Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Wed, Mar 3, 2021 at 11:07 AM Pierre Frenkiel wrote: > On Wed, 3 Mar 2021, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: > > > Pierre this is why I raised our true stochastic quantum natures You > might > > walk thru a wall tonight too. It just isn't very likely > > are you suggesting that by monitoring pulseaudio, I reduce the wave > packet, > like opening the cat's door? > Exactly. But don't forget to adjust expectations by taking "cat nature" into account :-) You can only influence and hope, never determine and fully control. A metaphor for the nature of reality. But we digress. > best regards, > -- > Pierre Frenkiel > >
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Wed, 3 Mar 2021, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: Pierre this is why I raised our true stochastic quantum natures You might walk thru a wall tonight too. It just isn't very likely are you suggesting that by monitoring pulseaudio, I reduce the wave packet, like opening the cat's door? best regards, -- Pierre Frenkiel
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Wed, Mar 3, 2021, 9:08 AM Pierre Frenkiel wrote: > On Wed, 3 Mar 2021, Greg Wooledge wrote: > > > OK, it's good that we can rule out some of the possible causes, like > > "permissions are wrong on /usr/bin" or "there's a cron job that > > deletes it every week". We're still left with a mystery, but it's > > slightly smaller now. > > actually, it's still a mystery, as I changed nothing in my configuration > and pulseaudio > no more disapears! > Pierre this is why I raised our true stochastic quantum natures ☺ You might walk thru a wall tonight too. It just isn't very likely best regards, > -- > Pierre Frenkiel > >
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Wed, 3 Mar 2021, Greg Wooledge wrote: OK, it's good that we can rule out some of the possible causes, like "permissions are wrong on /usr/bin" or "there's a cron job that deletes it every week". We're still left with a mystery, but it's slightly smaller now. actually, it's still a mystery, as I changed nothing in my configuration and pulseaudio no more disapears! best regards, -- Pierre Frenkiel
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
Pierre Frenkiel (pierre.frenk...@gmail.com) wrote:
> > ls -ld / /usr /usr/bin /usr/bin/pulseaudio
>
>drwxr-xr-x 39 root root 4096 Jul 13 2019 /
>drwxr-xr-x 12 root root 4096 Jul 7 2017 /usr
>drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 86016 Jul 7 2017 /usr/bin
>-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 95688 Aug 15 2019 /usr/bin/pulseaudio
> >
> > sudo grep -ri pulse /etc/crontab /etc/cron.* /var/spool/cron
>
>/var/spool/cron/crontabs/frenkiel:# 0-59/1 * * * * pulse-check >>
> ~frenkiel/log/pulse 2>&1
> >
> > find /lib/systemd /var/lib/systemd /etc/systemd -name '*.timer' \
> > -exec grep -i pulse /dev/null {} +
> >
> grep: /etc/systemd/system/timers.target.wants/phpsessionclean.timer: No such
> file or directory
OK, it's good that we can rule out some of the possible causes, like
"permissions are wrong on /usr/bin" or "there's a cron job that
deletes it every week". We're still left with a mystery, but it's
slightly smaller now.
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Mon, 1 Mar 2021, Greg Wooledge wrote:
ls -ld / /usr /usr/bin /usr/bin/pulseaudio
drwxr-xr-x 39 root root 4096 Jul 13 2019 /
drwxr-xr-x 12 root root 4096 Jul 7 2017 /usr
drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 86016 Jul 7 2017 /usr/bin
-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 95688 Aug 15 2019 /usr/bin/pulseaudio
sudo grep -ri pulse /etc/crontab /etc/cron.* /var/spool/cron
/var/spool/cron/crontabs/frenkiel:# 0-59/1 * * * * pulse-check >>
~frenkiel/log/pulse 2>&1
find /lib/systemd /var/lib/systemd /etc/systemd -name '*.timer' \
-exec grep -i pulse /dev/null {} +
grep: /etc/systemd/system/timers.target.wants/phpsessionclean.timer: No such
file or directory
If you can think of any other places from which an automatic or timed job
might run and do *ANYTHING AT ALL* involving pulseaudio, investigate it.
