Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
Hi Elric and all, First, I look both ways before I cross the street. Second, thank you (seriously) for considering my mental health :) This is likely the most common (xkcd 2347!) issue in FOSS projects, so... we're like everyone else. Gary On Sun, Jun 16, 2024 at 6:18 PM Elric V wrote: > > On 12/06/2024 15:45, Gary D. Gregory wrote: > > ## Community Health: > > > Regarding community health: please don't take this the wrong way, but it > feels like Gary is doing A LOT of the heavy lifting on all of the > commons projects. What happens if Gary is hit by a bus? Would the > commons community still be able to function? The XZ Utils backdoor > incident was a consequence of the main maintainer burning out, hopefully > a healthy community can help prevent such issues here. > > Is there anything the community can do to pitch in a bit more? Aside > from the obvious things like contributing bugfixes and tests etc. > > - Elric > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
On 12/06/2024 15:45, Gary D. Gregory wrote: ## Community Health: Regarding community health: please don't take this the wrong way, but it feels like Gary is doing A LOT of the heavy lifting on all of the commons projects. What happens if Gary is hit by a bus? Would the commons community still be able to function? The XZ Utils backdoor incident was a consequence of the main maintainer burning out, hopefully a healthy community can help prevent such issues here. Is there anything the community can do to pitch in a bit more? Aside from the obvious things like contributing bugfixes and tests etc. - Elric - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
Note that moving the dependabot PR emails to a different list (if it's even possible) is only part of the problem. Applying the PR generates a message to the commits list (which cannot safely be dropped) as well as a message closing the PR. On Sat, 15 Jun 2024 at 21:03, Phil Steitz wrote: > > On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 12:27 PM Gary Gregory > wrote: > > > Hm, would using GitHub Issues instead of Jira make the trail following > > easier, harder, or the same? > > > > Harder, because then you would have to search yet another place to > reconstruct history. But that would be less of an issue over time. I > don't see how it would make it better. What bugs me is not so much having > to look in multiple places as the degraded discussion. We never had > "roadblocks" before - just a convention that we use the dev list to talk > about substantive issues. JIRA (or Bugzilla or Github Issues or > ) is for users to report bugs, ask for enhancements, > organize work, mark things as done. etc. commits@, github PR review, > next_cool_review_board is to enable review of proposed or committed code. > The ML is for discussion. Trying to force all discussion into PR "threads" > has two big problems: 0) it lacks threading and unless we just drop dev@ it > fragments discussion 1) it causes things to be discussed late. It works > great for trivial changes but for things that significantly change > performance or behavior or where there are a lot of different ways they > could be done, it is way better to actually talk about them rather than > just hack a PR and try to collectively mutate it into something acceptable. > > Phil > > > > > Gary > > > > On Sat, Jun 15, 2024, 2:58 PM Gary Gregory > > wrote: > > > > > If we want to have everything recorded in one place, then we need to put > > > up some roadblocks to PRs, the Wiki, and Jira like ... what? Have a PR, > > > wiki, and Jira template/gate that says... you must discuss your > > > issue/bug/feature first on the mailing list? It does not feel workable. > > > > > > I don't think this is about people being dinosaurs, it's just the > > > technology and processes that are changing. I really like working with > > > GitHub PRs and GitHub CI builds. I don't want to go back to emails only > > > just like don't ever want to use an IRC thing. > > > > > > Some people don't want to create a GitHub account, so it's Jira and diff > > > files for them, but that's rare. BUT it gives us a LOT MORE work to > > > validate a patch compared to GitHub CI where it can use many OSs and Java > > > version while I'm sleeping :-) > > > > > > Gary > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Jun 15, 2024, 2:00 PM Phil Steitz wrote: > > > > > >> On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 10:19 AM Gary Gregory > > >> wrote: > > >> > > >> > Note that it is 1) awkward to say "Let's stop talking about this PR in > > >> > this PR" > > >> > > >> > > >> Funny we used to do that all the time in Jira comments. I guess times > > >> change. FWIW, I think it is a step backward in discussion and > > ultimately > > >> code and archive quality. To me it is "awkward" to have to be > > constantly > > >> @somebody and not have threads or definitive discussion anywhere. Works > > >> fine for trivial changes but does not really work for substantive > > >> discussion of bigger things. So we end up never actually having those > > >> discussions and there is no reasonably searchable archive of the thought > > >> process that led to the changes going in. We used to have that and it > > was > > >> a useful thing, especially for the more complex components. > > >> > > >> Phil > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > and 2) "You need to subscribe to a mailing to continue this > > >> > chat." It's just hard to find when to ask for a switch. Especially > > >> > when GH has a nice UI to make comments _about code_. Over at Log4j, we > > >> > now use GitHub issues instead of Jira, furthering the split... > > >> > > > >> > Gary > > >> > > > >> > On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 12:38 PM Phil Steitz > > >> > wrote: > > >> > > > > >> > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 10:58 AM Gary D. Gregory < > > ggreg...@apache.org > > >> > > > >> > > wrote: > > >> > > > > >> > > > On 2024/06/12 17:17:24 Phil Steitz wrote: > > >> > > > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 7:27 AM sebb wrote: > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > On Wed, 12 Jun 2024 at 14:45, Gary D. Gregory < > > >> ggreg...@apache.org > > >> > > > > >> > > > wrote: > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Hello All, > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on > > >> > submitting > > >> > > > in a > > >> > > > > > day or so, feedback is welcome. > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > ## Description: > > >> > > > > > > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and > > maintenance > > >> of > > >> > Java > > >> > > > > > focused > > >> > > > > > > reusable libraries and components > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > ## Project Status: > > >> > > > > > > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 12:27 PM Gary Gregory wrote: > Hm, would using GitHub Issues instead of Jira make the trail following > easier, harder, or the same? > Harder, because then you would have to search yet another place to reconstruct history. But that would be less of an issue over time. I don't see how it would make it better. What bugs me is not so much having to look in multiple places as the degraded discussion. We never had "roadblocks" before - just a convention that we use the dev list to talk about substantive issues. JIRA (or Bugzilla or Github Issues or ) is for users to report bugs, ask for enhancements, organize work, mark things as done. etc. commits@, github PR review, next_cool_review_board is to enable review of proposed or committed code. The ML is for discussion. Trying to force all discussion into PR "threads" has two big problems: 0) it lacks threading and unless we just drop dev@ it fragments discussion 1) it causes things to be discussed late. It works great for trivial changes but for things that significantly change performance or behavior or where there are a lot of different ways they could be done, it is way better to actually talk about them rather than just hack a PR and try to collectively mutate it into something acceptable. Phil > > Gary > > On Sat, Jun 15, 2024, 2:58 PM Gary Gregory > wrote: > > > If we want to have everything recorded in one place, then we need to put > > up some roadblocks to PRs, the Wiki, and Jira like ... what? Have a PR, > > wiki, and Jira template/gate that says... you must discuss your > > issue/bug/feature first on the mailing list? It does not feel workable. > > > > I don't think this is about people being dinosaurs, it's just the > > technology and processes that are changing. I really like working with > > GitHub PRs and GitHub CI builds. I don't want to go back to emails only > > just like don't ever want to use an IRC thing. > > > > Some people don't want to create a GitHub account, so it's Jira and diff > > files for them, but that's rare. BUT it gives us a LOT MORE work to > > validate a patch compared to GitHub CI where it can use many OSs and Java > > version while I'm sleeping :-) > > > > Gary > > > > > > On Sat, Jun 15, 2024, 2:00 PM Phil Steitz wrote: > > > >> On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 10:19 AM Gary Gregory > >> wrote: > >> > >> > Note that it is 1) awkward to say "Let's stop talking about this PR in > >> > this PR" > >> > >> > >> Funny we used to do that all the time in Jira comments. I guess times > >> change. FWIW, I think it is a step backward in discussion and > ultimately > >> code and archive quality. To me it is "awkward" to have to be > constantly > >> @somebody and not have threads or definitive discussion anywhere. Works > >> fine for trivial changes but does not really work for substantive > >> discussion of bigger things. So we end up never actually having those > >> discussions and there is no reasonably searchable archive of the thought > >> process that led to the changes going in. We used to have that and it > was > >> a useful thing, especially for the more complex components. > >> > >> Phil > >> > >> > >> > >> > and 2) "You need to subscribe to a mailing to continue this > >> > chat." It's just hard to find when to ask for a switch. Especially > >> > when GH has a nice UI to make comments _about code_. Over at Log4j, we > >> > now use GitHub issues instead of Jira, furthering the split... > >> > > >> > Gary > >> > > >> > On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 12:38 PM Phil Steitz > >> > wrote: > >> > > > >> > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 10:58 AM Gary D. Gregory < > ggreg...@apache.org > >> > > >> > > wrote: > >> > > > >> > > > On 2024/06/12 17:17:24 Phil Steitz wrote: > >> > > > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 7:27 AM sebb wrote: > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > On Wed, 12 Jun 2024 at 14:45, Gary D. Gregory < > >> ggreg...@apache.org > >> > > > >> > > > wrote: > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Hello All, > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on > >> > submitting > >> > > > in a > >> > > > > > day or so, feedback is welcome. > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > ## Description: > >> > > > > > > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and > maintenance > >> of > >> > Java > >> > > > > > focused > >> > > > > > > reusable libraries and components > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > ## Project Status: > >> > > > > > > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. > >> > > > > > > Issues for the board: none. > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > ## Membership Data: > >> > > > > > > Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) > >> > > > > > > There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in > this > >> > > > project. > >> > > > > > > The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > Missing from this paragraph is the fact that Commons has > enabled > >> > > > > > universal commit. > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Community changes,
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
Hm, would using GitHub Issues instead of Jira make the trail following easier, harder, or the same? Gary On Sat, Jun 15, 2024, 2:58 PM Gary Gregory wrote: > If we want to have everything recorded in one place, then we need to put > up some roadblocks to PRs, the Wiki, and Jira like ... what? Have a PR, > wiki, and Jira template/gate that says... you must discuss your > issue/bug/feature first on the mailing list? It does not feel workable. > > I don't think this is about people being dinosaurs, it's just the > technology and processes that are changing. I really like working with > GitHub PRs and GitHub CI builds. I don't want to go back to emails only > just like don't ever want to use an IRC thing. > > Some people don't want to create a GitHub account, so it's Jira and diff > files for them, but that's rare. BUT it gives us a LOT MORE work to > validate a patch compared to GitHub CI where it can use many OSs and Java > version while I'm sleeping :-) > > Gary > > > On Sat, Jun 15, 2024, 2:00 PM Phil Steitz wrote: > >> On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 10:19 AM Gary Gregory >> wrote: >> >> > Note that it is 1) awkward to say "Let's stop talking about this PR in >> > this PR" >> >> >> Funny we used to do that all the time in Jira comments. I guess times >> change. FWIW, I think it is a step backward in discussion and ultimately >> code and archive quality. To me it is "awkward" to have to be constantly >> @somebody and not have threads or definitive discussion anywhere. Works >> fine for trivial changes but does not really work for substantive >> discussion of bigger things. So we end up never actually having those >> discussions and there is no reasonably searchable archive of the thought >> process that led to the changes going in. We used to have that and it was >> a useful thing, especially for the more complex components. >> >> Phil >> >> >> >> > and 2) "You need to subscribe to a mailing to continue this >> > chat." It's just hard to find when to ask for a switch. Especially >> > when GH has a nice UI to make comments _about code_. Over at Log4j, we >> > now use GitHub issues instead of Jira, furthering the split... >> > >> > Gary >> > >> > On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 12:38 PM Phil Steitz >> > wrote: >> > > >> > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 10:58 AM Gary D. Gregory > > >> > > wrote: >> > > >> > > > On 2024/06/12 17:17:24 Phil Steitz wrote: >> > > > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 7:27 AM sebb wrote: >> > > > > >> > > > > > On Wed, 12 Jun 2024 at 14:45, Gary D. Gregory < >> ggreg...@apache.org >> > > >> > > > wrote: >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Hello All, >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on >> > submitting >> > > > in a >> > > > > > day or so, feedback is welcome. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > ## Description: >> > > > > > > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and maintenance >> of >> > Java >> > > > > > focused >> > > > > > > reusable libraries and components >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > ## Project Status: >> > > > > > > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. >> > > > > > > Issues for the board: none. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > ## Membership Data: >> > > > > > > Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) >> > > > > > > There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in this >> > > > project. >> > > > > > > The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. >> > > > > > >> > > > > > Missing from this paragraph is the fact that Commons has enabled >> > > > > > universal commit. >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Community changes, past quarter: >> > > > > > > - Claude Warren was added to the PMC on 2024-03-22 >> > > > > > > - No new committers. Last addition was Claude Warren on >> > 2022-02-01. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > ## Project Activity: >> > > > > > > Many releases of our components: >> > > > > > > CONFIGUATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. >> > > > > > >> > > > > > Is that a new component? >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. >> > > > > > > PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. >> > > > > > > JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. >> > > > > > > NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. >> > > > > > > VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. >> > > > > > > JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. >> > > > > > > DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. >> > > > > > > CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. >> > > > > > > COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. >> > > > > > > LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. >> > > > > > > PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. >> > > > > > > CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. >> > > > > > > RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. >> > > > > > > CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. >> > > > > > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. >> > > > > > > TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. >> > > > > > > BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. >>
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
