Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 11:20:30AM -0500, Mark L. Kahnt wrote: > Yes, I realised that at the time. I just treat the creation of the > filesystems on the partitions, and the positioning of them in the tree > to be two separate steps, and by default would select the formatting > from the start to the end, rather than automagically going to / first. / is the start of the filesystem as far as the OS is concerned. Yeah, it can be hard to shift your brain from disk layout mode to filesystem layout mode, but it is possible. 8:o) - -- .''`. Baloo Ursidae <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian admin and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+gqlvJ5vLSqVpK2kRAoaGAJ9oI0P7wIV35H6k6ItrFppEb4gfwgCg2E7s HLStnENV6wUzyFoG/UKXlyg= =kH8B -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: screen - recover session after a shut down
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 11:13:50AM -0800, Vineet Kumar wrote: > * Sandip P Deshmukh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [20030326 03:44 PST]: > > is there a way in which i can make screen remember what applications > > were open even after i reboot? > > Well, if you typically use the same applications, you can have them > started automatically via your .screenrc. It won't remember what you > had open last time, but if, for example, you always start up w3m, mutt, > mc, a local shell, and an ssh, you could put all of those in your > .screenrc and have screen start them up automatically every time. thanks. this is close to what i wanted - not exactly. -- regards, sandip p deshmukh --*** Honk if you love peace and quiet. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 03:28:03AM -0500, Mark L. Kahnt wrote: > A week ago, I was setting up a new box (well, new as Debian - had been > Win98 and RH) and got to try the Debian boot-floppies installation for > the first time in 2 1/2 years. Even after using Debian for 5 years, and > knowing how I wanted to lay things out, I had to repartition the box > three separate times to get something that would work with the installer > - it was being insistent that the first partition prepared should be /, > when I had planned to have /dev/hda1 as /boot. You can specify which partition does what, but you do have to mount / first. / can by any partition, not necissarily /dev/hda1, and this is supported by the boot-floppies installer of which you speak. /dev/hda3 is / on ursine, for example. - -- .''`. Baloo Ursidae <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian admin and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+gqjbJ5vLSqVpK2kRAnCmAJ9Tpe8yBEApBCjme/APREuLB/hyiACgyco9 ODDW5RPnG3UpeGIN/oeNzsU= =spjO -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Linux Sucketh not.
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 09:16:44PM -0500, ScruLoose wrote: > On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 07:57:22PM -0500, Mr. Baldwin wrote: > > BTW, Linux doesn't suck. > > > > Linux ROCKS! > -- > > I'm pretty sure that if you switch to digest mode you'll still be able > to post. Heck, you don't need to be subscribed at all in order to post. > It might be a little clunky to *reply* to a message in a digest... > (having to slice out the message you want, override the subject header > so it refers to the specific message instead of the digest itself...) This is a reply to this email as received in digest mode. I use mutt to read my mail. In mutt, I open the digest email by pressing CR, and then open a pick-list of contents of the email using 'v'. Then each post to the list appears as a separate 'sub-email'. I use 'L' to reply to the list from within one of the sub-emails just as I would reply if the emails had arrived individually. > > BTW, it is *strongly* recommended to set your MUA to break your lines at > a reasonable length (72 columns is standard). > It's considered good manners, as it makes it a lot easier to read and > quote your messages. > -- > ,-. > > -ScruLoose- | Check out the coolest radio station ever: < > > Please do not | www.radioparadise.com < > > reply off-list. | < > `-' -- Paul E Condon [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is my hard drive dying?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Please turn your line wraps on to something like 72 columns instead of 1 paragraph. On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 08:12:48AM +0800, Robert Storey wrote: > I had these exact same error messages, starting about two weeks > ago. I assumed the hard drive was dying, but it turned out to be a > bad motherboard. Actually, I wish it had been the drive - hard > drives are cheaper (and easier) to replace than motherboards. Might hit outpost.com, or better yet if you live near one, a Fry's Electronics. There, hard drives and decent motherboards run around the same price. - -- .''`. Baloo Ursidae <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian admin and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+gqJkJ5vLSqVpK2kRAnrwAKCDGmZLi8UDZHzY3gg2Xiwh+T93lACgokCK Rqer+YUDhMRhhHJZwl55FVg= =/M+K -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 10:53:36AM +0100, Matthias Hentges wrote: > Right! Linux will even tell you when your "Printer is on fire" ;) Unless you use a newer 2.4 kernel. - -- .''`. Baloo Ursidae <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian admin and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+gqEUJ5vLSqVpK2kRAg97AKC4vKQs4OuioJljXsLY2TrCXI5ezQCeJEO7 2Qj9U/Ylgf+oNqhzDwRfKWM= =aaJ4 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Official Exim 4 package
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 07:26:50AM -0600, Jamin W. Collins wrote: > > The Debian packaging system only understands progress and not > > necissarily the ramifications of such. This could very easily be > > fixed and allow for multiple versions of the same package in a > > particular tree if the packaging tools would ask the user which > > version they meant, and whichever version the packager recommends > > using could be the default option. All this would take is adding a > > single, optional flag for "default version." > > I'm not convinced that this alone would be enough. It may work well, > provided there are only 2 versions of the package, but what happens > when/if a third is needed for some reason? You'd have to give an example of why it wouldn't work with more packages... - -- .''`. Baloo Ursidae <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian admin and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+gp/aJ5vLSqVpK2kRAuGmAJ9CzgARbu6amfu7o2Cjzx7AiZdK5gCg3QKQ CgfDSYoDYVhMu3pKQ2pMTgw= =est1 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Official Exim 4 package
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 10:31:13AM -0800, Joey Hess wrote: > packages since users ignore suggests and recommends. Or at how many > developers have probably added too-tight dependencies because they got > tired of their users ignoring suggests and recommends. Seems like in the installation manual, there should be something saying, "If you're new to Debian or are unsure about whether or not you should install recommended or suggested packages, install them. Once you learn more about the package, you can remove the unused recommended or suggested packages later." Perhaps an explaination that these packages often are required for the software to operate in a manner the user expects. - -- .''`. Baloo Ursidae <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian admin and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+gp8MJ5vLSqVpK2kRAm5dAJ0bKE0k4D1dij+RWt9cptZKBQzEwwCgjZee mA9EeF3ac9SEfKNfTgyr9ek= =g3WR -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 03:30:10PM +1100, Lindsay Yardley wrote: > I've looked after windows boxes for many years, windows users find it quite > difficult. Many shudder at the thought of installing anything. OK, good. The night-shift isn't driving me weird. I have the same opinion. I think anybody whose ever supported both Windows and Linux would tell you that both are just as hard, just Linux doesn't try to hide it when there's a problem. - -- .''`. Baloo Ursidae <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian admin and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+gpghJ5vLSqVpK2kRAuBnAKC4c7xxW01DbMz1vOJadNNDy4nNrQCgsiW/ Z06Ugvq7TPK8HFvPc++WxK8= =A4tO -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Mon, Mar 24, 2003 at 07:52:15PM -0600, Scott C. Linnenbringer wrote: > Simply put, if you get frustrated easily, then you shouldn't be using Linux. No, you can use Linux just fine. You just shouldn't be maintaining a Linux system. There's a big difference. - -- .''`. Baloo Ursidae <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian admin and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+gpfBJ5vLSqVpK2kRAtVQAJ4grYfzOUYRY2PITeYHkMIO0nbViACgpE2c IWzahoSU0+EgaPtlNkfM2Zc= =UQ98 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Linux Sucketh not.
On Wed, 2003-03-26 at 19:57, Mr. Baldwin wrote: > BTW, Linux doesn't suck. > > Linux ROCKS! > > War sucks. > Microsoft sucks. > Professional development seminars suck. > Traffic sucks. > > Lots of things suck. > But not Linux. > Linux is cool. > > Now, when I signed onto this list the only digest option I could see was > read-only...Was I mistaken? I would prefer to receive the list in digest, if > possible...Anyone? > > tony > --- > School-library.net > Read, Connect, Learn! I got the digest - for less than one week. You can't follow threads with it, and it is several big emails a day, at relatively indeterminate times, often apparently missing some of the key posts in numerous threads (they may be in a previous or even later digest.) -- Mark L. Kahnt, FLMI/M, ALHC, HIA, AIAA, ACS, MHP ML Kahnt New Markets Consulting Tel: (613) 531-8684 / (613) 539-0935 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: I cannot unsubscribe. It will not let me unsubscribe. I still receive hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of emails and nobody really seems to care except me. WIll someone help me please?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 11:13:25PM -0500, eauclair wrote: > I subscribed as eaulcair @ optonline .com, but by ISP is changing my email > addresss to eauclair @ optonline .net. I can receive emails to both > addresses, but can only send under the eauclair @ optline .net identity. So > now, I cannot unsubscribe. Damn, dude, did you even *read* the replies you got? You did get a couple of good suggestions. You're obviously getting the list OK, so why not read the replies when you post? > Can you unsubscribe me please? I am not you, nor am I the listmaster. No. - -- .''`. Baloo Ursidae <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian admin and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+gpQJJ5vLSqVpK2kRAhKhAKCszfiIluHMEcJtWqM9Fw/9vf8DRwCeNtCO /GJzv7c94d95H/KXhLe07Hc= =zTyX -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
two questions about USB keyboard/mouse
Hi, I have a Touchstream keyboard that also functions as a mouse. It uses a USB port. I also have a regular keyboard and mouse plugged into my computer. 1) After I reboot my computer, my Touchstream keyboard is not recognized until I hit a key on my regular keyboard. How do I get my Touchstream to be recognized immediately? 2) My Touchstream keyboard has a way of emulating a mouse wheel. This is not being recognized by X. I tried using "dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86" to tell X to recognize the wheel, but after I rebooted X wouldn't start because it couldn't find the couldn't find the core pointing device. This may be related to the first problem... thanks Melissa __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
On Wed, 2003-03-26 at 22:17, Marc Wilson wrote: > On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 06:02:33PM -0500, Roberto Sanchez wrote: > > True. Perhaps it would have been better stated by saying that every distro > > that wants to cater to Desktop users needs to implement a GUI installer > > (and many other GUI tools). > > Why? The *user* has zero business installing the box. Yes, Joe Moron > benefits from having GUI tools, because they mean he doesn't have to think, > but it matters not for the installer. > > Everyone is talking about intuitive interfaces, and Linux on the desktop, > and "the Windows XP killer", and etc... and no one wants to touch the basic > question: > > Why is Joe Moron expected to be installing the box? Not "how neat if he > could", but why in the world should it be set up for him to be able to? > Why do we *want* him to be able to? Why does anyone care if he can? > > Elitism be damned. You don't expect the man off the street to be > performing surgery... that's what skilled people are for. In fact, we > prosecute people like that who pretend, whether or not they hurt anyone. > What makes this different? Actually, I think the reason that this discussion tends to get brought up is because Linux hasn't been allowed to penetrate the home system market yet. Dell did pre-installs of RH on desktop systems for a while, but as far I know they've stopped that now except for servers. With the exception of Lindows now, I don't think there are any distributions available pre-installed on any big-name systems. Sure, you can get Debian pre installed at Joe's Computer Shack Inc, but not from Dell or Compaq or HP. Therefore, the only way that we can expect Linux to penetrate the desktop market is by users choosing to install Linux. That involves a few key points: 1) Your average Joe Somebody is never even going to consider chaning, assuming that s/he ever even HEARS of Linux in the first place. 2) Disgruntled Joe Somebody's who are sick and tired of Windows might be willing to give Linux a shot. 3) Technical users wanting more power will give Linux a shot. I think that 3 has been taken care of for quite some time. The only real limitation to these types of users is being able to do what they need to do in Linux. And with how mature of a system Linux is at this point, most technical users can use it full-time without a problem. 1 is never really GOING to get taken care of until we get the support of OEM's. Any user in category 1 is not going to change _what the system comes with_. Since systems come with Windows, users don't change. I'm willing to bet that 99% of all people in group 1 would NEVER change FROM Linux if it came pre-installed on their computer. 2 is the group that we have to focus on for the time being, and they're the group that require a GUI installer. The really have little to no idea of how their computer works, and they don't particularly WANT to know either. They just want it to work. Period. If your installer can't make them feel comfortable from the beginning, they're never even going to get far enough in to SEE your shiny X interface. And, unfortunately, for the majority of users this means that it HAS to be a GUI interface. My father has been using computers for longer than I have. He taught me DOS back in the early 90's. Today, he can't install a program in Windows with auto-run enabled without calling me. He calls me to ask me if its ok to click Next on each of the screens. I don't care how beautifully intuitive of a system you make, and if it's curses based or not, unless it LOOKS like Windows and unless he can CLICK something, he WILL NOT TOUCH IT. Sad but true. Now, with all of that said, I feel it is time to make one simple disclaimer. I don't particularly "want" idiot users in the Linux world. However, I DO want more mainstream support for Linux from vendors. Unfortunately, since the two are intertwined, I'm forced to choose. Personally, I'm happy the way I am. I'd much rather go without support for some devices and some programs than walk by a store and see a shelf stocked with $200 copies of Microsoft Linux PX (tm)(r)(c)(md)(ps)(ie)(eg)(pu)(etc) :) -- Alex Malinovich Support Free Software, delete your Windows partition TODAY! Encrypted mail preferred. You can get my public key from any of the pgp.net keyservers. Key ID: A6D24837 signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
