Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel j2
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/13/2001 8:51:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Oh goody, now tell me which country you want to discuss. Prudy ANY ONE WHICH PRACTICES DEMOCRACY AND/OR MULTICULTURALIUSM. Jeez! Isn't this what we've been talking about all this time? What's with you? Are getting senile like Colleen? Well, I'm probably a lot older than Colleen so I can be forgetful. Let's try Egypt. Is that near enough for you. Turkey, of course, is multicultural and while a republic is at least as democratic as the United States, except that it's against the law not to vote. So everybody does vote. I just am not sure of your standards. Is there another democracy in the Middle East that treats half of its citizens like dogs? I don't know, but I haven't lived in all of them. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel j2
-Caveat Lector- Egypt - good example and the US sends them lots of money, and we have a good relationship with them ( at least until the rising Muslim fundamentalists take over) and so does Israel. hmmm democracies get along... excellent and again turkey in NOT an Arab country It is not the function of our government to keep the citizen from falling into error; it is the function of the citizen to keep the government from falling into error. Justice Robert H. Jackson-- NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew From: Prudence L. Kuhn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2001 09:19:55 EDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israelj2 -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/13/2001 8:51:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Oh goody, now tell me which country you want to discuss. Prudy ANY ONE WHICH PRACTICES DEMOCRACY AND/OR MULTICULTURALIUSM. Jeez! Isn't this what we've been talking about all this time? What's with you? Are getting senile like Colleen? Well, I'm probably a lot older than Colleen so I can be forgetful. Let's try Egypt. Is that near enough for you. Turkey, of course, is multicultural and while a republic is at least as democratic as the United States, except that it's against the law not to vote. So everybody does vote. I just am not sure of your standards. Is there another democracy in the Middle East that treats half of its citizens like dogs? I don't know, but I haven't lived in all of them. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance?not soap-boxing?please! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'?with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright frauds?is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel j2
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/08/2001 10:57:03 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Main Entry:Ar·ab Pronunciation:'ar-b, 'er-; dial also 'A-rab Function:noun Etymology:Middle English, from Latin Arabus, Arabs, from Greek Arab-, Araps Date:14th century 1 a : a member of the Semitic people of the Arabian peninsula b : a member of an Arabic-speaking people Oh goody, now tell me which country you want to discuss. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel j2
-Caveat Lector- Prudence L. Kuhn wrote: -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/08/2001 10:57:03 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Main Entry:Ar·ab Pronunciation:'ar-b, 'er-; dial also 'A-rab Function:noun Etymology:Middle English, from Latin Arabus, Arabs, from Greek Arab-, Araps Date:14th century 1 a : a member of the Semitic people of the Arabian peninsula b : a member of an Arabic-speaking people Oh goody, now tell me which country you want to discuss. Prudy ANY ONE WHICH PRACTICES DEMOCRACY AND/OR MULTICULTURALIUSM. Jeez! Isn't this what we've been talking about all this time? What's with you? Are getting senile like Colleen? J2 A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/06/2001 6:20:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: (Israelis are citizens of the nation state of Israel - Jews are followers of the Jewish religion. Practitioners of the Jewish religion can be found in almost every country of the world and are citizens of most countries of the world.) flw This should be so true. Perhaps once it was, for just a little time. I was truly startled when Israel became a place where non-Jews became welcome only as tourists. And it is true that practitioners of the Jewish faith are found in almost every country of the world and are citizens of those countries. Even more startling to me was the change in my country's laws that allowed American Jews to have dual citizenship and vote in Israeli elections. I had never thought of patria as a plural word. I do not know if all those Jews who live in countries other than the United States have dual citizenship, but I certainly hope not. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- dual citizenship is common in many many countries -- -- -- -- -- Planet spins - so do I neo-sufi wisdom NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew From: Prudence L. Kuhn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 09:45:46 EDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/06/2001 6:20:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: (Israelis are citizens of the nation state of Israel - Jews are followers of the Jewish religion. Practitioners of the Jewish religion can be found in almost every country of the world and are citizens of most countries of the world.) flw This should be so true. Perhaps once it was, for just a little time. I was truly startled when Israel became a place where non-Jews became welcome only as tourists. And it is true that practitioners of the Jewish faith are found in almost every country of the world and are citizens of those countries. Even more startling to me was the change in my country's laws that allowed American Jews to have dual citizenship and vote in Israeli elections. I had never thought of patria as a plural word. I do not know if all those Jews who live in countries other than the United States have dual citizenship, but I certainly hope not. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance?not soap-boxing?please! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'?with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright frauds?is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel j2
-Caveat Lector- I'm serious too. I don't know what you consider ARAB. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel j2
-Caveat Lector- Main Entry:Ar·ab Pronunciation:'ar-b, 'er-; dial also 'A-rab Function:noun Etymology:Middle English, from Latin Arabus, Arabs, from Greek Arab-, Araps Date:14th century 1 a : a member of the Semitic people of the Arabian peninsula b : a member of an Arabic-speaking people Free your mind and your ass will follow. St George NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew From: Prudence L. Kuhn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 10:43:05 EDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israelj2 -Caveat Lector- I'm serious too. I don't know what you consider ARAB. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/07/2001 6:30:58 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Well, that's pretty good. But you did leave out one or two key points. Firstly, the house does not belong to you. The house belongs to an absentee landlord in Turkey. After he lost the house in a poker game with the town officials, THEY decided to split the house in two. It was a big house. THEN Prudy, your story starts. After feeling guilty about the fires they helped start and not put out, THEN they declared that half of the half of the house will be made available to the burned out family. Wouldn't it be wonderful if the burned out family took just half the house. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel j2
