Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Michael Shiloh wrote: Robin Paulson wrote: On 19/01/2008, Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: So I invite you all to help me organize this. It would be useful to create images of what's in these files, both high res and low res. It would be useful to have these files converted to other formats. Then I can figure out how to document and announce this properly. The archive is http://downloads.openmoko.org/CAD/GTA01_dimensions.zip Michael, i see these files are for the gta01. Can you tell us how similar these are to the GTA02? If they are different, will FIC/OM be releasing another set for the GTA02 at some point? Hi Robin, I'll double-check, but as I understand it the ID is identical between GTA01 and GTA02. I did check, and I was wrong. There are differences between GTA01 and GTA02. I don't know what those are exactly, but I suspect they are mostly internal. As far as I know, we do not intend to release the CAD drawings for GTA02 at this time. By the way, a friend with Pro-E is trying to convert those files for me/us. I hope to know soon what's in those files, and have some alternative formats for you all. My friend has converted those files to IGES and STEP formats. He can do convert to more formats. I'll ask him to DXF, at the very least so that I can see them with blender. We understand that information can be lost in any of these conversions, some more than others. I'll try to get the IGES and STEP formats on to downloads later today. Michael Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Robin Paulson wrote: On 19/01/2008, Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: So I invite you all to help me organize this. It would be useful to create images of what's in these files, both high res and low res. It would be useful to have these files converted to other formats. Then I can figure out how to document and announce this properly. The archive is http://downloads.openmoko.org/CAD/GTA01_dimensions.zip Michael, i see these files are for the gta01. Can you tell us how similar these are to the GTA02? If they are different, will FIC/OM be releasing another set for the GTA02 at some point? Hi Robin, I'll double-check, but as I understand it the ID is identical between GTA01 and GTA02. By the way, a friend with Pro-E is trying to convert those files for me/us. I hope to know soon what's in those files, and have some alternative formats for you all. Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
On 19/01/2008, Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > So I invite you all to help me organize this. It would be useful to > create images of what's in these files, both high res and low res. It > would be useful to have these files converted to other formats. > > Then I can figure out how to document and announce this properly. > > The archive is > > http://downloads.openmoko.org/CAD/GTA01_dimensions.zip Michael, i see these files are for the gta01. Can you tell us how similar these are to the GTA02? If they are different, will FIC/OM be releasing another set for the GTA02 at some point? thanks ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Michael Shiloh wrote: I personally look forward to non-traditional materials. I have an obsession with concrete, which I'm trying to figure out how to apply in this situation. lol.. concrete.. nice.. so a modern 'brick' phone.. :) Anyone have access to useful manufacturing tools? I have friends with CNC mills and lathes, and one with a water jet cutter. I have indirect access to 3D printers. Anything else interesting out there? I have a Roland MDX-15 machine and also a Sherline 5410 CNC Mill (less than 12 month old) and have a number of 1/16th inch end mills which are ok for fine work.. will be interested to look at the case models when they come out... Neil Davey Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- --- Neil Davey Daveytronics.com.au P.O. Box 6089 Logan Central QLD, 4114 Looking for cost effective web hosting? Need a domain name for your business? It's cheaper than you think!! Talk to us and see what we can do for you --- ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Can you generate CAM paths with Blender? That I don't know. I don't think Blender does.. although you might be able to write a plugin.. :) It's for windows, but I've been evaluating MeshCAM (http://www.grzsoftware.com/) for tool path generation from STL files and it seems ok so far, but I've only used it handful of times.. Regards Neil Davey Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- --- Neil Davey Daveytronics.com.au P.O. Box 6089 Logan Central QLD, 4114 Looking for cost effective web hosting? Need a domain name for your business? It's cheaper than you think!! Talk to us and see what we can do for you --- ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 01:33:48 +, "andy selby" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > unzip GTA01_dimensions.zip > Archive: GTA01_dimensions.zip ... > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > cat GTA01_dimensions/README.txt > This file was saved from Pro/Engineer Wildfire 3.0. > Open via gtc01-mme01.asm. > > Nothing that Blender recognises. I'd love to know what the > bluetooth-adhesive.prt.1 file contains. > Thanks a lot Michael, I'm sure they'd com in useful. > According to this page : http://5axes.free.fr/Format_Echange.htm#PROE There is nothing but ProE to open these files. Is ProE able to export in STEP (standard) format ? -- Steven Le Roux [EMAIL PROTECTED] xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
[EMAIL PROTECTED] > unzip GTA01_dimensions.zip Archive: GTA01_dimensions.zip creating: GTA01_dimensions/ inflating: GTA01_dimensions/_2in1_hinge_asm.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/_gbsa-100a.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/_p06.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/_v_l_any.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/antenna-bluetooth-wavefar.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/antenna_pcb_any.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/antenna_pcb_cover_any.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/batt-conn-octek-03jax.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/battery-1200mah-welldone.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/black.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/bluetooth-adhesive.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/bluetooth-delta-assy.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/bluetooth-delta.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/btc-024_any.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/COPYING.txt inflating: GTA01_dimensions/ct0gps-a-mpm1.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/ct0gps-a-msk1-0.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/curv.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/dsc20-14xxx00_asm_3.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/dsc20-14xxx1x_af0_asm_1.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/dsc20-pcb_1.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/fpc-39p-hrs.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/fpcb-bluetooth-delta.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gbsa-100a.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gbsa-100a_any.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gps-ant-conn.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gps-ant-ext-25109.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gps-ant-ext-conn.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gps-ant-ext-mmcx-plug.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gps-ant-ext-plug-s.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gps-antenna-ciro-15x15.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gsm-ant-bottom.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mah01.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mah02.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mcb01.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mcf01.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mcs01-rf-frame.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mcs01-rf.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mcs02-rf-cover.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mcs03-gps.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mcs06-bb-frame.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mcs06-new-bb.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mcs07-bb-cover.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mfm01.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mgs01.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mgs02.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mkt01.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mkt02.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mms01.