITB */
i = addr->srr;
addr->srr = 0x8000; /* Turn off ITB, set DELQA select */
if  (i != 0x8001)
{
printf("qt@%o !-YM\n", addr);
return(0);
}
/*
 * Board is a DELQA-YM.  Send the commands to enable Turbo mode.  Delay
 * 1 second, testing the SRR register every millisecond to see if the
 * board has shifted to Turbo mode.
*/
addr->xcr0 = 0x0baf;
addr->xcr1 = 0xff00;
for (i = 0; i < 1000; i++)
{
if  ((addr->srr & SRR_RESP) == 1)
break;
delay(1000L);
}
if  (i >= 1000)
{
printf("qt@%o !Turbo\n", addr);
return(0);
}

RE: CXY08 and DELQA compatible with 2.11bsd?

[Robert Armstrong via cctalk]

> Josh Dersch dersc...@gmail.com wrote:

>Correction: it's the "qt" driver for the DELQA. 

  FWIW, looks like the CXY08 in DHV mode works find with 2.11bsd.

  The qt driver, however only works if you have the very late model DELQA that 
has "turbo" mode.  I think that was called the DETQA, but I'm not sure about 
that.  If you have an earlier DELQA then the qt driver simply says "qt0: 
!Turbo" and quits.  Gotta love those terse Un*x error messages!

  The older non-turbo DELQAs and the DESQA (M3127, which is what I have) only 
seem to work with the qe driver.  It correctly recognizes and identifies them 
as a DELQA.  I believe the DESQA was identical to the DELQA but with S-box 
handles and a built in thinwire transceiver.

Bob

Re: CXY08 and DELQA compatible with 2.11bsd?

[Warner Losh via cctalk]

On Fri, Mar 16, 2018 at 12:03 AM, Josh Dersch via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> On 3/15/2018 8:22 PM, Robert Armstrong via cctalk wrote:
>
>Does anyone know offhand if the CXY08 (M3119) and DELQA (M7516) work
>> with
>> 2.11bsd?
>>
>>
>>I think the CXY08 has the same programmer interface as the DHV11, and
>> I'm
>> hoping it works with the 2.11bsd dh driver.  Ditto for the DELQA and the
>> qe
>> driver.  If somebody knows for sure, though, I'd appreciate it if you can
>> save me the trouble of installing it all just to find out it doesn't work.
>>
>
> The DELQA should work fine with the qe driver.  I can't comment on the
> CXY08 as I've never tried it personally.
>

At least he's not trying to use a DEQNA interface, so he's ahead of the
game...

Warner


> - Josh
>
>
>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Bob
>>
>>
>>
>

Re: CXY08 and DELQA compatible with 2.11bsd?

[Josh Dersch via cctalk]

On 3/15/2018 11:03 PM, Josh Dersch wrote:


On 3/15/2018 8:22 PM, Robert Armstrong via cctalk wrote:

   Does anyone know offhand if the CXY08 (M3119) and DELQA (M7516) 
work with

2.11bsd?


   I think the CXY08 has the same programmer interface as the DHV11, 
and I'm
hoping it works with the 2.11bsd dh driver.  Ditto for the DELQA and 
the qe
driver.  If somebody knows for sure, though, I'd appreciate it if you 
can
save me the trouble of installing it all just to find out it doesn't 
work.


The DELQA should work fine with the qe driver.  I can't comment on the 
CXY08 as I've never tried it personally.


- Josh




Correction: it's the "qt" driver for the DELQA.  Regardless, it should 
work...





Thanks,

Bob

Re: CXY08 and DELQA compatible with 2.11bsd?

[Josh Dersch via cctalk]

On 3/15/2018 8:22 PM, Robert Armstrong via cctalk wrote:


   Does anyone know offhand if the CXY08 (M3119) and DELQA (M7516) work with
2.11bsd?

  


   I think the CXY08 has the same programmer interface as the DHV11, and I'm
hoping it works with the 2.11bsd dh driver.  Ditto for the DELQA and the qe
driver.  If somebody knows for sure, though, I'd appreciate it if you can
save me the trouble of installing it all just to find out it doesn't work.


The DELQA should work fine with the qe driver.  I can't comment on the 
CXY08 as I've never tried it personally.


- Josh




  


Thanks,

Bob