Re: [UX][DESIGN EXPLORATION] - flat application icons

[Kevin Grignon]

I think we should explore the icons with and without the gulls. 

Let's see what the feasible options look like before we drive towards a single 
solution. 

Kevin 

On Jul 7, 2013, at 5:09 PM, janI  wrote:

> On 7 July 2013 22:56, Andrea Pescetti  wrote:
> 
>> Samer Mansour wrote:
>> 
>>> I've thrown my icon set up again if you are interested in using it or
>>> altering it, let me know.
>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/**confluence/display/OOOUSERS/**
>>> AOO4+-+Desktop+Icons
>> 
>> They are quite nice, and they fit well with the flat orb.
>> 
>> I would keep the gull(s) since this is a distinctive feature of
>> OpenOffice. I'm not sure about the black outline in the last row icons
>> (those suggested for templates), it seems a bit cluttered.
> 
> The gulls should be like the orb, and not reduced to a single gull.  That
> way the gulls becomes the theme that follow our product throughout.
> 
> I like the icons as such.
> 
> rgds
> jan I.
> 
> 
>> Regards,
>>  Andrea.
>> 
>> --**--**-
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Re: [UX][DESIGN EXPLORATION] - flat application icons

[Kevin Grignon]

Samer,

Nice explorations. 

Could we try a version where the the app icons are all round? This would 
associate the product icons with the AOO icon.

The document icons could remain square. 

Finally, could we see try the icons without the birds. They are hard to render 
at small sizes and add noise. 

Let's keep sketching ideas. Best to visualize the feasible options. 

Kevin 
 

On Jul 5, 2013, at 10:24 AM, Armin Le Grand  wrote:

>Hi Samer,
> 
> On 05.07.2013 16:03, Samer Mansour wrote:
>> Hey guys,
>> 
>> I've thrown my icon set up again if you are interested in using it or
>> altering it, let me know.
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO4+-+Desktop+Icons
> 
> Thanks for sharing, nice stuff. As you know, I like the rectangle ones which 
> are similar to 'App'-style ones, thus I like the 1st line :-)
> 
> I saw you have changed the symbol for Impress; I think it's not too well 
> distinguishable as Presentation app/File, I had to detect it by excluding the 
> other ones. Would it be better to use the 'Dia' association which Kevin used, 
> maybe with graphic objects in the dia?
> 
> Sincerely,
>Armin
> 
>> 
>> Samer Mansour
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Mon, Jul 1, 2013 at 5:47 PM, Kay Schenk  wrote:
>> 
>>> On Wed, Jun 26, 2013 at 11:31 PM, Kevin Grignon
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Hello all,
>>>> 
>>>> I've updated my flat application icons design exploration to show the
>>> icons
>>>> adjacent to the new flat logo.
>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO4+-+Desktop+Icons
>>>> Scroll to end of page to see the flat icons.
>>>> 
>>>> Thoughts?
>>>> 
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Kevin
>>> Hi -- I LIKE these! Very nice.  Modern.
>>> 
>>> I would just like to mention that a small "flat" orb icon in various sizes
>>> might also be needed to replace the images that start with "main..." in:
>>> 
>>> http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/openoffice/trunk/main/default_images/res/
>>> 
>>> This is used on (my) Linux system(s) for the main soffice component.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>> -
>>> MzK
>>> 
>>> "If you stick with a vision, it might not all work,
>>>  but some of it will be absolute genius."
>>>-- Kim Cattrall
> --
> ALG
> 
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[UX][DESIGN EXPLORATION] - flat application icons

[Kevin Grignon]

Hello all,

I've updated my flat application icons design exploration to show the icons
adjacent to the new flat logo.

https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO4+-+Desktop+Icons

Scroll to end of page to see the flat icons.

Thoughts?

Regards,
Kevin

Re: AOO 4.0 Logo: We're not done yet!

[Kevin Grignon]

Hello All,

I saved the file in Illustrator. Odd it is not loading.

I've prepare all the remaining graphics. See:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Product+Logo+Use for
updated owner and status.

>From what I can tell, all relevant graphics are done.

I'm at the airport right now, and won't have time to upload the files.
Actually, I don't know where to put them, either on the wiki or in the
source control.

I'll send them to Rob ;)

Regards,
Kevin




On Wed, Jun 26, 2013 at 11:48 PM, Rob Weir  wrote:

> On Wed, Jun 26, 2013 at 11:45 AM, Armin Le Grand 
> wrote:
> > Hi Rob,
> >
> > On 26.06.2013 17:41, Rob Weir wrote:
> >
> > [stuff deleted]
> >
> >
> >> Kevin sent me an updated SVG file, but I'm having problems opening it in
> >> Inkscape or Illustrator.
> >
> >
> > Tried with AOO already...?
> >
>
> No.  It is missing XML name space declarations, so it is not even
> well-formed XML..
>
> -Rob
>
>
> >
> >> But I have posted the PNG of the result to the wiki:
> >>
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Stage+3+Logo+Refinement
> >> Once we have a working SVG file we can move ahead.
> >>>
> >>> 2) Alexandro said something about adjusting the colors.  But I'm not
> >>> certain I understood that correctly.
> >>>
> >>
> > [stuff deleted]
> >
> >
> > -
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> >
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Re: AOO 4.0 Logo: We're not done yet!

[Kevin Grignon]

KG01 - see comments inline. 

On Jun 24, 2013, at 12:18 PM, Juergen Schmidt  wrote:

> Am Freitag, 21. Juni 2013 um 18:28 schrieb Kay Schenk:
>> On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 4:47 PM, Dave Fisher  wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jun 20, 2013, at 11:46 AM, Rob Weir wrote:
>>> 
 In case you are not following the discussion on the dev list, Juergen,
 the 4.0 Release Manager, has proposed an endgame schedule for the AOO
 4.0 release:
 
>>> 
>>> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/openoffice-dev/201306.mbox/%3C51C16876.402%40gmail.com%3E
 
 The date relevant to the logo is Monday July 1th. That is the
 deadline for getting the logo changes integrated into Subversion for
 the OpenOffice product.
 
 Changes on the website and social networking don't have a hard
 deadline and can come later, perhaps synched up with the actual
 release of AOO 4.0, which is planned for later in July.
 
 So what needs to be done?
 
 1) Kevin said he wanted to make some fine tuning of the text kerning
 in the logo.
 

KG01 - ok, I've adjusted the keening and will post updated .svg. 

 2) Alexandro said something about adjusting the colors. But I'm not
 certain I understood that correctly.
 
 3) We need to update the graphics in the product. And there are a lot
 of them, around 25 of them, which I've laboriously transcribed onto
 the wiki:
 
 https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Product+Logo+Use
 
 Most of them will be simple. It is just a matter of replacing one
 logo with another, and preserving the right formats, dimensions, color
 depths, etc.

KG01 - I will start to work on these images. Will send along progress notes as 
I go. 

 
 A few exceptions, of placements which will require some more thought:
 
 a) The splash screen is here:
>>> https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/openoffice/trunk/main/default_images/introabout/intro.png
 
 It has integrated text and graphics and the text is rather ugly. Can
 we do better here? This is a place where some "wow" is appropriate.
 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Consider
>>> 
>>> (1) Take the logo SVG
>>> (2) Add "4"
>>> (3) Scale to the 550 x 365 px size.
>>> (4) Add updated and well written text in the same font.
>>> (5) Add quality Apache Feather.
>>> (6) Include trademark.
>>> (7) Cool contextual graphics?
>>> (8) Create a PNG from the SVG.
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> Dave
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Could you post an image for us?
>> 
>> I truly liked the idea of incorporating the feather, somehow, but well,
>> none of the submitted logos with it got high ratings.
>> 
>> 
> 
> and this should be accepted. We use the feather in combination with our logo 
> in some cases and that is ok and enough.
> 
> We don't have to combine the logo with the feather. See the flex logo.