If we want to have everything recorded in one place, then we need to put up some roadblocks to PRs, the Wiki, and Jira like ... what? Have a PR, wiki, and Jira template/gate that says... you must discuss your issue/bug/feature first on the mailing list? It does not feel workable. I don't think this is about people being dinosaurs, it's just the technology and processes that are changing. I really like working with GitHub PRs and GitHub CI builds. I don't want to go back to emails only just like don't ever want to use an IRC thing. Some people don't want to create a GitHub account, so it's Jira and diff files for them, but that's rare. BUT it gives us a LOT MORE work to validate a patch compared to GitHub CI where it can use many OSs and Java version while I'm sleeping :-) Gary On Sat, Jun 15, 2024, 2:00 PM Phil Steitz wrote: > On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 10:19 AM Gary Gregory > wrote: > > > Note that it is 1) awkward to say "Let's stop talking about this PR in > > this PR" > > > Funny we used to do that all the time in Jira comments. I guess times > change. FWIW, I think it is a step backward in discussion and ultimately > code and archive quality. To me it is "awkward" to have to be constantly > @somebody and not have threads or definitive discussion anywhere. Works > fine for trivial changes but does not really work for substantive > discussion of bigger things. So we end up never actually having those > discussions and there is no reasonably searchable archive of the thought > process that led to the changes going in. We used to have that and it was > a useful thing, especially for the more complex components. > > Phil > > > > > and 2) "You need to subscribe to a mailing to continue this > > chat." It's just hard to find when to ask for a switch. Especially > > when GH has a nice UI to make comments _about code_. Over at Log4j, we > > now use GitHub issues instead of Jira, furthering the split... > > > > Gary > > > > On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 12:38 PM Phil Steitz > > wrote: > > > > > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 10:58 AM Gary D. Gregory > > > wrote: > > > > > > > On 2024/06/12 17:17:24 Phil Steitz wrote: > > > > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 7:27 AM sebb wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, 12 Jun 2024 at 14:45, Gary D. Gregory < > ggreg...@apache.org > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on > > submitting > > > > in a > > > > > > day or so, feedback is welcome. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ## Description: > > > > > > > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and maintenance > of > > Java > > > > > > focused > > > > > > > reusable libraries and components > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ## Project Status: > > > > > > > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. > > > > > > > Issues for the board: none. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ## Membership Data: > > > > > > > Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) > > > > > > > There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in this > > > > project. > > > > > > > The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. > > > > > > > > > > > > Missing from this paragraph is the fact that Commons has enabled > > > > > > universal commit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Community changes, past quarter: > > > > > > > - Claude Warren was added to the PMC on 2024-03-22 > > > > > > > - No new committers. Last addition was Claude Warren on > > 2022-02-01. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ## Project Activity: > > > > > > > Many releases of our components: > > > > > > > CONFIGUATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > > > > > > > > > > Is that a new component? > > > > > > > > > > > > > NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > > > > > PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > > > > > JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. > > > > > > > NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. > > > > > > > VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. > > > > > > > JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. > > > > > > > DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. > > > > > > > CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. > > > > > > > COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. > > > > > > > LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. > > > > > > > PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. > > > > > > > CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. > > > > > > > RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. > > > > > > > CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. > > > > > > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. > > > > > > > TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. > > > > > > > BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. > > > > > > > IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. > > > > > > > COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. > > > > > > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. > > > > > > > PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. > > > > > > > IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-0
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 10:19 AM Gary Gregory wrote: > Note that it is 1) awkward to say "Let's stop talking about this PR in > this PR" Funny we used to do that all the time in Jira comments. I guess times change. FWIW, I think it is a step backward in discussion and ultimately code and archive quality. To me it is "awkward" to have to be constantly @somebody and not have threads or definitive discussion anywhere. Works fine for trivial changes but does not really work for substantive discussion of bigger things. So we end up never actually having those discussions and there is no reasonably searchable archive of the thought process that led to the changes going in. We used to have that and it was a useful thing, especially for the more complex components. Phil > and 2) "You need to subscribe to a mailing to continue this > chat." It's just hard to find when to ask for a switch. Especially > when GH has a nice UI to make comments _about code_. Over at Log4j, we > now use GitHub issues instead of Jira, furthering the split... > > Gary > > On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 12:38 PM Phil Steitz > wrote: > > > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 10:58 AM Gary D. Gregory > > wrote: > > > > > On 2024/06/12 17:17:24 Phil Steitz wrote: > > > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 7:27 AM sebb wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Wed, 12 Jun 2024 at 14:45, Gary D. Gregory > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > > > > > > > > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on > submitting > > > in a > > > > > day or so, feedback is welcome. > > > > > > > > > > > > ## Description: > > > > > > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and maintenance of > Java > > > > > focused > > > > > > reusable libraries and components > > > > > > > > > > > > ## Project Status: > > > > > > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. > > > > > > Issues for the board: none. > > > > > > > > > > > > ## Membership Data: > > > > > > Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) > > > > > > There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in this > > > project. > > > > > > The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. > > > > > > > > > > Missing from this paragraph is the fact that Commons has enabled > > > > > universal commit. > > > > > > > > > > > Community changes, past quarter: > > > > > > - Claude Warren was added to the PMC on 2024-03-22 > > > > > > - No new committers. Last addition was Claude Warren on > 2022-02-01. > > > > > > > > > > > > ## Project Activity: > > > > > > Many releases of our components: > > > > > > CONFIGUATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > > > > > > > > Is that a new component? > > > > > > > > > > > NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > > > > PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > > > > JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. > > > > > > NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. > > > > > > VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. > > > > > > JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. > > > > > > DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. > > > > > > CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. > > > > > > COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. > > > > > > LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. > > > > > > PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. > > > > > > CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. > > > > > > RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. > > > > > > CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. > > > > > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. > > > > > > TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. > > > > > > BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. > > > > > > IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. > > > > > > COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. > > > > > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. > > > > > > PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. > > > > > > IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-03-28. > > > > > > LOGGING-1.3.1 was released on 2024-03-24. > > > > > > PARENT-68 was released on 2024-03-23. > > > > > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.1 was released on 2024-03-20. > > > > > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.0 was released on 2024-03-13. > > > > > > > > > > The above list should probably be sorted > > > > > > > > > > > ## Community Health: > > > > > > We welcomed Claude Warren as our latest PMC member. Mailing list > > > > > activity has > > > > > > increased. > > > > > > > > > > Much of the increased mailing list activity is driven by dependabot > > > > > PRs, many of which are useless, as it does not take Java > compatibility > > > > > into account. > > > > > > > > > > > > > +1 > > > > I have had to filter out most of the messages and once I do that, > there > > > is > > > > almost no actual discussion on-list. I am worried that when people > do > > > try > > > > to start discussion, the messages are being missed. I personally > see the > > > > lack of ml discussion as a problem. Lots of code changes are > happening > > > > with no d
