Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
> On May 18, 2021, at 9:05 AM, Peter Coghlan via cctalk > wrote: > > Zane Healy wrote: >> >> Sorry Peter, I wasn’t even thinking about that at the time, as Malte had >> reported he was able to read them with DECW$BOOKREADER. Though thinking >> about it again, it’s not a bad idea, as it would let me see exactly what >> I’m seeing. >> >> Any pointers to “FILE”? I’m finding it to be “fun” to try to >> track down various tools. Though mention of this made me realize, I >> should be able to fix file attributes on a 7.3 or 8.3 system. I think >> the install for VTB needs that. I’m *STILL* trying to find the original >> VTBOOK. >> > > FILE is a tricky keyword to search for, isn't it :-) > > I think it should be on the freeware CDs but there is also a copy here: > > http://vms.process.com/fileserv-software.html > > Regards, > Peter Coghlan. It is indeed tricky to search for “FILE”. :-) Anyway, thanks to you jogging my memory, I have VTB installed on PDXVAX, which makes the files from the CD readable. I simply reset the file attributes on the saveset using OpenVMS 8.3, and I was able to install VTB013.A with no problem. VTB works great, so I think the problem is MGBOOK, which is unfortunate, as its UI is easier to use. I finally found VTBOOK, though I haven’t tried it, it can be found at. http://decuslib.com/decus/vs0174/vtbook/ The contents of the July 1989 CONOLD CD-ROM are now available on PDXVAX, which is accessible on HECnet. Zane
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
Zane Healy wrote: > > Sorry Peter, I wasn’t even thinking about that at the time, as Malte had > reported he was able to read them with DECW$BOOKREADER. Though thinking > about it again, it’s not a bad idea, as it would let me see exactly what > I’m seeing. > > Any pointers to “FILE”? I’m finding it to be “fun” to try to > track down various tools. Though mention of this made me realize, I > should be able to fix file attributes on a 7.3 or 8.3 system. I think > the install for VTB needs that. I’m *STILL* trying to find the original > VTBOOK. > FILE is a tricky keyword to search for, isn't it :-) I think it should be on the freeware CDs but there is also a copy here: http://vms.process.com/fileserv-software.html Regards, Peter Coghlan. > > Zane >
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
> On May 18, 2021, at 3:57 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk > wrote: > > I think Zane was reading the files from an ISO image I made of a 1989 CONOLD > CDROM. Correct. > That CDROM had previously been used as a toboggan by one or more members the > DEC Reading Engineering Team and so was somewhat heavily scuffed when I got > it. > > I eventually recovered it through a process of manual polishing involving > sandpaper and elbow grease. I think ddrescue reported 2048 bad bytes in the > end (one sector). > > It is entirely possible that one or more of the files is corrupt, although > the text files (the BOOKSHEFLF files, for example) seem OK. > > The filesystem structures do seem OK, so maybe I was lucky. I’m not really concerned with corruption of the BOOK files, I think my problem is with the tool I’m trying to read them with. Since Malte Dehling reports being able to read them with DECW$BOOKREADER, I think they’re okay. Zane
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On May 18, 2021, at 2:17 AM, Peter Coghlan via cctalk wrote: > > Zane Healy wrote: >> On May 17, 2021, at 2:43 PM, Peter Coghlan via cctalk >> wrote: >>> Zane, >>> >>> How about redirecting DECW$BOOKREADER to display on an X server elsewhere? >>> >>> $ SET DISPLAY /NODE=domain.name /TRANSPORT=TCPIP /CREATE >>> $ MCR DECW$BOOKREADER >>> >>> Regards, >>> Peter Coghlan >> >> I’m trying to make the files readable via HECnet, so I need VTBOOK, MGBOOK, >> or similar. I see that at least an early Freeware CD had VTB, but the >> copy I downloaded appears to be corrupt. >> > > Zane, > > The content of your posting which I was replying to and the error message you > quoted suggested to me that your concern was that the bookreader files you are > attempting to read are "corrupt". > > My suggestion was intended to help you discover whether the bookreader files > are > "corrupt" or the tools you are using to read them are mishandling them. > > (In my experience "corrupt" files on VMS are usually due to file attributes > being lost when the files were transferred via some other system. On early > version of VMS, this can usually be fixed using Joe Meadows' "FILE" utility.) > > Regards, > Peter Coghlan. Sorry Peter, I wasn’t even thinking about that at the time, as Malte had reported he was able to read them with DECW$BOOKREADER. Though thinking about it again, it’s not a bad idea, as it would let me see exactly what I’m seeing. Any pointers to “FILE”? I’m finding it to be “fun” to try to track down various tools. Though mention of this made me realize, I should be able to fix file attributes on a 7.3 or 8.3 system. I think the install for VTB needs that. I’m *STILL* trying to find the original VTBOOK. Zane
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
Antonio Carlini wrote: On 18/05/2021 10:17, Peter Coghlan via cctalk wrote: The content of your posting which I was replying to and the error message you quoted suggested to me that your concern was that the bookreader files you are attempting to read are "corrupt". I think Zane was reading the files from an ISO image I made of a 1989 CONOLD CDROM. That CDROM had previously been used as a toboggan by one or more members the DEC Reading Engineering Team and so was somewhat heavily scuffed when I got it. I eventually recovered it through a process of manual polishing involving sandpaper and elbow grease. I think ddrescue reported 2048 bad bytes in the end (one sector). It is entirely possible that one or more of the files is corrupt, although the text files (the BOOKSHEFLF files, for example) seem OK. The filesystem structures do seem OK, so maybe I was lucky. My suggestion was intended to help you discover whether the bookreader files are "corrupt" or the tools you are using to read them are mishandling them. (In my experience "corrupt" files on VMS are usually due to file attributes being lost when the files were transferred via some other system. On early version of VMS, this can usually be fixed using Joe Meadows' "FILE" utility.) In this case any corruption will be down to over-enthusiastic handling 20+ years ago. I've been following the thread and I suspected as much too. I was trying to offer a suggestion on how to narrow down whether the bookreader files themselves are faulty or the applications being used to process them are faulty as suggested elsewhere. I also wanted to offer a reminder that incorrect file attributes are just as likely, maybe more likely to mess things up as incorrect file contents are, especially when bookshelf files which are just plain text files as far as I recall, seem to be responsible for errors like: %MGBOOK-E-READERR, Error reading bookshelf entry information -RMS-W-RTB, 1022 byte record too large for user's buffer Knowing more details about the problem may lead to finding a solution. It has also since dawned on me that the objective of making the files readable via HECnet can also be met in at least two other ways, either by directing the X output from DECW$BOOKREADER running locally to an X display elsewhere on the HECnet network using DECnet transport or by making it possible for DECW$BOOKREADER running remotely to read the bookreader files via the network. Therefore, it is not strictly necessary to use VTBOOK, MGBOOK etc although it would be good to figure out exactly what is stopping these applications from working correctly. Regards, Peter Coghlan. Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 18/05/2021 10:17, Peter Coghlan via cctalk wrote: The content of your posting which I was replying to and the error message you quoted suggested to me that your concern was that the bookreader files you are attempting to read are "corrupt". I think Zane was reading the files from an ISO image I made of a 1989 CONOLD CDROM. That CDROM had previously been used as a toboggan by one or more members the DEC Reading Engineering Team and so was somewhat heavily scuffed when I got it. I eventually recovered it through a process of manual polishing involving sandpaper and elbow grease. I think ddrescue reported 2048 bad bytes in the end (one sector). It is entirely possible that one or more of the files is corrupt, although the text files (the BOOKSHEFLF files, for example) seem OK. The filesystem structures do seem OK, so maybe I was lucky. My suggestion was intended to help you discover whether the bookreader files are "corrupt" or the tools you are using to read them are mishandling them. (In my experience "corrupt" files on VMS are usually due to file attributes being lost when the files were transferred via some other system. On early version of VMS, this can usually be fixed using Joe Meadows' "FILE" utility.) In this case any corruption will be down to over-enthusiastic handling 20+ years ago. Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
