Re: [CTRL] Global Warming: Socialisms Trojan Horse
In a message dated 2/24/02 3:40:59 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: And yes... environmentalism in some form WILL be the > idea > and primary cause of the extinction of Capitalism Environmentalism is the tar holding together the wall of global government being built around us. It's how global government is being sold to the masses, so it cannot be questioned and the truth be damned. The adjective "sustainable" is used to describe anything to be globalized. No, capitalism will not disappear with global government, far from it. Big business will work hand in hand with global government. Small business capitalism will be encouraged, though strongly regulated, because the risks that such capitalists must take will be on the heads of those attempting new projects. See the very old book by Mark Satin, New Age Politics. His website is radicalmiddle.com.
Re: [CTRL] Global Warming: Socialisms Trojan Horse
-Caveat Lector- Hey Joshua, thanks a lot for proving my point with your quote below. Sorry to burst your bubble, pal, but you Greens (Reds, really) do not have a monopoly on environmental policy or morality. > Joshua2 wrote: > Ha ha ha ha ha ha. That's so funny! And yes... environmentalism in some form WILL be the idea and primary cause of the extinction of Capitalism. > > Greens are like watermelons -- green on the > outside > > and red on the inside. > > --- Nurev Ind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > -Caveat Lector- > > - Original Message - > From: "John Wallace" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2002 9:42 AM > Subject: Re: [CTRL] Global Warming: Socialisms > Trojan Horse > > > > -Caveat Lector- > > > > So true. > > > > Greens are like watermelons -- green on the > outside > > and red on the inside. > > > > Ha ha ha ha ha ha. That's so funny! Try this one > genius. > What's you on the outside, and dead on the inside? > > Green is not socialism moron. Green is EVERYTHING. > > Fortunately most people in the world have enough > brains to > understand that their very existance depends on the > good > functioning of the natural environment. > > And yes... environmentalism in some form WILL be the > idea > and primary cause of the extinction of Capitalism. > But that's > because capitalism is THE MOST DESTRUCTIVE FORCE TO > THE > ENVIRONMENT in the world at this time, and more > folks come > to understand this every day. Since most people are > poor and > don't have ANY vested interest in a system which > only serves the > rich and the greedy who desperately want to be rich, > it's obvious > that Capitalism is on the way out. > > You and Johnson should submit your names to the " > Darwin's" > list for consideration. > > Enjoy it while you can, > Joshua2 > > > > > > > --- "M. A. Johnson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > -Caveat Lector- > > > > > > ~~for educational purposes only~~ > > > [Title 17 U.S.C. section 107] > > > > > > Global Warming: Socialism's Trojan Horse > > > by Eric Englund > > > > > > On February 14, 2002, President Bush provided > > > details for > > > his plan to combat global warming. The > cornerstone > > > of his > > > plan is to promote voluntary reductions in > > > greenhouse gas > > > emissions. Naturally, environmentalists were > > > outraged that > > > President Bush refused to adhere to the Kyoto > > > Treaty. It > > > is President Bush's contention that the Kyoto > > > protocol would > > > cost nearly 5,000,000 jobs in the U.S. alone. Of > > > course, > > > environmentalists claimed that there is a bigger > > > picture > > > here. All people, especially those living in > > > industrialized > > > countries such as the U.S., must sacrifice in > order > > > to win > > > the universal struggle against global warming. > As we > > > have > > > seen over the past three decades, > environmentalists > > > have > > > succeeded in eroding property rights in the > United > > > States in > > > order to protect Mother Earth as they see fit > (i.e. > > > through > > > the Clean Water Act, through the Endangered > Species > > > Act, > > > through ridiculous wetlands legislation, through > air > > > quality > > > laws, etc). Whether or not President Bush > > > understands this, > > > the real struggle is between liberty and > > > totalitarianism. > > > For if environmentalists succeed in gradually > taking > > > away > > > our private property rights, then a free market > and > > > liberty > > > cannot exist. Thus, it is my contention that the > > > struggle > > > against environmentalism is actually a struggle > for > > > liberty > > > (using the classical liberal definition). > > > > > > Undoubtedly, environmentalists will take > exception > > > to being > > > called illiberal socialists (but I repeat > myself). > > > Perhaps > > > there are those of you who are alarmed about > global > > > warming > > > and sympathize with the environmental/green > > > movement. My > > > response is for you to be careful with whom you >
Re: [CTRL] Global Warming: Socialisms Trojan Horse