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
Note that it is 1) awkward to say "Let's stop talking about this PR in this PR" and 2) "You need to subscribe to a mailing to continue this chat." It's just hard to find when to ask for a switch. Especially when GH has a nice UI to make comments _about code_. Over at Log4j, we now use GitHub issues instead of Jira, furthering the split... Gary On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 12:38 PM Phil Steitz wrote: > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 10:58 AM Gary D. Gregory > wrote: > > > On 2024/06/12 17:17:24 Phil Steitz wrote: > > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 7:27 AM sebb wrote: > > > > > > > On Wed, 12 Jun 2024 at 14:45, Gary D. Gregory > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > > > > > > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on submitting > > in a > > > > day or so, feedback is welcome. > > > > > > > > > > ## Description: > > > > > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and maintenance of Java > > > > focused > > > > > reusable libraries and components > > > > > > > > > > ## Project Status: > > > > > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. > > > > > Issues for the board: none. > > > > > > > > > > ## Membership Data: > > > > > Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) > > > > > There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in this > > project. > > > > > The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. > > > > > > > > Missing from this paragraph is the fact that Commons has enabled > > > > universal commit. > > > > > > > > > Community changes, past quarter: > > > > > - Claude Warren was added to the PMC on 2024-03-22 > > > > > - No new committers. Last addition was Claude Warren on 2022-02-01. > > > > > > > > > > ## Project Activity: > > > > > Many releases of our components: > > > > > CONFIGUATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > > > > > > Is that a new component? > > > > > > > > > NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > > > PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > > > JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. > > > > > NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. > > > > > VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. > > > > > JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. > > > > > DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. > > > > > CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. > > > > > COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. > > > > > LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. > > > > > PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. > > > > > CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. > > > > > RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. > > > > > CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. > > > > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. > > > > > TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. > > > > > BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. > > > > > IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. > > > > > COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. > > > > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. > > > > > PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. > > > > > IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-03-28. > > > > > LOGGING-1.3.1 was released on 2024-03-24. > > > > > PARENT-68 was released on 2024-03-23. > > > > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.1 was released on 2024-03-20. > > > > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.0 was released on 2024-03-13. > > > > > > > > The above list should probably be sorted > > > > > > > > > ## Community Health: > > > > > We welcomed Claude Warren as our latest PMC member. Mailing list > > > > activity has > > > > > increased. > > > > > > > > Much of the increased mailing list activity is driven by dependabot > > > > PRs, many of which are useless, as it does not take Java compatibility > > > > into account. > > > > > > > > > > +1 > > > I have had to filter out most of the messages and once I do that, there > > is > > > almost no actual discussion on-list. I am worried that when people do > > try > > > to start discussion, the messages are being missed. I personally see the > > > lack of ml discussion as a problem. Lots of code changes are happening > > > with no discussion, other than maybe random nits on PRs ending up in > > github > > > threads that don't end up organized that well in list archives. This > > > problem is not unique to Commons. > > > > Hi Phil, > > > > We had a discussion a while back about creating a "bot" email list but: > > - no one actually proposed anything concrete and did any work > > - we already have bot lists like "commit", "notifications", "issues", > > can't we reuse those? > > > > +1 for that. How about moving the dependabot things to "notifications"? > What exactly do we use that list for now? I think it is important for > committers to monitor commits but that is not really possible with all of > the dependabot spam in there. I personally filter that to /dev/null. > > The problem with github PR comments basically replacing dev@ is a bigger > one. It would be helpful if we could figure out a way to pipe (only) the > code discussion
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 10:58 AM Gary D. Gregory wrote: > On 2024/06/12 17:17:24 Phil Steitz wrote: > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 7:27 AM sebb wrote: > > > > > On Wed, 12 Jun 2024 at 14:45, Gary D. Gregory > wrote: > > > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > > > > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on submitting > in a > > > day or so, feedback is welcome. > > > > > > > > ## Description: > > > > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and maintenance of Java > > > focused > > > > reusable libraries and components > > > > > > > > ## Project Status: > > > > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. > > > > Issues for the board: none. > > > > > > > > ## Membership Data: > > > > Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) > > > > There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in this > project. > > > > The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. > > > > > > Missing from this paragraph is the fact that Commons has enabled > > > universal commit. > > > > > > > Community changes, past quarter: > > > > - Claude Warren was added to the PMC on 2024-03-22 > > > > - No new committers. Last addition was Claude Warren on 2022-02-01. > > > > > > > > ## Project Activity: > > > > Many releases of our components: > > > > CONFIGUATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > > > > Is that a new component? > > > > > > > NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > > PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > > JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. > > > > NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. > > > > VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. > > > > JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. > > > > DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. > > > > CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. > > > > COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. > > > > LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. > > > > PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. > > > > CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. > > > > RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. > > > > CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. > > > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. > > > > TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. > > > > BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. > > > > IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. > > > > COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. > > > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. > > > > PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. > > > > IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-03-28. > > > > LOGGING-1.3.1 