Zane Healy wrote: > On May 17, 2021, at 2:43 PM, Peter Coghlan via cctalk > wrote: >> Zane, >> >> How about redirecting DECW$BOOKREADER to display on an X server elsewhere? >> >> $ SET DISPLAY /NODE=domain.name /TRANSPORT=TCPIP /CREATE >> $ MCR DECW$BOOKREADER >> >> Regards, >> Peter Coghlan > > I’m trying to make the files readable via HECnet, so I need VTBOOK, MGBOOK, > or similar. I see that at least an early Freeware CD had VTB, but the > copy I downloaded appears to be corrupt. > Zane, The content of your posting which I was replying to and the error message you quoted suggested to me that your concern was that the bookreader files you are attempting to read are "corrupt". My suggestion was intended to help you discover whether the bookreader files are "corrupt" or the tools you are using to read them are mishandling them. (In my experience "corrupt" files on VMS are usually due to file attributes being lost when the files were transferred via some other system. On early version of VMS, this can usually be fixed using Joe Meadows' "FILE" utility.) Regards, Peter Coghlan. > Zane
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On May 17, 2021, at 2:43 PM, Peter Coghlan via cctalk wrote: > Zane, > > How about redirecting DECW$BOOKREADER to display on an X server elsewhere? > > $ SET DISPLAY /NODE=domain.name /TRANSPORT=TCPIP /CREATE > $ MCR DECW$BOOKREADER > > Regards, > Peter Coghlan I’m trying to make the files readable via HECnet, so I need VTBOOK, MGBOOK, or similar. I see that at least an early Freeware CD had VTB, but the copy I downloaded appears to be corrupt. Zane
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
Zane Healy wrote: > On May 17, 2021, at 1:54 PM, Malte Dehling wrote: >> >> On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 12:46:31PM -0700, Zane Healy wrote: On May 16, 2021, at 5:51 AM, Malte Dehling via cctalk wrote: I have now generated a contents listing for the CONOLD CDs: https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-03 https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-07 >>> >>> Did you read these on a VAX? I’m trying to use MGBOOK (based on >>> VTBOOK), to read the files from >>> CDROM-AG-NC67C-RE-1989-07-VMS-CONOLD.iso. I’m on a system running >>> VAX/VMS 5.5-2, and I am able to read the DECW$BOOKSHELF files, but not >>> the DECW$BOOK files. >>> >>> I’m able to read the Bookreader documentation installed with VAX/VMS >>> 5.5-2 just fine using MGBOOK. >> >> I just did a TYPE *.DECW$BOOKSHELF in a simulated vax and wrote a little >> python script to generate the contents listing. >> >> I don't know MGBOOK, so I can't help you there. On my VAXstation 3100 >> running VMS 5.5-2, I can read the documentation using the standard >> DECW$BOOKREADER application after doing: >> >> DEFINE/SYSTEM DECW$BOOK DKA400:[DECW$BOOK] > > Thanks! Knowing that helps. I don’t have a monitor on any of my > VAXstations, so couldn’t try that. > Zane, How about redirecting DECW$BOOKREADER to display on an X server elsewhere? $ SET DISPLAY /NODE=domain.name /TRANSPORT=TCPIP /CREATE $ MCR DECW$BOOKREADER Regards, Peter Coghlan > > Zane >
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On May 17, 2021, at 1:54 PM, Malte Dehling wrote: > > On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 12:46:31PM -0700, Zane Healy wrote: >>> On May 16, 2021, at 5:51 AM, Malte Dehling via cctalk >>> wrote: >>> I have now generated a contents listing for the CONOLD CDs: >>> >>> https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-03 >>> https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-07 >> >> Did you read these on a VAX? I’m trying to use MGBOOK (based on >> VTBOOK), to read the files from >> CDROM-AG-NC67C-RE-1989-07-VMS-CONOLD.iso. I’m on a system running >> VAX/VMS 5.5-2, and I am able to read the DECW$BOOKSHELF files, but not >> the DECW$BOOK files. >> >> I’m able to read the Bookreader documentation installed with VAX/VMS >> 5.5-2 just fine using MGBOOK. > > I just did a TYPE *.DECW$BOOKSHELF in a simulated vax and wrote a little > python script to generate the contents listing. > > I don't know MGBOOK, so I can't help you there. On my VAXstation 3100 > running VMS 5.5-2, I can read the documentation using the standard > DECW$BOOKREADER application after doing: > > DEFINE/SYSTEM DECW$BOOK DKA400:[DECW$BOOK] Thanks! Knowing that helps. I don’t have a monitor on any of my VAXstations, so couldn’t try that. Zane
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 12:46:31PM -0700, Zane Healy wrote: > > On May 16, 2021, at 5:51 AM, Malte Dehling via cctalk > > wrote: > > I have now generated a contents listing for the CONOLD CDs: > > > > https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-03 > > https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-07 > > Did you read these on a VAX? I’m trying to use MGBOOK (based on > VTBOOK), to read the files from > CDROM-AG-NC67C-RE-1989-07-VMS-CONOLD.iso. I’m on a system running > VAX/VMS 5.5-2, and I am able to read the DECW$BOOKSHELF files, but not > the DECW$BOOK files. > > I’m able to read the Bookreader documentation installed with VAX/VMS > 5.5-2 just fine using MGBOOK. I just did a TYPE *.DECW$BOOKSHELF in a simulated vax and wrote a little python script to generate the contents listing. I don't know MGBOOK, so I can't help you there. On my VAXstation 3100 running VMS 5.5-2, I can read the documentation using the standard DECW$BOOKREADER application after doing: DEFINE/SYSTEM DECW$BOOK DKA400:[DECW$BOOK] Cheers, Malte -- Malte Dehling
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
> On May 16, 2021, at 5:51 AM, Malte Dehling via cctalk > wrote: > > On Fri, May 14, 2021 at 11:47:09AM +0200, Malte Dehling wrote: >> I plan on updating the description for the CONOLD CDs with a list of >> the books included. That probably means writing a script to extract >> that information from the DECW$BOOKSHELF files. > > I have now generated a contents listing for the CONOLD CDs: > > https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-03 > https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-07 > > Cheers, > Malte > > -- > Malte Dehling > Did you read these on a VAX? I’m trying to use MGBOOK (based on VTBOOK), to read the files from CDROM-AG-NC67C-RE-1989-07-VMS-CONOLD.iso. I’m on a system running VAX/VMS 5.5-2, and I am able to read the DECW$BOOKSHELF files, but not the DECW$BOOK files. I’m able to read the Bookreader documentation installed with VAX/VMS 5.5-2 just fine using MGBOOK. Error from in MGBOOK when trying to read a DECW$BOOK after reading a DECW$BOOKSHELF file. %SYSTEM-F-ACCVIO, access violation, reason mask=00, virtual address=0011, PC=3B2F, PSL=03C0 Error from MGBOOK when trying to read a DECW$BOOK directly. %MGBOOK-E-READERR, Error reading bookshelf entry information -RMS-W-RTB, 1022 byte record too large for user's buffer Zane
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 16/05/2021 21:53, Zane Healy wrote: What exactly is VAX/VMS V5.5-2H4? I’ve never been too clear on that. It’s just V5.5-2 with added hardware support, isn’t it? Yes, that would seem to be the case: |---|-|--||9| |---| | |V5.5-2HW |Limited HW Release||3|2| OpenVMS VAX V5.5-2HW was a special hardware release that | | | | | FRS=9/4/92 | | | supported the following new VAX systems and peripherals: | | | | || | | VAX 7000 Model 600 & VAX 1 Model 600 (Neon) | | | | || | | VAX 4000 Model 400 (Omega-slow)/ VAX 4000 Model 100 | | | | || | | (Cheetah-Q) MicroVAX 3100 Model 90 (Cheetah-W) / VAXstation | | | | || | | 4000 Model 90 (Cougar) / RZ26 / TZ86 / ESE50 | |---|-|--|| | |---| https://web.archive.org/web/20170824234825/http://h41379.www4.hpe.com/openvms/os/openvms-release-history.txt (and also http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/vax/vms/openvms-release-history.txt). Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On Sun, May 16, 2021 at 2:03 PM Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: > > What exactly is VAX/VMS V5.5-2H4? I’ve never been too clear on that. It’s > just V5.5-2 with added hardware support, isn’t it? https://wiki.vmssoftware.com/OpenVMS VIKING V5.5-2H4 July 26,1993 Limited Hardware Release based on V5.5-2. Includes support for VAX 4000 models: 100A, 500A, 600A, 700A. Also supports 2nd SCSI adapter, KZDDA, on MicroVAX 3100 Model 90. Also includes support for DEFTA (FDDI to TURBOchannel adapter) and DEFQA (FDDI to Q-bus adapter) and Tagged Command Queuing (TCQ) for StorageWorks RAID Array 110 Subsystem.