-Caveat Lector- - Original Message - From: "John Wallace" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2002 9:42 AM Subject: Re: [CTRL] Global Warming: Socialisms Trojan Horse > -Caveat Lector- > > So true. > > Greens are like watermelons -- green on the outside > and red on the inside. > Ha ha ha ha ha ha. That's so funny! Try this one genius. What's you on the outside, and dead on the inside? Green is not socialism moron. Green is EVERYTHING. Fortunately most people in the world have enough brains to understand that their very existance depends on the good functioning of the natural environment. And yes... environmentalism in some form WILL be the idea and primary cause of the extinction of Capitalism. But that's because capitalism is THE MOST DESTRUCTIVE FORCE TO THE ENVIRONMENT in the world at this time, and more folks come to understand this every day. Since most people are poor and don't have ANY vested interest in a system which only serves the rich and the greedy who desperately want to be rich, it's obvious that Capitalism is on the way out. You and Johnson should submit your names to the " Darwin's" list for consideration. Enjoy it while you can, Joshua2 > > > --- "M. A. Johnson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > -Caveat Lector- > > > > ~~for educational purposes only~~ > > [Title 17 U.S.C. section 107] > > > > Global Warming: Socialism's Trojan Horse > > by Eric Englund > > > > On February 14, 2002, President Bush provided > > details for > > his plan to combat global warming. The cornerstone > > of his > > plan is to promote voluntary reductions in > > greenhouse gas > > emissions. Naturally, environmentalists were > > outraged that > > President Bush refused to adhere to the Kyoto > > Treaty. It > > is President Bush's contention that the Kyoto > > protocol would > > cost nearly 5,000,000 jobs in the U.S. alone. Of > > course, > > environmentalists claimed that there is a bigger > > picture > > here. All people, especially those living in > > industrialized > > countries such as the U.S., must sacrifice in order > > to win > > the universal struggle against global warming. As we > > have > > seen over the past three decades, environmentalists > > have > > succeeded in eroding property rights in the United > > States in > > order to protect Mother Earth as they see fit (i.e. > > through > > the Clean Water Act, through the Endangered Species > > Act, > > through ridiculous wetlands legislation, through air > > quality > > laws, etc). Whether or not President Bush > > understands this, > > the real struggle is between liberty and > > totalitarianism. > > For if environmentalists succeed in gradually taking > > away > > our private property rights, then a free market and > > liberty > > cannot exist. Thus, it is my contention that the > > struggle > > against environmentalism is actually a struggle for > > liberty > > (using the classical liberal definition). > > > > Undoubtedly, environmentalists will take exception > > to being > > called illiberal socialists (but I repeat myself). > > Perhaps > > there are those of you who are alarmed about global > > warming > > and sympathize with the environmental/green > > movement. My > > response is for you to be careful with whom you > > associate; > > which leads me to provide the following quote from > > Dr. George > > Reisman's magnum opus Capitalism: > > > > ... it should not be surprising to see hordes of > > former > > Reds, or of those who otherwise would have become > > Reds, > > turning from Marxism and becoming the Greens of > > the > > ecology movement. It is the same fundamental > > philosophy > > in a different guise, ready as ever to wage war on > > the > > freedom and well-being of the individual. > > > > So who are these former Reds who have converted to > > Green > > Socialism? One excellent example is Mikhail > > Gorbachev. Mr. > > Gorbachev is now the president of Green Cross > > International > > (a non-governmental environmental organization). > > Among the > > many issues with which Green Cross International has > > become > > involved, global warming is right at the top of its > > list. > > Gosh, when Mikhail Gorbachev, Ronald Reagan, and > > Margaret > > Thatcher became so chummy in the m
Re: [CTRL] Global Warming: Socialisms Trojan Horse
-Caveat Lector- So true. Greens are like watermelons -- green on the outside and red on the inside. --- "M. A. Johnson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > -Caveat Lector- > > ~~for educational purposes only~~ > [Title 17 U.S.C. section 107] > > Global Warming: Socialisms Trojan Horse > by Eric Englund > > On February 14, 2002, President Bush provided > details for > his plan to combat global warming. The cornerstone > of his > plan is to promote voluntary reductions in > greenhouse gas > emissions. Naturally, environmentalists were > outraged that > President Bush refused to adhere to the Kyoto > Treaty. It > is President Bushs contention that the Kyoto > protocol would > cost nearly 5,000,000 jobs in the U.S. alone. Of > course, > environmentalists claimed that there is a bigger > picture > here. All people, especially those living in > industrialized > countries such as the U.S., must sacrifice in order > to win > the universal struggle against global warming. As we > have > seen over the past three decades, environmentalists > have > succeeded