Re: edn

[Richard Lyman]

On Thu, Sep 6, 2012 at 7:01 PM, Rich Hickey  wrote:
> I've started to document a subset of Clojure's data format in an effort to 
> get it more widely used as a data exchange format, e.g. as an alternative to 
> JSON.
>
> Please have a look:
>
> https://github.com/richhickey/edn
>
> Rich
>

Thanks for sharing!

I've added a link on the wiki implementations page to an initial stab
at an Amotoen grammar for edn (
https://github.com/richhickey/edn/wiki/Implementations )

I'm very interested in any test data that I can code against. While
I'll be coming up with my own examples, since edn is so
straightforward, it could help to have a 'canonical' collection of
test data.

-Rich

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Re: Lightweight lib/way to strip html from text

[Richard Lyman]

On Thu, Sep 6, 2012 at 11:41 AM, jamieorc  wrote:
> Hey all, I'm looking for a lightweight way to strip html from a long String
> of text and leave just the text. I've come across JSoup, but at over 300kb
> for the lib, not quite lightweight.
>
> Suggestions?
>
> Cheers,
> Jamie
>

When you say 'html' do you mean any html that a modern or even older
browser would accept, or is a very restricted set of very clean html?

-Rich

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Re: SaxParseException when using the Rome rss library

[Richard Lyman]

On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 5:26 PM, keedon  wrote:
> Hi,
> I've got a clojure problem and I'm hoping someone can help:
>
> I'm trying to parse an rss feed which contains illegal characters and I'm
> getting this error
>
> SAXParseException An invalid XML character (Unicode: 0x19) was found in the
> element content of the document.
>
> I've tried adding a function to remove control characters, but it doesn't
> seem to be working the filter function I've written is
>
> (defn remove-control [seq]
> (filter (fn [ch] (not (Character/isISOControl ch))) seq))
>
> Thanks for any help
>
> Keith
>

I'm not sure I can help, but I *am* interested in a sample of the RSS
that you're trying to work with.

Could you provide a sample?

-Rich

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Re: Can you make Amotoen faster?

[Richard Lyman]

On Thu, Jul 19, 2012 at 7:09 AM, David Nolen  wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 18, 2012 at 10:12 PM, Richard Lyman  
> wrote:
>> All,
>>
>> There's not much code, and (sadly) not much documentation, but what's
>> there needs some performance love.
>>
>> https://github.com/richard-lyman/amotoen
>>
>> Notes:
>>  - jvisualvm doesn't like me this week so help there might be enough
>> (I can't see anything other than clojure classes - I'd love to only
>> see my code)
>
> Have you tried profiling with YourKit? They allow free usage for open
> source projects.
>
> David

YourKit was fantastic!! I especially loved the 'Hot Spots'
functionality--it led me right to the problems.

I've sped up Amotoen by several orders of magnitude on some of my
tests... I'm into the mid-twenty milliseconds on my self-check. It's
funny... I didn't believe it was that much faster - I had to step in
and verify that it was still creating the structures it needed to
instead of just bailing on an error or something.

Turns out that ref and dosync are *really* expensive. I always knew
there was a hit, but I never realized how much 'till now.

Thanks!
-Rich

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Re: Can you make Amotoen faster?

[Richard Lyman]

On Thu, Jul 19, 2012 at 7:09 AM, David Nolen  wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 18, 2012 at 10:12 PM, Richard Lyman  
> wrote:
>> All,
>>
>> There's not much code, and (sadly) not much documentation, but what's
>> there needs some performance love.
>>
>> https://github.com/richard-lyman/amotoen
>>
>> Notes:
>>  - jvisualvm doesn't like me this week so help there might be enough
>> (I can't see anything other than clojure classes - I'd love to only
>> see my code)
>
> Have you tried profiling with YourKit? They allow free usage for open
> source projects.
>
> David

I seem to remember looking into it at some point... I'll check it out again.

Thanks!
-Rich

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Can you make Amotoen faster?

[Richard Lyman]

All,

There's not much code, and (sadly) not much documentation, but what's
there needs some performance love.

https://github.com/richard-lyman/amotoen

Notes:
 - jvisualvm doesn't like me this week so help there might be enough
(I can't see anything other than clojure classes - I'd love to only
see my code)
 - reifying IPosition to a faster implementation seems like it has potential
 - I've used *warn-on-reflection* and fixed the single spot it mentioned
 - I'm not convinced that the code used in 'either' is the best, and
I'm a bit confused about why it's better than the two other
commented-out forms
 - Switching IPosition grammar-grammar away from a character-based
approach is an option, just one I'd like to avoid

It's a leiningen project, with 'lein test' being what I run to check
performance. The grammar parses itself 40 times and prints out how
long that took. The self-check method might be a good place to start
if walking through the code. Ignore the grammar samples, they haven't
been updated in a while. Basically the two 'core' files, under src and
test are all I'm working with right now.

Is it already as 'fast' as it can be??

-Rich

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Re: Creating parsers in clojure

[Richard Lyman]

The little information you've provided leaves the field pretty open...

... but when I'm 'toying' around with ASTs I like Amotoen ('course I'm
probably biased. ;-)).

https://github.com/richard-lyman/amotoen

-Rich


On Fri, Feb 3, 2012 at 6:21 AM, Anna  wrote:
> I'm new to clojure and I'm looking for code examples for building
> parsers in clojure on the fly using a grammar. I'm supposed to write a
> little SQL parser to experience with sql parse tree normalization's.
> Any recommendations?
>
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Re: Looking for parser generator library

[Richard Lyman]

Have you looked at amotoen?

https://github.com/richard-lyman/amotoen

I'm not sure what your needs are...