KG01 - Our logo type includes the Apache name. This is sufficient. Their logo 
needs a refresh :)

> 
> Juergen
>> 
>> 
>> 
 
 b) Some of the placements have "high contrast" versions, needed for
 when this mode is enabled in the operating system. This improves
 visibility for users with low vision. For example:
 
>>> 
>>> https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/openoffice/trunk/main/default_images/framework/res/backing_hc.png
 
 I think we need to consult with someone with expertise in this to know
 exactly what we should be doing here.
 
 c) This is from the SDK install:
>>> https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/openoffice/trunk/main/instsetoo_native/inc_sdkoo/windows/msi_templates/Binary/Image.bmp
 
 As you can see it is a more elaborate, 3D image showing
 "OpenOffice.org" in the title bar. This will require someone skilled
 with their graphics editor to replace that text and make it look
 natural. Or redo the image.
 
 So plenty of work to do here for anyone who is good with a graphics
 editor and wants to help.
 
 But first we need Kevin and Alexandro to make their changes to the
 master SVG. After that we can work in parallel on the remaining
 pieces.
 
 The master SVG, from Chris, is here:
>>> https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/openoffice/ooo-site/trunk/content/marketing/art/galleries/logos/aoo-working/
 
 We have a little more than a week to do this, so can I strongly
 suggest that Kevin and Alexandro make their changes ASAP, and by
 Monday June 24th at the latest?
 
 Thanks!
 
 -Rob
 
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>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
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>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> -

Re: new logo on test website

[Kevin Grignon]

KG 01 - see comments inline

On Jun 14, 2013, at 8:53 PM, Rob Weir  wrote:

> On Thu, Jun 13, 2013 at 9:58 PM, Kevin Grignon
>  wrote:
>> Hello All,
>> 
>> Yes, there was a vote. And yes, some people voted, however branding is not 
>> just a simple two round activity. Design is iterative.  It needs refinement 
>> to be ready for production.
>> 
> 
> The entire product is iterative, and one of the steps in each
> iteration is that we release a new version of the product.  This
> forces a decision on what level of perfection is included in this
> release versus deferred for the next release.  I could go down the
> line, feature by feature and talk about iteration. It is a universal
> truth with software.  But so is releasing.
> 
>> Before we run off and slap the new logo everywhere, let's take a moment to 
>> prepare the logo source files for production and establish some simple usage 
>> rules, including colours, alignment and padding.
>> 
>> For example, the "ff" should be merged into a single element, the "p" 
>> descender in the Apache text should be shortened so it doesn't stab the 
>> letter beneath it.
>> 
>> I will work on it this weekend.
>> 
> 
> It would be great if you can make these changes.  I'm not sure others
> have an eye for the refinement that you are suggesting.

KG01 - will do. 


> 
> Thanks!
> 
> -Rob
> 
>> Finally, let's be mindful that this is UI activity more than anything. The 
>> brand change is so subtle. The real effort will come in preparing the 
>> application graphics. Let's get the source files ready for production then 
>> start updating the app graphics.
>> 
>> Kevin
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Jun 14, 2013, at 7:18 AM, Kay Schenk  wrote:
>> 
>>> On Thu, Jun 13, 2013 at 12:43 AM, Andre Fischer  wrote:
>>> 
>>>> On 13.06.2013 01:15, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> I know this is approved and all, and I like it too (though the Orb seems
>>>>> a bit apart from the text).
>>>>> 
>>>>> If I was Apache Branding, though, I'd be disappointed that "Apache" is
>>>>> barely visible.  It has about as much punch as the tiny "TM".
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> We have voted on the logo.  This is like "speak now or forever hold your
>>>> peace" in the movies.  We are now in the "hold your peace" part.
>>>> 
>>>> -Andre
>>> 
>>> 
>>> yes...
>>> 
>>> OK, I just did a quick update to fix the vertical align with the text  to
>>> the right. So, take another look if you want. It's now 300 x 105. I kind of
>>> like more spacing around the logo vs what we have now -- it gives the logo
>>> a bit more presence this way, but of course we need a consensus.
>>> 
>>> http://www.openoffice.org/test/
>>> 
>>> I made this from the optim rendering which to me -- with bad eyes and not
>>> the best monitor -- seems to make "Apache" the darkest.
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> - Dennis
>>>>> 
>>>>> -Original Message-
>>>>> From: Kay Schenk [mailto:kay.sch...@gmail.com]
>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 12, 2013 01:44 PM
>>>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>>>> Subject: Re: new logo on test website
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 12:13 PM, Marcus (OOo) 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Am 06/12/2013 06:53 PM, schrieb Kay Schenk:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> A quick mockup of the new logo with www.openoffice.org is available
>>>>>> from:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> http://www.openoffice.org/test/ <http://www.openoffice.org/**test/><
>>>>>>> http://www.openoffice.org/**test/ <http://www.openoffice.org/test/>>
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> As the new logo needs alignment etc., more coming soon. (and mockups for
>>>>>>> the project site)
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I must say that I really like this and feels it brightens things up! :)
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> absolutely, looks fresh and new. Thanks for the test.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Is the bigger white space around the logo intended - comp

Re: new logo on test website

[Kevin Grignon]

Hello All,

Yes, there was a vote. And yes, some people voted, however branding is not just 
a simple two round activity. Design is iterative.  It needs refinement to be 
ready for production. 

Before we run off and slap the new logo everywhere, let's take a moment to 
prepare the logo source files for production and establish some simple usage 
rules, including colours, alignment and padding. 

For example, the "ff" should be merged into a single element, the "p" descender 
in the Apache text should be shortened so it doesn't stab the letter beneath 
it. 

I will work on it this weekend. 

Finally, let's be mindful that this is UI activity more than anything. The 
brand change is so subtle. The real effort will come in preparing the 
application graphics. Let's get the source files ready for production then 
start updating the app graphics. 

Kevin






On Jun 14, 2013, at 7:18 AM, Kay Schenk  wrote:

> On Thu, Jun 13, 2013 at 12:43 AM, Andre Fischer  wrote:
> 
>> On 13.06.2013 01:15, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
>> 
>>> I know this is approved and all, and I like it too (though the Orb seems
>>> a bit apart from the text).
>>> 
>>> If I was Apache Branding, though, I'd be disappointed that "Apache" is
>>> barely visible.  It has about as much punch as the tiny "TM".
>>> 
>> 
>> We have voted on the logo.  This is like "speak now or forever hold your
>> peace" in the movies.  We are now in the "hold your peace" part.
>> 
>> -Andre
> 
> 
> yes...
> 
> OK, I just did a quick update to fix the vertical align with the text  to
> the right. So, take another look if you want. It's now 300 x 105. I kind of
> like more spacing around the logo vs what we have now -- it gives the logo
> a bit more presence this way, but of course we need a consensus.
> 
> http://www.openoffice.org/test/
> 
> I made this from the optim rendering which to me -- with bad eyes and not
> the best monitor -- seems to make "Apache" the darkest.
> 
> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>>  - Dennis
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Kay Schenk [mailto:kay.sch...@gmail.com]
>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 12, 2013 01:44 PM
>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>> Subject: Re: new logo on test website
>>> 
>>> On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 12:13 PM, Marcus (OOo) 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Am 06/12/2013 06:53 PM, schrieb Kay Schenk:
 
  A quick mockup of the new logo with www.openoffice.org is available
 from:
 
> http://www.openoffice.org/test/ <
> http://www.openoffice.org/**test/ >
> 
> As the new logo needs alignment etc., more coming soon. (and mockups for
> the project site)
> 
> I must say that I really like this and feels it brightens things up! :)
> 
> absolutely, looks fresh and new. Thanks for the test.
 
 Is the bigger white space around the logo intended - compared with the
 old
 one? If not, I would suggest to reduce it, so that the same space is
 used.
 Because currently everything below is wrapped a bit lower.
 
 Marcus
 
 It needs to resized some -- I will play with this. I actually like the
>>> larger size of the whole logo though compared to the old one. It seems to
>>> give more space and visual appeal in some way. It needs to be cropped at
>>> the top and left so it lines up better with the text. I'll see what I can
>>> do.
>>> 
>>> @RGB on the older logo. Hmmm yes...maybe we should use a different
>>> graphic for this item altogether. Right now we don't have an svg for just
>>> the new orb. I think that may be in process.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 --**
 --**-
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 dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.**a**pache.org
 
> 
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>>> 
>> 
>> --**--**-
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>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> -
> MzK
> 
> "Normal is not something to aspire to, it is something to get away from."
> 
> -- Jodie Foster

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Re: Logo next steps

[Kevin Grignon]

I propose we take a final pass to prepare the logo for production. 