-Caveat Lector- Prudence L. Kuhn wrote: -Caveat Lector- I'm serious too. I don't know what you consider ARAB. Prudy Don't play this. Your too smart. Just open a dictionary or encyclopedia. The question still stands. J2 A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- Prudence L. Kuhn wrote: -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/07/2001 6:30:58 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Well, that's pretty good. But you did leave out one or two key points. Firstly, the house does not belong to you. The house belongs to an absentee landlord in Turkey. After he lost the house in a poker game with the town officials, THEY decided to split the house in two. It was a big house. THEN Prudy, your story starts. After feeling guilty about the fires they helped start and not put out, THEN they declared that half of the half of the house will be made available to the burned out family. Wouldn't it be wonderful if the burned out family took just half the house. Prudy Yes it would. From the Jordan to Mediteranian, and the Palestinian half from the Jordan to Arabia. As was the original partition before Trans- Jordan annexed the West Bank and then lost it to Israel. Leaving a hostile enemy in the Jew's half of the house. But I'm glad you agree that Israel should take full posession of their half. J2 A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- thew wrote: -Caveat Lector- dual citizenship is common in many many countries -- -- -- -- -- Planet spins - so do I neo-sufi wisdom NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew From: Prudence L. Kuhn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 09:45:46 EDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/06/2001 6:20:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: (Israelis are citizens of the nation state of Israel - Jews are followers of the Jewish religion. Practitioners of the Jewish religion can be found in almost every country of the world and are citizens of most countries of the world.) flw This should be so true. Perhaps once it was, for just a little time. I was truly startled when Israel became a place where non-Jews became welcome only as tourists. And it is true that practitioners of the Jewish faith are found in almost every country of the world and are citizens of those countries. Even more startling to me was the change in my country's laws that allowed American Jews to have dual citizenship and vote in Israeli elections. I had never thought of patria as a plural word. I do not know if all those Jews who live in countries other than the United States have dual citizenship, but I certainly hope not. Prudy What's wrong with dual citizenship? I believe that every European country allows dual citizenship as well as many others. I know quite a few Brits who are dual citizens. I worry about their loyalty to the good ol' USA. You know we had a war against them. AND, we got into both world wars to save them. I don't know. I just don't trust THOSE people. J2 A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- There were no Israelis when the Arabs refused to sell land to the JEWS prior to WWII. So you've managed to slip out of giving a straight answer about anything. Good work. J2 You are so right. Since the state of Israeli did not yet exist before 1948, obviously the Zionists who were buying up Arab land prior to 1948 were merely looking for vacation homes as a respite from the European winter. Similiar to the British farmers who bought up farmland in South Africajust before the Boer War. flw A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/05/2001 10:01:11 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: it was the muftis who refused to share the homeland I can imagine they did, but no effort was made to explain was there? Imagine that the people down the block from you have a fire that destroys their house. The house might have been saved, but the fire department decided not to bother to respond to their call for help. Since the folks that have had the burn out have no place to call their own, they need a place to live. So, the mayor, the fire chief and the local minister (knowing they had done a bad thing by not putting out the fire) decide the family should move into your house with you. You are furious and tell everyone to get them out. You are told that several hundred years ago, the great-grandparents of this family lived in your house. That gives them a right to your domicile, and you and yours can now make your home in the garage. Chances are this matter could escalate into a real disagreement. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel j2
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/06/2001 6:03:38 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Just one question here Prudy. How many of the Arab countries DON'T practice apartheid with ANY non Arab group living within their borders? Please answer this question since you accuse Israel of doing this. Give me a list of your Arab countries, and I will check it out. I know that Palestine did not, prior to WWII, because I have an old friend who escaped from Austria with her parents, and their first stop was in Palestine which then could only have been one of those hateful Arab places. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- Prudence L. Kuhn wrote: -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/05/2001 10:01:11 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: it was the muftis who refused to share the homeland I can imagine they did, but no effort was made to explain was there? There was nothing to explain. Every one understood what was happening. The local Arabs saw an influx of foreign looking people with a different outlook and a different culture streaming into their lands. No secrets here. The Turkish and Arab elites were making money hand over fist but the Falaheen ( peasants ) could not compete with the literate and hard working newcomers. The same thing happened in the larger towns. The locals really didn't like the competition. Every one wanted to stop the influx of immigrants. For different reasons. Oooh. Oooh. Prudy is going to tell a story. Imagine that the people down the block from you have a fire that destroys their house. The house might have been saved, but the fire department decided not to bother to respond to their call for help. Since the folks that have had the burn out have no place to call their own, they need a place to live. So, the mayor, the fire chief and the local minister (knowing they had done a bad thing by not putting out the fire) decide the family should move into your house with you. You are furious and tell everyone to get them out. You are told that several hundred years ago, the great-grandparents of this family lived in your house. That gives them a right to your domicile, and you and yours can now make your home in the garage. Chances are this matter could escalate into a real disagreement. Prudy Well, that's pretty good. But you did leave out one or two key points. Firstly, the house does not belong to you. The house belongs to an absentee landlord in Turkey. After he lost the house in a poker game with the town officials, THEY decided to split the house in two. It was a big house. THEN Prudy, your story starts. After feeling guilty about the fires they helped start and not put out, THEN they declared that half of the half of the house will be made available to the burned out family. So they moved into their 1/4 of the house. But even that was unacceptable to our residents so they hired five hit men to come and kill off the unwanted newcomers. OK said the hit men. But you will need to leave for a little while because we're going to shoot up the building and kill everyone inside. After that you can come back and take possession of your whole half of the house. Once the shooting commenced it became obvious that things were not going as planned. The local renters who stayed behind got real nervous. So the newcomers helped their house mates make up their minds about the necessity to relocate because the neighborhood had gone violent. Unfortunately, the Hitmen were from the Gang That Couldn't Shoot Straight, and the newcomers kicked their sorry ass and took possession of the entire half of the house and allowed some of the original squatters to remain because they were really nice guys. Then years later the Hitmen bought new guns from their uncles Nikita and Sam, and were ready to shoot up the old house again. But the new owners had a fine neighborhood gang who were real tough and could take on all the other gangs and Hitmen from the other neighborhoods. So they did. Now the Newcomers own the whole half of the house but the old tenants don't like their new landlord. Too bossy they say. But the new landlord thinks that his old tenants are trying to burn the house down. This makes the new landlord feel real bad. Now he thinks that maybe the old tenants would be much happier moving in to the other half of the big house with the rest of their relatives and everyone will live happily ever after. And that's the end of that part of the story. Joshua2 A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel j2