-Rich



On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 8:19 AM, Roman Perepelitsa
 wrote:
> I'm looking for a parser generator library. I stumbled upon fnparse, but
> unfortunately it doesn't work with clojure 1.3.
>
> Roman Perepelitsa.
>
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Re: Building Clojure applications w/ Maven

[Richard Lyman]

Can you provide the pom you're using?

By 'build' do you mean AOT?

-Rich



On Tue, Dec 6, 2011 at 3:35 PM, Riccardo  wrote:
> Hello, I am doing my dissertation project with Clojure and I am using
> Maven to build. It works on REPL and it build successfully, but the
> JAR file doesn't work, it says: "Java Exception" all the time. Any
> suggestion?
>
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Re: Handling of unsigned bytes

[Richard Lyman]

I have to deal with them when processing AMF packets, and I use the
Netty library - it's amazing, you should look into it.

http://www.jboss.org/netty

-Rich


On Fri, Feb 11, 2011 at 10:22 AM, timc  wrote:
> How on earth is one supposed to do communication programming (not to
> mention handling binary files etc) without an unsigned byte type?
>
> I see that this issue has been talked about vaguely - is there a
> solution?
>
> Thanks

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Re: getting started with clojure

[Richard Lyman]

On Tue, Oct 19, 2010 at 5:55 PM, ishkabible  wrote:
> lastly i have been messing around with new languages just to try them
> out.

Fantastic fun! I wish you the best of luck.

> in trying out coljure (only functional language i have tried yet)
> but i can compile anything longer than one line.

Are you using the 'repl'? That process can feel very different from
some styles of Clojure development.

> im using Coljure Box
> but im very confused as to how i am supposed to write code that dose
> more than one thing. basically how do i save files, compile them, then
> run them?

Clojure Box likely has a specific process that it advocates since it
uses "... clojure-mode and Slime, plus all the power of Emacs under
the hood."

While this development process works for some (most?) it doesn't work
so well for others.

I've documented one way of developing using Ant[1] and a certain
folder structure... which was OK for a while but I've since switched
to leiningen[2].

In the end all you _really_ need is to find a process that fits how
you're used to working. You can refer to the 'Getting Started' page on
the Assembla Wiki[3].

Again, good luck and have fun!

-Rich

[1] 
http://www.lithinos.com/Compiling-Clojure-Applications-and-Libraries-Round-2.html
[2] http://github.com/technomancy/leiningen
[3] http://www.assembla.com/wiki/show/clojure/Getting_Started

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[ANN] clj-peg is dead

[Richard Lyman]

Since Amotoen does everything that clj-peg did, and since Amotoen does
it in a more maintainable way...

http://github.com/richard-lyman/amotoen

-Rich

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[ANN] Amotoen

[Richard Lyman]

First:

http://github.com/richard-lyman/amotoen

Second:

Amotoen is a Clojure library that supports PEG style definitions of
grammars that can produce parsers. While there are academic papers
available that rigorously define PEG, I've found that PEGs, or Parsing
Expression Grammar(s), are best explained by the related Wikipedia
page.

The clj-peg library was a predecessor to Amotoen and as such, Amotoen
keeps the feel of the syntax in clj-peg. There are, however,
significant differences between using clj-peg and using Amotoen. The
most significant of those differences can be found in the lack of
macros, gen-class, or gen-interface. The clj-peg library used the
dirty three in the core, and Amotoen avoids all of them entirely.

Amotoen uses runtime processing of a given grammar, where clj-peg used
macro time expansion of a grammar. Amotoen uses protocols instead of
interfaces. Amotoen uses internally defined Throwables instead of
gen-classed Errors. All of these changes result in far greater ease of
use as well as increased maintainence.

Third:

The candy... there is a JSON grammar that is mostly done, as well as a
Markdown grammar that is the shortest I've seen but is mostly not
done.

-Rich

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Re: Flex as a Clojure Frontend

[Richard Lyman]

On Sun, Aug 15, 2010 at 9:13 PM, nchubrich  wrote:
> Thanks Rich--I'm actually interested in all kinds of configurations.
> For the time being, it will be a Flex frontend in the browser
> communicating with Clojure on the server.  In the future, we might
> want to make the Clojure part into a Java applet that runs on the
> client side and does computations while Flex handles the interface;
> finally, I'm also (in the long-term) interested in building standalone
> apps that use Flex/AIR for the interface and Clojure/Java for the
> backend.
>
> It all seems rather complicated, but I've found Flex to be the best
> way of programming interfaces (so far).
>
> Concerning BlazeDS and AMF: what is the advantage of that over just
> using straight HTTP with say JSON?  I know RTMP has "push" capability;
> any other reasons?
>
> -Nick.
>

Push has never been much of a selling point of RTMP for me, you could
use HTTP long-polling for a similar result. Bandwidth is probably the
largest selling point, with readability the biggest negative in
RTMP/AMF.

To understand what I mean about bandwidth, you could checkout:
http://www.jamesward.com/census/

-Rich

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Re: Flex as a Clojure Frontend

[Richard Lyman]

On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 1:40 PM, nchubrich  wrote:
> I'm wondering if anyone has any experience developing Clojure
> applications with a Flex interface, and if so, what is the best way of
> going about it.
>

I have quite a bit of experience. I've been writing an internal
implementation of the non-media parts of RTMP, so that your backend
can be anything that runs on the JVM (Java, Clojure, Scala, Groovy,
JRuby, etc.) and your frontend can be pure ActionScript.