The vector artwork should be converted curves, the "ff" elements need to be 
combined, and some font kerning adjusted. 

Then we should document the logo on the AOO UX wiki. 

Who is preparing all the new graphics?

Kevin



On Jun 11, 2013, at 5:44 AM, Kay Schenk  wrote:

> On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 10:12 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:
> 
>> On Thu, Jun 6, 2013 at 6:31 PM, Andrea Pescetti 
>> wrote:
>>> Rob Weir wrote:
 
 Now that the core decision making process is over, what are the next
 steps?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Good, congratulations to Chris and it's good to see that the outcome was
>>> basically the ratification of the preferences 5000+ people had expressed
>> in
>>> the survey.
>>> 
>>> 
 1) I've sent Chris a note requesting the latest SVG.  Once I receive
 it I'll check it in.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Thanks, and I assume you will also take care of all licensing and
>> paperwork.
>>> At a certain point in future we will claim this new logo as our trademark
>>> and I trust all appropriate steps are being taken in this respect too.
>>> 
>>> 
 2) We should make an inventory of places where this logo should go.
 What sizes are needed, formats, background color (or alpha
 transparency), border requirements, location in SVN, etc.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I would just add to your list: a square 100x100 icon for social media.
>>> Ideally, we should have it in place when OpenOffice 4 is released.
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I found this page which lists the various image sizes used by social
>> networks:
>> 
>> 
>> http://www.lunametrics.com/blog/2012/11/12/final-social-media-sizing-cheat-sheet/
>> 
>> It is more complicated than I realized.  We'll probably want to target
>> a specific bitmap rendering for each site, to have optimal quality.
>> 
>> We can also do more than just a profile image, if we want, on some
>> site.  For example, on Twitter we can have a 520x260 "Header Image" in
>> addition to the smaller profile photo.  That would look them like
>> this:
>> 
>> https://twitter.com/dickc
>> 
>> Facebook and Google+ have similar things, if we want to do more than
>> just the profile photo.
>> 
>> -Rob
>> 
> 
> I just submitted a VERY quick mockup on the main website index page to
> (attachment to --
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO4+-+Websites ):
> 
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/download/attachments/30752760/Apache+OpenOffice+-+The+Free+and+Open+Productivity+Suite.jpe
> 
> 
> if anyone wants to see how things are playing out so far.
> 
> I went a bit too far with resizing so the logo size on this is actually 299
> x 136 (I meant to stop at 300w).
> 
> Only the png logo has been checked into staging and nothing else.
> Due to the way things get rendered with one branding area, only local setup
> can be used for show-and-tell I think.
> 
> Top cropping (for realignment) obviously needs to be done but what else?
> 
> 
> 
>> 
>>> 
 Note:  Previously it was mentioned that the number "4" had unlucky
 connotations in some cultures.  So we need to include the version
 number as part of the logo in the splash screen and about box?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> We'd need to hear from them, but I would find it quite odd if we didn't
>>> include a "4" in the about box (and in the splash screen too). If this
>> was
>>> version 13 (which is unlucky in other cultures), I would find equally
>> odd to
>>> omit the "13" from the about box.
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>>  Andrea.
>>> 
>>> 
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> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> MzK
> 
> "You can't believe one thing and do another.
> What you believe and what you do are the same thing."
> -- Leonard Peltier

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Re: Next steps for AOO 4.0 Logo Selection

[Kevin Grignon]

I like the darker font colour for Apache, but prefer all caps as it supports a 
more balanced layout. The descender or long leg of the Apache letter "p" when 
rendered in lowercase causes tension as it stabs the openOffice logo type. 

Thoughts?

Kevin



On May 28, 2013, at 10:10 AM, Kadal Amutham  wrote:

> Looks like we are retaining almost the current logo with some small changes
> 
> With Warm Regards
> 
> V.Kadal Amutham
> 919444360480
> 914422396480
> 
> 
> On 28 May 2013 04:51, Dave Fisher  wrote:
> 
>> 
>> On May 27, 2013, at 3:55 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
>> 
>>> [This was cross-posted, so I'm not clear what list was intended.  Makes
>> tracking the discussion difficult.]
>>> 
>>> I'll bite:
>>> 
>>> I prefer Chris's latest.  The weight of the lettering is more powerful.
>> I think the "Apache" should not be so thin. The form used by Samer works
>> better.  I also think down-scaling will work better in this case.
>>> 
>>> As far as the orb goes, Chris's could be a tad larger, but not by much.
>> I prefer the orientation of the foreground bird to Kevin's, which has a
>> more threatening feel in my subjective experience.
>> 
>> These are good observations.
>> 
>> I would like to see it with an "ffi" ligature.
>> 
>> I think we should leave the 4 out. Others have mentioned that 4 is an
>> unlucky number is some cultures. Perhaps we have compromise and have both
>> versioned and un-versioned logo designs. If so then I think a treatment
>> like "Version 4.0" in grey and blue might work.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Dave
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> - Dennis
>>> 
>>> PS: Interesting that we've come around to a close variant of the current
>> logo.
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Rob Weir [mailto:robw...@apache.org]
>>> Sent: Monday, May 27, 2013 03:22 PM
>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; market...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> Subject: Next steps for AOO 4.0 Logo Selection
>>> 
>>> What we've done so far:
>>> 
>>> 1) Called for logo submissions from the community
>>> 
>>> 2) Many designers responded and we received 40 submissions.  There was
>>> a lot of "cross-fertilization" of ideas, as designers saw what others
>>> had come up with, what worked, and borrowed ideas.
>>> 
>>> 3) We did a survey of user responses to the 40 logo submissions.  Over
>>> 5000 users offered their ratings and written comments.
>>> 
>>> 4) Publish report and blog post on the results of the logo survey.
>>> 
>>> 5) Invited the designers of the top-rated logos to read over the
>>> survey comments and refine their designs and submit an updated
>>> version.
>>> 
>>> That's where we are now.  The updated logos (three of them) are on the
>> wiki now:
>>> 
>>> 
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Stage+2+Logo+Refinement
>>> 
>>> As you can see there is quite a bit of convergence on a design occurring.
>>> 
>>> So what next?
>>> 
>>> I'd like to propose some next steps.
>>> 
>>> A) Let's discuss the three designs on the mailing list for the next
>>> week.   The discussion might lead to further refinement.
>>> 
>>> B) If at the end of the week there is consensus on a single design
>>> we'll go with that one.
>>> 
>>> C) If at the end of the week there is not consensus on a single
>>> design, and the discussion is not leading us closer toward consensus,
>>> then we'll have a 72-hour vote of PMC members to pick the logo.
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> 
>>> -Rob
>>> 
>>> -
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
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>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -
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Re: Next steps for AOO 4.0 Logo Selection

[Kevin Grignon]

Hello all,

I wanted to share some design rationale for the gull/book pages enhancement in 
my logo. 

In my design I wanted to make the "gulls" into flying books. I made them 
broader and more active. I was going for the whole, "OpenOffice helps give my 
thoughts and ideas wings", versus "gills at sunset". 

Thoughts?

