Estão abertas as inscrições para a DebConf19 em Curitiba

[Paulo Henrique de Lima Santana]

Olá,

Estão abertas as inscrições gratuitas para a DebConf19 [1] - Conferência
Mundial de Desenvolvedores(as) do Projeto Debian, que acontecerá de 21 a
28 julho na UTFPR em Curitiba. O evento será precedido pela DebCamp, de
14 a 19 de julho, e pelo Open Day [2] no dia 20 de julho.

A DebConf é um evento aberto a todos(as), não importando como você se
identifica ou como os(a) outros(as) o(a) percebem. Queremos aumentar a
visibilidade da nossa diversidade e trabalhar para a inclusão no Projeto
Debian, incentivando a participação desde pessoas que estão iniciando a
sua jornada no Debian até desenvolvedores(as) experientes ou
contribuidores(as) ativos(as) do Debian, em diferentes áreas como
empacotamento, tradução, documentação, design, testes, derivados
especializados, suporte e muitos outras. Em outras palavras, todos(as)
são bem-vindos(as)!

Para se inscrever no evento, você deverá fazer login no sistema de
registro [3] e preencher o formulário. Você poderá editar e atualizar as
suas informações a qualquer momento. No entanto, para ajudar os
organizadores a ter uma estimativa melhor de quantas pessoas realmente
virão para evento, nós agradecemos se você puder acessar o sistema e
confirmar (ou cancelar) a sua participação na Conferência assim que
souber se será mesmo possível vir. O último dia para confirmar ou
cancelar a sua inscrição é 14 de junho de 2019 às 20:59:59 (horário de
Brasília). Se você não confirmar ou se inscrever após essa data, você
pode vir para a DebConf19, mas nós não poderemos garantir a
disponibilidade de hospedagem, de alimentação e do kit de participante
(camiseta, bolsa, etc.).

Para mais informações sobre a inscrição, acesse:  Informações sobre a
inscrição [4]

Bolsa para passagens, hospedagem e alimentação
--

Com o objetivo de promover a participação de mais contribuidores(as) na
DebConf, o Projeto Debian destina uma parte dos recursos financeiros
obtidos com os patrocínios do evento para pagar bolsas (passagens,
hospedagem e/ou alimentação) para os(as) participantes que solicitarem
esse apoio/patrocínio no momento da sua inscrição.

Como os recursos financeiros são limitados, nós avaliaremos os pedidos e
decidiremos quem receberão as bolsas. As bolsas são destinadas:

* Para contribuidores(as) ativos(as) do Debian.
* Para promoção de diversidade: novos(as) participantes no Debian e/ou
na DebConf, especialmente de grupos sub-representados na área de tecnologia.

Palestrar, organizar uma atividade ou ajudar durante a DebConf19 conta
pontos para ganhar a bolsa, então por favor mencione essas iniciativas
no seu pedido. Os planos para a DebCamp podem ser inseridos no link
habitual: Página dos Sprints no wiki do Debian [5].

Para mais informações sobre as bolsas, acesse: Candidatando-se para uma
Bolsa para da DebConf [6].

Atenção: as inscrições para a DebConf19 ficarão abertas até a data do da
Conferência, mas a solicitação das bolsas deverá ser realizada pelas
pessoas interessadas usando o formulário de inscrição até o dia 15 de
abril de 2019 às 20:59:59 (horário de Brasília). Esse prazo é necessário
para que os organizadores tenham tempo suficiente para analisar os
pedidos, e para que os aplicantes selecionados possam se preparar para a
Conferência.

Para realizar a sua inscrição, com ou sem pedido de bolsa, acesse:
https://debconf19.debconf.org/register
[1] https://debconf19.debconf.org
[2] https://debconf19.debconf.org/schedule/openday
[3] https://debconf19.debconf.org/register
[4] https://debconf19.debconf.org/pt-br/inscricao
[5] https://wiki.debian.org/Sprints
[6] https://debconf19.debconf.org/pt-br/bolsas

Abraços,
-- 
Paulo Henrique de Lima Santana (phls)
Curitiba - Brasil
Debian Developer
Diretor do Instituto para Conservação de Tecnologias Livres
Membro da Comunidade Curitiba Livre
Site: http://www.phls.com.br
GNU/Linux user: 228719  GPG ID: 0443C450

Organizador da DebConf19 - Conferência Mundial de Desenvolvedores(as) Debian
Curitiba - 21 a 28 de julho de 2019
http://debconf19.debconf.org



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Re: blank time in console too short

[David Wright]

On Fri 22 Mar 2019 at 21:16:11 (+0100), Hans wrote:
> Am Freitag, 22. März 2019, 20:45:13 CET schrieb bw:
> > In-Reply-To: <4205892.cicxXhXihB@protheus2>
> > 
> > >Both systems got an identical configuration but behave different.
> > 
> > I'm confused, did you try the methods you mentioned with no result?
> Well, all solutions I read, where about setterm or using kernel tags. But 
> this 
> is not what I am looking for. I am not looking for a solution (which I can 
> easily reach with setterm or a kernel parameter).
> 
> > 
> > Are you looking for how to solve it, or a clue why it is that way?
> 
> See above. I would like to understand, why two identically configured systems 
> behave different. This means for me, that some configuration(s) do not take 
> any 
> effect. But which one And I want just be sure, that I did something not 
> see.

Are the systems identical, or just the configurations?

I think you wrote EEEPC. These are obsolete? I read that setterm uses
APM for blanking when available. That's obsolete. So I guess what I'm
asking is, "Is it worth worrying about if you are able to solve the
problem anyway?".

Cheers,
David.

Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[David Wright]

On Fri 22 Mar 2019 at 16:16:51 (-0400), deb wrote:
> On 3/22/19 4:00 PM, David Wright wrote:
> > On Fri 22 Mar 2019 at 14:00:24 (-0400), deb wrote:
> > > On 3/22/19 1:48 PM, Curt wrote:
> > > > On 2019-03-22, deb  wrote:
> > > > > > Depending on what's on the disk, it might be more useful to just use
> > > > > > lsof to see what files are open and try to understand what those 
> > > > > > might
> > > > > > be doing.
> > > > I believe you said that the external USB drive's LED remains on, even
> > > > after unmounting, and that indicates to you that there's activity on the
> > > > drive. I've always labored under the idea that a *flashing* light
> > > > indicated activity and a steady one an idle state.
> > > > 
> > > > Now it occurs to me that these signal indications may depend on the make
> > > > and model of the drive itself.
> > > > 
> > > > What should be the behavior of the LED on your drive when the drive is
> > > > unmounted and/or inactive?
> > > YES -- this differs by manufacturer.
> > … and by model, in the case of Seagate.
> > 
> > > Just a reminder -- the bulk of mine are Seagate Backup Plus (1-5TB.
> > > USB 3.0).
> > > On Windows, when you dismount (Safely Remove) these
> > > the light goes off.
> > I've never seen the light go off until it spins down (those that do).
> > 
> > > It is On when connected and very dimmly flashed when being accessed.
> > > So, it can flash a bit when indexes are up[dated,
> > > or a file is flushed -- and go right back to steady on.
> > My 5TB doesn't ever flash or dim; a little annoying.
> > 
> > > I only *feel* safe, pulling the cable when the light is OFF.
> > If you're really worried, first remount the partitions readonly, which
> > will fail if they're in use. Then unmount them and disconnect.
> 
> Good idea David.
> 
> I'll add this to the list.

It was only a recommendation for yourself.

> by-the-by, (when I last checked) Windows does NOT have a mount
> read-only notion.
> 
> The recommended approach when I last looked was to rip through each
> file and folder setting them individually to read-only.
> 
> Guess how long that takes on a 5TB?
> 
> Now multiply that guess by an office of drives; with people wanting to
> switch them back and forth R-O -> W -> R-O

One would presumably be expected to script it if there's no
equivalent of chmod -R. But I have no idea whether the semantics
of write-protected directories is the same in Windows as it is
in linux, and particularly for NTFS which I only ever mount RO.

> > > Again, I can NOT suffer a data-loss-because-of-Evil-Linux situation,
> > > giving the Windows-folk ammo.
> > Disks occasionally fail for everyone, irrespective of OS.
> > 
> > > I wanted to switch to your name in the Subject Curt,
> > > but Jim P. will yell at me. :-)
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Screw it --- I switched it anyway.
> > I can already see whose post yours is commenting on. The rule is simple:
> > Change the subject line if the subject changes,
> > Don't change the subject line if the subject doesn't change.
> 
> Ack on the subject-line change.
> 
> I am one-time switching this one's back.
> 
> 
> Now then -- where ARE these rules?
> 
> I'd like to hand a list to new users.
> 
> Obviously, I don't know them all.

The more important ones are at https://www.debian.org/MailingLists/
Otherwise, "When in Rome" generally works best. That's why most
people lurk a while before they first post to a new list.
(That's not meant personally.)

> > On a technical point, there are those whose less functional
> > mail clients thread by subject line rather than Message-ID.
> > Their threading get totally fragmented by all your changes.

Cheers,
David.

Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[David Wright]

On Fri 22 Mar 2019 at 21:19:19 (-0400), deb wrote:
> On 3/22/19 7:39 PM, Michael Stone wrote:
> > On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 04:23:32PM -0400, deb wrote:
> > > On 3/22/19 4:07 PM, Michael Stone wrote:
> > > > On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 03:00:23PM -0500, David Wright wrote:
> > > > > If you're really worried, first remount the partitions readonly, which
> > > > > will fail if they're in use. Then unmount them and disconnect.
> > > > 
> > > > Just unmount--that will fail if the partition is in use
> > > > unless extra options are added.
> > > 
> > > Actually no.
> > 
> > Actually, yes.
> > > That's where I started at.
> > > 
> > > A given drive should behave the same on Windows & Linux as far
> > > as lights on/off/dimming.

I don't think the difference is in the behaviour of the drive, but in
the behaviour of whatever it's plugged into.