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On May 16, 2021, at 1:42 PM, Antonio Carlini wrote: > > On 16/05/2021 21:00, Zane Healy wrote: >> Does anyone know if a 5.5-2 era CONOLD is available? These that have just >> been made available are beyond awesome, as I gave my paper set of 5.x doc’s >> to Paul Allen’s computer museum, only keeping the basic 6 paperbacks, since >> I have a complete 6.x set, and the base 7.2 set >> >> I’m going to see about putting them on PDXVAX (which is on HECnet), and >> making them available for viewing with VTBOOK. I need to hunt up copies of >> that and a couple other things. I should have them in my archives. >> >> I want to say that there is a WASD package that will handle bookreader >> format doc’s. > > V5.5-2 would be 1991-NOV or so. There's a CONDIST 1991-MAY on > https://vaxstuff.files.wordpress.com/2020/08/. and I have a CONDIST 1991-NOV. > > The next CONOLD I have is 1992-JUL (3 discs) (I can image that one next if it > will help). PDXVAX runs 5.5-2, so I was hoping to get doc’s specific to that release, though realistically even the 5.1 doc’s you just uploaded will be great, and I’m rather curious to get them accessible anyway. > There's a V5.5-2H4 OS CD on VaxHaven at > http://vaxhaven.com/cd-image/AG-PXL1A-RE.iso.zip. What exactly is VAX/VMS V5.5-2H4? I’ve never been too clear on that. It’s just V5.5-2 with added hardware support, isn’t it? Zane
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 16/05/2021 21:00, Zane Healy wrote: Does anyone know if a 5.5-2 era CONOLD is available? These that have just been made available are beyond awesome, as I gave my paper set of 5.x doc’s to Paul Allen’s computer museum, only keeping the basic 6 paperbacks, since I have a complete 6.x set, and the base 7.2 set I’m going to see about putting them on PDXVAX (which is on HECnet), and making them available for viewing with VTBOOK. I need to hunt up copies of that and a couple other things. I should have them in my archives. I want to say that there is a WASD package that will handle bookreader format doc’s. V5.5-2 would be 1991-NOV or so. There's a CONDIST 1991-MAY on https://vaxstuff.files.wordpress.com/2020/08/. and I have a CONDIST 1991-NOV. The next CONOLD I have is 1992-JUL (3 discs) (I can image that one next if it will help). There's a V5.5-2H4 OS CD on VaxHaven at http://vaxhaven.com/cd-image/AG-PXL1A-RE.iso.zip. Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
Does anyone know if a 5.5-2 era CONOLD is available? These that have just been made available are beyond awesome, as I gave my paper set of 5.x doc’s to Paul Allen’s computer museum, only keeping the basic 6 paperbacks, since I have a complete 6.x set, and the base 7.2 set I’m going to see about putting them on PDXVAX (which is on HECnet), and making them available for viewing with VTBOOK. I need to hunt up copies of that and a couple other things. I should have them in my archives. I want to say that there is a WASD package that will handle bookreader format doc’s. Zane > On May 16, 2021, at 11:46 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk > wrote: > > On 16/05/2021 13:51, Malte Dehling wrote: >> I have now generated a contents listing for the CONOLD CDs: >> >> https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-03 >> https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-07 >> > That looks interesting: the fundamental VMS documentation is there, but very > little of the layered product info is present. > > The MAR-1989 CONOLD has FORTRAN and DBMS and the JUL-1989 CONOLD has C, > FORTRAN, PASCAL, GKS, DBMS, VDE and DECforms. > > So I would speculate that these would be amongst the earliest CONOLD > distributions. I read elsewhere (comp.os.vms) that the first CONDIST > > went out in the VMS V5.0 timeframe and the 1989-05 CONDIST contains both VMS > V5.0 and V5.1. VMS V5.0 was announced > > in APR-1998 > (https://eisner.decus.org/anon/htnotes/note?f1=INDUSTRY_NEWS&f2=64.0), so it > is possible that some earlier CONDIST > > may yet appear. > > > I've put the CD_CONTENTS.DAT that I have up on github: > https://github.com/AntonioCarlini/dec-cdrom-distros. (I just realised that > I've mis-named the 1989-05 release as 1989-03 ... I'll fix that rsn). > > I guess that I should do something similar for the CONOLD CDROMs. Did you > find DECW$SHELF to be enough to build up an accurate list of contents? > > > Antonio > > -- > Antonio Carlini > anto...@acarlini.com >
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 16/05/2021 13:51, Malte Dehling wrote: I have now generated a contents listing for the CONOLD CDs: https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-03 https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-07 That looks interesting: the fundamental VMS documentation is there, but very little of the layered product info is present. The MAR-1989 CONOLD has FORTRAN and DBMS and the JUL-1989 CONOLD has C, FORTRAN, PASCAL, GKS, DBMS, VDE and DECforms. So I would speculate that these would be amongst the earliest CONOLD distributions. I read elsewhere (comp.os.vms) that the first CONDIST went out in the VMS V5.0 timeframe and the 1989-05 CONDIST contains both VMS V5.0 and V5.1. VMS V5.0 was announced in APR-1998 (https://eisner.decus.org/anon/htnotes/note?f1=INDUSTRY_NEWS&f2=64.0), so it is possible that some earlier CONDIST may yet appear. I've put the CD_CONTENTS.DAT that I have up on github: https://github.com/AntonioCarlini/dec-cdrom-distros. (I just realised that I've mis-named the 1989-05 release as 1989-03 ... I'll fix that rsn). I guess that I should do something similar for the CONOLD CDROMs. Did you find DECW$SHELF to be enough to build up an accurate list of contents? Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On Fri, May 14, 2021 at 11:47:09AM +0200, Malte Dehling wrote: > I plan on updating the description for the CONOLD CDs with a list of > the books included. That probably means writing a script to extract > that information from the DECW$BOOKSHELF files. I have now generated a contents listing for the CONOLD CDs: https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-03 https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-07 Cheers, Malte -- Malte Dehling
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 14/05/2021 13:45, John Foust via cctalk wrote: In the USA, it is not uncommon that a public library would have such a CD/DVD rescue machine, too. Ask a librarian. It's moot now (until I come across the next one, I guess). But given the cost and the fact that I have a 100% hit rate right now, I have to say IBM (It's Better Manually) :-) Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 14/05/2021 13:40, Zane Healy wrote: Much to my surprise, I think I’m actually more interested in the Online Doc Library from ‘89 than in the CONDIST’s. It immediately made me think of VTBOOK. As of tomorrow, I’ll be on an 8-week Sabbatical, and I’m going to have to see about putting that Doc Library on PDXVAX, when taking a break from other projects. Zane I don't know how to programmatically check that the data blocks in that ISO are valid (by which I mean "match the original"). For backup savesets then BACKUP/ANALYZE is at least a starting point and the default is to write savesets with /CRC and to check the CRC on read. For DECW$BOOK stuff, I have no idea how you can be confident that it is 100% correct. Then again, it's just text you're going to read (line the [.LINE_DOCS] stuff) so I guess it's not hugely critical. Plus all the stuff I've recovered so far has at most 4096 missing bytes I think, which is 8 blocks at most. So the odds that you'd hit something bad are quite small. Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
> On May 14, 2021, at 5:45 AM, John Foust via cctalk > wrote: > > At 12:03 PM 4/17/2021, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: >> Do you have access to a Record Store that deals in used CDs? I know one of >> our local ones used to have a machine for resurfacing CDs, at the time, I >> didnât need to make use of the service. Another option might be used >> Video Game stores. > > In the USA, it is not uncommon that a public library would have > such a CD/DVD rescue machine, too. Ask a librarian. That’s an interesting point, they’d basically have to have one, at least in the same system as they are. I forget that Libraries are more about optical discs than books these days. :-( Of course I mainly forget that because I have more books on any topic that interests me, than our local library system. Zane
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
At 12:03 PM 4/17/2021, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: >Do you have access to a Record Store that deals in used CDs? I know one of >our local ones used to have a machine for resurfacing CDs, at the time, I >didnât need to make use of the service. Another option might be used Video >Game stores. In the USA, it is not uncommon that a public library would have such a CD/DVD rescue machine, too. Ask a librarian. - John
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
> On May 14, 2021, at 3:08 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk > wrote: > > There was the VTBOOK software on a DECUS release many years ago. It got > stomped on for a while and then DEC gave up the fight against PDF and (I > think) VTBOOK made it to the Freeware CD. That might help in working out the > format. Much to my surprise, I think I’m actually more interested in the Online Doc Library from ‘89 than in the CONDIST’s. It immediately made me think of VTBOOK. As of tomorrow, I’ll be on an 8-week Sabbatical, and I’m going to have to see about putting that Doc Library on PDXVAX, when taking a break from other projects. Zane
