Re: What's it worth... [7:27400]
US $80K to US $90K Tim Booth wrote: All goes well until the first CCIE candidate asks about money and was told its 60K (UK Sterling) no frills no overtime, maybe a car, but you only work at one site. This to work in London, where CCIE used to command 100K+ What's the equivalent in USD? Kind Regards, Tim Booth MCDBA, CCNP, CCDP, CCIE written - Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin, 1759 Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=27436t=27400 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: What's it worth... [7:27400]
To be honest, it just sucks right now economy wise. No big deal. The business world is, as we all know, cyclical, and it will eventually come back up. We didn't slide into this overnight, and we won't come out overnight either. Now is the time to study, get certs, go back to school and prop yourself up for the next boom. Everyone is hurting, even Cisco themselves. People are still getting laid off there as we speak. As for the CCIE's wishing they never did it, well they need a reality check. Of course the market will be diluted with CCIE eventually, but it's not yet. And they need to ask themselves, are they better of with their CCIE then without? Of course they are. Matthew Crane wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]">news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]... US $80K to US $90K Tim Booth wrote: All goes well until the first CCIE candidate asks about money and was told its 60K (UK Sterling) no frills no overtime, maybe a car, but you only work at one site. This to work in London, where CCIE used to command 100K+ What's the equivalent in USD? Kind Regards, Tim Booth MCDBA, CCNP, CCDP, CCIE written - Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin, 1759 Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=27467t=27400 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: What's it worth... [7:27400]
I'll agree with that last statement. It used to be CCIE ment you knew your stuff and if all hell broke loose you could hang with the smoke. People are getting their CCIE in an attempt to get big bucks. I always here I need to get my CCIE and/or my MCSE to get into the computer feild. That's what happened to the CNE. People studied their little brains out, past the test but when the server crashed they had no experience to get it back up because as we all know there is a HUGE difference between the controlled lab and a real WAN. This made employers think why should I hire one of these guys if they can not even do what they are certified to do. The same thing happened to the MCSE which is one supposed reason MS has made it a hell of a lot harder to pass. My 2 cents, Steve -Original Message- From: Matthew Crane [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, November 26, 2001 6:15 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: What's it worth... [7:27400] to be a certified Cisco engineer ? Answer these days appears to be 'not a lot' I have been with 3 clients today who are all trying to recruit CCNP or CCIE staff and they had asked for help in the interview process. The followign is just one example of an interview, but it goes for all 3 and more. All goes well until the first CCIE candidate asks about money and was told its 60K (UK Sterling) no frills no overtime, maybe a car, but you only work at one site. This to work in London, where CCIE used to command 100K+ So I did some checking with some friends who work as recruitment consultants and yes 60-70K is topline now for a CCIE, and 30K for CCNP with 5 years experience, its a lot less without experience IF you get a job. The reasons behind this a. Recession - so everyone will run for cover and take a permanent job. b. CCIE's are plentiful and therefore cheap and CCNP's are even worse off Now this is the view from the employer(s). I can print here what the Cisco account manager(s) said to me afterwards as we talked on the train home, but they and some of their associates are taking the message back, 'we have got it wrong' in trying to turen out CCIE's too quickly. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=27470t=27400 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: What's it worth... [7:27400]
Thats so truethere has been a real dis-service done to many of the certs and in truth, many of the training centers are responsible for this. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Steve Smith Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 10:12 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: What's it worth... [7:27400] I'll agree with that last statement. It used to be CCIE ment you knew your stuff and if all hell broke loose you could hang with the smoke. People are getting their CCIE in an attempt to get big bucks. I always here I need to get my CCIE and/or my MCSE to get into the computer feild. That's what happened to the CNE. People studied their little brains out, past the test but when the server crashed they had no experience to get it back up because as we all know there is a HUGE difference between the controlled lab and a real WAN. This made employers think why should I hire one of these guys if they can not even do what they are certified to do. The same thing happened to the MCSE which is one supposed reason MS has made it a hell of a lot harder to pass. My 2 cents, Steve -Original Message- From: Matthew Crane [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, November 26, 2001 6:15 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: What's it worth... [7:27400] to be a certified Cisco engineer ? Answer these days appears to be 'not a lot' I have been with 3 clients today who are all trying to recruit CCNP or CCIE staff and they had asked for help in the interview process. The followign is just one example of an interview, but it goes for all 3 and more. All goes well until the first CCIE candidate asks about money and was told its 60K (UK Sterling) no frills no overtime, maybe a car, but you only work at one site. This to work in London, where CCIE used to command 100K+ So I did some checking with some friends who work as recruitment consultants and yes 60-70K is topline now for a CCIE, and 30K for CCNP with 5 years experience, its a lot less without experience IF you get a job. The reasons behind this a. Recession - so everyone will run for cover and take a permanent job. b. CCIE's are plentiful and therefore cheap and CCNP's are even worse off Now this is the view from the employer(s). I can print here what the Cisco account manager(s) said to me afterwards as we talked on the train home, but they and some of their associates are taking the message back, 'we have got it wrong' in trying to turen out CCIE's too quickly. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=27481t=27400 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: What's it worth... [7:27400]