On Wednesday 26 March 2003 11:17 pm, Marc Wilson wrote: > On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 06:02:33PM -0500, Roberto Sanchez wrote: > > True. Perhaps it would have been better stated by saying that every > > distro that wants to cater to Desktop users needs to implement a GUI > > installer (and many other GUI tools). > > Why? The *user* has zero business installing the box. Yes, Joe Moron > benefits from having GUI tools, because they mean he doesn't have to think, > but it matters not for the installer. Are you always so condescending to people who don't know what you know? Perhaps it's not Joe Moron installing his box -- maybe it's someone with a PhD in Physics who is so busy with his work on quantam mechanics he doesn't have time to learn computers. Or maybe it's an MD. > Everyone is talking about intuitive interfaces, and Linux on the desktop, > and "the Windows XP killer", and etc... and no one wants to touch the basic > question: > > Why is Joe Moron expected to be installing the box? Not "how neat if he > could", but why in the world should it be set up for him to be able to? Why not? Why are you so determined to state who should and should not be installing a system? > Why do we *want* him to be able to? Why does anyone care if he can? Why should Joe User (or Joe Moron as you call him) have to care what you *want* him/her to be able to do? > Elitism be damned. I agree. Elitism be damned. I can't see why you're saying that. Your statements are elitism of the worst and strongest kind. It's clear you want to keep either Linux or Debian purely in the realm of "techies only." Why? It's almost as if you're threatened by the idea that the average user could one day install Linux on his own. >You don't expect the man off the street to be > performing surgery... that's what skilled people are for. Surgery. Gee, don't you have to be an MD for that? I know in the US that's 4 years of college, 3 years of med school and even more years as an intern. This is a very poor analogy. I learned enough to handle Linux and Debian (including the installer) in less than a year. I think if you want an anology, I think Joe User installing a system is closer to knowing emergency first aid, or perhaps being at the level of an EMT, which takes far less experience than being an MD. I'd also like to point out that learning enough to install a system doesn't even require ANY formal education. >In fact, we > prosecute people like that who pretend, whether or not they hurt anyone. > What makes this different? Again, why are you so scared at the idea of system being easy to install and Joe User being able to buy/download Linux (maybe even Debian) and being able to install it on his/her own system? If Henry Ford had your attitude, autos would have never been for more than mechanics. I'm sure you know computers very well, but it seems quite clear you do NOT know people -- your comments show a complete ignorance of the fact that people don't fit in pigeon holes. Some users want to learn more, some want to find out what else is out there, and some don't want to do a damn thing they don't have to. And some computer people just want to live in their own little world where they can show off their technical expertise and feel superior to others because they know things everyone else doesn't. Is it just possible you fit in the last category? I have to admit, I'm probably what you fear most. While your attitude is elitist and you prefer to decide what is made available to others (statements like "Why do we *want* him to be able to? Why does anyone care if he can?") and give people as little as possible, I'm a populist (I guess it comes from living in a republic) and feel it's better to empower as many people as possible with as many tools as possible, giving them the ability to make their own choices and decisions, rather than forcing them to work within the choices we make for them (which, come to think of it, is what Microsoft does -- makes the decisions on what users can and can't do with a computer -- maybe you should be working there...). Hal -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: ASUS motherboard
On Thu, 2003-03-27 at 08:22, Jim McCloskey wrote: > > I've been trying to install Debian (Woody) on a machine built around > an Asus P4S533-E motherboard. I'm using the vf-2.4 kernel-flavor. > > The problem I'm having is with the onboard LAN controller. > > It's listed among the PCI controllers at the initial stage of the boot > process (assigned IRQ 5) and lspci can find it and reports: > > 00:04.0 Ethernet controller: Silicon Integrated Systems [SiS] SiS900 10/100 Ethernet > (rev 91) > > I'm trying to use the eepro100 driver, but the interface cannot be > brought up. I get NO SUCH DEVICE error messages, and this in dmesg: > > eth0: EEPROM read 0 > > I installed (and run) Debian testing on a machine with an ASUS P4S533 > with no difficulties whatever, using the eepro100 driver. > > Does anyone know what might be different between the P4S533 and the > P4S533-E that could be at the root of this difficulty? > > I saw a reference to what looks like the same problem on a SuSe > web-site, and it suggested that a patched kernel was needed. The > information and advice was very specific to SuSe however. > > Might the sis900 driver be a better choice? > Definitely. I have an ASUS board with a sis900 on board LAN card. I don't actually use the pre-compiled kernels that you can apt-get and instead compile my own. However, I had absolutely no problems with this ethernet on board device. I just compiled the sis900 driver as a module and modprobed it and it worked. What I would suggest is the following: 1. Check if your kernel has compiled support for sis900 driver. You can do this by trying to modprobe sis900. If that doesn't work then grep through the config file for the kernel you are running like: grep -i 'sis900' /boot/config-2.4.20 (or whatever your kernel version is). You should see something like: CONFIG_SIS900=m or CONFIG_SIS900=y 2. If your kernel doesn't have support for the sis900 device then you can compile your own kernel with the support. The sis900 ethernet card worked great on my ASUS system. Cheers. Mark. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Linux Sucketh not.
On Wednesday 26 March 2003 08:16 pm, ScruLoose wrote: > BTW, it is *strongly* recommended to set your MUA to break your lines at > a reasonable length (72 columns is standard). > It's considered good manners, as it makes it a lot easier to read and > quote your messages. It's not *strongly* recommended. It's standard convention. :) -- Scott C. Linnenbringer finger sl at eskimo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
System Slows Down
Hey, I just installed debian 3.0, upgraded to testing, put on a custom 2.4.20 kernel, with nvidia-glx all up and running, and I am almost all set. One thing though. Every so often, things will slow to a CRAWL, and then poof, go back to normal. WHAT IS THIS? How can I stop it? Whatever clever program is running in the background, I would like it to stop! Thanks, Dan PS. Hardware: Athlon XP 2000, Asus MB, 768MB RAM, Debian on a Maxtor 20GB, Primary Boot, Windows XP on an WD 80GB, with 40GB Fat32 for media/docs. OnBoard Sound, Nvidia Geforce 4200Ti. An some kind of cd burner (tdk). -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How to unselect the german language as
Mariano Kamp wrote: > > I accidently have chosen german as the installer language which also > turned out to be the language of my system now. How can I revert to > english? The locale is typically controlled by the LANG shell variable. Either unset it or set it to the locale of your choice. Unsetting it will get you the C (POSIX) locale by default and will give you some immediate relief while you fix it permanently. unset LANG The debian method of controlling locale is with the 'locale' package. You can reconfigure it using dpkg-reconfigure. dpkg-reconfigure locales It is also fine to edit the /etc/locale.gen directly and run the locale-gen command manually. But then you also need to edit /etc/environment, or remove it, to cause it to take effect. Easier to run dpkg-reconfigure and let the scripts handle it. Bob pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
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Opinion
Dear debian USers My name is Saurabh and I am from India. I need your opinion in one of the problem i am facing with the Debian. I want to write my own script which will do network confriguration , install the Os , make partition after the Kernel is loaded. I cannot find the sample scripts or the Debian itself use to does so. Kindly see u can help Regards Saurabh -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Linux Sucketh not.
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 07:57:22PM -0500, Mr. Baldwin wrote: > BTW, Linux doesn't suck. > > Linux ROCKS! > > War sucks. > Microsoft sucks. > Professional development seminars suck. > Traffic sucks. > > Lots of things suck. > But not Linux. > Linux is cool. > > Now, when I signed onto this list the only digest option > I could see was read-only...Was I mistaken? I would prefer > to receive the list in digest, if possible...Anyone? Just unsubscribe from debian-user and subscribe to debian-user-digest. Continue to post your messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] That's all! Pigeon -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: LPRng and LaserWriter 8.7.1 Very Slow
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 06:35:26PM -0800, Nate Slater wrote: > Does anyone have any experience setting up LPRng for Mac clients? Do I need > to take special measures? I've done it, but don't have any insights to offer, I'm afraid. For my OS X box (iBook), it was just a question of pointing to the queue on the Linux box. For my OS 9 box (PMac 6100/66 w/ G3), it was about the same. The only difference here is that I have real LaserWriters. Yes, the Mac can print to them directly, but I want the queue management taking place on the Linux box. > This is my first post here. I hope it's not off-topic since I am running > LPRng on a Debian box. I'd be happy to provide more details, but I didn't > want to bother you with unnecessary ones. What is LPRng *doing* while it's trying to spool this job? Waiting on a filter? It sounds like it's not the daemon having the problem, but a filter, since if you set up a bounce queue things spool immediately. Just an idea. -- Marc Wilson | A fool and his honey are soon parted. [EMAIL PROTECTED] | -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 06:02:33PM -0500, Roberto Sanchez wrote: > True. Perhaps it would have been better stated by saying that every distro > that wants to cater to Desktop users needs to implement a GUI installer > (and many other GUI tools). Why? The *user* has zero business installing the box. Yes, Joe Moron benefits from having GUI tools, because they mean he doesn't have to think, but it matters not for the installer. Everyone is talking about intuitive interfaces, and Linux on the desktop, and "the Windows XP killer", and etc... and no one wants to touch the basic question: Why is Joe Moron expected to be installing the box? Not "how neat if he could", but why in the world should it be set up for him to be able to? Why do we *want* him to be able to? Why does anyone care if he can? Elitism be damned. You don't expect the man off the street to be performing surgery... that's what skilled people are for. In fact, we prosecute people like that who pretend, whether or not they hurt anyone. What makes this different? -- Marc Wilson | mathematician, n.: Some one who believes imaginary [EMAIL PROTECTED] | things appear right before your _i's. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I cannot unsubscribe. It will not let me unsubscribe. I still receivehundreds and hundreds and hundreds of emails and nobody really seems to careexcept me. WIll someone help me please?