> > > But as I noted earlier, on Windows, the light is OFF,
> > > signaling no drive activity upon being removed.
> > > 
> > > On debian 9.8, it stays on, after repeated dismounts.

Yes. Presumably you had to mount it between each dismount.
(You can't unmount something that's not mounted.)

In Windows, after you have Safely Removed the drive with the menu,
try leaving the drive plugged in. Now mount it again. Can you?
You could in linux.

> > Then there's nothing using the drive and you're barking up the
> > wrong tree.
> > 
> > What you're seeing is that windows does a disconnect if you're
> > using the "safely remove" thing. You might be able to get the same
> > effect in linux by running "eject" on the drive, depends on what
> > specifically the drive is looking for.
> 
> I had previously tried eject as well.
> 
> Hard light was still on.
> 
> My choice was shutdown and pull the cable or pull it out seemingly hot.

Is that a problem? USB was designed for hot plugging and unplugging.
In fact, some systems won't recognise that a device is present unless
it is plugged in hot, eg my AiO Printer.

> Hopefully the tool choices from the others will provide info.

If those tools are looking for activity, they won't find any.

Cheers,
David.

Thanks for the help today folks

[deb]

I will summarize them all up.

Thanks

Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[deb]

On 3/22/19 4:25 PM, David Wright wrote:

On Fri 22 Mar 2019 at 16:07:24 (-0400), Michael Stone wrote:

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 03:00:23PM -0500, David Wright wrote:

If you're really worried, first remount the partitions readonly, which
will fail if they're in use. Then unmount them and disconnect.

Just unmount--that will fail if the partition is in use unless extra
options are added.

Sorry, it hadn't occurred to me that the OP wasn't just doing that
(because they had said they used "Safely Remove" in Windows).
Nor had it occurred to me that one might need a bettery of tools
like iotop, hdparm, iostat, pidstat, perf top, and the rest,
rather than just unmounting. I thought they wanted a belt and braces
method, a bit of redundancy.

So it's just the usual Pose Problem A, Solve Problem B.

Cheers,
David.


To summarize, I had been unmounting (multiple times, NO errors)
as well as eject -ing.
Drives still have hard light on.
This is different behavior than on Windows, where the light goes off 
signaling it's ready to to be removed.

Same drives in both cases.


I am quite happy to have the battery of recommended tools to see what is 
accessing the drives BEFORE ever unmounting at all.


At least Linux has these tools.

It is often a sysinternals-level jaunt on Windows to figure out what's 
tying up a drive. Their default error messages are a joke.

Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[deb]

On 3/22/19 7:39 PM, Michael Stone wrote:

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 04:23:32PM -0400, deb wrote:


On 3/22/19 4:07 PM, Michael Stone wrote:

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 03:00:23PM -0500, David Wright wrote:

If you're really worried, first remount the partitions readonly, which
will fail if they're in use. Then unmount them and disconnect.


Just unmount--that will fail if the partition is in use unless extra 
options are added.


Mike Stone




Actually no.


Actually, yes.

That's where I started at.


A given drive should behave the same on Windows & Linux as far as 
lights on/off/dimming.


But as I noted earlier, on Windows, the light is OFF, signaling no 
drive activity upon being removed.


On debian 9.8, it stays on, after repeated dismounts.


Then there's nothing using the drive and you're barking up the wrong 
tree.


What you're seeing is that windows does a disconnect if you're using 
the "safely remove" thing. You might be able to get the same effect in 
linux by running "eject" on the drive, depends on what specifically 
the drive is looking for.


Mike Stone





I had previously tried eject as well.

Hard light was still on.

My choice was shutdown and pull the cable or pull it out seemingly hot.


Hopefully the tool choices from the others will provide info.

Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[deb]

On 3/22/19 4:21 PM, Cindy-Sue Causey wrote:

On 3/22/19, David Wright  wrote:

On Fri 22 Mar 2019 at 14:00:24 (-0400), deb wrote:

Just a reminder -- the bulk of mine are Seagate Backup Plus (1-5TB.
USB 3.0).
On Windows, when you dismount (Safely Remove) these
the light goes off.

I've never seen the light go off until it spins down (those that do).


You're reminding me of something I read and have now mostly forgotten.
It was something about today's hard drives being *maybe*
"intelligent".

On some (presumably newer) hardware, there are one or more BIOS
settings that affect how hard drives function. A quickly attempted
search landed the potentially useful phrases of "sleep mode" and "HDD
standby".

Cindy :)


Yes Cindy.

In fact, I fought against uying Western Digital drives once they stuck a 
password protected section on their drives; and refused to give the 
credentials to customers.


That was too Intel Management Engine-y for me.


https://superuser.com/questions/969026/remove-wd-unlocker-partition-from-wd-my-book


I don't think this is it, or the sleep mode on the Seagates.

At least, that is not an issue when running on Windows.


Thanks

Re: Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

[deb]

On 3/22/19 4:22 PM, Nicholas Geovanis wrote:
On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 2:52 PM deb > wrote:



They won't all be admins, but the top tech folks will be.
(But, those are likely the ones who will cause the most trouble).


Do you know how to "disable" select administrative commands using 
/etc/sudoers?

It can be useful in these situations. Your top tech folks can defeat it.



Yes, but I am A admin, these other folks will demand sudo privileges to 
even think about Linux.


Not optimal, I know.

Thanks Nicholas!




One thing they do do is backup.

Lots and lots of backups.


I will add the bug list check to my list (good idea).


>
> Some suggested reading here to get started.
> https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian
>
> I think this forum is a good place to read first, post later.  The
> archives have a ton of info. Many issues have already been done
to death.
> https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/
> https://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser
>
Thank you bw!

Re: youtube video downloader for chrome

[David Wright]

On Thu 21 Mar 2019 at 14:24:08 (-0700), Fred wrote:
> On 03/21/2019 11:57 AM, David Wright wrote:
> > On Thu 21 Mar 2019 at 10:17:11 (-0700), Fred wrote:
> > > On 03/21/2019 08:41 AM, David Wright wrote:
> > > > On Thu 21 Mar 2019 at 15:38:41 (+0100), Pierre Frenkiel wrote:
> > > > > On Wed, 20 Mar 2019, Celejar wrote:
> > > > > > On Wed, 20 Mar 2019 10:34:42 +0100 (CET) Pierre Frenkiel 
> > > > > >  wrote:
> > > > > > > On Tue, 19 Mar 2019, riveravaldez wrote:
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > Maybe worth mentioning: youtube-dl, exceptionally useful and 
> > > > > > > > simple CLI tool.
> > > > > > >  useful and simple... but it works only for urls with 
> > > > > > > alphanumeric characters
> > > > > > >  I tried with an url containing ? and &, and I got nothing
> > > > > > >  I tried also by escaping ? and & with \, and it was not 
> > > > > > > better.
> > > > > > >  I'll send you an example later, if you are not convinced...
> > > > > > You can also try putting the url(s) in a file, and feeding the file 
> > > > > > to
> > > > > > youtube-dl via its -a option.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Celejar
> > > > > > 
> > > > > At last, I fixed everything just by loadind the last version of 
> > > > > youtube-dl from the
> > > > > yt-dl site
> > > > > wget https://yt-dl.org/latest/youtube-dl -O 
> > > > > /usr/local/bin/youtube-dl
> > > > > 
> > > > > after that,  I can do either
> > > > >   youtube-dl --no-playlist  
> > > > > 'https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQd1IOyhKS4=RDEMlHFFKeq-aYlBhg-LtJ-SHw_radio=1'
> > > > >   or
> > > > >  youtube-dl https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQd1IOyhKS4 both give
> > > > > exactly the same result.
> > > > > 
> > > > > My question is why the Debian version so obsolte ans uneliable?
> > > > The latest version on the website is three days old. The version I
> > > > installed from backports on Jan 28 was 11 days old.
> > > > 
> > > > You have to understand that sites like youtube and the BBC can
> > > > obsolete youtube-dl and get_iplayer overnight, and they do.
> > > > Then some clever people come up with a fix and release a new
> > > > version, and I heave a big sigh of relief and thanks. (Most
> > > > BBC programmes expire after four weeks, and I'm usually two or
> > > > three weeks behind, so a quick fix is vital.)
> > > > 
> > > > Debian mainstream doesn't work to that timetable, so you should
> > > > check out the backports, where those sorts of package appear.
> > > > Fortunately, get_iplayer is a single Perl script so I just
> > > > download it from its site and put it in ~/bin, as you can see
> > > > from my examples.
> > > > 
> > > Hi,
> > > I think you would be better off with:
> > > 
> > > youtube-dl --update
> > a) Why?
> > 
> > b) How?
> > 
> > $ youtube-dl --update
> > Usage: youtube-dl [OPTIONS] URL [URL...]
> > 
> > youtube-dl: error: youtube-dl's self-update mechanism is disabled on Debian.
> > Please update youtube-dl using apt(8).
> > See https://packages.debian.org/sid/youtube-dl for the latest packaged 
> > version.
> > 
> > $
> > 
> > > also:
> > > 
> > >   youtube-dl --help
> > > 
> > > will show all the options.
> > … and, of course, --update is missing.
> > 
> > But which of these options did you mean to draw my attention to?

> Well, it would appear that I did not use the downlevel version from
> the Debian repository.  If you install from the youtube-dl website and
> then use the --update command you can be sure of having the latest
> version.

Yes, the very latest. But with backports I get something that's
almost invariably up-to-date enough, and I don't have to check
for upgrades—they just appear, like mainstream updates.

Cheers,
David.

Re: youtube video downloader for chrome

[David Wright]

On Wed 20 Mar 2019 at 18:21:20 (-0400), Celejar wrote:
> On Wed, 20 Mar 2019 15:00:12 -0400 rhkra...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Wednesday, March 20, 2019 02:10:57 PM David Wright wrote:
> > > Actually I don't call youtube-dl as above, because I have two helper
> > > functions which do things like history logging to prevent me
> > > accidentally downloading the same video twice.
> > 
> > Are you willing to share?
> 
> Note that you can apparently do something like this natively with
> youtube-dl itself - see its --download-archive option.