Part of the problem is caused by people who claim to be CCIE *without* having done the lab. They have just done the written exam, and I have heard one person say The lab is easy, I just don't have the time! -Anil -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Steve Smith Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 4:12 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: What's it worth... [7:27400] I'll agree with that last statement. It used to be CCIE ment you knew your stuff and if all hell broke loose you could hang with the smoke. People are getting their CCIE in an attempt to get big bucks. I always here I need to get my CCIE and/or my MCSE to get into the computer feild. That's what happened to the CNE. People studied their little brains out, past the test but when the server crashed they had no experience to get it back up because as we all know there is a HUGE difference between the controlled lab and a real WAN. This made employers think why should I hire one of these guys if they can not even do what they are certified to do. The same thing happened to the MCSE which is one supposed reason MS has made it a hell of a lot harder to pass. My 2 cents, Steve -Original Message- From: Matthew Crane [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, November 26, 2001 6:15 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: What's it worth... [7:27400] to be a certified Cisco engineer ? Answer these days appears to be 'not a lot' I have been with 3 clients today who are all trying to recruit CCNP or CCIE staff and they had asked for help in the interview process. The followign is just one example of an interview, but it goes for all 3 and more. All goes well until the first CCIE candidate asks about money and was told its 60K (UK Sterling) no frills no overtime, maybe a car, but you only work at one site. This to work in London, where CCIE used to command 100K+ So I did some checking with some friends who work as recruitment consultants and yes 60-70K is topline now for a CCIE, and 30K for CCNP with 5 years experience, its a lot less without experience IF you get a job. The reasons behind this a. Recession - so everyone will run for cover and take a permanent job. b. CCIE's are plentiful and therefore cheap and CCNP's are even worse off Now this is the view from the employer(s). I can print here what the Cisco account manager(s) said to me afterwards as we talked on the train home, but they and some of their associates are taking the message back, 'we have got it wrong' in trying to turen out CCIE's too quickly. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=27483t=27400 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: What's it worth... [7:27400]
DOWN WITH BOOT CAMPS : -Original Message- From: William Gragido [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 10:52 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: What's it worth... [7:27400] Thats so truethere has been a real dis-service done to many of the certs and in truth, many of the training centers are responsible for this. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Steve Smith Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 10:12 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: What's it worth... [7:27400] I'll agree with that last statement. It used to be CCIE ment you knew your stuff and if all hell broke loose you could hang with the smoke. People are getting their CCIE in an attempt to get big bucks. I always here I need to get my CCIE and/or my MCSE to get into the computer feild. That's what happened to the CNE. People studied their little brains out, past the test but when the server crashed they had no experience to get it back up because as we all know there is a HUGE difference between the controlled lab and a real WAN. This made employers think why should I hire one of these guys if they can not even do what they are certified to do. The same thing happened to the MCSE which is one supposed reason MS has made it a hell of a lot harder to pass. My 2 cents, Steve -Original Message- From: Matthew Crane [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, November 26, 2001 6:15 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: What's it worth... [7:27400] to be a certified Cisco engineer ? Answer these days appears to be 'not a lot' I have been with 3 clients today who are all trying to recruit CCNP or CCIE staff and they had asked for help in the interview process. The followign is just one example of an interview, but it goes for all 3 and more. All goes well until the first CCIE candidate asks about money and was told its 60K (UK Sterling) no frills no overtime, maybe a car, but you only work at one site. This to work in London, where CCIE used to command 100K+ So I did some checking with some friends who work as recruitment consultants and yes 60-70K is topline now for a CCIE, and 30K for CCNP with 5 years experience, its a lot less without experience IF you get a job. The reasons behind this a. Recession - so everyone will run for cover and take a permanent job. b. CCIE's are plentiful and therefore cheap and CCNP's are even worse off Now this is the view from the employer(s). I can print here what the Cisco account manager(s) said to me afterwards as we talked on the train home, but they and some of their associates are taking the message back, 'we have got it wrong' in trying to turen out CCIE's too quickly. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=27492t=27400 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: What's it worth... [7:27400]