And then tell us what it was, how you investigated it, and what you
learned.
I found no other places involving pulseaudio.
Anyway, it didn't disapear since several days ...
thanks for tour help.
best regards,
--
Pierre Frenkiel
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
Pierre Frenkiel (pierre.frenk...@gmail.com) wrote:
> On Sun, 28 Feb 2021, mick crane wrote:
>
> > That is a bit weird. Is it an actual file and not a link ?
>
> it's a file. Since I re-enabled my monitoring, it didn't disappear.
> wait and see...
Have you done *any* basic, proactive analysis yet?
ls -ld / /usr /usr/bin /usr/bin/pulseaudio
sudo grep -ri pulse /etc/crontab /etc/cron.* /var/spool/cron
find /lib/systemd /var/lib/systemd /etc/systemd -name '*.timer' \
-exec grep -i pulse /dev/null {} +
The first one should give 4 lines of output. Show them.
The latter two don't give any output on my system. If they give anything
on yours, show it. And then investigate it. And then tell us what you
learned.
If you can think of any other places from which an automatic or timed job
might run and do *ANYTHING AT ALL* involving pulseaudio, investigate it.
And then tell us what it was, how you investigated it, and what you
learned.
Re: OT (was: Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day)
On Mon, Mar 1, 2021, 7:22 AM wrote: > On Sunday, February 28, 2021 10:16:34 PM Nicholas Geovanis wrote: > > Hint: You know you're getting old when you find your 2nd wife on dating > > sites > > I hope that is your 2nd ex-wife ;-) > Well of course "ex-wife". Do I look like a Mormon polygamist?? Do I like the Utah wilderness?? Polygamist is a Greek word FYI My 3rd grade teacher was Mormon... >
OT (was: Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day)
On Sunday, February 28, 2021 10:16:34 PM Nicholas Geovanis wrote: > Hint: You know you're getting old when you find your 2nd wife on dating > sites I hope that is your 2nd ex-wife ;-)
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Sun, 28 Feb 2021, mick crane wrote: That is a bit weird. Is it an actual file and not a link ? it's a file. Since I re-enabled my monitoring, it didn't disappear. wait and see... best regards, -- Pierre Frenkiel
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Wed, Feb 24, 2021, 12:05 PM Pierre Frenkiel wrote: > On Wed, 24 Feb 2021, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: > > > In Schrödinger's Equation of quantum physics, "in practice, the square of > > the absolute value of the wave function at each point is taken to define > a > > probability density function". > > the situation is rather complex now, after the experiments following > the Bell's inequalities. > For example, a lot of people think now that in the Schrodinger's cat > experiment, the cat is actually alive or dead, before anybody open the > door. > But of course death is invariant to physics. In fact it makes the physics clearer without altering it in any way. Yet your pulseaudio has disappeared again. So it must result from human activity. The question remains, which human? You or others? ☺ Hint: You know you're getting old when you find your 2nd wife on dating sites best regards, > -- > Pierre Frenkiel
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On 2021-02-28 11:31, Pierre Frenkiel wrote: On Tue, 23 Feb 2021, David Wright wrote: Is this buster? yes Are you running any applications, particularly those involving sound, as root, particularly in response to some previous problem? no Is it just that binary that goes missing, or does apt/dpkg actually show that the entire package is uninstalled? The pulseaudio package contains about 216 files. Have they all gone, or just the one binary? (Run $ dpkg -L pulseaudio to list them.) I can answer today, as /usr/bin/pulseaudio was not there this morning: It's the only missing files. All other files of the package are still there. I'll enable again my monitoring every minute, hoping that observing a process will not modify it, as in quantum physics. best regards, That is a bit weird. Is it an actual file and not a link ? mick -- Key ID4BFEBB31
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Tue, 23 Feb 2021, David Wright wrote: Is this buster? yes Are you running any applications, particularly those involving sound, as root, particularly in response to some previous problem? no Is it just that binary that goes missing, or does apt/dpkg actually show that the entire package is uninstalled? The pulseaudio package contains about 216 files. Have they all gone, or just the one binary? (Run $ dpkg -L pulseaudio to list them.) I can answer today, as /usr/bin/pulseaudio was not there this morning: It's the only missing files. All other files of the package are still there. I'll enable again my monitoring every minute, hoping that observing a process will not modify it, as in quantum physics. best regards, -- Pierre Frenkiel