-Caveat Lector- Prudence L. Kuhn wrote: -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/06/2001 6:03:38 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Just one question here Prudy. How many of the Arab countries DON'T practice apartheid with ANY non Arab group living within their borders? Please answer this question since you accuse Israel of doing this. Give me a list of your Arab countries, and I will check it out. I know that Palestine did not, prior to WWII, because I have an old friend who escaped from Austria with her parents, and their first stop was in Palestine which then could only have been one of those hateful Arab places. Prudy C'mon now .I'm serious. Get a map up on the screen and pick one. J2 A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- I wonder how Libertarian worshipers of property rights feel about that? I also wonder how our Liberals feel about the issue of ' redlining '? Or is it only bad when it's done to anyone but Jews? J2 It appears that proper question is: Is it only bad when it is done to Israelis but not by Israelis? (Israelis are citizens of the nation state of Israel - Jews are followers of the Jewish religion. Practitioners of the Jewish religion can be found in almost every country of the world and are citizens of most countries of the world.) flw flw A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- - Original Message - From: flw [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, August 06, 2001 6:46 PM Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel -Caveat Lector- I wonder how Libertarian worshipers of property rights feel about that? I also wonder how our Liberals feel about the issue of ' redlining '? Or is it only bad when it's done to anyone but Jews? J2 It appears that proper question is: Is it only bad when it is done to Israelis but not by Israelis? (Israelis are citizens of the nation state of Israel - Jews are followers of the Jewish religion. Practitioners of the Jewish religion can be found in almost every country of the world and are citizens of most countries of the world.) flw flw which begs the question- how many religions have a homeland? i have always had the feeling that erisians oughta have a homeland... somewhere sunny mibbe, but wherever it is it must have an easily resettled indigenous population. A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel j2
-Caveat Lector- Prudence L. Kuhn wrote: -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/05/2001 8:39:53 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: How do you know this? Do you know any old Nazis? What are their addresses? Inquiring minds want to know. You don't know ' too many Israelis '. I'll bet that you don't know any Israelis. Am I wrong? I have known a few Nazis, and I've met at least one Israeli. I've never known a Palestinian, although I may have passed one or two in train stations in Europe. You would be amazed how many Teutonic types suddenly arrived in the United States after WWII, who had been unable to leave Germany and return home because of the declaration of war. Uh huh. I worked in a training outfit where there were many Israeli military, although I did not talk to any of them for an extended period of time. However, while I was living in Turkey, I escorted a visiting friend to see the giant heads at Adiyaman. It was a bit off season, but they wanted to go. We asked a young Turkish man who worked with my husband to go along with us to translate for us. We paid his expenses. When we got to our hotel, one of the few open in the area at that time, we had a good dinner and then when we went to go to our rooms. A handsome, blond young man was at the desk, desperately trying for a room, but the place was full. It was very late and there just was nothing in the area. I told him that we had a room with two beds in it, and if he would like to share with our Turkish interpreter, he could pay for half the room and have a place to sleep. He was quite happy with the arrangement, and our Turkish friend did not mind either. I met him again in the morning at breakfast. He said he had slept well and was most surprised at what a nice person the Turkish guy was in spite of being a Moslem. He commented in a surprised manner that the young man not only spoke perfect English but made a lot of jokes. Those of us who were well acquainted with Omer would have expected the jokes, but I realized that this Israeli who was a physicist and extremely well educated in other matters as well had learned to dehumanize the Arabs of the world. He was not criticizing Arabs. He was criticizing Moslems. Turks are not Arabs. Today Israel and Moslem Turkey are strong allies. They are prepared to war against Arab/Moslem Syria, Arab/Moslem Iraq, and Aryan-Non Arab/Moslem Iran. You are asking what Nazis and what Israeli we have known? Not as many as we might like to claim since we are not co-located, but here was a good Israeli citizen who truly had never known a Palestinian. I remember too that he had not read The Dancing Wu Li Masters, and I gave him a deposit slip which contained my name and address, so that if he could not find the book in Israel in either Hebrew or English, I would send him the copy I had. I did not hear from him, which I assume meant that he had obtained a copy. I could not imagine a physicist who had not had an opportunity to read that book. I hope he enjoyed it, and I hope that before he dies, he will actually get to know a Palestinian. God must not mind apartheid. Prudy Just one question here Prudy. How many of the Arab countries DON'T practice apartheid with ANY non Arab group living within their borders? Please answer this question since you accuse Israel of doing this. J2 A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- c. wrote: -Caveat Lector- - Original Message - From: flw [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, August 06, 2001 6:46 PM Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel -Caveat Lector- I wonder how Libertarian worshipers of property rights feel about that? I also wonder how our Liberals feel about the issue of ' redlining '? Or is it only bad when it's done to anyone but Jews? J2 It appears that proper question is: Is it only bad when it is done to Israelis but not by Israelis? (Israelis are citizens of the nation state of Israel - Jews are followers of the Jewish religion. Practitioners of the Jewish religion can be found in almost every country of the world and are citizens of most countries of the world.) flw flw which begs the question- how many religions have a homeland? Only one. Catholocism. J2 i have always had the feeling that erisians oughta have a homeland... somewhere sunny mibbe, but wherever it is it must have an easily resettled indigenous population. A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- flw wrote: -Caveat Lector- I wonder how Libertarian worshipers of property rights feel about that? I guess property rights worshipers don't want to answer this question. I also wonder how our Liberals feel about the issue of ' redlining '? Or is it only bad when it's done to anyone but Jews? J2 It appears that proper question is: Is it only bad when it is done to Israelis but not by Israelis? No. The question I posed was the proper question. The question YOU pose is a slight of hand distraction, and historically inaccurate. There were no Israelis when the Arabs refused to sell land to the JEWS prior to WWII. So you've managed to slip out of giving a straight answer about anything. Good work. J2 (Israelis are citizens of the nation state of Israel - Jews are followers of the Jewish religion. Practitioners of the Jewish religion can be found in almost every country of the world and are citizens of most countries of the world.) flw A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- flw wrote: -Caveat Lector- It's not because Jews were Nazis. Pssst. Jews didn't really like the Nazis. J2 The Nazis are not a people. But people are are Nazis. German people, Dutch people, Hungarian people, Ukrainian people, French people, Croatian people, Vatican people, and some American people. Nazism tranascends race, religion and nationality. The modern state of Israel is tracking towards Nazism (of course it is not the only country doing this). This is bullshit. Prove that it's Nazism. Nazism and not something else. Too many Israeli's have a Nazi mentality towards the Palestinians You don't know ' too many Israelis '. I'll bet that you don't know any Israelis. Am I wrong? - they consider the Palestinians an inferior people: racially, culturally, religiously, economically, etc. They have become the Pre WWII European Slavs according to the German Nazi mindset. What the hell are you talking about? You could say that they have become like Europeans in America, or Belgians in the Congo, or the English in Australia, or the Japanese in Korea. You could say all of these things just as easily. But you would still be full of shit. Why? Because all the above murdered millions. And the Israelis did not. Even though they could choose to do so anytime. This is the classic mindset of Nationalist Nazis who justify those whose land they want to steal by dehumanizing them. Too many Israeli's see arab land as natural expansion territory or in other words lebenstraum. Once you dehumanize a group, it is much easier to kill them. That's a valid description of some groups' behavior. But what was this behavior called BEFORE Nazism? Surely the Nazis didn't invent it. So why would you assign it to Israelis as Nazism? Don't bother. I know the answer. How did the Nazis take control in Germany? By convincing the German people that