Re: Stus-List Keel repair

[Russ & Melody via CnC-List]

Hi David & John,

With all due respect, I suggest you investigate 
the conditions of filing a claim immediately.
I have a colleague who tells about having 
initiated a house claim on the advice of the 
insurance broker but it did not proceed with any 
work being done by the insurance company and it 
was still treated as a claim even though nothing 
was paid out. Insurance can be a tough racket. 
There is lots of profit to protect.


For your own piece of mind get someone 
knowledgeable to have a look. The best area of 
interest to start looking at is the aft end of 
the keel area inside the boat, especially if you 
have the grid or ladder structure.


Marine Tex is good for small repairs but a little 
on the expensive side if it's going to require a lot.


Cheers, Russ
Sweet 35 mk-1
B.C. South Coast


At 05:12 PM 20/11/2015, you wrote:

Content-Type: multipart/related;
boundary="=_NextPart_000_0010_01D123CF.C38F0EB0"
Content-Language: en-us

David

Is your insurance up to date and premium 
paid??  A hard grounding that removes lead is by 
definition a serious stress on the keel and 
associated hull structure and needs to be 
addressed.  Suggest you immediately file a claim 
and have a reputable fiberglass guy inspect your 
keel, sump, surrounding hull and interior.  Get 
whatever needs to be fixed fixed and be 
confident in your boat’s integrity.  Remember 
that a crack shows something has in fact failed 
– the only question is how bad??  Arguably the 
best fiberglass guy in these parts is Nick Sahin at Fort Rachel


Best of luck


John and Maryann
Legacy III
1982 C&C 34
Noank, CT

From: CnC-List 
[mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of David Knecht via CnC-List

Sent: Thursday, November 19, 2015 10:13 PM
To: CnC CnC discussion list
Cc: David Knecht
Subject: Stus-List Keel repair

Aries is now finally out of the water and I had 
a chance to survey the damage to the keel from 
my encounter with Melton Ledge last summer.  I 
actually received a special award from the Race 
Committee for going up on the ledge during a 
race and needing to be towed off.  In my 
defense, the marker buoy was 100 yards from 
where it was supposed to be and the Coast Guard 
repositioned it after I alerted them to the problem.
The front edge of the keel is well smashed in 
over about a 6 inch area where it looks like the 
lead is actually missing.  I had presumed I 
would pound it back into shape and then smooth, 
but that does not look possible now that I see 
it.  The guy who helps out in the yard suggested 
using Marine Tex epoxy putty to fill in the 
missing volume and then smooth (angle 
grinder?)  I am hoping that the experts on this 
list can give me some guidance as to how to tackle the repair.  Thanks- Dave


Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT

[]





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Re: Stus-List chrome lewmar 30 ST winches for sale on eBay

[Ahmet via CnC-List]

I got one for $350, looking for a second.
So I have a self-tailer on Starboard tack and an regular winch on port tack
:)
 I missed an Ebay auction for a pair for $600 something.
These are the older single speed ones.
The newer 2 speed ones go for about $800 each.
Ahmet



On Fri, Nov 20, 2015 at 6:50 PM, Danny Haughey via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Full disclosure, this is a guy from the Viking group that is selling these.
>
> http://m.ebay.com/itm/231759918058?_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649&_mwBanner=1
>
> Thought I would pass the info along.  $850 for the pair
>
> Danny
>
> ___
>
> Email address:
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
> To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the
> bottom of page at:
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>
>


-- 
---
Ahmet
*"S/V Waterdancer"* 1990 Irwin 43 CC
"Tabasco" 1973 C&C 25
Winthrop Yacht Club, Winthrop, MA / USA
---
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Re: Stus-List Return skipper needed Bermuda to Annapolis

[Jim Watts via CnC-List]

I don't need the money, how are you on the hookers and blow end?

Oy, was that public?

