Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
Mark, if you Y-connect it to the existing bilge pump discharge, don't you worry about water going back into the bilge via the other hose? Now a stupid(?) question to the list: can you connect a bilge pump in series (i.e. to the same discharge hose, one pump at the bilge to keep it dry, the other (larger capacity) above the water line (next to the discharge)). The question has some merits (for me). I have a 1000 GPM (??) pump located in the lazarette pulling the water through a very long hose from the bilge. I am thinking about installing a smaller pump in the bilge (like the one suggested for Mark). My problem is that if I could avoid, I'd rather not run 15' of a hose through the bellows of the boat (I am not looking forward to snaking that hose behind and under all kinds of maze in the aft of the boat). If I could just connect the new pump to the existing hose, I would be set. I wonder what can go wrong with this kind of installation. thanks Marek (in Ottawa) -Original Message- From: Dr. Mark Bodnar via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2014 5:35 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning Thanks for all the advice. This is a great resource (thanks Stu). I've read some of this info scanning different online sites - but this list gives quick feedback on how and why. That Whale sub pump is exactly the one I was looking at. Plus a switch. I will take the wiring advice - heat shrink and silicone etc. Any thoughts on the discharge? I've read some people discharge through the galley sink drain - which would keep the hose run short and easy --- but then I'd have to leave that seacock open.. The other option is to Y the discharge to the current manual pump discharge (or one of the above waterline cockpit drain hoses) - but that would need 18'+ of hose. Mark - There is no cure for birth and death save to enjoy the interval. - George Santayana On 27/05/2014 10:51 AM, Wally Bryant via CnC-List wrote: Dennis had a good call with heat shrink and painting with liquid electrical tape. I took made my heat shrink about two inches longer than the connection, and injected marine silicone inside with a syringe. When the shrunk, silicone gushed out the ends. It has been wet often. Maybe I'm just lucky, but my 12 year old Rule pumps and float switches are still doing fine. I have a little 500 as the primary pump, and a big one that stays up on a platform about six inches off the bilge, just in case. The 500 does get clogged up with bilge gunk, and I just replaced it because they can't be taken apart and cleaned out.One thing I do is take a garden hose to 3/4 adapter and flush the hose out with high pressure dock water. I'll also backflush the pump with the garden hose. Most of the float switches I've seen fail are really due to bad wiring. I've seen plain crimp connections just sitting in the bilge, and it's no wonder the wire rots out. The worst, if you can believe it, was just wires twisted together and covered with electrical tape. No kidding. I found that down here in Mexico, as the sport fishing boat was sinking at the dock. The guy came back to town, and when I told him that I'd saved his boat he didn't even say thanks. Power boaters. (It probably didn't help that I said whoever did the wiring ought to be taken out and shot.) Wal you CnC-List wrote: I ran a rule float switch to one which failed that first year. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
Marek I think it is best if the automatic electric bilge pump exits high near the toe rail and before exiting a complete loop in the hose is a good idea and as suggested a check valve nearer the bilge can help too, that way when the pump shuts down all the water remaining in the hose won't flow back down into the bilge...my manual Whale gusher 10 pump which is mounted high (above the cockpit sole in the port lazerette exits out the stern of the boat, with a downhill slope from the pump to the exit point at the stern...I am not sure I would want both pumps exiting through the same hose and in my case it would be impractical because of how far the manual pump is located aft of the bilge...I would have to get the ayutomatic pump hose at least aft of that pump -Original Message- From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List Sent: May 28, 2014 9:22 AM To: Dr. Mark Bodnar; cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning Mark, if you Y-connect it to the existing bilge pump discharge, don't you worry about water going back into the bilge via the other hose? Now a stupid(?) question to the list: can you connect a bilge pump in series (i.e. to the same discharge hose, one pump at the bilge to keep it dry, the other (larger capacity) above the water line (next to the discharge)). The question has some merits (for me). I have a 1000 GPM (??) pump located in the lazarette pulling the water through a very long hose from the bilge. I am thinking about installing a smaller pump in the bilge (like the one suggested for Mark). My problem is that if I could avoid, I'd rather not run 15' of a hose through the bellows of the boat (I am not looking forward to snaking that hose behind and under all kinds of maze in the aft of the boat). If I could just connect the new pump to the existing hose, I would be set. I wonder what can go wrong with this kind of installation. thanks Marek (in