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mpb01.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mpf01.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mptf01.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-msh01.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-msh02.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-a-mtx01.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/gtc01-mme01.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/housing__w___any.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/i-dsc20-a14xx0_af0_1.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-ear-deco.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-earjack.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-emergency-key-0609.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-front-deco.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-front-pre.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-front-ring.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-front.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-gps-preliminary.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-gps.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-lens-pre.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-lens.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-middle-ekey-0609.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-middle-pre.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-middle-spk-opining-mdfy.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-middle.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-power-key.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-rear-deco.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-rear-pre.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-rear-ring.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-rear.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-sd-cov.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-speaker-deco.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-stacking.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/id-gtc-usb-cov.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/lcm-28-slim-toppoly.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/mic-d4-smd-aac.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/microsd-card_1.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/miniusm-2ubmb01-singatron-a.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/mm8430-2600b.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/p06.asm.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/pad__w___any.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/patch_da15_any.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/phonejack-jar02062101-unconn.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/phonejack-tg286d.prt.1 inflating: GTA01_dimensions/pin__w___any.prt.1 inflating: G
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Robin Paulson wrote: On 18/01/2008, Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I am preparing the right place to put the files. I have a question: "case schematics" is the wrong name. What is the right name? "CAD Files"? "ID CAD Files"? "CAD Drawings"? Someone in the field help me out here. they are CAD files yes, but the name needs to reflect their purpose and content, i.e. what they are CAD files of. i think 'case schematics' is fine, but i would say that, since i chose it (i'm a draughtsman by the way) maybe something from the following: what are they of? the case/body/housing what are they? drawings/models/schematics/layout/diagrams i'm sure whatever you choose will be fine A zip archive of our CAD/case schematics/dimensional drawings files is available. I can't tell for sure what's in them, because I don't have access to ProE. So I invite you all to help me organize this. It would be useful to create images of what's in these files, both high res and low res. It would be useful to have these files converted to other formats. Then I can figure out how to document and announce this properly. The archive is http://downloads.openmoko.org/CAD/GTA01_dimensions.zip Feedback is always welcome, Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: R: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
On Jan 18, 2008 2:47 AM, Michele Manzato <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Having used it for some time, my impression is that Blender is a 3d modeler > which is very much focussed on rendering, while other aspects of 3d design > are weak (e.g. keeping control over measurement - no quotation lines). > > The user interface is unconventional, it is based on a coordinated use of > keyboard + mouse takes some time to get used to - actually, I was never able > to master it properly. > > If one wants to do serious CAM then one is better off with something else. > Or perhaps export from blender e.g. to autocad. But it is perfectly ok to > test conceptual designs. That was my impression of blender too; I figured a real CAD package would be better, but there were no good options last time I looked. BRLCAD wasn't completely free - you had to send a physical letter to whatever gov't department that was, to state that you are a US citizen, and promise not to export the software, or something like that. It's good if one can just download and use it now. I will have to try it. I have some experience with Autocad but it was a long time ago (version 10 mostly), and it's so expensive to get a modern version. I'd like to try SolidWorks too, but that's even worse - it's not affordable at all unless you make your living with it. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
R: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Having used it for some time, my impression is that Blender is a 3d modeler which is very much focussed on rendering, while other aspects of 3d design are weak (e.g. keeping control over measurement - no quotation lines). The user interface is unconventional, it is based on a coordinated use of keyboard + mouse takes some time to get used to - actually, I was never able to master it properly. If one wants to do serious CAM then one is better off with something else. Or perhaps export from blender e.g. to autocad. But it is perfectly ok to test conceptual designs. Just my twopence. M > -Messaggio originale- > Da: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Per conto di > Michael Shiloh > Inviato: lunedì 14 gennaio 2008 20.59 > A: List for OpenMoko community discussion > Oggetto: Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available > > > > Shawn Rutledge wrote: > > On Jan 14, 2008 11:14 AM, Jeremiah Flerchinger > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> Yes, you did say they were going to try and make CAD files > available. > >> I'm happy to hear further confirmation back so soon. Hopefully it > >> won't take too much longer to get the files. DXF files > should also be fine. > >> I know of several free editors that can import these > natively or with > >> a plugin (although not all of them export dxf files). > > > > What is your favorite Linux CAD tool for actual 3D work? > > This would be excellent information to add to the wiki. > > I am not a CAD designer, but I work with many designers and > machinists. > Of course none of them are Linux users. > > I did a little research and found many commercial products > for Linux. I presume we are more interested in FOSS CAD tools. > > The one that stood out to me was Blender. It's designed for > much more, but 3D CAD is a solid part of its job. > > My girlfriend is a product designer. I gave her a Linux > computer with Blender installed in the hopes that she will > figure out how to use Blender and then teach me. Her initial > impression was that Blender is excellent for this kind of work. > > Michael > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.6/1230 - Release > Date: 17/01/2008 16.59 > > ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