Jim Watts
Paradigm Shift
C&C 35 Mk III
Victoria, BC

On 18 November 2015 at 16:30, Joel Aronson via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> All,
>
> I am looking for someone to skipper The Office back from Bermuda around
> June 18.
>
> I have several qualified crew, but need to have a skipper with ocean/Great
> Lakes experience.  Unfortunately, this is not a paid position and you would
> have to pay for your own transportation to Bermuda and from Annapolis.
>
> I may also have room for one or two more crew.
>
> Please contact me off list if interested.
>
> Joel
> 35/3
> The Office
> Annapolis
> joel.aron...@gmail.com
>
>
> --
> Joel
> 301 541 8551
>
> ___
>
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>
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Re: Stus-List Keel repair

[Michael Cotton via CnC-List]

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 20, 2015, at 8:12 PM, John and Maryann Read via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> David
>  
> Is your insurance up to date and premium paid??  A hard grounding that 
> removes lead is by definition a serious stress on the keel and associated 
> hull structure and needs to be addressed.  Suggest you immediately file a 
> claim and have a reputable fiberglass guy inspect your keel, sump, 
> surrounding hull and interior.  Get whatever needs to be fixed fixed and be 
> confident in your boat’s integrity.  Remember that a crack shows something 
> has in fact failed – the only question is how bad??  Arguably the best 
> fiberglass guy in these parts is Nick Sahin at Fort Rachel
>  
> Best of luck
>  
>  
> John and Maryann
> Legacy III
> 1982 C&C 34
> Noank, CT
>  
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of David 
> Knecht via CnC-List
> Sent: Thursday, November 19, 2015 10:13 PM
> To: CnC CnC discussion list
> Cc: David Knecht
> Subject: Stus-List Keel repair
>  
> Aries is now finally out of the water and I had a chance to survey the damage 
> to the keel from my encounter with Melton Ledge last summer.  I actually 
> received a special award from the Race Committee for going up on the ledge 
> during a race and needing to be towed off.  In my defense, the marker buoy 
> was 100 yards from where it was supposed to be and the Coast Guard 
> repositioned it after I alerted them to the problem.  
> The front edge of the keel is well smashed in over about a 6 inch area where 
> it looks like the lead is actually missing.  I had presumed I would pound it 
> back into shape and then smooth, but that does not look possible now that I 
> see it.  The guy who helps out in the yard suggested using Marine Tex epoxy 
> putty to fill in the missing volume and then smooth (angle grinder?)  I am 
> hoping that the experts on this list can give me some guidance as to how to 
> tackle the repair.  Thanks- Dave
>  
> Aries
> 1990 C&C 34+
> New London, CT
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
>   
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. 
> www.avast.com
> 
> 
> ___
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Re: Stus-List Winterizing the Holding Tank

[John and Maryann Read via CnC-List]

David



Yes pump it out (think of what happens if the contents are allowed to ferment 
for 6 months).  Then flush with fresh water and pump dry.  Then apply antifreeze



Cheers





John and Maryann

Legacy III

1982 C&C 34

Noank, CT



From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of David Knecht 
via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2015 8:00 AM
To: CnC CnC discussion list
Cc: David Knecht
Subject: Stus-List Winterizing the Holding Tank



Do people worry about emptying the holding tank for winter storage?  Both boats 
I have bought had stuff left in the holding tank when I took ownership, and 
there was no damage, so I have presumed that with plenty of expansion room in 
the tank, it won’t be a problem.  I have flushed some antifreeze through the 
lines, but the tank is about 1/3 full at present.  Has anyone ever had freezing 
damage to their tank?  Thanks- Dave



Aries

1990 C&C 34+

New London, CT








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Re: Stus-List Keel repair

[John and Maryann Read via CnC-List]

David

 

Is your insurance up to date and premium paid??  A hard grounding that
removes lead is by definition a serious stress on the keel and associated
hull structure and needs to be addressed.  Suggest you immediately file a
claim and have a reputable fiberglass guy inspect your keel, sump,
surrounding hull and interior.  Get whatever needs to be fixed fixed and be
confident in your boat's integrity.  Remember that a crack shows something
has in fact failed - the only question is how bad??  Arguably the best
fiberglass guy in these parts is Nick Sahin at Fort Rachel

 

Best of luck

 

 

John and Maryann

Legacy III

1982 C&C 34

Noank, CT

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of David
Knecht via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, November 19, 2015 10:13 PM
To: CnC CnC discussion list
Cc: David Knecht
Subject: Stus-List Keel repair

 

Aries is now finally out of the water and I had a chance to survey the
damage to the keel from my encounter with Melton Ledge last summer.  I
actually received a special award from the Race Committee for going up on
the ledge during a race and needing to be towed off.  In my defense, the
marker buoy was 100 yards from where it was supposed to be and the Coast
Guard repositioned it after I alerted them to the problem.  

