Re:Suggestion: default /etc/resolv.conf
Brian C writes: Suggestion: The rootfs should contain a resolv.conf that lists some publicly-available dns servers so that people with new FreeRunners would have a chance of getting net access without editing that file first. Despite clear instructions on the wiki, this issue continues to cause people problems and so the question comes up constantly on the list. Much better to get resolv.conf, along with IP address, from DHCP. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Suggestion: default /etc/resolv.conf
ian douglas writes: Joe Pfeiffer wrote: Much better to get resolv.conf, along with IP address, from DHCP. Typically, I'd agree -- except the Freerunner doesn't get its IP from DHCP for the USB port, which is where pretty much all of the DNS questions come from to the list (until GRPS starts working reliably...) Yes, but I'd like it to use DHCP for its usb IP address, as well. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Suggestion: default /etc/resolv.conf
arne anka writes: Yes, but I'd like it to use DHCP for its usb IP address, as well. what stops you? the dhcp client will overwrite resolv.conf, then. This is actually a reprise of a discussion a week or so ago -- as a matter of fact, that is what I do. But, since it's not set up that way in the default /etc/network/interfaces, there's some extra pain every time I reflash. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: SanDisk micro SDHC 8GB card under testing
Andrew Bennett writes: On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 1:47 PM, ian douglas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Federico Lorenzi wrote: Makes sense, ext3 is journaled, and using a journaling FS on flash memory is generally a bad idea. Could you also try ext2? Sorry, I'm not up to speed on flash and file systems -- why is a journaled file system a bad idea? Journaled file systems perform lots of extra writes to the drive. Flash drives wear out a little quicker (in terms of writes) than other drives. Putting the two together means you're probably decreasing the length of your drive's life. Well... using an inode-based filesystem like ext2 or ext3 is a really bad idea, since you end up rewriting some of the blocks a *lot*. Journalling the metadata, as ext3 does it, does make things even worse as you say. Using a purely journalled FS like jffs2, on the other hand, is a really good idea since it's designed to avoid exactly those flaws. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: SanDisk micro SDHC 8GB card under testing
Mikko Rauhala writes: pe, 2008-07-11 kello 15:17 -0600, Joe Pfeiffer kirjoitti: Well... using an inode-based filesystem like ext2 or ext3 is a really bad idea, since you end up rewriting some of the blocks a *lot*. Journalling the metadata, as ext3 does it, does make things even worse as you say. Using a purely journalled FS like jffs2, on the other hand, is a really good idea since it's designed to avoid exactly those flaws. SD does wear-leveling. JFFS2 is redundant on those, though probably generic leveling isn't quite as efficient than what a leveling filesystem can manage on raw flash. (Slapping leveling on leveling isn't likely to improve things much, I would think...) Checking you're right. I could swear I saw early on that the whole reason jffs2 was used on the GTA01 was because SD didn't do that. So anybody know why it was used? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: rationale for ASU (and change from GTK to Qt)
Michael 'Mickey' Lauer writes: Fwiw, my take on that is @ http://www.vanille-media.de/site/index.php/2008/06/28/gtk-asu-fso-tmtla/ Very good summary -- I'd really like to see the 2007.2 stack on top of FSO... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:Community Initiative GTK
I for one definitely prefer GTK: as a toolkit I know and like it (in fairness I haven't developed for qt -- I have GTK and especially GTKmm), but in general I find I prefer the look of GTK-based apps better). I also felt the direction the phone was moving up until the ASU was looking very good and promising to me. It was much more along the lines of a handheld computer with phone featuers, which is what I want (the automatic sync with evolution was also very nice). I just noticed the other day that the scaredycat images are still based on the GTK stack -- I hope to be trying that out in the next couple of days. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: rationale for ASU (and change from GTK to Qt)
Esben Stien writes: Ron K. Jeffries [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: the rationale for the decision to switch from the original GTK based OpenMoko There will be a fork here at one point. There's a good bunch of us who wants a standard GTK+ environment as the main guis' for the phone. There's even some that don't want any QT on the phone, at all;). Sounds good to me... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:Heller versus DC
Guys, this is really, really off-topic in this forum. Please, the list traffic is heavy enough with items that are germaine, let's not get into this branch of politics ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Patent threat to OpenMoko devices?
Atilla Filiz writes: Look who are sued: Palm, Nokia, Aplle, Dell... I thought most of them were doing this for years. :P Any fisherman will tell you that you don't start reeling in when the fish first nibbles the hook, you wait until they've had time to really take a solid bite. Patent trolls work on the same theory. If they'd sent a polite bill to the first company that announced a touchscreen phone, they'd have gotten a nice tidy little royalty (assuming the patent is valid). Now, they get to demand damages and who knows what else. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:Why not use forum?
Leonti Bielski writes: Hi! I was wondering - why are we not using forum for community? It's much better to view, you can subscribe and unsubscribe to the topics you want and etc. The main Personally I don't like mailing list because it's not that comfortable and I can see no advatages of using mailing list instead of forum? Can anyone explain to me why we can't install Oh, please, no. Every forum I've tried to work with (I'll admit there have been very few) has been very pretty, but absolutely painful in terms of actually being able to follow the flow of conversation and topics. Good old fashioned text-only email works very, very well for this (arguably, IRC works even better for a really dynamic conversation). Shortly after these mailling lists were established, somebody else was complaining about the lack of a forum, and was going to create one. I don't know whatever happened to that effort... if you'd like to create a forum for openmoko discussions, you are of course more than welcome to do so. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why not use forum?
Ortwin Regel writes: Pah, mailing lists are for old people. :P Get off my lawn, youngster! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:SIM cards for Freerunner (was Free Runner price vs iphone 3G price)
ian douglas writes: Joe Pfeiffer wrote: when I went to get a sim card to use in my moko, I was unable to find one without getting a subsidized phone to go with it. TMobile did this for me in about 15 minutes at one of their stores, and I didn't even have my Neo with me at the time. I simply told them I had an unlocked international GSM-capable phone and I just needed a SIM card for it. Did you get a lower price on your contract than you would have with a phone? Yes, they would have let me pay for a subsidized phone without giving me the phone... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: SIM cards for Freerunner (was Free Runner price vs iphone 3G price)
Stroller writes: On 11 Jun 2008, at 15:44, Joe Pfeiffer wrote: Did you get a lower price on your contract than you would have with a phone? Yes, they would have let me pay for a subsidized phone without giving me the phone... Where the heck are you? To the British it is quite *obvious* that a contract without a phone is cheaper. US. To me, it's quite obvious that a contract without a phone *should* be cheaper, but that's a long way from is (it actually worked out for the best, since I've had a working phne all these months as a result). The most obvious example of this is that one can choose how much to pay up front - on can choose the phone for free with one set of tariffs, or pay £75 on purchase and get the same number of minutes for £10 a month less (on an 18-month contract, for example). One can also get much cheaper contracts when no phone purchase is involved. I haven't seen anything like that here. The plan costs what it costs; you can pay varying amounts up front for different phones. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:Dual SIM?