they were their only salvation...that Germany was besieged on all sides by enemies out to destroy Germany (of course the Nazis did everything in their power to provoke social disruption and cause a self fulfilling prophecy). The Israeli Nazis have done a masterful job in silencing and cowing the majority in Israeli that is not Nazi minded by provoking the Palestinians and bringing about their own self fullfilling prophecy. And by this theory, the Palestinians have no responsibility at all because the Israeli/Nazis made them do it. Listen buddy. You are not dealing with beer swilling trailer trash here. Israelis are highly educated and VERY politically sophisticated as a group. There are dozens, DOZENS of news papers printed every day which cover the entire political spectrum from extreme Left to extreme Right. These people made a fair attempt at reconciliation with the Palestinians and the Palestinians were too stupid to realize their opportunity to get ahead. After this the Israeli public understood that there is no point to dicking around with the Palestinians any more. No Fuhrer brainwashed them. On the contrary, all the propaganda organs were for the continuation of the Oslo sham. They voted in Sharon because they want an end to the bullshit and violence of the local Arabs. This was a free, informed democratic choice which the Israelis will live with and the Palestinians will not. Your Nazi analogy is not applicable. All you do is show your ignorance when you try to intellectualize your bigotry. You might impress the likes of Shannon, Yardbird, Prudy, and Looneybird Saba, but that's not much. As long as Israelis allow the tail to wag the dog by permitting the Settler Colonialists to dictate policy, the only future for Israel is increasing militarization and nazification. A national bunker and self destructive mentality. The Israelis will win. The Israelis will do what it takes. It is clear that the current Israeli policy is to commit continuing atrocities against the Palestinians and to provoke them into an escalating terror bombing (terrorist bombing is bombing by people rather then multi milliion dollar helicopters, M-60 tanks, and F16's) campaign against Israel so Sharon can justify an invasion of the Palestinian land and commit mass murder terror against the Palestinian civilian population thereby reducing them to submissive peonage. Then it would be a DAMN good idea for the Palestinians not to fall for it eh? All they have to do to stop the inevitable is to stop killing Jews. Simple. Part of Sharon's campaign has already succeeded. Any Palestinian political force for moderation has been effectively destroyed by Sharon's blatant terrorist (aka targeted assassination) attacks against mainly Palestinian civilians and politicians. You don't know what the hell your talking about. You don't even know the names of these people, much less their political beliefs as moderates. You are SO full of shit. Israelis are Nazis, and Hamas are Moderates. Who can take you seriously. You are a joke. You've been taking Poly Sci
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/05/2001 8:39:53 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: How do you know this? Do you know any old Nazis? What are their addresses? Inquiring minds want to know. You don't know ' too many Israelis '. I'll bet that you don't know any Israelis. Am I wrong? I have known a few Nazis, and I've met at least one Israeli. I've never known a Palestinian, although I may have passed one or two in train stations in Europe. You would be amazed how many Teutonic types suddenly arrived in the United States after WWII, who had been unable to leave Germany and return home because of the declaration of war. Uh huh. I worked in a training outfit where there were many Israeli military, although I did not talk to any of them for an extended period of time. However, while I was living in Turkey, I escorted a visiting friend to see the giant heads at Adiyaman. It was a bit off season, but they wanted to go. We asked a young Turkish man who worked with my husband to go along with us to translate for us. We paid his expenses. When we got to our hotel, one of the few open in the area at that time, we had a good dinner and then when we went to go to our rooms. A handsome, blond young man was at the desk, desperately trying for a room, but the place was full. It was very late and there just was nothing in the area. I told him that we had a room with two beds in it, and if he would like to share with our Turkish interpreter, he could pay for half the room and have a place to sleep. He was quite happy with the arrangement, and our Turkish friend did not mind either. I met him again in the morning at breakfast. He said he had slept well and was most surprised at what a nice person the Turkish guy was in spite of being a Moslem. He commented in a surprised manner that the young man not only spoke perfect English but made a lot of jokes. Those of us who were well acquainted with Omer would have expected the jokes, but I realized that this Israeli who was a physicist and extremely well educated in other matters as well had learned to dehumanize the Arabs of the world. You are asking what Nazis and what Israeli we have known? Not as many as we might like to claim since we are not co-located, but here was a good Israeli citizen who truly had never known a Palestinian. I remember too that he had not read The Dancing Wu Li Masters, and I gave him a deposit slip which contained my name and address, so that if he could not find the book in Israel in either Hebrew or English, I would send him the copy I had. I did not hear from him, which I assume meant that he had obtained a copy. I could not imagine a physicist who had not had an opportunity to read that book. I hope he enjoyed it, and I hope that before he dies, he will actually get to know a Palestinian. God must not mind apartheid. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- this is factually inaccurate it was the muftis who refused to share the homeland -- -- -- -- -- Planet spins - so do I neo-sufi wisdom NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew From: Prudence L. Kuhn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 08:02:04 EDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel places. First of all the bad consciences of the allied leaders at the end of WWII and then in the decisions of some highly placed Israeli leaders who decided that they were not going to share the homeland they had finally gotten their hands on. Di A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- thew wrote: -Caveat Lector- this is factually inaccurate it was the muftis who refused to share the homeland This is half right. Actually, no Arabs, not those in Palestine or out wanted to share. Their religion does not allow it. The Muftis were the expounders of that religious point . Palestimian Arabs who sold their private land to Jews were assasinated. I wonder how Libertarian worshipers of property rights feel about that? I also wonder how our Liberals feel about the issue of ' redlining '? Or is it only bad when it's done to anyone but Jews? J2 -- -- -- -- Planet spins - so do I neo-sufi wisdom NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew From: Prudence L. Kuhn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 08:02:04 EDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel places. First of all the bad consciences of the allied leaders at the end of WWII and then in the decisions of some highly placed Israeli leaders who decided that they were not going to share the homeland they had finally gotten their hands on. Di A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- Prudy, I apologize. I was under the impression that you were saying that the holocaust was unimportant in the face of all the other destruction that went on in WWII. Your response was heartening and I realize that you do not think that. Please forgive my overeager reply. I do not approve of torture or torment of any people for any reason. I just feel that too many people are posting anti-Israeli articles that omit the fact that there are definitely two sides to the problems going on in the middle-east. Despite my last name, I feel that the arabs have let the Palestinian people suffer for arab gain. I do have a heart for the Palestinians, but don't see it as the Israeli's fault. The Jordanians, and other arab countries, could have absorbed these people decades ago but refused to do in order to create this very problem. The other arab nations do not want, and never did want, the nation of Israel to exist. This is their way of fighting it. And judging by this list, it is working. From: Prudence L. Kuhn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 09:00:57 EDT -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/02/2001 4:48:57 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Oh Prudy, did