Ottawa) -Original Message- From: Dr. Mark Bodnar via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2014 5:35 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning Thanks for all the advice. This is a great resource (thanks Stu). I've read some of this info scanning different online sites - but this list gives quick feedback on how and why. That Whale sub pump is exactly the one I was looking at. Plus a switch. I will take the wiring advice - heat shrink and silicone etc. Any thoughts on the discharge? I've read some people discharge through the galley sink drain - which would keep the hose run short and easy --- but then I'd have to leave that seacock open.. The other option is to Y the discharge to the current manual pump discharge (or one of the above waterline cockpit drain hoses) - but that would need 18'+ of hose. Mark - There is no cure for birth and death save to enjoy the interval. - George Santayana On 27/05/2014 10:51 AM, Wally Bryant via CnC-List wrote: Dennis had a good call with heat shrink and painting with liquid electrical tape. I took made my heat shrink about two inches longer than the connection, and injected marine silicone inside with a syringe. When the shrunk, silicone gushed out the ends. It has been wet often. Maybe I'm just lucky, but my 12 year old Rule pumps and float switches are still doing fine. I have a little 500 as the primary pump, and a big one that stays up on a platform about six inches off the bilge, just in case. The 500 does get clogged up with bilge gunk, and I just replaced it because they can't be taken apart and cleaned out.One thing I do is take a garden hose to 3/4 adapter and flush the hose out with high pressure dock water. I'll also backflush the pump with the garden hose. Most of the float switches I've seen fail are really due to bad wiring. I've seen plain crimp connections just sitting in the bilge, and it's no wonder the wire rots out. The worst, if you can believe it, was just wires twisted together and covered with electrical tape. No kidding. I found that down here in Mexico, as the sport fishing boat was sinking at the dock. The guy came back to town, and when I told him that I'd saved his boat he didn't even say thanks. Power boaters. (It probably didn't help that I said whoever did the wiring ought to be taken out and shot.) Wal you CnC-List wrote: I ran a rule float switch to one which failed that first year. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list
Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
I did much research about bilge pumps and the following are some of my conclusions and my build set-up; Short hose runs much better than long runsPumps should not share discharge with anything elseSmooth walled hoses better than ribbedPrimary pump (smaller) discharge was moved from starboard side to port side (it dawned on me one day that launch passengers may not want a snoot-full of my bilge water)Primary is on a bilge counter to determine pump cycles and a problemMy waterproof connections configuration is a bus bar as high in the bilge as possible sprayed with electronic waterproofing. Easier to inspect and has been working for years. Secondary pump is large capacity set up with a bilge alarm and a switch 6 above primary.Both discharges just below toerail mid-ships to minimize run and to eliminate back-siphoningPrimary is setup with a check valve to keep bilge as dry as possible, secondary is not. David F. Risch (401) 419-4650 (cell) To: drbod...@accesswave.ca; cnc-list@cnc-list.com Date: Wed, 28 May 2014 08:21:59 -0400 Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Mark, if you Y-connect it to the existing bilge pump discharge, don't you worry about water going back into the bilge via the other hose? Now a stupid(?) question to the list: can you connect a bilge pump in series (i.e. to the same discharge hose, one pump at the bilge to keep it dry, the other (larger capacity) above the water line (next to the discha rge)). The question has some merits (for me). I have a 1000 GPM (??) pump located in the lazarette pulling the water through a very long hose from the bilge. I am thinking about installing a smaller pump in the bilge (like the one suggested for Mark). My problem is that if I could avoid, I'd rather not run 15' of a hose through the bellows of the boat (I am not looking forward to snaking that hose behind and under all kinds of maze in the aft of the boat). If I could just connect the new pump to the existing hose, I would be set. I wonder what can go wrong with this kind of installation. thanks Marek (in Ottawa) -Original Message- From: Dr. Mark Bodnar via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2014 5:35 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning Thanks for all the advice. This is a great resource (thanks Stu). I've read some of this info scanning different online sites - but this list gives quick feedback on how and why. That Whale sub pump is exactly the one I was looking at. Plus a switch. I will take the wiring advice - heat shrink and silicone etc. Any thoughts on the discharge? I've read some people discharge through the galley sink drain - which would keep the hose run short and easy --- but then I'd have to leave that seacock open.. The other option is to Y the discharge to the current manual pump discharge (or one of the above waterline cockpit drain hoses) - but that would need 18'+ of hose. Mark - There is no cure for birth and death save to enjoy the interval. - George Santayana On 27/05/2014 10:51 AM, Wally Bryant via CnC-List wrote: Dennis had a good call with heat shrink and painting with liquid electrical tape. I took made my heat shrink about two inches longer than the connection, and injected marine silicone inside with a syringe. When the shrunk, silicone gushed out the ends. It has been wet often. Maybe I'm just lucky, but my 12 year old Rule pumps and float switches are still doing fine. I have a little 500 as the primary pump, and a big one that stays up on a platform about six inches off the bilge, just in case. The 500 does get clogged up with bilge gunk, and I just replaced it because they can't be taken apart and cleaned out.One thing I do is take a garden hose to 3/4 adapter and flush the hose out with high pressure dock water. I'll also backflush the pump with the garden hose. Most of the float switches I've seen fail are really due to bad wiring. I've seen plain crimp connections just sitting in the bilge, and it's no wonder the wire rots out. The worst, if you can believe it, was just wires twisted together and covered with electrical tape. No kidding. I found that down here in Mexico, as the sport fishing boat was sinking at the dock. The guy came back to town, and when I told him that I'd saved his boat he didn't even say thanks. Power boaters. (It probably didn't help that I said whoever did the wiring ought to be taken out and shot.) Wal you CnC-List wrote: I ran a rule float switch to one which failed that first year. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page
Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
All good stuff David.do you know if there is a requirement to have a manual bilge pump? Seems to me there should be in the evnt power is lost at a very inopportune time _ From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of David via CnC-List Sent: May 28, 2014 9:43 AM To: CNC CNC Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning I did much research about bilge pumps and the following are some of my conclusions and my build set-up; * Short hose runs much better than long runs * Pumps should not share discharge with anything else * Smooth walled hoses better than ribbed * Primary pump (smaller) discharge was moved from starboard side to port side (it dawned on me one day that launch passengers may not want a snoot-full of my bilge water) * Primary is on a bilge counter to determine pump cycles and a problem * My waterproof connections configuration is a bus bar as high in the bilge as possible sprayed with electronic waterproofing. Easier to inspect and has been working for years. * Secondary pump is large capacity set up with a bilge alarm and a switch 6 above primary. * Both discharges just below toerail mid-ships to minimize run and to eliminate back-siphoning * Primary is setup with a check valve to keep bilge as dry as possible, secondary is not. David F. Risch (401) 419-4650 (cell) To: drbod...@accesswave.ca; cnc-list@cnc-list.com Date: Wed, 28 May 2014 08:21:59 -0400 Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Mark, if you Y-connect it to the existing bilge pump discharge, don't you worry about water going back into the bilge via the other hose? Now a stupid(?) question to the list: can you connect a bilge pump in series (i.e. to the same discharge hose, one pump at the bilge to keep it dry, the other (larger capacity) above the water line (next to the discha rge)). The question has some merits (for me). I have a 1000 GPM (??) pump located in the lazarette pulling the water through a very long hose from the bilge. I am thinking about installing a smaller pump in the bilge (like the one suggested for Mark). My problem is that if I could avoid, I'd rather not run 15' of a hose through the bellows of the boat (I am not looking forward to snaking that hose behind and under all kinds of maze in the aft of the boat). If I could just connect the new pump to the existing hose, I would be set. I wonder what can go wrong with this kind of installation. thanks Marek (in Ottawa) -Original Message- From: Dr. Mark Bodnar via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2014 5:35 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning Thanks for all the advice. This is a great resource (thanks Stu). I've read some of this info scanning different online sites - but this list gives quick feedback on how and why. That Whale sub pump is exactly the one I was looking at. Plus a switch. I will take the wiring advice - heat shrink and silicone etc. Any thoughts on the discharge? I've read some people discharge through the galley sink drain - which would keep the hose run short and easy --- but then I'd have to leave that seacock open.. The other option is to Y the discharge to the current manual pump discharge (or one of the above waterline cockpit drain hoses) - but that would need 18'+ of hose. Mark - There is no cure for birth and death save to enjoy the interval. - George Santayana On 27/05/2014 10:51 AM, Wally Bryant via CnC-List wrote: Dennis had a good call with heat shrink and painting with liquid electrical tape. I took made my heat shrink about two inches longer than the connection, and injected marine silicone inside with a syringe. When the shrunk, silicone gushed out the ends. It has been wet often. Maybe I'm just lucky, but