Adilson Oliveira writes: I'm quite sure the answer is no but as I didn't find any definitive answer for that I decided to ask: does the openmoko hardware support 2 SIM cards? Not at the same time. Only one holder. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: SIM cards for Freerunner (was Free Runner price vs iphone 3G price)
Kevin Dean writes: On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 3:33 PM, Joe Pfeiffer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: US. To me, it's quite obvious that a contract without a phone *should* be cheaper, but that's a long way from is (it actually worked out for the best, since I've had a working phne all these months as a result). I'm an American and your statement confuses me. Why is it obvious that a contract without a phone should be cheaper? The service (cellular connectivity for voice and/or data) is the same service no matter what phone you have. Because the price of the free phone is bundled into the price of the contract. If I don't get a phone, I shouldn't have to pay for one. In the US, the price of service contracts doesn't change. The price of PHONES does when you agree to commit to a service contract but the service contract doesn't. The most obvious example of this is that one can choose how much to pay up front - on can choose the phone for free with one set of tariffs, or pay £75 on purchase and get the same number of minutes for £10 a month less (on an 18-month contract, for example). One can also get much cheaper contracts when no phone purchase is involved. Not sure if you're confusing cause and effect here or if Brits just look at cellular service differently than Americans. You are implying that the contract is the monthly service of voice/data connectivity and a handset. In the US, ONLY the monthly service of voice/data connectivity is contracted. It seems to me that what you're ACTUALLY doing when you make your purchase is purchasing a phone at some price, agreeing to a service level (monthly voice/data) and then financing the cost of that device through your monthly bill. By paying the £75 up front you're simply paying for the phone and NOT paying the cost of it in installments monthly. But from how I see it the service that is purchased (voice/data connectivity) remains the same price. Not quite -- you're also committed to pay the inflated price long enough to pay for the phone, or pay for the phone under the guise of an early termination fee. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: SIM cards for Freerunner (was Free Runner price vs iphone 3G price)
This is splitting hairs at a level the attorneys I know would be embarrassed to be a part of. Kevin Dean writes: On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 6:41 PM, Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Kevin Dean wrote: I'm an American and your statement confuses me. Why is it obvious that a contract without a phone should be cheaper? The service (cellular connectivity for voice and/or data) is the same service no matter what phone you have. In the US, the price of service contracts doesn't change. The price of PHONES does when you agree to commit to a service contract but the service contract doesn't. Which part of a portion of the contract pays for you phone ... phone ISN'T FREE, YOU ARE FINANCING THE PURCHASE OF THE PHONE VIA THE CONTRACT is hard to understand? I understand that statement ENTIRELY. Now that we're done beating down straw men, where have I ONCE mentioned anything about a free phone (with the exception of the use of quoting a previous poster, in responce to his use of the term) ? I have not. The average person walks into a cellular retailer, purchases a phone (A phone that is clearly marked as costing, say $199) signs up for the two year contract and recieves a discount on the phone and begins a service subscription. So far, so good. To say that he's getting a free phone is stupid - he got a $199 phone When I signed up with T-Mobile, the market value of the phone they gave me wasn't displayed anywhere. It was described as a *free* phone. I did read the contract; if it said it anywhere, it was written in 1/2 point type around the margin like the Santa clause. as a bonus for signing up for a contractual service (a voluntary service, by the way!). Did he pay for the phone? No. What he did was reduce the phone company's profit margin by making them expend more money in order to gain him as a customer of the recurring subscription for vioce/data services. Making? I don't think so. I would have been happier if they'd reduced their profit margin the same amount by letting me walk out of the store with a naked SIM card and a lower monthly bill. Not allowing me that choice was entirely their decision. If I walk into a retail outlet for my mobile service provider, I can pay for a phone WITHOUT service - I get no credits or refunds from the cellular provider. I pay for the phone. Haven't tried it. The local stores sure don't advertise that option, and it doesn't really address whether I can buy a plan without a phone (and not pay for the phone). I can also have my OWN phone and walk into a cellular service provider and sign up for a contract of video/data service. The price I pay for that service is the same as the price paid by the person who took the discount on the phone. I am simply creating a higher profit revenue for that company in the process. And you see this as something other than being forced* to pay for the subsidized phone, without getting the phone? Your logic escapes me. *Using the term loosely. I realize nobody is forcing me to have the contract at all -- but given that I want the contract, paying the phone subsidy isn't optional. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: SIM cards for Freerunner (was Free Runner price vs iphone 3G price)
Kevin Dean writes: On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 7:35 PM, Joe Pfeiffer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Because the price of the free phone is bundled into the price of the contract. I don't think so. The only thing that changes in the deal is the profit margin of the company. The costs of the mobile carrier also indirectly include the costs of electricity but if I said I'm not buying electricity from you so I shouldn't pay the mark up from electricity I would just sound really really stupid. I'm well aware that the mobile providers pays for the phone and as a cost of doing business, charges more for their products. Well, yes, you would -- they can't offer their service if they don't buy electricity. The can offer their service without buying the phone they give me. If I don't get a phone, I shouldn't have to pay for one. Walk into T-Mobile or ATT and buy a phone and sign up for a contract. Write down how much you pay. Walk out, put that phone in your car and walk back into the store and sign up for the same contract without a phone. Write THAT price down. Compare and you'll see they're the same. That's my objection. You're not arguing you shouldn't have to pay for a phone, you're arguing that you should be allowed to dictate the level of profit someone else's company is able to make on transactions. Very close, but not exactly (I mentioned hair-splitting in my last message). They, of course, have the right to adopt any pricing strategy they want, and they've done so. I, of course, have the right to argue that their strategy is not to the interest of this particular consumer, on the grounds that they are bundling goods and services together that I feel should be separate. And I'm doing exactly that. I feel like I'm back on my high school debating team. Not quite -- you're also committed to pay the inflated price long enough to pay for the phone, And as long as that company pays taxes. And as long as that company advertises. And as long as that company complies with minimum wage laws. Well, no. Whether they comply with the law (including taxes etc) has nothing whatever to do with how long I pay my contract. One hopes that their pricing structure enables them to do that, but it doesn't appear anywhere on my bill. I am aware that when a company spends money, in order to be profitable they will reclaim those costs they will increase the price of their products. I have