Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[Els]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

[extend background colour to bottom of page]
>> It would do that automagically if it weren't for the absolute
>> positioning.
>
> Yep. So is my choice just to reposition everything with
> relative positioning?

To give an element position:relative, means to give it a position 
*relative to its own original position*. Say you have an h1 and a 
paragraph below it. If you would give the h1 position:relative 
with a top value of 3em, it would be covering the paragraph below 
it.

> And then to go into layers rather than divs?

I don't know what you mean by that. Aren't divs layers in 
Dreamweaver speak? (I don't know Dreamweaver, but that's what I 
heard)

 Site is http://www.wdam.co.uk/clients/dynam/hh/
>>
>> CENTER tags??
>> (I'll ignore that bit too! ;-) )
>
> Probably best ;) I'll tidy up after I've got it looking right
> and there are no changes from the client :)

First get the code done correctly, and then make it look right.
The reverse will give you headaches.

> Thanks, it's much appreciated!

You're welcome :-)

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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[css]

On Fri, Jun 16, 2006 at 02:38:00PM +0200, Els wrote:
> How did you colour your page before it was centered?
> The problem with absolute positioning, is that you are taking the 
> elements out of the normal flow, thus leaving its parent 
> virtually empty. And an empty container doesn't gain any height.

Yep, that seems to be the problem... and I was not colouring
it before - I keep having to add bits as the client passes a 
new requirement.

> It would do that automagically if it weren't for the absolute 
> positioning.

Yep. So is my choice just to reposition everything with 
relative positioning? And then to go into layers rather than
divs?

> >> Site is http://www.wdam.co.uk/clients/dynam/hh/
> 
> CENTER tags??
> (I'll ignore that bit too! ;-) )

Probably best ;) I'll tidy up after I've got it looking right
and there are no changes from the client :)

Thanks, it's much appreciated!
-- 
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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[Els]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 16, 2006 at 12:16:03PM +0100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>> Ok, I've tried that. I've also used the container to give a
>> background colour of white for the content area, where the
>> main body background will be grey. This hasn't been entirely
>> successful; I guess I have to set a fixed height, as not
>> setting one meant the white background wasn't seen, and
>> setting 100% as I have at present isn't really what I want?

Indeed. Setting 100% height causes the background to stop when 
you need to scroll up to see more text (which happens on smaller 
windows and with enlarged text.

> This is still an issue for me.

How did you colour your page before it was centered?
The problem with absolute positioning, is that you are taking the 
elements out of the normal flow, thus leaving its parent 
virtually empty. And an empty container doesn't gain any height.

> I could define 4 container
> classes, one for each page, and set it to the appropriate
> height for that page, but this isn't really a fix.

Especially since the text will then 'fall out' of the bottom on 
enlarging the font-size.

> I've done
> lots of googling but I must be going wrong somehow because I
> can't find a way to get the container to be at least the
> length of the longest bit within it, but no longer.

It would do that automagically if it weren't for the absolute 
positioning.

>> Site is http://www.wdam.co.uk/clients/dynam/hh/
>
> The other issues were caused by me being a complete lemon and
> forgetting to add a CENTER tag in an important place, so please
> ignore them! Sorry, I'm not entirely well and it's been a long
> week!

CENTER tags??
(I'll ignore that bit too! ;-) )

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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[Kim Finleyson]

> Ok, I've tried that. I've also used the container to give a background

> colour of white for the content area, where the main body background 
> will be grey. This hasn't been entirely successful; I guess I have to 
> set a fixed height, as not setting one meant the white background 
> wasn't seen, and setting 100% as I have at present isn't really what I

> want?

>This is still an issue for me. I could define 4 container classes, one
for each page, and set it to the appropriate height for that page, but
this isn't really a fix. I've done lots of googling but I must be going
wrong somehow because I can't find a way to get the container to be at
least the length of the longest bit within it, but no longer.

> Site is http://www.wdam.co.uk/clients/dynam/hh/

>The other issues were caused by me being a complete lemon and
forgetting to add a CENTER tag in an important place, so please ignore
them! Sorry, I'm not entirely well and it's been a long week!