I have got no help from [EMAIL PROTECTED] I am trying to unsubscribe from the Debian lists. I subscribed as eaulcair @ optonline .com, but by ISP is changing my email addresss to eauclair @ optonline .net. I can receive emails to both addresses, but can only send under the eauclair @ optline .net identity. So now, I cannot unsubscribe. Can you unsubscribe me please? thanks! -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: kernel 2.4.20 dma problem
On Wed, 26 Mar 2003, Tom Allison wrote: > > Yes, I think it is. See below > Does that mean I'm in trouble? For me (I have a slightly different motherboard but the same VT82C686 South bridge) it meant massive data corruption until I switched off DMA. However the 2.4.21pre6 changelog contains the following: Alan Cox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: ... * correct handling of VIA PCI and of IDE legacy irq Which looks pretty promising. -- Jaldhar H. Vyas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> La Salle Debain - http://www.braincells.com/debian/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: remount md0 after disc failure
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 06:59:53PM +1100, Lindsay Yardley wrote: > OK, let's try it, df, /home is mounted on /dev/md0. Check contents of /home > then umount /home, check /home directory, empty as expected. Reboot ..., > hmmm, /home is NOT! empty, why? .. df, home is mounted on /dev/md0. > > So fstab is remounting /home, so should hda disc fail, & I put an image of > it back and reboot there's nothing to do, right? Replace the physical drive hda, restore its contents from your backup and away you go. All you've lost is anything changed on hda since your last backup. Don't forget to reinstall the bootloader. I take it by "image" you mean "all the files/directories/permissions and stuff" as opposed to something akin to a ISO9660 image of a CD? > What if the disk is not the same size/shape/colour would that change things? Doesn't matter, as long as all the files are there. Pigeon -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 07:03:48PM -, Stephen Sherlock wrote: > ... and get at least two sticks of > RAM in there (if one fails, the others keep working, so I'm told). Yeah, they do, but your machine still crashes when it tries to use the faulty RAM. It doesn't do a sort of RAID across memory modules. That is theoretically possible, but I don't think the Linux kernel supports it - certainly can't see any config options for it. Pigeon -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 11:28:23AM -0500, Hal Vaughan wrote: > It has EVERYTHING to do with the fact > that different people learn and perceive in different ways. Some people > learn and take in information best when everything is neat and orderly. > Others do best in what may be perceived as a chaotic environment. Some deal > only with facts, others work intuitively. > > This has been proven many times and is FACT. It's something I, as a special > ed teacher working in residential treatment facilities, have had to deal with > over and over in my life. If you want a pop-culture example, go out and read > about the Myers-Briggs personality type test. I realize that I'm taking a crazy, meandering thread even farther off topic here, but I can't resist tossing this little detail in here. If you want a personality-typing system that's a whole *lot* more insightful and flexible than the ol' Myers-Briggs, check out the Enneagram. These folks by no means invented it, but they do some of the most sound and usable writing on the subject: http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/ I own a couple of their dead-tree books, and recommend them highly. I always hated personality-typing systems in general, finding that they always tended to either stuff people in rigid little boxes, or be so vague you might as well use a horoscope. With the Enneagram's flexibility (nine basic types, each can have either of two adjacent types as a "wing", nine levels of healthy/unhealthy continuum, each type can "integrate" or "disintegrate" to incorporate facets of either of two more types...) it actually stands a fighting chance of providing useful insight into the complicated, messy, organic system that we call a person. Of course, this comes with a little bit of a learning curve at the beginning... kinda like Debian (or Linux in general)... Hey, I seem to have meandered back into being kinda-sorta-maybe on-topic! Anyway, sorry if this reads like a sales pitch... But you know how it is when you stumble upon something that's so cool you've just *got* to share it. Don't you? -- ,-. > -ScruLoose- | If it doesn't work, force it. < > Please do not | If it breaks, it needed replacing anyway. < > reply off-list. | < `-' pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
LPRng and LaserWriter 8.7.1 Very Slow
I'm trying to print to LPRng on my Woody box from a Mac with the LaserWriter 8.7.1 driver. I can print a whole web page to it just fine from an OS X box running CUPS. However, when I print a document containing one four-letter word with the LaserWriter 8.7.1 driver, it takes the LPRng server a little over a half hour to spool the document. My printcap file is quite simple: lp|l|Generic dot-matrix printer entry:\ :lp=:\ :rm=10.0.0.16:\ :rp=HP_LaserJet_1200:\ :sd=/var/spool/lpd/remote:\ :mx#0:\ :sh: I just modified the default file to make it forward everything to a printer on another machine. I have tried printing directly to that machine, and it's very zippy, even for larger documents. Does anyone have any experience setting up LPRng for Mac clients? Do I need to take special measures? This is my first post here. I hope it's not off-topic since I am running LPRng on a Debian box. I'd be happy to provide more details, but I didn't want to bother you with unnecessary ones. Peter -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Linux Sucketh not.
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 07:57:22PM -0500, Mr. Baldwin wrote: > BTW, Linux doesn't suck. > > Linux ROCKS! -- > Lots of things suck. > But not Linux. > Linux is cool. Absolutely. I tried several times over the last ten years or so to switch from MS to Linux... Tried Debian, RH, Mandrake, and Slackware ... and now Debian again as of Christmas break (Wasn't going to try a system install in the middle of a term of engineering!) With all my previous attempts, there were critical things I couln't get working, so I always ended up going reluctantly back to Windoze... This time, I've learned enough (and learned how to learn more) to get my system running quite happily. Now I'm feeling the rush of power. My computer *wants* to be a server. It's just begging me to get a domain name... get bogofilter and an IMAP server working and start giving clean e-mail accounts to my friends... And then there's Apache... Ahh, freedom! My computer actively wants me to do whatever I want. Yep, Linux rocks alright, and particularly Debian rocks. > Now, when I signed onto this list the only digest option I could see > was read-only...Was I mistaken? I would prefer to receive the list in > digest, if possible...Anyone? I'm pretty sure that if you switch to digest mode you'll still be able to post. Heck, you don't need to be subscribed at all in order to post. It might be a little clunky to *reply* to a message in a digest... (having to slice out the message you want, override the subject header so it refers to the specific message instead of the digest itself...) BTW, it is *strongly* recommended to set your MUA to break your lines at a reasonable length (72 columns is standard). It's considered good manners, as it makes it a lot easier to read and quote your messages. -- ,-. > -ScruLoose- | Check out the coolest radio station ever: < > Please do not | www.radioparadise.com < > reply off-list. | < `-' pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: hub.c
LeVA wrote: Hello! I have some problem with the usb driver in linux kernel 2.4.20. I don't now who can I write to, so I thought I should give a try here. I have an usb flash drive (usb pen drive). If I connect it to the rear (integrated, port 1) usb port, it works fine. But, if I connect it to the front panel usb port (port 2), it doesn't work. Now, here comes the complicated part :) If I first connect the pen drive to the front (port 2) usb port, It doesn't work. I have to connect it to the integrated (port 1) usb port, and then I can mount it. After the umount, I disconnect the pen drive from the port 1, and wow, it works in the front panel (port 2) usb port. So I have to connect it to the integrated port first, if I want to use on the usb port 2 (front panel usb port). I don't think this is normal. Sometimes when, I connect the drive to the port 1, I get an error message: "hub.c: connect-debounce failed, port 2 disabled" It uses scsi emulation over usb. I can mount the drive with device '/dev/sda'. After about 10 minutes, the port2 stops, and it doesn't work again. Then I have to do that work all over again (unplugging, plugging to the port 1 etc...). I know it is very strange, and complicated for the first time, but I hope, that someone can help me solving this problem, or telling an other email, which supports this driver. Thanks: Levai Daniel [EMAIL PROTECTED] I've been told that on some machines, the front USB ports are 2.0, whereas the backs are 1.x. This may be totally wrong, but if that's the case, it might providea direction for you to pursue further. Kent -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: kernel 2.4.20 dma problem
Jaldhar H. Vyas wrote: On Wed, 26 Mar 2003, Tom Allison wrote: Unless there is something that I'm missing, I think that this is a real bug in the kernel-image for the K7 build. Let me guess your motherboard has a VIA chipset? Yes, I think it is. See below Does that mean I'm in trouble? -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ sudo lspci -vv | grep -i via 00:07.0 ISA bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82C686 [Apollo Super South] (rev 1b) Subsystem: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82C686/A PCI to ISA Bridge 00:07.1 IDE interface: VIA Technologies, Inc. Bus Master IDE (rev 06) (prog-if 8a [Master SecP PriP]) 00:07.2 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. UHCI USB (rev 0e) (prog-if 00 [UHCI]) 00:07.4 SMBus: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82C686 [Apollo Super ACPI] (rev 20) [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ -- Overload -- core meltdown sequence initiated. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
Perhaps all that's needed is a help option [F1} with layman descriptions??? ... maybe? | -Original Message- | From: Mr. Baldwin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | Sent: Thursday, 27 March 2003 11:54 | To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | Subject: Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks | | | > | >> > I think that what most people who clammer for a GUI installer really | >> > want is a more easy-to-accomplish installation, not necessarily a | >> > graphics-based installation. Of course, I could be wrong. | | YES | | >> That's me. I don't need an X based installer -- just one | that can take | >> some of the frustration out of installing. | > | >I second that. Is debain's installer hard for a first time | installer? yes it | >is. Is debain's installer that hard that it's not useable? No, it's not. | > | | I don't need a graphical installer, necessarily, but at least | something a bit less indecipherable. I have only a year of | linux experience at all and am no expert. I didn;t know how to | respond to many of the queries posed during installation. | | tony | | --- | School-library.net | Read, Connect, Learn! | | | _ | Get 25MB, POP3, Spam Filtering with LYCOS MAIL PLUS for $19.95/year. | http://login.mail.lycos.com/brandPage.shtml?pageId=plus&ref=lmtplus | | | -- | To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] | with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | --- | Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. | Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). | Version: 6.0.463 / Virus Database: 262 - Release Date: 17/03/2003 | --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.463 / Virus Database: 262 - Release Date: 17/03/2003 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: philosophy mailing list
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 12:02:53PM -0500, Natali Gulbahce wrote: > Is this a philosophy mail list or Debian user list? When dealing with open source, you're bound to get philosophy. It goes with the territory. > I am getting tired of getting commentary emails long and philosophical. > Am I missing sth? > Is this the way mail lists work? Was your point to start the kind of thread that you're griping about? If so, I think you succeeded. - -- .''`. Baloo Ursidae <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian admin and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+glH8J5vLSqVpK2kRAhsdAKCt0r4j4IEvJLRawOeLOpNfcaYIRwCgnqSp 3sjNvhAw+NPPmJM/GmlXPRo= =mYs6 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: NFS over samba
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 11:09:15AM -0300, GBV wrote: > How can I map a netware share with samba? (final objective) You can't, Samba has nothing to do with Netware. Neither does NFS. Both do similar functions, but are incompatible. > 1. How can I access netware shares ? > 2. How can I mount a netware share? Have you tried apt-cache search netware? - -- .''`. Baloo Ursidae <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian admin and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+glGPJ5vLSqVpK2kRAoYAAJ9sW6hXd6MJJgiRY4WVMs+Bfh0TKwCghHTb TTtpm+E48JR1fGqYItEolUw= =32dv -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Linux Sucketh not.