no problem with a company making profit. In fact, I would strongly PERFER it because companies that provide me services tend to vanish when they don't make money. Oh, yes, I want them to make money for exactly the reasons you state. I don't want to pay for more of their profits than somebody who wants a subsidized phone, however. or pay for the phone under the guise of an early termination fee. You entered into the contract of your own free will. Entering into that contract is merely claiming that your word has value. Why do you complain about agreeing to something and then being held to that agreement? The terms are stated up front, if you find them disagreeable negotiate the terms. If you can't, don't enter into the agreement. There's a couple of issues being entangled here. I don't object to anything you state in your paragraph above. I do object to the lack of the option I prefer. The termination fee covers the loss to the company's profit margin when you fail to complete your payment agreement. They do this so that it's easier for customers to get cellular service. The cost of putting up towers, hiring support staff, providing them with bathrooms, purchasing computers, hiring programmers and engineers and all of that is not small. To recoup that cost, they need to make a certain amount of money. Putting a phone in the hands of people who don't have phones ALSO costs money, and they need to ensure that if that customer fails to generate profit for them, they will not face a loss from doing business with that customer. Yes, yes, yes. I really do understand all that. It has nothing whatever to do with whether a customer really ought to be able to pay less to get a SIM card with no phone than a SIM card with phone. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Free Runner price vs iphone 3G price
Robert Taylor writes: If the moko was subsidized out of pocket expense would be less because the moko would be cheaper. Well, yes, but when I went to get a sim card to use in my moko, I was unable to find one without getting a subsidized phone to go with it. So the economics (as I faced them) were subsidized phone vs. s. p. + moko. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Top Content page view of wiki
kosa writes: I myself use Icedove, wich is some kind of Debian br fork of Firefox (somehow firefox logos and others br were not free enough and the Debian team decided br to use the source and but not the name. It was funny br they named Icedove after Firefox). Anyway, I wonder br if the engine registersnbsp; my borwser as Firefox, as br Mozilla, as Mozilla Compatible Agent o just as Icedove.br Don't you mean iceweasel? The name change wasn't debian's idea: Mozilla decided that they didn't want their trademark used without doing a review of all of debian's patches; debian didn't want to put up with that, so they changed the name. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Open Hardware
Chris Wright writes: Openmoko phones are as cheap as they are because they use commodity hardware, I'm given to understand. If you wanted a phone with open hardware, you'd probably be paying thousands for all the custom components. Plus there's testing and certification for various parts, which probably is also expensive It's doable, but it'd be harder by far than the OGP. And consider that the first card released by the OGP costs $1500, which is two or three times the cost of the more expensive commodity cards, while delivering less performance (their target is 20fps in Quake 3 at 1280x1024). See http://www.opencellphone.org/index.php?title=Main_Page for a project trying to do this. Looks like it's been a couple of years since the web page was updated, though. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Linux PDA with wifi?
geek writes: Nokia N810 internet tablet...no openmoko...but mimo...good product with community support.. But no phone, if I understand correctly. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: software load for first mfg run of Freerunner? Is ASU what ships?
steve writes: The stndard openmoko software has been frozen for RTM. a while back. Which snapshot is that? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:QT/GTK madness
elektrolott writes: I really don't understand you people. Instead of being happy that FIC sells their phones with a workable app stack so that you can actually use the phone to make phone calls and manage your contacts you rant here about toolkits although many people have made it very clear that OM supports GTK as well as QT. Well, no. I am in the category of people who have learned *enough* toolkits and would really rather not learn another one at this point, but the bigger thing is that I really liked the idea that apps were developing that would sync seamlessly with evolution. Seeing all that abandoned (unless I somehow find a *lot* more time in the near future for coding not related to my job) hurts. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:clarification of Qtopia Vs. GTK
Michael Shiloh writes: I have had some further discussions with headquarters, and have edited my blog to try to explain the new software a little better. The important facts are that the new software: * Switches the Window Manager from Matchbox to Enlightenment (E17) * Ported Qtopia to Xorg, so it is possible to run Qtopia, GTK, ELF, and Python applications all at the same time * Replaced the GTK-based basic phone suite (dialer, contacts, SMS) with ones based on Qtopia So... one thing I liked about the old suite was that I could sync to evolution with rsync. Is there a way to sync evolution to the qtopia PIM? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Alarmclock puzzle
Michael Shiloh writes: Way off-topic, but the best alarm clock I've ever seen is one that shoots a little flying disc out of the top when the alarm goes off. You have to get out of bed, find the disc (perhaps this would encourage my daughter to clean up her room before going to bed?), and insert it correctly in the clock in order to shut the alarm off. I laugh every time I think of this thing. Innovative, practical, and fun. Fun is not a concept that I'm able to consolidate with alarm clock... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Alarmclock puzzle
Michael Shiloh writes: Joe Pfeiffer wrote: Michael Shiloh writes: Way off-topic, but the best alarm clock I've ever seen is one that shoots a little flying disc out of the top when the alarm goes off. You have to get out of bed, find the disc (perhaps this would encourage my daughter to clean up her room before going to bed?), and insert it correctly in the clock in order to shut the alarm off. I laugh every time I think of this thing. Innovative, practical, and fun. Fun is not a concept that I'm able to consolidate with alarm clock... Oh lighten up. Imagine this: That was actually intended as a humorous ironic remark... You've been up until 2am packing, you had to wake up at 5:45 to get an early morning flight, the airport shuttle is outside honking its horn, the baby is crying, and the dog just chewed up little plastic disc from the alarm clock. What's not fun about that? The part about me telling my wife I can't turn off the alarm, gotta go, bye? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: microSD support
Crane, Matthew writes: Yea, I got the 32 number from another wikipedia page, I didn't infer it from the name. I don't think it has much really to do with 32bits either for that matter, likely the 32 was entirely a marketing distinction. No, the 32 means that the FAT entries are 32 bits (in contrast to the earlier FAT aka FAT12 and FAT16 filesystems). But that doesn't matter, the important thing here is that Micro$oft sucks. That's a separte issue :) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: A few questions about the games
ian douglas writes: There's another real-world game involving getting a marble through a maze without dropping through holes by tilting the maze-board to get the marble to the end of the maze. http://www.amazon.com/none-CAR190-Labyrinth/dp/B0ISLL Sounds like it'd be a good game for accelerometers... That would be *awesome*. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Marble Maze (was: Re: A few questions about the games)