Hello,

I just caught the end of this thread and wanted to pass on some CSS code
for centering a page. I've tried different techniques and this
particular snippet works everytime:

body
{
margin: 0;
padding: 0;
text-align: center;
}

div#container   
{
margin: 1em auto;
width: 80%;
border: 1px solid #000;
padding: 1em;
background-color: #ddd;
text-align: left;
}

Note that you will probably want to change the border and background.
Also, I would recommend removing the deprecated center tag. Re-defining
the body tag and using a wrapper div will be sufficient. You don't have
to set a fixed height because the container wraps around the content of
your page, and the height will adjust to the content, so you should only
need one container div for the site.
 
***Hope this helps!
--Kim
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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[css]

On Fri, Jun 16, 2006 at 12:16:03PM +0100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Ok, I've tried that. I've also used the container to give a 
> background colour of white for the content area, where the 
> main body background will be grey. This hasn't been entirely
> successful; I guess I have to set a fixed height, as not setting
> one meant the white background wasn't seen, and setting 100%
> as I have at present isn't really what I want?

This is still an issue for me. I could define 4 container classes,
one for each page, and set it to the appropriate height for that
page, but this isn't really a fix. I've done lots of googling but
I must be going wrong somehow because I can't find a way to get
the container to be at least the length of the longest bit within
it, but no longer.

> Site is http://www.wdam.co.uk/clients/dynam/hh/

The other issues were caused by me being a complete lemon and 
forgetting to add a CENTER tag in an important place, so please
ignore them! Sorry, I'm not entirely well and it's been a long
week!

-- 
Flash Wilson - Web Design & Mastery - 0870 401 4061 / 07939 579090
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Work: www.wdam.co.uk  Personal: www.gorge.org
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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[css]

On Thu, Jun 15, 2006 at 12:21:04PM +0200, Els wrote:
> Just make a div with id="container" to hold all that's inside 
>  now, give it position:relative, and all that was 
> previously absolute positioned to the viewport, will now be 
> relative to the container. (no need to change any of the absolute 
> values you already set)
> Then you center the container by giving it a width and 
> margin:auto;.

Ok, I've tried that. I've also used the container to give a 
background colour of white for the content area, where the 
main body background will be grey. This hasn't been entirely
successful; I guess I have to set a fixed height, as not setting
one meant the white background wasn't seen, and setting 100%
as I have at present isn't really what I want?

Another issue, which I really can't get but perhaps this is just
because I've been staring at the screen too long... I have a 
purple triangle, which fits in the right place on my front page.
But when you go to the "homeseeker" page, which I have also 
amended to work with the new container, the purple triangle leaps
to the wrong place...

And I think the whole thing is leaping a few pixels when I go
from one page to another. Surely, the width should be fixed and
therefore the content area should remain in the same place between
pages? All areas where widths are set are in the stylesheet,
all pages have the same sections in them... so all should be the
same width?

Sorry to throw this at people on a Friday but I am boggling.
Been staring at the screen too long I think :(

Site is http://www.wdam.co.uk/clients/dynam/hh/


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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[Gunlaug Sørtun]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> http://www.wdam.co.uk/clients/dynam/hh/
> 
> I didn't post it at first as I didn't want it to look like I'm asking
>  you to do my homework for me; I'd rather grasp the concept than copy
>  parrot fashion.

Good thinking :-)

> That said, I do need to fix it rather fast!

Make sure you understand "Doctypes and their respective layout mode"
first...

...as it will make everything else a lot more consistent if you trigger
the right mode in all browsers that _has_ two modes.

Your existing...

...triggers 'quirks mode', so that's the same as having "no DocType at
all". IE6 is especially "quirky" with that DocType.

Choosing - and writing source-code in accordance with - a DocType
that'll trigger 'strict mode' will give you the option mentioned by
others in this thread: "styling a self-centering body".

Maybe use this DocType...
http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd";>
...since you have some 'non-strict' elements in there.

