Re: Package configure problem during Installation.

[tomas]

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On Sun, Nov 27, 2016 at 04:33:58AM +0530, amir khan wrote:

(Please keep the Debian user mailing list in the loop. First of
all, there are lots of people there far more knowledgeable than
me, thus raising the probability for you to get good help, second
the results of your quest are there in the archives to help other
people

There is already a longer thread in the mailing list about your
question. If you aren't subscribed, you can see it here:

  https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2016/11/msg00988.html

And oh, if you are not subscribed, please tell us to keep you in
copy, so you don't miss any annswers).

> Yes Tomas, I tried all those listed for India. But it didn't work. Hope to
> get it done the other way round(by using the mirror redirect service).
> And also, I'm new to the debian and linux world and I'm going to use it for
> Virtualization purposes(my final year project based on it). So , I just
> want to know that, why to install debian linux distribution if I can get it
> done on Ubuntu too. I'm a bit confused, please guide me. Thanks !

Well, those are two questions:

Archives:

the other archives in India: I don't know about the reachability of
those archives. I asked just to find out wheter it could be that this
one specific archive is down *or* whether you have more generic
network problems. Since now you tried several archives, if I were in
your place I'd try to find out whether your freshly installed VM has
access to the Internet at all. Pick one of the archives which failed:
can you access it from your browser?

Debian vs Ubuntu

Ubuntu is a Debian derivative, specially aimed at desktop users who
have less experience with Unix/Linux. Some tools are more polished,
some packages are newer. If you really want to tinker, Debian offers
more possibilities. That said, the differences are not that big, and
there are many tinkerers using Ubuntu and many "end-users" using
Debian. It's free software, that means that each project can (and
does) pick good things from the other. Since Debian is an open
distribution, there are many Debian derivatives.

regards
- -- tomás
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Re: Package configure problem during Installation.

[Sven Hartge]

Brian  wrote:

> The only thing I vaguely understand about the difference between the
> two is that httpredir.debian.org uses the traditional mirror network
> whereas deb.debian.org uses the Fastly CDN (Content Delivery Network)
> and there is some caching going on. 

Fastly and Cloudfront are used

> Because Fastly has local peering arrangements mirror choices are
> supposed to be local (and hence faster). I've not noticed any
> difference in a few short tests.

You are correct.

Additional bonus: deb.debian.org can also be accessed via HTTPS if you
want/need to further obfuscate what you pull from mirrors.

Grüße,
S°

-- 
Sigmentation fault. Core dumped.

Re: Package configure problem during Installation.

[Brian]

On Sat 26 Nov 2016 at 16:44:42 -0500, kamaraju kusumanchi wrote:

> On Sat, Nov 26, 2016 at 1:23 PM, Brian  wrote:
> > On Sat 26 Nov 2016 at 18:40:38 +0100, Sven Hartge wrote:
> >
> >> Brian  wrote:
> >> > I think viewing deb.debian.org as beta is fair. Viewing the redirector
> >> > as deprecated or about to be closed down in not correct. There is a
> >> > diversity of views in both threads.
> >>
> >> There are. But all more or less agree that httpredir.debian.org is
> >> unmaintained and just cruising along on auto-pilot.
> >
> > Very informative. Either would do for me in the UK, I think (assuming
> > httpredir.debian.org stays around). Should we now be recommending
> > deb.debian.org in user now? What do we get from it for our money?
> 
> I went through the threads posted by you and Sven. I think you can
> recommend httpredir service untill there is a formal announcement of
> moving to deb.debian.org . The httpredir service is just not
> maintained but not deprecated. If it does not work as expected, bugs
> can be filed[1] with the following pseudo headers.
> 
> Package: mirrors
> Severity: normal
> User: mirr...@packages.debian.org
> Usertags: httpredir

Seems to be a reasonable approach. Maybe deb.debian.org is better for
people with particular needs. I have to say I have generally done well
by the redirector in terms of speed and reliability.

The only thing I vaguely understand about the difference between the two
is that httpredir.debian.org uses the traditional mirror network whereas
deb.debian.org uses the Fastly CDN (Content Delivery Network) and there
is some caching going on. Because Fastly has local peering arrangements
mirror choices are supposed to be local (and hence faster). I've not
noticed any difference in a few short tests.

