Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 12:21:10AM +0200, lee wrote: > Tom H writes: > > > You seem to have misunderstood that Christian's one of d-i's > > maintainers (he also seems to be a big fan of fonts!): > > Well, I didn't know any of this, and he didn't mention it. I could help > with translations if they need some, no idea how to do that, though. http://www.debian.org/intro/help -- "If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing." --- Malcolm X -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120925054959.GZ8247@tal
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
On Wed, Sep 19, 2012 at 07:17:36PM +0200, lee wrote: > > That's perfect and wonderful, thank you! Sure the bug can be closed. Hopefully the submitter can close their own bugs? -- "If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing." --- Malcolm X -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120925054654.GY8247@tal
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
On Thu, Sep 20, 2012 at 06:34:47PM +0200, lee wrote: > need it. This requirement is ridiculous. It has come up only about 12 > years ago --- and aren't things nowadays supposed to be easier than they > were instead of being more difficult? Believe me, its a lot easier now than it was 12 or so years ago. Have you tried the NetBSD installer? -- "If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing." --- Malcolm X -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120925054211.GX8247@tal
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
Jon Dowland writes: > On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 07:58:36PM +0200, lee wrote: >> Jon Dowland writes: >> >> > The installer (in expert mode) supports an ssh client on an alternative >> > VT, afaik. One can connect to another machine with stuff already >> > installed via this if necessary. Surely this is sufficient to address >> > the request. >> >> It requires you to have a computer you can connect to, and it is exactly >> the need to have another working computer before installing Debian on >> one which I would like to see eliminated. > > I see. Is this a genuine need, or a hypothetical one? It is a genuine need. Every time I installed Debian, I wished I had another, working computer at hand, and every time I've had that, it was a great relief. You know that when you install an OS nowadays, you really should have another, working computer at hand (i. e. you're basically required to have one). If something (unforeseen) goes wrong, you do need it. This requirement is ridiculous. It has come up only about 12 years ago --- and aren't things nowadays supposed to be easier than they were instead of being more difficult? > In my experience, the kind of people who might desire a working > environment during an install are the types of "power" users likely to > have a few machines lying around. It can be useful for this kind of people, especially when they don't have the other computers lying around. It can also be useful for everyone else. The discussion we have had was going in part about clueless users trying to install Debian who get stuck when they need to make decisions about partitioning due to insufficient knowledge. So it was proposed to put information into the D/i that allows them to make educated decisions about partitioning. It was objected that this would have to be quite a lot of information, that the users won't read it, that the D/i isn't the right place for this kind of user education and that users who don't know what to do at that point are in the wrong place ... So it was proposed to let users have a working system /before/ they install. That takes away the need to install so that they can take their time to learn what they need to learn /before/ they start the installation. On top of that, it allows them to get more information at any time during the installation process. It eliminates the need to have another, working computer at hand when installing Debian. > Personally, I think you should just finish the install and use the > machine you're installing to. A perfect excuse to go and read a book > for 10 minutes or so. In most cases, it might be possible to do some kind of emergency installation to get a system running to the point where it's sufficient to acquire the information or software needed. Once you got that, you will have to start over again and try to get it right this time, and if it doesn't work, you can start the next round. That doesn't make sense. The most failures of the installer I have seen was the inability to install grub. It just won't do it, no matter what. At that point, you have spent quite some time with making all the settings, with carefully setting up the partitioning, and you have downloaded the packages you need. The installation is almost finished, but the installer says it cannot install grub. Now you're telling me I need to start over again and do an emergency installation. Then I need to set up the system so I can get what I need. That involves downloading a minimal graphical environment because I want at least a decent web