BTW, Linux doesn't suck. Linux ROCKS! War sucks. Microsoft sucks. Professional development seminars suck. Traffic sucks. Lots of things suck. But not Linux. Linux is cool. Now, when I signed onto this list the only digest option I could see was read-only...Was I mistaken? I would prefer to receive the list in digest, if possible...Anyone? tony --- School-library.net Read, Connect, Learn! _ Get 25MB, POP3, Spam Filtering with LYCOS MAIL PLUS for $19.95/year. http://login.mail.lycos.com/brandPage.shtml?pageId=plus&ref=lmtplus -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
> >> > I think that what most people who clammer for a GUI installer really >> > want is a more easy-to-accomplish installation, not necessarily a >> > graphics-based installation. Of course, I could be wrong. YES >> That's me. I don't need an X based installer -- just one that can take >> some of the frustration out of installing. > >I second that. Is debain's installer hard for a first time installer? yes it >is. Is debain's installer that hard that it's not useable? No, it's not. > I don't need a graphical installer, necessarily, but at least something a bit less indecipherable. I have only a year of linux experience at all and am no expert. I didn;t know how to respond to many of the queries posed during installation. tony --- School-library.net Read, Connect, Learn! _ Get 25MB, POP3, Spam Filtering with LYCOS MAIL PLUS for $19.95/year. http://login.mail.lycos.com/brandPage.shtml?pageId=plus&ref=lmtplus -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How to unselect the german language as
On 26 Feb 2003 22:40:00 +0100 Mariano Kamp <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi, > > I accidently have chosen german as the installer language which also > turned out to be the language of my system now. How can I revert to > english? Do "dpkg-reconfigure locales" to generate an English locale, then do "setlocale " to make it the default. See man(1) locale, man(5) locale, man(7) locale, man setlocale, and man locale-gen. They may lead you to others. Kevin -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: kernel 2.4.20 dma problem
On Wed, 26 Mar 2003, Tom Allison wrote: > Unless there is something that I'm missing, I think that this is a real bug > in the kernel-image for the K7 build. Let me guess your motherboard has a VIA chipset? -- Jaldhar H. Vyas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> La Salle Debain - http://www.braincells.com/debian/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 16:36:57 -0500 From: Bob Paige <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [snip] First, I think some people were raised on WIMP interfaces and are just plain scared of text-based interfaces. Call it a mental block, but I've seen it. . . . Yes, conditioning may do it. But here's another observation. As a magazine editor I concluded decades ago that writers & editors tend to be either *text types or *graphics types. The former sort hates art. The latter can't read. See for yourself. For a few weeks, pay close attention to news photos in any newspaper. Check details in each picture against the exact wording in the cutlines below. And weep. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Convincing someone to switch to Linux
Perhaps I am out in left field, but if a business considers a $1500 computer "expensive", there may be other problems at said company besides fear of linux. We are a club at the local university. With very limited funds, no less. -Roberto Sanchez _ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Convincing someone to switch to Linux
Just out of curiosity, what are the specs of the new machine, and what are they proposing to do with it? I cannot understand why they did not buy 2-3 machines instead of one expensive one. Is there some explanation other than blind stupidity? The machine specs are below. The real kick in the pants is this: This morning I was checking out the machine and saw that XP Pro and Office XP were installed (not XP Home and WordPerfect like it shipped with). So I asked the guy who was responsible for the purchase, why they would buy the machine with XP Home and then buy a seperate copy of XP Pro (I acutally thought he had pirated it, but didn't want to say that right off). He told me that he didn't need to buy it becuase he used the University site license. They told me originally that were purchasing the Dell and not going with my Linux solution becuase they wanted to maintain a M$ environment. I was not aware that our club is allowed access to the University's site license, otherwise I would have suggested that they buy four beige boxes and a printer from the local Walmart and save the $100 shipping charge. I would have loved to see them adopt Linux, but this goes beyond that. It was a complete and gross wast of funds that the club doesn't have. Oh well ... -Roberto Sanchez Dimension 2350 Series Dimension 2350, Intel® Celeron® Processor at 1.80GHz Qty: 1 Price: $1,007.00 Date: Wednesday, March 26, 2003 5:09:41 PM CDT Catalog Number: 29 19 Dimension 2350 Series: Dimension 2350, Intel® Celeron® Processor at 1.80GHz Memory: FREE UPGRADE! 256MB DDR SDRAM Keyboard: Dell® Quietkey® Keyboard Monitor: New 17 in (16.0 in v.i.s., .27dp) E772 Monitor Video Card: Integrated Intel® Extreme 3D Graphics Hard Drive: 60GB Ultra ATA/100 7200RPM Hard Drive Floppy Drive and Additional Storage Devices: 3.5 in Floppy Drive Operating System: Microsoft® Windows® XP Home Edition Mouse: Logitech® Optical USB Mouse Network Interface: Integrated 10/100 Ethernet Modem: 56K PCI Data/Fax Modem CD or DVD Drive: 16x Max DVD-ROM Drive Sound Card: Integrated Audio Speakers: New Harman Kardon® HK-206 Speakers Bundled Software: WordPerfect® Productivity Pack with Quicken New User Edition Digital Music: Dell Jukebox powered by MUSICMATCH Digital Photography: Dell Picture Studio Image Expert Standard Limited Warranty, Services and Support Options: FREE 1Yr Dell SecurityCenter(McAfee) w/3Yr Ltd Wty,3Yr At-Home Service Internet Access Services: 6 Months of America Online Membership Included Printers: Lexmark E320 Monochrome Laser Printer CD or DVD Burner for 2nd bay: FREE UPGRADE! New 48x/24x/48x Max CD-RW Drive FREE TaxCut Deluxe Software from H&R Block: FREE TaxCut Deluxe software from H&R Block _ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: smartsuite obsolete?
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 02:12:37PM +, Colin Watson wrote: > On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 07:18:24AM -0600, Brian McGroarty wrote: > > On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 06:02:04PM -0600, Jamin W. Collins wrote: > > > Looks like it was renamed to "smartmontools". > > > > To help avoid more questions in the future, where did you look to find > > this information? > > http://ftp-master.debian.org/removals.txt has a log of all package > removals. ... almost. Non-US ones are elsewhere, but there aren't many packages there any more. -- Colin Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: leaving computer on 24/7
if it's a 24/7 box it's probably better to run it headless and administer it from a web interface. i.e. webmin etc cheers Lindsay | -Original Message- | From: daniel huhardeaux [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | Sent: Thursday, 27 March 2003 09:32 | To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | Subject: Re: leaving computer on 24/7 | | | Karsten M. Self wrote: | | > [...] IBM (late 1990s?) suggests that: | > | > - Turning off your monitor (CRT) will provide power savings and spare | >your phosphors. Given that a monitor is likely the most long-lived | >component of your system, this is significant. | > | > | Yes. But don't forget, if you're on UPS and have a power failure, | switching on monitor to shutdown computer can simply crash the system if | UPS is on last period. So probably you will prefer to use power | management of monitor (sleep mode). | | -- | : __ __ __ __ __ __ [EMAIL PROTECTED] | : /_// __ // __ //_// __ // / phone.: +48 32 285 4554 | : / / / /_/ // /_/ / / / / /_/ // / fax: +48 32 285 4554 | : /_/ /_//_/ /_/ /_/ /_//_/ mobile..: +48 602 284 546 | | | | -- | To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] | with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | --- | Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. | Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). | Version: 6.0.463 / Virus Database: 262 - Release Date: 17/03/2003 | --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.463 / Virus Database: 262 - Release Date: 17/03/2003 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: acme on gnome2.2
On Wed, 2003-03-26 at 16:45, Praveen Kallakuri wrote: > WARNING: Unsanitized content follows. > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: SHA1 > > hello there > > i have been using acme2.0-1woody1 on gnome2.2 (backport provided by > evil-geniuses planet server). > > i had all the multimedia keys working on my compaq presario 1720US the > first time i configured them. but i think after i restarted the machine, > only the volume buttons work. there is no response from the other buttons. > i have tried unsetting all button-bindings, but it doesn't work. > > anyone has a suggestion? i am using woody with 2.4.17 custom kernel for > acpi. I think you just need to start it again, then when you logout you have to 'Save current setup'. Jamie -- Email:[EMAIL PROTECTED] GPG/PGP ID: 26384A3A Fingerprint: D9FF DF4A 2D46 A353 A289 E8F5 AA75 DCBE 2638 4A3A -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
I think you've just made an unfounded logical leap. Why does _every_ distribution need a graphical installer to make linux on the desktop a reality? Clearly the answer is, not every distro needs a graphical installer. If a distribution wants to cater to server-type machines, that's ok (it's great, really). If a distribution wants to cater to elites, that's fine too. If a distribution wants to ensure that the installer works when the console is a serial port, that's wonderful. True. Perhaps it would have been better stated by saying that every distro that wants to cater to Desktop users needs to implement a GUI installer (and many other GUI tools). Besides, linux on the desktop is a rather nebulous term. I know several people who would love to roll out desktop boxes running linux in their company; this would prevent joe clueless user from playing solitaire, installing backgrounds and mouse cursors, etc. I suspect you mean something very different, where linux becomes the Windows XP killer. That may or may not happen. Personally, I think there are two problems with the latter vision; the average (desktop) computer user views the computer as an appliance, but the average computer is too costly and not reliable enough to be an appliance. Secondly, as long as software companies feel they can make money and "lock in market share" by releases patent encumbered software (think audio/video codecs) and as long as major players _use_ that software, linux is fighting an uphill battle since linux represents the opposite philosophy, that of openness. I would love to see Linux become the Windows XP killer. When enough people realize that openness (in standards, file formats, interfaces, and so on) is the only way to ensure that everything can play nice together, things will change. Unfortunately the public needs much education before this can become a reality. Additionally, I would love to see Debian be at the forefront of the push to kill windoze. I like Debian and will continue to use it regardless. If I can't figure something out, I don't mind hopping on my other machine (also a Debian box) and hitting the search engines. But many people simply won't do that. I'm not saying that Debian should be dumbed down any, but that they should make tools available (without taking away the CLI, CURSES, or whatever other tools the gurus love to use) that make it easier for the average end user to use Debian. I think that this is really important because IMHO Debian represents the best of free software. Devil's advocate: how do you knmow firestarter does what it says it is doing if you don't understand iptables? Please don't take this as a personal attack; I just feel if you don't understand the technology, using said technology is fraught with peril. For a real world example, think "routing protocols" and look hard at the internet. There is breakage every day caused by ignorance. I understand that you are not atacking me :-) But, I take it on faith that if I can apt-get something from an official Debian mirror (especially on the stable tree) that it will work as advertised. Your argument could just as easily be applied to a commercial windoze product like Zone Alarm. In the case of Zone Alarm, though, I can't download and look at the source even if I wanted to. At least with firestarter I can, or at least do 'iptables -nvL' 8-) Ok, linux needs to be marketed to the average user. Why does that equate to "debian must satisfy the needs of all users" ? Note: I'm not saying debian shouldn't be easier to install, I just want you to think about why things that are good for "linux" may not necessarily be good for debian[1]. Finally, let me quote Doug Gwyn: GUIs normally make it simple to accomplish simple actions and impossible to accomplish complex actions. Ah, the random sig generator comes through again :-) [1] You realise debian is about more than just linux, right? Again, Debian doesn't have to satisfy the needs of all users. But if it were marketed more to the average user it would be a very good thing for the reasons I stated above. -Roberto Sanchez _ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
On Wednesday 26 March 2003 23:26, Hal Vaughan wrote: > On Wednesday 26 March 2003 03:22 pm, Kent West wrote: > > I think that what most people who clammer for a GUI installer really > > want is a more easy-to-accomplish installation, not necessarily a > > graphics-based installation. Of course, I could be wrong. (That'd be the > > third time this year if I am - doh!) > That's me. I don't need an X based installer -- just one that can take > some of the frustration out of installing. I second that. Is debain's installer hard for a first time installer? yes it is. Is debain's installer that hard that it's not useable? No, it's not. Many pleople like the idea of a graphical installer. It makes things, like i18n and l10n for some languages possible. But some (like me) can underestand that it's hard to develop and maintain such a thing on all these architectures. So, do I like a graphical installer? yes, I do, but it's not neccessary, a text based but inituative installer, with better hardware detection, can be the answer for the debain installer (at least, for the time being). Cheers -- /* Those who do not understand Unix *are condemned to reinvent it, poorly */ -UNDEAD Evil GNU/Linux Aryan Ameri -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: philosophy mailing list
Hey Yall,
Pigeon wrote:
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 12:02:53PM -0500, Natali Gulbahce wrote:
Hey all,
Is this a philosophy mail list or Debian user list?