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 14/05/2021 10:47, Malte Dehling wrote: Perfect! Thanks so much :-) The first two are now also on archive, the InfoServer CD will follow soon: Excellent. I plan on updating the description for the CONOLD CDs with a list of the books included. That probably means writing a script to extract that information from the DECW$BOOKSHELF files. I did look at the CONOLD and there didn't seem to be anything that would help (other than the bookshelf files). There was the VTBOOK software on a DECUS release many years ago. It got stomped on for a while and then DEC gave up the fight against PDF and (I think) VTBOOK made it to the Freeware CD. That might help in working out the format. Wow, thanks a lot! You are putting in some serious effort here! I'm glad this worked so well :-) I rather suspect that if I'd stopped the initial ddrescue when it was at 99% and just gone straight to the 1500 grit sandpaper, then I could have saved my DVD-RW a few days of work. I've just catalogued the VAX CONDIST/CONOLD sets I have and it comes in at 14 or so. I'm hoping that someone tells me that they're already archived before I start on those :-) Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On Thu, May 13, 2021 at 08:18:33PM +0100, Antonio Carlini wrote: > On 12/05/2021 13:58, Malte Dehling wrote: > > > > Here are the links to the relevant archive.org uploads: > > > > https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-07 > > https://archive.org/details/vms-ad-condist-1989-07 > > https://archive.org/details/vms-condist-1989-07 > > https://archive.org/details/vms-condist-1989-11 > > https://archive.org/details/digital-standards-1993-03 > > > > Let me know what you think! > > Thanks. Nice work, particularly grouping them together, pulling out the > JPEGs and seemingly mounting them to suck out the CD_CONTENTS.DAT! > > As a reward for your hard work here are a few more for you :-) > > I've now uploaded ag-nc67a-re.tar.xz, ag-mn36d-re.tar.xz and > ag-pcy4c-xe.tar.xz. > > These are: > > AG-NC67A-RE - VMS Online Documentation Library 1989-03 Disc 1 of 1 > AG-MN36D-RE - VMS Consolidated Software Distribution 1989-05 Disc 1 of 1 > AG-PCY4C-XE - InfoServer V2.0 Software Base Level 10 1991-11 Disc 1 of 1 Perfect! Thanks so much :-) The first two are now also on archive, the InfoServer CD will follow soon: https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-03 https://archive.org/details/vms-condist-1989-05 I plan on updating the description for the CONOLD CDs with a list of the books included. That probably means writing a script to extract that information from the DECW$BOOKSHELF files. > AG-MN36D-RE in particular took over 5 days to rescue. In the end it managed > 99.41% and couldn't get any more data off the CDROM when run with -R. So, > despite the internet saying use 2000 and 3000 grit sandpaper, I went against > all the advice and recklessly tried a seven minute does of 1500 frit > sandpaper, followed by the usual vigorous polishing. I've included a > "before" image of the rear (non-label) side of the CDROM and a triangular > "blemish" is clearly visible near the centre and extending out into the data > region. 2000 grit didn't touch it, I could still feel it afterwards with my > fingernail. 1500 grit wiped it away completely and ddrescue got to work > immediately and took just 10 minutes or so to recover the missing data > (apart from 4096 bytes). Wow, thanks a lot! You are putting in some serious effort here! I'm glad this worked so well :-) Cheers, Malte -- Malte Dehling
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On Fri, May 14, 2021 at 09:40:34AM +0100, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: > On 14/05/2021 00:19, Matt Burke via cctalk wrote: > > You might want to have a look at http://de.openvms.org/spl.php > > Thanks, that looks really useful. I'll have to work out which updates to > send him. I talked to him a while ago and I've sent him the cd_contents.dat files for your first round of uploads already (which is what he needs to update the database.) I'll send him the newer ones, too. Cheers, Malte -- Malte Dehling
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 14/05/2021 00:19, Matt Burke via cctalk wrote: You might want to have a look at http://de.openvms.org/spl.php Thanks, that looks really useful. I'll have to work out which updates to send him. Some time ago I made a copy of this data in an SQLite database which I've added some more entries to. You can download it here: http://www.9track.net/bits/dec/vms/spl.db.bz2 Thanks. You can see the entries I've added with SELECT * FROM spl WHERE rowid > 41236; Now I just need to read up on SQLite :) Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
> On May 13, 2021, at 4:19 PM, Matt Burke via cctalk > wrote: > > On 13/05/2021 20:18, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: >> Incidentally, I'm currently working through my OpenVMS VAX (and a few >> Alpha) CONDIST CDROMs and pulling out all the CD_CONTENTS.DAT so I can >> put together a script to build a list of which sets hold any given >> version of a product. > > You might want to have a look at http://de.openvms.org/spl.php > > Some time ago I made a copy of this data in an SQLite database which > I've added some more entries to. You can download it here: > > http://www.9track.net/bits/dec/vms/spl.db.bz2 > > You can see the entries I've added with > > SELECT * FROM spl WHERE rowid > 41236; > > Regards, > > Matt That is INCREDIBLY useful. Especially when trying to figure out which SPL’s will have copies of the version you want. In fact it looks like I need to update at least a couple things. The joke is I’ve had the SPL with the kits for probably 15+ years. Zane
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 13/05/2021 20:18, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: > Incidentally, I'm currently working through my OpenVMS VAX (and a few > Alpha) CONDIST CDROMs and pulling out all the CD_CONTENTS.DAT so I can > put together a script to build a list of which sets hold any given > version of a product. You might want to have a look at http://de.openvms.org/spl.php Some time ago I made a copy of this data in an SQLite database which I've added some more entries to. You can download it here: http://www.9track.net/bits/dec/vms/spl.db.bz2 You can see the entries I've added with SELECT * FROM spl WHERE rowid > 41236; Regards, Matt
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 12/05/2021 13:58, Malte Dehling wrote: Here are the links to the relevant archive.org uploads: https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-07 https://archive.org/details/vms-ad-condist-1989-07 https://archive.org/details/vms-condist-1989-07 https://archive.org/details/vms-condist-1989-11 https://archive.org/details/digital-standards-1993-03 Let me know what you think! Thanks. Nice work, particularly grouping them together, pulling out the JPEGs and seemingly mounting them to suck out the CD_CONTENTS.DAT! As a reward for your hard work here are a few more for you :-) I've now uploaded ag-nc67a-re.tar.xz, ag-mn36d-re.tar.xz and ag-pcy4c-xe.tar.xz. These are: AG-NC67A-RE - VMS Online Documentation Library 1989-03 Disc 1 of 1 AG-MN36D-RE - VMS Consolidated Software Distribution 1989-05 Disc 1 of 1 AG-PCY4C-XE - InfoServer V2.0 Software Base Level 10 1991-11 Disc 1 of 1 AG-MN36D-RE in particular took over 5 days to rescue. In the end it managed 99.41% and couldn't get any more data off the CDROM when run with -R. So, despite the internet saying use 2000 and 3000 grit sandpaper, I went against all the advice and recklessly tried a seven minute does of 1500 frit sandpaper, followed by the usual vigorous polishing. I've included a "before" image of the rear (non-label) side of the CDROM and a triangular "blemish" is clearly visible near the centre and extending out into the data region. 2000 grit didn't touch it, I could still feel it afterwards with my fingernail. 1500 grit wiped it away completely and ddrescue got to work immediately and took just 10 minutes or so to recover the missing data (apart from 4096 bytes). I had previously tried the image out using SIMH back when it was at a mere 99% and it mounted happily (although it complained that it could not find the alternate home block). I copied all the files to NLA0: and there were no errors. I don't think that means that all the data blocks were good (since VMS would have no way to tell) but there were no errors noted in the filesystem structures, so that's at least some comfort. I haven't tried BACKUP/ANALYZE on all the savesets but that might be one way to test the integrity of those files. The InfoServer CDROM I included because it has some nice cover art with (I presume) the faces of five of the develpment team. Anyone know who they are? I suspect that if you really want to use an Infoserver you might be better off with the most up to date version on the most recent OpenVMS Freeware release. Incidentally, I'm currently working through my OpenVMS VAX (and a few Alpha) CONDIST CDROMs and pulling out all the CD_CONTENTS.DAT so I can put together a script to build a list of which sets hold any given version of a product. So if anyone has any missing sets, and wants to supply some, please do. This will all end up on github eventually. To save you some time, for versions sometime before MAR-1992, you need the CD_CONTENTS.DAT from every disc in the set as they each contain details of only the products on that disc. Beyond that data the format changed and the contents are identical on each disc. The old style looks like this: LABEL CD_BIN_92932 %TYPE CONDIST ! ! NOVEMBER CONDIST: DISC 2 OF 2 ! !PRODUCT NAME UPI INST VERSION KIT CH DIS ROOT SAVESET(S) and the new style looks like this: %DISC_PRODUCT_NAME1 VMS Consolidated %DISC_PRODUCT_NAME2 Software Distribution %KIT_PART_NUMBER QA-VWJ8A-A8. U01 %SPINE_PART_NUMBER AV-MN37Y-RE ! %DISC_PART_NUMBER AG-MN36Y-RE,AG-PASMS-RE,AG-PCXXM-RE,AG-PFXCJ-RE,AG-PJ4YD-RE,AG-PNTPA-RE %DFARS Y I already have 1989-05/07/11, 1992-03/05/07/09/11, 1994-11, 1995-01, 1996-03/06/09/12, 1997-03/06/09/12 and 1998-03, so anything else (or anything from any Alpha CONDIST release) would be cool. Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On Wed, May 12, 2021 at 02:52:26PM +0200, Malte Dehling wrote: > > On 10/05/2021 10:05, Malte Dehling wrote: > > > I think uploading them to archive.org would be a good long-term > > > solution. I can take care of it if you don't have an account. > > > > Please do. Thanks. > > Will do. I'll let you know. Here are the links to the relevant archive.org uploads: https://archive.org/details/vms-conold-1989-07 https://archive.org/details/vms-ad-condist-1989-07 https://archive.org/details/vms-condist-1989-07 https://archive.org/details/vms-condist-1989-11 https://archive.org/details/digital-standards-1993-03 Let me know what you think! Cheers, Malte -- Malte Dehling