browser. Depending on how fast my internet connection is, that can take many hours. Then I need to start over from scratch again and go through the whole installation process again to find out if grub can be installed or not. If it can't, start the next round. How many days do you expect me to spend with trying to install Debian? Last time, I spent a whole day on it because grub couldn't be installed until I finally gave up and installed it in a way in which I didn't want to. (If you're curious, I wanted everything on a RAID-1. It was impossible. I knew it should be possible because I managed to do that after lots of trouble on another computer before.) >> Or can I connect to yours any time I might need to? Can I put software on >> some storage media like a CD or DVD with that without having to come around >> to pick it up? > > Of course you couldn't. So how much does that actually help me? :) >> In case I do have another working computer, I don't need ssh to connect to >> it. It's easier for me to use it directly. > > That rules out access to a remote server such as a VPS. Yes it does. Can I put software onto some storage media with that? I would be able to use lynx (if it's available on the remote server or if I can make it available), and I might be able to look at configuration files and installed documentation. It's better than nothing *if* you have it. I don't have it. Maybe I could ge
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 07:58:36PM +0200, lee wrote: > Jon Dowland writes: > > > The installer (in expert mode) supports an ssh client on an alternative > > VT, afaik. One can connect to another machine with stuff already > > installed via this if necessary. Surely this is sufficient to address > > the request. > > It requires you to have a computer you can connect to, and it is exactly > the need to have another working computer before installing Debian on > one which I would like to see eliminated. I see. Is this a genuine need, or a hypothetical one? In my experience, the kind of people who might desire a working environment during an install are the types of "power" users likely to have a few machines lying around. Personally, I think you should just finish the install and use the machine you're installing to. A perfect excuse to go and read a book for 10 minutes or so. > Or can I connect to yours any time I might need to? Can I put software on > some storage media like a CD or DVD with that without having to come around > to pick it up? Of course you couldn't. > In case I do have another working computer, I don't need ssh to connect to > it. It's easier for me to use it directly. That rules out access to a remote server such as a VPS. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120920124435.GC17882@debian
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
Brian writes: > On Wed 19 Sep 2012 at 03:14:05 +0200, lee wrote: > >> Richard Owlett writes: >> >> > Should one not be able to switch out of the installation process and >> > into a browser (2 are already included) to search out answers? >> >> One should be able to. Since I haven't tried the life-installer yet, I >> don't know what's possible. It would be nice if one could switch >> between the installer and a browser any time after starting the >> installation. I wouldn't say it's needed since one can just reboot from >> the installer into the life system, assuming that one doesn't lose much >> when doing so. This assumption might be a bad idea, though. > > Boot into a live sytem. Start a browser. Start d-i. ALT-TAB between the > two. Or CTRL-ALT-Fx for a virtual terminal. > > The feature you requested exists. Surely the bug could now be closed? That's perfect and wonderful, thank you! Sure the bug can be closed. -- Debian testing amd64 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/87txuulyof@yun.yagibdah.de
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
Samuel Thibault writes: > Brian, le Wed 19 Sep 2012 12:43:43 +0100, a écrit : >> On Wed 19 Sep 2012 at 12:27:57 +0200, Samuel Thibault wrote: >> >> > Brian, le Wed 19 Sep 2012 10:41:12 +0100, a écrit : >> > > >> > > Yes, planning ahead is required if you want to stay in X. For a spur of >> > > the moment need for information there is w3m in a terminal. >> > >> > How do you start a terminal? Going through the main menu is not an >> > option, one often needs to have both the question being asked by debconf >> > and the documentation at hand. >> >> I should have been clearer: CTRL-ALT-F1 > > That's not very user friendly. > >> With the Xfce Live image the installer window can be minimised. Also, >> it does not cover the task bar at the bottom of the screen, so another >> workspace is selectable. The documentation is only is a URL away. > > Ok, but that's not the case with at least gnome/lxde. As mentioned in a > previous mail, that's what this bug could be about (documenting "use > the xfce liveCD" seems quite lazy to me) It was only about using the "normal" Debian installer which when I used it last time (about a 3/4 year ago) didn't include any web browser at all. It somewhere does tell you that you can press Alt-F3 or something to get a console. The live installer could tell users that they can press Ctrl-Alt-F1 (or something) to get one. You are right that people would have to consider the possibility of needing a web browser during the installation before they start. So perhaps the following might make sense: 1.) Make the life installer the recommended default installer. People choosing a different one might be expected to know what they are doing. 