ian douglas writes: Joe Pfeiffer wrote: http://www.amazon.com/none-CAR190-Labyrinth/dp/B0ISLL Yeah, that's exactly the game I'm thinking of. I imagine implementing the physics of it (roll the ball faster the more you tilt) might be a bit tricky, but completely possible. We'd also have to allow for skill level / gravity level, etc. Could be a lot of fun to build (and play!). For the first time I'm wishing I'd waited for Freerunner! The physics would be trivial. The accelerometer outputs could be used directly as force on the ball; just have tuneable friction and elasticity bouncing off the walls. I'll have a look around, see if I can find an existing game -- no sense reinventing the wheel when all we're adding to it is accelerometer controls instead of buttons etc. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Marble Maze
ian douglas writes: That's a pretty slick video. I was thinking more of a top-down view of the wooden board that Joe sent the Amazon link for, since the Freerunner won't have the same slick 3D graphics that the Wii has ;o) Absolutely -- the top-down view would add an incredible sense of realism to it. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Stylus Recommendation
steve writes: haha. this will make you laugh. Not if you're a fisherman... though I've got rod holders I like a lot better. Like this in miniature mounted vertically on the back panel. backwoods geek! http://www.rodmounts.com/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Stylus Recommendation
Michael Shiloh writes: How about a stylus holder for the rear window of your pickup truck? It's jest a real BIG stylus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:Wrong Mini-USB-Jack
thomasg writes: In IRC we were wondering why the Freerunner, being a USB-OTG-Host (according to the OTG spec), Will Freerunner be OTG? NEO could do either host or device, but didn't follow OTG spec to do it. only has a USB Mini-B interface (black jack). This means that only USB-Mini-B cables can be used in that jack, what causes that USB-OTG cables can't be used. The Freerunner is clearly a device that should have a Mini-AB port (grey jack), means it can be used as a client (over standard Mini-B plugs) or as a OTG-Host (over standard Mini-A plugs). According to the wiki, it will have a Mini-AB ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:Wrong Mini-USB-Jack
Mark writes: This is a problem with the Nokia Internet Tablets as well. The main feature of the USB-OTG spec is that it *automatically* puts the device in host mode when the cable is inserted. (OTG compliant devices also allow swapping host peripheral modes at any time during the connection, but I haven't yet seen any examples where that's particularly useful. There's also a USB power control aspect, but again the usefulness in actual practice is limited.) As the Mini A to standard A female adapters/cables are difficult to find (Mini B to standard A female are much more common), I just spliced together a couple of cables I had lying around to make my own adapter cable. It works like a charm. I have to change to host or OTG mode manually, but that's no big deal. USB-OTG devices should work fine as a standard USB peripheral. Just as a clarification -- do you mean host vs. OTG, or host vs. device? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Quikwriting
Marco Trevisan (Treviño) writes: Mhmhmh I've tried the two demos (with mouse, of course), but I've some problems in writing on it... Expecially some lateral chars aren't writtable to me... To write a c, for example, I've to make many tries, and I guess they should be really more using a finger. I've read no docs, where am I wrong in? No idea -- it's worked great for me ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: accelerometer thought
Ortwin Regel writes: On 4/11/08, Michael 'Mickey' Lauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Friday 11 April 2008 03:12:45 Joe Pfeiffer wrote: It occurred to me as I was thinking about use cases that a setting in which the phone would be on vibrate while vertical (as in clipped to my belt) and ring when horizontal (as in lying on a table) would suit my typical use about 99% of the time. Hehe, that's amazing. So simple and effective. Same here -- what do the others think? Good idea as long as it's easy to turn it off. Being able to change ring/volume/vibrate settings easily is vital, no matter what they are. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: accelerometer thought
Tim Shannon writes: Sounds like a good idea, except for people who carry their phone in a bag, but definitely useful as an option nonetheless. Sure -- I was careful to say *my* use! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:Synchronization
ramsesoriginal writes: This topic was discussed a while ago, and I didn't heard anything about it since then (but since I missed a month or two it can already be clear by now.. I for myself don't know). I am speaking about the synchronization between the phone and other devise, could it be PC, a MAC, another phone, or even just Google calendar. Which way of synchronization has been chose? Which standards? Are there some branded or at least recommended clients? _What_ can be synchronized: contacts? calendar? rss feeds? GPS data? files? Sorry for the unclear questions and the bad English, I hope I made my question clear.. best regards, Stefan Insam I've synced anything I've wanted to (going to/from a linux box) using 'rsync -auv' ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
accelerometer thought
It occurred to me as I was thinking about use cases that a setting in which the phone would be on vibrate while vertical (as in clipped to my belt) and ring when horizontal (as in lying on a table) would suit my typical use about 99% of the time. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
Diego Fdez. Durán writes: On Tue, April 8, 2008 18:02, Joe Pfeiffer wrote: Andy Green writes: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | On ti, 2008-04-08 at 16:02 +0100, Andy Green wrote: | I think you're right, but just a thought if you could issue ready-coded | GSM codec frames, you can put the data direct in there for 1KBytes/sec | | Yeah, but you can't. can't is pretty strong... isn't not without seriously hacking something around better? If I understand the limitation correctly, in this case, I think hacking something around involves hacking at least firmware and quite possibly hardware inside the gsm modem. That's close enough to can't that the difference really doesn't matter. Can't you initiate a voice call between to FreeRunners and then use the mic and mixer devs to modulate the data as sound? Yes -- but that's the technique with the claimed limitation of roughly 1Kbps. It isn't inserting the raw gsm codec frames. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Hardware update
Alexander Frøyseth writes: Soo 400/500 MHz is no more? I've never heard any projection that openmoko was ever going to run on 400 or 500 MHz -- in fact, I'd never heard of that GSM band, and googled to find it! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:USB 2.0 insted of USB 1.1
Alexander Fr?yseth writes: Why is it USB 1.1 on the neo, and not USB 2.0? It is cheaper to buy a USB 2.0 cable, than a card reader. The processor on the neo isn't able to support 2.0. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: USB 2.0 insted of USB 1.1
Sebastian Billaudelle writes: There is no such thing as an USB 2.0 cable. It is called USB cable. There is no difference between a cable used for USB 1.0, 1.1 or 2.0. Yes, there is! With USB 1.x you afaik can use longer cables! But normally you are right. For normal use there is no difference! No, there isn't. Same cables, same max length. It's entirely likely that a longer non-compliant cable would actually work with 1.1 speeds than 2.0 speeds, but that's a different question. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: support win mobile
Paolo Cavallini writes: Vincent ha scritto: Excellent! While I thought the Neo was an excellent device, I didn't quite like the openness of the OS. You know, it adds security risks and stuff. ?? Congratulations -- you got one! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:Congratulations Harald!