The front edge of the keel is well smashed in over about a 6 inch area where
it looks like the lead is actually missing.  I had presumed I would pound it
back into shape and then smooth, but that does not look possible now that I
see it.  The guy who helps out in the yard suggested using Marine Tex epoxy
putty to fill in the missing volume and then smooth (angle grinder?)  I am
hoping that the experts on this list can give me some guidance as to how to
tackle the repair.  Thanks- Dave

 

Aries

1990 C&C 34+

New London, CT




 



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Re: Stus-List lewmar 30 winches

[Danny Haughey via CnC-List]

I may have spoke too soon.  It seems he wants $850 for one.  Sorry about the 
mis- information...

Danny
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Stus-List chrome lewmar 30 ST winches for sale on eBay

[Danny Haughey via CnC-List]

Full disclosure, this is a guy from the Viking group that is selling these.

http://m.ebay.com/itm/231759918058?_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649&_mwBanner=1

Thought I would pass the info along.  $850 for the pair

Danny

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Re: Stus-List Winterizing the Holding Tank

[Don Newman via CnC-List]

Years ago we had a power boat in our marina that was renamed The Busted
Flush after their half full holding tank froze and burst over the winter.
Even with room for expansion ice will put extra pressure on the tank that
may or may not withstand it.  I prefer not to take the chance.

-- 
Don Newman
C&C 44
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Re: Stus-List Batteries in the cabin. Was Re: Changing weight distribution in Landfall 38

[Ahmet via CnC-List]

Waterdancer, although an amazingly good sailor (for a Irwin Center Cockpit)
has a a wing keel and a great Yanmar Turbo engine, but functions as a
floating apartment.
Hence the C&C 25.
Since we are both working, my wife would not be happy to have her home not
to be there when she comes back home.

However, we have some over here at Constitution Marina in Boston who are
living in 26 - 30 footers.
Not me. I like my shower, hot water, nice big saloon and queen size bed.
However, in the 3 months I had the C&C 25, I probably almost  sailed her
more that I did the Irwin 43 in the past 7 years.
I am tempted to do some longer distance cruising with "Tabasco", like
Boston to Cape Cod etc.
Back to the basics. I am actually enjoying "Good Old Boat" magazine again.
Living aboard a 45 footer (and working full time) somewhat removed me from
the pure fun of sailing.

---
Ahmet
*"S/V Waterdancer"* 1990 Irwin 43 CC
"Tabasco" 1973 C&C 25
Winthrop Yacht Club, Winthrop, MA / USA
---



On Fri, Nov 20, 2015 at 11:40 AM, Robert Boyer via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Ah yes, I missed that...Ok, makes more sense!
>
> Sent from my iPhone, Bob Boyer
>
> On Nov 20, 2015, at 9:46 AM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Bob — I think you missed the boat reference underneath the C&C25:  Irwin
> 43 “Waterdancer”.  I imagine that’s where the batteries live…  and the
> dogs…   :^)
>
>
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(
>
> On Nov 20, 2015, at 7:54 AM, Robert Boyer via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> The symptoms are (1) an unexplainable urge to find warm weather, (2) an
> urge to get off the boat when it snows, and (3) cold feet in the winter.
>  (Just kidding)
>
> Life is full of dangers--the biggest one on the highway.
>
> How did you manage to fit 5 group 27s under your cabin sole in a C&C 27?
> Are you crazy living aboard avC&C 27 in the winter in Boston?  I can
> understand the need for 2 dogs--hope they are big ones!
>
> Bob
>
> Bob Boyer
> S/V Rainy Days / Annapolis MD
> 1983 C&C Landfall 38 - Hull #230
> email: dainyr...@icloud.com 
> blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
>
> "There is nothing--absolutely nothing--half so much worth doing as simply
> messing about in boats."  --Kenneth Grahame
>
> On Nov 19, 2015, at 11:30 PM, Sailnomad via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Ok, now I am worried
> I have 5 group 27 wet cell batteries under my cabin sole. They are not
> wented. And I live aboard full time with wife and 2 dogs. Am I living
> dangerously ? I never smelled anything. What are the symptoms ?
> Ahmet
> C&C 25 "Tabasco"
> Irwin 43 "Waterdancer"
> Boston, MA
>
>
> ___
>
> Email address:
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
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>
>