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Wed, 24 Feb 2021, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: In Schrödinger's Equation of quantum physics, "in practice, the square of the absolute value of the wave function at each point is taken to define a probability density function". the situation is rather complex now, after the experiments following the Bell's inequalities. For example, a lot of people think now that in the Schrodinger's cat experiment, the cat is actually alive or dead, before anybody open the door. best regards, -- Pierre Frenkiel
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Wed, Feb 24, 2021, 10:16 AM Nicholas Geovanis wrote: > On Wed, Feb 24, 2021, 7:57 AM Pierre Frenkiel > wrote: > >> On Wed, 24 Feb 2021, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: >> >> > Quantum physics principles manifest in software, seen it before. The >> closer >> > you look, the more dice you have to roll >> > >> but according Einstein, God doesn't play dice >> it seems he was wrong, this time >> > > But of course Einstein said that in response to the work of Heisenberg and > Bohr. Which was also quite experimental as well as theoretical. Probability > is predictive at the sub-atomic level. > In Schrödinger's Equation of quantum physics, "in practice, the square of the absolute value of the wave function at each point is taken to define a probability density function". best regards, >> -- >> Pierre Frenkiel >> >
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Wed, Feb 24, 2021, 7:57 AM Pierre Frenkiel wrote: > On Wed, 24 Feb 2021, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: > > > Quantum physics principles manifest in software, seen it before. The > closer > > you look, the more dice you have to roll > > > but according Einstein, God doesn't play dice > it seems he was wrong, this time > But of course Einstein said that in response to the work of Heisenberg and Bohr. Which was also quite experimental as well as theoretical. Probability is predictive at the sub-atomic level. best regards, > -- > Pierre Frenkiel > >
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Wed, 24 Feb 2021, Dan Ritter wrote: Your best bet there is alsa with apulse to pretend that it's PulseAudio. the main difference is that it took 15 seconds to install pulseaudio and make it to work, and after 15 minutes of fight, I'm unable to make apulse to work I don't see why I should waste time to to replace a working solution by a non-working one. PS: now, I don't need to re-install. I cross fingers. best regards, -- Pierre Frenkiel
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Wed, 24 Feb 2021, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: Quantum physics principles manifest in software, seen it before. The closer you look, the more dice you have to roll but according Einstein, God doesn't play dice it seems he was wrong, this time best regards, -- Pierre Frenkiel
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
Pierre Frenkiel wrote: > On Tue, 23 Feb 2021, Dan Ritter wrote: > > > Could be an option. What do you need pulseaudio for that > > isn't handled by alsa, jack and/or apulse? > > it's needed to have sound on youtube. > I tried your other suggestions a long time ago, and could not make them to > work. > I'll try again today Your best bet there is alsa with apulse to pretend that it's PulseAudio. -dsr-
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
> > > I can't answer that now, because I run > "ls -l /usr/bin/pulseaudio" every minute to find when it disappears, > and curiously, it didn't disappear this night > I'll see what happens after removing the ls command in cron. > You could use ``inotify-tools`` https://packages.debian.org/en/buster/inotify-tools They are based on kernel inotify api: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inotify