my 12 year old Rule pumps and float switches are still doing fine. I have a little 500 as the primary pump, and a big one that stays up on a platform about six inches off the bilge, just in case. The 500 does get clogged up with bilge gunk, and I just replaced it because they can't be taken apart and cleaned out. One thing I do is take a garden hose to 3/4 adapter and flush the hose out with high pressure dock water. I'll also backflush the pump with the garden hose. Most of the float switches I've seen fail are really due to bad wiring. I've seen plain crimp connections just sitting in the bilge, and it's no wonder the wire rots out. The worst, if you can believe it, was just wires twisted together and covered with electrical tape. No kidding. I found that down here in Mexico, as the sport fishing boat was sinking at the dock. The guy came back to town, and when I told him that I'd saved his boat he
Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
I have a similar setup. As the big hose from the Whale Gusher runs from the bilge to a point just under the toe rail on the Port side of the boat near the wheel, I ran the little 3/4 smooth hose from the little one right next to it and exited at the same altitude. Didn't have to create a new path. I then found out the long hose allowed too much water back to the bilge (with an automatic pump, it kept cycling), so I put in a check valve where it is easy to clean (under the floorboard hatch about a foot behind the mast). The Whale is mounted through the cockpit floor and its pickup line is in the bilge, output is short. Gary not GPM, GPH! - Original Message - From: David via CnC-List To: CNC CNC Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 8:43 AM Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning I did much research about bilge pumps and the following are some of my conclusions and my build set-up; a.. Short hose runs much better than long runs b.. Pumps should not share discharge with anything else c.. Smooth walled hoses better than ribbed d.. Primary pump (smaller) discharge was moved from starboard side to port side (it dawned on me one day that launch passengers may not want a snoot-full of my bilge water) e.. Primary is on a bilge counter to determine pump cycles and a problem f.. My waterproof connections configuration is a bus bar as high in the bilge as possible sprayed with electronic waterproofing. Easier to inspect and has been working for years. g.. Secondary pump is large capacity set up with a bilge alarm and a switch 6 above primary. h.. Both discharges just below toerail mid-ships to minimize run and to eliminate back-siphoning i.. Primary is setup with a check valve to keep bilge as dry as possible, secondary is not. David F. Risch (401) 419-4650 (cell) To: drbod...@accesswave.ca; cnc-list@cnc-list.com Date: Wed, 28 May 2014 08:21:59 -0400 Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Mark, if you Y-connect it to the existing bilge pump discharge, don't you worry about water going back into the bilge via the other hose? Now a stupid(?) question to the list: can you connect a bilge pump in series (i.e. to the same discharge hose, one pump at the bilge to keep it dry, the other (larger capacity) above the water line (next to the discha rge)). The question has some merits (for me). I have a 1000 GPM (??) pump located in the lazarette pulling the water through a very long hose from the bilge. I am thinking about installing a smaller pump in the bilge (like the one suggested for Mark). My problem is that if I could avoid, I'd rather not run 15' of a hose through the bellows of the boat (I am not looking forward to snaking that hose behind and under all kinds of maze in the aft of the boat). If I could just connect the new pump to the existing hose, I would be set. I wonder what can go wrong with this kind of installation. thanks Marek (in Ottawa) -Original Message- From: Dr. Mark Bodnar via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2014 5:35 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning Thanks for all the advice. This is a great resource (thanks Stu). I've read some of this info scanning different online sites - but this list gives quick feedback on how and why. That Whale sub pump is exactly the one I was looking at. Plus a switch. I will take the wiring advice - heat shrink and silicone etc. Any thoughts on the discharge? I've read some people discharge through the galley sink drain - which would keep the hose run short and easy --- but then I'd have to leave that seacock open.. The other option is to Y the discharge to the current manual pump discharge (or one of the above waterline cockpit drain hoses) - but that would need 18'+ of hose. Mark - There is no cure for birth and death save to enjoy the interval. - George Santayana On 27/05/2014 10:51 AM, Wally Bryant via CnC-List wrote: Dennis had a good call with heat shrink and painting with liquid electrical tape. I took made my heat shrink about two inches longer than the connection, and injected marine silicone inside with a syringe. When the shrunk, silicone gushed out the ends. It has been wet often. Maybe I'm just lucky, but my 12 year old Rule pumps and float switches are still doing fine. I have a little 500 as the primary pump, and a big one that stays up on a platform about six inches off the bilge, just in case. The 500 does get clogged up with bilge gunk, and I just replaced it because they can't be taken apart and cleaned out. One thing I do is take
Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
Don’t forget to properly fuse the wire within seven inches of the connection to +12VDC!!! This fuse should be sized to protect the wire going to the pump switch. There should also be a fuse closer to the pump, sized per the pump instructions; this is to protect the pump from overheat/fire in case the shaft or impeller seizes. Fred Street -- Minneapolis S/V Oceanis (1979 CC Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI :^( On May 26, 2014, at 10:54 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: Install a Rule Model 43 rocker switch in a convenient but out of the way location. Wire the switch's positive to one of the battery cables on the back of your battery switch (not the common, the one marked #1 or #2) and the negative to ground (for the indicator light). By connecting to the #1 or #2 connection, you're essentially connecting to one of the batteries. As a rule, I don't like to connect directly to a battery inside the battery box. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
I also recommend the Whale. High capacity in a small package. Joel On Tuesday, May 27, 2014, Frederick G Street via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: Don’t forget to properly fuse the wire within seven inches of the connection to +12VDC!!! This fuse should be sized to protect the wire going to the pump switch. There should also be a fuse closer to the pump, sized per the pump instructions; this is to protect the pump from overheat/fire in case the shaft or impeller seizes. Fred Street -- Minneapolis S/V Oceanis (1979 CC Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI :^( On May 26, 2014, at 10:54 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.comjavascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','cnc-list@cnc-list.com'); wrote: Install a Rule Model 43 rocker switch in a convenient but out of the way location. Wire the switch's positive to one of the battery cables on the back of your battery switch (not the common, the one marked #1 or #2) and the negative to ground (for the indicator light). By connecting to the #1 or #2 connection, you're essentially connecting to one of the batteries. As a rule, I don't like to connect directly to a battery inside the battery box. -- Joel 301 541 8551 ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
I have had so many of those rule pumps fail on me, I went to a pair of gusher diaphragm pumps, mounted up high and dry, with hoses to the bilge. I ran a rule float switch to one which failed that first year. Now I have sea choice float switch that has been working for 2 seasons, going on 3. So, I have one gusher with an automatic switch that I can turn on manually, a manually controlled gusher and a manual whale pump in the cock pit, all installed out of the bilge. I have a goal to keep the bilge as empty as possible. The PO found the bilge a great place for a wire chase Danny From my Android phone Original message From: M Bod via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com Date: 05/26/2014 11:18 PM (GMT-05:00) To: CC list cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning Rich, Thanks for the heads up. I was just online tonight looking at bilge pumps. My CS 30 doesn't have an automatic bilge pump, just a manual. I feel like I should add an automatic pump, but I wonder what size. My boat has a very flat bilge with no 'deep' spots at all and maybe 4 space under the floor boards. What size bilge pump is appropriate? (And will fit) Suggestions? Would you the the 'integrated electronic' switch or the old fashioned float? And suggestions on installation? I gather I should have it pump out near the transom above water level (maybe Y it onto the drain from the manual pump?) Do you 'direct wire' it to the batteries and bypass the panel? Mark On 26 May 2014 23:34, Rich Knowles via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: My bilge pump and I had a small altercation this weekend. It’s a 2000 gph PAR unit that I have had on the boat for at least 10 years. It has never given me problems until it recently decided not to pump any water. The motor ran just fine, and I could see the water in the bilge being stirred around, but nothing was being sent overboard. It acted as though it had an airlock with the impeller only partially submerged. I dismantled it and found that the small slit that acts as an air vent at the top of the plastic impeller housing was completely plugged. This prevented any trapped air from escaping from the pump body. Once I cleaned the crud out of the vent slit, it performed as new. Good for another ten years, thank you. Just a note to tuck away in case anyone has a similar “failure”. Rich Knowles INDIGO LF38 Halifax, NS. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