Sure, but I prefer my history file which saves a valid URL that
I can pass on to people who don't use youtube-dl.

Cheers,
David.

Re: Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

[deb]

On 3/22/19 7:43 PM, Andy Smith wrote:

Hello,

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 11:44:15AM -0400, deb wrote:

Are there list-suggested ways to help verify non-free / out-of-stable-distro
or even seldomly updated in-distro tools, PRE-INSTALL?

If in your /etc/apt/sources.list you stick to one distribution and
don't include "contrib" and "non-free" suites then you aren't going
to get any non-free software and the packages you install will at
least have been considered acceptable by Debian for release.


Are there suggested sites to look up Linux tools to verify them a bit;
rather than just one-off searches?

Are there suggested sites where KNOWN BAD tools are listed?

That all sounds highly subjective and don't see how you could have
any such definitive thing.

There is no substitute for proper research but as a blunt tool, once
you have identified multiple different packages that do what you
want you could look at Debian's popcon to compare how many reported
installations there are of each of them:

 https://popcon.debian.org/

Cheers,
Andy



This popcorn page looks useful Andy!

https://qa.debian.org/popcon.php?package=iotop


Thank you -- I did not know about that one.


This gets added to my little list of things to check with.


Thanks!

Re: Reco - Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[David]

Hi deb

I don't know why you have a habit of editing the message
subject to add people's names, but I ask you to stop doing it.

Please only edit the message subject when it no longer
represents the content of the message.

Please note:
1) Everybody else here does this. When participating in a
community, it is polite to respect and observe the community
behaviour.
2) You are messing up the archive indexes, for example
look here:
https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2019/03/subject.html
This page and others becomes a mess because you keep
changing the subject.

Acess Devian 9 laptop by another devica via wifi

[Tom Browder]

I travel often with a hefty laptop running Debian 9 and like to do casual
programming on it remotely via a terminal app (Termius) on an iPad. In many
situations I am able to access the laptop when on a wireless LAN by getting
its IP address with "sudo ifconfig" and simply using that address in
Termius to ssh in to the laptop.

However, someteimes that does not work until I edit the wireless connection
and declare it public. And in still other cases I cannot access the laptop
at all.

Is there any reliable way to either (1) always connect via the LAN or (2)
make the laptop broadcast its own LAN so I can login to it wirelessly from
the iPad?

Thanks.

With warmest regards,

-Tom

Re: Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

[Andy Smith]

Hello,

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 11:44:15AM -0400, deb wrote:
> Are there list-suggested ways to help verify non-free / out-of-stable-distro
> or even seldomly updated in-distro tools, PRE-INSTALL?

If in your /etc/apt/sources.list you stick to one distribution and
don't include "contrib" and "non-free" suites then you aren't going
to get any non-free software and the packages you install will at
least have been considered acceptable by Debian for release.

> Are there suggested sites to look up Linux tools to verify them a bit;
> rather than just one-off searches?
> 
> Are there suggested sites where KNOWN BAD tools are listed?

That all sounds highly subjective and don't see how you could have
any such definitive thing.

There is no substitute for proper research but as a blunt tool, once
you have identified multiple different packages that do what you
want you could look at Debian's popcon to compare how many reported
installations there are of each of them:

https://popcon.debian.org/

Cheers,
Andy

-- 
https://bitfolk.com/ -- No-nonsense VPS hosting

Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[Michael Stone]

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 04:23:32PM -0400, deb wrote:


On 3/22/19 4:07 PM, Michael Stone wrote:

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 03:00:23PM -0500, David Wright wrote:

If you're really worried, first remount the partitions readonly, which
will fail if they're in use. Then unmount them and disconnect.


Just unmount--that will fail if the partition is in use unless extra 
options are added.


Mike Stone




Actually no.


Actually, yes. 


That's where I started at.


A given drive should behave the same on Windows & Linux as far as 
lights on/off/dimming.


But as I noted earlier, on Windows, the light is OFF, signaling no 
drive activity upon being removed.


On debian 9.8, it stays on, after repeated dismounts.


Then there's nothing using the drive and you're barking up the wrong 
tree.


What you're seeing is that windows does a disconnect if you're using the 
"safely remove" thing. You might be able to get the same effect in linux 
by running "eject" on the drive, depends on what specifically the drive 
is looking for.


Mike Stone

Re: Other lists? Fire support for new users

[Andy Smith]

Hello,

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 11:31:07AM -0400, deb wrote:
> For someone trying to pull Windows (and Mac) users into Linux
> does anyone have:
> 
> Preferred other email lists, for new users?

Honestly I don't recommend mailing lists for technical support.
Especially this one where moderation is nearly non-existent and
nothing prevents prolific posters from deluging with inappropriate
or massively-offtopic responses.

I think the Stack Overflow-like web communities of superuser.com and
similar are much better for that use case. Answers supplied need to
be effective and on-topic otherwise they get voted down and buried.

Debian did used to have a similar thing running Shapado. It was at
http://shapado.debian.net/. But it was never very well-used and
ceased to work some years ago. I think this was a shame.

Previous discussion of Debian's now defunct Shapado instance was
here:

https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2010/10/msg00096.html

Cheers,
Andy

-- 
https://bitfolk.com/ -- No-nonsense VPS hosting

Re: Discussion? New names of betwork devices

[Felix Miata]

ghe composed on 2019-03-22 16:14 (UTC-0600):

> But when I'm looking to connect a cable, the location of the port on the
> outside of the box is much more useful to me than the address number on
> the bus.

> When writing software, though, the bus address becomes more important
> than the location.

> A labeling algorithm useful in both situations would be nice...

IME, using net.ifnames=0, the motherboard NIC closer to an ATX power supply is
always eth0. With BTX I've never had two NICs, but have to suppose it would be
the opposite. I think PCI(e) resources flow the same direction, from CPU & PS/2
port end to last slot end.
-- 
Evolution as taught in public schools is religion, not science.

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: Discussion? New names of betwork devices

[ghe]

On 3/22/19 1:56 PM, Joe wrote:

> The 'p' is for PCI, and they are numbered for their PCI bus position.

That makes some sense.

But when I'm looking to connect a cable, the location of the port on the
outside of the box is much more useful to me than the address number on
the bus.

When writing software, though, the bus address becomes more important
than the location.

A labeling algorithm useful in both situations would be nice...

-- 
Glenn English

Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[Curt]

On 2019-03-22, Cindy-Sue Causey  wrote:
>
> For my instances, the drive was mounted but very idle... except for
> those times the light would start beaconing when I landed on that one
> consumer website.

AFAIK unmounted hard drives are inaccessible to the operating system by
definition.

Wrong tree, meet barking dog?

> Cindy :)

Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[Cindy-Sue Causey]

On 3/22/19, deb  wrote:
>
> A given drive should behave the same on Windows & Linux as far as lights
> on/off/dimming.
>
> But as I noted earlier, on Windows, the light is OFF, signaling no drive
> activity upon being removed.
>
> On debian 9.8, it stays on, after repeated dismounts.
>
>
> Hence my request for tools to (easily) see what's going on.
>
> *Something* is hitting the drive.


*Your* words reminded that I suspected a website of repeatedly poking
my exterior hard drive when it had no business doing so. I was just
about to poke Brian Krebs (KrebsOnSecuirty) and ask him to test if
that's what was going on, but that behavior ceased when the
potentially offending website was redesigned...

For my instances, the drive was mounted but very idle... except for
those times the light would start beaconing when I landed on that one
consumer website.

Cindy :)
-- 
Cindy-Sue Causey
Talking Rock, Pickens County, Georgia, USA

* runs with birdseed *

Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[Cindy-Sue Causey]

On 3/22/19, deb  wrote:
>
> A given drive should behave the same on Windows & Linux as far as lights
> on/off/dimming.
>
> But as I noted earlier, on Windows, the light is OFF, signaling no drive
> activity upon being removed.
>
> On debian 9.8, it stays on, after repeated dismounts.
>
>
> Hence my request for tools to (easily) see what's going on.
>
> *Something* is hitting the drive.


*Your* words reminded that I suspected a website of repeatedly poking
my exterior hard drive when it had no business doing so. I was just
about to poke Brian Krebs (KrebsOnSecuirty) and ask him to test if
that's what was going on, but that behavior ceased when the
potentially offending website was redesigned...

For my instances, the drive was mounted but very idle... except for
those times the light would start beaconing when I landed on that one
consumer website.

Cindy :)
-- 
Cindy-Sue Causey
Talking Rock, Pickens County, Georgia, USA

* runs with birdseed *

Re: patcher en mode conservateur ?

[Étienne Mollier]

François Meyer, au 2019-03-22 :
> Je cherche à patcher un fichier sans rien lui retirer.
>
> Autrement dit, ajouter à un fichier  les lignes d'un autre
> fichier mais seulement celles qui n'y sont pas déjà.
>
> Il doit y avoir une option dans diff ou patch, mais je ne
> trouve pas, et la seule solution (sale) que j'ai trouvée
> consiste à effacer les lignes commençant par "-" dans le
> fichier patch puis à appliquer le patch normalement sur le
> fichier à incrémenter.

Bonjour François,

Les programmes diff et patch ont été écrit dans une optique de
génie logiciel, où retirer des lignes a autant d'importance que
d'en ajouter.  Filtrer le résultat du diff pour votre cas
d'usage comme vous le faite n'a rien de bien choquant, tant que
ce n'est pas pour mettre à jour du code source.  :)

Si vraiment vous voulez minimiser le nombre de commandes lancées
par votre script, jetez un œil au manuel de diff(1), à partir de
l'option -D, il semble qu'il y ait des options de formatage qui
permette des manipulations intéressantes sur la sortie de diff.
Notez toutefois que manipuler le formatage n'est pas compatible
avec les options -u et -U.  Je crains cependant que la
lisibilité de votre script n'en pâtisse.