The 'best way' probably depends on how you'll be deploying your
application. Are you going with some J2EE container, are you packaging
everything into a standalone app? (Or maybe something between the
two...)

> I also wonder if anyone has used Las3rI'm a little reluctant to
> use it because the Flash Builder programming environment is so
> effective.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Nick.

I don't have experience with Las3r - but it says it's a port of
Clojure (parts of) to run on the AVM2. That's pretty different than
the standard method of communication between a Flex frontend and a JVM
backend. If I were you I'd look at getting Jetty or Tomcat (JBoss if
you're very brave or previously-enterprise-skilled) to work with
BlazeDS - then you can write your Clojure code compiled to JARs and
expose the methods as AMF messagebrokers to a RemoteObject running
from Flex.

-Rich

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Re: ClojureDocs.org

[Richard Lyman]

On Sun, Jul 11, 2010 at 8:14 AM, Phil Hagelberg  wrote:
> On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 11:23 PM, zkim  wrote:
>>> but what do you think about using Justin's codebase, or an Aleph-based 
>>> server to
>>> host the thing instead of Ruby/Rails? (see the link above for more details)
>>
>> I'm inclined to move forward with the Ruby / Rails for now.  The
>> reason I went with rails is that (in my experience) none of the
>> clojure web libraries are mature enough to do something like
>> clojuredocs as quickly and easily as I personally would be able to do
>> in rails.
>
> Could you provide details about what it was specifically that you
> found was lacking?
>
> -Phil
>

It sounded to me like he was only saying that he's more familiar with
Ruby/Rails than he is with Clojure. It seemed like it was a question
of 'time to finish and tweak' that's shortest for him if he wrote it
in Ruby/Rails.

Maybe this is a good opportunity to be able to compare two
implementations side-by-side. His excellent solution with one written
in Clojure that produces the same-ish website.

-Rich

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Re: DSL with a grammar

[Richard Lyman]

On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 1:34 PM, Nicolas Oury  wrote:
> Sorry, that's why I had quote around my parse.
> I meant, use clojure reader to take a sequence in a macro and then "parse"
> it for my own DSL.
> So I shouldn't need any help from the reader (even if having some metas with
> line and character attached to thing would help)
> I do not want to go the parser generator way because I want the DSL to be
> tightly integrated with Clojure.

The clj-peg library allows for a grammar that is all Clojure code.
It's successor will be even more integrated.

Both _could_ be considered parser combinators... so you might not want
to rule out all parser combinators as not being tightly integrated.

Just FYI. I hope you find what you're looking for. :-)

-Rich

> Thanks for your answer,
>
>
> Nicolas.

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Re: Recommendations on prepping a library for 1.2 release?

[Richard Lyman]

On Wed, Jun 16, 2010 at 8:36 PM, David Nolen  wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 16, 2010 at 10:17 PM, Richard Lyman 
> wrote:
>>
>> Everything's on github - right? The simplest commands to grab the core
>> (and contrib?) from github as well as the commands to keep updating
>> every week or so until release would be fantastic.
>
> git clone url, to get it
> git pull, to update it
> git fetch, to grab the other branches
> git checkout branch, to switch to a branch
> ant, to build the branch you are on.

Do I need any branches? What are the branches? I thought that when a
branch was stable it would be merged back into master (if I'm using
the right terms).

>>
>> All of this is assuming, hopefully incorrectly, that there's no
>> automated nightly JAR that's being produced and made available
>> somewhere.
>
> The clojure master branch is being built continuously here,
> http://build.clojure.org/

When you say master branch, do you mean just core, or does that include contrib?

Speaking of which: Should I still care about contrib? I remember
hearing that several items had been merged into core...

> David

Thanks for the quick and succinct response.
-Rich

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Recommendations on prepping a library for 1.2 release?

[Richard Lyman]

I guess I'm mostly wondering where to get the best (continually
update-able best) version of 1.2 core (and contrib?) before it's
released.

I'd rather not go Lein or Maven2 - just a vanilla checkout and Ant if
that's still a supported build option.

Everything's on github - right? The simplest commands to grab the core
(and contrib?) from github as well as the commands to keep updating
every week or so until release would be fantastic.

All of this is assuming, hopefully incorrectly, that there's no
automated nightly JAR that's being produced and made available
somewhere.

Thanks!
-Rich

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Re: Macros, any reading suggestion?

[Richard Lyman]

On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 1:24 PM, Miki  wrote:
> Hello alux,
>
>> I still have some technical questions, but the main issue seems to be
>> that I need to dive more deeply into the whole area of macro
>> programming.
> You might find http://www.paulgraham.com/onlisp.html interesting.
> (The PDF version of the book is free to download there)
>
> It's about common lisp, but taught me a lot about macros.
>
> HTH,
> --
> Miki

I'd second the onlisp book.

In addition to that book, code is the best thing to understanding the
abilities that macros bring.

-Rich

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Re: Calling for advice on a parser's location data

[Richard Lyman]

On Sun, May 2, 2010 at 6:29 PM, joshua-choi  wrote:
> I'm making a parsing library that can keep track of its location in a
> stream of tokens, and the tokens can be of any type—character, map,
> and so forth. I need advice on this question:
>
> Can you think of an instance where the location would not be a line
> number and column number, such as {:line 3, :column 25}?

Binary input wouldn't be required to have a concept of lines or columns.

> I'm deciding if I should bother with the trouble of making the
> location data structure independent and pluggable with my parser, or
> if I should make it always a line-column pair, which would make the
> API much simpler.