2.) Change [1] to clearly present this recommendation. When you look at [1], the life installer doesn't really show up. It says "Try Debian live before installing". When I'm looking for the installer, I'm not looking to try out Debian before installing it, so I'm immediately ignoring this option and don't find out about it. Make the life installer the only one presented on [1] and add links to the installation manual and things like "press Ctrl-Alt-F1" so it is easy for people to know and find out a few things they really should know before starting to install. Links to the other versions of the installer could (should) also be there so that people looking for them can find them. [1]: http://www.debian.org/distrib/ Maybe it's just me, but when I look at [1]: "Getting Debian": Ok that's what I'm looking for. So where's the installer? "Debian is distributed freely over Internet.": Yeah I know that, so where is the installer? --- Notice that I don't read any further, so I don't see that there is a link to the installation manual. I'm serious, I've been looking like 10 times or more at this page during the last couple days and I only noticed that link just now, and that only because it has a different colour now because I visited it when I followed an URL in a post in this mailing list the other day and because I'm looking more closely at the page now. "Buy a set of ...": No, not what I want. "Download a small ...": Hm, maybe, but I really don't care if the download is small or not. With a small download, I might be missing something useful and it might take longer to install because more stuff needs to be downloaded and I don't want to wait on that. "Download large ...": Ok, what means large? "Buy a computer with Debian pre-installed": No, not what I want. So what means large? "Useful when the install target has no Internet connection.": Well, I do have an internet connection. So what is it about? "The CD/DVD images can be downloaded using HTTP/FTP, BitTorrent, or Jigdo.": Yeah sure, I guess I can somehow download them!? That isn't relevant here. BitTorrent is painfully slow and you might never get what you're trying to get, and I don't know about jigdo, so screw that. "The large CD and DVD images contain more packages, making it easier to install machines without an Internet connection. However, if you get a whole set of CDs or DVDs, you will get a lot of packages that you won't actually use.": Err, hm, ok, what's that supposed to mean? That I would download the whole distribution? Or a "larger" CD or DVD? There is only so much you can fit onto a CD or DVD, so what does it mean? Maybe I need a small image because I don't want to download so much? "Use Internet to download additional files during installation.": I will have to do that anyway unless I download the whole distribution. Even if I download the whole distribution, it will become outdated. (Since I'm running testing, I'm actually looking for an installer for testing. That is even harder to find.) "Buy a set ...": Ah, no, that takes too long ... See what I mean? 1.) "Try Debian live before installing" is a tiny option at the bottom right of the screen, overshadowed by all the others. It is the first o
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
On Wed 19 Sep 2012 at 13:46:52 +0200, Samuel Thibault wrote: > Brian, le Wed 19 Sep 2012 12:43:43 +0100, a écrit : > > > With the Xfce Live image the installer window can be minimised. Also, > > it does not cover the task bar at the bottom of the screen, so another > > workspace is selectable. The documentation is only is a URL away. > > Ok, but that's not the case with at least gnome/lxde. As mentioned in a > previous mail, that's what this bug could be about (documenting "use > the xfce liveCD" seems quite lazy to me) I wouldn't dream of suggesting such an addition to the documentation. For GNOME and KDE ALT-F1 comes up with a menu. It's ALT-F2 on Xfce. Is this user-friendly enough? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120919151034.GO20063@desktop
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
Brian, le Wed 19 Sep 2012 12:43:43 +0100, a écrit : > On Wed 19 Sep 2012 at 12:27:57 +0200, Samuel Thibault wrote: > > > Brian, le Wed 19 Sep 2012 10:41:12 +0100, a écrit : > > > > > > Yes, planning ahead is required if you want to stay in X. For a spur of > > > the moment need for information there is w3m in a terminal. > > > > How do you start a terminal? Going through the main menu is not an > > option, one often needs to have both the question being asked by debconf > > and the documentation at hand. > > I should have been clearer: CTRL-ALT-F1 That's not very user friendly. > With the Xfce Live image the installer window can be minimised. Also, > it does not cover the task bar at the bottom of the screen, so another > workspace is selectable. The documentation is only is a URL away. Ok, but that's not the case with at least gnome/lxde. As mentioned in a previous mail, that's what this bug could be about (documenting "use the xfce liveCD" seems quite lazy to me) Samuel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120919114652.gp5...@type.bordeaux.inria.fr