All this is good advice. The thing I'm finding not so good is that, while we all faithfully install tinned marine wire in hopes of staving off corrosion, equipment and bilge pump makers still frequently use untinned copper wire that is very prone to corrosion. Shame! Rich On May 27, 2014, at 10:51, Wally Bryant via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: Dennis had a good call with heat shrink and painting with liquid electrical tape. I took made my heat shrink about two inches longer than the connection, and injected marine silicone inside with a syringe. When the shrunk, silicone gushed out the ends. It has been wet often. Maybe I'm just lucky, but my 12 year old Rule pumps and float switches are still doing fine. I have a little 500 as the primary pump, and a big one that stays up on a platform about six inches off the bilge, just in case. The 500 does get clogged up with bilge gunk, and I just replaced it because they can't be taken apart and cleaned out.One thing I do is take a garden hose to 3/4 adapter and flush the hose out with high pressure dock water. I'll also backflush the pump with the garden hose. Most of the float switches I've seen fail are really due to bad wiring. I've seen plain crimp connections just sitting in the bilge, and it's no wonder the wire rots out. The worst, if you can believe it, was just wires twisted together and covered with electrical tape. No kidding. I found that down here in Mexico, as the sport fishing boat was sinking at the dock. The guy came back to town, and when I told him that I'd saved his boat he didn't even say thanks. Power boaters. (It probably didn't help that I said whoever did the wiring ought to be taken out and shot.) Wal you CnC-List wrote: I ran a rule float switch to one which failed that first year. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
Wal: you must be lucky or I am unlucky, my Rule bilge pump float switches last from one to 3 years and this replacement frequency has been going on for the 27 years I've owned my boat! (My last Rule bilge pump lasted about 15 years though--real good service!). I am switching to a completely enclosed sensing type of switch made by Johnson--I hope it lasts much longer! Bob Bob Boyer S/V Rainy Days / Annapolis MD 1983 CC Landfall 38 - Hull #230 email: dainyr...@icloud.com blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com There is nothing--absolutely nothing--half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats. --Kenneth Grahame ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
I installed a big 2000, but doubt it pumps 2000GPM, more like GPH on it's best day. - Original Message - From: CNC boat owners, cnc-list cnc-list@cnc-list.com To: Gary Nylander gnylan...@atlanticbb.net, CNC boat owners, cnc-list cnc-list@cnc-list.com Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2014 10:55:22 AM Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning Some bilge pump; 500 gallons per minute...fight fires with that baby -Original Message- From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Gary Nylander via CnC-List Sent: May 27, 2014 11:46 AM To: w...@wbryant.com; cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning I wired a 500 gpm Rule pump straight to the panel (through a connector under the dinette seat). The pump comes with long enough wires that any connection is completely up in the (dry) seat area, but I still used Anchor connectors with built in heat shrink. So far, so good. I expect it will fail for some reason (way down under the mast step) so am planning another diaphragm pump with a hose down there. I've done this before. The pump itself just craps out. I worry little about the fact I have to turn it on and off, as I live less than a block from the boat and it is in an active yard - they will call if there is any problem (plus I draw five feet and am in about six feet of water at low tide, seven to eight at high). And there is not enough room in the deep part of the bilge for a pump and a switch - I have found the automatic 'all in one' pumps seem to die earlier than manual ones. Just replaced the Whale Gusher (I think OEM) after 33 years - you would think those things would be durable - this time, I will use it every so often - it was virtually welded together from corrosion. Gary 30-1, 1980 - Original Message - From: Wally Bryant via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2014 9:51 AM Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning Dennis had a good call with heat shrink and painting with liquid electrical tape. I took made my heat shrink about two inches longer than the connection, and injected marine silicone inside with a syringe. When the shrunk, silicone gushed out the ends. It has been wet often. Maybe I'm just lucky, but my 12 year old Rule pumps and float switches are still doing fine. I have a little 500 as the primary pump, and a big one that stays up on a platform about six inches off the bilge, just in case. The 500 does get clogged up with bilge gunk, and I just replaced it because they can't be taken apart and cleaned out. One thing I do is take a garden hose to 3/4 adapter and flush the hose out with high pressure dock water. I'll also backflush the pump with the garden hose. Most of the float switches I've seen fail are really due to bad wiring. I've seen plain crimp connections just sitting in the bilge, and it's no wonder the wire rots out. The worst, if you can believe it, was just wires twisted together and covered with electrical tape. No kidding. I found that down here in Mexico, as the sport fishing boat was sinking at the dock. The guy came back to town, and when I told him that I'd saved his boat he didn't even say thanks. Power boaters. (It probably didn't help that I said whoever did the wiring ought to be taken out and shot.) Wal you CnC-List wrote: I ran a rule float switch to one which failed that first year. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