On 18/01/2008, Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I am preparing the right place to put the files. I have a question: > > "case schematics" is the wrong name. What is the right name? "CAD > Files"? "ID CAD Files"? "CAD Drawings"? Someone in the field help me out > here. they are CAD files yes, but the name needs to reflect their purpose and content, i.e. what they are CAD files of. i think 'case schematics' is fine, but i would say that, since i chose it (i'm a draughtsman by the way) maybe something from the following: what are they of? the case/body/housing what are they? drawings/models/schematics/layout/diagrams i'm sure whatever you choose will be fine ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Jeremiah Flerchinger wrote: Wolgang, someone made a wiki entry at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_case_schematics, so this would likely be a good place to place the Pro-E schematics for the Neo1973. I am preparing the right place to put the files. I have a question: "case schematics" is the wrong name. What is the right name? "CAD Files"? "ID CAD Files"? "CAD Drawings"? Someone in the field help me out here. It will be a big zipfile, probably over 30MByte. Perhaps later we'll break it out so those of you with slow connections can get only what you want, but for now it's all one big file. I'll find the right place to put this. Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Thanks to Mario for the link. I'll have to try MEDUSA in the next few days. From the documentation, it looks like it may be like BRLCAD and require a copy of ProE for the coversion (hopefully not), but we'll have to wait & see unless someone already knows for sure. I'm glad to see a decision has been made regardless. Wolfgang & the OpenMoko team will give us files in the same format they use, insuring no degradation of dimensional information between them & us, and I'm sure we can find some programs & people that can convert the files from there. We can at least try. Getting the files like this should at least speed up the process for the OpenMoko team. Wolgang, someone made a wiki entry at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_case_schematics, so this would likely be a good place to place the Pro-E schematics for the Neo1973. Jeremiah Wolfgang Spraul wrote: Mario - thanks, that is good to see. After long discussions, we have settled on releasing the files in Pro/E .asm/.prt format, the same as used by our mechanical engineers. Zero loss of fidelity. Highest quality. Expect to see more from Michael soon. Thanks again for the link. Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 10:33 PM, Rogen, Mario wrote: I did not follow the whole discussion but today i've read about a CAD Software which is free for personal use and i think it is able to read/import? Pro-E files: http://www.medusa4.com/index.php?screen=1.3&ziel=Products-MEDUSA&land=co m maybe someone knows more details? Best regards Mario -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Wolfgang Spraul Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 1:29 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: List for OpenMoko community discussion Subject: Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available Jeremiah - thanks for the detailed information, it is indeed very helpful. The file format is the last open question. We have been looking into it the whole day. We are concerned that we release a file that will not be really useful for the purpose we are trying to achieve - allow for custom cases, case addons, mods. Our internal engineers use Pro/E Wildfire 3.0. They believe an export to DXF would severely limit the ability to use the file in an actual custom case project. Of course it may be that they are just most familiar with Pro/E. So at the moment I am leaning towards releasing the GTA01 case design in the original Pro/E format (.asm/.prt), with zero loss in fidelity. That would also make it easier for us in the future to release more such data, because our engineers could make sure the files we are releasing are really high quality and useful data, rather than as a last step exporting to a format they never use, and hope the exported file is still useful. It would probably be posted as an attachment in our wiki (about 70 MB). If someone can do a conversion to a more open format as part of a real project, and thus keep the quality/usability of the file intact, that would be great! What do you think? Regards, Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 1:57 PM, Jeremiah Flerchinger wrote: Wolfgang Spraul wrote: Jeremiah - thanks for the information, that is indeed very helpful. Your list includes DXF, that was the preference before. I am concerned that the export process will corrupt the file and we release a file that will be painful to actually use. From the formats you listed (Wavefront, DXF, STL), which is your preference? Which one do you believe is a format where Pro/E can export all information into, without loosing much? I'm not very familiar with internal structure/format of DXF files, but have written software that uses STL and Wavefront files. I'll answer to the best of my knowledge. The most information would be lost with STL files. DXF files would likely loose the least information and Wavefront would be somewhere between. This is dependent on how good the converters in ProE are. Often only the most basic features of the Wavefront format are implemented in applications and a surface description equal to or only slightly better than a STL file is achieved. This could also apply to DXF files, depending on the quality of the converter and the app that reads them in, but I bet the converter in ProE is pretty good. One issue is there are many versions of the DXF file format. A quick search shows Blender supports a subset of objects up to DXF version 2007. Art of Illusion only loads from ASCII DXF files and is limited to vertex information. Of course as long as the conversion is good & loads well for a couple apps, we could do additional conversions on our own. I believe an ASCII DXF format would be more accurate for most people and lose the least amount of information in the conversion. There may be fewer version compatibility issues with Wavefront files,
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Mario - thanks, that is good to see. After long discussions, we have settled on releasing the files in Pro/ E .asm/.prt format, the same as used by our mechanical engineers. Zero loss of fidelity. Highest quality. Expect to see more from Michael soon. Thanks again for the link. Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 10:33 PM, Rogen, Mario wrote: I did not follow the whole discussion but today i've read about a CAD Software which is free for personal use and i think it is able to read/import? Pro-E files: http://www.medusa4.com/index.php?screen=1.3&ziel=Products-MEDUSA&land=co m maybe someone knows more details? Best regards Mario -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Wolfgang Spraul Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 1:29 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: List for OpenMoko community discussion Subject: Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available Jeremiah - thanks for the detailed information, it is indeed very helpful. The file format is the last open question. We have been looking into it the whole day. We are concerned that we release a file that will not be really useful for the purpose we are trying to achieve - allow for custom cases, case addons, mods. Our internal engineers use Pro/E Wildfire 3.0. They believe an export to DXF would severely limit the ability to use the file in an actual custom case project. Of course it may be that they are just most familiar with Pro/E. So at the moment I am leaning towards releasing the GTA01 case design in the original Pro/E format (.asm/.prt), with zero loss in fidelity. That would also make it easier for us in the future to release more such data, because our engineers could make sure the files we are releasing are really high quality and useful data, rather than as a last step exporting to a format they never use, and hope the exported file is still useful. It would probably be posted as an attachment in our wiki (about 70 MB). If someone can do a conversion to a more open format as part of a real project, and thus keep the quality/usability of the file intact, that would be great! What do you think? Regards, Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 1:57 PM, Jeremiah Flerchinger wrote: Wolfgang Spraul wrote: Jeremiah - thanks for the information, that is indeed very helpful. Your list includes DXF, that was the preference before. I am concerned that the export process will corrupt the file and we release a file that will be painful to actually use. From the formats you listed (Wavefront, DXF, STL), which is your preference? Which one do you believe is a format where Pro/E can export all information into, without loosing much? I'm not very familiar with internal structure/format of DXF files, but have written software that uses STL and Wavefront files. I'll answer to the best of my knowledge. The most information would be lost with STL files. DXF files would likely loose the least information and Wavefront would be somewhere between. This is dependent on how good the converters in ProE are. Often only the most basic features of the Wavefront format are implemented in applications and a surface description equal to or only slightly better than a STL file is achieved. This could also apply to DXF files, depending on the quality of the converter and the app that reads them in, but I bet the converter in ProE is pretty good. One issue is there are many versions of the DXF file format. A quick search shows Blender supports a subset of objects up to DXF version 2007. Art of Illusion only loads from ASCII DXF files and is limited to vertex information. Of course as long as the conversion is good & loads well for a couple apps, we could do additional conversions on our own. I believe an ASCII DXF format would be more accurate for most people and lose the least amount of information in the conversion. There may be fewer version compatibility issues with Wavefront files, but DXF readers can also often read newer files than they were designed for at a lower level of detail. Jeremiah Thanks, Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 10:37 AM, Jeremiah Flerchinger wrote: I don't think ProE by itself is suitable, especially since you need a copy of ProE even to import it to BRLCAD. I myself would suggest Wavefront (.obj), ASCII DXF (.dxf), or STL (.stl) file. All are standard formats & should be in ProE and any other 3D editor. Instructions for converting from ProE to STL are as follows: ProE * File > Export &g