Kevin 

On May 28, 2013, at 10:10 AM, Kadal Amutham  wrote:

> Looks like we are retaining almost the current logo with some small changes
> 
> With Warm Regards
> 
> V.Kadal Amutham
> 919444360480
> 914422396480
> 
> 
> On 28 May 2013 04:51, Dave Fisher  wrote:
> 
>> 
>> On May 27, 2013, at 3:55 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
>> 
>>> [This was cross-posted, so I'm not clear what list was intended.  Makes
>> tracking the discussion difficult.]
>>> 
>>> I'll bite:
>>> 
>>> I prefer Chris's latest.  The weight of the lettering is more powerful.
>> I think the "Apache" should not be so thin. The form used by Samer works
>> better.  I also think down-scaling will work better in this case.
>>> 
>>> As far as the orb goes, Chris's could be a tad larger, but not by much.
>> I prefer the orientation of the foreground bird to Kevin's, which has a
>> more threatening feel in my subjective experience.
>> 
>> These are good observations.
>> 
>> I would like to see it with an "ffi" ligature.
>> 
>> I think we should leave the 4 out. Others have mentioned that 4 is an
>> unlucky number is some cultures. Perhaps we have compromise and have both
>> versioned and un-versioned logo designs. If so then I think a treatment
>> like "Version 4.0" in grey and blue might work.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Dave
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> - Dennis
>>> 
>>> PS: Interesting that we've come around to a close variant of the current
>> logo.
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Rob Weir [mailto:robw...@apache.org]
>>> Sent: Monday, May 27, 2013 03:22 PM
>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; market...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> Subject: Next steps for AOO 4.0 Logo Selection
>>> 
>>> What we've done so far:
>>> 
>>> 1) Called for logo submissions from the community
>>> 
>>> 2) Many designers responded and we received 40 submissions.  There was
>>> a lot of "cross-fertilization" of ideas, as designers saw what others
>>> had come up with, what worked, and borrowed ideas.
>>> 
>>> 3) We did a survey of user responses to the 40 logo submissions.  Over
>>> 5000 users offered their ratings and written comments.
>>> 
>>> 4) Publish report and blog post on the results of the logo survey.
>>> 
>>> 5) Invited the designers of the top-rated logos to read over the
>>> survey comments and refine their designs and submit an updated
>>> version.
>>> 
>>> That's where we are now.  The updated logos (three of them) are on the
>> wiki now:
>>> 
>>> 
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Stage+2+Logo+Refinement
>>> 
>>> As you can see there is quite a bit of convergence on a design occurring.
>>> 
>>> So what next?
>>> 
>>> I'd like to propose some next steps.
>>> 
>>> A) Let's discuss the three designs on the mailing list for the next
>>> week.   The discussion might lead to further refinement.
>>> 
>>> B) If at the end of the week there is consensus on a single design
>>> we'll go with that one.
>>> 
>>> C) If at the end of the week there is not consensus on a single
>>> design, and the discussion is not leading us closer toward consensus,
>>> then we'll have a 72-hour vote of PMC members to pick the logo.
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> 
>>> -Rob
>>> 
>>> -
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -
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>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -
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>> 
>> 

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Re: Next steps for AOO 4.0 Logo Selection

[Kevin Grignon]

Hello All,

I propose we get feedback on second round and identify what aspects of each we 
like. 

Let's converge on a design which reflects the best if each. 

Regards,
Kevin


On May 28, 2013, at 10:10 AM, Kadal Amutham  wrote:

> Looks like we are retaining almost the current logo with some small changes
> 
> With Warm Regards
> 
> V.Kadal Amutham
> 919444360480
> 914422396480
> 
> 
> On 28 May 2013 04:51, Dave Fisher  wrote:
> 
>> 
>> On May 27, 2013, at 3:55 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
>> 
>>> [This was cross-posted, so I'm not clear what list was intended.  Makes
>> tracking the discussion difficult.]
>>> 
>>> I'll bite:
>>> 
>>> I prefer Chris's latest.  The weight of the lettering is more powerful.
>> I think the "Apache" should not be so thin. The form used by Samer works
>> better.  I also think down-scaling will work better in this case.
>>> 
>>> As far as the orb goes, Chris's could be a tad larger, but not by much.
>> I prefer the orientation of the foreground bird to Kevin's, which has a
>> more threatening feel in my subjective experience.
>> 
>> These are good observations.
>> 
>> I would like to see it with an "ffi" ligature.
>> 
>> I think we should leave the 4 out. Others have mentioned that 4 is an
>> unlucky number is some cultures. Perhaps we have compromise and have both
>> versioned and un-versioned logo designs. If so then I think a treatment
>> like "Version 4.0" in grey and blue might work.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Dave
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> - Dennis
>>> 
>>> PS: Interesting that we've come around to a close variant of the current
>> logo.
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Rob Weir [mailto:robw...@apache.org]
>>> Sent: Monday, May 27, 2013 03:22 PM
>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; market...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> Subject: Next steps for AOO 4.0 Logo Selection
>>> 
>>> What we've done so far:
>>> 
>>> 1) Called for logo submissions from the community
>>> 
>>> 2) Many designers responded and we received 40 submissions.  There was
>>> a lot of "cross-fertilization" of ideas, as designers saw what others
>>> had come up with, what worked, and borrowed ideas.
>>> 
>>> 3) We did a survey of user responses to the 40 logo submissions.  Over
>>> 5000 users offered their ratings and written comments.
>>> 
>>> 4) Publish report and blog post on the results of the logo survey.
>>> 
>>> 5) Invited the designers of the top-rated logos to read over the
>>> survey comments and refine their designs and submit an updated
>>> version.
>>> 
>>> That's where we are now.  The updated logos (three of them) are on the
>> wiki now:
>>> 
>>> 
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Stage+2+Logo+Refinement
>>> 
>>> As you can see there is quite a bit of convergence on a design occurring.
>>> 
>>> So what next?
>>> 
>>> I'd like to propose some next steps.
>>> 
>>> A) Let's discuss the three designs on the mailing list for the next
>>> week.   The discussion might lead to further refinement.
>>> 
>>> B) If at the end of the week there is consensus on a single design
>>> we'll go with that one.
>>> 
>>> C) If at the end of the week there is not consensus on a single
>>> design, and the discussion is not leading us closer toward consensus,
>>> then we'll have a 72-hour vote of PMC members to pick the logo.
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> 
>>> -Rob
>>> 
>>> -
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -
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>> 
>> 

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Re: Critique of the Help/About box

[Kevin Grignon]

KG01 - see comments at base

On May 10, 2013, at 1:40 AM, "Marcus (OOo)"  wrote:

> Am 05/09/2013 07:33 PM, schrieb Ariel Constenla-Haile:
>> On Thu, May 09, 2013 at 07:21:49PM +0200, Marcus (OOo) wrote:
>>> Am 05/09/2013 06:34 PM, schrieb Rob Weir:
 I wonder if we can make this be more rational?
 
 For example, the About box currently says: "Copyright © 2012 Apache
 Software Foundation.
 All rights reserved."
 
 That needs to be changed to 2013, right?
>>> 
>>> If you aren't happy to change this every year, just get the current
>>> year from a function like "today()" or similar. Then the first build
>>> in 2014 will show the correct year.
>> 
>> Do you mean set at build time or at runtime? The later might not be
>> "legal".
> 

KG01 - how might we include information and calls to action for people to 
contribute to the effort?

Regards,
Kevin
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Re: Handlers Drawing - Desing of the nodes.

[Kevin Grignon]

Alan, 

What issues are you looking to address in your node enhancements?

Ideally, we should seek a unified visual language for object selection all 
editors. Perhaps this is great opportunity to explore. 

Thoughts?

Regards,
Kevin



On May 16, 2013, at 9:03 AM, Alan Eduardo Puc Pech  
wrote:

> Hi all.
> 
> I need your help, I would like to change the design of the nodes. Because
> now in drawing, the nodes  are square and have color cyan. Therefore I
> would like to know what code manipulates the node shapes square in color
> cyan.
> 
> Now I have this code:
> http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/xref/aoo-trunk/main/svx/source/svdraw/svdmrkv.cxx
> 
> 
> This code is in the following line:
> /SRC_ROOT/main/svx/source/svdraw/svdmrkv.cxx
> 
> Regards
> 
> Alan.

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Re: Results of the Apache OpenOffice 4.0 Logo Survey

[Kevin Grignon]

Coolio. Will upload. 