It's a Debian user list with philosophically inclined subscribers.
Gotta jump in here, since the topic was my major
Philosophy, means a friend of wisdom (dam, I still can't drop the funny
old father from "My big fat Greek weeding," popping up If I ever met
the director of that movie, I am gonna blast her with a water pistol!)
Therefore, we are all being complimented as friends of wisdom or Wise
Debian Geeks.
A, thats nice! :-)
*BFN* & joyful geeking,
Greek Geek :-)
All your Web publications are belong to us - People's Daily {with GG
assistance!}
--
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Re: philosophy mailing list
> On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 12:02:53PM -0500, Natali Gulbahce wrote: > > Is this a philosophy mail list or Debian user list? ُTrying to seperate *nix from philosophy has never worked in the past (And I hope things like Lindows won't change it in the future). This is not a CISCO or a windows mailing list. People here, have philosophical and political ideas, which are usually related to the software they use. When you are in a *nix mailing list, and things become philosophical, you shall either i) ignore that tread or (usually what I do) ii) enjoy the tread ! Cheers -- /* Those who do not understand Unix *are condemned to reinvent it, poorly */ -UNDEAD Evil GNU/Linux Aryan Ameri -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Newbee-ish X and root question
Thanks to all who answered to this! Really overwhelming by all the useful information. Thanks, Lukas = . *** ** [EMAIL PROTECTED] ** **t. +31 (0) 10 418 2023 ** ** philips willemstraat 14B2 3051 PP rotterdam ** ** IT'S A MAN'S WORLD DESIGNING TACKY INTERFACES ** ** http://64.177.18.35 ** *** __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Unsubscribe
Title: Message I love this thread. Matt-- -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, 27 March 2003 6:06 AMTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Subject: UnsubscribeUnsubscribe
RE: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
> > Devil's advocate: how do you knmow firestarter does what it > says it is doing if you don't understand iptables? Please > don't take this as a personal attack; I just feel if you > don't understand the technology, using said technology is > fraught with peril. For a real world example, think "routing > protocols" and look hard at the internet. There is breakage > every day caused by ignorance. > You cannot eliminate all risks. You cannot expect to understand everything. Are you suggesting everyone should thoroughly understand tcp/ip, osi layers and have read several RFC before sending an email ? As for 'fraught with peril', this is borderline fear mongering. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: nfsroot: client kernel hangs
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 03:35:08PM +0300, Andrei Smirnov wrote: > Hi people! please help: > > Im triing to make an nfs-bootable system > and client kernel (with all appropriate config) 2&4&18 > HANGS right after > TCP: Hash tables configured (established 16384 bind 16384) > (no more messages or any other activity) Thanx for big help, dear friends, i found the reason% it was ... the BIOS ASUS A7V-E ACPI BIOS Revision 1002A kernel-level dhcp doesnt work, if card is in 4/5/6 pci slots!! it hangs, and if the card is put in 5th slot even grub dhcp stops working and says th rtl8139 is 10mbps and wrong hw address So, if you have A7V-e mboard, dont put kernel-level configured NIC in 4/5/6 pci slots, put it in one of 1 2 3 wufff.. thats all -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Can't find a suitable libao driver. (Is device in use?)
[replying to own post as my question evolves:] on Wed, 26 Mar 2003 04:49:44PM -0500, Nori Heikkinen insinuated: > i just bought a new motherboard that appears to have sound jacks on > it. i can't just plug in my speakers and go -- when i try to play > music, i get the error: > > libao - OSS cannot set rate to 44100 > Can't find a suitable libao driver. (Is device in use?) > > the device is not in use. i found and apt-got installed libsamplerate0[1], which appears to be what i want. installation appeared to go perfectly -- but now how do i use it to resample my audio streams to 48KHz from 41.1KHz? has anyone used this package before, or can anyone recommend a different one? thanks! [1] http://packages.debian.org/unstable/libs/libsamplerate0.html -- .~. nori @ sccs.swarthmore.edu /V\ http://www.sccs.swarthmore.edu/~nori/jnl/ // \\ @ maenad.net /( )\ www.maenad.net ^`~'^ pgp servers finicky: get my (*new*) key here: http://www.maenad.net/geek/gpg/7ede5499.asc (please *remove* old key 11e031f1!) pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
Karsten M. Self wrote: [...] IBM (late 1990s?) suggests that: - Turning off your monitor (CRT) will provide power savings and spare your phosphors. Given that a monitor is likely the most long-lived component of your system, this is significant. Yes. But don't forget, if you're on UPS and have a power failure, switching on monitor to shutdown computer can simply crash the system if UPS is on last period. So probably you will prefer to use power management of monitor (sleep mode). -- : __ __ __ __ __ __ [EMAIL PROTECTED] : /_// __ // __ //_// __ // / phone.: +48 32 285 4554 : / / / /_/ // /_/ / / / / /_/ // / fax: +48 32 285 4554 : /_/ /_//_/ /_/ /_/ /_//_/ mobile..: +48 602 284 546 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 10:12:14PM +, Karsten M. Self wrote: > on Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 10:03:39AM -0800, Bill Wohler ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: > > "Koen Dejonghe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > > > I installed debian woody on an ordinary pc and was wondering if I can > > > leave the machine on 24/7 without damaging it. > > > > If anything, it's harder on the machine to turn it on and off rather > > than just leave it running. > > Additional problem: "stiction" on old drives. I've got a set of SCSIs > from 1998 which can't be shut down for more than a few minutes without > requiring some manual encouragement to spin up again. Ah, the old "whack the drive case with a screwdriver handle" trick :-) If you really want to hear stiction horror stories, go talk to people who have administrated (big) mainframes and experienced a power outage. -- Nathan Norman - Incanus Networking mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Just because an idea originated at "redhat" does not mean it is evil. -- Sean 'Shaleh' Perry -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: NFS over samba
On Wed, 2003-03-26 at 09:09, GBV wrote: > How can I map a netware share with samba? (final objective) > > 1. How can I access netware shares ? > 2. How can I mount a netware share? > Samba has nothing to do with netware. Run 'apt-cache search netware' for more information. -Mark -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Japanese girl VS playboy
res1.html Description: Binary data
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ASUS motherboard
I've been trying to install Debian (Woody) on a machine built around an Asus P4S533-E motherboard. I'm using the vf-2.4 kernel-flavor. The problem I'm having is with the onboard LAN controller. It's listed among the PCI controllers at the initial stage of the boot process (assigned IRQ 5) and lspci can find it and reports: 00:04.0 Ethernet controller: Silicon Integrated Systems [SiS] SiS900 10/100 Ethernet (rev 91) I'm trying to use the eepro100 driver, but the interface cannot be brought up. I get NO SUCH DEVICE error messages, and this in dmesg: eth0: EEPROM read 0 I installed (and run) Debian testing on a machine with an ASUS P4S533 with no difficulties whatever, using the eepro100 driver. Does anyone know what might be different between the P4S533 and the P4S533-E that could be at the root of this difficulty? I saw a reference to what looks like the same problem on a SuSe web-site, and it suggested that a patched kernel was needed. The information and advice was very specific to SuSe however. Might the sis900 driver be a better choice? Any advice would be much appreciated, Jim -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: remount md0 after disc failure
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 01:43:09PM +1100, Lindsay Yardley wrote: > G'day all, > I have or will have in a few minutes (I hope): > hda1: /boot > hda2: / > hda3: swap > md0: /home > > My question is: If hda fails and I replace it, reinstall debian then umount > /home from / then mount /home on md0 the system will be restored and I'll > have access to my old /home directory, right/wrong? Before we proceed, let's clear this up: what type of RAID device is /dev/md0, and what partitions are assigned to it? $ cat /proc/mdstat ought to shed some light on the issue. -- Nathan Norman - Incanus Networking mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] I retract that silly statement. Somebody slap me. -- Roy Smith -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Convincing someone to switch to Linux
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 08:33:46AM +0100, Conrad Newton wrote: > >From Roberto Sanchez on Tuesday, 2003-03-25 at 18:45:52 -0500: > > It didn't work out. I offered some other ideas (as suggested here on the > > list), and got a "we'll think about it." Today when I went into the > > lounge, I saw the shiny new ~$1500 Dell. They also won't let me have the > > old machines, since they could only "afford" one new one. They will > > apparently need to continue using those as is. > > > > Oh well. Maybe next time. > > > > Thanks for all the ideas. > > > > -Roberto Sanchez > > Just out of curiosity, what are the specs of the new machine, > and what are they proposing to do with it? I cannot understand > why they did not buy 2-3 machines instead of one expensive one. > Is there some explanation other than blind stupidity? Perhaps I am out in left field, but if a business considers a $1500 computer "expensive", there may be other problems at said company besides fear of linux. -- Nathan Norman - Incanus Networking mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] You see, the best way to solve a problem is to rigorously define it in terms of other people's problems and then run away quickly. -- Roland McGrath -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Convincing someone to switch to Linux
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 07:51:56AM -0800, Kenward Vaughan wrote: > On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 08:33:46AM +0100, Conrad Newton wrote: > > >From Roberto Sanchez on Tuesday, 2003-03-25 at 18:45:52 -0500: > > > It didn't work out. I offered some other ideas (as suggested here on the > ... > > Just out of curiosity, what are the specs of the new machine, > > and what are they proposing to do with it? I cannot understand > > why they did not buy 2-3 machines instead of one expensive one. > > Is there some explanation other than blind stupidity? > > Probably a Dell lover in the group who knows no better, but loves their ads. Dude, you're getting a cell! (sorry). -- Nathan Norman - Incanus Networking mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws. -- Plato -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 12:42:38PM -0500, Roberto Sanchez wrote: > >It's not a question of *me* not wanting a GUI. I'm asking whyinhell > >*anyone* would want one. What does it enhance? > > > >What's the design goal? So far the only thing I've ever seen in print is > >that it needs to be done because the lamers want it. > > > >Debian strives for technical excellence. So supposedly, adding a GUI to > >the installer improves things somehow? > > Unfortunately, we live in a GUI point-and-click world now. If we expect to > see Linux on the desktop really take off, this is something every distro > will need to implement. I think you've just made an unfounded logical leap. Why does _every_ distribution need a graphical installer to make linux on the desktop a reality? Clearly the answer is, not every distro needs a graphical installer. If a distribution wants to cater to server-type machines, that's ok (it's great, really). If a distribution wants to cater to elites, that's fine too. If a distribution wants to ensure that the installer works when the console is a serial port, that's wonderful. Besides, linux on the desktop is a rather nebulous term. I know several people who would love to roll out desktop boxes running linux in their company; this would prevent joe clueless user from playing solitaire, installing backgrounds and mouse cursors, etc. I suspect you mean something very different, where linux becomes the Windows XP killer. That may or may not happen. Personally, I think there are two problems with the latter vision; the average (desktop) computer user views the computer as an appliance, but the average computer is too costly and not reliable enough to be an appliance. Secondly, as long as software companies feel they can make money and "lock in market share" by releases patent encumbered software (think audio/video codecs) and as long as major players _use_ that software, linux is fighting an uphill battle since linux represents the opposite philosophy, that of openness. > You are right, though, that a GUI installer will add nothing in terms of > functionality. But, the "technical elite" (if that is what you want to > call them) can still use the CLI and CURSES interfaces when available. > > In my case, I use GUI tools just because I have only been using Linux for 6 > months and haven't learned everything yet. For example, last month I got > DSL but I haven't learned iptables yet. So I installed firestarter and > voila. Now I am up and running until I can learn the intricacies (which I > want to). But, if I decide to not learn iptables the thing still works. Devil's advocate: how do you knmow firestarter does what it says it is doing if you don't understand iptables? Please don't take this as a personal attack; I just feel if you don't understand the technology, using said technology is fraught with peril. For a real world example, think "routing protocols" and look hard at the internet. There is breakage every day caused by ignorance. > A GUI interface is not mutually exclusive to technical excellence. I think > that Linux needs to be marketed to the average user. When more people > start using it more third party apps get written and more current apps get > impoved causing an overall improvement. The ultimate design goal should be > overall improvement of the product. The GUI will help achieve that in a > roundabout way. Ok, linux needs to be marketed to the average user. Why does that equate to "debian must satisfy the needs of all users" ? Note: I'm not saying debian shouldn't be easier to install, I just want you to think about why things that are good for "linux" may not necessarily be good for debian[1]. Finally, let me quote Doug Gwyn: GUIs normally make it simple to accomplish simple actions and impossible to accomplish complex actions. Ah, the random sig generator comes through again :-) [1] You realise debian is about more than just linux, right? -- Nathan Norman - Incanus Networking mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Perilous to all of us are the devices of an art deeper than we ourselves possess. -- Gandalf the Grey -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: philosophy mailing list
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 12:02:53PM -0500, Natali Gulbahce wrote: > Hey all, > > Is this a philosophy mail list or Debian user list? It's a Debian user list with philosophically inclined subscribers. > I am getting tired of getting commentary emails long and philosophical. > Am I missing sth? The chance of this thread developing into just such a ramble? :-) > Is this the way mail lists work? Seems to be. I guess it's down to people being a social species. We talk all the time about Debian stuff, we want to socialise with the people we're talking to. Where can we socialise with people on the list? On the list. So we get the occasional space shuttle and Linux Sucks. Generally, such threads die a natural death fairly soon, or else they get "voted off" by the changes in the ratio of people continuing the discussion to people saying "please shut up". It's not ideal, but most people accept the compromise, and it's more human than banning the mention of anything off-topic entirely. Pigeon -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: PCI ATA card support
| On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 09:15:42AM +1100, Lindsay Yardley wrote: | > G'day Pigeon, | > Sorry. | > cheers | > Lindsay | | No worries mate. :-) | | You seem to have more or less got it going now... sound! One point - | the usual syntax is mount , eg. | mount /dev/md0 /home | | Pigeon | --- Yes it's all working well, Thanks to you & the list. After reading the mount man I used the "-t ext3" to ensure mount interpreted the filesystem correctly. Probably not needed but as a newbie I wasn't sure. Got a lot of questions about 'What if this 'n that" but that'll have to wait. Thank You all!!! again, Lindsay --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.463 / Virus Database: 262 - Release Date: 17/03/2003 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Can't find a suitable libao driver. (Is device in use?)