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
On Wed 19 Sep 2012 at 12:27:57 +0200, Samuel Thibault wrote: > Brian, le Wed 19 Sep 2012 10:41:12 +0100, a écrit : > > > > Yes, planning ahead is required if you want to stay in X. For a spur of > > the moment need for information there is w3m in a terminal. > > How do you start a terminal? Going through the main menu is not an > option, one often needs to have both the question being asked by debconf > and the documentation at hand. I should have been clearer: CTRL-ALT-F1 With the Xfce Live image the installer window can be minimised. Also, it does not cover the task bar at the bottom of the screen, so another workspace is selectable. The documentation is only is a URL away. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120919114343.GM20063@desktop
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
Brian, le Wed 19 Sep 2012 10:41:12 +0100, a écrit : > On Wed 19 Sep 2012 at 11:23:10 +0200, Samuel Thibault wrote: > > > Brian, le Wed 19 Sep 2012 10:15:44 +0100, a écrit : > > > > > > Boot into a live sytem. Start a browser. Start d-i. ALT-TAB between the > > > two. Or CTRL-ALT-Fx for a virtual terminal. > > > The feature you requested exists. Surely the bug could now be closed? > > > > So you need to know in advance that you'll need a browser. If you don't > > remember starting one, you're stuck in d-i. That's not really a good > > solution. > > Yes, planning ahead is required if you want to stay in X. For a spur of > the moment need for information there is w3m in a terminal. How do you start a terminal? Going through the main menu is not an option, one often needs to have both the question being asked by debconf and the documentation at hand. Samuel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120919102757.gh5...@type.bordeaux.inria.fr
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
On Wed 19 Sep 2012 at 11:23:10 +0200, Samuel Thibault wrote: > Brian, le Wed 19 Sep 2012 10:15:44 +0100, a écrit : > > > > Boot into a live sytem. Start a browser. Start d-i. ALT-TAB between the > > two. Or CTRL-ALT-Fx for a virtual terminal. > > The feature you requested exists. Surely the bug could now be closed? > > So you need to know in advance that you'll need a browser. If you don't > remember starting one, you're stuck in d-i. That's not really a good > solution. Yes, planning ahead is required if you want to stay in X. For a spur of the moment need for information there is w3m in a terminal. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120919094112.GL20063@desktop
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
Brian, le Wed 19 Sep 2012 10:15:44 +0100, a écrit : > On Wed 19 Sep 2012 at 03:14:05 +0200, lee wrote: > > > Richard Owlett writes: > > > > > Should one not be able to switch out of the installation process and > > > into a browser (2 are already included) to search out answers? > > > > One should be able to. Since I haven't tried the life-installer yet, I > > don't know what's possible. It would be nice if one could switch > > between the installer and a browser any time after starting the > > installation. I wouldn't say it's needed since one can just reboot from > > the installer into the life system, assuming that one doesn't lose much > > when doing so. This assumption might be a bad idea, though. > > Boot into a live sytem. Start a browser. Start d-i. ALT-TAB between the > two. Or CTRL-ALT-Fx for a virtual terminal. > The feature you requested exists. Surely the bug could now be closed? So you need to know in advance that you'll need a browser. If you don't remember starting one, you're stuck in d-i. That's not really a good solution. Samuel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120919092310.gg5...@type.bordeaux.inria.fr
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
On Wed 19 Sep 2012 at 03:14:05 +0200, lee wrote: > Richard Owlett writes: > > > Should one not be able to switch out of the installation process and > > into a browser (2 are already included) to search out answers? > > One should be able to. Since I haven't tried the life-installer yet, I > don't know what's possible. It would be nice if one could switch > between the installer and a browser any time after starting the > installation. I wouldn't say it's needed since one can just reboot from > the installer into the life system, assuming that one doesn't lose much > when doing so. This assumption might be a bad idea, though. Boot into a live sytem. Start a browser. Start d-i. ALT-TAB between the two. Or CTRL-ALT-Fx for a virtual terminal. The feature you requested exists. Surely the bug could now be closed? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120919091544.GK20063@desktop