-- 
Brian.

-- 
Brian.

Re: Package configure problem during Installation.

[kamaraju kusumanchi]

On Sat, Nov 26, 2016 at 1:23 PM, Brian  wrote:
> On Sat 26 Nov 2016 at 18:40:38 +0100, Sven Hartge wrote:
>
>> Brian  wrote:
>> > I think viewing deb.debian.org as beta is fair. Viewing the redirector
>> > as deprecated or about to be closed down in not correct. There is a
>> > diversity of views in both threads.
>>
>> There are. But all more or less agree that httpredir.debian.org is
>> unmaintained and just cruising along on auto-pilot.
>
> Very informative. Either would do for me in the UK, I think (assuming
> httpredir.debian.org stays around). Should we now be recommending
> deb.debian.org in user now? What do we get from it for our money?

I went through the threads posted by you and Sven. I think you can
recommend httpredir service untill there is a formal announcement of
moving to deb.debian.org . The httpredir service is just not
maintained but not deprecated. If it does not work as expected, bugs
can be filed[1] with the following pseudo headers.

Package: mirrors
Severity: normal
User: mirr...@packages.debian.org
Usertags: httpredir

[1] - https://lists.debian.org/debian-project/2016/04/msg00035.html
-- 
Kamaraju S Kusumanchi | http://raju.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Blog

Re: Package configure problem during Installation.

[Brian]

On Sat 26 Nov 2016 at 18:40:38 +0100, Sven Hartge wrote:

> Brian  wrote:
> 
> > For the -devel thread:
> 
> >   https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2016/07/msg00071.html
> 
> I had a more recent thread in mind and I just found it. It was kind of
> buried inside the "When should we https our mirrors?" thread.
> 
> From: https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2016/10/msg00362.html
> 
> ,[ Peter Palfrader 
> | > TL;DR: Would we now recommend deb.d.o over httpredir.d.o for
> | > production use e.g. in base images (including for Jessie)?
> |
> | Yes.
> `
> 
> And here https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2016/10/msg00490.html one
> of the maintainers behind deb.debian.org states the "experimental" phase
> has ended:
> 
> ,[ Tollef Fog Heen 
> | As of this morning, the bit about experimental was removed from the web
> | page.
> `
> 
> And here the reference for d-i (more precisely debootstrap) switching to
> deb.debian.org:
> https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2016/11/msg6.html
> 
> > I think viewing deb.debian.org as beta is fair. Viewing the redirector
> > as deprecated or about to be closed down in not correct. There is a
> > diversity of views in both threads.
> 
> There are. But all more or less agree that httpredir.debian.org is
> unmaintained and just cruising along on auto-pilot.

Very informative. Either would do for me in the UK, I think (assuming
httpredir.debian.org stays around). Should we now be recommending
deb.debian.org in user now? What do we get from it for our money?

-- 
Brian.

Re: Package configure problem during Installation.

[Sven Hartge]

Brian  wrote:
> On Sat 26 Nov 2016 at 11:51:19 -0500, kamaraju kusumanchi wrote:

>> Thanks Sven. Is this still a beta service or mature enough to be
>> recommended to debian users? Hopefully there is a formal announcement
>> on this. As it stands, httpredir is mentioned in many places. For
>> example
>> 
>> https://www.debian.org/mirror/list
>> https://www.debian.org/mirror/
>> http://httpredir.debian.org/
>> 
>> and is all over the wiki (there are 145 hits for httpredir
>> site:wiki.debian.org in google).

> For the -devel thread:

>   https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2016/07/msg00071.html

I had a more recent thread in mind and I just found it. It was kind of
buried inside the "When should we https our mirrors?" thread.

From: https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2016/10/msg00362.html

,[ Peter Palfrader 
| > TL;DR: Would we now recommend deb.d.o over httpredir.d.o for
| > production use e.g. in base images (including for Jessie)?
|
| Yes.
`

And here https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2016/10/msg00490.html one
of the maintainers behind deb.debian.org states the "experimental" phase
has ended:

,[ Tollef Fog Heen 
| As of this morning, the bit about experimental was removed from the web
| page.
`

And here the reference for d-i (more precisely debootstrap) switching to
deb.debian.org:
https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2016/11/msg6.html

> I think viewing deb.debian.org as beta is fair. Viewing the redirector
> as deprecated or about to be closed down in not correct. There is a
> diversity of views in both threads.