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
(I had accidentally sent my reply below only to Antonio. I'm resending it to the list.) > On 10/05/2021 10:05, Malte Dehling wrote: > > Thanks a lot, Antonio, these are very valuable to have! > I've only checked a couple of them under SIMH, so it would be helpful to > know if I need to check my workflow or not. > > I think uploading them to archive.org would be a good long-term > > solution. I can take care of it if you don't have an account. > > Please do. Thanks. Will do. I'll let you know. > In other news, I polished the MAR-1989 CONOLD, which looked very bad, to > start with. Amazingly it buffed up quite nicely and then read surprisingly > well: > > [ > > $ ddrescue -r5 -v /dev/sr1 CDROM-AG-NC67A-RE-1989-03-VMS-CONOLD.iso > CDROM-AG-NC67A-RE-1989-03-VMS-CONOLD.map > GNU ddrescue 1.23 > About to copy 205199 kBytes from '/dev/sr1' to > 'CDROM-AG-NC67A-RE-1989-03-VMS-CONOLD.iso' > Starting positions: infile = 0 B, outfile = 0 B > Copy block size: 128 sectors Initial skip size: 128 sectors > Sector size: 512 Bytes > > Press Ctrl-C to interrupt > ipos: 205198 kB, non-trimmed: 0 B, current rate: 0 B/s > opos: 205198 kB, non-scraped: 0 B, average rate: 637 kB/s > non-tried: 0 B, bad-sector: 2048 B, error rate: 170 B/s > rescued: 205197 kB, bad areas: 1, run time: 5m 22s > pct rescued: 99.99%, read errors: 25, remaining time: n/a > time since last successful read: 2m 1s > Finished > ] > > > So I went ahead and tried the CONDIST from MAY-1989. That too now can be > read, although it is proving a somewhat tougher nut to crack: > > [ > > $ ddrescue -r5 -v /dev/sr1 CDROM-AG-MN36D-RE-1989-05-VMS-CONDIST.iso > CDROM-AG-MN36D-RE-1989-05-VMS-CONDIST.map > GNU ddrescue 1.23 > About to copy 623247 kBytes from '/dev/sr1' to > 'CDROM-AG-MN36D-RE-1989-05-VMS-CONDIST.iso' > Starting positions: infile = 0 B, outfile = 0 B > Copy block size: 128 sectors Initial skip size: 128 sectors > Sector size: 512 Bytes > > Press Ctrl-C to interrupt > ipos: 5919 kB, non-trimmed: 0 B, current rate: 0 B/s > opos: 5919 kB, non-scraped: 11127 kB, average rate: 14694 B/s > non-tried: 0 B, bad-sector: 2843 kB, error rate: 85 B/s > rescued: 609276 kB, bad areas: 445, run time: 11h 31m 2s > pct rescued: 97.75%, read errors: 5884, remaining time: 5d 23h 43m > time since last successful read: 2m 45s > Scraping failed blocks... (forwards) ] > > > On the plus side, that's 97.75% more data than I had before :-) but the > "remaining time" looks like it could be the rest of the week (it varies > quite a bit). > > > I think, from reading the manual, that I can use CTRL-C and restart this > again later and it will pick up where it left off using the map file. Is > this right? Very nice, this worked much better than I had expected! And you're right, you can simply CTRL-C and restart ddrescue with the same command (i.e., with the iso and map file; different options should work.) I would make a copy of the files before restarting, just in case. > Are there any other options I should consider trying? Can you try with "-b 2048 -d" for direct disc access and maybe once more with "-R" for reverse? > Another thought is that perhaps a shade more polishing might help. If I > polish the CDROM a little more and then resume the ddrescue, I think I won't > be any worse off than I am now, i.e. all existing data will still be there > and all I'll be risking is data that maybe would have eventually read before > but now may not read at all. Is that right? Successful reads are now ~20m > apart, so I suspect that the remaining data will be quite difficult to > recover. After trying the various options on the disk in its current state, I see no harm in trying this approach. With the map file, ddrescue should never overwrite already-read data. Again, I would make a copy to be safe. Cheers, Malte -- Malte Dehling
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 10/05/2021 10:05, Malte Dehling wrote: Thanks a lot, Antonio, these are very valuable to have! I've only checked a couple of them under SIMH, so it would be helpful to know if I need to check my workflow or not. I think uploading them to archive.org would be a good long-term solution. I can take care of it if you don't have an account. Please do. Thanks. In other news, I polished the MAR-1989 CONOLD, which looked very bad, to start with. Amazingly it buffed up quite nicely and then read surprisingly well: [ $ ddrescue -r5 -v /dev/sr1 CDROM-AG-NC67A-RE-1989-03-VMS-CONOLD.iso CDROM-AG-NC67A-RE-1989-03-VMS-CONOLD.map GNU ddrescue 1.23 About to copy 205199 kBytes from '/dev/sr1' to 'CDROM-AG-NC67A-RE-1989-03-VMS-CONOLD.iso' Starting positions: infile = 0 B, outfile = 0 B Copy block size: 128 sectors Initial skip size: 128 sectors Sector size: 512 Bytes Press Ctrl-C to interrupt ipos: 205198 kB, non-trimmed: 0 B, current rate: 0 B/s opos: 205198 kB, non-scraped: 0 B, average rate: 637 kB/s non-tried: 0 B, bad-sector: 2048 B, error rate: 170 B/s rescued: 205197 kB, bad areas: 1, run time: 5m 22s pct rescued: 99.99%, read errors: 25, remaining time: n/a time since last successful read: 2m 1s Finished ] So I went ahead and tried the CONDIST from MAY-1989. That too now can be read, although it is proving a somewhat tougher nut to crack: [ $ ddrescue -r5 -v /dev/sr1 CDROM-AG-MN36D-RE-1989-05-VMS-CONDIST.iso CDROM-AG-MN36D-RE-1989-05-VMS-CONDIST.map GNU ddrescue 1.23 About to copy 623247 kBytes from '/dev/sr1' to 'CDROM-AG-MN36D-RE-1989-05-VMS-CONDIST.iso' Starting positions: infile = 0 B, outfile = 0 B Copy block size: 128 sectors Initial skip size: 128 sectors Sector size: 512 Bytes Press Ctrl-C to interrupt ipos: 5919 kB, non-trimmed: 0 B, current rate: 0 B/s opos: 5919 kB, non-scraped: 11127 kB, average rate: 14694 B/s non-tried: 0 B, bad-sector: 2843 kB, error rate: 85 B/s rescued: 609276 kB, bad areas: 445, run time: 11h 31m 2s pct rescued: 97.75%, read errors: 5884, remaining time: 5d 23h 43m time since last successful read: 2m 45s Scraping failed blocks... (forwards) ] On the plus side, that's 97.75% more data than I had before :-) but the "remaining time" looks like it could be the rest of the week (it varies quite a bit). I think, from reading the manual, that I can use CTRL-C and restart this again later and it will pick up where it left off using the map file. Is this right? Are there any other options I should consider trying? Another thought is that perhaps a shade more polishing might help. If I polish the CDROM a little more and then resume the ddrescue, I think I won't be any worse off than I am now, i.e. all existing data will still be there and all I'll be risking is data that maybe would have eventually read before but now may not read at all. Is that right? Successful reads are now ~20m apart, so I suspect that the remaining data will be quite difficult to recover. Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On Sun, May 09, 2021 at 10:23:19PM +0100, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: > I've now uploaded: ag-mn36e-re.tar.xz, ag-nh37b-re.tar.xz and > el-cdrom-01-rev-L.tar.xz. > > The full set now available are: > > AG-MN36E-RE - VMS Consolidated Software Distribution 1989-07 Disc 1 of 1 > AG-NC67C-RE - VMS Online Documentation Library 1989-07 Disc 1 of 1 > AG-NH36B-RE - VMS AD Software Consolidation 1989-07 Disc 1 of 2 > AG-NH37B-RE - VMS AD Software Consolidation 1989-07 Disc 2 of 2 > AG-MN36G-RE - VMS Consolidated Software Distribution 1989-11 Disc 1 of 2 > AG-PASMA-RE - VMS Consolidated Software Distribution 1989-11 Disc 2 of 2 > EL-CDROM-01 - Digital Standards and Related Documents 1993-03-19 Rev L Thanks a lot, Antonio, these are very valuable to have! > If anyone wants to offer them a permanent home, that's fine by my (I > don't need the space on the google drive just yet, but I will have to > remove some images if I start to image a lot more (and I do seem to > have a fair few more). I think uploading them to archive.org would be a good long-term solution. I can take care of it if you don't have an account. Cheers, Malte -- Malte Dehling
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