CSS:
body {
   width: 730px /* suitable width to hold the layout */;
   margin: 0 auto 0 auto /* auto-centering */;
   position: relative /* makes AP relate to body */;
}
...will center body in Opera, Firefox *and* IE6 (and probably most other
"mode-switching browsers" but I didn't check), and place all the
absolute positioned elements firmly inside that centered body. No extra
wrapper-div needed.

regards
Georg
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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[Els]

Scott Reston wrote:
> I'm wondering - wouldn't it work to simply set the width of
> the body appropriately, then set it's left and right margins
> to "auto"?

And give it position:relative, yes :-)

> Same effect without any extra non-semantic cruft.
>
> This just off the top of my head, so YMMV.

Yup, good idea. I'm just so used to having a wrapper, that I 
forgot to think of that option. At the same time though, ISTR 
that there is/was a browser that didn't work with that. IE6, 
Firefox and Opera do though, so I'm not sure if I'm mistaken in 
my memory.

Sidenote to styling : if you don't want the rest of the 
page to have the same background as , you need to style 
 separately.

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http://locusoptimus.com/ 


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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[Scott Reston]

I'm wondering - wouldn't it work to simply set the width of the body
appropriately, then set it's left and right margins to "auto"?

Same effect without any extra non-semantic cruft.

This just off the top of my head, so YMMV.


-- 

s:r {
  scott reston
  raleigh, nc
  http://scott.therestons.com
  scott at therestons * com
  }



[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 15, 2006 at 12:21:04PM +0200, Els wrote:
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>>> So... My idea is to make a container class for it all, and then
>>> to have everything positioned relative rather than absolute.
>>> And centre the containing class.
>> Just make a div with id="container" to hold all that's inside 
>>  now, give it position:relative, and all that was 
>> previously absolute positioned to the viewport, will now be 
>> relative to the container. (no need to change any of the absolute 
>> values you already set)
>> Then you center the container by giving it a width and 
>> margin:auto;.
> 
> Oh - it's that simple?
> 
> Ok, that sounds good! I'll get to trying it.
> 
> Thanks very much to you, and to David, for your help.
> 
> Let's see how I get on... 
> 
> Cheers,




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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[css]

On Thu, Jun 15, 2006 at 12:21:04PM +0200, Els wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > So... My idea is to make a container class for it all, and then
> > to have everything positioned relative rather than absolute.
> > And centre the containing class.
> 
> Just make a div with id="container" to hold all that's inside 
>  now, give it position:relative, and all that was 
> previously absolute positioned to the viewport, will now be 
> relative to the container. (no need to change any of the absolute 
> values you already set)
> Then you center the container by giving it a width and 
> margin:auto;.

Oh - it's that simple?

Ok, that sounds good! I'll get to trying it.

Thanks very much to you, and to David, for your help.

Let's see how I get on... 

Cheers,
-- 
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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[Els]

Dave Goodchild wrote:
> To centre in the browser there are two main ways, either use
> the IE heck (text-align: center then text-align: left etc)
> but I prefer using relative positioning and negative margins
> - example:
>
> #wrapper {
> width: 740px;
> position: relative;
> left: 50%;
> margin-left: -370px;
> }
>
> which is not a hack.

Not a hack, but you're losing content on browser window widths 
narrower than 740px.
What you call an IE hack above, is only needed for IE5. Other 
browsers, including IE6, understand margin:auto;.
Given a choice between a "hack" and inaccessibility of content, 
I'll choose the hack anytime.

-- 
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http://locusoptimus.com/ 


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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[Els]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Having spent ages learning how to position stuff in CSS and
> getting it meticulously right (using the nice hack that I was
> pointed at to get IE to behave, too) the client has now said
> "Oh, can you make the content centre in the browser?"
>
> ARGH! If I was still using tables for layout this would be
> trivial but I am using absolutely positioned stuff.
>
> So... My idea is to make a container class for it all, and then
> to have everything positioned relative rather than absolute.
> And centre the containing class.

Just make a div with id="container" to hold all that's inside 
 now, give it position:relative, and all that was 
previously absolute positioned to the viewport, will now be 
relative to the container. (no need to change any of the absolute 
values you already set)
Then you center the container by giving it a width and 
margin:auto;.