On May 16, 2013, at 1:45 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:

> On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 1:03 PM, Kevin Grignon
>  wrote:
>> Hi Rob,
>> 
>> Attached for your consideration is my refined logo submission.
>> 
> 
> Hi Kevin,  I'm looking forward to seeing your updated version.
> Unfortunately binary attachments are stripped from the list.  But you
> can upload the logo to the wiki page here:
> 
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Stage+2+Logo+Refinement
> 
> Regards,
> 
> -Rob
> 
> 
>> My refined logo includes refinements to the gulls/pages emphasis, font, font
>> weight, font kerning, and layout.
>> 
>> For the orb and gulls, I've emphasized the gulls curves to be more
>> representative of book pages, and generally stronger visually.
>> 
>> For the logo type, I've updated my font to Open Sans, which I had in an
>> earlier sketch but didn't submit for the voting. This font is available from
>> Google Fonts and would allow us to use this font for website typography when
>> we extend the styling updates to our websites.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Kevin
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Sat, May 11, 2013 at 2:02 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:
>>> 
>>> On Fri, May 10, 2013 at 12:55 PM, janI  wrote:
>>>> On 10 May 2013 17:54, Rob Weir  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Thanks to all in the community who took time to offer feedback on our
>>>>> recent logo survey for Apache OpenOffice 4.0. Over 5000 users rated
>>>>> the 40 logo proposals and many offered detailed comments.
>>>>> 
>>>>> We have a new blog post where you can see what the top logo proposals
>>>>> were, as well as meet the volunteer designers of the top logos and
>>>>> learn how they approached the design task:
>>>>> 
>>>>> https://blogs.apache.org/OOo/entry/results_of_apache_openoffice_4
>>>>> 
>>>>> The designers are now refining their logos in preparation for a 2nd
>>>>> round of evaluation and discussion.
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> does refining include making versions for icon, favicen etc. (I am not
>>>> sure
>>>> which other variants we use) ?
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> Refine means the designers of the top logos look at the comment
>>> feedback from the survey and then adjusting ("refine") their logos to
>>> improve them if possible.
>>> 
>>> Hopefully then we can pick a single best logo from among them.
>>> 
>>> Once we have one design to work from, and from that a color palette,
>>> etc., then the other things flow from that, such as splash screen,
>>> favicon, etc.
>>> 
>>>> Just too bad we cannot combine the best ones, get the feather into the
>>>> logo
>>>> would be a real sign of integration with ASF.
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> Isn't that how we got the duck-billed platypus?
>>> 
>>> ;-)
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> 
>>> -Rob
>>> 
>>>> rgds
>>>> jan I.
>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> 
>>>>> -Rob
>>>>> 
>>>>> -
>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>> 
>>> -
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>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -
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Re: Results of the Apache OpenOffice 4.0 Logo Survey

[Kevin Grignon]

Hi Rob,

Attached for your consideration is my refined logo submission.

My refined logo includes refinements to the gulls/pages emphasis, font,
font weight, font kerning, and layout.

For the orb and gulls, I've emphasized the gulls curves to be more
representative of book pages, and generally stronger visually.

For the logo type, I've updated my font to Open Sans, which I had in an
earlier sketch but didn't submit for the voting. This font is available
from Google Fonts and would allow us to use this font for website
typography when we extend the styling updates to our websites.

Regards,
Kevin





On Sat, May 11, 2013 at 2:02 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:

> On Fri, May 10, 2013 at 12:55 PM, janI  wrote:
> > On 10 May 2013 17:54, Rob Weir  wrote:
> >
> >> Thanks to all in the community who took time to offer feedback on our
> >> recent logo survey for Apache OpenOffice 4.0. Over 5000 users rated
> >> the 40 logo proposals and many offered detailed comments.
> >>
> >> We have a new blog post where you can see what the top logo proposals
> >> were, as well as meet the volunteer designers of the top logos and
> >> learn how they approached the design task:
> >>
> >> https://blogs.apache.org/OOo/entry/results_of_apache_openoffice_4
> >>
> >> The designers are now refining their logos in preparation for a 2nd
> >> round of evaluation and discussion.
> >>
> >
> > does refining include making versions for icon, favicen etc. (I am not
> sure
> > which other variants we use) ?
> >
>
> Refine means the designers of the top logos look at the comment
> feedback from the survey and then adjusting ("refine") their logos to
> improve them if possible.
>
> Hopefully then we can pick a single best logo from among them.
>
> Once we have one design to work from, and from that a color palette,
> etc., then the other things flow from that, such as splash screen,
> favicon, etc.
>
> > Just too bad we cannot combine the best ones, get the feather into the
> logo
> > would be a real sign of integration with ASF.
> >
>
> Isn't that how we got the duck-billed platypus?
>
> ;-)
>
> Regards,
>
> -Rob
>
> > rgds
> > jan I.
> >
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>
> >> -Rob
> >>
> >> -
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
> >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
> >>
> >>
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>
>

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Re: Results of the Apache OpenOffice 4.0 Logo Survey

[Kevin Grignon]

Rob,

I will try to submit my refined logo by Wednesday. 

Regards,
Kevin


On May 11, 2013, at 2:02 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:

> On Fri, May 10, 2013 at 12:55 PM, janI  wrote:
>> On 10 May 2013 17:54, Rob Weir  wrote:
>> 
>>> Thanks to all in the community who took time to offer feedback on our
>>> recent logo survey for Apache OpenOffice 4.0. Over 5000 users rated
>>> the 40 logo proposals and many offered detailed comments.
>>> 
>>> We have a new blog post where you can see what the top logo proposals
>>> were, as well as meet the volunteer designers of the top logos and
>>> learn how they approached the design task:
>>> 
>>> https://blogs.apache.org/OOo/entry/results_of_apache_openoffice_4
>>> 
>>> The designers are now refining their logos in preparation for a 2nd
>>> round of evaluation and discussion.
>>> 
>> 
>> does refining include making versions for icon, favicen etc. (I am not sure
>> which other variants we use) ?
>> 
> 
> Refine means the designers of the top logos look at the comment
> feedback from the survey and then adjusting ("refine") their logos to
> improve them if possible.
> 
> Hopefully then we can pick a single best logo from among them.
> 
> Once we have one design to work from, and from that a color palette,
> etc., then the other things flow from that, such as splash screen,
> favicon, etc.
> 
>> Just too bad we cannot combine the best ones, get the feather into the logo
>> would be a real sign of integration with ASF.
>> 
> 
> Isn't that how we got the duck-billed platypus?
> 
> ;-)
> 
> Regards,
> 
> -Rob
> 
>> rgds
>> jan I.
>> 
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> 
>>> -Rob
>>> 
>>> -
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> 
>>> 
> 
> -
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Re: Conversation: Pick A Logo

[Kevin Grignon]

If we pursue flat, let's explore some modifications to the pages (gulls). In my 
flat submission I have made the gulls more predominant which broader strikes 
and deeper arcs. 

Also, we should see the proposals with drop shadows as key OS apply one. The 
wingtip which extends off the orb would need such a shadow. 

Regards,
Kevin

On Apr 15, 2013, at 6:27 AM, Kay Schenk  wrote:

