Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
On Oct 19, 2008, at 2:32 AM, Andy Lee wrote: On Oct 19, 2008, at 5:20 AM, Roland King wrote: I need a make a few icons and other graphics for my app, simple stuff like a small yellow triangle with an invisible background. I'm totally and completely graphically challenged which never helps. I can't find a simple (preferably free!) drawing program which will let me make stuff like this. What does everyone use for these things? When the time comes to replace the ugly icons in my app, I plan to try NodeBox (I doubt I'll have the money to pay someone). Daniel Jalkut got very nice results with it for his blog and for his FlexTime app, and it looks like a really fun way to learn Python while I'm at it: http://www.red-sweater.com/blog/146/blog-redesign --Andy After reading the article, I decided the same thing and downloaded a copy of NodeBox. Like Daniel Jalkut, I think that, while NodeBox has a way to go, it's very sophisticated and polished as-is. I've never really used Python before -- no knowledge of syntax or the like -- but, with some fiddling, have already come up with some cool icon ideas using it. If anyone wants some bezier path rounded rectangle code I can provide it -- for some reason, although I'm using Leopard, I'm having trouble getting Leopard's rounded rectangle bezier path methods to work with it (I suspect that it was linked to an earlier SDK, although it's equally probably that I'm making a Python-newbie mistake of some sort). Cheers, Andrew smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
I have been using Inkscape for making images for buttons. The native Inkscape file format is svg (scalable vector graphics) with a pixel canvas. I changed the canvas units to points with a size of 32 x 32 or smaller, set the grid size to one point wide, and then draw my stuff with the vector tools so that it looks correctly on the 1 x 1 point grid. I then save as a pdf (a single vector image inside) and then use the pdf directly in Interface Builder. So far it works well. The background is transparent and it renders very well at all user interface resolutions in Quartz Debug with just a single image and file. There are a few bugs in Inkscape but so far I have been able to work around them. Some of the issues seem to be perhaps related to the fact that the pixel canvas and point canvas are internally different sizes. I have a tradition mechanical draftsman type of background and so find the entire path based vector drawing paradigm and tools extremely bizarre but I am getting used to it. The primary thing I like about Inkscape is that it is free. Inkscape works natively on WindowsXP which I have been using. I also downloaded the version of Inkscape for use with Leopard and X11 yesterday. It seems to work just the same as on XP including the same bugs with the same workarounds required. If anyone with more graphics experience than myself would like to comment on the pros and cons of this approach the feedback would be welcome. Richard On Oct 19, 2008, at 3:20AM, Roland King wrote: I need a make a few icons and other graphics for my app, simple stuff like a small yellow triangle with an invisible background. I'm totally and completely graphically challenged which never helps. I can't find a simple (preferably free!) drawing program which will let me make stuff like this. What does everyone use for these things? ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
Adobe Illustrator CS3 and up has a feature called live trace which is like the old Streamline program, to trace raster images into vector format. There is also an app called Vector Magic that can vectorize images, there is a demo online somewhere. As a professional graphic designer breaking into programming, I make most of my icons with Illustrator, as almost all vector objects, then bring into Photoshop for final tweaking, at 512x512 pixel or 128x128 pixels, and then use either IconFactory's IconBuilder, or just save the PSD file with transparent background and drop into Apple IconComposer. For UI items I use .tif format, as it supports alpha channels (transparent areas), so it's suitable for buttons or just UI background items. Here's a tip- Don't rely on a photo of something as your application icon. Consider that many people will view the icon at 16x16 (list view) or 32x32. Too much detail will destroy an (application) icon's visibility at small sizes. ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
I need a make a few icons and other graphics for my app, simple stuff like a small yellow triangle with an invisible background. I'm totally and completely graphically challenged which never helps. I can't find a simple (preferably free!) drawing program which will let me make stuff like this. What does everyone use for these things? Another option to try is Opacity http://likethought.com/opacity/. You can create your icons in a vector drawing like manner and then it renders them to various sizes. Enjoy, Peter. -- Keyboard Maestro 3 Now Available! Now With Status Menu triggers! Keyboard Maestro http://www.keyboardmaestro.com/ Macros for your Mac http://www.stairways.com/ http://download.stairways.com/ ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
If you don't have skill, pay somebody to do it. Not always an option, even if desirable. For those of who do want to go with the paid route, our CocoaHeads group keeps a list of some of the Mac-oriented graphic designers we've found and/or used in the past. Feel free to register on the site and add to it: http://cocoaheads.byu.edu/wiki/graphic-artists-and-designers Dave ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
what do you use to make icons and similar?