RE: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
I did not follow the whole discussion but today i've read about a CAD Software which is free for personal use and i think it is able to read/import? Pro-E files: http://www.medusa4.com/index.php?screen=1.3&ziel=Products-MEDUSA&land=co m maybe someone knows more details? Best regards Mario -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Wolfgang Spraul Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 1:29 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: List for OpenMoko community discussion Subject: Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available Jeremiah - thanks for the detailed information, it is indeed very helpful. The file format is the last open question. We have been looking into it the whole day. We are concerned that we release a file that will not be really useful for the purpose we are trying to achieve - allow for custom cases, case addons, mods. Our internal engineers use Pro/E Wildfire 3.0. They believe an export to DXF would severely limit the ability to use the file in an actual custom case project. Of course it may be that they are just most familiar with Pro/E. So at the moment I am leaning towards releasing the GTA01 case design in the original Pro/E format (.asm/.prt), with zero loss in fidelity. That would also make it easier for us in the future to release more such data, because our engineers could make sure the files we are releasing are really high quality and useful data, rather than as a last step exporting to a format they never use, and hope the exported file is still useful. It would probably be posted as an attachment in our wiki (about 70 MB). If someone can do a conversion to a more open format as part of a real project, and thus keep the quality/usability of the file intact, that would be great! What do you think? Regards, Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 1:57 PM, Jeremiah Flerchinger wrote: Wolfgang Spraul wrote: Jeremiah - thanks for the information, that is indeed very helpful. Your list includes DXF, that was the preference before. I am concerned that the export process will corrupt the file and we release a file that will be painful to actually use. From the formats you listed (Wavefront, DXF, STL), which is your preference? Which one do you believe is a format where Pro/E can export all information into, without loosing much? I'm not very familiar with internal structure/format of DXF files, but have written software that uses STL and Wavefront files. I'll answer to the best of my knowledge. The most information would be lost with STL files. DXF files would likely loose the least information and Wavefront would be somewhere between. This is dependent on how good the converters in ProE are. Often only the most basic features of the Wavefront format are implemented in applications and a surface description equal to or only slightly better than a STL file is achieved. This could also apply to DXF files, depending on the quality of the converter and the app that reads them in, but I bet the converter in ProE is pretty good. One issue is there are many versions of the DXF file format. A quick search shows Blender supports a subset of objects up to DXF version 2007. Art of Illusion only loads from ASCII DXF files and is limited to vertex information. Of course as long as the conversion is good & loads well for a couple apps, we could do additional conversions on our own. I believe an ASCII DXF format would be more accurate for most people and lose the least amount of information in the conversion. There may be fewer version compatibility issues with Wavefront files, but DXF readers can also often read newer files than they were designed for at a lower level of detail. Jeremiah Thanks, Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 10:37 AM, Jeremiah Flerchinger wrote: I don't think ProE by itself is suitable, especially since you need a copy of ProE even to import it to BRLCAD. I myself would suggest Wavefront (.obj), ASCII DXF (.dxf), or STL (.stl) file. All are standard formats & should be in ProE and any other 3D editor. Instructions for converting from ProE to STL are as follows: ProE * File > Export > Model * STL * Set chord height to 0. The field will be replaced by minimum acceptable value. * Set Angle Control to 1 * OK ProE Wildfire * File > Save a Copy > Model
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Jeremiah - thanks for the detailed information, it is indeed very helpful. The file format is the last open question. We have been looking into it the whole day. We are concerned that we release a file that will not be really useful for the purpose we are trying to achieve - allow for custom cases, case addons, mods. Our internal engineers use Pro/E Wildfire 3.0. They believe an export to DXF would severely limit the ability to use the file in an actual custom case project. Of course it may be that they are just most familiar with Pro/E. So at the moment I am leaning towards releasing the GTA01 case design in the original Pro/E format (.asm/.prt), with zero loss in fidelity. That would also make it easier for us in the future to release more such data, because our engineers could make sure the files we are releasing are really high quality and useful data, rather than as a last step exporting to a format they never use, and hope the exported file is still useful. It would probably be posted as an attachment in our wiki (about 70 MB). If someone can do a conversion to a more open format as part of a real project, and thus keep the quality/usability of the file intact, that would be great! What do you think? Regards, Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 1:57 PM, Jeremiah Flerchinger wrote: Wolfgang Spraul wrote: Jeremiah - thanks for the information, that is indeed very helpful. Your list includes DXF, that was the preference before. I am concerned that the export process will corrupt the file and we release a file that will be painful to actually use. From the formats you listed (Wavefront, DXF, STL), which is your preference? Which one do you believe is a format where Pro/E can export all information into, without loosing much? I'm not very familiar with internal structure/format of DXF files, but have written software that uses STL and Wavefront files. I'll answer to the best of my knowledge. The most information would be lost with STL files. DXF files would likely loose the least information and Wavefront would be somewhere between. This is dependent on how good the converters in ProE are. Often only the most basic features of the Wavefront format are implemented in applications and a surface description equal to or only slightly better than a STL file is achieved. This could also apply to DXF files, depending on the quality of the converter and the app that reads them in, but I bet the converter in ProE is pretty good. One issue is there are many versions of the DXF file format. A quick search shows Blender supports a subset of objects up to DXF version 2007. Art of Illusion only loads from ASCII DXF files and is limited to vertex information. Of course as long as the conversion is good & loads well for a couple apps, we could do additional conversions on our own. I believe an ASCII DXF format would be more accurate for most people and lose the least amount of information in the conversion. There may be fewer version compatibility issues with Wavefront files, but DXF readers can also often read newer files than they were designed for at a lower level of detail. Jeremiah Thanks, Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 10:37 AM, Jeremiah Flerchinger wrote: I don't think ProE by itself is suitable, especially since you need a copy of ProE even to import it to BRLCAD. I myself would suggest Wavefront (.obj), ASCII DXF (.dxf), or STL (.stl) file. All are standard formats & should be in ProE and any other 3D editor. Instructions for converting from ProE to STL are as follows: ProE * File > Export > Model * STL * Set chord height to 0. The field will be replaced by minimum acceptable value. * Set Angle Control to 1 * OK ProE Wildfire * File > Save a Copy > Model * Change type to STL (*.stl) * Set Chord Height to 0. The field will be replaced by minimum acceptable value. * Set Angle Control to 1 * OK I'm sure the process would be similar to convert to either of the other 2 formats. Jeremiah Flerchinger Wolfgang Spraul wrote: Esben - Interesting. I checked on BRLCAD's website Converting Geometry Between BRL-CAD and other Formats, Page 17 http://ftp.brlcad.org/VolumeIV-Converting_Geometry.pdf and it seems Pro/E import is actually quite solid. However you need a seat of Pro/E to do the conversion. Is releasing in Pro/E format (.prt and .asm files) an acceptable way? Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 2:36 AM, Esben Stien wrote: Wolfgang Spraul <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: Regarding the format, the original is in Pro/Engineer Assembly (.asm) and Part (.prt) files. That's probably hard to digest for any FOSS CAD software. BRLCAD[0] has preliminary support for this format. [0]http://brlcad.org/ -- Esben Stien is [EMAIL PROTECTED] s a http://www. s tn m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact sip:b0ef@ e