-- 
---
Ahmet
*"S/V Waterdancer"* 1990 Irwin 43 CC
"Tabasco" 1973 C&C 25
Winthrop Yacht Club, Winthrop, MA / USA
---
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Re: Stus-List Batteries in the cabin. Was Re: Changing weight distribution in Landfall 38

[Ahmet via CnC-List]

And the oxygen may actually help :)
I know that if you overcharge a battery, or it is a bad battery, you get a
sulfur smell.
99% of the time I am running on shore power. The battery voltage oscillates
between 12.7 and 14.1
I suspect that most of the charging current goes directly to my consumption
without going into the battery,
which is mostly cabin lights and the fridge. Not sure how much chemical
reaction happens then
I have a 40 amp charger, and on the average I use 10 amps.
It was mostly an economical decision to use lead acid batteries.
Next round I will switch to Gel-Cell batteries
Thanks
Ahmet

On Fri, Nov 20, 2015 at 4:58 AM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Ahmet,
>
> Symptoms? Kaboom!
>
> During the charging process the same electrical current that is used to
> charge the batteries also tears the chemical bonds in the water molecules
> apart.  This is know as electrolysis.  The result is hydrogen and oxygen
> gas.  All lead acid batteries are subject to this.  This is the reason that
> water needs added periodically.  Overcharging and using excessive current
> will increase the amount of electrolysis occurring.
>
> My opinion is that the amount of explosive gas being generated is
> relatively insignificant and our boats are not air tight enough to allow
> gasses to accumulate.  Hydrogen is also different from propane and gasoline
> fumes in that hydrogen is lighter than air and will not accumulate in the
> low points of the bilge.
>
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C&C 37+
> Solomons, MD
>
> ___
>
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Re: Stus-List Batteries in the cabin. Was Re: Changing weight distribution in Landfall 38

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

Ah yes, I missed that...Ok, makes more sense!

Sent from my iPhone, Bob Boyer

> On Nov 20, 2015, at 9:46 AM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Bob — I think you missed the boat reference underneath the C&C25:  Irwin 43 
> “Waterdancer”.  I imagine that’s where the batteries live…  and the dogs…   
> :^)
> 
> 
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(
> 
>> On Nov 20, 2015, at 7:54 AM, Robert Boyer via CnC-List 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> The symptoms are (1) an unexplainable urge to find warm weather, (2) an urge 
>> to get off the boat when it snows, and (3) cold feet in the winter.  (Just 
>> kidding)
>> 
>> Life is full of dangers--the biggest one on the highway.
>> 
>> How did you manage to fit 5 group 27s under your cabin sole in a C&C 27?  
>> Are you crazy living aboard avC&C 27 in the winter in Boston?  I can 
>> understand the need for 2 dogs--hope they are big ones!
>> 
>> Bob
>> 
>> Bob Boyer
>> S/V Rainy Days / Annapolis MD
>> 1983 C&C Landfall 38 - Hull #230
>> email: dainyr...@icloud.com 
>> blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
>> 
>> "There is nothing--absolutely nothing--half so much worth doing as simply 
>> messing about in boats."  --Kenneth Grahame
>> 
>>> On Nov 19, 2015, at 11:30 PM, Sailnomad via CnC-List 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Ok, now I am worried
>>> I have 5 group 27 wet cell batteries under my cabin sole. They are not 
>>> wented. And I live aboard full time with wife and 2 dogs. Am I living 
>>> dangerously ? I never smelled anything. What are the symptoms ?
>>> Ahmet
>>> C&C 25 "Tabasco"
>>> Irwin 43 "Waterdancer"
>>> Boston, MA
>>> 
> 
> ___
> 
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Re: Stus-List Winterizing the Holding Tank

[johnr via CnC-List]

Pump out is inexpensive and should be done. Yes you do want anti-freeze in the 
lines.