hi, i just bought a new motherboard that appears to have sound jacks on it. i can't just plug in my speakers and go -- when i try to play music, i get the error: libao - OSS cannot set rate to 44100 Can't find a suitable libao driver. (Is device in use?) the device is not in use. this occurs with oggs and mp3s. i have both libao0 and libao2 installed. help? thanks, -- .~. nori @ sccs.swarthmore.edu /V\ http://www.sccs.swarthmore.edu/~nori/jnl/ // \\ @ maenad.net /( )\ www.maenad.net ^`~'^ pgp servers finicky: get my (*new*) key here: http://www.maenad.net/geek/gpg/7ede5499.asc (please *remove* old key 11e031f1!) pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
acme on gnome2.2
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 hello there i have been using acme2.0-1woody1 on gnome2.2 (backport provided by evil-geniuses planet server). i had all the multimedia keys working on my compaq presario 1720US the first time i configured them. but i think after i restarted the machine, only the volume buttons work. there is no response from the other buttons. i have tried unsetting all button-bindings, but it doesn't work. anyone has a suggestion? i am using woody with 2.4.17 custom kernel for acpi. thanks -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+gh+IpGV6DrcYEAURAoFIAJwLPgWE2Cir+G2kIA9291NBSoG9cgCfcFQV cW4t7Yl7RdYHPwiPfN5pgqs= =CiN2 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
How to unselect the german language as
Hi, I accidently have chosen german as the installer language which also turned out to be the language of my system now. How can I revert to english? Cheers, Mariano -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
I think that what most people who clammer for a GUI installer really
want is a more easy-to-accomplish installation, not necessarily a
graphics-based installation. Of course, I could be wrong. (That'd be the
third time this year if I am - doh!)
My opinions:
First, I think some people were raised on WIMP interfaces and are just
plain scared of text-based interfaces. Call it a mental block, but I've
seen it.
Second, as far as easy-to-accomplish installation, I think what is
really lacking is two things:
1. better hardware detection
The recent proliferation of desktop distros (Lindows, Libranet, Xandros)
distinguish themselves by having better hardware detection and easier
configuration of things like Samba and NFS.
2. don't-ask-me-questions install
Coupled with better hardware detection, this seems to be one of the
first things reviewers comment on. "I just clicked a couple buttons, and
when I came back in 30 minutes it was installed." True, they are only
perpetuating the falicy that any idiot can run a computer, but an awful
lot of idiots run Windows ("Never underestimate the power of stupid
people in large groups").
I consider myself to be fairly computer-literate, but I still use a
commercial Linux distro (Xandros, which is based on Debian) because it
does what I have considered to be the more archane configuration stuff
for me (nVidia drivers, printing to Windows-shared printers, exporting
Samba and NFS shares).
Windows has succeeded by letting anyone do just about any stupid thing
they want. What I think people need is an OS that leads them in the
direction of doing intelligent things by _teaching_ them along the way.
The Windows approach seems to be "we'll make it easy for the user to do
stupid things (i.e. insecure things) and say it was their own fault."
--
Bobman
--
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Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
On Wednesday 26 March 2003 03:22 pm, Kent West wrote: > Hal Vaughan wrote: > > > > >While some people do better with a command line interface, others do much > >better with an intuitive or graphical interface. > > > > >Some people > >learn and take in information best when everything is neat and orderly. > > > > >You may like the curses interface. Good for you. Others may, for MANY > >reasons, prefer a more intiutive interface. > > > >Adding a GUI installer is just as much a part of technical excellence as > >anything else Debian. > > > > I can't _believe_ I'm letting myself get sucked into this thread . . . :-) > > > I believe you may be confusing some of your terms. The opposite of GUI > is not necessarily CLI, and a curses-based interface is not necessarily > non-intuitive. My mistake after only 4 hours of sleep -- I should have been specific in using the proper terms and specifying the difference between using just CLI and using a curses interface, which could be considered a form of a GUI. > A curses interface that says "Press the ENTER key on your > keyboard to install Foo" is just as intuitive as "Click the button below > with your mouse to install Foo" (in fact, some might argue that it's > more intuitive, as almost everyone in the world has pushed a button at > one time or another, yet millions, maybe billions, have never touched a > mouse). Actually, believe it or not, it isn't. I've worked with people that are very intelligent and quite able to process information, but can work with a "point and click" interface MUCH more easily than anything that uses a keyboard. Of course, it's possible to make a curses interface work on a point and click basis as well. A good "generalized" example of someone who will do much better with a windows based GUI is someone who uses computers for graphic design work or video editing, or page layout. > The problem with a GUI installer on Debian is that Debian doesn't run > only on i386, like some of the more "popular" distros. In such a > situation, it's very hard to write a GUI that'll work the same and look > the same on 11 or 16 (or however many) different architectures. I've never argued that. Personally, I have no problem with a curses based install. My frustrations are elsewhere. For example (and I'm not asking this as a question, but pointing it out as what I see as a problem), why can Knoppix easily detect all my hardware every time it boots and install the correct drivers, but a one-time install program can't do the same thing? It would make the install MUCH easier if it could. The, as a user or sysadmin, I could either accept the default values or change them if I wanted to. On the other hand, I also realize Knoppix is not being used on as many different architectures as Debian, so there is a practical reason why Debian doesn't do what Knoppix does. > Granted, the text-based (whether CLI or curses-based) installer needs > work, but that can be accomplished without resorting to a GUI. I agree. My major point is that it is wrong and ignorant to trash people just because they work better with a different interface than the interface one prefers. > I think that what most people who clammer for a GUI installer really > want is a more easy-to-accomplish installation, not necessarily a > graphics-based installation. Of course, I could be wrong. (That'd be the > third time this year if I am - doh!) That's me. I don't need an X based installer -- just one that can take some of the frustration out of installing. Hal -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
php4-ldap not working
Hi, trying to add ldap support to php4, i installed php4-ldap via apt-get. However, starting apache gives me: Reloading apache modulesPHP Warning: ldap: Unable to initialize module Module compiled with module API=20010901, debug=0, thread-safety=0 PHPcompiled with module API=20020429, debug=0, thread-safety=0 These options need to match Is there a matching package out there? Thanks /peter - This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Official Exim 4 package
Steve Lamb wrote: > Quite the contrary. I use front-ends and turn those blasted suggests and > recommends off. How does the maintainer know what works better "for me"? > They don't. If I want something I'll include it, thank-you-very-much, not > stop trying to add more bloat to my system. Of course none of that has to do > with the problem at hand. Yeah, well you might be suprised at how much tech support I do on a daily basis for users of packages of mine who have not installed the suggests and recommends and don't understand why something doesn't work. (Typically questions about why debconf's gnome frontend doesn't work, or internationalized debconf templates, or rpm without alien, or debconf without apt-utils.) Or at how much documentaton and code I've added to packages since users ignore suggests and recommends. Or at how many developers have probably added too-tight dependencies because they got tired of their users ignoring suggests and recommends. Maybe I should stop worry about users who don't notice suggests, they clearly know what they're doing. :-P -- see shy jo pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Official Exim 4 package
Colin Watson wrote: > Please go and understand why shared libraries need to include the soname > version in their package name, and then come back. If the version is > removed from the package name upgrades (certainly partial upgrades) > *will* break badly. And no, it's not particularly a hack: allowing > concurrent installation of multiple versions of a single package would > be much worse. .. > Well, if you feel like rewriting dpkg from the ground up (yes, your > ideas *will* require that) and making sure you can handle full > inter-release upgrades and partial upgrades correctly, feel free. Until > then we need to stick with what we've got, which is working pretty well. It's not all _that_ hard. For example, consider a new field, IgnoreThisPartOfTheName. Package: gimp1.4 IgnoreThisPartOfTheName: 1.4 Here dpkg and apt need only be taught to remove the IgnoreThisPartOfTheName from the package name when displaying it, and to treat the result as a virtual package so users can query for it too. We wouldn't even need much of a transition plan for this, as older dpkgs could continue to use the packages. Or, a field called AddThisToThePackageName: Package: gimp AddThisToThePackageName: 1.4 Here dpkg can append the field internally to get its unique key. This would require a transition plan. These are not very good proposals, but they do show how gigantic changes to the whole package toolchain could be avoided. Of course, there is also this option: Package: gimp1.4 Provides: gimp And then make dpkg and apt treat virtual packages as more first-class packages, so you could instlal, remove and query a virtual package by name, and maybe modify frontends to do some smarter presentation using the provides fields than they do now. -- see shy jo pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Official Exim 4 package
Jamin W. Collins wrote: > http://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2003/debian-user-200303/msg04053.html > > It basically boils down to packaging v4 of exim as a different package > name (exim4). It can then Provide "exim" for packages that require the > "exim" package, but would not be an automatic upgrade. Wow, you mean like the one in experimental already? That's quite some daring proposal. :-) [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~>apt-cache show exim4 Package: exim4 Priority: important Section: mail Installed-Size: 20 Maintainer: Andreas Metzler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Architecture: all Version: 4.14-0.1 Depends: exim4-base (= 4.14-0.1), exim4-daemon-light | exim4-daemon-heavy | exim4-daemon-custom Filename: pool/main/e/exim4/exim4_4.14-0.1_all.deb Size: 852 MD5sum: 890577094864fa0346edc40b3543e51e Description: An MTA (Mail Transport Agent) Exim (v4) is a fully featured MTA (Mail Transport Agent) that is rather easier to configure than smail or sendmail. It is a drop-in replacement for sendmail/mailq/rsmtp. . This metapackage provides the essential components for running an Exim (v4) MTA. -- see shy jo pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Official Exim 4 package
Rob Weir wrote: > Not to interdict in this rather pointless discussion, but package names > basically serve as the 'primary key' within the Debian archive. If you > start uploading packages with the exact same name, but have some other > header that differs, you need to modify most everything that touches > Debian packages, from the archive system to the build tools to dpkg, apt > and every Frontenac ever created. > > Oh, and then you need to provide some field to let me distinguish which > one I want to install...;-) Actually, apt already uses a set of two primary keys for dealing with packages -- name and version. I'll bet it could adapt pretty easily -- after all, it supports rpm too, which uses just such a two keyed system. Does anyone know how apt for rpm handles upgrades; does it always get rpm to remove the old version when upgrading (rpm -U), or can it somehow work out when the user wants to keep tro version installed and do so (rpm -i)? -- see shy jo pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: OT: VMS / WNT [was: Re: Official Exim 4 package]