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Wed, Feb 24, 2021, 3:18 AM Pierre Frenkiel wrote: > > I can't answer that now, because I run > "ls -l /usr/bin/pulseaudio" every minute to find when it disappears, > and curiously, it didn't disappear this night > Quantum physics principles manifest in software, seen it before. The closer you look, the more dice you have to roll ☺ I'll see what happens after removing the ls command in cron. > > best regards, > -- > Pierre Frenkiel > >
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Tue, 23 Feb 2021, David Wright wrote: Is this buster? yes Are you running any applications, particularly those involving sound, as root, particularly in response to some previous problem? no Is it just that binary that goes missing, or does apt/dpkg actually show that the entire package is uninstalled? I can't answer that now, because I run "ls -l /usr/bin/pulseaudio" every minute to find when it disappears, and curiously, it didn't disappear this night I'll see what happens after removing the ls command in cron. best regards, -- Pierre Frenkiel
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Tue, 23 Feb 2021, Dan Ritter wrote: Could be an option. What do you need pulseaudio for that isn't handled by alsa, jack and/or apulse? it's needed to have sound on youtube. I tried your other suggestions a long time ago, and could not make them to work. I'll try again today best regards, -- Pierre Frenkiel
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Tue, Feb 23, 2021, 3:13 PM Dan Ritter wrote: > Pierre Frenkiel wrote: > > On Tue, 23 Feb 2021, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: > > > > > Patient: Doctor when I move my arm this way, it hurts. > > > Doctor: Don't do that with your arm. Next! > > > > very funny, but I don't see how it is related to my pulseaudio problem, > > unless you suggest to don't use it ! > > Could be an option. What do you need pulseaudio for that > isn't handled by alsa, jack and/or apulse? > And one reason I interjected that is dealing with software sound synthesis and learning that whole sectors recommend ALSA and jack to the exclusion of others. Often not just a recommendation but a requirement. I dont have an axe to grind on that, just that's what "they tell me". -dsr- > >
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
Pierre Frenkiel wrote: > On Tue, 23 Feb 2021, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: > > > Patient: Doctor when I move my arm this way, it hurts. > > Doctor: Don't do that with your arm. Next! > > very funny, but I don't see how it is related to my pulseaudio problem, > unless you suggest to don't use it ! Could be an option. What do you need pulseaudio for that isn't handled by alsa, jack and/or apulse? -dsr-
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Tue, 23 Feb 2021, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: Patient: Doctor when I move my arm this way, it hurts. Doctor: Don't do that with your arm. Next! very funny, but I don't see how it is related to my pulseaudio problem, unless you suggest to don't use it ! best regards, -- Pierre Frenkiel
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Tue, 23 Feb 2021, David Wright wrote: When did this start to happen? . for years? . since installation? Is this buster? Are you running any applications, particularly those involving sound, as root, particularly in response to some previous problem? Is it just that binary that goes missing, or does apt/dpkg actually show that the entire package is uninstalled? The pulseaudio package contains about 216 files. Have they all gone, or just the one binary? (Run $ dpkg -L pulseaudio to list them.) hi David, I'll answer to-morrow. Meantime, may-be my every minute check will have given some usefull information best regards, -- Pierre Frenkiel
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Tue 23 Feb 2021 at 09:38:08 (+0100), Pierre Frenkiel wrote: > every morning, ls /usr/bin/pulseaudio gives: > ls: cannot access '/usr/bin/pulseaudio': No such file or directory > and I must issue "aptitude reinstall pulseaudio" I plan to put the ls > command every minute to find when it disappears, > unless somebody can give me an axplanation (and a fix...) When did this start to happen? . for years? . since installation? Is this buster? Are you running any applications, particularly those involving sound, as root, particularly in response to some previous problem? Is it just that binary that goes missing, or does apt/dpkg actually show that the entire package is uninstalled? The pulseaudio package contains about 216 files. Have they all gone, or just the one binary? (Run $ dpkg -L pulseaudio to list them.) Cheers, David.