John McLaughlin
"Pyewacket"



-Original Message-
From: Robert Boyer via CnC-List 
To: cnc-list 
Cc: Robert Boyer 
Sent: Fri, Nov 20, 2015 8:58 am
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing the Holding Tank



Why take a chance?  Why not get a pumpout?

Bob Boyer
S/V Rainy Days / Annapolis MD
1983 C&C Landfall 38 - Hull #230
email: dainyr...@icloud.com 
blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com



"There is nothing--absolutely nothing--half so much worth doing as simply 
messing about in boats."  --Kenneth Grahame


On Nov 20, 2015, at 8:00 AM, David Knecht via CnC-List  
wrote:



Do people worry about emptying the holding tank for winter storage?  Both boats 
I have bought had stuff left in the holding tank when I took ownership, and 
there was no damage, so I have presumed that with plenty of expansion room in 
the tank, it won’t be a problem.  I have flushed some antifreeze through the 
lines, but the tank is about 1/3 full at present.  Has anyone ever had freezing 
damage to their tank?  Thanks- Dave



Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT






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Re: Stus-List Winterizing the Holding Tank

[Bill Coleman via CnC-List]

Absolutely.

Plus, once that smell permeates your boat, it will be obnoxious

I even try to keep mine as empty as possible during the year.  

 

Regards,

 

Bill Coleman

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of David Knecht 
via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2015 8:00 AM
To: CnC CnC discussion list
Cc: David Knecht
Subject: Stus-List Winterizing the Holding Tank

 

Do people worry about emptying the holding tank for winter storage?  Both boats 
I have bought had stuff left in the holding tank when I took ownership, and 
there was no damage, so I have presumed that with plenty of expansion room in 
the tank, it won’t be a problem.  I have flushed some antifreeze through the 
lines, but the tank is about 1/3 full at present.  Has anyone ever had freezing 
damage to their tank?  Thanks- Dave

 

Aries

1990 C&C 34+

New London, CT




 

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Re: Stus-List Batteries in the cabin. Was Re: Changing weight distribution in Landfall 38

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

And since the biggest batteries you could fit into the bilge of a 25 would be D 
cells, I think the Irwin 43 is the correct assumption.

 

Rick Brass

Imzadi  C&C 38 mk 2

la Belle Aurore C&C 25 mk1

Washington, NC

 

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Frederick G 
Street via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2015 9:47 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Frederick G Street 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Batteries in the cabin. Was Re: Changing weight 
distribution in Landfall 38

 

Bob — I think you missed the boat reference underneath the C&C25:  Irwin 43 
“Waterdancer”.  I imagine that’s where the batteries live…  and the dogs…   :^)


Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(

 

On Nov 20, 2015, at 7:54 AM, Robert Boyer via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

 

The symptoms are (1) an unexplainable urge to find warm weather, (2) an urge to 
get off the boat when it snows, and (3) cold feet in the winter.  (Just kidding)

 

Life is full of dangers--the biggest one on the highway.

 

How did you manage to fit 5 group 27s under your cabin sole in a C&C 27?  Are 
you crazy living aboard avC&C 27 in the winter in Boston?  I can understand the 
need for 2 dogs--hope they are big ones!