I need a make a few icons and other graphics for my app, simple stuff like a small yellow triangle with an invisible background. I'm totally and completely graphically challenged which never helps. I can't find a simple (preferably free!) drawing program which will let me make stuff like this. What does everyone use for these things? ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
Le 19 oct. 08 à 11:20, Roland King a écrit : I need a make a few icons and other graphics for my app, simple stuff like a small yellow triangle with an invisible background. I'm totally and completely graphically challenged which never helps. I can't find a simple (preferably free!) drawing program which will let me make stuff like this. What does everyone use for these things? ___ There is Gimp. It can do whatever you need, but you may have to learn how to use it (this is not the most intuitive software I know). If you need simple graphics, you can also use the free vetor graphic editor: inkscape. What do you want to do with your images ? icns are mainly used for Desktop Icon, for other application images (toolbar, button, ..), you can use tiff that is far more versatile. If you want to create icns, just create your images in a standard format (tiff, png, etc…) and then use Icon Composer (from the Xcode tools) to create the icns version. ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
On Oct 19, 2008, at 5:20 AM, Roland King wrote: I need a make a few icons and other graphics for my app, simple stuff like a small yellow triangle with an invisible background. I'm totally and completely graphically challenged which never helps. I can't find a simple (preferably free!) drawing program which will let me make stuff like this. What does everyone use for these things? When the time comes to replace the ugly icons in my app, I plan to try NodeBox (I doubt I'll have the money to pay someone). Daniel Jalkut got very nice results with it for his blog and for his FlexTime app, and it looks like a really fun way to learn Python while I'm at it: http://www.red-sweater.com/blog/146/blog-redesign --Andy ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
forgot about GIMP, might try that. I found something called 'DrawIt', the free version of which is crippled to 5 layers but .. not really an issue for what I'm doing. What I'm creating here are some very small button icons and a few indicators, 30x30 pixels, small, with very simple shapes, that size things have to be pretty clear, not much room for fancy stuff. Gradient fill would be nice but I may just have to live without it. I believe png are really what I'm trying to make here, they seem to be recommended. Thanks for the tip. On Oct 19, 2008, at 5:37 PM, Jean-Daniel Dupas wrote: Le 19 oct. 08 à 11:20, Roland King a écrit : I need a make a few icons and other graphics for my app, simple stuff like a small yellow triangle with an invisible background. I'm totally and completely graphically challenged which never helps. I can't find a simple (preferably free!) drawing program which will let me make stuff like this. What does everyone use for these things?___ There is Gimp. It can do whatever you need, but you may have to learn how to use it (this is not the most intuitive software I know). If you need simple graphics, you can also use the free vetor graphic editor: inkscape. What do you want to do with your images ? icns are mainly used for Desktop Icon, for other application images (toolbar, button, ..), you can use tiff that is far more versatile. If you want to create icns, just create your images in a standard format (tiff, png, etc…) and then use Icon Composer (from the Xcode tools) to create the icns version. ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
I believe png are really what I'm trying to make here, they seem to be recommended. PNGs are not resolution independent, although they are perfectly acceptable. Saving as a TIFF then converting it to PDF with Preview works well for me. ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
On Oct 19, 2008, at 5:50 AM, Benjamin Dobson wrote: I believe png are really what I'm trying to make here, they seem to be recommended. PNGs are not resolution independent, although they are perfectly acceptable. Saving as a TIFF then converting it to PDF with Preview works well for me. Please excuse me if I missed something earlier in the thread, but my understanding of TIFFs (and PNGs and JPEGs) is that they're all purely raster formats. Thus, how does saving a TIFF as a PDF get you resolution independence? (At least that's what I read you to be saying.) steve ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
: I believe png are really what I'm trying to make here, they seem to be recommended. PNGs are not resolution independent, although they are perfectly acceptable. Saving as a TIFF then converting it to PDF with Preview works well for me. Please excuse me if I missed something earlier in the thread, but my understanding of TIFFs (and PNGs and JPEGs) is that they're all purely raster formats. Thus, how does saving a TIFF as a PDF get you resolution independence? (At least that's what I read you to be saying.) steve It doesn't and it cannot. PDF is only a container, that happens to support vector art well, but cannot vectorize a raster image. If you properly placed some vector art into a pdf you might be able to garner some sort of resolution independence, but it's probably not worth the effort, and definitely won't look as good in most cases as well designed/optimized icons. Until displays approach something like 300dpi or higher, like print media, our eyes will be better served by icons hand-tooled for particular sizes. Your safest bet is to make use of PNG. It supports transparency. If you need something in .icns format, make use of Icon Composer. As for drawing/painting apps, don't be cheap! If you don't have skill, pay somebody to do it. ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