Well deserved by both recipients! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:NXP free their PMU user manual/datasheet for OM community
Fantastic! This is really great news. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Application idea: Bicycle computer
Andy writes: Carbon Fiber can also be conductive and can create a Faraday cage, so be careful! I'm actually trying to remember if I've ever seen transparent carbon fiber... ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: FAX2PDF with OpenMoko?
Nick Guenther writes: On Tue, Feb 26, 2008 at 12:02 PM, kenneth marken [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tuesday 26 February 2008 17:46:28 Tilman Baumann wrote: Nils Faerber wrote: Fax is dead. yep, instead one should start to see printers with a built in mailing system so that one could assign a mail address to it, and have it auto-print said mail, complete with attachments of it came in pdf or odf... Or you know.. we could just use email, like we already do, and save the paper. I seem to recall having seen a scanner that does the much-more-useful other direction: scan a document and it sends it in (some format I don't remember) as an email. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:Wiki - organising by end user type - Wiki Personas
I'd guess Chris Casual doesn't hate the command line, he or she isn't aware that there is a command line. The Chrises of the world don't really expect a good user manual, they expect to not need one. JW writes: Hi All Do you have comments about the Wiki Personas now described here? http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Personas JW ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Patents and OpenMoko
Nils Faerber writes: Isn't this already a problem? From what I know especially in the US patent system you are *forced* to actively defend your patent, i.e. if you get to know that someone uses your patent and is not paying you roayalties (or you get an alternative commercial advantage like cross licensing) you have to sue him. If you do not do so the patent can be revoked. IANAL, but -- no. You seem to be confusing patents with trademarks -- you can lose a trademark by failing to actively defend it; a patent can't be revoked on those grounds (now, if you let somebody use your patent for a decade before you sue them, you could end up getting far less damages than you would have otherwise. But that's a different issue than losing the patent). And you have to collect royalties since the patent system only cares about businesses, i.e. the sole purpose of patents is to make money from it. Not using it to make money by either sublicensing or self-use of the IP will constitue non active use of the patent and is also a reason for revocation. Again, no. There is no requirement that you charge royalties. So even if you have the intend of not sueing you might be forced to either sue others and/or collect license fees. The expressed intend not to make money from the patent could already be a reason for not accepting it. So imagine someone else using the OpenMoko software on another device with some of your patented parts in it. You would be forced to sue this person/company/whatever. This is not what we you/we want. It's also not the law. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Patents and OpenMoko
Jonathan Spooner writes: So you want to patent any unique tech in the neo to prevent some scum from patenting your ideas then taking openmoko to court? Then just do it! Its in everyones interest not to see openmoko taken down so I'd imagine anyone here with an ounce of sense would not have a bad word to say about that. Its really that simple, is it not? No, it's not. Simply releasing information publicly establishes prior art that prevents patenting by others (well, valid patents). The idea here is to set up an ability to defend against other companies with valid patents that are inadvertently infringed: whoops, didn't realize, sorry. Say, if you want royalties from us, let's have a chat about our patent X which you're infringing while we're at it... Patenting ideas and joining the Patent Commons seems like a really good way of establishing that you're simply trying to protect yourself in today's reality, not trying to profit by the broken system. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: support for using yyyy-mm-dd (2008-01-31) date format in Wiki and elsewhere
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: How about insted of worrying about the way it's encoded we just write it January 1, 2008. I think that's pretty much standard. In the US, it's standard. Pretty much any other place in the world, it's non-standard. The ISO representation is standard (by definition), people really have no excuse to get confused by it, and sorting on ISO-format dates just works. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:New to OpenMoko
Barry Steele writes: I am looking on the Openmoko site, but I would really appreciate any advice. Take a look at the instructions at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Flashing_openmoko (I noticed several people told you to flash it, but I didn't notice anybody telling you how!) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: New to OpenMoko
Lorn Potter writes: andy selby wrote: u, better programming API? ;) No, openmoko uses GTK. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Michael Shiloh writes: Now what would a steampunk phone look like? I really, really like what might be a called a restrained steampunk style. Something like the existing black/silver case, with a wood veneer in place of black and brass-bound for the silver. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Videos and pictures of Neo FreeRunner at CES:
Schmidt András writes: You are absolutely right! I couldn't catch any meaning of the post. Maybe the guy who wrote it should have some mental treatment. Or is it funny? Looking at some other takezero.net posts, they all read like that. Some of them (like http://takezero.net/3g-and-mobile-news/eco-friendly-next-generation-mobile-homes) look like they might have come out of a really bad automatic translator -- the phrase river State University (MSU) sounds like Mississippi (both a river and a state in the US) got translated... ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: noise while making a phone call: hardware or software?