was released on 2024-03-24. > > > > PARENT-68 was released on 2024-03-23. > > > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.1 was released on 2024-03-20. > > > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.0 was released on 2024-03-13. > > > > > > The above list should probably be sorted > > > > > > > ## Community Health: > > > > We welcomed Claude Warren as our latest PMC member. Mailing list > > > activity has > > > > increased. > > > > > > Much of the increased mailing list activity is driven by dependabot > > > PRs, many of which are useless, as it does not take Java compatibility > > > into account. > > > > > > > +1 > > I have had to filter out most of the messages and once I do that, there > is > > almost no actual discussion on-list. I am worried that when people do > try > > to start discussion, the messages are being missed. I personally see the > > lack of ml discussion as a problem. Lots of code changes are happening > > with no discussion, other than maybe random nits on PRs ending up in > github > > threads that don't end up organized that well in list archives. This > > problem is not unique to Commons. > > Hi Phil, > > We had a discussion a while back about creating a "bot" email list but: > - no one actually proposed anything concrete and did any work > - we already have bot lists like "commit", "notifications", "issues", > can't we reuse those? > +1 for that. How about moving the dependabot things to "notifications"? What exactly do we use that list for now? I think it is important for committers to monitor commits but that is not really possible with all of the dependabot spam in there. I personally filter that to /dev/null. The problem with github PR comments basically replacing dev@ is a bigger one. It would be helpful if we could figure out a way to pipe (only) the code discussion messages to the dev list, but I think the better answer there would be to establish the discipline that any discussion beyond nits gets moved to dev@. That may be a dinosaur view, but I think it is worth considering. I agree with Gilles that fast processing of long-tail one-shot PRs is useful but misleading when it comes to community health. Steering people to dev@ and actually talking about the code might be annoying to some in the long tail, but it might net us some new committers, which IMO is more valuable than a lot of the one shot PRs that we get. Phil > - I don't know if GitHub lets us configure targe
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
Thanks, Gary Phil On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 10:37 AM Gary D. Gregory wrote: > I've edited the sections commented on as: > > ## Project Activity: > Many releases of our components: > CONFIGURATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. > NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. > PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. > JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. > NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. > VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. > JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. > DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. > CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. > COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. > LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. > PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. > CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. > RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. > CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. > TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. > BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. > IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. > COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. > PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. > IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-03-28. > LOGGING-1.3.1 was released on 2024-03-24. > PARENT-68 was released on 2024-03-23. > CONFIGURATION-2.10.1 was released on 2024-03-20. > CONFIGURATION-2.10.0 was released on 2024-03-13. > > ## Community Health: > We welcomed Claude Warren as our latest PMC member. Mailing list activity > has > increased mostly due to GitHub automated emails. Most if not all of our > growth > in contributions are coming in through GitHub pull requests. GitHub PRs > with > our use of GitHub continuous integration builds provide > validation of PRs and the existing code base. The flip side is that the > increase in GitHub usage is matched by a decrease in Jira usage. > > Gary > > On 2024/06/12 14:17:50 Gilles Sadowski wrote: > > Hi. > > > > Le mer. 12 juin 2024 à 15:45, Gary D. Gregory a > écrit : > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on submitting in > a day or so, feedback is welcome. > > > > > > ## Description: > > > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and maintenance of Java > focused > > > reusable libraries and components > > > > > > ## Project Status: > > > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. > > > Issues for the board: none. > > > > > > ## Membership Data: > > > Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) > > > There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in this project. > > > The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. > > > > > > Community changes, past quarter: > > > - Claude Warren was added to the PMC on 2024-03-22 > > > - No new committers. Last addition was Claude Warren on 2022-02-01. > > > > > > ## Project Activity: > > > Many releases of our components: > > > CONFIGUATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. > > > NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. > > > VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. > > > JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. > > > DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. > > > CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. > > > COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. > > > LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. > > > PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. > > > CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. > > > RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. > > > CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. > > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. > > > TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. > > > BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. > > > IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. > > > COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. > > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. > > > PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. > > > IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-03-28. > > > LOGGING-1.3.1 was released on 2024-03-24. > > > PARENT-68 was released on 2024-03-23. > > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.1 was released on 2024-03-20. > > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.0 was released on 2024-03-13. > > > > > > ## Community Health: > > > We welcomed Claude Warren as our latest PMC member. Mailing list > activity has > > > increased. Most if not all of our increasing contributions are coming > in > > > through GitHub pull requests. This is working well for us: > > > > It is just one opinion, which I (still) do not share. > > [Not denying the many utilities readily available from GH; the > > issues lay elsewhere...] > > > > Gilles > > > > - > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
On 2024/06/12 22:25:29 sebb wrote: > On Wed, 12 Jun 2024 at 18:58, Gary D. Gregory wrote: > > > > On 2024/06/12 17:17:24 Phil Steitz wrote: > > > > +1 > > > I have had to filter out most of the messages and once I do that, there is > > > almost no actual discussion on-list. I am worried that when people do try > > > to start discussion, the messages are being missed. I personally see the > > > lack of ml discussion as a problem. Lots of code changes are happening > > > with no discussion, other than maybe random nits on PRs ending up in > > > github > > > threads that don't end up organized that well in list archives. This > > > problem is not unique to Commons. > > > > Hi Phil, > > > > We had a discussion a while back about creating a "bot" email list but: > > - no one actually proposed anything concrete and did any work > > That's not strictly true. > There were various suggestions (e.g. run dependabot less frequently, We run it once a week which feels to me like the sweet spot. We _used to_, like Log4j does, run it once a day. > or only on demand) The would defeats one of the purposes of the "bot" part of Dependabot. but they were shouted down, so no action was taken > as it would have been vetoed. > > > - we already have bot lists like "commit", "notifications", "issues", can't > > we reuse those? > > That is part of the problem: the commits list is overrun with > dependabot commits. I don't know what you are proposing here, a new list called "gitbot"? Gary > > > - I don't know if GitHub lets us configure target emails for "I created a > > PR" (or someone commented on a PR), vs. other types of messages. > > > Gary > > > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Most if not all of our increasing contributions are coming in > > > > > through GitHub pull requests. This is working well for us: GitHub PRs > > > > with > > > > > continuous integration builds providing great infrastructure and > > > > validation of > > > > > PRs and the existing code base. The flip side is that the increase in > > > > GitHub > > > > > usage is matched by a decrease in Jira usage. > > > > > > > > > > Gary > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