 

Bob

Bob Boyer

S/V Rainy Days / Annapolis MD

1983 C&C Landfall 38 - Hull #230

email: dainyr...@icloud.com   

blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com  

 

"There is nothing--absolutely nothing--half so much worth doing as simply 
messing about in boats."  --Kenneth Grahame


On Nov 19, 2015, at 11:30 PM, Sailnomad via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

Ok, now I am worried
I have 5 group 27 wet cell batteries under my cabin sole. They are not wented. 
And I live aboard full time with wife and 2 dogs. Am I living dangerously ? I 
never smelled anything. What are the symptoms ?
Ahmet
C&C 25 "Tabasco"
Irwin 43 "Waterdancer"
Boston, MA

 

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Re: Stus-List Batteries in the cabin. Was Re: Changing weight distribution in Landfall 38

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

Bob — I think you missed the boat reference underneath the C&C25:  Irwin 43 
“Waterdancer”.  I imagine that’s where the batteries live…  and the dogs…   :^)


Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(

> On Nov 20, 2015, at 7:54 AM, Robert Boyer via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> The symptoms are (1) an unexplainable urge to find warm weather, (2) an urge 
> to get off the boat when it snows, and (3) cold feet in the winter.  (Just 
> kidding)
> 
> Life is full of dangers--the biggest one on the highway.
> 
> How did you manage to fit 5 group 27s under your cabin sole in a C&C 27?  Are 
> you crazy living aboard avC&C 27 in the winter in Boston?  I can understand 
> the need for 2 dogs--hope they are big ones!
> 
> Bob
> 
> Bob Boyer
> S/V Rainy Days / Annapolis MD
> 1983 C&C Landfall 38 - Hull #230
> email: dainyr...@icloud.com  
> blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com 
> 
> "There is nothing--absolutely nothing--half so much worth doing as simply 
> messing about in boats."  --Kenneth Grahame
> 
> On Nov 19, 2015, at 11:30 PM, Sailnomad via CnC-List  > wrote:
> 
>> Ok, now I am worried
>> I have 5 group 27 wet cell batteries under my cabin sole. They are not 
>> wented. And I live aboard full time with wife and 2 dogs. Am I living 
>> dangerously ? I never smelled anything. What are the symptoms ?
>> Ahmet
>> C&C 25 "Tabasco"
>> Irwin 43 "Waterdancer"
>> Boston, MA
>> 

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Re: Stus-List Keel repair

[mike amirault via CnC-List]

David, in most hard groundings it is the back of the keel that gets driven up 
through the boat causing cracks inside the bilge. My son who does repairs at a 
local marina has seen this many times. Take a good look at the back end of your 
bilge for cracks, you could have some serious structrual damage. Wouldn't hurt 
to get a pro to look at it too. Good luck.

Mike Amirault 
C&C33mkii
SMSC___

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Re: Stus-List Winterizing the Holding Tank

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

Why take a chance?  Why not get a pumpout?

Bob Boyer
S/V Rainy Days / Annapolis MD
1983 C&C Landfall 38 - Hull #230
email: dainyr...@icloud.com 
blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com

"There is nothing--absolutely nothing--half so much worth doing as simply 
messing about in boats."  --Kenneth Grahame

> On Nov 20, 2015, at 8:00 AM, David Knecht via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Do people worry about emptying the holding tank for winter storage?  Both 
> boats I have bought had stuff left in the holding tank when I took ownership, 
> and there was no damage, so I have presumed that with plenty of expansion 
> room in the tank, it won’t be a problem.  I have flushed some antifreeze 
> through the lines, but the tank is about 1/3 full at present.  Has anyone 
> ever had freezing damage to their tank?  Thanks- Dave
> 
> Aries
> 1990 C&C 34+
> New London, CT
> 
> 
> 
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Re: Stus-List Batteries in the cabin. Was Re: Changing weight distribution in Landfall 38

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

The symptoms are (1) an unexplainable urge to find warm weather, (2) an urge to 
get off the boat when it snows, and (3) cold feet in the winter.  (Just kidding)

Life is full of dangers--the biggest one on the highway.

How did you manage to fit 5 group 27s under your cabin sole in a C&C 27?  Are 
you crazy living aboard avC&C 27 in the winter in Boston?  I can understand the 
need for 2 dogs--hope they are big ones!