What exactly do you mean by noise? I've noticed an objectionable hum; is that it? (just finding out what's been reported -- no, I don't have a fix) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Case Schematics
Gabriel Ambuehl writes: On Wednesday 26 December 2007 21:11:18 Michael Shiloh wrote: The main reason IIRC is that some of the chips came with NDAs that prevent us from doing so. You have chips in the case? oOOOo Well, the original request was phrased strangely -- the case wouldn't *have* schematics! Presumably what was meant was dimensional drawings (which also haven't been released, for reasons that escape me). ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: usb network dongle (was Re: dhcp on usb0)
Jay Vaughan writes: The question I have about this is how do we connect USB devices to the neo? Isn't it so that the USB Host port is only on the debug board? If so, thats mighty fidgety to plug in and get set up with a USB hub and so .. I must confess I have cursed at the ribbon cable and its feeble, wimpy, connectors more than a few times since I got my neo .. No, the USB connector on the NEO is a mini-AB. That means you can connect either type of cable to it, and hardware-wise it can be either host or device. I'm not sure whether the host driver is working yet, though. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:A problem with usb networking
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I have a neo1973 and I wish I could connect it to my Laptop in order to access the internet ( I use Ubuntu 7.10 ). I followed this page on the wiki http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking but nothing... my neo won't connect to the internet! Everything seems ok but the internet connection... (what follows is for Debian Linux. If you've got another Linux, mapping this to your environment should be straightforward. If you're running Windows... oh, well). There are a bunch of things that could be happening -- in a nutshell, you need to make sure that your laptop will route appropriate packets to your NEO, and that it will forward packets. My first problem when I tried setting up networking was that my home network is 192.168.0.x, and of course the NEO wants 192.168.0.202. So the first thing I did was to edit the NEO's /etc/network/interfaces to use IP 192.168.200.202, with gateway 192.168.200.200. I also set the DNS server to 192.168.200.200. On my laptop, I edited /etc/network/interfaces to include allow-hotplug usb0 iface usb0 inet static address 192.168.200.200 netmask 255.255.255.0 So now, when a usb0 net interface is created by plugging in the NEO, the NEO and the laptop can talk to each other. I set the NEO's DNS server to be my laptop because I'm already running dnsmasq on the laptop for other reasons, and this way I don't need to reconfigure the NEO depending on whether I'm at home or at work. Next, I needed to turn on packet forwarding on the laptop. This required editing my /etc/sysctl.conf to uncomment the line net.ipv4.ip_forward=1 Finally, turning on NAT in my laptop's firewall finished the job. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: A problem with usb networking
Jay Vaughan writes: My first problem when I tried setting up networking was that my home network is 192.168.0.x, and of course the NEO wants 192.168.0.202. So the first thing I did was to edit the NEO's /etc/network/interfaces to use IP 192.168.200.202, with gateway 192.168.200.200. I also set the DNS server to 192.168.200.200. this to me looks like a settings panel target. thank you for describing it so well. maybe a little python hacking on settingsGUI could pick this up .. Something I haven't investigated -- could the NEO do dhcp? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:A problem with usb networking
If your network was 192.168.1.x to start with, you shouldn't have had to modify that. What exactly isn't working? Are you able to ping the phone from your laptop? Does your laptop have a usb0 network device after plugging in the NEO? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:A problem with usb networking
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I think so... neo's dns is 192.168.200.200 Is it wrong? Almost certainly. That's the DNS address I used, because I've got a DNS server on my laptop. You should set NEO's DNS to the same DNS as your laptop goes to. Also -- make sure you've got ip forwarding and NAT running on your laptop! ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: A problem with usb networking
Ian Darwin writes: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm able to ping the phone and my laptop, too. But I can't connect to the internet: ... We had two different responses: 1) Mickey concluded it must be resolv.conf; 2) Dr. Schaller concluded the notebook doesn't have IP forwarding turned on. There's also a 2a -- IP forwarding is turned on, but NAT isn't. I'm not sure how you'd differentiate this from 2 without a packet sniffer. (your diagnostic to tell 1 from 2 is spot-on). ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: A problem with usb networking
Jay Vaughan writes: Something I haven't investigated -- could the NEO do dhcp? yes - in fact i'm using this to avoid all the hassles with my network .. ipkg install udhcpd should give you what you need .. Thanks -- I'll have to play with that. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: need someone to develop this....
GWMobile writes: I don't think discussing this here would be considered an open disclosure. Talking on a finite list or limited membership with moderation and thus controlled membership is not necessarily open disclosure and not the same as a public printing therefore I think it would still be patentable. IANAL, but my reading is that since the archives are public, it counts as disclosure. The good news is that if somebody *else* tries to patent it in the future, there's really solid prior art! ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:Community update: GSM firmware and GPS driver
Thanks for the update -- this is very helpful! ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Gphone and 850, perspectives
Edwin Lock writes: Exactly, North America(and Canada) apparently uses 850/1800 and the rest of the world uses 900/1900. And without 850 you won't have coverage in North America in a lot of places, so practically it won't work. Lucky I like in the Netherlands:) I thought US was 850/1900, ROTW was 900/1800 (not that this affects the 850 issue, but just for completeness) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:Community update: The 850 MHz issue
Michael Shiloh writes: The chipset is capable of quad band but the board was laid out to only support 3 bands. So, 850Mhz is not supported on the GTA01 board. Instead we support 900/1800/1900MHz. How does the board layout affect the supported bands? Is it a jumper or something? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Community update: The 850 MHz issue
Michael Shiloh writes: How does the board layout affect the supported bands? Is it a jumper or something? Would that it were a jumper. Unfortunately it's much more complicated: it's a combination of circuit, components, firmware, and certification. Drat -- when firmware gets into it, it becomes problematic... ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Some feedback from using the neo as a phone for a day
Lalo Martins writes: Also spracht Kero van Gelder (Mon, 15 Oct 2007 19:03:08 +0200): I noticed that too. Maybe the panel applets process needs to run under a supervisor that will restart it? Nah, they (or one of them, since I think it's one application) should simply not crash. Supervisors add complexity that I do not desire. I beg to disagree. It's impossible to be absolutely sure it won't crash, since we're open to users installing random stuff there. And I think the complexity of a supervisor is at least trivial. Making sure the phone never becomes partially unusable is much more important to me than the tiny difference in complexity a supervisor would add. A user can certainly add something that will crash; that doesn't mean it should cause anything else to crash. Last I saw (haven't looked in a little while), the problem with the top icons wasn't that they were crashing; it's that gsmd would terminate when it decided the modem had died, and the icon bar shared memory with it. The two things this argues for are for gsmd to not terminate unless requested (including if it concludes there's no modem out there) and/or the top icons using an architecture that doesn't involve sharing memory with other applications. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:List formatting request
Doug Parker writes: Excuse my repeat request, but is there any way to add a blank newline after the SUBJECT: line in the email postings? It would make all of the lists a lot easier to scan. In a word, no -- or if it is possible, it wouldn't be a good idea. What you're asking for is special formatting of a part of the message (the headers) that really isn't formatted. In the case of my MUA (vm inside emacs), I've got two more lines of header after the Subject: line (in posts from this list). Other MUAs don't even put the headers and the body in the same buffer when it displays them. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 3G status within the US?