The clj-peg library requires pre-wrapping any input to be parsed in an
interface that provides quite a bit of flexibility like this.

I would agree that it makes it more complicated though.

-Rich

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Re: jogl classpath not found

[Richard Lyman]

I'm not sure if this will help, but here's some tidbits from the day I spent
toying around with JOGL... I think it was version 1.1.1.

This is part of the Ant file that I used:
...












...

I can reproduce a similar error by commenting out the line for the jogl_jar.

Exception in thread "main" java.lang.ClassNotFoundException:
javax.media.opengl.GLCanvas (jogltest.clj:1)

Here's the Clojure file I used (be warned - it's very very bad Clojure
code):

(ns jogltest
(:import
(java.io BufferedReader InputStreamReader)
(java.awt Frame)
(java.awt.event WindowListener WindowAdapter KeyListener KeyEvent)
(javax.media.opengl GLCanvas GLEventListener GL GLAutoDrawable)
(javax.media.opengl.glu GLU)
(com.sun.opengl.util Animator))
(:gen-class))

(defn exit [a f]
(.stop a)
(.dispose f))


(defn -main [& args]
(println "works")
(let [
rotateT 0
glu (new GLU)
canvas (new GLCanvas)
frame (new Frame "Jogl 3D Shape/Rotation")
animator (new Animator canvas)]

(.addGLEventListener
canvas
(proxy [GLEventListener] []
 (display
  [#^GLAutoDrawable drawable]
  (doto (.getGL drawable)
(.glClear (. GL GL_COLOR_BUFFER_BIT))
(.glClear (. GL GL_DEPTH_BUFFER_BIT))
(.glLoadIdentity)
(.glTranslatef 0 0 -5)
(.glRotatef rotateT 1 0 0)
(.glRotatef rotateT 0 1 0)
(.glRotatef rotateT 0 0 1)
(.glRotatef rotateT 0 1 0)
(.glBegin (. GL GL_TRIANGLES))
; Front
(.glColor3f 0 1 1) (.glVertex3f 0 1 0) (.glColor3f 0 0 1) (.glVertex3f
-1 -1 1) (.glColor3f 0 0 0) (.glVertex3f 1 -1 1)
; Right Side Facing Front
(.glColor3f 0 1 1) (.glVertex3f 0 1 0) (.glColor3f 0 0 1) (.glVertex3f 1
-1 1) (.glColor3f 0 0 0) (.glVertex3f 0 -1 -1)
; Left Side Facing Front
(.glColor3f 0 1 1) (.glVertex3f 0 1 0) (.glColor3f 0 0 1) (.glVertex3f 0
-1 -1) (.glColor3f 0 0 0) (.glVertex3f -1 -1 1)
;Bottom
(.glColor3f 0 0 0) (.glVertex3f -1 -1 1) (.glColor3f 0.1 0.1 0.1)
(.glVertex3f 1 -1 1) (.glColor3f 0.2 0.2 0.2) (.glVertex3f 0 -1 -1)
(.glEnd))
  (def rotateT (+ 0.2 rotateT)))

 (displayChanged [drawable m d])

 (init
  [#^GLAutoDrawable drawable]
  (doto (.getGL drawable)
(.glShadeModel (. GL GL_SMOOTH))
(.glClearColor 0 0 0 0)
(.glClearDepth 1)
(.glEnable (. GL GL_DEPTH_TEST))
(.glDepthFunc (. GL GL_LEQUAL))
(.glHint (. GL GL_PERSPECTIVE_CORRECTION_HINT)
 (. GL GL_NICEST)))
  (.addKeyListener
   drawable
   (proxy [KeyListener] []
 (keyPressed
  [e]
  (when (= (.getKeyCode e) (. KeyEvent VK_ESCAPE))
(exit animator frame))

 (reshape
  [#^GLAutoDrawable drawable x y w h]
  (when (> h 0)
(let [gl (.getGL drawable)]
  (.glMatrixMode gl (. GL GL_PROJECTION))
  (.glLoadIdentity gl)
  (.gluPerspective glu 50 (/ w h) 1 1000)
  (.glMatrixMode gl (. GL GL_MODELVIEW))
  (.glLoadIdentity gl))

(doto frame
(.add canvas)
(.setSize 640 480)
(.setUndecorated true)
(.setExtendedState (. Frame MAXIMIZED_BOTH))
(.addWindowListener
 (proxy [WindowAdapter] []
   (windowClosing [e] (exit animator frame
(.setVisible true))
(.start animator)
(.requestFocus canvas)

;(Thread/sleep (* 1 1000))

)
)

Good luck!!
-Rich

P.s. - I switched to using JME... it had more of the features I was looking
for.

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Re: map not working in loop

[Richard Lyman]

On Fri, Mar 5, 2010 at 7:31 AM, Glen Rubin  wrote:

> The problem was that coll was being called as a fcn as others pointed
> out.  You say the function being supplied as my second parameter does
> not modify my third parameter?
>
> (defn pyt [coll]
>  (loop [b (rest coll)]
>   (map  #(* % %) b)))
>
> I am taking the third parameter and squaring it.  Isn't that a
> modification?
>
> thx everybody for the help!
>
> On Mar 5, 7:15 am, Richard Lyman  wrote:
> > On Fri, Mar 5, 2010 at 7:05 AM, Glen Rubin  wrote:
> > > The following code does not work, when using (range 1 5) as coll
> > > input:
> >
> > > (defn pyt [coll]
> > >  (loop [b (rest (coll))]
> >
> > >(map  #(* % %) b)))
> >
> > > The real code was more complicated, but I refined it to its simplest
> > > form while still producing the error.   (map f coll)  looks correct to
> > > me??  :(
> >
> > I'm not sure what effect you're looking for, but...
> >
> > Don't forget, map is lazy and the function you've supplied as the second
> > parameter doesn't modify b.
> >
> > Depending on what outcome you're looking for, you might want to wrap the
> > call to map in a call to doall, or modify b and your second parameter so
> > that b is changed.
> >
> > -Rich
>

Sorry for the miscommunication.