Bob

Bob Boyer
S/V Rainy Days / Annapolis MD
1983 C&C Landfall 38 - Hull #230
email: dainyr...@icloud.com 
blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com

"There is nothing--absolutely nothing--half so much worth doing as simply 
messing about in boats."  --Kenneth Grahame

> On Nov 19, 2015, at 11:30 PM, Sailnomad via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Ok, now I am worried
> I have 5 group 27 wet cell batteries under my cabin sole. They are not 
> wented. And I live aboard full time with wife and 2 dogs. Am I living 
> dangerously ? I never smelled anything. What are the symptoms ?
> Ahmet
> C&C 25 "Tabasco"
> Irwin 43 "Waterdancer"
> Boston, MA
>> On Nov 19, 2015 12:50 PM, "Robert Boyer via CnC-List" 
>>  wrote:
>> I DO use AGMs--so, vapors are not an issue.  I have some space just forward 
>> of the mast under the settee but close to the boat's centerline that might 
>> work for battery storage--I have to check out the dimensions but this would 
>> remove weight aft and add it close to the center of gravity.
>> 
>> Bob
>> 
>> Bob Boyer
>> S/V Rainy Days / Annapolis MD
>> 1983 C&C Landfall 38 - Hull #230
>> email: dainyr...@icloud.com 
>> blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
>> 
>> "There is nothing--absolutely nothing--half so much worth doing as simply 
>> messing about in boats."  --Kenneth Grahame
>> 
>>> On Nov 19, 2015, at 11:54 AM, Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Bob,
>>>  
>>> as you said, the current from the house batteries should never be high, so 
>>> the wires should not be an issue. However, if you calculate your load at 30 
>>> A and select appropriate gauge of the wire (for distance), make sure that 
>>> you install an appropriate fuse (probably not larger than 50 A) (I would do 
>>> it right on the terminal, but ABYC says, within 6 or 7 in from the 
>>> terminal) to protect that wire. Such fuse would probably allow for one 
>>> quick start of the motor (it would not allow for cranking a cranky motor). 
>>> But if you want to be able to use your house batteries for cranking, you 
>>> have to allow for at least 80 – 100 A in that cable (i.e. appropriate 
>>> gauge). Keep in mind that if you install bigger cable, your voltage loss 
>>> would be less, so you would have more energy available to you lights and 
>>> instruments (instead of heating the cabin).
>>>  
>>> One other thought. I am not sure if putting batteries under the V-berth is 
>>> the best idea. As much as you could, you should avoid placing heavy objects 
>>> far away from the centre of gravity. In heavy weather the heavy bow would 
>>> be your enemy, not a friend.
>>>  
>>> And finally, at least theoretically, you should not install the normal 
>>> lead-acid batteries in the cabin (where they are not vented directly 
>>> outside). If you want to install batteries below, you should use the gel or 
>>> AGM batteries. This, in turn, leads to a more complex charging system 
>>> (especially, if you are going to use AGMs).
>>>  
>>> just a few ideas to consider
>>>  
>>> Marek
>>> 1994 C270, “Legato”
>>> Ottawa, ON
>>>  
>>>  
>>> From: Robert Boyer via CnC-List
>>> Sent: Thursday, November 19, 2015 11:24 AM
>>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>>> Cc: Robert Boyer
>>> Subject: Stus-List Changing weight distribution in Landfall 38
>>>  
>>> I am equipping my boat for 8 months per year of cruising in the Bahamas.  I 
>>> have added a 19-gallon auxiliary diesel tank where my holding tank was 
>>> located (under the navigation seat) which adds weight aft.  I currently 
>>> have 4 group 27 batteries which will be eventually upgraded to Group 
>>> 31's--these also are located aft.
>>>  
>>> I have been considering moving 2 or 3 batteries from the aft cockpit locker 
>>> to some dead space under the v-berth.  This would take some weight from the 
>>> aft and add it forward.  (My boat currently sits about 2" high at the bow 
>>> and maybe 1 inch low at the stern with no one aboard but full fuel tanks.)
>>>  
>>> I could configure the batteries such that the new forward bank could be the 
>>> house bank and the starting bank (which I could probably reduce to 1 or 2 
>>> batteries) could remain aft.  My problem is sizing the cables that would 
>>> run from the forward batteries to the aft controls.  As I see it, these 
>>> cables would never carry more than 30 amps (maximum charging from my solar 
>>> panels) unless I needed them for starting (in the event of a dead starting 
>>> battery).
>>>  
>>> Does anyone have any comments or suggestions on this matter?
>>>  
>>> Bob
>>> 
>>> Bob Boyer
>>> S/V Rainy Days / Annapolis MD
>>> 1983 C&C Landfall 38 