you suffer from WWII as well? You have a crappy attitude. I hardly think that the Jews feel like they were the only ones to suffer. They were there, remember? They saw others being tortured and dehumanized by your heroes, the nazis. Why do you thrive on making less of it than it really was? Could be you're still mad that the Allies took your S.S. whip from you. -Ashley What are you talking about? I guess I might have suffered a tiny bit in WW II. The things done to the Jews in Europe by the Nazis were unthinkable. The films at the end of the war showed such horror that watching them was a penance. What could ever make you think I could have approved of that? The Nazis were beasts. The Jews who survived told us that, and there is no reason for disbelief. I am not making less of it. I am making more of it. Remember, the Jews who survived the Holocaust that seemed to have been approved by the British and American authorities (not to mention Pope Pius) are mostly gone now, and in many cases were not treated fairly even by the Israel whose methods you seem to approve. Torture and torment are not exclusive to the Nazis in Germany and the European populations of World War II. Torture and torment perpetrated by Israeli against the Palestinians is no less disgusting. Torture and torment of a people because of their race and/or religion is a Nazi characteristic and is abhorrent. You may approve of what the Israeli have done and are doing to the Palestinians but I cannot. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- - Original Message - From: ashley Abraham [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 7:58 AM Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel -Caveat Lector- Despite my last name, I feel that the arabs have let the Palestinian people suffer for arab gain. I do have a heart for the Palestinians, but don't see it as the Israeli's fault. The Jordanians, and other arab countries, could have absorbed these people decades ago this is a shitty remark. tell me ashley (and don't bother with the hysterical anti-semiticim accusations) do you think israel should comply with the numerous UN resolutions? but refused to do in order to create this very problem. The other arab nations do not want, and never did want, the nation of Israel to exist. This is their way of fighting it. And judging by this list, it is working. it is a one sided war. it is a war between a very heavily armed nation state with seemingly endless support from amerika against a civilian population who are so desperate that the only resource they have is to use suicide bombers. suicide bombers are only ever going to be symbols of defiance against their oppressors. it is not a workable offence or defence tactic. it is the sign of a people completely subdued and without any means of defending themselves in a desperately horrid situation. you can judge the list all you want- the fuck i care what you think. i can be an anti-zionist without being anti-semite. prudy is right (if i understood her correctly)- the jews lay claim to the horror of the holocaust to the exclusion of all the other victims of the nazis. seemingly forgetting that there were many specific targets and victims. the jews aren't special in that context- just one vicitm of many. you say that if comparisons between nazis and jews is relevent then it is the same with nazis and palestinians/ arabs because they hate israelis. i cannot agree at all- the isralis are not ghettoised the way the palestinians are. at all. the palestinians are fucked. waaay fucked. and it is israel thatis doiiung it- and we are all sitting back and watching gunships versus rock throwers. we are all fucked. A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- No Ashley, it was Gideon the hit and run assassin, who stood every man in his place? Love the title of your little argument here - I can smell you from here. Saba A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/04/2001 2:58:27 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Despite my last name, I feel that the arabs have let the Palestinian people suffer for arab gain. I do have a heart for the Palestinians, but don't see it as the Israeli's fault. The Jordanians, and other arab countries, could have absorbed these people decades ago but refused to do in order to create this very problem. The other arab nations do not want, and never did want, the nation of Israel to exist. No matter what anyone's name is or their cultural heritage, an unbiased view is required. It is one of the most difficult challenges there is. No matter who we are, we all fall into some kind of groups--age, sex, religion, politics are just a few. It takes some long meditation sometimes to see the other side. And then as one member of a group that I am part of says, The other side has another side. The situation in the Middle East is not the fault of the Israeli, but it is not the fault of the Palestinians either. As I see it, the fault lies in two places. First of all the bad consciences of the allied leaders at the end of WWII and then in the decisions of some highly placed Israeli leaders who decided that they were not going to share the homeland they had finally gotten their hands on. Different religions, tribes, and cultures have existed side by side in the area that is now Israel since the beginning of time, sometimes under the yoke of conquerors, sometimes as ruling, sometimes as subject factions. Today's politics do not seem to allow such co-existence. As for the arabs of Jordan and other places taking in the arabs of Palestine. That is not realistic. Would you expect the United States to take in the population of Canada or vice versa if say China took over one or the other of those countries tomorrow and said to the present population, We don't want you here.? The arabs as you call them are not all the same religion. Many are Christian (but of many different types of Christian worship) and the Moslems may be any one of several Islamic factions. They do not necessarily speak the same languages. Even in Turkey, it is common for one small community to have four languages present. And little, money-strapped Turkey was one of the few places where the Pesmergah, Kurdish refugees from Iraq, were welcomed and provided for. Would Mexico welcome the population of Nicaragua? One country cannot take in the population of another just to make things more comfortable for a take-over. I see no good resolution for the situation in Israel. The Israeli are very determined, very powerful and they have powerful friends. They will win, and the Palestinians will gradually cease to be. They cannot be absorbed or even allowed to exist. The terrible things that are happening to the Palestinians will not stop until there are no more Palestinians or the small remnant of them who survive will exist as the Ainu do in present day Japan--a kind of quaint reminder of another time. One cannot blame the Israeli for their actions in this matter any more than one can blame the citizens of the United States for taking their country from the Native Americans who were its citizens when their ancestors landed on these shores. This kind of thing is the normal human endeavor. We know that power is not going to be shared. What actually bothers me is the vilification of the Palestinians. To hear insults heaped on a people whose main flaw is that they have been relieved of their country is a hard thing to countenance. To know that the torture and torment of these people brings pleasure to others is even harder to endure. Life has always been and will always be a brutal struggle. The strong must win. It is not necessary to enjoy the defeat of the vanquished. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/04/2001 12:15:36 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 50's; before anyone had a chance to put their own slant on things. You should also read The Warrior by Ariel Sharon, if you are not too far gone on hating all jews. He gives a good account of what it was like in Israel before and during WWII. But there was no Israel before WWII. PRudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
In a message dated 8/3/01 11:15:36 PM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Bill, you should read a little book called The Rise And Fall Of The Third Reich, written in the 50's; before anyone had a chance to put their own slant on things. You should also read The Warrior by Ariel Sharon, if you are not too far gone on hating all jews. Ashley, To spell it out for you- I don't hate "all Jews"...I don't really "hate" anyone, I quite dislike the ethnic cleansing that the Zionists in Israel are carrying out and I frankly think that the historic ties between the Zionists and Hitler are something that has been suppressed for too long. I'd read Sharon's book as a curio, he after all is one of the worst offenders of his movement and clearly a war criminal. Bill.