-- 
Els
http://locusmeus.com/
http://locusoptimus.com/ 


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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[Dave Goodchild]

On 15/06/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On Thu, Jun 15, 2006 at 11:12:49AM +0100, Dave Goodchild wrote:
> > Can you give me the URL?
>
> Course!
>
> http://www.wdam.co.uk/clients/dynam/hh/
>
> I didn't post it at first as I didn't want it to look like I'm
> asking you to do my homework for me; I'd rather grasp the concept
> than copy parrot fashion. That said, I do need to fix it rather
> fast!
>
> --
>
What I would do first is deal with the #main div, if that's the wrapper.
Change position to relative, left to 50%, and margin-left to half the
required width. Take out the top and left absolutes. Get the main wrapper
centred like that and then deal with the other contained elements, which I
would float.
-- 
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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[css]

On Thu, Jun 15, 2006 at 11:12:49AM +0100, Dave Goodchild wrote:
> Can you give me the URL?

Course!

http://www.wdam.co.uk/clients/dynam/hh/

I didn't post it at first as I didn't want it to look like I'm
asking you to do my homework for me; I'd rather grasp the concept
than copy parrot fashion. That said, I do need to fix it rather
fast!

-- 
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-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Work: www.wdam.co.uk  Personal: www.gorge.org
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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[Dave Goodchild]

On 15/06/06, Flash Wilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On Thu, Jun 15, 2006 at 11:01:05AM +0100, Dave Goodchild wrote:
> > > To centre in the browser there are two main ways, either use the IE
> heck
> > > (text-align: center then text-align: left etc) but I prefer using
> relative
> > > positioning and negative margins - example:
> >
> > Is this what you are trying to do?
>
> Um.
>
> Everything in my design is laid out with absolute positioning,
> so its X pixels from top, Y pixels from left, etc.
>
> And having finished the design I now have to scoop it all up and
> make it centre in the browser as it is resized. Obviously at the
> moment it will not do that, it will always be exactly where I told
> it to be!
>
> So my question was, can I change the word "absolute" to "relative"
> in every case, and it still work? Then if I do that, I could put
> a wrapper / container around everything, and make that wrapper be
> centred? And everything would still be my precise X pixels from the
> edge of the wrapper?
>
> Is that how it works?
> --
> Flash Wilson - Web Design & Mastery - 0870 401 4061 / 07939 579090
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> Work: www.wdam.co.uk  Personal: www.gorge.org
>

Can you give me the URL?
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Re: [css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[Dave Goodchild]

On 15/06/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Having spent ages learning how to position stuff in CSS and getting
> it meticulously right (using the nice hack that I was pointed at
> to get IE to behave, too) the client has now said "Oh, can you
> make the content centre in the browser?"
>
> ARGH! If I was still using tables for layout this would be trivial
> but I am using absolutely positioned stuff.
>
> So... My idea is to make a container class for it all, and then
> to have everything positioned relative rather than absolute. And
> centre the containing class.
>
> Is this the right idea? Or will it all go horribly wrong?
>
> I'm only asking for advice, not for you to do all the work for me!
> But I thought I'd better ask before I try it, screw up and confuse
> myself horribly
>
> Thanks :)
>
> To centre in the browser there are two main ways, either use the IE heck
> (text-align: center then text-align: left etc) but I prefer using relative
> positioning and negative margins - example:



#wrapper {
width: 740px;
position: relative;
left: 50%;
margin-left: -370px;
}

which is not a hack.

Is this what you are trying to do?




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[css-d] Centering a CSS positioned design

[css]

Having spent ages learning how to position stuff in CSS and getting
it meticulously right (using the nice hack that I was pointed at
to get IE to behave, too) the client has now said "Oh, can you 
make the content centre in the browser?" 

ARGH! If I was still using tables for layout this would be trivial
but I am using absolutely positioned stuff.

So... My idea is to make a container class for it all, and then
to have everything positioned relative rather than absolute. And
centre the containing class. 

Is this the right idea? Or will it all go horribly wrong?

I'm only asking for advice, not for you to do all the work for me!
But I thought I'd better ask before I try it, screw up and confuse
myself horribly

Thanks :)

-- 
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