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
Richard Owlett writes: > Should one not be able to switch out of the installation process and > into a browser (2 are already included) to search out answers? One should be able to. Since I haven't tried the life-installer yet, I don't know what's possible. It would be nice if one could switch between the installer and a browser any time after starting the installation. I wouldn't say it's needed since one can just reboot from the installer into the life system, assuming that one doesn't lose much when doing so. This assumption might be a bad idea, though. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/87392eq0f6@yun.yagibdah.de
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
Jon Dowland writes: > The installer (in expert mode) supports an ssh client on an alternative > VT, afaik. One can connect to another machine with stuff already > installed via this if necessary. Surely this is sufficient to address > the request. This requires you to have the other machine you can connect to. The idea is to be able to install without having another computer to fall back to. The life-installer CD probably solves the problem; I'll have to try it. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/87a9wmq11a@yun.yagibdah.de
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
Tom H writes: > You seem to have misunderstood that Christian's one of d-i's > maintainers (he also seems to be a big fan of fonts!): Well, I didn't know any of this, and he didn't mention it. I could help with translations if they need some, no idea how to do that, though. -- Debian testing amd64 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/87d31kwasp@yun.yagibdah.de
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 2:16 PM, lee wrote: > Christian PERRIER writes: >> >> Frankly speaking, I would very much prefer seeing people working on >> current issues of the installer (I mean, not only during 3 months >> before the release) rather than adding more bells, whistles and shiny >> new features. It would be great if existing features were kept working >> during the entire release process. > > They'll do that or not, and we probably cannot decide for them what to > spend their time with. > >> This is of course not targeted at you who reported this bug (don't >> shoot the messenger) but more at all these people who have great >> ideas on debian-user but never show up in development teams. > > Did you show up on a development team to work on the issues you would > like to see the developers working on? > > How do you show up on such a team? Did you ever try to provide a Debian > package? I'd have liked to and only found it being ridiculously > difficult, so I gave up on it. If you want to try, I probably still > have the sources and you can have them --- they'd need fixing though, > which I didn't because I don't need it anymore. I had it uploaded to > freshmeat or sourceforge, and last time I checked, they seemed to have > removed it. Well, not my loss ... You seem to have misunderstood that Christian's one of d-i's maintainers (he also seems to be a big fan of fonts!): http://qa.debian.org/developer.php?login=bubulle&comaint=yes -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/CAOdo=Sx_J-XJ=_0ljqgyffpqax9ksrqtwjgmgnreun6iuvi...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
Christian PERRIER writes: > Quoting lee (l...@yun.yagibdah.de): >> Package: installation-reports >> Severity: wishlist >> >> Dear Maintainer, >> >> this is a feature request: It would be nice if users would have at >> least a web browser like lynx and an irc client available while they >> are using the installer. There has been/currently is a lengthy >> discussion about this on the debian-user mailing list starting with > > > Frankly speaking, I would very much prefer seeing people working on > current issues of the installer (I mean, not only during 3 months > before the release) rather than adding more bells, whistles and shiny > new features. It would be great if existing features were kept working > during the entire release process. They'll do that or not, and we probably cannot decide for them what to spend their time with. > This is of course not targeted at you who reported this bug (don't > shoot the messenger)but more at all these people who have great ideas > on debian-user but never show up in development teams. Did you show up on a development team to work on the issues you would like to see the developers working on? How do you show up on such a team? Did you ever try to provide a Debian package? I'd have liked to and only found it being ridiculously difficult, so I gave up on it. If you want to try, I probably still have the sources and you can have them --- they'd need fixing though, which I didn't because I don't need it anymore. I had it uploaded to freshmeat or sourceforge, and last time I checked, they seemed to have removed it. Well, not my loss ... > If you want a web browser, an IRC client, games, etc. in D-I, then > please come and first fix issues related to GRUB and encrypted > partitions, partitions sizes, preseeding, documentation, etc. *Then* > we'll see if we add a web browser. Would it really require an excrutiating amount of effort to just add lynx to what's available? It could probably be done with much less effort than fixing the issues you mention and be helpful for users to deal with these issues until they are fixed (at which time there'll be new issues to deal with ...). Anyway, the problem appears to be solved already :) -- Debian testing amd64 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/87y5k8zf9u@yun.yagibdah.de