Thanks for all the advice. This is a great resource (thanks Stu). I've read some of this info scanning different online sites - but this list gives quick feedback on how and why. That Whale sub pump is exactly the one I was looking at. Plus a switch. I will take the wiring advice - heat shrink and silicone etc. Any thoughts on the discharge? I've read some people discharge through the galley sink drain - which would keep the hose run short and easy --- but then I'd have to leave that seacock open.. The other option is to Y the discharge to the current manual pump discharge (or one of the above waterline cockpit drain hoses) - but that would need 18'+ of hose. Mark - There is no cure for birth and death save to enjoy the interval. - George Santayana On 27/05/2014 10:51 AM, Wally Bryant via CnC-List wrote: Dennis had a good call with heat shrink and painting with liquid electrical tape. I took made my heat shrink about two inches longer than the connection, and injected marine silicone inside with a syringe. When the shrunk, silicone gushed out the ends. It has been wet often. Maybe I'm just lucky, but my 12 year old Rule pumps and float switches are still doing fine. I have a little 500 as the primary pump, and a big one that stays up on a platform about six inches off the bilge, just in case. The 500 does get clogged up with bilge gunk, and I just replaced it because they can't be taken apart and cleaned out.One thing I do is take a garden hose to 3/4 adapter and flush the hose out with high pressure dock water. I'll also backflush the pump with the garden hose. Most of the float switches I've seen fail are really due to bad wiring. I've seen plain crimp connections just sitting in the bilge, and it's no wonder the wire rots out. The worst, if you can believe it, was just wires twisted together and covered with electrical tape. No kidding. I found that down here in Mexico, as the sport fishing boat was sinking at the dock. The guy came back to town, and when I told him that I'd saved his boat he didn't even say thanks. Power boaters. (It probably didn't help that I said whoever did the wiring ought to be taken out and shot.) Wal you CnC-List wrote: I ran a rule float switch to one which failed that first year. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
Mark, the Whale I noted has a built in switch. Rich On May 27, 2014, at 18:35, Dr. Mark Bodnar via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: Thanks for all the advice. This is a great resource (thanks Stu). I've read some of this info scanning different online sites - but this list gives quick feedback on how and why. That Whale sub pump is exactly the one I was looking at. Plus a switch. I will take the wiring advice - heat shrink and silicone etc. Any thoughts on the discharge? I've read some people discharge through the galley sink drain - which would keep the hose run short and easy --- but then I'd have to leave that seacock open.. The other option is to Y the discharge to the current manual pump discharge (or one of the above waterline cockpit drain hoses) - but that would need 18'+ of hose. Mark - There is no cure for birth and death save to enjoy the interval. - George Santayana On 27/05/2014 10:51 AM, Wally Bryant via CnC-List wrote: Dennis had a good call with heat shrink and painting with liquid electrical tape. I took made my heat shrink about two inches longer than the connection, and injected marine silicone inside with a syringe. When the shrunk, silicone gushed out the ends. It has been wet often. Maybe I'm just lucky, but my 12 year old Rule pumps and float switches are still doing fine. I have a little 500 as the primary pump, and a big one that stays up on a platform about six inches off the bilge, just in case. The 500 does get clogged up with bilge gunk, and I just replaced it because they can't be taken apart and cleaned out.One thing I do is take a garden hose to 3/4 adapter and flush the hose out with high pressure dock water. I'll also backflush the pump with the garden hose. Most of the float switches I've seen fail are really due to bad wiring. I've seen plain crimp connections just sitting in the bilge, and it's no wonder the wire rots out. The worst, if you can believe it, was just wires twisted together and covered with electrical tape. No kidding. I found that down here in Mexico, as the sport fishing boat was sinking at the dock. The guy came back to town, and when I told him that I'd saved his boat he didn't even say thanks. Power boaters. (It probably didn't help that I said whoever did the wiring ought to be taken out and shot.) Wal you CnC-List wrote: I ran a rule float switch to one which failed that first year. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