Mais si vraiment les performances sont un problème, une
réimplémentation en langage compilé (C, Rust, ...) du problème
que vous voulez résoudre peut être une solution plus appropriée.

À vous de voir...

Amicalement,
-- 
Étienne Mollier 

All opinions are my own.

Re: Curt --- Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[David Wright]

On Fri 22 Mar 2019 at 16:07:24 (-0400), Michael Stone wrote:
> On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 03:00:23PM -0500, David Wright wrote:
> > If you're really worried, first remount the partitions readonly, which
> > will fail if they're in use. Then unmount them and disconnect.
> 
> Just unmount--that will fail if the partition is in use unless extra
> options are added.

Sorry, it hadn't occurred to me that the OP wasn't just doing that
(because they had said they used "Safely Remove" in Windows).
Nor had it occurred to me that one might need a bettery of tools
like iotop, hdparm, iostat, pidstat, perf top, and the rest,
rather than just unmounting. I thought they wanted a belt and braces
method, a bit of redundancy.

So it's just the usual Pose Problem A, Solve Problem B.

Cheers,
David.

Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[deb]

On 3/22/19 4:07 PM, Michael Stone wrote:

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 03:00:23PM -0500, David Wright wrote:

If you're really worried, first remount the partitions readonly, which
will fail if they're in use. Then unmount them and disconnect.


Just unmount--that will fail if the partition is in use unless extra 
options are added.


Mike Stone




Actually no.

That's where I started at.


A given drive should behave the same on Windows & Linux as far as lights 
on/off/dimming.


But as I noted earlier, on Windows, the light is OFF, signaling no drive 
activity upon being removed.


On debian 9.8, it stays on, after repeated dismounts.


Hence my request for tools to (easily) see what's going on.

*Something* is hitting the drive.

Thanks

Re: Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

[Nicholas Geovanis]

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 2:52 PM deb  wrote:

>
> They won't all be admins, but the top tech folks will be.
> (But, those are likely the ones who will cause the most trouble).
>

Do you know how to "disable" select administrative commands using
/etc/sudoers?
It can be useful in these situations. Your top tech folks can defeat it.

One thing they do do is backup.
>
> Lots and lots of backups.
>
>
> I will add the bug list check to my list (good idea).
>
>
> >
> > Some suggested reading here to get started.
> > https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian
> >
> > I think this forum is a good place to read first, post later.  The
> > archives have a ton of info. Many issues have already been done to death.
> > https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/
> > https://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser
> >
> Thank you bw!
>
>

Re: Curt --- Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[Cindy-Sue Causey]

On 3/22/19, David Wright  wrote:
> On Fri 22 Mar 2019 at 14:00:24 (-0400), deb wrote:
>>
>> Just a reminder -- the bulk of mine are Seagate Backup Plus (1-5TB.
>> USB 3.0).
>> On Windows, when you dismount (Safely Remove) these
>> the light goes off.
>
> I've never seen the light go off until it spins down (those that do).


You're reminding me of something I read and have now mostly forgotten.
It was something about today's hard drives being *maybe*
"intelligent".

On some (presumably newer) hardware, there are one or more BIOS
settings that affect how hard drives function. A quickly attempted
search landed the potentially useful phrases of "sleep mode" and "HDD
standby".

Cindy :)
-- 
Cindy-Sue Causey
Talking Rock, Pickens County, Georgia, USA

* runs with birdseed *

Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[deb]

On 3/22/19 4:00 PM, David Wright wrote:

On Fri 22 Mar 2019 at 14:00:24 (-0400), deb wrote:

On 3/22/19 1:48 PM, Curt wrote:

On 2019-03-22, deb  wrote:

Depending on what's on the disk, it might be more useful to just use
lsof to see what files are open and try to understand what those might
be doing.

I believe you said that the external USB drive's LED remains on, even
after unmounting, and that indicates to you that there's activity on the
drive. I've always labored under the idea that a *flashing* light
indicated activity and a steady one an idle state.

Now it occurs to me that these signal indications may depend on the make
and model of the drive itself.

What should be the behavior of the LED on your drive when the drive is
unmounted and/or inactive?

YES -- this differs by manufacturer.

… and by model, in the case of Seagate.


Just a reminder -- the bulk of mine are Seagate Backup Plus (1-5TB.
USB 3.0).
On Windows, when you dismount (Safely Remove) these
the light goes off.

I've never seen the light go off until it spins down (those that do).


It is On when connected and very dimmly flashed when being accessed.
So, it can flash a bit when indexes are up[dated,
or a file is flushed -- and go right back to steady on.

My 5TB doesn't ever flash or dim; a little annoying.


I only *feel* safe, pulling the cable when the light is OFF.

If you're really worried, first remount the partitions readonly, which
will fail if they're in use. Then unmount them and disconnect.




Good idea David.

I'll add this to the list.


by-the-by, (when I last checked) Windows does NOT have a mount read-only 
notion.


The recommended approach when I last looked was to rip through each file 
and folder setting them individually to read-only.


Guess how long that takes on a 5TB?

Now multiply that guess by an office of drives; with people wanting to 
switch them back and forth R-O -> W -> R-O



I love Linux.





Again, I can NOT suffer a data-loss-because-of-Evil-Linux situation,
giving the Windows-folk ammo.

Disks occasionally fail for everyone, irrespective of OS.


I wanted to switch to your name in the Subject Curt,
but Jim P. will yell at me. :-)


Screw it --- I switched it anyway.

I can already see whose post yours is commenting on. The rule is simple:
Change the subject line if the subject changes,
Don't change the subject line if the subject doesn't change.



Ack on the subject-line change.

I am one-time switching this one's back.


Now then -- where ARE these rules?

I'd like to hand a list to new users.

Obviously, I don't know them all.




On a technical point, there are those whose less functional
mail clients thread by subject line rather than Message-ID.
Their threading get totally fragmented by all your changes.

Cheers,
David.

Re: blank time in console too short

[Hans]

Am Freitag, 22. März 2019, 20:45:13 CET schrieb bw:
> In-Reply-To: <4205892.cicxXhXihB@protheus2>
> 
> >Both systems got an identical configuration but behave different.
> 
> I'm confused, did you try the methods you mentioned with no result?
Well, all solutions I read, where about setterm or using kernel tags. But this 
is not what I am looking for. I am not looking for a solution (which I can 
easily reach with setterm or a kernel parameter).

> 
> Are you looking for how to solve it, or a clue why it is that way?

See above. I would like to understand, why two identically configured systems 
behave different. This means for me, that some configuration(s) do not take any 
effect. But which one And I want just be sure, that I did something not 
see.

Best

Hans



signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part.

Re: Curt --- Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[Michael Stone]

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 03:00:23PM -0500, David Wright wrote:

If you're really worried, first remount the partitions readonly, which
will fail if they're in use. Then unmount them and disconnect.


Just unmount--that will fail if the partition is in use unless extra 
options are added.


Mike Stone

Re: blank time in console too short

[bw]

In-Reply-To: <4205892.cicxXhXihB@protheus2>

>Both systems got an identical configuration but behave different.

I'm confused, did you try the methods you mentioned with no result?

Are you looking for how to solve it, or a clue why it is that way?

Re: Curt --- Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[David Wright]

On Fri 22 Mar 2019 at 14:00:24 (-0400), deb wrote:
> On 3/22/19 1:48 PM, Curt wrote:
> > On 2019-03-22, deb  wrote:
> > > > Depending on what's on the disk, it might be more useful to just use
> > > > lsof to see what files are open and try to understand what those might
> > > > be doing.

> > I believe you said that the external USB drive's LED remains on, even
> > after unmounting, and that indicates to you that there's activity on the
> > drive. I've always labored under the idea that a *flashing* light
> > indicated activity and a steady one an idle state.
> > 
> > Now it occurs to me that these signal indications may depend on the make
> > and model of the drive itself.
> > 
> > What should be the behavior of the LED on your drive when the drive is
> > unmounted and/or inactive?

> YES -- this differs by manufacturer.

… and by model, in the case of Seagate.

> Just a reminder -- the bulk of mine are Seagate Backup Plus (1-5TB.
> USB 3.0).
> On Windows, when you dismount (Safely Remove) these
> the light goes off.

I've never seen the light go off until it spins down (those that do).

> It is On when connected and very dimmly flashed when being accessed.
> So, it can flash a bit when indexes are up[dated,
> or a file is flushed -- and go right back to steady on.

My 5TB doesn't ever flash or dim; a little annoying.

> I only *feel* safe, pulling the cable when the light is OFF.

If you're really worried, first remount the partitions readonly, which
will fail if they're in use. Then unmount them and disconnect.

> Again, I can NOT suffer a data-loss-because-of-Evil-Linux situation,
> giving the Windows-folk ammo.

Disks occasionally fail for everyone, irrespective of OS.

> I wanted to switch to your name in the Subject Curt,
> but Jim P. will yell at me. :-)
> 
> 
> Screw it --- I switched it anyway.

I can already see whose post yours is commenting on. The rule is simple:
Change the subject line if the subject changes,
Don't change the subject line if the subject doesn't change.

On a technical point, there are those whose less functional
mail clients thread by subject line rather than Message-ID.
Their threading get totally fragmented by all your changes.

Cheers,
David.

patcher en mode conservateur ?

[Francois Meyer]

Bonjour à tous



Je cherche à patcher un fichier sans rien lui retirer.

Autrement dit, ajouter à un fichier  les lignes d'un autre fichier mais 
seulement celles qui n'y sont pas déjà.


Il doit y avoir une option dans diff ou patch, mais je ne trouve pas, et 
la seule solution (sale) que j'ai trouvée consiste à effacer les lignes 
commençant par "-" dans le fichier patch puis à appliquer le patch 
normalement sur le fichier à incrémenter.