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
In a message dated 8/4/01 8:12:54 AM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I frankly think that the historic ties between the Zionists and Hitler are something that has been suppressed for too long. Yeah right!! But what about the historic ties beteween Zionism and the Borg Collective? And we cannot ignore the historic ties to the Kodan Armada can we. Carl Ben Zaddock
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel -Ashley, Saba nix the @#$%^
-Caveat Lector- Very well said, Prudy. Om K Ashley and Saba, an interesting debate, but can we please tone down the rhetoric and name-calling. Can it. Or be gone. Capricious dictator of this list - me. Om K A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel -Ashley, Saba nix the @#$%^
-Caveat Lector- Okay Om K. Saba A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel J2
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 8/2/01 8:44:50 PM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So it goes in the real world. If this bothers you, good. No one gives a shit. But don't go making up silly stuff. It makes you seem dumb like Saba, and shallow like Prudy. Argue you position from the truth like a man. Your history is flawed. I have made nothing up and only report the truth unlike you. J2 I have the VERY best record of being both consistently honest AND accurate. The proof is in the archives. I won't bother saying more about this subject because it's not necessary. It's very clear that you are nothing more than a shill, that you are a Zionist and that you, like your Zionist friends are short-tempered and don't suffer dissent well. J2 I'm tired of you racist pricks. I am not now, nor have I ever been a Zionist. Officially, unofficially, or otherwise. I am however, against the destruction of Israel. I am a Jew. I am not an Arab. If I were an Arab, I would be pro-Palestinian. I am not working for or affiliated with ANY Jewish or Zionist groups or organizations. I don't really give a fuck what you think, but I do want to put it on record. I don't care for the Nazis nor do I care for the Zionists and they really are kindred spirits. J2 Silly bigot. If the Zionists were like Nazis the would be NO Palestinian issue at this time at all. That's the proof that you are a vicious bigot. Spouting this Arab / Neo-Nazi drivel shows you for what you are. And having Icke as a source makes it obvious. For you to insist that this isn't the case makes your stripes perfectly clear, and that's fine but please don't ever claim to be anything but a very biased shill ok? J2 Fuck you asshole. Don't tell me what I am, when you don't have a clue. I'm not sure why you even bother...your lobby is one of the most powerful in America and has more than ample chances to spread its propaganda in mainstream forums. J2 I bother because I am the only one on this ( and other ) list(s) who goes to the trouble of exposing the lies of people like you. Just your above paragraph is a fine example. If you were a real researcher, you could randomly monitor the Net and the US and world media ANY DAY and see that the overwhelming media coverage is Pro-Palestinian. That is what's known as a fact. Anybody reading this can test this statement. You, on the other hand continue with your stupid 'Jews control the world media conspiracy theory'. If that were indeed the case, then you wouldn't really see the overwhelmingly one sided coverage you do. I keep daily vodeo records of TV broadcast news shows. I monitor AT LEAST 4 news programs every day, including the BBC and ITN. I actually know what I'm talking about, while you live in your emotional sewer of bigoted fanatsy. I want to repeat. ANYBODY READING THIS CAN TEST AND COMPARE. Zionism IS racism, you know this well J2. Bill. J2 Zionism is Jewish nationalism. It doesn't really matter what others think about it. It doesn't really matter because all your wheel spinning is irrelevant. If you don't like the way it's playing out in the Mid East, great! I wouldn't have it any other way. So it goes in the real world. If this bothers you, good. No one gives a shit. But don't go making up silly stuff. It makes you seem dumb like Saba, and shallow like Prudy. Argue you position from the truth like a man. Joshua2 A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- J2, Thanks, I couldn't have said it better myself. Bill, you should read a little book called The Rise And Fall Of The Third Reich, written in the 50's; before anyone had a chance to put their own slant on things. You should also read The Warrior by Ariel Sharon, if you are not too far gone on hating all jews. He gives a good account of what it was like in Israel before and during WWII. -Ashley No little Ashley is not poorly informed. You little Willy are a little bigot who learns about Jews from the Neo-Nazis. Not the most reliable source for studying Jewish history. You take the tiny fraction of the Zionist movement of the time and claim it's actions for the whole movement. Besides being a racist schmuck, you seem to think that people are as gullible as you. I'm going to let you in on a little secret. It was that the Brits were the ones preventing the European Jews from emigrating to Palestine that made the faction that Shamir belonged to consider the Brits a worse enemy of Zionism than the Nazis AT THAT POINT IN TIME. It's not because Jews were Nazis. Pssst. Jews didn't really like the Nazis. These Zionists were mainly responsible for evicting the Brits after the war. No Nazis. No Brits. Just Arabs. Five armies of them and the Local Arabs A.K.A. Palestinians. They fought. They lost. They're out. So it goes in the real world. If this bothers you, good. No one gives a shit. But don't go making up silly stuff. It makes you seem dumb like Saba, and shallow like Prudy. Argue you position from the truth like a man. J2 A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- FLW, I wonder, how do the Arabs feel about the Jews? Couldn't they be considered Nazis as well by these standards? From: flw [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 08:33:50 -0400 -Caveat Lector- It's not because Jews were Nazis. Pssst. Jews didn't really like the Nazis. J2 The Nazis are not a people. Nazism tranascends race, religion and nationality. The modern state of Israel is tracking towards Nazism (of course it is not the only country doing this). Too many Israeli's have a Nazi mentality towards the Palestinians - they consider the Palestinians an inferior people: racially, culturally, religiously, economically, etc. They have become the Pre WWII European Slavs according to the German Nazi mindset. This is the classic mindset of Nationalist Nazis who justify those whose land they want to steal by dehumanizing them. Too many Israeli's see arab land as natural expansion territory or in other words lebenstraum. Once you dehumanize a group, it is much easier to kill them. How did the Nazis take control in Germany? By convincing the German people that they were their only salvation...that Germany was besieged on all sides by enemies out to destroy Germany (of course the Nazis did everything in their power to provoke social disruption and cause a self fulfilling prophecy). The Israeli Nazis have done a masterful job in silencing and cowing the majority in Israeli that is not Nazi minded by provoking the Palestinians and bringing about their own self fullfilling prophecy. As long as Israelis allow the tail to wag the dog by permitting the Settler Colonialists to dictate policy, the only future for Israel is increasing militarization and nazification. A national bunker and self destructive mentality. It is clear that the current Israeli policy is to commit continuing atrocities against the Palestinians and to provoke them into an escalating terror bombing (terrorist bombing is bombing by people rather then multi milliion dollar helicopters, M-60 tanks, and F16's) campaign against Israel so Sharon can justify an invasion of the Palestinian land and commit mass murder terror against the Palestinian civilian population thereby reducing them to submissive peonage. Part of Sharon's campaign has already succeeded. Any Palestinian political force for moderation has been effectively destroyed by Sharon's blatant terrorist (aka targeted assassination) attacks against mainly Palestinian civilians and politicians. The Israeli Nazi types worse fear is a deal that would disband the Settler Colonialist outposts in return for an internationally guaranteed peace treaty. The Mitchell Solution is anathema to the Sharon Gang. Can Jews be Nazis? Of course. The old Nazis are laughing from their graves or their wheelchairs in South America...the victims have become the oppressors. Imitation is the highest form of flattery. flw A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- Oh Prudy, did you suffer from WWII as well? You have a crappy attitude. I hardly think that the Jews feel like they were the only ones to suffer. They were there, remember? They saw others being tortured and dehumanized by your heroes, the nazis. Why do you thrive on making less of it than it really was? Could be you're still mad that the Allies took your S.S. whip from you. -Ashley From: Prudence L. Kuhn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2001 11:26:01 EDT -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 07/31/2001 6:37:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Only followed orders sounds awful to people with a memory. The Danes, it seems, remember. Just sounds like the Israeli anthem--Only WE suffered during World War II. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- Taken from an earlier article on this list: The equation of Zionism with the Holocaust, though, is based on a false presumption. Far from being a haven for all Jews, Israel is founded by Zionist Jews who helped the Nazis fill the gas chambers and stoke the ovens of the death camps. Israel would not be possible today if the World Zionist Congress and other Zionist agencies hadn't formed common cause with Hitler's exterminators to rid Europe of Jews. In exchange for helping round up non-Zionist Jews, sabotage Jewish resistance movements, and betray the trust of Jews, Zionists secured for themselves safe passage to Palestine. This arrangement was formalized in a number of emigration agreements signed in 1938. The most notorious case of Zionist collusion concerned Dr. Rudolph Kastner Chairman of the Zionist Organization in Hungary from 1943-45. To secure the safe passage of 600 Zionists to Palestine, he helped the Nazis send 800,000 Hungarian Jews to their deaths. The Israeli Supreme Court officially whitewashed Kastner's crimes because to admit them would have denied Israel the moral right to exist. At 01:48 AM 8/2/2001 -0700, you wrote: -Caveat Lector- Oh Prudy, did you suffer from WWII as well? You have a crappy attitude. I hardly think that the Jews feel like they were the only ones to suffer. They were there, remember? They saw others being tortured and dehumanized by your heroes, the nazis. Why do you thrive on making less of it than it really was? Could be you're still mad that the Allies took your S.S. whip from you. -Ashley From: Prudence L. Kuhn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2001 11:26:01 EDT -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 07/31/2001 6:37:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Only followed orders sounds awful to people with a memory. The Danes, it seems, remember. Just sounds like the Israeli anthem--Only WE suffered during World War II. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om Evan Morris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: + 27 11 792 2777 Fax: +27 11 792 2711 Free Mumia Abu-Jamal http://www.mumia2000.org/top.html Everybody should think they're ultra-cool. The world would be a much better