Clojure 1.0.0-
user=> (def b '(1 2 3))
#'user/b
user=> b
(1 2 3)
user=> (map #(* % %) b)
(1 4 9)
user=> b
(1 2 3)
user=>

I didn't know if "the real code" used b inside the let after the call to map
and had expected it to be different.

-Rich

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Re: map not working in loop

[Richard Lyman]

On Fri, Mar 5, 2010 at 7:05 AM, Glen Rubin  wrote:

> The following code does not work, when using (range 1 5) as coll
> input:
>
>
> (defn pyt [coll]
>  (loop [b (rest (coll))]
>
>(map  #(* % %) b)))
>
>
> The real code was more complicated, but I refined it to its simplest
> form while still producing the error.   (map f coll)  looks correct to
> me??  :(
>

I'm not sure what effect you're looking for, but...

Don't forget, map is lazy and the function you've supplied as the second
parameter doesn't modify b.

Depending on what outcome you're looking for, you might want to wrap the
call to map in a call to doall, or modify b and your second parameter so
that b is changed.

-Rich

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Re: [ANN] clj-peg 0.7 (switch to EPL)

[Richard Lyman]

On Sat, Feb 13, 2010 at 5:33 PM, Brendan Ribera wrote:

> Cool! I'll probably make use of this soon. Any plans to get it set up on
> github for contributions?
>


No plans right now. I'm open to the idea, but I'd like to see what it's like
to work with contributions in the current setup.

I'd like to get it to v1.0 before I open it up more.

Let me know how using it goes I'm excited to see if it can help others.

-Rich

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[ANN] clj-peg 0.7 (switch to EPL)

[Richard Lyman]

All,

I've switched the clj-peg library to be under the EPL.

This project adds support in Clojure for Parsing Expression
Grammars.
In addition to the basic operators I've added tracking AST branches,
referring to tracked branches, gathering simple repetitions, and specifying
a repetition count. While the current version allows for expanding the types
of supported input to anything you'd like, future releases will include an
input wrapper to process binary structures.

A relevant post:
http://www.lithinos.com/Releasing-clj-peg-under-the-epl.html

The project page: http://www.lithinos.com/clj-peg/index.html

The beginning user manual:
http://www.lithinos.com/clj-peg/0.7.0/clj-peg-manual.pdf

-Rich

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About releasing clj-peg under the EPL 1.0

[Richard Lyman]

I have a few questions I'm hoping to get some feedback on.


 = Releasing source code =
If I understand the EPL 1.0 correctly, under section 3(b) part IV, I'm
forced to release my source code - right?

I _cannot_ just release an AOT JAR under the EPL 1.0 and keep the source
code under a different licence - right?

Or does that only apply to everyone _other_ that the initial Contributor?


 = Other's commercial profit =
Under 2(a) and 2(b) I've pretty much given each Recipient full patent and
copyright permissions. There's nothing available to me if I want to profit
from it in the future. I have to change the license on some future release,
and even then they still would have the full permissions I had granted in
some past release - right?

Under 2(c), even though I've given the permissions I can, the Recipient
still might not be able to distribute my Contribution if my Contribution
infringes some third party patent for which the Recipient is required to
secure any rights that might be necessary. It seems odd that there could
still be some loophole... some way that I could benefit from the third-party
patent licensing - right?


This has been a fairly painful process for me, thanks for any helpful
feedback.
-Rich

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Re: clj-peg v0.6 released

[Richard Lyman]

On Fri, Jan 8, 2010 at 11:07 AM, Paul Mooser  wrote:

> At some point, hopefully someone will write an open-source parsing
> library with liberal licensing terms for clojure.
>

Would you mind elaborating on your definitions for the terms "open-source"
and "liberal licensing"?

I'm not sure I like the current licensing scheme for clj-peg and I've spent
quite a bit of time thinking about how I should approach this project's
license in particular. I have two very different perspectives about this
issue.

On the one hand, if I were a user and not the developer I doubt I'd use this
library because I really don't like paying for software. I also would be a
bit wary of the 'except for commercial use' part in the license.

On the other hand, I've put a significant amount of time and energy into
this as a product. Money isn't what it used to be and I'm reluctant to lose
the potential extra income that a dual license might provide.

There is value in augmenting whatever reputation I have by providing the
code for free, but reputation alone doesn't pay the bills.

So... that's why I'm wondering if you would mind helping me understand your
point-of-view.

-Rich
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Re: [ANN] clj-peg v0.6 released

[Richard Lyman]

Currently I'm only providing the code in AOT form. If the JAR is on your
classpath everything in the manual works just fine.

Did that answer your question?

-Rich


2010/1/7 Michał Kwiatkowski 

> On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 11:27 PM, Richard Lyman 
> wrote:
> > This project adds support in Clojure for Parsing Expression Grammars.
> > You'll be able to write pseudo-ebnfs directly in your Clojure code.
>
> Sounds nice, but where's the source code?
>
> Cheers,
> mk
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Re: [ANN] clj-peg v0.6 released

[Richard Lyman]

For now I'd rather be compensated if someone were planning on using clj-peg
commercially. I'm not sure how much I'd charge for a commercial-friendly
license, and I don't have an automated process for handling billing and
production of a differently licensed product, so I'm reluctant to move that
direction for now.