in eroding property rights in the United > States in > order to protect Mother Earth as they see fit (i.e. > through > the Clean Water Act, through the Endangered Species > Act, > through ridiculous wetlands legislation, through air > quality > laws, etc). Whether or not President Bush > understands this, > the real struggle is between liberty and > totalitarianism. > For if environmentalists succeed in gradually taking > away > our private property rights, then a free market and > liberty > cannot exist. Thus, it is my contention that the > struggle > against environmentalism is actually a struggle for > liberty > (using the classical liberal definition). > > Undoubtedly, environmentalists will take exception > to being > called illiberal socialists (but I repeat myself). > Perhaps > there are those of you who are alarmed about global > warming > and sympathize with the environmental/green > movement. My > response is for you to be careful with whom you > associate; > which leads me to provide the following quote from > Dr. George > Reismans magnum opus Capitalism: > > ... it should not be surprising to see hordes of > former > Reds, or of those who otherwise would have become > Reds, > turning from Marxism and becoming the Greens of > the > ecology movement. It is the same fundamental > philosophy > in a different guise, ready as ever to wage war on > the > freedom and well-being of the individual. > > So who are these former Reds who have converted to > Green > Socialism? One excellent example is Mikhail > Gorbachev. Mr. > Gorbachev is now the president of Green Cross > International > (a non-governmental environmental organization). > Among the > many issues with which Green Cross International has > become > involved, global warming is right at the top of its > list. > Gosh, when Mikhail Gorbachev, Ronald Reagan, and > Margaret > Thatcher became so chummy in the mid-1980s, I never > once > heard the Soviet dictator express concern about the > environment. > Clearly, Mr. Gorbachev has identified > environmentalism as a > Trojan horse capable of resurrecting socialism on a > global > scale. > > How can I say that about Mikhail Gorbachev? Didnt > he bring > glasnost (freedom of speech) and perestroika > (economic and > political reforms) to the Soviet Union? Indeed he > did. Yet, > these were means to his end of trying to save Soviet > Communism > and, therefore, to save his absolute and unspeakable > power > (that brought human misery to millions). > > Perhaps I am being too harsh on Mr. Gorbachev? To > this I > simply respond, read Requiem for Marx (edited by > Yuri N. > Maltsev). Dr. Maltsev was a reformist member of the > Institute > of Economics of the Soviet Academy of Sciences until > he defected > in 1989 (he now is an Associate Professor of > economics at > Carthage College and is a senior fellow of the > Ludwig von Mises > Institute). In writing the introduction to this > excellent book, > Dr. Maltsev states: "Gorbachev never learned > economics in school. > In all my dealings with him I had never seen even a > slight flash > of economic insight, or even the desire to learn > more about > economics. He preferred to think like a communist: > everything > can be done by issuing orders and demanding > obedience, no matter > how perverse, contrary to human nature, and brutal > they may be." > This certainly isnt the image painted by the United > States > adoring press corps. Gorbachev seems to be so nice. > > To this I respond with another excerpt (regarding > the "nice" Mr. > Gorbachev) from Yuri Maltsevs introduction in > Requiem for Marx: > > What he did in the Baltic States authorizing the > Soviet > military to crack the skulls of innocent people in > the > Baltics qualified him to be included among > historys > litany of murderous rulers, but he was never > included. > Even while he was heralded in the West as a grea
Re: [CTRL] Global Warming: Socialisms Trojan Horse (fwd)
-Caveat Lector- Yes, Bill, everyone should be free to pollute as much as they like. Just look at how well volunteer pollution controls have worked for Bush's Texas. And then there's Enron, a true example of your idea of 'free enterprise'. Steve On 22 Feb 02, at 12:12, William Bacon wrote: > As we have > seen over the past three decades, environmentalists have > succeeded in eroding property rights in the United States in > order to protect Mother Earth as they see fit (i.e. through > the Clean Water Act, through the Endangered Species Act, > through ridiculous wetlands legislation, through air quality > laws, etc). Whether or not President Bush understands this, > the real struggle is between liberty and totalitarianism. > For if environmentalists succeed in gradually taking away > our private property rights, then a free market and liberty > cannot exist. Thus, it is my contention that the struggle > against environmentalism is actually a struggle for liberty > (using the classical liberal definition). "In little more than a year we have gone from enjoying peace and the most prosperous economy in our history, to a nation plunged into war, recession and fear. This is a nation being transformed before our very eyes." http://www.truthout.com Steve Wingate, Webmaster ANOMALOUS IMAGES AND UFO FILES http://www.anomalous-images.com http://www.ctrl.org/";>www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html";>Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/";>ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