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- So what Ev? One bad apple ruins the whole barrel? If that is so, God help America. From what I've seen of Americans on this list, we deserve to be put out of our self-agrandizing misery. Thank God this is not how the whole of this country thinks. The true Zionists in Israel during WWII were busy fighting off the arabs who were armed by the Nazis, not off consorting with Hitler. Only liars believe lies. From: Evan Morris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 10:48:45 +0200 -Caveat Lector- Taken from an earlier article on this list: The equation of Zionism with the Holocaust, though, is based on a false presumption. Far from being a haven for all Jews, Israel is founded by Zionist Jews who helped the Nazis fill the gas chambers and stoke the ovens of the death camps. Israel would not be possible today if the World Zionist Congress and other Zionist agencies hadn't formed common cause with Hitler's exterminators to rid Europe of Jews. In exchange for helping round up non-Zionist Jews, sabotage Jewish resistance movements, and betray the trust of Jews, Zionists secured for themselves safe passage to Palestine. This arrangement was formalized in a number of emigration agreements signed in 1938. The most notorious case of Zionist collusion concerned Dr. Rudolph Kastner Chairman of the Zionist Organization in Hungary from 1943-45. To secure the safe passage of 600 Zionists to Palestine, he helped the Nazis send 800,000 Hungarian Jews to their deaths. The Israeli Supreme Court officially whitewashed Kastner's crimes because to admit them would have denied Israel the moral right to exist. At 01:48 AM 8/2/2001 -0700, you wrote: -Caveat Lector- Oh Prudy, did you suffer from WWII as well? You have a crappy attitude. I hardly think that the Jews feel like they were the only ones to suffer. They were there, remember? They saw others being tortured and dehumanized by your heroes, the nazis. Why do you thrive on making less of it than it really was? Could be you're still mad that the Allies took your S.S. whip from you. -Ashley From: Prudence L. Kuhn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2001 11:26:01 EDT -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 07/31/2001 6:37:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Only followed orders sounds awful to people with a memory. The Danes, it seems, remember. Just sounds like the Israeli anthem--Only WE suffered during World War II. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- At 02:35 AM 8/2/2001 -0700, you wrote: -Caveat Lector- So what Ev? One bad apple ruins the whole barrel? If that is so, God help America. From what I've seen of Americans on this list, we deserve to be put out of our self-agrandizing misery. I agree. But then, I'm not an American. :-) Thank God this is not how the whole of this country thinks. The true Zionists in Israel during WWII were busy fighting off the arabs who were armed by the Nazis, not off consorting with Hitler. Only liars believe lies. From: Evan Morris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 10:48:45 +0200 -Caveat Lector- Taken from an earlier article on this list: The equation of Zionism with the Holocaust, though, is based on a false presumption. Far from being a haven for all Jews, Israel is founded by Zionist Jews who helped the Nazis fill the gas chambers and stoke the ovens of the death camps. Israel would not be possible today if the World Zionist Congress and other Zionist agencies hadn't formed common cause with Hitler's exterminators to rid Europe of Jews. In exchange for helping round up non-Zionist Jews, sabotage Jewish resistance movements, and betray the trust of Jews, Zionists secured for themselves safe passage to Palestine. This arrangement was formalized in a number of emigration agreements signed in 1938. The most notorious case of Zionist collusion concerned Dr. Rudolph Kastner Chairman of the Zionist Organization in Hungary from 1943-45. To secure the safe passage of 600 Zionists to Palestine, he helped the Nazis send 800,000 Hungarian Jews to their deaths. The Israeli Supreme Court officially whitewashed Kastner's crimes because to admit them would have denied Israel the moral right to exist. At 01:48 AM 8/2/2001 -0700, you wrote: -Caveat Lector- Oh Prudy, did you suffer from WWII as well? You have a crappy attitude. I hardly think that the Jews feel like they were the only ones to suffer. They were there, remember? They saw others being tortured and dehumanized by your heroes, the nazis. Why do you thrive on making less of it than it really was? Could be you're still mad that the Allies took your S.S. whip from you. -Ashley From: Prudence L. Kuhn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2001 11:26:01 EDT -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 07/31/2001 6:37:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Only followed orders sounds awful to people with a memory. The Danes, it seems, remember. Just sounds like the Israeli anthem--Only WE suffered during World War II. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- After reading this shit put out by Ashley, it makes one wonder if we did not fight on the wrong side in WWII - many people thought we did. It took von Braun to get us to the moon while moslems, JEWS, and christians still worship pieces of rock in the holy land but the Israelies big guns, we pay for them to slaughter little children Read the Talmud if you want to see what - well put it this way, something evil this way cometh. Something has been festering and rotting in Israel for a long time - and America has slowly been rotting away under this same Zionist influence. Israel is a welfare state - and it is about time these bullies were let us say, stood in their place .. and their place is beneatha the feet of any good Knights Templar. Saba Jihud is forever A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 08/02/2001 4:48:57 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Oh Prudy, did you suffer from WWII as well? You have a crappy attitude. I hardly think that the Jews feel like they were the only ones to suffer. They were there, remember? They saw others being tortured and dehumanized by your heroes, the nazis. Why do you thrive on making less of it than it really was? Could be you're still mad that the Allies took your S.S. whip from you. -Ashley What are you talking about? I guess I might have suffered a tiny bit in WW II. The things done to the Jews in Europe by the Nazis were unthinkable. The films at the end of the war showed such horror that watching them was a penance. What could ever make you think I could have approved of that? The Nazis were beasts. The Jews who survived told us that, and there is no reason for disbelief. I am not making less of it. I am making more of it. Remember, the Jews who survived the Holocaust that seemed to have been approved by the British and American authorities (not to mention Pope Pius) are mostly gone now, and in many cases were not treated fairly even by the Israel whose methods you seem to approve. Torture and torment are not exclusive to the Nazis in Germany and the European populations of World War II. Torture and torment perpetrated by Israeli against the Palestinians is no less disgusting. Torture and torment of a people because of their race and/or religion is a Nazi characteristic and is abhorrent. You may approve of what the Israeli have done and are doing to the Palestinians but I cannot. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- Hey, I'm sure that after being on this list, you are thankful of that, eh? What a pretty picture we make. I hope that you are embarrassed for us. O'er the land of the FREE, and the home of the hate groups. Yeeehaw, I'm so proud of all of you. Let's just bomb the shit out of those insane Jews for thinking they should have freedom in their OWN COUNTRY! EGAD!!! I agree. But then, I'm not an American. :-) _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
In a message dated 8/2/01 4:35:33 AM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The true Zionists in Israel during WWII were busy fighting off the arabs who were armed by the Nazis, not off consorting with Hitler. Only liars believe lies. The "true Zionists" were indeed consorting with Hitler and Mussolini and company. You need to read your history and not the propaganda that passes as being "fair and balanced". The real enemy of the German Zionist's of that era were German Jews who favored assimililation, the future Jewish state was FAR more important to the Zionists than these anti-fascists. Yitzak Shamir wanted to forge an alliance with Hitler against the Brits in 1941!! The Zionists and the Nazis had a common goal which was to gather the Jews into a world ghetto...Madagascar, Palestine...didn't much matter initially. You little Ashley are poorly informed! Bill.