Merci, bonne journée

François

Re: Discussion? New names of betwork devices

[Joe]

On Fri, 22 Mar 2019 13:53:33 -0600
ghe  wrote:

>
> The powers that be are calling my Ethernet devices enp6s0 and enp7s0.
> I guess enp (EtherNet Port) is OK. But 6 and 7 aren't. There are only
> two of them, and numbers on my computers don't start at 6.

The 'p' is for PCI, and they are numbered for their PCI bus position.
Hence the hope that the name will never change.

-- 
Joe

Re: Discussion? New names of betwork devices

[ghe]

On 3/22/19 9:06 AM, Hans wrote:

> since some time the names for network devices have changed. So its is no more 
> "ethX" , but "enp1s10" or similar or "wlan0" and now "wlp5s0". You know, what 
> I mean.

Interesting that this came up this morning. I'm on Buster.alpha5. I
tried to relabel my Ethernet interfaces the eth names a few days ago.
It didn't seem to work, so I tried to undo everything I'd done. This
morning, after another reboot, it came up with the eth names.

The powers that be are calling my Ethernet devices enp6s0 and enp7s0. I
guess enp (EtherNet Port) is OK. But 6 and 7 aren't. There are only two
of them, and numbers on my computers don't start at 6.

Another suggestion:

The front panel of my Juniper firewall has a row of Ethernet ports
across it. It calls all of those ethernet0/. Ethernet ports in the
plugins in the back start at ethernet1/.

Eth sounds good to me, as long as nothing non-Ethernet is labeled eth.
But Juniper's naming algorithm makes a lot of sense. The connectors on
the motherboard could be called eth0. And added boards could be eth1,
2, 3, etc.

> This is made by the kernel.

Not in Buster.alphs5, it ain't. The naming is quite complex, and there
are several files that've been chattr'ed so they cant be changed.

> However, I discovered many packages, where are still the old names 
> preconfigured with the old names. 

Change them to check the Ethernet port labels? I suspect that'd be
fairly easy for the Debian maintainers.

But udev can do all this well and nicely, if people'd just leave it
alone and let it do its job. And make sure things use the correct device
labels.

-- 
Glenn English

Re: Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

[deb]

On 3/22/19 3:14 PM, bw wrote:

in-reply-to=


Are there list-suggested ways to help verify non-free /
out-of-stable-distro or even seldomly updated in-distro tools,
PRE-INSTALL?

Well... that's a deep subject.  You mention three different categories of
pkgs, but I think many people would say there are only two main
categories:

"in-repo" and "out-of-repo"

Everything in the repo has a bug page at bugs.debian.org/ and
also a page at packages.debian.org/

"out-of-repo" stuff, well... again that's a deep subject.  Not enough
time.  If you want to pull win users into linux, start them off right.
They don't need to all be administrators, do they?  If you just want to
let them trash the system and play around that's cool.  Make an hourly
backup.


They won't all be admins, but the top tech folks will be.

(But, those are likely the ones who will cause the most trouble).


One thing they do do is backup.

Lots and lots of backups.


I will add the bug list check to my list (good idea).




Some suggested reading here to get started.
https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian

I think this forum is a good place to read first, post later.  The
archives have a ton of info. Many issues have already been done to death.
https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/
https://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser


Thank you bw!

Re: Bluetooth audio problem

[deloptes]

Mark Fletcher wrote:

> So this turned out to be a weirdie -- if I dropped the "sudo" my
> original command worked.
> 
> So now, suddenly from that update that started this thread, if I run the
> pactl command as an unprivileged user, it works fine. I have no idea why
> it changed but I'm just happy I have it working again.

you can mark also as solved, if solved

Re: blank time in console too short

[deloptes]

Hans wrote:

> As I said, not in X, but the console in the terminal you reach by ALT-F1,
> ALT-F2 and so on. And sa I also said: Both systems got an identical
> configuration but behave different.
> 
> Best
> 
> Hans
> 
> 
> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/
>
Display_Power_Management_Signaling#DPMS_interaction_in_a_Linux_console_with
> _setterm[2]

And the link I sent is about DPMS on the console and it is also not clear if
they use the same monitor, but even so - they might have different video
cards.

regards

Re: Bajar Debian 10

[Jhosue rui]

El dom., 10 mar. 2019 8:33 p. m., Marcelo Eduardo Giordano <
marcelogiord...@gmail.com> escribió:

> El 10/3/19 a las 20:39, Emiliano Gabriel Reynoso escribió:
>
> Este es el link de buster:
>
> https://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/
>
> Entras ahí y bajas la imagen que necesites.
>
> Es la versión testing de Debian. Yo la uso y no he tenido grandes
> problemas.
> Suerte!
>
>
>
>
> El dom., 10 de mar. de 2019 20:12, Marcelo Eduardo Giordano <
> marcelogiord...@gmail.com> escribió:
>
>> Esta pregunta que voy a hacer es vergonzosa, pero no puedo solucionarla.
>>
>> Como bajo debian 10?
>>
>> probé aca pero nada
>>
>> https://www.debian.org/CD/live/
>>
>> Gracias de antemano
>>
>> Versiones live de debian 10 no vienen?
>
> Gracias de antemano
>
Para ese propósito es necesario usar en este momento el paquete live-build,
cuando salga estable ya habrá imágenes oficiales

>

Re: Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

[bw]

in-reply-to=

>Are there list-suggested ways to help verify non-free / 
>out-of-stable-distro or even seldomly updated in-distro tools, 
>PRE-INSTALL? 

Well... that's a deep subject.  You mention three different categories of 
pkgs, but I think many people would say there are only two main 
categories:

"in-repo" and "out-of-repo"

Everything in the repo has a bug page at bugs.debian.org/ and 
also a page at packages.debian.org/

"out-of-repo" stuff, well... again that's a deep subject.  Not enough 
time.  If you want to pull win users into linux, start them off right.  
They don't need to all be administrators, do they?  If you just want to 
let them trash the system and play around that's cool.  Make an hourly 
backup.

Some suggested reading here to get started.  
https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian

I think this forum is a good place to read first, post later.  The 
archives have a ton of info. Many issues have already been done to death.
https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/
https://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

Re: Other lists? Fire support for new users

[Cindy-Sue Causey]

On 3/22/19, Paul Sutton  wrote:
>
> Why not direct them here,  just perhaps set up their e-mail client so
> that all e-mails are sent to a folder,  that way the main inbox doesn't
> get full of e-mail from here, as there can be quite a lot at times.
> Maybe teach them how to watch specific threads,  so they post a
> question, when it arrives in their inbox from the list, tag it to watch.
>
> I suggest this, as it is the main list for Debian,  plus I am not a full
> expert but can still help with some stuff,  and happy to do so.
>
> Also new users asking questions here can highlight specific issues,  a
> task that should (and is considered simple, by developers or more
> experienced users) may not be,  and may need looking in to as to how
> that task can be made less complex (if that makes sense) or explained
> differently.
>
> Sometimes when new users and developers (including documentation
> editors) can communicate good things happen.  if may also help us
> develop good documentation too, as even writing that can throw up
> questions.


More than a few times, I've seen warm-fuzzies inducing moments where a
tough issue will be discussed here then within sometimes a few hours,
there will be an upgrade posted for the very package that had just
been discussed here.

Yes, that could regularly be a reflection that there was a bug
officially filed. Just sometimes it feels like a developer read
something here then jumped on it, took the initiative to proactively
fix whatever had been ailing at that second to help Users get back on
track as soon as possible. *cool!*

#ThankYou, Developers!

Cindy :)
-- 
Cindy-Sue Causey
Talking Rock, Pickens County, Georgia, USA

* runs with birdseed *

Re: (Paul) Re: Other lists? Fire support for new users

[Curt]

On 2019-03-22, Jim Popovitch  wrote:
>> 
>> Like that ^
>
> I have no way to know what ^ is pointing to from your perspective.
>
>> 

It's pointing at Paul from my perspective.

Re: (Paul) Re: Other lists? Fire support for new users

[Jim Popovitch]

On Fri, 2019-03-22 at 13:46 -0400, deb wrote:
> On 3/22/19 1:36 PM, Jim Popovitch wrote:
> > On Fri, 2019-03-22 at 13:14 -0400, deb wrote:
> > > I guess I found that some folks here (not many, but vocal) can be gruff
> > > and insensitive; and I just wanted to see if there were more "yielding"
> > > lists.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > The last thing I want to do is have new users rebuffed in the spot I
> > > send them to for help.
> > 
> > One of the sure ways to do that is to unnecessarily modify the Subject line 
> > of
> > emails you send..
> > 
> > -Jim P.
> > 
> > 
> 
> Like that ^

I have no way to know what ^ is pointing to from your perspective.

> 
> I was told before to do that if I was talking (or thanking) one person 
> BUT also sharing the data with all.
> 
> I personally would want the name in the subject so that I can see if 
> someone is asking me something directly.
> Some days, there are a lot of emails.
> 
> So --- from the gruff perspective -- which way is it?

It's not a gruff issue, it's a courtesy and common sense issue,  Look at the
ways everyone else sends email, which way do you think it should be?

-Jim P.

Curt --- Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[deb]

On 3/22/19 1:48 PM, Curt wrote:

On 2019-03-22, deb  wrote:

Depending on what's on the disk, it might be more useful to just use
lsof to see what files are open and try to understand what those might
be doing.


Thank you Michael.

I'll build up a list of these recommendations for here.



I believe you said that the external USB drive's LED remains on, even
after unmounting, and that indicates to you that there's activity on the
drive. I've always labored under the idea that a *flashing* light
indicated activity and a steady one an idle state.

Now it occurs to me that these signal indications may depend on the make
and model of the drive itself.

What should be the behavior of the LED on your drive when the drive is
unmounted and/or inactive?

(This is probably a waste of everybody's time.)




> (This is probably a waste of everybody's time.)

Not of mine.

Or a bunch of users.


YES -- this differs by manufacturer.


Just a reminder -- the bulk of mine are Seagate Backup Plus (1-5TB. USB 
3.0).