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
Jon Dowland writes: > The installer (in expert mode) supports an ssh client on an alternative > VT, afaik. One can connect to another machine with stuff already > installed via this if necessary. Surely this is sufficient to address > the request. It requires you to have a computer you can connect to, and it is exactly the need to have another working computer before installing Debian on one which I would like to see eliminated. Or can I connect to yours any time I might need to? Can I put software on some storage media like a CD or DVD with that without having to come around to pick it up? In case I do have another working computer, I don't need ssh to connect to it. It's easier for me to use it directly. -- Debian testing amd64 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/87392g1qgj@yun.yagibdah.de
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
The installer (in expert mode) supports an ssh client on an alternative VT, afaik. One can connect to another machine with stuff already installed via this if necessary. Surely this is sufficient to address the request. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120917122740.GB20063@debian
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
Christian PERRIER wrote: Quoting lee (l...@yun.yagibdah.de): Package: installation-reports Severity: wishlist Dear Maintainer, this is a feature request: It would be nice if users would have at least a web browser like lynx and an irc client available while they are using the installer. There has been/currently is a lengthy discussion about this on the debian-user mailing list starting with Frankly speaking, I would very much prefer seeing people working on current issues of the installer (I mean, not only during 3 months before the release) rather than adding more bells, whistles and shiny new features. It would be great if existing features were kept working during the entire release process. This is of course not targeted at you who reported this bug (don't shoot the messenger)but more at all these people who have great ideas on debian-user but never show up in development teams. If you want a web browser, an IRC client, games, etc. in D-I, then please come and first fix issues related to GRUB and encrypted partitions, partitions sizes, preseeding, documentation, etc. *Then* we'll see if we add a web browser. As I tried to say elsewhere in this thread, I suspect the solution already exists in the liveCD. [and as an aside to Mr. Thibault the reason I believe so is having used the CD and followed several discussions on several Debian groups] There are icons in lower right for several workspaces. I've seen comments about switching consoles with function key combinations. Should one not be able to switch out of the installation process and into a browser (2 are already included) to search out answers? Although launching a browser internally and loading a specific link may be a significant effort, if my idea is technically feasible it would apparently only require a page of instructional text. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/505708fe.3020...@cloud85.net
Re: Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer
Quoting lee (l...@yun.yagibdah.de): > Package: installation-reports > Severity: wishlist > > Dear Maintainer, > > this is a feature request: It would be nice if users would have at > least a web browser like lynx and an irc client available while they > are using the installer. There has been/currently is a lengthy > discussion about this on the debian-user mailing list starting with Frankly speaking, I would very much prefer seeing people working on current issues of the installer (I mean, not only during 3 months before the release) rather than adding more bells, whistles and shiny new features. It would be great if existing features were kept working during the entire release process. This is of course not targeted at you who reported this bug (don't shoot the messenger)but more at all these people who have great ideas on debian-user but never show up in development teams. If you want a web browser, an IRC client, games, etc. in D-I, then please come and first fix issues related to GRUB and encrypted partitions, partitions sizes, preseeding, documentation, etc. *Then* we'll see if we add a web browser. signature.asc Description: Digital signature