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 8/2/01 4:35:33 AM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The true Zionists in Israel during WWII were busy fighting off the arabs who were armed by the Nazis, not off consorting with Hitler. Only liars believe lies. The true Zionists were indeed consorting with Hitler and Mussolini and company. You need to read your history and not the propaganda that passes as being fair and balanced. The real enemy of the German Zionist's of that era were German Jews who favored assimililation, the future Jewish state was FAR more important to the Zionists than these anti-fascists. Yitzak Shamir wanted to forge an alliance with Hitler against the Brits in 1941!! The Zionists and the Nazis had a common goal which was to gather the Jews into a world ghetto...Madagascar, Palestine...didn't much matter initially. You little Ashley are poorly informed! Bill. + No little Ashley is not poorly informed. You little Willy are a little bigot who learns about Jews from the Neo-Nazis. Not the most reliable source for studying Jewish history. You take the tiny fraction of the Zionist movement of the time and claim it's actions for the whole movement. Besides being a racist schmuck, you seem to think that people are as gullible as you. I'm going to let you in on a little secret. It was that the Brits were the ones preventing the European Jews from emigrating to Palestine that made the faction that Shamir belonged to consider the Brits a worse enemy of Zionism than the Nazis AT THAT POINT IN TIME. It's not because Jews were Nazis. Pssst. Jews didn't really like the Nazis. These Zionists were mainly responsible for evicting the Brits after the war. No Nazis. No Brits. Just Arabs. Five armies of them and the Local Arabs A.K.A. Palestinians. They fought. They lost. They're out. So it goes in the real world. If this bothers you, good. No one gives a shit. But don't go making up silly stuff. It makes you seem dumb like Saba, and shallow like Prudy. Argue you position from the truth like a man. J2 A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 07/31/2001 6:37:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Only followed orders sounds awful to people with a memory. The Danes, it seems, remember. Just sounds like the Israeli anthem--Only WE suffered during World War II. Prudy A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
[CTRL] Something Rotten In The State Of Israel
http://www.mediamonitors.net/index.html
Something is Rotten in the State of Israel
by Uri Avnery
There is no international law against stupidity. Therefore, Karmi Gilon
cannot be tried on this account.
The foolish actions of the Ambassador-on-the-way (the way home) start with
his agreeing to become the Israeli ambassador in Denmark in the first place.
Denmark is a very sensitive country. For some reason, the Danes don’t like
torture, nor do they like torturers. Why would a person who headed the
Israeli Security Service (nicknamed Shin-Bet or Shabak, by its Hebrew
initials), at a time when it practiced wholesale torture, insist on serving
in Denmark of all places? Why should he not be content with the post of
ambassador in Guatemala or the Congo?
One could phrase it like this: Early in life a person must decide what he
wants to become when he grows up. He can either become a Shin-Betnick or an
ambassador to Denmark. He can’t become both.
But Gilon accepted the job. That was folly #1. It was nothing compared to
folly #2: After the outcry in Denmark had already started, Gilon undertook to
explain to the slow-witted Danes that torturing Palestinians was not only
extremely important, but also that the Shin-Bet would be well-advised to
resort to it again (if indeed it has ever been stopped).
The resulting outcry induced the Danish government to consider arresting His
Excellency on arrival.
The only diplomatic thing for the ambassador to do now is to break his leg
diplomatically, so that he will be compelled to give up the post. If he does
not do so voluntarily, Moderate Physical Pressure should be applied.
This affair has another aspect that should be considered. On the morrow of
the Six-Day War, the prophet Isayah (Leibowitz) prophesied that the
occupation would turn us into a nation of foremen and Shin-Betnicks. This
prophesy has been fulfilled. In other countries, Secret Service people work
in the dark. Even after becoming pensioners, they keep quiet. But in Israel,
they are elected to the Knesset, figure in the gossip columns, star in high
society parties, shoot their mouths off in talk-shows and write commentaries
in the papers. Now they are being sent abroad as ambassadors.
And Foreign Minister Shimon Peres explains that Gilon, the great patriot,
acted according to the laws of Israel and only followed orders. That tells
the Danes that something is rotten in the state of Israel. "Only followed
orders" sounds awful to people with a memory. The Danes, it seems, remember.
It is to be hoped that the Gilon affair will put an end to these nominations.
The slogan will be: Shin-Betnick, Stay Home!
Parallel to the Gilon business, the Sharon affair is taking place in Belgium.
This, too, has far-reaching implications.
It started years ago, but nobody noticed at the time. General Amos Yaron, a
star of the Sabra and Shatila affair, was sent as military attache to the
United States and Canada. When the massacre occurred, Yaron was the
commanding officer in the area. Elli Hbeika, the Phalangist commander,
orchestrated the massacre from the roof of Yaron’s command post,. Yaron’s
officers heard what was happening and reported to him. After the war, Yaron –
to his credit – admitted that "our senses had become blunted".
As military attache, Yaron did not encounter any difficulty in the States.
But in Canada he hit a wall. The Canadians just did not want to see his face.
He acted prudently and a scandal was avoided. Now he serves a Director
General of the Ministry of Defense.
His boss, Ariel Sharon, has never admitted to blunted senses. Even now, when
proceedings have started against him in Belgium for his part in the Sabra and
Shatila atrocities, he professes to be a righteous man. "This is not a
personal matter," he told reporters, "It is a matter of the State of Israel."
("It is not a personal matter" has always been Sharon’s preferred
stock-phrase.)
Not a personal matter? A matter of the State of Israel? Very sorry, we are
the citizen of Israel and it most certainly is not a matter of ours. We did
not take a gang of certified murderers, who had already committed atrocities
in half a dozen Palestinian camps, and put them into the defenseless Sabra
and Shatila camps. We did not light the night for them, nor provide them with
tractors to cover the bodies. If that was a war crime, it is a very personal
affair of Sharon and his entourage.
I object to the involvement of the legal apparatus of the state, led by the
pussy-footing Attorney General, in Sharon’s defense in my name and at my
expense.
All these affairs have a common denominator: Something has changed in the
world. The sooner this is understood in Israel, the better for many people,
soldiers and functionaries.
At the beginning of the new century, at long last, humanity has woken up and
started to deal with war crimes, the bane of the 20th century. The
international criminal court is on the