Tim Shannon writes: So the consensus is that the Neo won't work in the US if you just go an get a new account with ATT or T-Mobile? Mine works with a T-Mobile SIM (non 3G). ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 3G status within the US?
August (got it when my Neo arrived). Tim Shannon writes: How new is your account? On 10/8/07, Joe Pfeiffer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tim Shannon writes: So the consensus is that the Neo won't work in the US if you just go an get a new account with ATT or T-Mobile? Mine works with a T-Mobile SIM (non 3G). ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community How new is your account?brbrdivspan class=gmail_quoteOn 10/8/07, b class=gmail_sendernameJoe Pfeiffer/b lt;a href=mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED]/agt; wrote:/spanblockquote class=gmail_quote style=border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex; Tim Shannon writes:brgt;So the consensus is that the Neo won#39;t work in the US if you just go an getbrgt;a new account with ATamp;T or T-Mobile?brbrMine works with a T-Mobile SIM (non 3G).brbr___ brOpenMoko community mailing listbra href=mailto:community@lists.openmoko.org;community@lists.openmoko.org/abra href=http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community;http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community /abr/blockquote/divbr ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 3G status within the US?
ian douglas writes: The version number on my TMobile SIM is 39.01a and does NOT work. My ATT SIM is listed on the wiki within the range of serial numbers that will not work. The version number on my (working) T-Mobile SIM is 37.05A. Just another data point... ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 3G status within the US?
Though Ian's problem is with a SIM that's newer than mine... as another data point, what's the version number on yours? Jeff Andros writes: you might try swapping your sim card for one of the newer ones (somehow make it not work, I think it's like $5 to replace it and update your sim number) the one I got middle of last month works... even with the 3G fireball on it On 10/8/07, Joe Pfeiffer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ian douglas writes: The version number on my TMobile SIM is 39.01a and does NOT work. My ATT SIM is listed on the wiki within the range of serial numbers that will not work. The version number on my (working) T-Mobile SIM is 37.05A. Just another data point... ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Jeff O|||O you might try swapping your sim card for one of the newer ones (somehow make it not work, I think it#39;s like $5 to replace it and update your sim number) the one I got middle of last month works... even with the 3G fireball on it brbrdivspan class=gmail_quoteOn 10/8/07, b class=gmail_sendernameJoe Pfeiffer/b lt;a href=mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED]/agt; wrote:/spanblockquote class=gmail_quote style=border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex; ian douglas writes:brgt;The version number on my TMobile SIM is 39.01a and does NOT work. Mybrgt;ATamp;T SIM is listed on the wiki within the range of serial numbers thatbrgt;will not work.brbrThe version number on my (working) T-Mobile SIM is 37.05A.nbsp;nbsp;Justbranother data point...brbr___brOpenMoko community mailing listbra href=mailto:community@lists.openmoko.org;community@lists.openmoko.org/abra href=http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community; http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community/abr/blockquote/divbrbr clear=allbr-- brJeffbrO|||O ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: UI responsiveness, Hope its not like new Blackberry
Kyle Bassett writes: I agree. Palm OS experiences the same kind of lag in certain cases. That's really sad. One of the real strengths of the old versions of PalmOS (and the applications developed for it) was that interaction was instantaneous -- in almost all cases, what you wanted happened right away, and in the few exceptions, you were notified immediately that the app had gotten the input and would take a while to process. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: UI responsiveness, Hope its not like new Blackberry
Ben Burdette writes: That's really sad. One of the real strengths of the old versions of PalmOS (and the applications developed for it) was that interaction was instantaneous -- in almost all cases, what you wanted happened right away, and in the few exceptions, you were notified immediately that the app had gotten the input and would take a while to process. Mine has become less responsive over time, as I have added more and more data without ever deleting anything. The time lag is in some surprising places, not just where you'd expect like phone number lookup. It is disconcerting when the GUI takes over a second to respond sometimes, then seems to be ok right afterward. Interesting. Mine (an antique Samsung I300, on an equally antique Coldfire CPU) is really predictable about where the lags will be. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 3 requests/questions for Openmoko: DVB-T / Buddylist / Batman-Mesh
Michael Schmidt writes: On 9/16/07, Flemming Richter Mikkelsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can install Qt if you like, but you cannot assume that all users will do that. Qt takes a lot of space Qt is the future, would it be possible to pre-install the open libraries? Or aren t the needed classes and widgets of QT then in the gui of each app, so that the whole QT library need not ot be installed? just the app? It's a future, not necessarily the' future. I'm a very happy GTK user. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: SMedia 3362
Harald Welte writes: On Sat, Sep 01, 2007 at 04:31:00PM +0100, Giles Jones wrote: Seems like an odd choice of unit then for an open source phone. So are you claiming the open source drivers that we are writing are not open source, merely by the fact that we are writing them? Using this argument, the entire openmoko software stack would not be open source, because we are writing it. Well... not speaking for Giles, but the drivers I've seen for closed chipsets have generally involved a thin open-source wrapper around a closed binary driver. Letting you write a real open-source driver while demanding NDA to see the specs you're writing the driver to seems odd on their part (but much better than the norm!). ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:Resetting the icon theme
Igor Foox writes: When I first booted the phone after flashing the kernel + rootfs, I didn't calibrate the touch screen properly, and then when trying to mess around with the stylus I somehow managed to mess up the gnome theme. The current state is that there are no icons showing up and instead I have little icons with an 'x' in them indicating that there is no icon. Those are I couldn't find the pixmap for this icon icons. Try a reboot -- I've got absolutely no idea why, but I sometimes see the icons in that state when I boot, but then a reboot brings them up properly. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:Incorrect UPS tracking numbers?
Roland Dreier writes: I just got my Your order has shipped! email (yay!), but the UPS tracking number included showed a package signed for by Mike (not my name) in San Ramon, CA, (not where my address is). Did that happen to anyone else? I'm afraid that the last time UPS showed a package of mine as having been delivered when I hadn't gotten it... it had been delivered someplace else. They were able to track it down and get it to me the same night. If you haven't found your package on your doorstep by the time you read this, call UPS. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Where's the Micro-SD?