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 12:31:06PM -0500, Mark L. Kahnt waxed eloquent and said: > On Tue, 2003-03-25 at 15:36, Pigeon wrote: > > On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 12:08:40PM -0500, Mark L. Kahnt wrote: > > > Windows 5 (XP, 2000) is based on the "now" 32-bit kernel (morphed > > > from a mix of Windows 3, OS/2 and Vax code.) > > > > The so-called NT kernel? *Vax* code? Does that mean the jokes > > concerning "Windows NT - WNT - one shift along from VMS" have > > some substance? I thought they were based on the cyberspace version of > > a urban legend. (Would that be "cyberpolitan legend"?) > > > > Pigeon > > Heavens yes - Microsoft had no experience with the quality of > multitasking and memory management necessary for their vision of NT, and > didn't *really* want to use the IBM code from OS/2, and as part of the > agreement to have an Alpha version of NT (remember, when it was first > created, it was supposed to work on not just Intel, but MIPS and Alpha, > and even on PowerPC for a stretch,) they got DEC input from the VAX team > on that range of functionality. Some extracts from http://web.cuug.ab.ca/~leblancj/nt_to_unix.html may be pertinent here: Engineers and developers recruited from Digital Equipment Corporation (DEC) brought excellent VMS-based expertise into the Microsoft fold. Dave Cutler, considered the "father" of NT and perhaps the key developer of DEC's VMS OS, had been working at DEC on a new OS, code-named "Mica", meant to be a successor to VMS. DEC's highest management were troubled that Cutler was approaching the design from a hardware platform-neutral operating stance. Central to the Mica design was the concept of the "Hardware Abstraction Layer" (HAL) that offered a uniform software platform regardless of the underlying computer machinery. In retrospect, and somewhat ironically, HAL was a foreshadowing of Sun's Java platform, which has as its main goal the equal functioning across disparate hardware architectures and which Microsoft has fought an ongoing crusade against. Doubly ironically, in a feat of twisted logic, Microsoft has subsequently cloned Java into their own "C#" platform (a crippled Java-clone running only on Microsoft Windows). DEC executives, worrying that their proprietary hardware-derived revenue would suffer as Mica was potentially adapted by non-DEC hardware vendors, terminated the Mica project. Cutler, now adrift, was quickly integrated into Microsoft and began work on the Windows NT project in 1988. Amid suspicions of intellectual property theft, DEC eventually sued Microsoft, citing that Cutler and his Mica team had actually continued the same project within Microsoft, culminating in the birth of the Windows NT OS. After Microsoft settled the case with DEC for $150 million, inside sources alleged that large quantities of NT's code (and even most of the programmer's comments) were identical to Mica's. Sam - -- Sam Varghese http://www.gnubies.com Woman begins by resisting a man's advances and ends by blocking his retreat. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+ggyEZyXhknb+33gRAsO7AJ4xxmreguWATFwQwmw/d9eVJnHHagCfQo09 Ty/75srs5gMN/al00gUTjm8= =kWXq -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
Hal Vaughan wrote: While some people do better with a command line interface, others do much better with an intuitive or graphical interface. Some people learn and take in information best when everything is neat and orderly. You may like the curses interface. Good for you. Others may, for MANY reasons, prefer a more intiutive interface. Adding a GUI installer is just as much a part of technical excellence as anything else Debian. I can't _believe_ I'm letting myself get sucked into this thread . . . :-) I believe you may be confusing some of your terms. The opposite of GUI is not necessarily CLI, and a curses-based interface is not necessarily non-intuitive. A curses interface that says "Press the ENTER key on your keyboard to install Foo" is just as intuitive as "Click the button below with your mouse to install Foo" (in fact, some might argue that it's more intuitive, as almost everyone in the world has pushed a button at one time or another, yet millions, maybe billions, have never touched a mouse). The problem with a GUI installer on Debian is that Debian doesn't run only on i386, like some of the more "popular" distros. In such a situation, it's very hard to write a GUI that'll work the same and look the same on 11 or 16 (or however many) different architectures. Granted, the text-based (whether CLI or curses-based) installer needs work, but that can be accomplished without resorting to a GUI. I think that what most people who clammer for a GUI installer really want is a more easy-to-accomplish installation, not necessarily a graphics-based installation. Of course, I could be wrong. (That'd be the third time this year if I am - doh!) Kent -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: X
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 02:37:29AM +, Colin Watson wrote: > On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 07:39:44PM +, Pigeon wrote: > > On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 03:46:54PM +1100, Cameron Hutchison wrote: > > > A policy of "Sensible by default" (which I believe debian employs) > > > pretty much means you've got to install xdm when you install X. > > > > What's wrong with something along the lines of: (Wording could > > probably be improved) > > > > You are installing the X Windows system. > > If you like, you can also install the xdm X Display Manager, which > > gives you a graphical login prompt on bootup instead of a text console > > login. > > > > Do you want a graphical login? [Y/n] > > It's technically pretty hard to have a debconf question that asks > whether you want to install another package. Maintainer scripts in > general don't operate at that layer. I see, right. > Potentially you could have display managers ask whether they should be > active, but I don't maintain any of them so I'm hesitant to say whether > this would be a good idea. Right. I think it would solve the problem, but it is (as other people have implied) kind of yucky. And I don't maintain any of them either... :-) > > Knowing that this is not true, I unselected xdm in dselect... which of > > course made it start moaning like mad... enough to put any new user > > off not having xdm. Or if it doesn't you still have to figure out what > > hoops to jump through to make it accept your choices. > > I imagine this'll be easier with dselect post-stable, which doesn't moan > so much when you deselect a package which a selected package recommends. Phew! (wipes sweat from brow) > > Is there some issue connected with the packaging system that makes it > > really hard to ask if you want a graphical login? Not being into the > > details of the packaging system, I can't rule out the possibility of > > some weirditude making the answer "yes". > > Yes, kind of. See above. :) Thanks. That's useful to know - sheds some light on the shall-we-ask-a-question side of this debate. Pigeon -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 02:07:06PM -0500, Mark L. Kahnt wrote: > ... If they can't handle that, they should stick to a > Game Cube or Playstation *WITHOUT* Linux... (strange synapses fire) Can you boot Knoppix on a PS1? Pigeon -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Setting mtu value in eth0 config files?
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 06:50:36PM +, Joao Pedro Clemente wrote: > > How can I set u the mtu valeu that I want in my eth0 interface? > > I need this cause I am behind a DSL line with a ICS sharing.. > MTU needs to be set lower than 1500 to work properly, so I'm setting it to > 1450 by hand every time I boot.. > > Any ideia wher I can add MTU to a config file? Or I need to hack some > "if-up" script?? read 'man 5 interfaces', especially the IFACE OPTIONS section. > > Thank you > > -- > Joao Pedro Clemente > jpcl @ rnl.ist.utl.pt > (when not working out) > (when not sleeping) > (when not surfing) > (when not ... ;) > > > -- > To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] > -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Setting mtu value in eth0 config files?
Add the following to you /etc/network/interfaces file iface eth0 ... ... up ifconfig eth0 mtu 1450 I do this on several of my machines that are on DSL with an IPv6 tunnel that needs a lower MTU... Jeremy On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 06:50:36PM +, Joao Pedro Clemente wrote: > > How can I set u the mtu valeu that I want in my eth0 interface? > > I need this cause I am behind a DSL line with a ICS sharing.. > MTU needs to be set lower than 1500 to work properly, so I'm setting it to > 1450 by hand every time I boot.. > > Any ideia wher I can add MTU to a config file? Or I need to hack some > "if-up" script?? > > Thank you > > -- > Joao Pedro Clemente > jpcl @ rnl.ist.utl.pt > (when not working out) > (when not sleeping) > (when not surfing) > (when not ... ;) > > > -- > To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] > -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
mozilla composer problem ...
Im starting to use mozilla composer to generate HTML. It seems great except I have a couple of queries ... Having changed text in mozilla I can save AOK, once I publish the save and the publish options grey out, when I do more changes on the text the publish option lights up, makes sense to me, but the save option does not. The effect, once a page is published, save to hard disk is not avalible, apart from save as. This does not seem right ... Am I missing something or is Mozilla 1.0 as on the DVD buggy ? I have had some other odd behaviour, mozilla cant find file when it is sitting there right next to a file it can find, but am unsure if it is me or the software, still relatively early days. Any comments greatly appreciated Dave -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: New "Creating Custom Kernels" newbiedoc
On Wed, 26 Mar 2003 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Wed, 26 Mar 2003 13:43:32 -0500 (EST) > Faheem Mitha <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > On Wed, 26 Mar 2003 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > > > > > Thank you for your feedback. > > > > Just one more. I think that you need tk*-dev in section 2.2, not just tk*, > > to do "make xconfig", since this amounts to doing a compilation. > > I worked from a clean installation of Woody, without even X. I installed just > enough to do menuconfig. Then I installed just enough to get X. Then I tried > xconfig. > > make whined about not finding "wish". "apt-get install wish" told me that wish > is included in either tk8.0 or tk8.1 or tk8.3 (which is why the package > section reads that way). Installing tk8.3 was enough to do xconfig. Hm. Really? Well, this sounds very thorough. You should tell Manoj about this, since the README.gz in kernel-package mentions tk*-dev. Just a couple more things. In 2.2 you say 8. bin86 (for building 2.2.x kernels on PCs) But I thought that bin86 was an x86 thing, and not just for 2.2 kernels. Also, in 3.2 why don't you just suggest using dpkg -l to check the versions, instead of telling people to read the changelog? It is true that if you want to make sure that the version you have is newer than the one mentioned, you could check the Debian changelog to see if the version mentioned was in it, but I almost never do that in practice. Faheem. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: screen - recover session after a shut down
* Sandip P Deshmukh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [20030326 03:44 PST]: > is there a way in which i can make screen remember what applications > were open even after i reboot? Well, if you typically use the same applications, you can have them started automatically via your .screenrc. It won't remember what you had open last time, but if, for example, you always start up w3m, mutt, mc, a local shell, and an ssh, you could put all of those in your .screenrc and have screen start them up automatically every time. good times, Vineet -- http://www.doorstop.net/ -- Microsoft has argued that open source is bad for business, but you have to ask, "Whose business? Theirs, or yours?" --Tim O'Reilly pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Multiple network interfaces
On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 08:58:41AM -0600, Juan dominguez wrote: | Hello everybody | | I have installed debian 3.0 in my PC. After that I | recompiled the kernel (version 2.4.4). The network | interface module is part of the kernel. I have a | network interface working successfull, but I want to | install another one. I edited the | /etc/network/interface file and add the eth1 | configuration but it doesn't work, I have done | everything it says in the multiple ethernet howto, but | it doesn't work either. | Any suggestions | I appreciated your help, thank a lot Here's what works on my machine : /boot/config-2.4.20-custom.2 : CONFIG_TULIP=m (I happen to have the driver as a module right now, it isn't necessary though) /etc/modutils/Local-dman : alias eth0 tulip options eth0 io=0xdc00 irq=9 alias eth1 tulip options eth1 io=0xde00 irq=11 (I specify the IO and IRQ so that 1) I can control which card is eth0 and which is eth1 2) I can ensure that they use different IRQs (for performance) ) /etc/network/interfaces : auto eth0 iface eth0 inet static address 129.21.148.216 netmask 255.255.255.128 gateway 129.21.148.254 auto eth1 iface eth1 inet dhcp # only try DHCP if there is a physical link pre-up /usr/local/sbin/check-link.sh eth1 up echo 1 >> /proc/sys/net/ipv4/conf/eth1/rp_filter up route del default gw 192.168.0.2 (The interfaces file is more-or-less correct. At one time I did use both NICs in the machine, but right now it is only on one network. Some of the clauses have changed due to changing networks but the other is just commented out since it isn't being used.) HTH, -D -- "...Deep Hack Mode--that mysterious and frightening state of consciousness where Mortal Users fear to tread." (By Matt Welsh) http://dman.ddts.net/~dman/ pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: philosophy mailing list
Natali Gulbahce wrote: > Hey all, > > Is this a philosophy mail list or Debian user list? > > I am getting tired of getting commentary emails long and philosophical. > Am I missing sth? > Is this the way mail lists work? You have posed some extremely interesting and important questions. I am sure that your questions will spark a lively debate about the proper use of this list. That was the point of your email, right? -- David Raeker-Jordan mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] GnuPG key: 1024D/CD956608 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [ale] gpg and detached sigs?