On Windows, when you dismount (Safely Remove) these
the light goes off.


It is On when connected and very dimmly flashed when being accessed.
So, it can flash a bit when indexes are up[dated,
or a file is flushed -- and go right back to steady on.


I only *feel* safe, pulling the cable when the light is OFF.


Again, I can NOT suffer a data-loss-because-of-Evil-Linux situation,
giving the Windows-folk ammo.



I wanted to switch to your name in the Subject Curt,
but Jim P. will yell at me. :-)


Screw it --- I switched it anyway.

Re: Michael - Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[Curt]

On 2019-03-22, deb  wrote:
>
>>
>> Depending on what's on the disk, it might be more useful to just use 
>> lsof to see what files are open and try to understand what those might 
>> be doing.
>>
>
> Thank you Michael.
>
> I'll build up a list of these recommendations for here.
>
>

I believe you said that the external USB drive's LED remains on, even
after unmounting, and that indicates to you that there's activity on the
drive. I've always labored under the idea that a *flashing* light
indicated activity and a steady one an idle state.

Now it occurs to me that these signal indications may depend on the make
and model of the drive itself.

What should be the behavior of the LED on your drive when the drive is
unmounted and/or inactive? 

(This is probably a waste of everybody's time.)

-- 
“Let us again pretend that life is a solid substance, shaped like a globe,
which we turn about in our fingers. Let us pretend that we can make out a plain
and logical story, so that when one matter is despatched--love for instance--
we go on, in an orderly manner, to the next.” - Virginia Woolf, The Waves

Re: (Paul) Re: Other lists? Fire support for new users

[deb]

On 3/22/19 1:36 PM, Jim Popovitch wrote:

On Fri, 2019-03-22 at 13:14 -0400, deb wrote:

I guess I found that some folks here (not many, but vocal) can be gruff
and insensitive; and I just wanted to see if there were more "yielding"
lists.


The last thing I want to do is have new users rebuffed in the spot I
send them to for help.


One of the sure ways to do that is to unnecessarily modify the Subject line of
emails you send..

-Jim P.




Like that ^


I was told before to do that if I was talking (or thanking) one person 
BUT also sharing the data with all.


I personally would want the name in the subject so that I can see if 
someone is asking me something directly.

Some days, there are a lot of emails.

So --- from the gruff perspective -- which way is it?

Re: (Paul) Re: Other lists? Fire support for new users

[Jim Popovitch]

On Fri, 2019-03-22 at 13:14 -0400, deb wrote:
> 
> I guess I found that some folks here (not many, but vocal) can be gruff 
> and insensitive; and I just wanted to see if there were more "yielding" 
> lists.
> 
> 
> The last thing I want to do is have new users rebuffed in the spot I 
> send them to for help.


One of the sure ways to do that is to unnecessarily modify the Subject line of
emails you send..

-Jim P.

Michael - Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[deb]

On 3/22/19 12:24 PM, Michael Stone wrote:

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 11:23:29AM -0400, deb wrote:

a.  Has anyone used iotop? thoughts?

(I did -- it's CLI-based. I was underwhelmed. Hard-ish to use; can't 
easily

pinpoint processes accessing the drives)


Well, it's hard to say what would work better if you can't explain 
what the problem is with iotop. By default it sorts by io %, which 
isn't necessarily the best view. Left and right arrows highlight and 
sort by other columns, and it may be more useful to look at reads and 
writes individually.


Depending on what's on the disk, it might be more useful to just use 
lsof to see what files are open and try to understand what those might 
be doing.




Thank you Michael.

I'll build up a list of these recommendations for here.


I'm looking at hdparm -C too.

No --help on that one.

man hdparm

-C  Check  the  current  IDE power mode status, which will always be
  one  of  unknown  (drive  does  not   support this   
command),
  active/idle  (normal  operation), standby (low power 
mode, drive
  has spun down), or sleeping (lowest power mode, drive  
is  com‐
  pletely  shut down).  The -S, -y, -Y, and -Z options can 
be used

  to manipulate the IDE power modes.

Thank you

Reco - Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[deb]

On 3/22/19 11:56 AM, Reco wrote:

Hi.

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 11:23:29AM -0400, deb wrote:

a.  Has anyone used iotop? thoughts?

Implemented in Python, so it's a toy. Was*the*  thing back in 2.6.x
kernel's days.



b. Can anyone recommend a different tool?

"iostat -kx 1" to pinpoint a drive.
"pidstat -dl 1" to point at a process eating I/O.

Both come with "sysstat" package.

"perf top", but it*does*  require skill, knowledge and determination.

Reco




There you go!

Good answer.

I saw the python in iotop as well and had doubts from there.


If it was an ext4 drive on Linux, I'd be thinking lazy ext4 init,


I'm looking at hdparm -C too.


Thank you Reco

Re: Discussion? New names of betwork devices

[Reco]

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 05:40:43PM +0100, Hans wrote:
> Am Freitag, 22. März 2019, 17:15:29 CET schrieb Reco:
> > No, this is done by udev. It can be disabled, it can be configured, and
> > it can be left as is.
> > 
> I know, that the old style can be kept by either using udev (withg persistent-
> net.rules for example) or by a kernel parm (something like "ifnet.rename=0, 
> or 
> similar, forgot the correct syntax)

They did confuse you. All this renaming is done by udev.
Kernel does not need "net.ifnames" at all as it names network interfaces
in the first place.
Udev abuses kernel commandline do grab "net.ifnames", and then udev's rules
check the parameter.


> > > However, I discovered many packages, where are still the old names
> > > preconfigured with the old names.
> > 
> > Some examples are in order.
> > 
> I had to correct /etc/network/interfaces,

User-written by definition.

> kismet,

Yep, that's valid. I prefer aircrack-ng though.


> wicd-*,

Probably. ifupdown is more than enough for me (that includes 802.11x),
but don't they give a GUI for wicd?


> powertweak,

[1]. Is it a Debian package at all?


> snort 

Comes with debconf and interface detection as far I can see it.
But I accept this particular one for the sake of simplicity.


> > Most of the server-side packages that I can think of are either bind to all
> > available interfaces by default, or bind to lo, which is still here.
> 
> There were more the desktop users with laptops in my mind.

Does not invalidate my point. One can install a server package on a
laptop if a need arises. I have nginx installed on my *phone* because
it's convenient, for instance.


> > > I know, the last one might be problematic, because the developer never can
> > > know, whhich interface is used (eth0? eth1? wlan0? whatever)
> > 
> > Or, for instance, en0p2gibberish. They call them Unpredictable Device
> > Named for a reason.
> > 
> 
> Yes, thsis is another thing, which I am thinking of: The names could change 
> (in case, when there are more than one network devices are active or the 
> order 
> of activing changed).

Long story short, they invented Unpredictable Device Names to prevent
this very scenario.
I'm aware of one major case when it failed miserably (VMWare), and two
minor ones (renaming didn't happen for virtio, and cannot be configured
for USB devices).


> In the past, I forced the order with persistent-> net.rules. Dunno, if
> normal users can deal with it.

I don't hold by breath.


> > > For myself I got the solution: just edited all configs to the new names,
> > > but I believe, for unexperienced users, this could be problematic.
> > 
> > So-called "unexperienced" users should not meddle in servers'
> > configuration in the first place.
> > And NIC configuration is hardly relevant for a typical desktop.
> > 
> > > And I also believe, an unexperienced user gets in trouble, when nobody
> > > points him, where to look.

They have this list here. They have LUGs. They have
serverfault/stackoverflow (I know, it's a bad manners to mention
*these*).
Last, but not least, there's paid support.


> > I don't know about that. I mean, you wrote here, isn't it? Nobody's
> > stopping this hypothetical "unexperienced" users to do the same.
> 
> Remember, this list is in English, not all people do speak English well 
> (included myself),

Ditto. But this list is where all the fun happens, so I hang here.
And yes, it has surprising variance of questions.


> and I doubt, most people want to spare the time, to crawl 
> through all the lists. They want it just work.

If one desires that one should pay someone who can actually force a
device do the job.
No amount of pre-configuration can change that. Even if we're
considering M$/Apple.


Reco

[1] 
https://packages.debian.org/search?searchon=names=all=all=mozilla-search=powertweak

(Paul) Re: Other lists? Fire support for new users

[deb]

On 3/22/19 12:39 PM, Paul Sutton wrote:

On 22/03/2019 15:31, deb wrote:

Hello folks:


For someone trying to pull Windows (and Mac) users into Linux
does anyone have:


Preferred other email lists, for new users?

Perhaps more basic than this one?

There are forums, but the emails are a good way to work too.


Thanks!


Why not direct them here,  just perhaps set up their e-mail client so
that all e-mails are sent to a folder,  that way the main inbox doesn't
get full of e-mail from here, as there can be quite a lot at times.
Maybe teach them how to watch specific threads,  so they post a
question, when it arrives in their inbox from the list, tag it to watch.

I suggest this, as it is the main list for Debian,  plus I am not a full
expert but can still help with some stuff,  and happy to do so.

Also new users asking questions here can highlight specific issues,  a
task that should (and is considered simple, by developers or more
experienced users) may not be,  and may need looking in to as to how
that task can be made less complex (if that makes sense) or explained
differently.

Sometimes when new users and developers (including documentation
editors) can communicate good things happen.  if may also help us
develop good documentation too, as even writing that can throw up
questions.

Paul



Thanks Paul:

And I agree -- it would be great to have one place to send them to and 
Yes, old pros can get trends (or early leads) of problems this way.


I guess I found that some folks here (not many, but vocal) can be gruff 
and insensitive; and I just wanted to see if there were more "yielding" 
lists.




The last thing I want to do is have new users rebuffed in the spot I 
send them to for help.


I was just checking to see what else was available :-)

Dig?

Thank you!

Re: Flushing all Buffers Before Exiting

[tomas]

On Thu, Mar 21, 2019 at 07:52:33PM -0500, Martin McCormick wrote:

[...]