> On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 3:42 PM, Samer Mansour  wrote:
> 
>> Summary of feedback (which I found made points):
>> 
>> Samer - Lets go flat, its strong in all aspects brought up.
>> Kay S. - Agrees with flat logo. Poll should be limited to few.
>> Robin - Wordmarks need more attention (not logo specific), Vasilis logo is
>> cool, downside too different. Robin made a similar refresh with/without
>> feather. Scales his orb down, no indication for his logo preference (he did
>> submit one more). Agrees technical aspect of print, but its not deciding
>> factor (I agree but it should be satisfied).
>> Dave F - Wordmark needs attention as well, likes flat logo.
>> Dennis - Check with trademark@
>> Andrea - Likes orb, not a fan of flat (as its been used as a surrogate in
>> the past due to limitations).
>> Alexandro - alters Robins logo.
>> Juergen - What about stand alone logo for buttons, stickers. Proposes we
>> should poll.
>> Kadal - "Because companies do it, we shouldn't?" - not sure that is
>> convincing b/c they pay expert designers.
>> Vasilis - Likes flat, but wordmark not so much.
>> Milo - Likes flat, but workmark needs changing, TM placement too.
>> Rob - Poll, but its not decision making. PMC decides in end. PMC likes
>> data, more the better (ie. poll data). "Consider conferences and booth
>> materials, CD prints, etc."
>> Janl - Agrees poll for decision is bad idea, but poll for data is good.
>> "Keep it similar to classic orb". "Doesn't have to be flat" but Janl
>> doesn't state outright if flat is bad.
>> Graham L - "Logo is not a computer icon". Print is a huge part of
>> marketing. Print good -> electronically good, but not necessarily other way
>> around.
>> 
>> I could set up a visual poll and share multiple time over facebook and
>> social media.
>> 
>> http://freeonlinesurveys.com/app/showpoll.asp?qid=244375&sid=xz7athj6ytcg4mb244375&new=True
>> 
>> Respond with your favourite 3 logo please, or top 2 or 1. The logos that
>> score the least will be eliminated:
>> 
>> 1. Flattened Logo
>> 2. Kevin G. Flat Feather.
>> 3. third pick abstained.
>> 
> 
> I would also include:
> 
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/download/attachments/31818000/OO_4_final_design_Robin-Fowler.jpg?version=1&modificationDate=1365884183026
> 
> Yes, the feather is a bit too big but it could be made smaller...
> 
> I guess we work on lettering after the logo?
> 
> Thanks for all this work by everybody!
> 
> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 12:13 PM, Ian Lynch  wrote:
>> 
>>> On 13 April 2013 16:25, Graham Lauder  wrote:
>>> 
> Hi Milos,
> 
> On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 06:45:18PM +0200, Milosh Vujnovic wrote:
>> Hi guys,
>> 
>> just a quick comment and clarification regarding printing and
>> logos.
>> Print-friendly version (vector, CMYK) is crucial to be prepared
>> during logo design process. This includes color and black&white
>> version (on light and dark background).
>> 
>> I must disagree with the comments on that printing is rarely used
>> anymore - few examples include billboards, fair stands, business
>> cards, letterheads and other stationery, and so on.
> 
> But OpenOffice is a desktop application. For me, this means the main
> focus should be in a logo that looks good everywhere where it is
>> mainly
> used, in the user's desktop (even in the window title bar) and the
> website (even in the website favicon). Thus, IMHO, printing has the
> lowest priority.
> 
> 
> Regards
 
 I have been keeping out of this conversation because I don't have time
>> at
 the
 moment to give sufficient focus to OO, but I have been reading the list
>>> as
 I
 am able.  The above statement however prompts me to respond.
 
 The main focus of the logo is to identify and attract. The statement
>>> above
 shows a limited understanding of marketing.  The advent of computers
>> has
 far
 from given us a paperless office, it has in fact increased paper usage
>>> by a
 huge margin.  Print media is a hugely significant part of marketing
 collateral.  Flyers, posters CD sleeves and labels, business cards etc.
 Whenever reviews are printed in magazines there should be a logo with
>> the
 article.  Logo is not just about finding OO on a computer, that's an
>>> icon.
 
 The logo should work in print (specifically worst case scenario which
>> is
>>> 4
 colour on newsprint) and it will work digitally, the opposite does not
 necessarily follow.
 
 Cheers
 GL
 
 ---

Re: Conversation: Pick A Logo

[Kevin Grignon]

Hello All,

Sorry, i haven't had cycles to work on this. 

Please consider these votes a selection of direction as final adjustments will 
need to be made to the graphics and text. 

It appears there is interest in a flat treatment. Other than that, palette, 
fonts and relation ship to app icons and other graphics is still open. 

Sorry to open a can of worms, but design is not linear, is not well suited for 
polls. Rather, select a direction, say flat, then open a quick iteration to 
explore flat. Incremental decisions will allow us to refine. It is not all or 
nothing. Also, consider the synergy which is possible by combining elements 
from different designs. 

Regards,
Kevin

On Apr 15, 2013, at 6:27 AM, Kay Schenk  wrote:

> On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 3:42 PM, Samer Mansour  wrote:
> 
>> Summary of feedback (which I found made points):
>> 
>> Samer - Lets go flat, its strong in all aspects brought up.
>> Kay S. - Agrees with flat logo. Poll should be limited to few.
>> Robin - Wordmarks need more attention (not logo specific), Vasilis logo is
>> cool, downside too different. Robin made a similar refresh with/without
>> feather. Scales his orb down, no indication for his logo preference (he did
>> submit one more). Agrees technical aspect of print, but its not deciding
>> factor (I agree but it should be satisfied).
>> Dave F - Wordmark needs attention as well, likes flat logo.
>> Dennis - Check with trademark@
>> Andrea - Likes orb, not a fan of flat (as its been used as a surrogate in
>> the past due to limitations).
>> Alexandro - alters Robins logo.
>> Juergen - What about stand alone logo for buttons, stickers. Proposes we
>> should poll.
>> Kadal - "Because companies do it, we shouldn't?" - not sure that is
>> convincing b/c they pay expert designers.
>> Vasilis - Likes flat, but wordmark not so much.
>> Milo - Likes flat, but workmark needs changing, TM placement too.
>> Rob - Poll, but its not decision making. PMC decides in end. PMC likes
>> data, more the better (ie. poll data). "Consider conferences and booth
>> materials, CD prints, etc."
>> Janl - Agrees poll for decision is bad idea, but poll for data is good.
>> "Keep it similar to classic orb". "Doesn't have to be flat" but Janl
>> doesn't state outright if flat is bad.
>> Graham L - "Logo is not a computer icon". Print is a huge part of
>> marketing. Print good -> electronically good, but not necessarily other way
>> around.
>> 
>> I could set up a visual poll and share multiple time over facebook and
>> social media.
>> 
>> http://freeonlinesurveys.com/app/showpoll.asp?qid=244375&sid=xz7athj6ytcg4mb244375&new=True
>> 
>> Respond with your favourite 3 logo please, or top 2 or 1. The logos that
>> score the least will be eliminated:
>> 
>> 1. Flattened Logo
>> 2. Kevin G. Flat Feather.
>> 3. third pick abstained.
>> 
> 
> I would also include:
> 
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/download/attachments/31818000/OO_4_final_design_Robin-Fowler.jpg?version=1&modificationDate=1365884183026
> 
> Yes, the feather is a bit too big but it could be made smaller...
> 
> I guess we work on lettering after the logo?
> 
> Thanks for all this work by everybody!
> 
> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 12:13 PM, Ian Lynch  wrote:
>> 
>>> On 13 April 2013 16:25, Graham Lauder  wrote:
>>> 
> Hi Milos,
> 
> On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 06:45:18PM +0200, Milosh Vujnovic wrote:
>> Hi guys,
>> 
>> just a quick comment and clarification regarding printing and
>> logos.
>> Print-friendly version (vector, CMYK) is crucial to be prepared
>> during logo design process. This includes color and black&white
>> version (on light and dark background).
>> 
>> I must disagree with the comments on that printing is rarely used
>> anymore - few examples include billboards, fair stands, business
>> cards, letterheads and other stationery, and so on.
> 
> But OpenOffice is a desktop application. For me, this means the main
> focus should be in a logo that looks good everywhere where it is
>> mainly
> used, in the user's desktop (even in the window title bar) and the
> website (even in the website favicon). Thus, IMHO, printing has the
> lowest priority.
> 
> 
> Regards
 
 I have been keeping out of this conversation because I don't have time
>> at
 the
 moment to give sufficient focus to OO, but I have been reading the list
>>> as
 I
 am able.  The above statement however prompts me to respond.
 
 The main focus of the logo is to identify and attract. The statement
>>> above
 shows a limited understanding of marketing.  The advent of computers
>> has
 far
 from given us a paperless office, it has in fact increased paper usage
>>> by a
 huge margin.  Print media is a hugely significant part of marketing
 collateral.  Flyers, posters CD sleeves and labels, business cards etc.
 Whenever reviews are printed in magazines there should be a l

Re: Do we need a survey mechanism?