There are. But all more or less agree that httpredir.debian.org is
unmaintained and just cruising along on auto-pilot.

Grüße,
Sven.

-- 
Sigmentation fault. Core dumped.

Re: Package configure problem during Installation.

[Brian]

On Sat 26 Nov 2016 at 11:51:19 -0500, kamaraju kusumanchi wrote:

> On Sat, Nov 26, 2016 at 11:33 AM, Sven Hartge  wrote:
> > kamaraju kusumanchi  wrote:
> >
> >> Where is it documented that httpredir is deprecated and that we should
> >> use deb.debian.org's service going forward? Has it been announce
> >> somewhere?
> >
> > There has been a thread on debian-devel (I can't find the Message-ID at
> > the moment) and the latest version of the next debian-installer for
> > Stretch switched the URL from httpredir.debian.org to deb.debian.org.
> >
> >> Also, will it work for Jessie or is it more for stretch or later?
> >
> > It will work a bit more efficient for Stretch+, but it also works as
> > intended for Wheezy and Jessie.
> >
> 
> Thanks Sven. Is this still a beta service or mature enough to be
> recommended to debian users? Hopefully there is a formal announcement
> on this. As it stands, httpredir is mentioned in many places. For
> example
> 
> https://www.debian.org/mirror/list
> https://www.debian.org/mirror/
> http://httpredir.debian.org/
> 
> and is all over the wiki (there are 145 hits for httpredir
> site:wiki.debian.org in google).

For the -devel thread:

  https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2016/07/msg00071.html

For the -project thread:

  https://lists.debian.org/debian-project/2016/04/msg00012.html

I think viewing deb.debian.org as beta is fair. Viewing the redirector
as deprecated or about to be closed down in not correct. There is a
diversity of views in both threads.

> Now I feel stupid for filing
> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=845769 today morning
> asking httpredir to be discussed in the debian-handbook. :FacePalm:

Don't feel like that. You can either close the report with an explantion
or add to it saying you have become aware of deb.debian.org and leaving
any decision until things clarify may not be a bad idea.

-- 
Brian.

Re: Package configure problem during Installation.

[kamaraju kusumanchi]

On Sat, Nov 26, 2016 at 11:33 AM, Sven Hartge  wrote:
> kamaraju kusumanchi  wrote:
>
>> Where is it documented that httpredir is deprecated and that we should
>> use deb.debian.org's service going forward? Has it been announce
>> somewhere?
>
> There has been a thread on debian-devel (I can't find the Message-ID at
> the moment) and the latest version of the next debian-installer for
> Stretch switched the URL from httpredir.debian.org to deb.debian.org.
>
>> Also, will it work for Jessie or is it more for stretch or later?
>
> It will work a bit more efficient for Stretch+, but it also works as
> intended for Wheezy and Jessie.
>

Thanks Sven. Is this still a beta service or mature enough to be
recommended to debian users? Hopefully there is a formal announcement
on this. As it stands, httpredir is mentioned in many places. For
example

https://www.debian.org/mirror/list
https://www.debian.org/mirror/
http://httpredir.debian.org/

and is all over the wiki (there are 145 hits for httpredir
site:wiki.debian.org in google).

Now I feel stupid for filing
https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=845769 today morning
asking httpredir to be discussed in the debian-handbook. :FacePalm:

raju
-- 
Kamaraju S Kusumanchi | http://raju.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Blog

Re: Package configure problem during Installation.

[Sven Hartge]

kamaraju kusumanchi  wrote:
> On Sat, Nov 26, 2016 at 11:09 AM, Sven Hartge  wrote:

>> httpredir is somewhat deprecated now.
>>
>> The new official service is deb.debian.org:
>>
>> deb http://deb.debian.org/debian jessie main contrib non-free
>>
>> But you can use both at the same time to get the maximum coverage, of
>> course.

> Where is it documented that httpredir is deprecated and that we should
> use deb.debian.org's service going forward? Has it been announce
> somewhere?