If you were interested in licensing clj-peg under different terms I'm
willing to discuss it outside of this mailing list.

Did that answer your question?

-Rich



On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 8:17 AM, Stefan Tilkov wrote:

> Richard, can you elaborate on the license?
>
> The license page says "Permission is granted to use and redistribute this
> software except for commercial use […]"
>
> Stefan
> --
> Stefan Tilkov, http://www.innoq.com/blog/st/
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Re: clj-peg v0.6 released

[Richard Lyman]

I'm not familiar with Scala's parser combinators, in addition, I'm fuzzy on
the technical definition of a parser combinator.

I think I'd call it a parser combinator, since the grammar is embedded in
the code using native Clojure data structures, evaluation can be delayed,
and grammar definitions can be modified at runtime before the parser is
generated.

What key parts to the definition of "parser combinator" would need to be met
in order to be comparable to Scala's parser combinators?

-Rich


On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 6:00 AM, Seth  wrote:

> I forgot to appreciate having something like clg-peg to play with...
> no clue where my manners went. Is this comparable at all to Scala's
> parser combinators?
>

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Re: clj-peg v0.6 released

[Richard Lyman]

Yeah, the management software for my site is in flux. Getting RSS done is on
the todo list, but not very high.

There really aren't pre-releases - when I have a version to release I
announce it here as soon as it's available. I hadn't thought that there
might actually be people interested in pre-releases... thanks for the
suggestion. Maybe adding RSS feeds back in should take a higher priority.

-Rich



On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 8:25 PM, Seth  wrote:

> An RSS feed might help early adopters test prereleases, but it's been
> explicitly disabled?
>
> On Jan 4, 5:43 pm, Richard Lyman  wrote:
> > Oh, sorry!
> >
> > I was thinking about releasing this version last week - but with the new
> > year likely taking precedence I thought I'd wait.
> >
> > Maybe next time I'll send you a version a few days before I announce it.
> ;-)
> >
> > -Rich
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 3:32 PM, Anniepoo  wrote:
> > > Sweet!
> >
> > > Wish I'd had this a few days ago, I just spent the last few days
> > > writing parsers.
>

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Re: clj-peg v0.6 released

[Richard Lyman]

Oh, sorry!

I was thinking about releasing this version last week - but with the new
year likely taking precedence I thought I'd wait.

Maybe next time I'll send you a version a few days before I announce it. ;-)

-Rich



On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 3:32 PM, Anniepoo  wrote:

> Sweet!
>
> Wish I'd had this a few days ago, I just spent the last few days
> writing parsers.
>

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[ANN] clj-peg v0.6 released

[Richard Lyman]

All,

This project adds support in Clojure for Parsing Expression Grammars.
You'll be able to write pseudo-ebnfs directly in your Clojure code.

Currently, this...
 Expr  <- [Sum $]
 Sum   <- [Product (* [SumOp Product])]
 Product   <- [Value (* [ProductOp Value])]
 Value <- (| Num Sum)
 Num   <- JSONNumber
 SumOp <- #"^[+-]"
 ProductOp <- #"^[*/]"
... turns into a parser with only a few extra lines of code (three more
lines would be comfortable).

The grammar reads quite easily as well. The production for the non-terminal
Sum could be read, "A Sum is a Product followed by zero-or-more of the SumOp
Product pair."

Project page: http://www.lithinos.com/clj-peg/index.html
Manual: http://www.lithinos.com/clj-peg/0.6.10/clj-peg-manual.pdf

-Rich

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[ANN] clj-peg 0.4

[Richard Lyman]

Version 0.4 brings modifications to the syntax for declaring grammars as
well as suggestions about avoiding the exponential runtimes that can occur.

Here is a post walking through these
changes
.

-Rich

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Re: Questions / guidelines for adopting Clojure

[Richard Lyman]

On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 6:08 AM, Roman Roelofsen <
roman.roelof...@googlemail.com> wrote:

>
> Hi all!


Hello! Welcome to the group.



* Syntax *
>
> I never used a LISP-like language before and I can't read the clojure
> code as fluent as code from different languages. Take for example this
> scala snippet:
>
> (0 until 100) map (_ * 2) filter (_ % 3 == 0)
>
> I can easily read this line from left to right (just like english) and
> instantly see whats going on. By contrast, I have to read the clojure
> version a couple of times to understand it:
>
> (filter #(= 0 (rem % 3)) (map #(* 2 %) (range 100)))
>
> Is this just a matter of pratice? Do you find it easy to read the
> clojure version?


I find it easier to read Clojure code when I don't have everything on one
line. In other languages I've been able to put everything on one line and
survive, but in CL and Clojure it has always read better on multiple lines.
For instance, the code you provided could be written like:

(filter   #(= 0 (rem % 3))
  (map   #(* 2 %)
(range 100)))

Then the parts of the code and their relations can be easier to find. Now I
can easily tell that whatever comes out of the call to map is being filtered
- without caring about what is 'under' the call to map. This ability to
ignore the parts that are 'inside' some deeper code has helped me in reading
Clojure code.




>
> Sorry for the long posting and thanks a lot for reading it ;-)


I don't mind the long posting. You had everything sectioned out nicely.

Cheers,
>
> Roman



Good luck with learning Clojure, I hope you continue to enjoy it..