i second third that...ccie boot camps are a waste of time -Original Message- From: Steve Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 10:38 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: What's it worth... [7:27400] DOWN WITH BOOT CAMPS : -Original Message- From: William Gragido [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 10:52 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: What's it worth... [7:27400] Thats so truethere has been a real dis-service done to many of the certs and in truth, many of the training centers are responsible for this. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Steve Smith Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 10:12 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: What's it worth... [7:27400] I'll agree with that last statement. It used to be CCIE ment you knew your stuff and if all hell broke loose you could hang with the smoke. People are getting their CCIE in an attempt to get big bucks. I always here I need to get my CCIE and/or my MCSE to get into the computer feild. That's what happened to the CNE. People studied their little brains out, past the test but when the server crashed they had no experience to get it back up because as we all know there is a HUGE difference between the controlled lab and a real WAN. This made employers think why should I hire one of these guys if they can not even do what they are certified to do. The same thing happened to the MCSE which is one supposed reason MS has made it a hell of a lot harder to pass. My 2 cents, Steve -Original Message- From: Matthew Crane [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, November 26, 2001 6:15 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: What's it worth... [7:27400] to be a certified Cisco engineer ? Answer these days appears to be 'not a lot' I have been with 3 clients today who are all trying to recruit CCNP or CCIE staff and they had asked for help in the interview process. The followign is just one example of an interview, but it goes for all 3 and more. All goes well until the first CCIE candidate asks about money and was told its 60K (UK Sterling) no frills no overtime, maybe a car, but you only work at one site. This to work in London, where CCIE used to command 100K+ So I did some checking with some friends who work as recruitment consultants and yes 60-70K is topline now for a CCIE, and 30K for CCNP with 5 years experience, its a lot less without experience IF you get a job. The reasons behind this a. Recession - so everyone will run for cover and take a permanent job. b. CCIE's are plentiful and therefore cheap and CCNP's are even worse off Now this is the view from the employer(s). I can print here what the Cisco account manager(s) said to me afterwards as we talked on the train home, but they and some of their associates are taking the message back, 'we have got it wrong' in trying to turen out CCIE's too quickly. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=27498t=27400 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: What's it worth... [7:27400]
Steve Smith wrote: DOWN WITH BOOT CAMPS : Ya especially Ft. Jackson SC in July when you never been south of southern Minnesota your whole life!!! Don't tell my boss about the CCIE stuff ;) Dave I'll agree with that last statement. It used to be CCIE ment you knew your stuff and if all hell broke loose you could hang with the smoke. People are getting their CCIE in an attempt to get big bucks. I always here I need to get my CCIE and/or my MCSE to get into the computer feild. That's what happened to the CNE. People studied their little brains out, past the test but when the server crashed they had no experience to get it back up because as we all know there is a HUGE difference between the controlled lab and a real WAN. This made employers think why should I hire one of these guys if they can not even do what they are certified to do. The same thing happened to the MCSE which is one supposed reason MS has made it a hell of a lot harder to pass. My 2 cents, Steve -Original Message- From: Matthew Crane [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, November 26, 2001 6:15 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: What's it worth... [7:27400] to be a certified Cisco engineer ? Answer these days appears to be 'not a lot' I have been with 3 clients today who are all trying to recruit CCNP or CCIE staff and they had asked for help in the interview process. The followign is just one example of an interview, but it goes for all 3 and more. All goes well until the first CCIE candidate asks about money and was told its 60K (UK Sterling) no frills no overtime, maybe a car, but you only work at one site. This to work in London, where CCIE used to command 100K+ So I did some checking with some friends who work as recruitment consultants and yes 60-70K is topline now for a CCIE, and 30K for CCNP with 5 years experience, its a lot less without experience IF you get a job. The reasons behind this a. Recession - so everyone will run for cover and take a permanent job. b. CCIE's are plentiful and therefore cheap and CCNP's are even worse off Now this is the view from the employer(s). I can print here what the Cisco account manager(s) said to me afterwards as we talked on the train home, but they and some of their associates are taking the message back, 'we have got it wrong' in trying to turen out CCIE's too quickly. -- David Madland Sr. Network Engineer CCIE# 2016 Qwest Communications Int. Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 612-664-3367 Emotion should reflect reason not guide it Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=27500t=27400 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: What's it worth... [7:27400]
All goes well until the first CCIE candidate asks about money and was told its 60K (UK Sterling) no frills no overtime, maybe a car, but you only work at one site. This to work in London, where CCIE used to command 100K+ What's the equivalent in USD? Kind Regards, Tim Booth MCDBA, CCNP, CCDP, CCIE written - Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin, 1759 Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=27411t=27400 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