[Kevin Grignon]

KG02 - see comments inline

On Mar 19, 2013, at 6:11 AM, Kay Schenk  wrote:

> On Sun, Mar 17, 2013 at 6:09 PM, Kevin Grignon 
> wrote:
> 
>> KG01 - see comments inline.
>> 
>> On Mar 18, 2013, at 1:59 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:
>> 
>>> On Sun, Mar 17, 2013 at 1:10 PM, RGB ES  wrote:
>>>> 2013/3/17 Kay Schenk 
>>>> 
>>>>> In light of our recent start on Strategic Planning, is it worthwhile to
>>>>> investigate some sort of survey mechanism?
>> 
>> KG01 - Graham and I set up a LimeSurvey account, which he hosts. I am the
>> tool admin.
>> 
>> 
>>>>> I know we've used Google
>>>>> Moderator, and I see there were mixed opinions on that.
>> 
>> KG01 - yes, this more a discussion tool
>> 
>>>>> We really need to
>>>>> get a better feel of WHAT our end users are doing with AOO I think,
>> before
>>>>> we can get into any indepth product planning.
>> 
>> KG01 - yes, this was our goal when we launched the survey effort last
>> year. Actually, the survey process is documented in the AOO UX wiki. We
>> developed the baseline demographic questions which accompany topic specific
>> survey topics.
>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> See related thread on using BZ:
>>>>> 
>>>>> http://markmail.org/message/5a4j74e4oths55rg
>>>>> 
>>>>> Ideally, we should attempt to use some mechanism that doesn't
>> explicitly
>>>>> require an account setup.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I started thinking about this a few days ago and saw that there is a
>> MWiki
>>>>> extension called "Survey". Maybe we could use this.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Coupled with that, is there some way to setup an automatic "login" for
>> such
>>>>> a page display,  but coupled with CAPTCHA for survey submission maybe?
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> +1 for a survey tool. I remember "LimeSurvey"(1) being discussed on this
>>>> list several month ago, but I don't remember the output of that
>> discussion.
>>>> 
>>>> (1) http://www.limesurvey.org/
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> Right.  Google Moderator is more a brainstorming or "ideation" tool.
>>> It is not really a survey tool.  Something like LimeSurvey is much
>>> better for surveys.
>>> 
>>> We have a few options there:
>>> 
>>> 1) See if we can get it hosted here at Apache, on a VM/BSD jail.
>>> 
>> KG01 -this approach is more effort, but highly scalable as it supports the
>> periodic succession of hosting and research volunteers. +1
>> 
>> 
>>> 2) Have a volunteer host it on their own survey.  If we only do
>>> anonymous surveys and don't collect personally identifying information
>>> I think this would be low-risk.
>> 
>> Kg01 -Currently doing this, just need more resources to deploy surveys and
>> take action.
>>> 
>>> 3) With either of the above options we could assign it a subdomain
>>> like surveys.openoffice.org
>>> 
>>> At one point Graham was looking into #2, but that was a while ago.
>> 
>> KG01 - Graham and Kevin and Graham. See notes above.
>> 
> 
> Kevin, does limesurvey require some sort of registration by participants?
> 
> It looks like it does.
> 

KG02 -Hh good question. I hope not, lets verify. 


> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> -Rob
>>> 
>>>> Regards
>>>> Ricardo
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> --
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>> 
>>>>> MzK
>>>>> 
>>>>> "Achieving happiness requires the right combination of Zen and Zin."
>>>>> 
>>> 
>>> -
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>>> 
>> 
>> -
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> MzK
> 
> "Achieving happiness requires the right combination of Zen and Zin."

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Re: Do we need a survey mechanism?

[Kevin Grignon]

KG01 - see comments inline. 

On Mar 18, 2013, at 1:59 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:

> On Sun, Mar 17, 2013 at 1:10 PM, RGB ES  wrote:
>> 2013/3/17 Kay Schenk 
>> 
>>> In light of our recent start on Strategic Planning, is it worthwhile to
>>> investigate some sort of survey mechanism?  

KG01 - Graham and I set up a LimeSurvey account, which he hosts. I am the tool 
admin. 


>>> I know we've used Google
>>> Moderator, and I see there were mixed opinions on that.

KG01 - yes, this more a discussion tool

>>> We really need to
>>> get a better feel of WHAT our end users are doing with AOO I think, before
>>> we can get into any indepth product planning.

KG01 - yes, this was our goal when we launched the survey effort last year. 
Actually, the survey process is documented in the AOO UX wiki. We developed the 
baseline demographic questions which accompany topic specific survey topics. 

>>> 
>>> See related thread on using BZ:
>>> 
>>> http://markmail.org/message/5a4j74e4oths55rg
>>> 
>>> Ideally, we should attempt to use some mechanism that doesn't explicitly
>>> require an account setup.
>>> 
>>> I started thinking about this a few days ago and saw that there is a MWiki
>>> extension called "Survey". Maybe we could use this.
>>> 
>>> Coupled with that, is there some way to setup an automatic "login" for such
>>> a page display,  but coupled with CAPTCHA for survey submission maybe?
>>> 
>> 
>> +1 for a survey tool. I remember "LimeSurvey"(1) being discussed on this
>> list several month ago, but I don't remember the output of that discussion.
>> 
>> (1) http://www.limesurvey.org/
>> 
> 
> Right.  Google Moderator is more a brainstorming or "ideation" tool.
> It is not really a survey tool.  Something like LimeSurvey is much
> better for surveys.
> 
> We have a few options there:
> 
> 1) See if we can get it hosted here at Apache, on a VM/BSD jail.
> 
KG01 -this approach is more effort, but highly scalable as it supports the 
periodic succession of hosting and research volunteers. +1


> 2) Have a volunteer host it on their own survey.  If we only do
> anonymous surveys and don't collect personally identifying information
> I think this would be low-risk.

Kg01 -Currently doing this, just need more resources to deploy surveys and take 
action. 
> 
> 3) With either of the above options we could assign it a subdomain
> like surveys.openoffice.org
> 
> At one point Graham was looking into #2, but that was a while ago.

KG01 - Graham and Kevin and Graham. See notes above. 

> 
> -Rob
> 
>> Regards
>> Ricardo
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>> 
>>> MzK
>>> 
>>> "Achieving happiness requires the right combination of Zen and Zin."
>>> 
> 
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
> 

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Re: AOO logo for special purposes?

[Kevin Grignon]

There is a logo proposal for an updated logo which actually has an arrow over 
the orb. 

Check out the AOO 4.0 logo proposals on the marketing wiki. 

Kevin. 

On Mar 15, 2013, at 5:15 PM, Jörg Schmidt  wrote:

>> We've done some special logo variation.  For example, Drew made the
>> "Get it here" logo:  http://openoffice.apache.org/get-it-here.html
> 
> yes, I know
> 
>>> From a trademark perspective, this can be a good idea to keep the
>> original logo for use only in the product and the website, but then
>> create special, but related logos for other things.
> 
> Yes.
> 
> My concern at the moment is a first AOO-pin, because I always had an 
> OpenOffice.org pin.
> 
> An Apache-pin (eg http://shop.kernelconcepts.de/images/apache-pin.jpg) 
> advertises not accurate enough for AOO.
> 
>> (Also, I think there are more graphics people on the marketing list,
>> so you might want to ask the same question there)
> 
> OK, I'll do that, I need only register there first.
> 
> 
> 
> Greetings,
> Jörg
> 
> 
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
> 

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Re: Branding Refresh For AOO 4.0 [Closing in 72hrs]

[Kevin Grignon]

Hello all,

Recruiting designers is great, and if we start to refine our current design 
submissions, we can leverage any additional support to accelerate the design 
avtivity  

As a reminder, we have a number of submissions that we should start 
considering. 

Design is iterative, we need to review the submissions and identify which 
design elements resonate, and continue to iterate.

It feels like the challenge right now is how to move the iterative design 
process forward. 

I could propose a process to help drive the design process forward. 

Thoughts?