On Wed, 12 Jun 2024 at 18:58, Gary D. Gregory wrote: > > On 2024/06/12 17:17:24 Phil Steitz wrote: > > +1 > > I have had to filter out most of the messages and once I do that, there is > > almost no actual discussion on-list. I am worried that when people do try > > to start discussion, the messages are being missed. I personally see the > > lack of ml discussion as a problem. Lots of code changes are happening > > with no discussion, other than maybe random nits on PRs ending up in github > > threads that don't end up organized that well in list archives. This > > problem is not unique to Commons. > > Hi Phil, > > We had a discussion a while back about creating a "bot" email list but: > - no one actually proposed anything concrete and did any work That's not strictly true. There were various suggestions (e.g. run dependabot less frequently, or only on demand) but they were shouted down, so no action was taken as it would have been vetoed. > - we already have bot lists like "commit", "notifications", "issues", can't > we reuse those? That is part of the problem: the commits list is overrun with dependabot commits. > - I don't know if GitHub lets us configure target emails for "I created a PR" > (or someone commented on a PR), vs. other types of messages. > Gary > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > Most if not all of our increasing contributions are coming in > > > > through GitHub pull requests. This is working well for us: GitHub PRs > > > with > > > > continuous integration builds providing great infrastructure and > > > validation of > > > > PRs and the existing code base. The flip side is that the increase in > > > GitHub > > > > usage is matched by a decrease in Jira usage. > > > > > > > > Gary > > > > > > > > - > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > > > > > > > > > > - > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > > > > > > > > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
On 2024/06/12 17:17:24 Phil Steitz wrote: > On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 7:27 AM sebb wrote: > > > On Wed, 12 Jun 2024 at 14:45, Gary D. Gregory wrote: > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on submitting in a > > day or so, feedback is welcome. > > > > > > ## Description: > > > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and maintenance of Java > > focused > > > reusable libraries and components > > > > > > ## Project Status: > > > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. > > > Issues for the board: none. > > > > > > ## Membership Data: > > > Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) > > > There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in this project. > > > The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. > > > > Missing from this paragraph is the fact that Commons has enabled > > universal commit. > > > > > Community changes, past quarter: > > > - Claude Warren was added to the PMC on 2024-03-22 > > > - No new committers. Last addition was Claude Warren on 2022-02-01. > > > > > > ## Project Activity: > > > Many releases of our components: > > > CONFIGUATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > > Is that a new component? > > > > > NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. > > > JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. > > > NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. > > > VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. > > > JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. > > > DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. > > > CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. > > > COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. > > > LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. > > > PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. > > > CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. > > > RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. > > > CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. > > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. > > > TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. > > > BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. > > > IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. > > > COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. > > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. > > > PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. > > > IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-03-28. > > > LOGGING-1.3.1 was released on 2024-03-24. > > > PARENT-68 was released on 2024-03-23. > > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.1 was released on 2024-03-20. > > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.0 was released on 2024-03-13. > > > > The above list should probably be sorted > > > > > ## Community Health: > > > We welcomed Claude Warren as our latest PMC member. Mailing list > > activity has > > > increased. > > > > Much of the increased mailing list activity is driven by dependabot > > PRs, many of which are useless, as it does not take Java compatibility > > into account. > > > > +1 > I have had to filter out most of the messages and once I do that, there is > almost no actual discussion on-list. I am worried that when people do try > to start discussion, the messages are being missed. I personally see the > lack of ml discussion as a problem. Lots of code changes are happening > with no discussion, other than maybe random nits on PRs ending up in github > threads that don't end up organized that well in list archives. This > problem is not unique to Commons. Hi Phil, We had a discussion a while back about creating a "bot" email list but: - no one actually proposed anything concrete and did any work - we already have bot lists like "commit", "notifications", "issues", can't we reuse those? - I don't know if GitHub lets us configure target emails for "I created a PR" (or someone commented on a PR), vs. other types of messages. Gary > > Phil > > > > > > > > Most if not all of our increasing contributions are coming in > > > through GitHub pull requests. This is working well for us: GitHub PRs > > with > > > continuous integration builds providing great infrastructure and > > validation of > > > PRs and the existing code base. The flip side is that the increase in > > GitHub > > > usage is matched by a decrease in Jira usage. > > > > > > Gary > > > > > > - > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > > > > > > > - > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > > > > > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
On 2024/06/12 14:26:53 sebb wrote: > On Wed, 12 Jun 2024 at 14:45, Gary D. Gregory wrote: > > > > Hello All, > > > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on submitting in a > > day or so, feedback is welcome. > > > > ## Description: > > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and maintenance of Java > > focused > > reusable libraries and components > > > > ## Project Status: > > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. > > Issues for the board: none. > > > > ## Membership Data: > > Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) > > There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in this project. > > The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. > > Missing from this paragraph is the fact that Commons has enabled > universal commit. > > > Community changes, past quarter: > > - Claude Warren was added to the PMC on 2024-03-22 > > - No new committers. Last addition was Claude Warren on 2022-02-01. > > > > ## Project Activity: > > Many releases of our components: > > CONFIGUATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. > > Is that a new component? Edited for