[CTRL] Global Warming: Socialisms Trojan Horse
-Caveat Lector- ~~for educational purposes only~~ [Title 17 U.S.C. section 107] Global Warming: Socialisms Trojan Horse by Eric Englund On February 14, 2002, President Bush provided details for his plan to combat global warming. The cornerstone of his plan is to promote voluntary reductions in greenhouse gas emissions. Naturally, environmentalists were outraged that President Bush refused to adhere to the Kyoto Treaty. It is President Bushs contention that the Kyoto protocol would cost nearly 5,000,000 jobs in the U.S. alone. Of course, environmentalists claimed that there is a bigger picture here. All people, especially those living in industrialized countries such as the U.S., must sacrifice in order to win the universal struggle against global warming. As we have seen over the past three decades, environmentalists have succeeded in eroding property rights in the United States in order to protect Mother Earth as they see fit (i.e. through the Clean Water Act, through the Endangered Species Act, through ridiculous wetlands legislation, through air quality laws, etc). Whether or not President Bush understands this, the real struggle is between liberty and totalitarianism. For if environmentalists succeed in gradually taking away our private property rights, then a free market and liberty cannot exist. Thus, it is my contention that the struggle against environmentalism is actually a struggle for liberty (using the classical liberal definition). Undoubtedly, environmentalists will take exception to being called illiberal socialists (but I repeat myself). Perhaps there are those of you who are alarmed about global warming and sympathize with the environmental/green movement. My response is for you to be careful with whom you associate; which leads me to provide the following quote from Dr. George Reismans magnum opus Capitalism: ... it should not be surprising to see hordes of former Reds, or of those who otherwise would have become Reds, turning from Marxism and becoming the Greens of the ecology movement. It is the same fundamental philosophy in a different guise, ready as ever to wage war on the freedom and well-being of the individual. So who are these former Reds who have converted to Green Socialism? One excellent example is Mikhail Gorbachev. Mr. Gorbachev is now the president of Green Cross International (a non-governmental environmental organization). Among the many issues with which Green Cross International has become involved, global warming is right at the top of its list. Gosh, when Mikhail Gorbachev, Ronald Reagan, and Margaret Thatcher became so chummy in the mid-1980s, I never once heard the Soviet dictator express concern about the environment. Clearly, Mr. Gorbachev has identified environmentalism as a Trojan horse capable of resurrecting socialism on a global scale. How can I say that about Mikhail Gorbachev? Didnt he bring glasnost (freedom of speech) and perestroika (economic and political reforms) to the Soviet Union? Indeed he did. Yet, these were means to his end of trying to save Soviet Communism and, therefore, to save his absolute and unspeakable power (that brought human misery to millions). Perhaps I am being too harsh on Mr. Gorbachev? To this I simply respond, read Requiem for Marx (edited by Yuri N. Maltsev). Dr. Maltsev was a reformist member of the Institute of Economics of the Soviet Academy of Sciences until he defected in 1989 (he now is an Associate Professor of economics at Carthage College and is a senior fellow of the Ludwig von Mises Institute). In writing the introduction to this excellent book, Dr. Maltsev states: "Gorbachev never learned economics in school. In all my dealings with him I had never seen even a slight flash of economic insight, or even the desire to learn more about economics. He preferred to think like a communist: everything can be done by issuing orders and demanding obedience, no matter how perverse, contrary to human nature, and brutal they may be." This certainly isnt the image painted by the United States adoring press corps. Gorbachev seems to be so nice. To this I respond with another excerpt (regarding the "nice" Mr. Gorbachev) from Yuri Maltsevs introduction in Requiem for Marx: What he did in the Baltic States authorizing the Soviet military to crack the skulls of innocent people in the Baltics qualified him to be included among historys litany of murderous rulers, but he was never included. Even while he was heralded in the West as a great reformer, he was also running labor camps, committing human rights violations, and sending people to prison for speech crimes. As the Soviet Union came to an end, the public had been reduced to a collective of hunter gatherers, barely living at a subsistence level. Maybe the former Soviet dictator has changed. Perhaps Mikhail Gorbachev really does care about the environment and has no interest in resurrecting socialism. To this, I simply refer o