I've now uploaded: ag-mn36e-re.tar.xz, ag-nh37b-re.tar.xz and el-cdrom-01-rev-L.tar.xz. The full set now available are: AG-MN36E-RE - VMS Consolidated Software Distribution 1989-07 Disc 1 of 1 AG-NC67C-RE - VMS Online Documentation Library 1989-07 Disc 1 of 1 AG-NH36B-RE - VMS AD Software Consolidation 1989-07 Disc 1 of 2 AG-NH37B-RE - VMS AD Software Consolidation 1989-07 Disc 2 of 2 AG-MN36G-RE - VMS Consolidated Software Distribution 1989-11 Disc 1 of 2 AG-PASMA-RE - VMS Consolidated Software Distribution 1989-11 Disc 2 of 2 EL-CDROM-01 - Digital Standards and Related Documents 1993-03-19 Rev L I think that a fair bit (if not even all) of the Standards CDROM is actually already available on bitsavers, but just in case, I've uploaded it anyway. If anyone wants to offer them a permanent home, that's fine by my (I don't need the space on the google drive just yet, but I will have to remove some images if I start to image a lot more (and I do seem to have a fair few more). Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 18/04/2021 18:00, Antonio Carlini wrote: I'm using a seven year old DVD-RW drive and a similarly aged DVD-ROM drive. The results are the same in either case. Life got in the way, as usual, but here are a few CDROMs to start with: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1c1ttR83wt5Y4z4O9DsFWtJgV-PdpHarS?usp=sharing. Hopefully those will be accessible to whoever wants them. AG-MN36G-RE and AG-PASMA-RE are discs 1 and 2 of NOV-1989 CONDIST. AG-NC67C-RE is the JUL-1987 CONOLD. AG-NH36B-RE is Disc 1 of 2 of the JUL-1989 "VMS AD Software Consolidation", which I think was some sort of experiment. Two of them may well be completely unrecoverable. The others that I've tried with 1989 date codes are 99+% recoverable so I'm hoping that the missing sector or so doesn't upset ODS-2 too much. If I get the time, I'll try them out tonight. The May 1989 CONDIST (and the Mar 1989 CONOLD) are both currently completely unreadable. I'll try one of them in the GAME polishing machine, assuming they actually have a polishing machine nearby. If there is no such machine nearby then I'll try the 3000 grit sandpaper as there's not really much to lose. I've no idea whether the nearby GAME store has a polisher, as they've not replied to my queries and I've given up waiting. I'm going to try 2000/3000 grit sandpaper on the MAR-1989 CONOLD soon, so we'll see how that goes (I picked up some rubbing compound today, which is needed for the final stage). I do have a few more early ones imaged, I just haven't scanned the CDROM themselves, so as soon as I get that done (hopefully less than a month this time!) I'll upload those and make a note here. These are tar images compressed with xz. "-J" should expand them. There is a sha256sum.txt file inside and a readme with details of the extraction and the results of the ddrescue command. I think AG-PASMA-RE read without error using dd. Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On Wed, Apr 21, 2021 at 09:53:26PM +0100, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: > I've managed to reconstitute my SIMH config and I've checked out a few > of the ISO files I managed to generate using ddrescue. > > The Mar 89 CONOLD and May 89 CONDIST do not even show up as media > under Linux. If I get the chance I'll try out the Oxford GAME store > polisher for one at least of them. As a backup I'll dig out my 3000 > grit sandpaper and try that out. I have to say I'm a little worried about the sandpaper... do you have a spare CD to test the effect on? Another option might be to send the CD to someone who does have a store nearby with a CD polisher. Either way, I guess the first step would be to find out whether the Oxford GAME store has one. Thanks again for your effort! > I've only looked at a few CONDIST volumes and none of the > corresponding CONOLD volumes. > > The oldest working one is the 1989 July CONDIST, which read 99.99% > with ddrescue. It mounts quite happily and I can see the directory. > > [...] > > Anyway, it looks like it is all there. However (and there's always a > "however") the VAXSET kit that started this all off is VAXSET*080* and > not the hoped for *070*. Interestingly the [.LINE] subdirectory does > contain some doc files but the [.KIT] directory is empty. I've > included the CD_CONTENTS.DAT below. From that you can see: > > "VAXSET" N V8.0 SUB N Y VAXSET080 NO_BINARIES > > which would suggest that the kit didn't ship although the SPD and so > on did. No idea why. Until I saw that I assumed that this was the one > set of files to get whacked, but that seems very unlikely. Especially > since the 1989 JUL AD CONDIST is the same. VAXSET is just a combined package consisting of CMS, LSE, SCA, MMS, PCA, and DTM. Here's a table of corresponding version numbers I've compiled from various sources (likely not 100% correct): |=== | VAXSET | v5.0 | v6.0 | v7.0 | v8.0 | v9.0 | v10.0 | CMS | v2.3 | v3.0 | v3.1 | v3.2 | v3.3 | v3.4 | LSE | v2.1 | v2.2 | v2.2 | v2.3 | v3.0 | v3.1 | SCA | v1.1 | v1.2 | v1.2 | v1.3 | v2.0 | v3.0 | MMS | v2.2 | v2.3 | v2.4 | v2.5 | v2.5 | v2.6 | PCA |?v1.2 | v2.0 | v2.0 | v2.1 | v2.2 | v3.0 | DTM | v2.2 | v2.3 | v2.3 | v3.0 | v3.1 | v3.2 | Release | 1987 | 1988 | 1988 | 1989 | 1990 | 1990 | Minimal VMS |?v4.4 | v4.6 | v4.6 | v5.1 | v5.3 | v5.3 |=== It looks like the individual components of VAXSET v8.0 are on the 1989-07 CONDIST even if VAXSET is listed as NO_BINARIES. While VAXSET v8.0 requires VMS v5.1, I'm not sure about its components. Some of them may run on (Micro)VMS 4.7. > I also ran up the MENU.EXE that is included and VAXSET is listed under > "New Products" and not "Updated Products". My interpretation would be > that it is not on any earlier CONDIST CDROMs. But it would be nice for > earlier ones to get flushed out and published! That's entirely possible, I have no reason to believe VAXSET was on earlier CONDIST CDs. Either way, I'm very interested in the older CONDISTs, too! This one already contains a few other things I have been looking for for a while. > Anyway, over the next few days I'll package up these early CDROMs and > put them up on either google drive or dropbox. I'll post a link here > and whoever wants them can grab them. If Al wants them for bitsavers > that's OK by me. > > I plan to include the ISO, a README.TXT that explains that these are > all incomplete and I'll attach the ddrescue output, a scan of the CD, > a SHA256 of the files. I'll tar it up and compress with xz. > > If anyone would prefer some other format or compression or whatever, > I'm open to suggestions. Maybe a ZIP file is easier for some people? Otherwise this sounds good! Cheers, Malte -- Malte Dehling
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 21/04/2021 22:13, Peter Coghlan via cctalk wrote: I've just tried ANALYZE/DISK on VAXBINMAY931 which is the oldest I can put a hand on right now and it gives exactly the same output as you got. Thanks ... that's reassuring. Individual savesets can be tested with BACKUP/LIST or (more extensively) by extracting each BACKUP - that would show up any errors. ZIP is probably most commonly used for compressed archives on VMS. The version of ZIP that runs on VMS can save VMS file attributes when told to so that it doesn't lose important attributes for the installation kits like tar would. (I only came across xz anywhere for the first time about a week ago...) It's true that ZIP is probably the most common archiver on VMS (and I'm sure it's on the various OpenVMS FREEWARE disks). That said, I expect that most people making such images available for distribution (e.g. bitsavers) are not running VMS. I'm planning to distribute an ISO plus some extra bits, not the individual backup savesets, so attributes shouldn't be a problem. I'd expect that anyone who wants to use this stuff will run up SIMH and mount an ISO or possibly burn a CD-R and use it that way. I might try zip (under Unix, so gzip) for fun, but I expect that xz will beat it hands down for space. I guess an ISO could also be accessed using LDDRIVER, although my main constraint back in the day was always disk space. I'm not going to try zip on OpenVMS because ... much as I love VMS, SIMH on my laptop just isn't as fast as Linux on a Ryzen! Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
Antonio Carlini wrote: The oldest working one is the 1989 July CONDIST, which read 99.99% with ddrescue. It mounts quite happily and I can see the directory. ANA/DISK complains slightly: [ $ ana/disk dua3: Analyze/Disk_Structure for _VAX072$DUA3: started on 21-APR-2021 21:11:34.25 %ANALDISK-I-SHORTBITMAP, storage bitmap on RVN 1 does not cover the entire device %ANALDISK-I-OPENQUOTA, error opening QUOTA.SYS -SYSTEM-W-NOSUCHFILE, no such file ] There's never a QUOTA.SYS on a CDROM, so that's probably OK. Not sure about the SHORTBITMAP (it's been a long time since I used VMS as my daily driver and I've not had the chance to try an ISO that was read with no errors, nor a real CDROM in a real CDROM drive on a real VAX). I've just tried ANALYZE/DISK on VAXBINMAY931 which is the oldest I can put a hand on right now and it gives exactly the same output as you got. I plan to include the ISO, a README.TXT that explains that these are all incomplete and I'll attach the ddrescue output, a scan of the CD, a SHA256 of the files. I'll tar it up and compress with xz. If anyone would prefer some other format or compression or whatever, I'm open to suggestions. ZIP is probably most commonly used for compressed archives on VMS. The version of ZIP that runs on VMS can save VMS file attributes when told to so that it doesn't lose important attributes for the installation kits like tar would. (I only came across xz anywhere for the first time about a week ago...) Regards, Peter Coghlan.