you wrote: Any thoughts on the discharge? Yes, beyond a shadow of a doubt I would put the discharge output above the waterline at any point of sail at any time. All of mine are just below the toe rail aft. They have been underwater, but that was my mistake. There was one time when I had a passenger on board who honestly weighed about 300 pounds, and that really messed up the lines. He was an 'expert' and invited himself onto my boat after I rebuilt the rig. I hear he now sails a trawler. I have a check valve on the little 500 pump. I can honestly say that I'd rather have a check valve than not have one. The hose run is long, but it's better than a siphon when the rails are under water. To be honest, I've learned that my boat sails best when the rails are about 8-14 inches off the water. So I manage my sails appropriately. But, really, Gotta go. My stereo just blasted out Jimmy B's 'why don't we get skunked and draw' followed by Joan Jetts cover of Tommy James and the Shondells's Crimson and Clover. And I still can't find the darn remote to turn it off. And I met this woman today who swore she knew a better brand of tequila than the one I've been nursing for the last 25 years. I don't believe it, but heck, there's always a chance. Wal ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
Rich, Thanks for the heads up. I was just online tonight looking at bilge pumps. My CS 30 doesn't have an automatic bilge pump, just a manual. I feel like I should add an automatic pump, but I wonder what size. My boat has a very flat bilge with no 'deep' spots at all and maybe 4 space under the floor boards. What size bilge pump is appropriate? (And will fit) Suggestions? Would you the the 'integrated electronic' switch or the old fashioned float? And suggestions on installation? I gather I should have it pump out near the transom above water level (maybe Y it onto the drain from the manual pump?) Do you 'direct wire' it to the batteries and bypass the panel? Mark On 26 May 2014 23:34, Rich Knowles via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: My bilge pump and I had a small altercation this weekend. It’s a 2000 gph PAR unit that I have had on the boat for at least 10 years. It has never given me problems until it recently decided not to pump any water. The motor ran just fine, and I could see the water in the bilge being stirred around, but nothing was being sent overboard. It acted as though it had an airlock with the impeller only partially submerged. I dismantled it and found that the small slit that acts as an air vent at the top of the plastic impeller housing was completely plugged. This prevented any trapped air from escaping from the pump body. Once I cleaned the crud out of the vent slit, it performed as new. Good for another ten years, thank you. Just a note to tuck away in case anyone has a similar “failure”. Rich Knowles INDIGO LF38 Halifax, NS. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Bilge pump installation - was Re: Bilge Pump Cleaning
Mark, Rich may offer a different solution but here's how I generally install a bilge pump. Get the biggest Rule pump that will fit the space and a separate Rule float switch, either the Rule-a-Matic or the Superswitch. If you want a better float switch and it will fit, get the USS Ultra Pumpswitch mini. Coat all connections below with TefGel. Really important in the bilge. Install a Rule Model 43 rocker switch in a convenient but out of the way location. Wire the switch's positive to one of the battery cables on the back of your battery switch (not the common, the one marked #1 or #2) and the negative to ground (for the indicator light). By connecting to the #1 or #2 connection, you're essentially connecting to one of the batteries. As a rule, I don't like to connect directly to a battery inside the battery box. Run the Model 43's auto connection to one side of the float switch. Connect the other side of the float switch and the Model 43's manual connection both to the brown wire (+) on the bilge pump. Make sure the connection is in a dry place, heat shrink it and coat it with liquid electrical tape. Connect the pump's black wire to ground. Make sure to put a loop in the discharge hose. Dennis C. Touche' 35-1 #83 Mandeville, LA On Mon, May 26, 2014 at 10:18 PM, M Bod via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.comwrote: Rich, Thanks for the heads up. I was just online tonight looking at bilge pumps. My CS 30 doesn't have an automatic bilge pump, just a manual. I feel like I should add an automatic pump, but I wonder what size. My boat has a very flat bilge with no 'deep' spots at all and maybe 4 space under the floor boards. What size bilge pump is appropriate? (And will fit) Suggestions? Would you the the 'integrated electronic' switch or the old fashioned float? And suggestions on installation? I gather I should have it pump out near the transom above water level (maybe Y it onto the drain from the manual pump?) Do you 'direct wire' it to the batteries and bypass the panel? Mark On 26 May 2014 23:34, Rich Knowles via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: My bilge pump and I had a small altercation this weekend. It’s a 2000 gph PAR unit that I have had on the boat for at least 10 years. It has never given me problems until it recently decided not to pump any water. The motor ran just fine, and I could see the water in the bilge being stirred around, but nothing was being sent overboard. It acted as though it had an airlock with the impeller only partially submerged. I dismantled it and found that the small slit that acts as an air vent at the top of the plastic impeller housing was completely plugged. This prevented any trapped air from escaping from the pump body. Once I cleaned the crud out of the vent slit, it performed as new. Good for another ten years, thank you. Just a note to tuck away in case anyone has a similar “failure”. Rich Knowles INDIGO LF38 Halifax, NS. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