typo. > > > NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. > > PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. > > JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. > > NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. > > VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. > > JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. > > DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. > > CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. > > COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. > > LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. > > PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. > > CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. > > RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. > > CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. > > TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. > > BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. > > IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. > > COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. > > PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. > > IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-03-28. > > LOGGING-1.3.1 was released on 2024-03-24. > > PARENT-68 was released on 2024-03-23. > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.1 was released on 2024-03-20. > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.0 was released on 2024-03-13. > > The above list should probably be sorted It is sorted, in chronological release older as it always has been. It could be sorted in AB order... Gary > > > ## Community Health: > > We welcomed Claude Warren as our latest PMC member. Mailing list activity > > has > > increased. > > Much of the increased mailing list activity is driven by dependabot > PRs, many of which are useless, as it does not take Java compatibility > into account. > > > > Most if not all of our increasing contributions are coming in > > through GitHub pull requests. This is working well for us: GitHub PRs with > > continuous integration builds providing great infrastructure and validation > > of > > PRs and the existing code base. The flip side is that the increase in GitHub > > usage is matched by a decrease in Jira usage. > > > > Gary > > > > - > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
I've edited the sections commented on as: ## Project Activity: Many releases of our components: CONFIGURATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-03-28. LOGGING-1.3.1 was released on 2024-03-24. PARENT-68 was released on 2024-03-23. CONFIGURATION-2.10.1 was released on 2024-03-20. CONFIGURATION-2.10.0 was released on 2024-03-13. ## Community Health: We welcomed Claude Warren as our latest PMC member. Mailing list activity has increased mostly due to GitHub automated emails. Most if not all of our growth in contributions are coming in through GitHub pull requests. GitHub PRs with our use of GitHub continuous integration builds provide validation of PRs and the existing code base. The flip side is that the increase in GitHub usage is matched by a decrease in Jira usage. Gary On 2024/06/12 14:17:50 Gilles Sadowski wrote: > Hi. > > Le mer. 12 juin 2024 à 15:45, Gary D. Gregory a écrit : > > > > Hello All, > > > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on submitting in a > > day or so, feedback is welcome. > > > > ## Description: > > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and maintenance of Java > > focused > > reusable libraries and components > > > > ## Project Status: > > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. > > Issues for the board: none. > > > > ## Membership Data: > > Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) > > There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in this project. > > The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. > > > > Community changes, past quarter: > > - Claude Warren was added to the PMC on 2024-03-22 > > - No new committers. Last addition was Claude Warren on 2022-02-01. > > > > ## Project Activity: > > Many releases of our components: > > CONFIGUATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. > > NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. > > PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. > > JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. > > NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. > > VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. > > JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. > > DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. > > CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. > > COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. > > LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. > > PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. > > CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. > > RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. > > CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. > > TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. > > BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. > > IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. > > COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. > > PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. > > IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-03-28. > > LOGGING-1.3.1 was released on 2024-03-24. > > PARENT-68 was released on 2024-03-23. > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.1 was released on 2024-03-20. > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.0 was released on 2024-03-13. > > > > ## Community Health: > > We welcomed Claude Warren as our latest PMC member. Mailing list activity > > has > > increased. Most if not all of our increasing contributions are coming in > > through GitHub pull requests. This is working well for us: > > It is just one opinion, which I (still) do not share. > [Not denying the many utilities readily available from GH; the > issues lay elsewhere...] > > Gilles > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
On Wed, Jun 12, 2024 at 7:27 AM sebb wrote: > On Wed, 12 Jun 2024 at 14:45, Gary D. Gregory wrote: > > > > Hello All, > > > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on submitting in a > day or so, feedback is welcome. > > > > ## Description: > > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and maintenance of Java > focused > > reusable libraries and components > > > > ## Project Status: > > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. > > Issues for the board: none. > > > > ## Membership Data: > > Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) > > There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in this project. > > The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. > > Missing from this paragraph is the fact that Commons has enabled > universal commit. > > > Community changes, past quarter: > > - Claude Warren was added to the PMC on 2024-03-22 > > - No new committers. Last addition was Claude Warren on 2022-02-01. > > > > ## Project Activity: > > Many releases of our components: > > CONFIGUATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. > > Is that a new component? > > > NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. > > PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. > > JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. > > NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. > > VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. > > JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. > > DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. > > CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. > > COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. > > LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. > > PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. > > CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. > > RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. > > CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. > > TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. > > BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. > > IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. > > COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. > > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. > > PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. > > IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-03-28. > > LOGGING-1.3.1 was released on 2024-03-24. > > PARENT-68 was released on 2024-03-23. > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.1 was released on 2024-03-20. > > CONFIGURATION-2.10.0 was released on 2024-03-13. > > The above list should probably be sorted > > > ## Community Health: > > We welcomed Claude Warren as our latest PMC member. Mailing list > activity has > > increased. > > Much of the increased mailing list activity is driven by dependabot > PRs, many of which are useless, as it does not take Java compatibility > into account. > +1 I have had to filter out most of the messages and once I do that, there is almost no actual discussion on-list. I am worried that when people do try to start discussion, the messages are being missed. I personally see the lack of ml discussion as a problem. Lots of code changes are happening with no discussion, other than maybe random nits on PRs ending up in github threads that don't end up organized that well in list archives. This problem is not unique to Commons. Phil > > > > Most if not all of our increasing contributions are coming in > > through GitHub pull requests. This is working well for us: GitHub PRs > with > > continuous integration builds providing great infrastructure and > validation of > > PRs and the existing code base. The flip side is that the increase in > GitHub > > usage is matched by a decrease in Jira usage. > > > > Gary > > > > - > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > >
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
On Wed, 12 Jun 2024 at 14:45, Gary D. Gregory wrote: > > Hello All, > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on submitting in a day > or so, feedback is welcome. > > ## Description: > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and maintenance of Java focused > reusable libraries and components > > ## Project Status: > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. > Issues for the board: none. > > ## Membership Data: > Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) > There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in this project. > The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. Missing from this paragraph is the fact that Commons has enabled universal commit. > Community changes, past quarter: > - Claude Warren was added to the PMC on 2024-03-22 > - No new committers. Last addition was Claude Warren on 2022-02-01. > > ## Project Activity: > Many releases of our components: > CONFIGUATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. Is that a new component? > NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. > PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. > JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. > NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. > VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. > JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. > DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. > CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. > COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. > LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. > PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. > CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. > RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. > CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. > TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. > BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. > IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. > COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. > PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. > IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-03-28. > LOGGING-1.3.1 was released on 2024-03-24. > PARENT-68 was released on 2024-03-23. > CONFIGURATION-2.10.1 was released on 2024-03-20. > CONFIGURATION-2.10.0 was released on 2024-03-13. The above list should probably be sorted > ## Community Health: > We welcomed Claude Warren as our latest PMC member. Mailing list activity has > increased. Much of the increased mailing list activity is driven by dependabot PRs, many of which are useless, as it does not take Java compatibility into account. > Most if not all of our increasing contributions are coming in > through GitHub pull requests. This is working well for us: GitHub PRs with > continuous integration builds providing great infrastructure and validation of > PRs and the existing code base. The flip side is that the increase in GitHub > usage is matched by a decrease in Jira usage. > > Gary > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: [DRAFT] June Report to the Board
Hi. Le mer. 12 juin 2024 à 15:45, Gary D. Gregory a écrit : > > Hello All, > > Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on submitting in a day > or so, feedback is welcome. > > ## Description: > The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and maintenance of Java focused > reusable libraries and components > > ## Project Status: > Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. > Issues for the board: none. > > ## Membership Data: > Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) > There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in this project. > The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. > > Community changes, past quarter: > - Claude Warren was added to the PMC on 2024-03-22 > - No new committers. Last addition was Claude Warren on 2022-02-01. > > ## Project Activity: > Many releases of our components: > CONFIGUATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. > NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. > PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. > JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. > NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. > VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. > JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. > DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. > CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. > COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. > LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. > PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. > CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. > RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. > CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. > TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. > BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. > IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. > COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. > IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. > PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. > IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-03-28. > LOGGING-1.3.1 was released on 2024-03-24. > PARENT-68 was released on 2024-03-23. > CONFIGURATION-2.10.1 was released on 2024-03-20. > CONFIGURATION-2.10.0 was released on 2024-03-13. > > ## Community Health: > We welcomed Claude Warren as our latest PMC member. Mailing list activity has > increased. Most if not all of our increasing contributions are coming in > through GitHub pull requests. This is working well for us: It is just one opinion, which I (still) do not share. [Not denying the many utilities readily available from GH; the issues lay elsewhere...] Gilles - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
[DRAFT] June Report to the Board
Hello All, Here is the draft of our board report for June I plan on submitting in a day or so, feedback is welcome. ## Description: The mission of Apache Commons is the creation and maintenance of Java focused reusable libraries and components ## Project Status: Current project status: Ongoing with moderate activity. Issues for the board: none. ## Membership Data: Apache Commons was founded 2007-06-19 (17 years ago) There are currently 149 committers and 44 PMC members in this project. The Committer-to-PMC ratio is roughly 5:2. Community changes, past quarter: - Claude Warren was added to the PMC on 2024-03-22 - No new committers. Last addition was Claude Warren on 2022-02-01. ## Project Activity: Many releases of our components: CONFIGUATION-2.11.0 was released on 2024-06-10. NET-3.11.1 was released on 2024-06-10. PARENT-71 was released on 2024-06-10. JEXL-3.4.0 was released on 2024-06-06. NET-3.11.0 was released on 2024-05-31. VALIDATOR-1.9.0 was released on 2024-05-28. JCS-3.2.1 was released on 2024-05-27. DAEMON-1.4.0 was released on 2024-05-24. CLI-1.8.0 was released on 2024-05-23. COMPRESS-1.26.2 was released on 2024-05-23. LOGGING-1.3.2 was released on 2024-05-15. PARENT-70 was released on 2024-05-15. CSV-1.11.0 was released on 2024-05-02. RELEASE-PLUGIN-1.8.2 was released on 2024-04-19. CLI-1.7.0 was released on 2024-04-18. IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha5 was released on 2024-04-18. TEXT-1.12.0 was released on 2024-04-16. BUILD-PLUGIN-1.14.0 was released on 2024-04-15. IO-2.16.1 was released on 2024-04-08. COLLECTIONS-4.5.0-M1 was released on 2024-04-02. IMAGING-1.0.0-alpha4 was released on 2024-04-02. PARENT-69 was released on 2024-04-01. IO-2.16.0 was released on 2024-03-28. LOGGING-1.3.1 was released on 2024-03-24. PARENT-68 was released on 2024-03-23. CONFIGURATION-2.10.1 was released on 2024-03-20. CONFIGURATION-2.10.0 was released on 2024-03-13. ## Community Health: We welcomed Claude Warren as our latest PMC member. Mailing list activity has increased. Most if not all of our increasing contributions are coming in through GitHub pull requests. This is working well for us: GitHub PRs with continuous integration builds providing great infrastructure and validation of PRs and the existing code base. The flip side is that the increase in GitHub usage is matched by a decrease in Jira usage. Gary - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