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
I've managed to reconstitute my SIMH config and I've checked out a few of the ISO files I managed to generate using ddrescue. The Mar 89 CONOLD and May 89 CONDIST do not even show up as media under Linux. If I get the chance I'll try out the Oxford GAME store polisher for one at least of them. As a backup I'll dig out my 3000 grit sandpaper and try that out. I've only looked at a few CONDIST volumes and none of the corresponding CONOLD volumes. The oldest working one is the 1989 July CONDIST, which read 99.99% with ddrescue. It mounts quite happily and I can see the directory. ANA/DISK complains slightly: [ $ ana/disk dua3: Analyze/Disk_Structure for _VAX072$DUA3: started on 21-APR-2021 21:11:34.25 %ANALDISK-I-SHORTBITMAP, storage bitmap on RVN 1 does not cover the entire device %ANALDISK-I-OPENQUOTA, error opening QUOTA.SYS -SYSTEM-W-NOSUCHFILE, no such file ] There's never a QUOTA.SYS on a CDROM, so that's probably OK. Not sure about the SHORTBITMAP (it's been a long time since I used VMS as my daily driver and I've not had the chance to try an ISO that was read with no errors, nor a real CDROM in a real CDROM drive on a real VAX). Anyway, it looks like it is all there. However (and there's always a "however") the VAXSET kit that started this all off is VAXSET*080* and not the hoped for *070*. Interestingly the [.LINE] subdirectory does contain some doc files but the [.KIT] directory is empty. I've included the CD_CONTENTS.DAT below. From that you can see: "VAXSET" N V8.0 SUB N Y VAXSET080 NO_BINARIES which would suggest that the kit didn't ship although the SPD and so on did. No idea why. Until I saw that I assumed that this was the one set of files to get whacked, but that seems very unlikely. Especially since the 1989 JUL AD CONDIST is the same. I also ran up the MENU.EXE that is included and VAXSET is listed under "New Products" and not "Updated Products". My interpretation would be that it is not on any earlier CONDIST CDROMs. But it would be nice for earlier ones to get flushed out and published! Anyway, over the next few days I'll package up these early CDROMs and put them up on either google drive or dropbox. I'll post a link here and whoever wants them can grab them. If Al wants them for bitsavers that's OK by me. I plan to include the ISO, a README.TXT that explains that these are all incomplete and I'll attach the ddrescue output, a scan of the CD, a SHA256 of the files. I'll tar it up and compress with xz. If anyone would prefer some other format or compression or whatever, I'm open to suggestions. Antonio The list of kits on the 1989-07 CONDIST is: [ $ type cd_contanets ents.dat %LABEL CD_BIN_90403 %TYPE CONDIST ! !JULY CONDIST !-- !PRODUCT NAME UPI INST VERSION KIT CH DIS ROOT SAVESET(S) ! "AAF01/VMS SUBROUTINE LIBRARY" GEFR Y V2.0 SUB1 A Y AAF01020 AAF01020 "ADF01/VMS SUBROUTINE LIBRARY" 375 Y V4.0 SUB1 A Y ADF01040 ADF01040 "DEC GKS FOR VMS" 810A Y V4.0 SUB N Y DECGKS040 DECGKS040,DECGKSRTO040 "DEC GKS-3D FOR VMS" VFXE Y V1.0 SUB1 N Y DECGKS3D010 DECGKS3D010,DECGKS3DRT "DECFORMS" VCH Y V1.0 SUB N Y FORMS010 FORMS010,FORMSTR010 "DECNET-VAX" N V5.1 SUB A Y NETVAX051 NO_BINARIES "DECNET/SNA DATA TRANSFER FACILITY" VEBA Y V2.0 SUB1 A Y SNADTF020 SNADTFS020,SNADTFU020 "DECNET/SNA GATEWAY FOR CHANNEL TRANSPORT" VC9 Y V1.0 SUB2 A Y SNACSA010 SNACSA010 "DECNET/SNA GATEWAY FOR SYNCHRONOUS TRANSPORT" S01A Y V1.0 SUB2 A Y SNACST010 SNACST010 "DECNET/SNA VMS 3270 DATA STREAM PROGRAMMING INTERFACE" Y V1.4 SUB N Y SNA3270014 SNA3270014 "DECNET/SNA VMS 3270 TERMINAL EMULATOR" 454A Y V1.5 SUB N Y SNATE015 SNATE015 "DECNET/SNA VMS APPC/LU6.2 PROGRAMMING INTERFACE" 022A Y V2.1 SUB A Y SNALU62021 SNALU62021 "DECNET/SNA VMS APPLICATION PROGRAMMING INTERFACE" 455A Y V2.3 SUB N Y SNALU0023 SNALU0023 "DECNET/SNA VMS DISOSS DOCUMENT EXCHANGE FACILITY" 042A Y V1.4 SUB1 A Y SNADDXF014 SNADDXF014 "DECNET/SNA VMS DISTRIBUTED HOST COMMAND FACILITY" 043A Y V1.2 SUB N Y SNADHCF012 SNADHCF012 "DECNET/SNA VMS GATEWAY MANAGEMENT" 452A Y V2.0 SUB2 A Y SNAGM020 SNAGM020 "DECROUTER 2000" S03 Y V1.1 SUB1 A Y ROU011 ROU011 "DECSERVER 200 FOR VAX/VMS AND MICROVMS" Z06A Y V2.0 SUB A Y DS2020 DS2020 "DECSERVER 500/VMS" Z46 Y V1.1 SUB1 A Y DS5011 DS5011 "DECVOICE SOFTWARE" VFU Y V1.0 SUB A Y VOX010 VOX010 "DRX11-C/VMS DRIVER" S36 Y V6.0 SUB1 A Y DRX11C060 DRX11C060 "EXTERNAL DOCUMENT EXCHANGE WITH IBM DISOSS" Y V2.1 SUB1 N Y EDEDIS021 EDEDIS021 "IEX-VMS-DRIVER" 519A Y V4.0 SUB1 A Y IEX040 IEX040 "IXV/VAXELN DRIVER" VG3A Y V2.0 SUB A Y IXVELN020 IXVELN020 "IXV11/VMS DRIVER" VHZA Y V2.0 SUB A Y IXV11020 IXV11020 "KMV1A MICROVAX DRIVER AND X.25 LINK LEVEL SOFTWARE" VCQA Y V2.0 SUB A Y UWX25020 UWX25020 "KMV1A MICROVAX DRIVER" VCPA Y V2.0 SUB A Y UWDRV020 UWDRV020 "MICROVAX MIRA SWITCH CONTROL" Y V2.1 SUB N Y MRA021 MRA0
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 17/04/2021 23:37, Jon Elson wrote: On 04/17/2021 11:24 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: If anyone has any suggestions for how to clean CDs to recover data, I'm all ears. If by the "data side" you mean the clear side the CD is read from, those can be polished with toothpaste or plastic polish. Modern CD/DVD drives are much better at reading poor quality disks. I'm using a seven year old DVD-RW drive and a similarly aged DVD-ROM drive. The results are the same in either case. If the data layer is scratched, they are likely unrecoverable. That is the side with the label on it, and the data layer is only a few thousandths below the label. Two of them may well be completely unrecoverable. The others that I've tried with 1989 date codes are 99+% recoverable so I'm hoping that the missing sector or so doesn't upset ODS-2 too much. If I get the time, I'll try them out tonight. The May 1989 CONDIST (and the Mar 1989 CONOLD) are both currently completely unreadable. I'll try one of them in the GAME polishing machine, assuming they actually have a polishing machine nearby. If there is no such machine nearby then I'll try the 3000 grit sandpaper as there's not really much to lose. Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On Sat, 17 Apr 2021 at 20:35, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote: > > ddrescue Agreed. Important note: `ddrescue` is the newer tool and is more modern than either `dd_rescue` or `gddrescue`. They are *NOT* the same tools under different names. GNU ddrescue or just `ddrescue` It is the preferred choice and should be tried first, but if you encounter problems you can try the older `dd_rescue` or `gddrescue` if you wish. https://askubuntu.com/questions/211578/whats-the-difference-between-ddrescue-gddrescue-and-dd-rescue -- Liam Proven – Profile: https://about.me/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk – gMail/gTalk/gHangouts: lpro...@gmail.com Twitter/Facebook/LinkedIn/Flickr: lproven – Skype: liamproven UK: +44 7939-087884 – ČR (+ WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal): +420 702 829 053
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 04/17/2021 11:24 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: If anyone has any suggestions for how to clean CDs to recover data, I'm all ears. If by the "data side" you mean the clear side the CD is read from, those can be polished with toothpaste or plastic polish. Modern CD/DVD drives are much better at reading poor quality disks. If the data layer is scratched, they are likely unrecoverable. That is the side with the label on it, and the data layer is only a few thousandths below the label. Jon
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On Sat, Apr 17, 2021 at 08:33:59PM +0100, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: > On 17/04/2021 19:35, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote: > > On 4/17/21 11:30 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: > > > > > So far I've just tried using dd to recover the data but perhaps I > > > should try to find something that won't give up when the OS reports > > > an unreadable sector. Anyone have any suggestions? > > > > > > ddrescue > > > > I guess I should've remembered that one, thanks! > > > So has this just lost ~3KiB? "pct rescued" suggests that it did quite well. > Does "bad areas" mean one bad sector (2048 bytes)? > > > $ ddrescue -r5 -v /dev/sr1 JUL89DIST.iso JUL89DIST.map > GNU ddrescue 1.23 > About to copy 623247 kBytes from '/dev/sr1' to 'JUL89DIST.iso' > Starting positions: infile = 0 B, outfile = 0 B > Copy block size: 128 sectors Initial skip size: 128 sectors > Sector size: 512 Bytes > > Press Ctrl-C to interrupt > ipos: 623246 kB, non-trimmed: 0 B, current rate: 0 B/s > opos: 623246 kB, non-scraped: 0 B, average rate: 1303 kB/s > non-tried: 0 B, bad-sector: 4096 B, error rate: 73 B/s > rescued: 623243 kB, bad areas: 1, run time: 7m 58s > pct rescued: 99.99%, read errors: 49, remaining time: n/a > time since last successful read: 5m 11s > Finished > > This is what ls sees (I renamed the ISO to match what it actually is): > > > -rw-rw-r-- 1 antonioc antonioc 623243264 Apr 17 20:14 > CDROM-AG-MN36E-RE-1989-07-VMS-CONDIST.iso > > (That happens to be exactly the same result as dd). That looks pretty good already! Can you try with "-b 2048 -d" for direct disc access and maybe once more with "-R" for reverse? Cheers, Malte -- Malte Dehling