-Rich

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[ANN] clj-peg

[Richard Lyman]

I'm a little apprehensive about sharing this project with others, but I
thought I might as well try.

I'm very interested in any feedback, but for now the license is a
bit-non-open.
There are modifications that I'm still wanting to make to the core before I
fully open the license.

Here's a bit of info:
 - clj-peg is intended to eventually support Parser Expression
Grammars(it
does a good job as is).
 - It's released as an AOT compiled pair of JARs (I'd love feedback on this
approach to distributing a Clojure library).
 - It is in _no_ way optimized. (I'm pretty sure current runtimes are
exponential in the worst case.)
 - The project page is at: http://www.lithinos.com/clj-peg/
 - An intro post is at: http://www.lithinos.com/Intro-to-clj-peg.html

A sample of the syntax that I'm currently using (though I'm really not happy
with it yet):
Expr  <- (=ast expr-ast (=s Sum (=e)))
Sum   <- (=ast sum-ast (=s Product (=* (=s SumOp Product
Product   <- (=ast product-ast (=s Value (=* (=s ProductOp Value
Value <- (=ast value-ast (=o Num (=s LParen Expr RParen)))
Num   <- (=ast num-ast (=+ NumChar))
SumOp <- #"^[+-]"
ProductOp <- #"^[*/]"
LParen<- "("
RParen<- ")"
NumChar   <- #"^[0-9]"

What does everyone think?

-Rich

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Re: How to call function (or Java method) using string name?

[Richard Lyman]

There's a section on the wiki with almost the exact same title:

http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Clojure_Programming/Examples#Invoking_Java_method_through_method_name_as_a_String

If I'm understanding the question correctly that should do what you're
wanting to do.

-Rich


On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 11:50 AM, timc  wrote:

>
> Thanks Stuart.
>
> I have figured out another way, which is much more general (and uses
> the lowest level of how Clojure works).
>
> (defn evalStr [s] (clojure.lang.Compiler/eval (clojure.lang.RT/
> readString s)))
>
> will (attempt to) execute any valid form (i.e. the string that is the
> source of the form).
>
> Thus: (evalStr "(+ 1 2)") --> 3
>

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Re: [ANN] Compiling Clojure applications using Ant

[Richard Lyman]

Cool. Thanks for the pointer to clojure.lang.Compile and the reminder about
failonerror - I'll update it as soon as I can.

I'll also look into coming up with a clearer explanation of the app
variable.

Thanks!
-Rich



On Sat, Apr 11, 2009 at 3:55 PM, John D. Hume wrote:

>
> On Sat, Apr 11, 2009 at 3:49 PM, Richard Lyman 
> wrote:
> > http://www.lithinos.com/Compiling-Clojure-applications-using-Ant.html
> >
> > What do you guys think?
> >
> > -Rich
>
> It's a bit simpler to use clojure.lang.Compile as a main class.
> Here's the relevant bit from one of my build.xmls:
>
>  
>  classpathref="project.classpath"
>  fork="true"
>  failonerror="true">
>  
>  
>  
>
>  
>
>
> http://github.com/duelinmarkers/clj-record/blob/c8235e7d854c0049a785d7773665cb6c62efb024/build.xml#L30
>
> I strongly recommend failonerror="true" so that your build will abort
> if compilation fails. (If you stick with the clojure.main -e
> "(compile..." approach I think you'll find clojure.main doesn't exit
> with an error code, so it won't work. There's another recent thread
> about that and I'm planning to open an issue and submit a patch for it
> when I have a chance. clojure.lang.Compile does exit with an error
> when compilation fails, so the above will fail a build appropriately.)
>
> Also, I'd recommend being clearer in describing the "app" variable. It
> will need to be a Clojure namespace that when loaded will (one way or
> another) load in all of your Clojure code. If someone is building a
> library, it's relatively likely there is no such namespace.
>
> -hume.
> --
> http://elhumidor.blogspot.com/
>
> >
>

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[ANN] Compiling Clojure applications using Ant

[Richard Lyman]

Searching for 'clojure ant compile' returns pages that talk about the
process of compiling the Clojure and Contrib JARs - but I couldn't find
pointers on setting up a project to use Ant, so...

http://www.lithinos.com/Compiling-Clojure-applications-using-Ant.html

What do you guys think?

-Rich

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Re: 6 + 7 = 13

[Richard Lyman]

It's probably already been changed.

They've had a really fast response time here for things like that.

-Richard



On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 10:08 AM, Marko  wrote:

>
> Strange, I'm sure I saw 7 this morning and not 36. Either I was
> delusional or somebody changed it already.
> >
>

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[Solved] Re: Invoking Java method through method name as a String

[Richard Lyman]

I've added a section on the Wiki under the examples:

http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Clojure_Programming/Examples#Invoking_Java_method_through_method_name_as_a_String

Again, thanks!
-Rich

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Re: Invoking Java method through method name as a String

[Richard Lyman]

This is _so_ awesome!!

Thanks a ton for your patient help Tim, and others.

In the end I also had to switch the use of into-array to to-array, since
into-array expects all the elements to be the same type, and my args were of
varying types. Using to-array worked since it cast each element to the
Object type before passing it along.

Again, thanks a ton. I'd been working for quite a while on trying to get
this knot tied off.

I'm going to make a page on the Wiki about this, hopefully no one else will
need to go through this again. :-)

-Rich

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Re: Invoking Java method through method name as a String

[Richard Lyman]

Cool... that looks like it got me past the 'method-as-a-string' problem, but
now I'm getting errors with not finding a matching method on the class by
that name. I'm guessing that this means there was a problem matching the
type signature of the method.