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Wolfgang Spraul wrote: Jeremiah - thanks for the information, that is indeed very helpful. Your list includes DXF, that was the preference before. I am concerned that the export process will corrupt the file and we release a file that will be painful to actually use. From the formats you listed (Wavefront, DXF, STL), which is your preference? Which one do you believe is a format where Pro/E can export all information into, without loosing much? I'm not very familiar with internal structure/format of DXF files, but have written software that uses STL and Wavefront files. I'll answer to the best of my knowledge. The most information would be lost with STL files. DXF files would likely loose the least information and Wavefront would be somewhere between. This is dependent on how good the converters in ProE are. Often only the most basic features of the Wavefront format are implemented in applications and a surface description equal to or only slightly better than a STL file is achieved. This could also apply to DXF files, depending on the quality of the converter and the app that reads them in, but I bet the converter in ProE is pretty good. One issue is there are many versions of the DXF file format. A quick search shows Blender supports a subset of objects up to DXF version 2007. Art of Illusion only loads from ASCII DXF files and is limited to vertex information. Of course as long as the conversion is good & loads well for a couple apps, we could do additional conversions on our own. I believe an ASCII DXF format would be more accurate for most people and lose the least amount of information in the conversion. There may be fewer version compatibility issues with Wavefront files, but DXF readers can also often read newer files than they were designed for at a lower level of detail. Jeremiah Thanks, Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 10:37 AM, Jeremiah Flerchinger wrote: I don't think ProE by itself is suitable, especially since you need a copy of ProE even to import it to BRLCAD. I myself would suggest Wavefront (.obj), ASCII DXF (.dxf), or STL (.stl) file. All are standard formats & should be in ProE and any other 3D editor. Instructions for converting from ProE to STL are as follows: ProE * File > Export > Model * STL * Set chord height to 0. The field will be replaced by minimum acceptable value. * Set Angle Control to 1 * OK ProE Wildfire * File > Save a Copy > Model * Change type to STL (*.stl) * Set Chord Height to 0. The field will be replaced by minimum acceptable value. * Set Angle Control to 1 * OK* * I'm sure the process would be similar to convert to either of the other 2 formats. Jeremiah Flerchinger* * Wolfgang Spraul wrote: Esben - Interesting. I checked on BRLCAD's website Converting Geometry Between BRL-CAD and other Formats, Page 17 http://ftp.brlcad.org/VolumeIV-Converting_Geometry.pdf and it seems Pro/E import is actually quite solid. However you need a seat of Pro/E to do the conversion. Is releasing in Pro/E format (.prt and .asm files) an acceptable way? Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 2:36 AM, Esben Stien wrote: Wolfgang Spraul <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: Regarding the format, the original is in Pro/Engineer Assembly (.asm) and Part (.prt) files. That's probably hard to digest for any FOSS CAD software. BRLCAD[0] has preliminary support for this format. [0]http://brlcad.org/ -- Esben Stien is [EMAIL PROTECTED] s a http://www. s tn m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact sip:b0ef@ e e jid:b0ef@n n ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
There are converters from .stl and .dxf files to G-code. A web search will bring up a few. I couldn't recommend any because I haven't tried them. Shawn Rutledge wrote: On Jan 14, 2008 8:32 PM, Jeremiah Flerchinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Can you generate CAM paths with Blender? What type of CAM files/input do you have in mind? I know both Blender & AOI support .stl files and a few others. Plugins are available for both. Are you asking about CNC G-code or something else? Yeah, G-code. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Jeremiah - thanks for the information, that is indeed very helpful. Your list includes DXF, that was the preference before. I am concerned that the export process will corrupt the file and we release a file that will be painful to actually use. From the formats you listed (Wavefront, DXF, STL), which is your preference? Which one do you believe is a format where Pro/E can export all information into, without loosing much? Thanks, Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 10:37 AM, Jeremiah Flerchinger wrote: I don't think ProE by itself is suitable, especially since you need a copy of ProE even to import it to BRLCAD. I myself would suggest Wavefront (.obj), ASCII DXF (.dxf), or STL (.stl) file. All are standard formats & should be in ProE and any other 3D editor. Instructions for converting from ProE to STL are as follows: ProE * File > Export > Model * STL * Set chord height to 0. The field will be replaced by minimum acceptable value. * Set Angle Control to 1 * OK ProE Wildfire * File > Save a Copy > Model * Change type to STL (*.stl) * Set Chord Height to 0. The field will be replaced by minimum acceptable value. * Set Angle Control to 1 * OK I'm sure the process would be similar to convert to either of the other 2 formats. Jeremiah Flerchinger Wolfgang Spraul wrote: Esben - Interesting. I checked on BRLCAD's website Converting Geometry Between BRL-CAD and other Formats, Page 17 http://ftp.brlcad.org/VolumeIV-Converting_Geometry.pdf and it seems Pro/E import is actually quite solid. However you need a seat of Pro/E to do the conversion. Is releasing in Pro/E format (.prt and .asm files) an acceptable way? Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 2:36 AM, Esben Stien wrote: Wolfgang Spraul <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: Regarding the format, the original is in Pro/Engineer Assembly (.asm) and Part (.prt) files. That's probably hard to digest for any FOSS CAD software. BRLCAD[0] has preliminary support for this format. [0]http://brlcad.org/ -- Esben Stien is [EMAIL PROTECTED] s a http://www. s tn m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact sip:b0ef@ e e jid:b0ef@n n ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