>   Opening, appending and closing for each new line of
> output made me a bit squeamish.  The program is monitoring a
> stream of data from a radio scanner.  The data spew in at about
> 20 or 30 lines per second.

Don't fear. Measure :-)

Doesn't sound outrageous to line-buffer your output to file.

The output to screen is already line-buffered (by default,
at least) and isn't killing you, so if I were you, I'd set
up a benchmark run and torture things a bit. Then, *if* you
notice any whiff of a problem, you could try a more clever
scheme like timeout based flush to better get hold of bursts
(if I understood your description, things go out in bursts).

Cheers
-- tomás


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: Discussion? New names of betwork devices

[Hans]

Am Freitag, 22. März 2019, 17:15:29 CET schrieb Reco:
>   Hi.
Hi Reco,
> 
> No, this is done by udev. It can be disabled, it can be configured, and
> it can be left as is.
> 
I know, that the old style can be kept by either using udev (withg persistent-
net.rules for example) or by a kernel parm (something like "ifnet.rename=0, or 
similar, forgot the correct syntax)

> > However, I discovered many packages, where are still the old names
> > preconfigured with the old names.
> 
> Some examples are in order.
> 
I had to correct /etc/network/interfaces, kismet, wicd-*, powertweak, snort 
and some others. No big deal.

> 
> Most of the server-side packages that I can think of are either bind to all
> available interfaces by default, or bind to lo, which is still here.

There were more the desktop users with laptops in my mind.

> 
> > I know, the last one might be problematic, because the developer never can
> > know, whhich interface is used (eth0? eth1? wlan0? whatever)
> 
> Or, for instance, en0p2gibberish. They call them Unpredictable Device
> Named for a reason.
> 

Yes, thsis is another thing, which I am thinking of: The names could change 
(in case, when there are more than one network devices are active or the order 
of activing changed). In the past, I forced the order with persistent-
net.rules. Dunno, if normal users can deal with it. Can it your Mom or your 
Dad? Grandpa? Grandma? 
 
> > For myself I got the solution: just edited all configs to the new names,
> > but I believe, for unexperienced users, this could be problematic.
> 
> So-called "unexperienced" users should not meddle in servers'
> configuration in the first place.
> And NIC configuration is hardly relevant for a typical desktop.
> 
> > And I also believe, an unexperienced user gets in trouble, when nobody
> > points him, where to look.
> 
> I don't know about that. I mean, you wrote here, isn't it? Nobody's
> stopping this hypothetical "unexperienced" users to do the same.

Remember, this list is in English, not all people do speak English well 
(included myself), and I doubt, most people want to spare the time, to crawl 
through all the lists. They want it just work.
> 
> > You do not need to look for a solution for me, I just wanted to remember
> > this thing and hope, we should keep this little problem in mind. Maybe
> > this is worth a discussion, if not, please excuse the noise.
> 
> That's OK. It's Friday and it's been an eventful week, so a list can use
> a flamewar.
> 

No, a flamewar will be funny for some people, but IMO it has got not much 
worth. For myself, I can only tell: Upredictable Device Name is nice, but only 
a good idea for specialists. But this is my opinion, and no one is forced, to 
take it over.

Happy hacking and a nice weekend!

> Reco


Best 

Hans

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Description: This is a digitally signed message part.

Re: Other lists? Fire support for new users

[Paul Sutton]

On 22/03/2019 15:31, deb wrote:
> Hello folks:
>
>
> For someone trying to pull Windows (and Mac) users into Linux
> does anyone have:
>
>
> Preferred other email lists, for new users?
>
> Perhaps more basic than this one?
>
> There are forums, but the emails are a good way to work too.
>
>
> Thanks!
>

Why not direct them here,  just perhaps set up their e-mail client so
that all e-mails are sent to a folder,  that way the main inbox doesn't
get full of e-mail from here, as there can be quite a lot at times.  
Maybe teach them how to watch specific threads,  so they post a
question, when it arrives in their inbox from the list, tag it to watch.

I suggest this, as it is the main list for Debian,  plus I am not a full
expert but can still help with some stuff,  and happy to do so. 

Also new users asking questions here can highlight specific issues,  a
task that should (and is considered simple, by developers or more
experienced users) may not be,  and may need looking in to as to how
that task can be made less complex (if that makes sense) or explained
differently.

Sometimes when new users and developers (including documentation
editors) can communicate good things happen.  if may also help us
develop good documentation too, as even writing that can throw up
questions.  

Paul

-- 
Paul Sutton
http://www.zleap.net
https://www.linkedin.com/in/zleap/
gnupg : 7D6D B682 F351 8D08 1893  1E16 F086 5537 D066 302D

Re: Flushing all Buffers Before Exiting

[Jeremy Nicoll]

On Fri, 22 Mar 2019, at 00:53, Martin McCormick wrote:

>   Opening, appending and closing for each new line of
> output made me a bit squeamish. ...

You could always count lines written and do a close & reopen 
every (say) 1000 lines.  That way there's less overhead but
the amount of data you might lose is reduced.

-- 
Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[Michael Stone]

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 11:23:29AM -0400, deb wrote:

a.  Has anyone used iotop? thoughts?

(I did -- it's CLI-based. I was underwhelmed. Hard-ish to use; can't easily
pinpoint processes accessing the drives)


Well, it's hard to say what would work better if you can't explain what 
the problem is with iotop. By default it sorts by io %, which isn't 
necessarily the best view. Left and right arrows highlight and sort by 
other columns, and it may be more useful to look at reads and writes 
individually.


Depending on what's on the disk, it might be more useful to just use 
lsof to see what files are open and try to understand what those might 
be doing. 

Re: Discussion? New names of betwork devices

[Reco]

Hi.

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 04:06:33PM +0100, Hans wrote:
> Hi folks,
> 
> since some time the names for network devices have changed. So its is no more 
> "ethX" , but "enp1s10" or similar or "wlan0" and now "wlp5s0". You know, what 
> I mean.

Yep, so called Unpredicable Device Names.


> This is made by the kernel.

No, this is done by udev. It can be disabled, it can be configured, and
it can be left as is.


> However, I discovered many packages, where are still the old names 
> preconfigured with the old names.

Some examples are in order.


> I think, this may be led to confusion, so let 
> me offer some suggestions:
> 
> - during installation there should be an advice, to check the name of the 
> interface

File a "wishlist" bug report against an appropriate package.


> - interface entries should be generally commented, so that the user has 
> forcedly to check the entry

Most of the server-side packages that I can think of are either bind to all
available interfaces by default, or bind to lo, which is still here.


> I know, the last one might be problematic, because the developer never can 
> know, whhich interface is used (eth0? eth1? wlan0? whatever)

Or, for instance, en0p2gibberish. They call them Unpredictable Device
Named for a reason.


> For myself I got the solution: just edited all configs to the new names, but 
> I 
> believe, for unexperienced users, this could be problematic.

So-called "unexperienced" users should not meddle in servers'
configuration in the first place.
And NIC configuration is hardly relevant for a typical desktop.


> And I also believe, an unexperienced user gets in trouble, when nobody
> points him, where to look.

I don't know about that. I mean, you wrote here, isn't it? Nobody's
stopping this hypothetical "unexperienced" users to do the same.


> You do not need to look for a solution for me, I just wanted to remember this 
> thing and hope, we should keep this little problem in mind. Maybe this is 
> worth a discussion, if not, please excuse the noise.

That's OK. It's Friday and it's been an eventful week, so a list can use
a flamewar.

Reco

Re: iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[Reco]

Hi.

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 11:23:29AM -0400, deb wrote:
> a.  Has anyone used iotop? thoughts?

Implemented in Python, so it's a toy. Was *the* thing back in 2.6.x
kernel's days.


> b. Can anyone recommend a different tool?

"iostat -kx 1" to pinpoint a drive.
"pidstat -dl 1" to point at a process eating I/O.

Both come with "sysstat" package.

"perf top", but it *does* require skill, knowledge and determination.

Reco

Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

[deb]

Hello folks:


Again, for someone trying to pull Windows (and Mac) users into Linux ...

Are there list-suggested ways to help verify non-free / 
out-of-stable-distro or even seldomly updated in-distro tools, PRE-INSTALL?



A portion of the users are going to have the ability to sudo apt-get 
install 


No way around that.

I have them (at least) do this first:


 * $ apt-cache search the-thing  # shows variants

 * $ apt-cache show the-thing # Let's them see more, pre-install

 * https://startpage.com the-thing

 * talk to me.    # gives me a chance to 
brace myself.




Are there suggested sites to look up Linux tools to verify them a bit; 
rather than just one-off searches?


Are there suggested sites where KNOWN BAD tools are listed?


Thanks again

Other lists? Fire support for new users

[deb]

Hello folks:


For someone trying to pull Windows (and Mac) users into Linux
does anyone have:


Preferred other email lists, for new users?

Perhaps more basic than this one?

There are forums, but the emails are a good way to work too.


Thanks!

iotop - or, checking what is accessing a drive

[deb]

Hello folks:


Situation:

  Plenty of portable NTFS drives, occasionally hooked to debian.

  The drive's light stays on [indicating use] even when dismounted (but 
still connected via USB).



  I'd like to try and find out what's using the drive.

  I don't like the idea of just yanking the cable...

  I can not afford to trash data.

  I found iotop below (a top for processes creating I/O).



a.  Has anyone used iotop? thoughts?

(I did -- it's CLI-based. I was underwhelmed. Hard-ish to use; can't 
easily pinpoint processes accessing the drives)



b. Can anyone recommend a different tool?

Thanks!