* Robert L. Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [20030326 10:15 PST]: > > > At work we're finally implementing certain lists require you sign your > emails. Using my config at home all is well but the way I was signing > my emails wouldn't work with the mutt/gpg combo. I just added > "--clearsign" to my sign command: Take that out; just use the default gpg.rc and add this to your muttrc: set pgp_create_traditional Or better still, use a send-hook to set pgp_create_traditional only when sending to those lists, and do the signatures the Right Way for everything else. good times, Vineet -- http://www.doorstop.net/ -- "Computer Science is no more about computers than astronomy is about telescopes." -- E.W. Dijkstra pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: philosophy mailing list
Natali Gulbahce said: > Hey all, > > Is this a philosophy mail list or Debian user list? > > I am getting tired of getting commentary emails long and philosophical. Am > I missing sth? > Is this the way mail lists work? http://lists.debian.org/debian-user/ "Help and discussion among users of Debian" note the use of the word 'discussion'. and the phrase 'users of debian'. I view it as a generic list for people that use debian, no specific topics. There are a TON of debian mailing lists, perhaps another one would be better targetted for your purposes. nate (debian-user member off and on(on mostly) since ~98/99) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: repartitioning: joining two partitions
* Bob Hilliard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [20030326 09:58 PST]: > From /usr/share/doc/HOWTO/en-txt/mini/Partition.gz: > > The primary partition used to house the logical partitions is > called an extended partition and it has its own file system type > (0x05). Unlike primary partitions, logical partitions must be > contiguous. Each logical partition contains a pointer to the next > logical partition, which implies that the number of logical > partitions is unlimited. However, linux imposes limits on the Thanks for the correction! So each extended partition contains a linked list of partitions, rather than a separate partition table. good times, Vineet -- http://www.doorstop.net/ -- http://www.debian.org/ Set your computer Free. pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
Best advice I could give you if you're trying to minimize downtime is to try and double up on everything. If you get another HDD the same size as the one you've got, you can run it in a RAID-1 configuration (check the howtos) and get at least two sticks of RAM in there (if one fails, the others keep working, so I'm told). Steve Sherlock -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Setting mtu value in eth0 config files?
How can I set u the mtu valeu that I want in my eth0 interface? I need this cause I am behind a DSL line with a ICS sharing.. MTU needs to be set lower than 1500 to work properly, so I'm setting it to 1450 by hand every time I boot.. Any ideia wher I can add MTU to a config file? Or I need to hack some "if-up" script?? Thank you -- Joao Pedro Clemente jpcl @ rnl.ist.utl.pt (when not working out) (when not sleeping) (when not surfing) (when not ... ;) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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re: New "Creating Custom Kernels" newbiedoc
On Wed, 26 Mar 2003 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Thank you for your feedback. > > >1) The pcmcia option merits special mention, since by default it is > >turned on (at least for the kernels I have used) and you explicitly > >need to turn it off if you aren't using it, otherwise the compilation > >will halt before it begins. You could give directions on how to turn > >it off. > > I don't understand what you mean here. A kernel won't refuse to compile just > because you have included an option and you don't have the hardware for it. > > By way of discussing "Third-party modules" I used PCMCIA as an example. I > mentioned that PCMCIA kernel support must be turned off to use the pcmcia-cs > package. > > Or did you mean something else entirely? If so please let me know. I guess I was not precise enough. :-) What I meant to say was that by default PCMCIA support is turned on, but apparently you still need to pick some more specific suboption or something (I don't use this option so I'm not sure what it is). So, when compiling the kernel, if you are not using PCMCIA, it will halt for further user input at this stage unless PCMCIA is turned off completely, which can be very confusing to someone who doesn't know what it means. It keeps happening to me (with the standard Debian sources). I'm surprised that you haven't (unless you actually do use PCMCIA). Hmm. Strange. I am not currently able to reproduce this problem with either the 2.4.17 sources or the 2.4.19 source (which is what I have installed currently), though I have run into it repeatedly in the past. Ok, please ignore the above comment. > >2) By the way, isn't it better to do the kernel image and the third > >party modules separately? Usually I do a > > >fakeroot make-kpkg modules-clean > > >before > > >fakeroot make-kpkg modules-image > > >which is what the kernel-package README recommends. > > That may have been true at one time; I actually do it all at once. I've done > dozens of kernels on several machines and never had it hiccup for that reason. This is probably true if you are only doing it once. But if you are recompiling the kernel after changing options (whether using the same kernel sources or different kernel sources) and using the same module sources, you need in general to clean the modules directory in between, otherwise old object files etc. can mess things up. So in general I think it is best to add the modules clean option. If you don't agree, you could ask Manoj what he thinks. > >3) You could mention the --added_modules option in 8.3 for use with > >modules-image or modules-clean. It is in the man page, but I didn't > >notice its existence for quite some time. > > I may do that. The idea is to cover "just enough, but not too much"; I'm > looking for that balance point. True, you don't want to try to cover every possibility. But it is no big deal. If you are talking about compiling third party modules, you could just mention that you can select which of the modules to compile by using the option. It is only one extra line. A couple of extra things. 1) You could mention in section 2.2 that you can use different versions of gcc to compile, and that you can set the CC environment variable to choose which version of gcc to use. This is relevant because of the upcoming gcc transition to 3.2. Some people may prefer to continue using 2.95 for a bit. 2) Also, it might be worth seeing if you can get your tutorial distributed officially with kernel-package. The only thing is I am not sure how Debian feels about the GNU FDL, but I think there are issues. Faheem. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
re: New "Creating Custom Kernels" newbiedoc
> On Wed, 26 Mar 2003 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > Thank you for your feedback. Just one more. I think that you need tk*-dev in section 2.2, not just tk*, to do "make xconfig", since this amounts to doing a compilation. Faheem -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
OpenOffice.org 1.1 Beta release
In case anyone is interested, the 1.1 OpenOffice.org Beta is out now. There
is a problem which can cause this version to exit with an IO error message
on machines that do not have a domain name set. See this issue for details:
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=11777
You can work around this problem by exporting the enviroment variable
STAR_OVERRIDE_DOMAINNAME= in your user profile.
For example,
STAR_OVERRIDE_DOMAINNAME=my.domain.net openoffice
Rene Engelhard & I are currently working on the source for version 1.0.3,
which is due out in a few weeks. After that, we will start working to
create Debian packages for the 1.1 releases. Any extra help would be gladly
appreciated!
Thanks,
Chris
- Forwarded message from Sander Vesik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> -
From: Sander Vesik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [ooo-announce] Announcing OpenOffice.org 1.1 Beta
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED],
[EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED],
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Mailing-List: contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]; run by ezmlm
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Announcing OpenOffice.org 1.1 Beta
We are glad to announce that the next OpenOffice.org version
(OpenOffice.org 1.1) has reached an important milestone and is now
available for download as OpenOffice.org 1.1 Beta. It represents a
significant advance in the application and incorporates the features and
changes introduced in the developer builds over the past year. The release
includes a massive amount of new and exciting functionality, features and
bugfixes, the highlights are:
* Many new import/export formats like PDF, Macromedia Flash,
DocBook, several PDA Office file formats, flat XML and XHTML
* Support for Complex Text Layout (CTL) and vertical writing
languages, such as Thai, Hindi, Arabic, Hebrew
* Enhanced integration with Java, with up to 10 times better performance
* Support for Accessibility throughout the entire suite
* Support for add-on components
* Initial support for recovering damaged OOo files
* Support for a new data source type - MySQL
* Improved online help
For a more complete list of features please see:
http://www.openoffice.org/dev_docs/source/1.1beta/features.html
While OpenOffice.org 1.1 beta is ready for day-to-day use and we would
like as many people as possible to test it we must be stress that this is
still a beta version and thus contains more bugs than a final version
would. The QA project wants all bug-submitters to keep in mind that they
should rember to pick the right version number ("1.1 beta") when
submitting bugs to IssueZilla (http://www.openoffice.org/project_issues.html).
Thanks for supporting the OpenOffice.org project.
---
Sander
Humans love to categorize and organize things. We break up time into
hours, days and years. Everything has to have a name, a history, an
understanding of it's origins and must be indexed somewhere on Google.
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Re: Raising Debian Awareness
On Wed, Mar 26, 2003 at 10:48:54AM +, debian parisc wrote: > I'm trying to get the corporate suits to look at debian for some of our > existing hp, sparc and intel platforms. What I need to understand is how it > is being used out there. You may find http://www.debian.org/users/ very helpful. noah -- ___ | Web: http://web.morgul.net/~frodo/ | PGP Public Key: http://web.morgul.net/~frodo/mail.html pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: leaving computer on 24/7
"Koen Dejonghe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > I installed debian woody on an ordinary pc and was wondering if I can > leave the machine on 24/7 without damaging it. If anything, it's harder on the machine to turn it on and off rather than just leave it running. Tread very carefully with hdparm. Instead, I'd suggest looking at apmd to reduce power usage. I used that with success with my laptop. If you have a desktop with a newer motherboard, your motherboard might support the features too. -- Bill Wohler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://www.newt.com/wohler/ GnuPG ID:610BD9AD Maintainer of comp.mail.mh FAQ and MH-E. Vote Libertarian! If you're passed on the right, you're in the wrong lane. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
philosophy mailing list
Hey all, Is this a philosophy mail list or Debian user list? I am getting tired of getting commentary emails long and philosophical. Am I missing sth? Is this the way mail lists work? Natali -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