On 19 Oct 2008, at 16:22:44, Steve Christensen wrote: On Oct 19, 2008, at 7:38 AM, Benjamin Dobson wrote: On 19 Oct 2008, at 15:12:09, Steve Christensen wrote: On Oct 19, 2008, at 5:50 AM, Benjamin Dobson wrote: I believe png are really what I'm trying to make here, they seem to be recommended. PNGs are not resolution independent, although they are perfectly acceptable. Saving as a TIFF then converting it to PDF with Preview works well for me. Please excuse me if I missed something earlier in the thread, but my understanding of TIFFs (and PNGs and JPEGs) is that they're all purely raster formats. Thus, how does saving a TIFF as a PDF get you resolution independence? (At least that's what I read you to be saying.) I'm not entirely sure. I saved a TIFF file from the GIMP, and yes, it does look like raster. But there is evidently more information there, as when I converted it to PDF in Preview, it saved it as a scalable format. I don't know how, but it evidently worked. So if you scale the PDF to different sizes, is the image from the TIFF always crisp (no jaggy edges, etc.)? The PDF never seems to get jaggy edges. The original TIFF file does, but the PDF remains fine. I think it depends in part on what application you use. ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
Le 19 oct. 08 à 16:32, John Joyce a écrit : : I believe png are really what I'm trying to make here, they seem to be recommended. PNGs are not resolution independent, although they are perfectly acceptable. Saving as a TIFF then converting it to PDF with Preview works well for me. Please excuse me if I missed something earlier in the thread, but my understanding of TIFFs (and PNGs and JPEGs) is that they're all purely raster formats. Thus, how does saving a TIFF as a PDF get you resolution independence? (At least that's what I read you to be saying.) steve It doesn't and it cannot. PDF is only a container, that happens to support vector art well, but cannot vectorize a raster image. If you properly placed some vector art into a pdf you might be able to garner some sort of resolution independence, but it's probably not worth the effort, and definitely won't look as good in most cases as well designed/optimized icons. Until displays approach something like 300dpi or higher, like print media, our eyes will be better served by icons hand-tooled for particular sizes. Your safest bet is to make use of PNG. It supports transparency. If you need something in .icns format, make use of Icon Composer. As for drawing/painting apps, don't be cheap! If you don't have skill, pay somebody to do it. unlike tiff, png does not support multi representations with different resolution which is the recommanded way to store raster images (vectorial images should be pdf of course). So, PNG is not recommanded. See this for details: http://developer.apple.com/documentation/UserExperience/Conceptual/HiDPIOverview/HiDPIArt/chapter_4_section_5.html ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
On Oct 19, 2008, at 9:32 AM, John Joyce wrote: It doesn't and it cannot. PDF is only a container, that happens to support vector art well, but cannot vectorize a raster image. If you properly placed some vector art into a pdf you might be able to garner some sort of resolution independence, but it's probably not worth the effort, and definitely won't look as good in most cases as well designed/optimized icons. I will disagree here. It was so worth the effort to move all my bitmapped images to vector-based artwork. I got beautiful scaling from 0.5 to 3.0x to include non-integral scaling factors. In terms of the statement cannot vectorize a raster image... Adobe Illustrator can do such a task. Until displays approach something like 300dpi or higher, like print media, our eyes will be better served by icons hand-tooled for particular sizes. It all depends upon the artwork. I think you'll find that most artwork will scale very well if vectorized. ___ Ricky A. Sharp mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Instant Interactive(tm) http://www.instantinteractive.com ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
On Oct 19, 2008, at 12:09 PM, Ricky Sharp wrote: I will disagree here. It was so worth the effort to move all my bitmapped images to vector-based artwork. I got beautiful scaling from 0.5 to 3.0x to include non-integral scaling factors. In terms of the statement cannot vectorize a raster image... Adobe Illustrator can do such a task. Illustrator has what used to be Streamline built into it, but it really is only good for stuff that should have been vector-based when it was created anyway. For instance, photographic bitmaps can't be vectorized in this way, or is there some magic new tool that I don't know about? ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: what do you use to make icons and similar?
On 20 Oct 2008, at 1:32 am, John Joyce wrote: If you don't have skill, pay somebody to do it. Not always an option, even if desirable. For a small one-man shop, consider these prices, which I received from a certain icon shop that is promoted (among several) on Apple's own site's business resources. They are possibly reasonable if you already have an established business but for a startup? Our app will probably end up needing about 200 icons overall throughout its UI. So together with the app icon we are looking at ~$105,000. That's crazy. The cost of a logo/application icon is $2500. Mac OS X toolbar icons are $525/icon and come in all the standard sizes and file formats the platform supports. Web icons: 32x32 - $262/icon 24x24 - $175/icon ___ Cocoa-dev mailing list (Cocoa-dev@lists.apple.com) Please do not post admin requests or moderator comments to the list. Contact the moderators at cocoa-dev-admins(at)lists.apple.com Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/cocoa-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