The arguments to the method are stored in a 'clojure.lang.PersistentVector',
and if I duplicate the method I'm trying to access but set the only
parameter to be typed as 'clojure.lang.PersistentVector', then it works. The
new method with the new type signature works. Which to me means that we're
passing all the arguments to the method still inside their original vector -
right?

I guess I'm still stuck on how to expand the vector of arguments in place...
and I'm really not very sure what you're doing with the '&' in the
parameters for the str-invoke. Is that a way of slurping all the remaining
parameters into a vector? If so, then aren't I needing to do the opposite?

I tried removing the &, and into-array - that didn't work. I tried changing
the method into a macro so I could splice in the vector of args - that
didn't work. This is getting frustrating. Everything else has been so
relatively easy to do until now.

I really appreciate your help in walking me through my lack of
understanding.

If I'm following you correctly I think we're here:

user=> (defn str-invoke [instance method-str & args]
(clojure.lang.Reflector/invokeInstanceMethod instance method-str (into-array
args)))
#'user/str-invoke
user=> (def i "sampleString")
#'user/i
user=> (def m "substring")
#'user/m
user=> (def args [2,3])
#'user/args
user=> (str-invoke i m args)
java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Unexpected param type (NO_SOURCE_FILE:0)
user=> (str-invoke i m 2 3)
"m"
user=>

-Rich



On Sat, Feb 21, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Timothy Pratley
wrote:

>
> How embarrassing!
>
> This works much better:
>
> (defn str-invoke [method-str instance & args]
>  (clojure.lang.Reflector/invokeInstanceMethod instance method-str (to-
> array args)))
>
> (let [ts "toString", ct "compareTo"]
>  (println (str-invoke ts 5))
>  (println (str-invoke ct 5 4))
>  (println (str-invoke ct 5 5)))
>
> ie: this is just using reflection as pmf suggested, however I think
> this form is more convenient as Clojure's Reflector class does all the
> hard work of matching the parameters for you. I'm sure someone will
> post a macro solution, but hopefully this will do till then.
>
>
> Regards,
> Tim.
>

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Re: Clojure Questions

[Richard Lyman]

>From the http://clojure.org/getting_started page:

"Clojure is delivered in a zip file containing a single .jar, clojure.jar, a
readme, the CPL license and the source code in a src subdirectory. It uses
the ASM 3.0 bytecode library , and the current
alpha distribution includes it.
Java1.5 or greater is
required."

Good luck! :-)

-Richard



On Sat, Feb 21, 2009 at 11:57 AM, Christian Vest Hansen <
karmazi...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> I *think* that Clojure does not require anything from Java 6, and thus
> can work on any compliant Java 5 or greater.
>
> On Sat, Feb 21, 2009 at 3:13 PM, Sean  wrote:
> >
> > Hi everyone,
> > I'm working on cleaning up the wikibook some, and I've got a few
> > questions.  If anyone could answer, that would be a great help.
> >
> > What is the minimum required JVM version for clojure?
> >
> > What versions of Java have been tested?
> >
> > What versions of Java are supported?
> >
> > Thanks!
> > >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Venlig hilsen / Kind regards,
> Christian Vest Hansen.
>
> >
>

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Re: Invoking Java method through method name as a String

[Richard Lyman]

Thanks for the quick response! :-)

This works fine when the method name is not in a var, but if you try:

user=> (defmacro my-invoke [method-str instance & args]
 `(. ~instance ~(symbol method-str) ~...@args))
nil
user=> (my-invoke "toString" 5)
"5"
user=> (def command "toString")
#'user/command
user=> (my-invoke command 5)
java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: No matching field found: command for
class java.lang.Integer (NO_SOURCE_FILE:0)
user=>


The macro is processed before the expression is eval'd - right? That's why
the call to symbol inside the macro returns 'command' as the method you're
invoking - right?

I'm not sure I'm understanding everything here, but it seems like I'm
needing a way to delay the evaluation of that part of the macro until the
value bound to the command var can be inserted...

-Richard




On Sat, Feb 21, 2009 at 6:15 AM, Timothy Pratley
wrote:

>
> Hi Richard,
>
> As you probably know, Clojure java interop requires the method to be a
> symbol:
> user=> (. 5 toString)
> "5"
>
> So if you want to invoke a method from a string, you can convert the
> string to symbol first:
> user=> (symbol "toString")
> toString
>
> Great! but (. 5 (symbol "toString")) wont work because (symbol
> "toString") is not evaluated. Instead it gets transformed into
> 5.symbol("toString") which is not what we want :( :(
> However with a little trickery we can still do it (please excuse
> ugliness - my macro-fu is weak):
>
> (defmacro my-invoke [method-str instance & args]
>  `(. ~instance ~(symbol method-str) ~...@args))
>
> user=> (my-invoke "toString" 5)
> "5"
>
>
>
> Regards,
> Tim.
> >
>

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Invoking Java method through method name as a String

[Richard Lyman]

I have an instance of the Java class in a variable.
I have the method arguments in a vector.
I have the method name as a String.

I've tried so many different ways to invoke that method on that class and
pass those parameters. I've tried macros, reflection, and read/eval. None of
the ways I've tried feel right, and none of them have worked so far. Rather
than dump all the failed code, here's some pseudo-code that I wish worked...

(prn "Result: "
   (apply (memfn-from-string "nameOfMethod")
 class-instance
 [arg1 arg2 arg3]))

Any pointers? What am I not seeing? Am I wanting too much?

Thanks!
-Richard

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