My info was found here:


https://www.hecticgeek.com/2015/01/ext4-external-hard-disk-busy-at-idle-fix/


 "My Newly Formatted (‘Ext4’) External Hard Disk is Busy, Even at Idle
 [Fix]

January 8, 2015 
 
by Gayan 


I recently purchased a Western Digital My Passport Ultra (1TB, USB 3.0) 
external hard disk as I was running out of space to save my 
files. Although I dual-boot a GNU/Linux 
 distribution (which is the 
awesome Fedora 21 
 nowadays) with 
Windows 8.1, and almost all of my friends rely on the Windows operating 
system, I took the decision to format it into ‘Ext4’ anyway, despite 
having the obvious drawback to which I am bound (that would be sharing 
data of course  ).


To be honest, I never had used a native GNU/Linux file system on a large 
USB hard disk before, thus, after creating an ‘Ext4’ file system on the 
1TB USB drive, I made an interesting (and irritating) observation. What 
happened was that, after formatting the drive into ‘Ext4’, whenever I 
mounted the USB disk, even when I was not using it, the LED starts to 
indicate (by blinking) a mild disk activity.


I ignored it the first time, but every time I mounted the drive, it 
happened again and again. And on all these instances the LED kept 
blinking non-stop for minutes and the only way stop it was to detach the 
USB disk from the computer. So in an attempt to isolate its cause, I 
used the ‘iotop 
‘ 
utility (it’s a tool that sorts & lists processes by their disk I/O 
consumption). And as soon as I opened it, ‘iotop’ listed a process 
called ‘ext4lazyinit’ that was consuming a mild I/O bandwidth (about 
11-13 Mb/s) out of my WD USB hard disk."

Discussion? New names of betwork devices

[Hans]

Hi folks,

since some time the names for network devices have changed. So its is no more 
"ethX" , but "enp1s10" or similar or "wlan0" and now "wlp5s0". You know, what 
I mean.

This is made by the kernel.

However, I discovered many packages, where are still the old names 
preconfigured with the old names. I think, this may be led to confusion, so let 
me offer some suggestions:

- during installation there should be an advice, to check the name of the 
interface

or

- interface entries should be generally commented, so that the user has 
forcedly to check the entry

or 

- preconfigure (and repreconfigure) configs, which are preinstalled with the 
new 
names

I know, the last one might be problematic, because the developer never can 
know, whhich interface is used (eth0? eth1? wlan0? whatever)

For myself I got the solution: just edited all configs to the new names, but I 
believe, for unexperienced users, this could be problematic. And I also 
believe, an unexperienced user gets in trouble, when nobody points him, where 
to look.

You do not need to look for a solution for me, I just wanted to remember this 
thing and hope, we should keep this little problem in mind. Maybe this is 
worth a discussion, if not, please excuse the noise.

Best regards

Hans 

signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part.

Re: Bluetooth audio problem

[Mark Fletcher]

On Sun, Mar 03, 2019 at 06:04:05PM +0100, deloptes wrote:
> Mark Fletcher wrote:
> 
> > Hello
> > 
> > Since upgrading to Stretch shortly after it became stable, I have had to
> > execute the following after a reboot before being able to connect to
> > bluetooth devices using the Gnome bluetooth applet:
> > 
> > $ sudo pactl load-module module-bluetooth-discover
> > 



> > Now, when I run the above command it is erroring out with:
> > 
> > xcb_connection_has_error() returned true
> > Connection failure: Connection refused
> > pa_context_connect() failed: Connection refused
> > 
> 
> 
> When I want to debug pulse I do
> 
> echo "autospawn = no" > ~/.pulse/client.conf
> 
> kill PA and run it from command line with -v option you can also
> use --log-level (man pulseaudio)
> 
> perhaps you can see what is the problem there. If not it might be dbus issue
> with permissions - check the dbus settings
> 
> Also some times it helps to remove the ~/.pulse directory and restart
> pulseaudio.
> 

So this turned out to be a weirdie -- if I dropped the "sudo" my 
original command worked.

So now, suddenly from that update that started this thread, if I run the 
pactl command as an unprivileged user, it works fine. I have no idea why 
it changed but I'm just happy I have it working again.

Mark

Re: youtube video downloader for chrome

[Fred]

On 03/22/2019 05:05 AM, Greg Wooledge wrote:

On Thu, Mar 21, 2019 at 02:24:08PM -0700, Fred wrote:

One option that might have helped with a problem that was posted in about
the last week is the --restrict-filenames option which may prevent the need
to quote the URL.

No, that won't prevent the need to quote a URL containing & characters.
Those are special to the shell and will cause the command to be split
at that point, becoming two separate commands, one of which will be
executed in the background.

wooledg:~$ echo a
[1] 9208
a
bash: b: command not found
[1]+  Doneecho a
wooledg:~$



Hi,

I realized that after sending the post.  The --restrict-filenames option 
is for the destination file.


Best regards,
Fred

Re: devscripts 'bts' mail setup

[황병희]

> BTS_SMTP_HOST=posteo.de:587
> BTS_SMTP_AUTH_USERNAME=jsc...@posteo.net

sorry for other approach if you like postfix:
http://www.postfix.org/SOHO_README.html#client_sasl_sender

-- 
^고맙습니다 _地平天成_ 감사합니다_^))//

Re: djbwares version 9

[황병희]

On Thu, Mar 21 2019, Dan Ritter wrote:
> 황병희 wrote: 
>> On Wed, Mar 20 2019, Jonathan de Boyne Pollard wrote:
>> > ...snip...
>> >http://jdebp.eu./Softwares/djbwares/qmail-patches.html#any-to-cname
>> 
>> just comment:
>> whenever i see these patches, i think qmail is not easy to handle.
>
> qmail is the easiest mail server to understand and configure.

OK thanks, i'll try qmail within 10 years^^^

Sincerely, Byung-Hee.

-- 
^고맙습니다 _地平天成_ 감사합니다_^))//

Re: Bajar Debian 10

[Debian]

El 10/3/19 a las 21:32, Marcelo Eduardo Giordano escribió:

El 10/3/19 a las 20:39, Emiliano Gabriel Reynoso escribió:

Este es el link de buster:

https://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/

Entras ahí y bajas la imagen que necesites.

Es la versión testing de Debian. Yo la uso y no he tenido grandes 
problemas.

Suerte!




El dom., 10 de mar. de 2019 20:12, Marcelo Eduardo Giordano 
mailto:marcelogiord...@gmail.com>> escribió:


Esta pregunta que voy a hacer es vergonzosa, pero no puedo
solucionarla.

Como bajo debian 10?

probé aca pero nada

https://www.debian.org/CD/live/

Gracias de antemano


Versiones live de debian 10 no vienen?

Gracias de antemano



No.

Debian Live es sólo sobre "stable"

JAP

Re: Compartir mi internet a traves de mi tarjeta inalambrica Debian 9 Cinnamon

[Debian]

El 19/3/19 a las 21:20, Patrimonio Pinar del Río escribió:
Hola Lista. Tengo Debian 9 Cinnamon instalado ... Quisiera que alguien 
me diga cómo puedo compartir mi internet a traves de mi tarjeta 
inalambrica para mi phone androide ...




STFW


https://wiki.debian.org/es/Compartir_red_fisica_con_WiFi


JAP

Re: youtube video downloader for chrome

[Greg Wooledge]

On Thu, Mar 21, 2019 at 02:24:08PM -0700, Fred wrote:
> One option that might have helped with a problem that was posted in about
> the last week is the --restrict-filenames option which may prevent the need
> to quote the URL.

No, that won't prevent the need to quote a URL containing & characters.
Those are special to the shell and will cause the command to be split
at that point, becoming two separate commands, one of which will be
executed in the background.

wooledg:~$ echo a
[1] 9208
a
bash: b: command not found
[1]+  Doneecho a
wooledg:~$ 

Re: why key repeating fails?

[Curt]

On 2019-03-21, Long Wind  wrote:
>
> it fails after i use stretch for more than a few hours
>
> (i'm not aware of any keyboard/mouse input that might cause key
> repeating f ailure) i try "xset r on", it doesn't helpkey repeating is
> still ok in tty (text mo de)but i use X window most of time
>
>

Is this a laptop?

I've read that disabling the PEAQ WMI hotkeys works around the problem
(peaq_wmi module).

I guess 'xinput list' would tell you whether the module is loaded (or
'lsmod'). If so

 sudo rmmod peaq_wmi

If that works you could blacklist the thing (of whose purpose I have no
notion).

If not, sorry pal.

Strona WWW dla Twojej firmy na WordPress. Sprawdź.

[Dominik Rędziński| Strony WWW]

Dzień dobry, 

specjalizuję się w realizacji projektów 
nowoczesnych *Stron 
Internetowyc*h na *WordPress. *

 Będzie mi miło, jeśli wyrazicie Państwo 
zainteresowanie moją propozycją. 

Aby to zrobić wystarczy odpisać *TAK*na 
tego e-mail’a.

_ _ _
Dominik Rędziński
IT Specialist




 

Re: logiciel fiche de paie

[Klaus Becker]

Le 21/03/2019 à 23:14, j.valmer a écrit :

On Wednesday 20 March 2019 20:52:34 Klaus Becker wrote:

existe-t-il un logiciel de fiche de paie pour Debian ?


Pour GNU/Linux ou Debian exclusivement ?



Pour GNU/Linux bien sûr.

merci du tuyau

bonne journée

Klaus



http://www.open-paie.com/fr

Re: blank time in console too short

[Hans]

Am Donnerstag, 21. März 2019, 23:13:39 CET schrieb deloptes:




On Wed, Mar 20, 2019 at 7:15 AM Hans  wrote:


>> No, I mean not in windowmanager (or X), I mean in TTY1 - 5.



> So what about the monitor or precisely the DPMS setting 


As I said, not in X, but the console in the terminal you reach by ALT-F1, 
ALT-F2 and 
so on. And sa I also said: Both systems got an identical configuration but 
behave 
different.

Best

Hans


https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/
Display_Power_Management_Signaling#DPMS_interaction_in_a_Linux_console_with
_setterm[2]








[1] mailto:hans.ullr...@loop.de
[2] https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/
Display_Power_Management_Signaling#DPMS_interaction_in_a_Linux_console_with
_setterm


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