I don't think ProE by itself is suitable, especially since you need a copy of ProE even to import it to BRLCAD. I myself would suggest Wavefront (.obj), ASCII DXF (.dxf), or STL (.stl) file. All are standard formats & should be in ProE and any other 3D editor. Instructions for converting from ProE to STL are as follows: ProE * File > Export > Model * STL * Set chord height to 0. The field will be replaced by minimum acceptable value. * Set Angle Control to 1 * OK ProE Wildfire * File > Save a Copy > Model * Change type to STL (*.stl) * Set Chord Height to 0. The field will be replaced by minimum acceptable value. * Set Angle Control to 1 * OK* * I'm sure the process would be similar to convert to either of the other 2 formats. Jeremiah Flerchinger* * Wolfgang Spraul wrote: Esben - Interesting. I checked on BRLCAD's website Converting Geometry Between BRL-CAD and other Formats, Page 17 http://ftp.brlcad.org/VolumeIV-Converting_Geometry.pdf and it seems Pro/E import is actually quite solid. However you need a seat of Pro/E to do the conversion. Is releasing in Pro/E format (.prt and .asm files) an acceptable way? Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 2:36 AM, Esben Stien wrote: Wolfgang Spraul <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: Regarding the format, the original is in Pro/Engineer Assembly (.asm) and Part (.prt) files. That's probably hard to digest for any FOSS CAD software. BRLCAD[0] has preliminary support for this format. [0]http://brlcad.org/ -- Esben Stien is [EMAIL PROTECTED] s a http://www. s tn m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact sip:b0ef@ e e jid:b0ef@n n ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Esben - Interesting. I checked on BRLCAD's website Converting Geometry Between BRL-CAD and other Formats, Page 17 http://ftp.brlcad.org/VolumeIV-Converting_Geometry.pdf and it seems Pro/E import is actually quite solid. However you need a seat of Pro/E to do the conversion. Is releasing in Pro/E format (.prt and .asm files) an acceptable way? Wolfgang On Jan 17, 2008, at 2:36 AM, Esben Stien wrote: Wolfgang Spraul <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: Regarding the format, the original is in Pro/Engineer Assembly (.asm) and Part (.prt) files. That's probably hard to digest for any FOSS CAD software. BRLCAD[0] has preliminary support for this format. [0]http://brlcad.org/ -- Esben Stien is [EMAIL PROTECTED] s a http://www. s tn m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact sip:b0ef@ e e jid:b0ef@n n ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Wolfgang Spraul <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Regarding the format, the original is in Pro/Engineer Assembly > (.asm) and Part (.prt) files. That's probably hard to digest for any > FOSS CAD software. BRLCAD[0] has preliminary support for this format. [0]http://brlcad.org/ -- Esben Stien is [EMAIL PROTECTED] s a http://www. s tn m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact sip:b0ef@ e e jid:b0ef@n n ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
On Wednesday 16 January 2008, Wolfgang Spraul wrote: > Jeremiah - > > > Do you know if this model has objects providing dimensions for the > > pcb, screen, battery, & other elements? It isn't a problem to wait > > & see, if the release will be occurring soon. I was just curious. > > Why would you want dimensions for pcb, screen, battery, etc? Anyone designing an alternative case needs to accommodate these bits. Having their actual dimensions is better than inferring them from the current case. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Jeremiah - Do you know if this model has objects providing dimensions for the pcb, screen, battery, & other elements? It isn't a problem to wait & see, if the release will be occurring soon. I was just curious. Why would you want dimensions for pcb, screen, battery, etc? Regarding the format, the original is in Pro/Engineer Assembly (.asm) and Part (.prt) files. That's probably hard to digest for any FOSS CAD software. Besides DXF, any other preference? Or does anyone know what format Pro/Engineer can export to where both during export in Pro/E as well as import in a common FOSS CAD software not too much information/precision is lost? Thanks, Wolfgang On Jan 15, 2008, at 2:14 AM, Jeremiah Flerchinger wrote: Yes, you did say they were going to try and make CAD files available. I'm happy to hear further confirmation back so soon. Hopefully it won't take too much longer to get the files. DXF files should also be fine. I know of several free editors that can import these natively or with a plugin (although not all of them export dxf files). Do you know if this model has objects providing dimensions for the pcb, screen, battery, & other elements? It isn't a problem to wait & see, if the release will be occurring soon. I was just curious. Jeremiah Michael Shiloh wrote: Hi Community, Can't remember if I told you this or not, but OpenMoko has decided to make available the CAD files detailing the NEO case. I'm pretty sure the format will be .dxf files. To my limited understanding of CAD, this seems pretty universal and easy to convert to the other formats. We're in the process of getting all the pieces in order. I'll let you know as soon as it is available. Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Some ideas: BRLCAD is always an option: "BRL-CAD is a powerful solid modeling system developed by the U.S. Army Research Laboratory (formerly known as the Ballistic Research Laboratory, or BRL) that includes an interactive geometry editor (MGED), a ray-tracing library with support for rendering and geometric analysis, network distributed framebuffer support, an embedded scripting language, image- and signal-processing tools, and a host of additional utilities. The package supports a variety of geometric representations, including traditional combinatorial solid geometry (CSG) primitives, solids made from closed collections of uniform B-spline surfaces as well as non-uniform rational B-spline (NURBS) surfaces, faceted geometry, and n-manifold geometry (NMG)." It is not FOSS, but Varicad is a 2D/3D CAD option for Linux. I believe they have a 30 day trial version and discounts for students. This was the most easily used software for Linux that I encountered. http://www.varicad.com There is also the CAE Linux Project, which I have used, but is much more than just a "CAD" program. It is amazingly powerful software with the GUI glue of many engineering tools written in Python / TCL / Tk. If you are into CAE, look for the Salome-Meca-2007.1-GPL tarball. http://www.caelinux.com/CMS/ I admit I find Blender confusing and difficult to use, as well as BRLCAD. YMMV, HTH Andy >> Esben Stien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >> The one that stood out to me was Blender. It's designed for much >> more, but 3D CAD is a solid part of its job. > > Then you've misunderstood blender; it is definitely not CAD; it's an > artistic tool lacking severely in engineering tools. > >> Her initial impression was that Blender is excellent for this kind >> of work. > > Lacking splines and any kind of dimensioning, surfacing, etc, it's the > worst possible tool for the job. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHjMfqTHCOtwancvwRAjftAJ90dkqnVsSGDR+9We62eNPfQlhhowCgtH8c n+OlFbbaLmHHm171Ur53eeA= =udRM -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
I would say that you need a 3d modelling program. QCad is 2D (maybe 2.5D as in that you can model a cross-section and say to the program that the model should be axi-symmetrical with that cross-section) Maybe http://www.gcad3d.org/ or http://www.cad-schroer.com/index.php?ziel=Products-MEDUSA&land=com&scr=1.3 is something? Kind regards, Hans Bakker 2008/1/15, Mikael Lammentausta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > What about qcad? > > http://www.ribbonsoft.com/qcad.html > > > > 2008/1/15, Esben Stien < [EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > Michael Shiloh < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > > > The one that stood out to me was Blender. It's designed for much > > > more, but 3D CAD is a solid part of its job. > > > > Then you've misunderstood blender; it is definitely not CAD; it's an > > artistic tool lacking severely in engineering tools. > > > > > Her initial impression was that Blender is excellent for this kind > > > of work. > > > > Lacking splines and any kind of dimensioning, surfacing, etc, it's the > > worst possible tool for the job. > > > > -- > > Esben Stien is [EMAIL PROTECTED] s a > > http://www. s tn m > > irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact > >sip:b0ef@ e e > >jid:b0ef@n n > > > > ___ > > OpenMoko community mailing list > > community@lists.openmoko.org > > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > > > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
What about qcad? http://www.ribbonsoft.com/qcad.html 2008/1/15, Esben Stien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > The one that stood out to me was Blender. It's designed for much > > more, but 3D CAD is a solid part of its job. > > Then you've misunderstood blender; it is definitely not CAD; it's an > artistic tool lacking severely in engineering tools. > > > Her initial impression was that Blender is excellent for this kind > > of work. > > Lacking splines and any kind of dimensioning, surfacing, etc, it's the > worst possible tool for the job. > > -- > Esben Stien is [EMAIL PROTECTED] s a > http://www. s tn m > irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact >sip:b0ef@ e e >jid:b0ef@n n > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > The one that stood out to me was Blender. It's designed for much > more, but 3D CAD is a solid part of its job. Then you've misunderstood blender; it is definitely not CAD; it's an artistic tool lacking severely in engineering tools. > Her initial impression was that Blender is excellent for this kind > of work. Lacking splines and any kind of dimensioning, surfacing, etc, it's the worst possible tool for the job. -- Esben Stien is [EMAIL PROTECTED] s a http://www. s tn m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact sip:b0ef@ e e jid:b0ef@n n ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