Re: Stus-List Winterizing the Holding Tank

[Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List]

David,

I don’t think the tank would suffer much. I hope that all the lines to and from 
have been properly winterised (empty and/or full of undiluted antifreeze).

When I bought my current boat, it arrived very late in the season so there was 
no time to splash it and you can reach the pump out only from the dock, so I 
did not empty the tank. The PO was supposed to empty them, but the job was not 
complete. I had about 1/4 of the tank filled. The only negative from that was 
that the tank stunk. I guess the less time the waste stays in the tank, the 
less stink you have in and around the tank.

Every time since I completely empty the tank before the haul out and then 
winterise the head. I claim that, after three seasons, the smell under the 
berth, where the tank is located is much more bearable.

Marek
1994 C270 “Legato”
Ottawa, ON

From: David Knecht via CnC-List 
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2015 8:00 AM
To: CnC CnC discussion list 
Cc: David Knecht 
Subject: Stus-List Winterizing the Holding Tank

Do people worry about emptying the holding tank for winter storage?  Both boats 
I have bought had stuff left in the holding tank when I took ownership, and 
there was no damage, so I have presumed that with plenty of expansion room in 
the tank, it won’t be a problem.  I have flushed some antifreeze through the 
lines, but the tank is about 1/3 full at present.  Has anyone ever had freezing 
damage to their tank?  Thanks- Dave 

Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT

 




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Re: Stus-List Winterizing the Holding Tank

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

I suck mine out and refill a few times with fresh water.  Then a shot of
bleach down the toilet to clean the lines and then some more flushing.  All
of this is completed with a shot of glycol.  I have a vacu-flush so vacuum
tank and lines are longer and more critical.  Once glycol is in the tank I
use the macerator pump to pump the tank dry...everything has been flushed,
cleaned, freeze protected, and emptied.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD
Do people worry about emptying the holding tank for winter storage?  Both
boats I have bought had stuff left in the holding tank when I took
ownership, and there was no damage, so I have presumed that with plenty of
expansion room in the tank, it won’t be a problem.  I have flushed some
antifreeze through the lines, but the tank is about 1/3 full at present.
Has anyone ever had freezing damage to their tank?  Thanks- Dave

Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT



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Stus-List Winterizing the Holding Tank

[David Knecht via CnC-List]

Do people worry about emptying the holding tank for winter storage?  Both boats 
I have bought had stuff left in the holding tank when I took ownership, and 
there was no damage, so I have presumed that with plenty of expansion room in 
the tank, it won’t be a problem.  I have flushed some antifreeze through the 
lines, but the tank is about 1/3 full at present.  Has anyone ever had freezing 
damage to their tank?  Thanks- Dave

Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT



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Re: Stus-List Batteries in the cabin. Was Re: Changing weight distribution in Landfall 38

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Ahmet,

Symptoms? Kaboom!

During the charging process the same electrical current that is used to
charge the batteries also tears the chemical bonds in the water molecules
apart.  This is know as electrolysis.  The result is hydrogen and oxygen
gas.  All lead acid batteries are subject to this.  This is the reason that
water needs added periodically.  Overcharging and using excessive current
will increase the amount of electrolysis occurring.

My opinion is that the amount of explosive gas being generated is
relatively insignificant and our boats are not air tight enough to allow
gasses to accumulate.  Hydrogen is also different from propane and gasoline
fumes in that hydrogen is lighter than air and will not accumulate in the
low points of the bilge.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD
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