Brad Midgley writes: it mounts on /media/card if it has a supported filesystem (fat/ext2) Ah. The problem was I'd installed a rootfs but not a new kernel, so I didn't have any modules. New kernel - access to micro-sd. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Finger Graffiti
Giles Jones writes: Are you policing this project for violations? Look, he pointed out a potential trademark issue, which will have to be considered if some sort of ungraffiti is to be distributed. There really isn't any reason to keep going on about it. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
US: T-Mobile plans
This is addressed to people who have successfully navigated t-mobile's thicket: wouldn't it be nice if their web page gave good, complete, technical information? Anyway, my reading of their page is that to get web access on the phone I need to add their T-MobileWeb service, but I don't need their T-Mobile Internet? The latter clearly includes features I don't need: unlimited wi-fi hotspot access, for instance. But the former mumbles about the mobile internet, so I wonder if there's some filtering going on distinguishing the mobile internet from the whole thing. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: US: T-Mobile plans
Dan Trevino writes: I have their $5.99 internet plan working with my unsupported Treo 680. After reading the posts to howardforums (thanks Adam!), I have to ask: when you say it's working, does that mean you can go to an arbitrary URL and see what's there? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Where's the Micro-SD?
Not physically -- I had no problem plugging it into the phone. But where does it appear to the software? where is it in /dev? Is it automatically mounted at boot time? What's the mountpoint? Foolish question, I know... ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: US: T-Mobile plans
Nkoli writes: The only difference between T-Mobile Web and T-Mobile Internet on the phone is that T-Mobile Internet allows VPN while T-Mobile Web doesn't. You can access any arbitrary html or wap site on your phone with both plans. I've been using the cheaper plan since their t-zones unlimited days and haven't had any problems getting online. Tethering should also work with T-Mobile Web. Many, many thanks. This is *exactly* what I was looking for. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Finger Graffiti
David \Lefty\ Schlesinger writes: Graffiti (as it pertains to handwriting systems) is a registered trademark of ACCESS Systems Americas, not a generic term; you want to find some alternate terminology. Sorry, gotta point it out, it's part of my job... Much as I've liked Graffiti on my Palm... The technology I'm interested in pursuing on this device is Quikwriting. Really looks like a best-of-both-worlds to me. http://mrl.nyu.edu/projects/quikwriting/ ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Finger Graffiti
Michael Welter writes: So, who are they going to sue??? Who said anything about a lawsuit? It is their trademark; stepping on it would be really rude, no matter who they decided to go after as a result. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:3G sim cards
Harrison Metzger writes: Many people (including I) have not been able to get the att 3g sim card (the one with the 3g fireball) working in our neos. The older cingular ones do work (they are 64K smart chip). I dont care if it does 2g, I would like for my att sim card to work in the phone. According to the GSM modem it gives error CME 10 (sim card not inserted). any ideas? Many people (including I) have not been able to get the atamp;t 3g sim card (the one with the quot;3g fireballquot;) working in our neos. The older cingular ones do work (they are quot;64K smart chipquot;). I dont care if it does 2g, I would like for my atamp;t sim card to work in the phone. According to the GSM modem it gives error CME 10 (sim card not inserted). any ideas?br OK, several people have reported failure -- has anybody reported success? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: ...Order shipped: OpenMoko direct order
Krzysztof Kajkowski writes: Mine isn't shipped yet ;( Mine shipped last night. Currently between San Pablo CA and Albuquerque, NM. ETA is Monday. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: I got charged ;)
Myk Melez writes: Update: I just received a payment received message. It says they'll send out my order ASAP and will notify me again when it's been sent. Sounds like it'll go out too late for me to receive it before heading off for OSCON tomorrow afternoon, unfortunately. That would be my guess -- I got my payment received notice during the weekend, and haven't gotten a ship notice yet. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [via Slashdot] yet another alternative text input subject : Five finger keyboards
Giles Jones writes: Florent THIERY [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote : Interesting blog post when you consider the custom cases possibility: http://trevors-trinkets.blogspot.com/2007/07/five-finger-keyboards.html Always better sticking with the convention 0-9 abc def type keyboard. Anything unconventional will split people 50:50, half will love it (mostly geeks), half won't. Besides, typing numbers by holding down multiple keys just seems silly. KISS = Keep it simple stupid. I'd much sooner see OLED buttons where the text can change to suit the task. There's a *lot* of prior art in chord keyboards (as they're normally called), and they work really well in a lot of environments. I suspect I might like five nicely-spaced buttons so I could do one-handed typing on the phone. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:PRESS: Hands-on with the OpenMoko Phone
Jason Elwell writes: http://blog.wired.com/monkeybites/2007/07/hands-on-with-t.html Thanks for posting that -- certainly whetted my appetite. It's also interesting that the author of the article didn't quite understand which decisions have been made, and which are pending: he didn't seem to understand that next version *won't* have a camera (incidentally, I'm one of the people who would really like to see a camera added, but I've also got several friends who work in no-camera environments, who find trying to buy a cell phone nearly impossible these days). ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [via Slashdot] yet another alternative text input subject : Five finger keyboards
Giles Jones writes: Ian Stirling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote : I'd much sooner see OLED buttons where the text can change to suit the task. Those are quite expensive per. True, we're not talking about this model or the next. I would sooner see a limited number of adaptable keys than 5 fairly fixed ones. A key can be infinitely adaptable without OLED. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Duplicate message troubleshooting
Marco Barreno writes: On Tue, Jul 24, 2007 at 10:42:01PM +0200, thus spake Andreas Kostyrka: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Ok, putting on my Postmaster hat, could you please provide Message Ids and headers for messages from heaven.kostyrka.org that were sent duplicate? Please use private mail. Not from that domain, but I've now seen message-ID [EMAIL PROTECTED] (from inside openmoko.com, mind you!) twice. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Duplicate message troubleshooting
Joe Pfeiffer writes: Marco Barreno writes: On Tue, Jul 24, 2007 at 10:42:01PM +0200, thus spake Andreas Kostyrka: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Ok, putting on my Postmaster hat, could you please provide Message Ids and headers for messages from heaven.kostyrka.org that were sent duplicate? Please use private mail. Not from that domain, but I've now seen message-ID [EMAIL PROTECTED] (from inside openmoko.com, mind you!) twice. Now four times, unless I missed it once. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OK, the forum is coming..
Joe Friedrichsen writes: On 7/22/07, Mickael Faivre-Macon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What about creating a google group ? You can still receive each mail individually if you want, or watch it as a forum. Everybody is happy. And have the threaded view for those that want it. You can view flat as well And people who remember the term usenet can even look at it with a proper news reader. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