On Jan 14, 2008 8:32 PM, Jeremiah Flerchinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Can you generate CAM paths with Blender? > > > What type of CAM files/input do you have in mind? I know both Blender & > AOI support .stl files and a few others. Plugins are available for > both. Are you asking about CNC G-code or something else? Yeah, G-code. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Shawn Rutledge wrote: What is your favorite Linux CAD tool for actual 3D work? I have to agree with the people that say Blender is a high quality program. For a simple 3D editor I would suggest something like Art of Illusion (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Art_of_Illusion). In my opinion that would would be a simpler application to use before moving to something more powerful like Blender. Can you generate CAM paths with Blender? What type of CAM files/input do you have in mind? I know both Blender & AOI support .stl files and a few others. Plugins are available for both. Are you asking about CNC G-code or something else? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
I also suggest Alibre Express, although it is for Windows and it's not FOSS, but I was involved in much of the writing of it, so I enjoy seeing it being used. Blender would work great for this application, although it's not a parametric solid modeler. I'll have to give it a spin. --Mark Arvidson P.S. check out my first openmoko app at http://sagacis.doesntexist.com/openmoko-dashboard_0.9_armv4t.ipk On Jan 14, 2008 1:55 PM, Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Jeremiah Flerchinger wrote: > > Yes, you did say they were going to try and make CAD files available. > > I'm happy to hear further confirmation back so soon. Hopefully it won't > > take too much longer to get the files. DXF files should also be fine. > > I know of several free editors that can import these natively or with a > > plugin (although not all of them export dxf files). > > A quick spot-check indicated that Blender can import and export dxf > files. Blender is FOSS and runs on Linux. > > > > > > Do you know if this model has objects providing dimensions for the pcb, > > screen, battery, & other elements? It isn't a problem to wait & see, if > > the release will be occurring soon. I was just curious. > > I don't know. I'd ask, but I don't want to slow the process down. I > agree with you - wait and see what we get, then I can ask for the rest > later. > > Michael > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Daniel Barkalow wrote: Anyone have access to useful manufacturing tools? I have friends with CNC mills and lathes, and one with a water jet cutter. I have indirect access to 3D printers. Anything else interesting out there? http://www.candyfab.org/ Other phones make their owners angry. Ours is good enough to eat[*]. I thought of that. His resolution isn't quite good enough for a phone. Maybe I'll ask him to make us one just for fun. He'd be into it, I'm sure. Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Shawn Rutledge wrote: On Jan 14, 2008 12:52 PM, Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I personally look forward to non-traditional materials. I have an obsession with concrete, which I'm trying to figure out how to apply in this situation. A concrete phone? You can't make it anywhere near as thin as plastic can you? I didn't say it would be trivial :-) I guess you could make a concrete docking station. Anyone have access to useful manufacturing tools? I have friends with CNC mills and lathes, and one with a water jet cutter. I have indirect access to 3D printers. Anything else interesting out there? I've got a CNC micro-mill (Sherline based) but it's not very reliable... it's kindof worn (I got it used) and the screws tend to stick sometimes in some positions, it's slow (more likely to stick if I get the step rate up too fast), and it's not easy to do any significant metal cutting. I run it from a DOS machine because real-time Linux so far has been more trouble to get going, and requires a faster machine to get the same results. I also have it booting from a CF card for reliability, and it can mount Samba shares, so it's easy enough to generate files on Linux and then mill them on DOS. I was just hoping to mill PC boards, but I mostly have not been able to get acceptable results; it's so hard to find small-enough cutters, and the ones that are small enough break too easily. I got a simple pyramid-shaped engraving bit, and it tears the edges of the copper too much, so that fine traces tend not to have continuity when it's done. So fine-pitch surface-mount stuff is not an option right now (but I did make one good board with a 6-pin SOIC on it). Plus my wife won't let me use it when she's at home because it's so loud. All in all it's much less trouble to just send designs somewhere to be made (like Olimex if you're not in a hurry - they are cheap). And what am I going to spend my spare time on anyway? My software projects take a lot of time and aren't getting done fast enough, and I don't have time to read as many books as I'd like because I'm always hacking on something. Also have a decent-sized non-CNC Harbor Freight milling machine. I don't have enough experience yet to be any good with either one. Didn't get around to getting a lathe yet. Nice setup. The Sherline is highly rated, in its category. I expect if you ever want to sell it you'll get close to your money back. Can you generate CAM paths with Blender? That I don't know. Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
On Mon, 14 Jan 2008, Michael Shiloh wrote: > > great, now we can swing into action and get al those alternative cases > > designed and built > > I personally look forward to non-traditional materials. I have an obsession > with concrete, which I'm trying to figure out how to apply in this situation. > > Anyone have access to useful manufacturing tools? I have friends with CNC > mills and lathes, and one with a water jet cutter. I have indirect access to > 3D printers. Anything else interesting out there? http://www.candyfab.org/ Other phones make their owners angry. Ours is good enough to eat[*]. [*] Do not eat electronics or battery in phone. -Daniel *This .sig left intentionally blank* ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Michael Shiloh writes: > >Now what would a steampunk phone look like? I really, really like what might be a called a "restrained steampunk" style. Something like the existing black/silver case, with a wood veneer in place of black and brass-bound for the silver. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
On 15/01/2008, Ben Burdette <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > great, now we can swing into action and get al those alternative cases > > designed and built > > > > My company gets aluminum sensor boxes made on a regular basis. They are > pretty comparable to the neo case in complexity, and I think we could > get them made for about 200$ each in a batch of 30-40 or so. Expensive, > but black anodised aluminum would be pretty neat. they would be very cool, and yes that is expensive, but someone might be interested. would you care to add details to the wiki? http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_alternate_cases and http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Hardware:Neo1973:Alternate_Cases:Alternate_colours/materials ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Ben Burdette schrieb: > >> great, now we can swing into action and get al those alternative cases >> designed and built >> > > My company gets aluminum sensor boxes made on a regular basis. They > are pretty comparable to the neo case in complexity, and I think we > could get them made for about 200$ each in a batch of 30-40 or so. > Expensive, but black anodised aluminum would be pretty neat. But keep Mister Faraday in mind... otherwise you won't have any WiFi/GSM/GPS signals... Anyway i would love black anodised aluminum! =) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
great, now we can swing into action and get al those alternative cases designed and built My company gets aluminum sensor boxes made on a regular basis. They are pretty comparable to the neo case in complexity, and I think we could get them made for about 200$ each in a batch of 30-40 or so. Expensive, but black anodised aluminum would be pretty neat. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