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
Patient: Doctor when I move my arm this way, it hurts. Doctor: Don't do that with your arm. Next! ☺ On Tue, Feb 23, 2021, 7:09 AM wrote: > On Tue, Feb 23, 2021 at 01:40:22PM +0100, Nicolas George wrote: > > Greg Wooledge (12021-02-23): > > > This *is* part of the diagnostics. Preventing the deletion and then > > > watching the logs to see who complains may help you pinpoint the > > > culprit. Or it may not. But it's worth a try. > > > > Watching the logs was not in the advice. With that addition, the advice > > is reasonable. Without, it was terrible, as was "changing the disk". > > [META] we are in violent agreement. Instead of saying "DON'T DO THIS", > I'd humbly propose to enhance that advice, then :) > > Cheers > - t >
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Tue, Feb 23, 2021 at 01:40:22PM +0100, Nicolas George wrote: > Greg Wooledge (12021-02-23): > > This *is* part of the diagnostics. Preventing the deletion and then > > watching the logs to see who complains may help you pinpoint the > > culprit. Or it may not. But it's worth a try. > > Watching the logs was not in the advice. With that addition, the advice > is reasonable. Without, it was terrible, as was "changing the disk". [META] we are in violent agreement. Instead of saying "DON'T DO THIS", I'd humbly propose to enhance that advice, then :) Cheers - t signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Tue, Feb 23, 2021 at 01:07:10PM +0100, Nicolas George wrote: > fm+deb+u...@phosphorusnetworks.com (12021-02-23): > > maybe change your disk, but for now, try: > > > > # chattr +i /usr/bin/pulseaudio > > > > and see if it continues disappearing. > > And if somebody has an ache somewhere, they should just take > painkillers? > > Fixing the symptom without understanding the issue is rarely a good > idea, especially with an unsubtle heavy handed measure. That's why I proposed looking into the logs. I've used it like this as a diagnostic device. Cheers - t signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
Greg Wooledge (12021-02-23): > This *is* part of the diagnostics. Preventing the deletion and then > watching the logs to see who complains may help you pinpoint the > culprit. Or it may not. But it's worth a try. Watching the logs was not in the advice. With that addition, the advice is reasonable. Without, it was terrible, as was "changing the disk". Regards, -- Nicolas George signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
Nicolas George (geo...@nsup.org) wrote: > fm+deb+u...@phosphorusnetworks.com (12021-02-23): > > maybe change your disk, but for now, try: > > > > # chattr +i /usr/bin/pulseaudio > > > > and see if it continues disappearing. > > And if somebody has an ache somewhere, they should just take > painkillers? > > Fixing the symptom without understanding the issue is rarely a good > idea, especially with an unsubtle heavy handed measure. This *is* part of the diagnostics. Preventing the deletion and then watching the logs to see who complains may help you pinpoint the culprit. Or it may not. But it's worth a try. What's your better idea? Don't just bad-mouth other people's suggestions if you have none of your own. Other suggestions I might make would include: ls -ld /usr/bin /usr/bin/pulseaudio # (before the deletion) If it turns out the permissions on /usr/bin are incorrect, that's a thing you'll want to fix immediately.
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
fm+deb+u...@phosphorusnetworks.com (12021-02-23): > maybe change your disk, but for now, try: > > # chattr +i /usr/bin/pulseaudio > > and see if it continues disappearing. And if somebody has an ache somewhere, they should just take painkillers? Fixing the symptom without understanding the issue is rarely a good idea, especially with an unsubtle heavy handed measure. Regards, -- Nicolas George signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
On Tue, Feb 23, 2021 at 08:37:34AM -0300, fm+deb+u...@phosphorusnetworks.com wrote: [...] > maybe change your disk, but for now, try: > > # chattr +i /usr/bin/pulseaudio > > and see if it continues disappearing. And watch your log files. Perhaps you catch the perpetrator whining loudly that it can't delete that file. Cheers - t signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: need to reinstall pulseaudio every day
> >hi, >the problem is exactly what says my subject. >every morning, ls /usr/bin/pulseaudio gives: > ls: cannot access '/usr/bin/pulseaudio': No such file or directory >and I must issue "aptitude reinstall pulseaudio" >I plan to put the ls command every minute to find when it disappears, >unless somebody can give me an axplanation (and a fix...) > >best regards, >-- >Pierre Frenkiel > > maybe change your disk, but for now, try: # chattr +i /usr/bin/pulseaudio and see if it continues disappearing. Regards, Fabio Martins GPG: 0xCC59C123 Fingerprint: D06E 24DE 2A72 1BB3 A1A0 C790 E51E 33C4 CC59 C123 PHOSPHORUS NETWORKS https://phosphorusnetworks.com/