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 17/04/2021 19:35, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote: On 4/17/21 11:30 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: So far I've just tried using dd to recover the data but perhaps I should try to find something that won't give up when the OS reports an unreadable sector. Anyone have any suggestions? ddrescue I guess I should've remembered that one, thanks! So has this just lost ~3KiB? "pct rescued" suggests that it did quite well. Does "bad areas" mean one bad sector (2048 bytes)? $ ddrescue -r5 -v /dev/sr1 JUL89DIST.iso JUL89DIST.map GNU ddrescue 1.23 About to copy 623247 kBytes from '/dev/sr1' to 'JUL89DIST.iso' Starting positions: infile = 0 B, outfile = 0 B Copy block size: 128 sectors Initial skip size: 128 sectors Sector size: 512 Bytes Press Ctrl-C to interrupt ipos: 623246 kB, non-trimmed: 0 B, current rate: 0 B/s opos: 623246 kB, non-scraped: 0 B, average rate: 1303 kB/s non-tried: 0 B, bad-sector: 4096 B, error rate: 73 B/s rescued: 623243 kB, bad areas: 1, run time: 7m 58s pct rescued: 99.99%, read errors: 49, remaining time: n/a time since last successful read: 5m 11s Finished This is what ls sees (I renamed the ISO to match what it actually is): -rw-rw-r-- 1 antonioc antonioc 623243264 Apr 17 20:14 CDROM-AG-MN36E-RE-1989-07-VMS-CONDIST.iso (That happens to be exactly the same result as dd). Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On Sat, Apr 17, 2021 at 11:35:41AM -0700, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote: > On 4/17/21 11:30 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: > > > So far I've just tried using dd to recover the data but perhaps I should > > try to find something that won't give up when the OS reports an > > unreadable sector. Anyone have any suggestions? > > > ddrescue I agree with the suggestion. I think it's worth trying this before anything else. If anything can be read without further work, ddrescue should do the trick. Of course it helps to test with different drives, too, like you already did. Sorry this turned into more work than expected, and thanks again for your effort! -- Malte Dehling
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 4/17/21 11:30 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: So far I've just tried using dd to recover the data but perhaps I should try to find something that won't give up when the OS reports an unreadable sector. Anyone have any suggestions? ddrescue
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 17/04/2021 18:03, Zane Healy wrote: On Apr 17, 2021, at 9:24 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk mailto:cctalk@classiccmp.org>> wrote: If anyone has any suggestions for how to clean CDs to recover data, I'm all ears. Do you have access to a Record Store that deals in used CDs? I know one of our local ones used to have a machine for resurfacing CDs, at the time, I didn’t need to make use of the service. Another option might be used Video Game stores. Thanks for that, I didn't realise that such a service even existed. There's a GAME in the Westgate in Oxford and the GAME website mentions CD cleaning for games, so I might call and check to see if they have the machine. £3 per disc, so it perhaps might be worth trying on one. When I hold the CD up to the light there are definite pin pricks where I can see the light shining through so I rather suspect that there are some points that are unrecoverable. So maybe not. I also happened across two youtube videos (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tpcd-5fd9nY and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNV7mDfWuWI) where people do the same sort of thing by hand. I happen to have some 3000 grit wet-and-dry available. I might have a go at that too, although I think I should find a data CD that I don't care about, rough it up and see if I can "unrough it up". Pity I threw away all those AOL CDs years ago :-) Actually, I suspect I have a number of duplicate MSDN CDs, so those might do for experimentation. So far I've just tried using dd to recover the data but perhaps I should try to find something that won't give up when the OS reports an unreadable sector. Anyone have any suggestions? Thanks Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 4/17/21 1:03 PM, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: On Apr 17, 2021, at 9:24 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: If anyone has any suggestions for how to clean CDs to recover data, I'm all ears. Do you have access to a Record Store that deals in used CDs? I know one of our local ones used to have a machine for resurfacing CDs, at the time, I didn’t need to make use of the service. Another option might be used Video Game stores. I have used BonAmi to polish scratches on music CDs with considerable success. bill
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On Apr 17, 2021, at 9:24 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: > > If anyone has any suggestions for how to clean CDs to recover data, I'm all > ears. Do you have access to a Record Store that deals in used CDs? I know one of our local ones used to have a machine for resurfacing CDs, at the time, I didn’t need to make use of the service. Another option might be used Video Game stores. Zane
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 17/04/2021 16:53, John H. Reinhardt via cctalk wrote: On 4/17/2021 2:15 AM, Mark J. Blair via cctalk wrote: On Apr 16, 2021, at 11:38 AM, Malte Dehling via cctalk wrote: Whether VAXSET is on there or not, I would be very interested in ISOs of both of these either way! If Antonio does not mind sharing them a bit more widely, I would also like to have ISOs of them. I'm interested in running earlier VMS versions on my 11/730. I too would be interested if it is possible to get disk images of these two CDs. I'll make them available to all. May 1989 wouldn't load up at all in the DVD drive. When I looked at the data side they were very badly scuffed. July 1989 and November 1989 look better but don't read completely. I've tried some CD cleaning solution I have and I've also tried a different drive (and a different OS!). I'll try them out on SIMH and if they're even partially useful, I'll post them. They should be backup savesets, so it should be easy to tell if those have been corrupted or not with BACKUP/ANALYSE. If anyone has any suggestions for how to clean CDs to recover data, I'm all ears. These came out of DEC and were probably dropped off in my cube (as the group was being sold off to Cabletron) after years of kicking around and being used as coasters etc. The ones that I was on a subscription list were looked after and still work :-) (but they're V6 onwards iirc). I suppose that I should start to archive those too, but it will take some time. I should be able to resurrect my SIMH config tonight/tomorrow and then I can test them and put them up somewhere. Any thoughts about what to provide for each one? So far ...: the ISO (with SHA256 or similar) a scan of the CD a README with the CD title and whether it read error free or not: in the latter case a dnesg snippet. Anything else worth adding while I'm at it? Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 4/17/2021 2:15 AM, Mark J. Blair via cctalk wrote: On Apr 16, 2021, at 11:38 AM, Malte Dehling via cctalk wrote: Whether VAXSET is on there or not, I would be very interested in ISOs of both of these either way! If Antonio does not mind sharing them a bit more widely, I would also like to have ISOs of them. I'm interested in running earlier VMS versions on my 11/730. I too would be interested if it is possible to get disk images of these two CDs. -- John H. Reinhardt
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
> On Apr 16, 2021, at 11:38 AM, Malte Dehling via cctalk > wrote: > > Whether VAXSET is on there or not, I would be very interested in ISOs of > both of these either way! If Antonio does not mind sharing them a bit more widely, I would also like to have ISOs of them. I'm interested in running earlier VMS versions on my 11/730. -- Mark J. Blair, NF6X https://www.nf6x.net/
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
Hi Antonio, On Fri, Apr 16, 2021 at 06:03:45PM +0100, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: > On 16/04/2021 14:11, Malte Dehling via cctalk wrote: > > If anyone has an early 1990 (or older) Consolidated Software > > Distribution CD: that should contain VAXSET v7.0 and I would love to > > obtain a copy. > > Just to check that my memory wasn't playing tricks I went and looked > for it. I stopped looking before finding int because I found > > AG-MN36D-RE VMS Consolidated Software Disk May 1989 > > and > > AG-NC67A-RE VMS Online Documentation Library May 1989 thanks a lot for checking, that looks great! I didn't even know _such_ early versions existed :-) > I'll check them out in SIMH later on tonight, but if they look suitable I > can probably make the ISOs available via dropbox or similar. Whether VAXSET is on there or not, I would be very interested in ISOs of both of these either way! Cheers, Malte -- Malte Dehling
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
On 16/04/2021 14:11, Malte Dehling via cctalk wrote: I was informed of a typo: the version I have is VAXSET100, so v10.0. I am still looking for earlier versions (v8.0 already requires VMS 5.x.) If anyone has an early 1990 (or older) Consolidated Software Distribution CD: that should contain VAXSET v7.0 and I would love to obtain a copy. Or maybe someone still has an old VAXSET TK50 tape? I have working TK50 drives and am happy to pay a reasonable price and deal with tape baking etc if needed. Cheers, Malte I was going to tell you that I have an early CD that was obviously an early CONDIST dated something like 1992, so you were unlikely to find a pre-1990 CD set. Just to check that my memory wasn't playing tricks I went and looked for it. I stopped looking before finding int because I found AG-MN36D-RE VMS Consolidated Software Disk May 1989 and AG-NC67A-RE VMS Online Documentation Library May 1989 :-) I'll check them out in SIMH later on tonight, but if they look suitable I can probably make the ISOs available via dropbox or similar. Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: Looking for VAXSET Software Engineering Tools for VMS 4.x
Dear all, On Thu, Apr 08, 2021 at 02:13:58PM +0200, Malte Dehling wrote: > I am looking for a version of the VAXSET Software Engineering Tools to > run on (Micro)VMS 4.7. The oldest version I have found so far is > VAXSET010 which requires VMS 5.3 to run (this was on CSD 1991/05.) I was informed of a typo: the version I have is VAXSET100, so v10.0. I am still looking for earlier versions (v8.0 already requires VMS 5.x.) If anyone has an early 1990 (or older) Consolidated Software Distribution CD: that should contain VAXSET v7.0 and I would love to obtain a copy. Or maybe someone still has an old VAXSET TK50 tape? I have working TK50 drives and am happy to pay a reasonable price and deal with tape baking etc if needed. Cheers, Malte -- Malte Dehling