There has been a thread on debian-devel (I can't find the Message-ID at
the moment) and the latest version of the next debian-installer for
Stretch switched the URL from httpredir.debian.org to deb.debian.org.

> Also, will it work for Jessie or is it more for stretch or later?

It will work a bit more efficient for Stretch+, but it also works as
intended for Wheezy and Jessie.

Grüße,
Sven.

-- 
Sigmentation fault. Core dumped.

Re: Package configure problem during Installation.

[kamaraju kusumanchi]

On Sat, Nov 26, 2016 at 11:09 AM, Sven Hartge  wrote:
> kamaraju kusumanchi  wrote:
>
>> For these and many other reasons, it is better to use the "mirror
>> redirector service". The idea is to add something like
>
>> deb http://httpredir.debian.org/debian jessie main contrib non-free
>
>> in the /etc/apt/sources.list and let apt-get figure out the best
>> mirror for you. More details on this approach can be found at
>> http://httpredir.debian.org/ .
>
> httpredir is somewhat deprecated now.
>
> The new official service is deb.debian.org:
>
> deb http://deb.debian.org/debian jessie main contrib non-free
>
> But you can use both at the same time to get the maximum coverage, of
> course.

Where is it documented that httpredir is deprecated and that we should
use deb.debian.org's service going forward? Has it been announce
somewhere?

Also, will it work for Jessie or is it more for stretch or later?

thanks
raju
-- 
Kamaraju S Kusumanchi | http://raju.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Blog

Re: Package configure problem during Installation.

[Sven Hartge]

kamaraju kusumanchi  wrote:

> For these and many other reasons, it is better to use the "mirror
> redirector service". The idea is to add something like

> deb http://httpredir.debian.org/debian jessie main contrib non-free

> in the /etc/apt/sources.list and let apt-get figure out the best
> mirror for you. More details on this approach can be found at
> http://httpredir.debian.org/ .

httpredir is somewhat deprecated now. 

The new official service is deb.debian.org:

deb http://deb.debian.org/debian jessie main contrib non-free

But you can use both at the same time to get the maximum coverage, of
course.

Grüße,
Sven.

-- 
Sigmentation fault. Core dumped.

Re: Package configure problem during Installation.

[kamaraju kusumanchi]

On Sat, Nov 26, 2016 at 5:59 AM, amir khan  wrote:
> Hello!
> I am unable to configure the package manager. The mirrors given in the list
> of INDIA can't fetch any content.
> Is there any other way to configure it. I would really appreciate any help.
>
> Thank You!

Hi Amir Khan,

There are currently 3 Debian mirrors in India - debianmirror.nkn.in,
ftp.iitm.ac.in, mirror.cse.iitk.ac.in . The list changes from time to
time. To get the latest set of mirrors, go to
https://www.debian.org/mirror/list and search for the country of
interest (which in your case is India).

You can try these mirrors one-by-one and see which one works for you.
But I do not suggest this for the following reasons

1) This is not a scalable approach. For example, there could be many
mirrors for some countries (ex:- United States has 60) and trying each
can be tiring.
2) Geographical proximity to a mirror does not always mean that it
will serve you best.
3) Not all mirrors carry all the architectures. For example,
debianmirror.nkn.in carries three architectures while ftp.iitm.ac.in
carries five.
4) The process has to be repeated every time you move to a different
location which can be annoying for laptop users.

For these and many other reasons, it is better to use the "mirror
redirector service". The idea is to add something like

deb http://httpredir.debian.org/debian jessie main contrib non-free

in the /etc/apt/sources.list and let apt-get figure out the best
mirror for you. More details on this approach can be found at
http://httpredir.debian.org/ .

hope that helps
raju
-- 
Kamaraju S Kusumanchi | http://raju.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Blog

Re: Package configure problem during Installation.

[tomas]

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On Sat, Nov 26, 2016 at 04:29:19PM +0530, amir khan wrote:
> Hello!
> I am unable to configure the package manager. The mirrors given in the list
> of INDIA can't fetch any content.
> Is there any other way to configure it. I would really appreciate any help.

Have you tried with any other mirrors?

regards
- -- tomás
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