On Jan 14, 2008 12:52 PM, Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I personally look forward to non-traditional materials. I have an > obsession with concrete, which I'm trying to figure out how to apply in > this situation. A concrete phone? You can't make it anywhere near as thin as plastic can you? I guess you could make a concrete docking station. > Anyone have access to useful manufacturing tools? I have friends with > CNC mills and lathes, and one with a water jet cutter. I have indirect > access to 3D printers. Anything else interesting out there? I've got a CNC micro-mill (Sherline based) but it's not very reliable... it's kindof worn (I got it used) and the screws tend to stick sometimes in some positions, it's slow (more likely to stick if I get the step rate up too fast), and it's not easy to do any significant metal cutting. I run it from a DOS machine because real-time Linux so far has been more trouble to get going, and requires a faster machine to get the same results. I also have it booting from a CF card for reliability, and it can mount Samba shares, so it's easy enough to generate files on Linux and then mill them on DOS. I was just hoping to mill PC boards, but I mostly have not been able to get acceptable results; it's so hard to find small-enough cutters, and the ones that are small enough break too easily. I got a simple pyramid-shaped engraving bit, and it tears the edges of the copper too much, so that fine traces tend not to have continuity when it's done. So fine-pitch surface-mount stuff is not an option right now (but I did make one good board with a 6-pin SOIC on it). Plus my wife won't let me use it when she's at home because it's so loud. All in all it's much less trouble to just send designs somewhere to be made (like Olimex if you're not in a hurry - they are cheap). And what am I going to spend my spare time on anyway? My software projects take a lot of time and aren't getting done fast enough, and I don't have time to read as many books as I'd like because I'm always hacking on something. Also have a decent-sized non-CNC Harbor Freight milling machine. I don't have enough experience yet to be any good with either one. Didn't get around to getting a lathe yet. Can you generate CAM paths with Blender? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Robin Paulson wrote: On 15/01/2008, Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I personally look forward to non-traditional materials. I have an obsession with concrete, which I'm trying to figure out how to apply in this situation. concrete! now there's an idea. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Steampunk is one of the non-traditional ones that caught my eye Love it! For inspiration, may I point you to the projects of some of my friends: http://steamtreehouse.com/ http://www.kineticsteamworks.org/ http://www.xlounge.com/neverwas/neverwas_proposal.html Now what would a steampunk phone look like? Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
On 15/01/2008, Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I personally look forward to non-traditional materials. I have an > obsession with concrete, which I'm trying to figure out how to apply in > this situation. concrete! now there's an idea. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Steampunk is one of the non-traditional ones that caught my eye plus http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Hardware:Neo1973:Alternate_Cases:Alternate_colours/materials which aren't so leftfield ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Shawn Rutledge wrote: On Jan 14, 2008 11:14 AM, Jeremiah Flerchinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Yes, you did say they were going to try and make CAD files available. I'm happy to hear further confirmation back so soon. Hopefully it won't take too much longer to get the files. DXF files should also be fine. I know of several free editors that can import these natively or with a plugin (although not all of them export dxf files). What is your favorite Linux CAD tool for actual 3D work? This would be excellent information to add to the wiki. I am not a CAD designer, but I work with many designers and machinists. Of course none of them are Linux users. I did a little research and found many commercial products for Linux. I presume we are more interested in FOSS CAD tools. The one that stood out to me was Blender. It's designed for much more, but 3D CAD is a solid part of its job. My girlfriend is a product designer. I gave her a Linux computer with Blender installed in the hopes that she will figure out how to use Blender and then teach me. Her initial impression was that Blender is excellent for this kind of work. Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Jeremiah Flerchinger wrote: Yes, you did say they were going to try and make CAD files available. I'm happy to hear further confirmation back so soon. Hopefully it won't take too much longer to get the files. DXF files should also be fine. I know of several free editors that can import these natively or with a plugin (although not all of them export dxf files). A quick spot-check indicated that Blender can import and export dxf files. Blender is FOSS and runs on Linux. Do you know if this model has objects providing dimensions for the pcb, screen, battery, & other elements? It isn't a problem to wait & see, if the release will be occurring soon. I was just curious. I don't know. I'd ask, but I don't want to slow the process down. I agree with you - wait and see what we get, then I can ask for the rest later. Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
yes, dxf is spot on Thanks for the confirmation. great, now we can swing into action and get al those alternative cases designed and built I personally look forward to non-traditional materials. I have an obsession with concrete, which I'm trying to figure out how to apply in this situation. Anyone have access to useful manufacturing tools? I have friends with CNC mills and lathes, and one with a water jet cutter. I have indirect access to 3D printers. Anything else interesting out there? Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
> What is your favorite Linux CAD tool for actual 3D work? Blender seems to import .dxf files though I've never tried any thing other than native files. Get it at www.blender3d.org ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
On Jan 14, 2008 11:14 AM, Jeremiah Flerchinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Yes, you did say they were going to try and make CAD files available. > I'm happy to hear further confirmation back so soon. Hopefully it won't > take too much longer to get the files. DXF files should also be fine. > I know of several free editors that can import these natively or with a > plugin (although not all of them export dxf files). What is your favorite Linux CAD tool for actual 3D work? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
On 15/01/2008, Michael Shiloh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Can't remember if I told you this or not, but OpenMoko has decided to > make available the CAD files detailing the NEO case. fantastic, no i don't recall seeing this confirmed. thanks michael > I'm pretty sure the format will be .dxf files. To my limited > understanding of CAD, this seems pretty universal and easy to convert to > the other formats. yes, dxf is spot on > We're in the process of getting all the pieces in order. I'll let you > know as soon as it is available. great, now we can swing into action and get al those alternative cases designed and built ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Yes, you did say they were going to try and make CAD files available. I'm happy to hear further confirmation back so soon. Hopefully it won't take too much longer to get the files. DXF files should also be fine. I know of several free editors that can import these natively or with a plugin (although not all of them export dxf files). Do you know if this model has objects providing dimensions for the pcb, screen, battery, & other elements? It isn't a problem to wait & see, if the release will be occurring soon. I was just curious. Jeremiah Michael Shiloh wrote: Hi Community, Can't remember if I told you this or not, but OpenMoko has decided to make available the CAD files detailing the NEO case. I'm pretty sure the format will be .dxf files. To my limited understanding of CAD, this seems pretty universal and easy to convert to the other formats. We're in the process of getting all the pieces in order. I'll let you know as soon as it is available. Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
CAD files for the case of the Neo will be made available
Hi Community, Can't remember if I told you this or not, but OpenMoko has decided to make available the CAD files detailing the NEO case. I'm pretty sure the format will be .dxf files. To my limited understanding of CAD, this seems pretty universal and easy to convert to the other formats. We're in the process of getting all the pieces in order. I'll let you know as soon as it is available. Michael ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