Kevin



On Mar 6, 2013, at 10:46 PM, Samer Mansour  wrote:

> That looks great!
> 
> On Mon, Mar 4, 2013 at 5:00 PM, Andrea Pescetti  wrote:
> 
>> On 02/03/2013 Samer Mansour wrote:
>> 
>>> I've populated some minimal how to participate info on
>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/**confluence/display/OOOUSERS/**
>>> Apache+OpenOffice+4.0+Brand+**Refresh+Project
>>> .
>>> Could you help with making that a blog post?  Even if its short "Call
>>> For Designers" And a link to the above
>>> 
>> 
>> Thanks. I've put together a draft blog post, using your text, at
>> 
>> http://blogs.apache.org/**preview/OOo/?previewEntry=**
>> call_for_designers_apache_**openoffice
>> 
>> Comments/suggestions welcome.
>> 
>> Regards,
>>  Andrea.
>> 
>> --**--**-
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: 
>> dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.**apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>> 
>> 

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Re: I Volunteer

[Kevin Grignon]

Augustus,

We also have many ux design explorations ready to go. 

See the UX page on wiki.  

Reach out to me for more info. 

Regards,
Kevin

On Feb 18, 2013, at 6:51 AM, Andrea Pescetti  wrote:

> Augustus - Aparanji Fine Arts wrote:
>> I'm a graduate of Photography (BFA) from Jawaharlal Nehru University,
>> Hyderabad, India and got interest in Graphic Designing with great zeal
>> over art and aesthetics.
>> I like to work as volunteer for you.
> 
> Welcome, Augustus! Your skills make you a perfect candidate for the ongoing 
> logo discussions currently being held on the marketing mailing list.
> 
> See http://openoffice.apache.org/orientation/intro-marketing.html for more 
> information on joining the OpenOffice marketing group and see the wiki to get 
> up to speed with the current logo discussions: for example,
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO4+-+Logo
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO4+-+Desktop+Icons
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Branding+Planning
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Apache+OpenOffice+4.0+Brand+Refresh+Project
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO4+-+Social+Sites
> 
> Regards,
>  Andrea.

Re: Helping with development

[Kevin Grignon]

Gerek,

Thanks for generous offer. 
Yes there are many open visual design and user experience design tasks. 

We are currently exiting a branding refresh. 

See : 
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Apache+OpenOffice+4.0+Brand+Refresh+Project

There is also a design task backlog on the UX wiki. I'll send along the link in 
another note. 

Regards,
Kevin

On Feb 27, 2013, at 3:15 PM, "ITH.sk | Gerek Juraj"  wrote:

> Hi there
> 
> I have interest to help you in graphic way for your products of Open
> office. Im designer with long time praxis and i have a many sucessfull
> projects behind me. If you want to improve your graphic environment in any
> way like website or some program please contact me.
> 
> -- 
> *Best Regards*
> 
> *Gerek Juraj**
> *
> Štefánikova 264/30
> 029 01 Námestovo*
> *
> 
> telefón : +421 911 316 241
> web : * www.ith.sk*
> e-mail : ge...@ith.sk*
> *
> 
> IČO : 43418635
> DIČ : SK1074736278

Re: Two ideas for supporting images as well as text links in announcement area of website

[Kevin Grignon]

And... We could create a community tab in the new side bar to promote similiar 
outreach messaging. 

On Feb 15, 2013, at 6:23 AM, Kay Schenk  wrote:

> On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 12:24 PM, Rob Weir  wrote:
> 
>> I'd like to run this by as an idea.
>> 
>> Today, the announcement at the top of our website is controlled by this
>> file:
>> 
>> 
>> https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/ooo/ooo-site/trunk/content/brand.mdtext
>> 
>> The "announce" and "announceurl" values  then enter into the
>> templating process via:
>> 
>> 
>> https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/ooo/ooo-site/trunk/templates/brand.html
>> 
>> Specifically:
>> 
>> {% block announce %}{% if headers.announce %}> href="{{ headers.announceurl }}" title="{{ headers.announcetip }}">{{
>> headers.announce }}{% endif %}{% endblock %}
>> 
>> So what if we want to support images there as well?
>> 
>> Two approaches:
>> 
>> 1) Add additional possible value for brand.mdtext, "announceimage".
>> Change logic in brand.html so it follows some precedence order, say
>> look for announceimage first, if that exists, put an  there,
>> otherwise look for announce and display that as a  hyperlink.
>> 
>> 2) Or, we could just change announce so it is the contents of a .
>> So brand.html is actually simplified, and brand.mdtext would contain
>> the actual markup.  For example, it could be: announce=> href="foo.html">
>> 
> 
> The Announcements line already has a div generated for it ---
> 
> see generated source:
> 
>  href="http://openoffice.apache.org/get-involved.html
> http://openoffice.apache.org/get-involved.html>"
> title="Read the announcement">Volunteers needed in all areas — Help us
> make 4.0 the best OpenOffice ever!
> 
> If this helps. Style is in:
> 
> http://www.openoffice.org/css/ooo.css
> 
> But you are correct, the WAY this is generated would need some changes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> 
>> #2 has the advantage of flexibility, that it allows other kinds of
>> markup to be inserted there, including lists, tables, etc..  Of
>> course, UI-wise, there is not a lot of space to play with, but it
>> would have that flexibility.
>> 
>> Any thoughts?
>> 
> 
> I would need to see some examples before any more thoughts on this. Right
> now I think the format of the Announcements really needs some improvement
> -- via margins especially.
> 
> Any images etc well might not work real well with current design.
> 
> If you have something particular in mind, some mockups would help.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> 
>> -Rob
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> MzK
> 
> "Achieving happiness requires the right combination of Zen and Zin."

Re: Branding Refresh For AOO 4.0 [Closing in 72hrs]

[Kevin Grignon]

On Mon, Feb 25, 2013 at 12:46 PM, Kevin Grignon
wrote:

> My pleasure.
>
> On Feb 25, 2013, at 4:26 AM, Samer Mansour  wrote:
>
> > Kevin Grignon if you have spare time and experience in the area of design
> > language and messaging your help would be really appreciated as I have
> > limited experience in this area.  If you have a cwiki account, I don't
> mind
> > if you alter the pages I've worked on.
> >
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Apache+OpenOffice+4.0+Brand+Refresh+Project
> >
> > Andrea I'll try to populate the wiki better so that it leads into each
> > design area and add more contact information and submission help so
> > volunteers know how to subscribe to the marketing mailing list and post
> > their proposals to the cwiki. Then we can blog saying we need designers
> for
> > ideas and to help implement.
> >
> > This is going to take me a few days, I'm really busy in the next day or
> so.
> >
> > Samer
> >
> > On Sun, Feb 24, 2013 at 3:51 AM, Andrea Pescetti  >wrote:
> >
> >> On 23/02/2013 Rob Weir wrote:
> >>
> >>> My advice:  continue pushing the effort forward, but avoid the
> >>> perception of exclusion that comes by specifying a hard deadline,
> >>> especially a sudden one.  The progress of AOO 4.0 will create its own
> >>> practical deadline.
> >>>
> >>
> >> And my advice (in addition to agreeing with Rob on this): get exposure.
> >>
> >> The text in
> >> https://cwiki.apache.org/**confluence/display/OOOUSERS/**
> >> Apache+OpenOffice+4.0+Brand+**Refresh+Project<
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Apache+OpenOffice+4.0+Brand+Refresh+Project
> >
> >> can be copied almost verbatim to a blog post that can generate
> awareness,
> >> traffic and involvement, and perhaps a few unusable submissions, but
> also a
> >> few good ones.
> >>
> >> Choosing a new logo is an occasion to get more attention on one hand,
> and
> >> a duty to inform current users on the other hand: we are changing a
> >> well-known brand and this need proper communication.
> >>
> >> I've already written this, but it would be good to add to
> >> https://cwiki.apache.org/**confluence/display/OOOUSERS/**
> >> Apache+OpenOffice+4.0+Brand+**Refresh+Project<
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Apache+OpenOffice+4.0+Brand+Refresh+Project>(and
> to the possible blog post) some contact information, possibly the
> >> marketing or dev list. If you tweak the text so that it can be used as a
> >> blog post, I can take care of posting it to
> http://blogs.apache.org/OOo/
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>  Andrea.
> >>
>

KG-01: I've added my logo submissions to the 4.0 logo concepts page.

See:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO+4.x+-+Logo+Explorations

Regards,
Kevin

Re: Sidebar color scheme survey

[Kevin Grignon]

KG01 - see comments inline. 

On Feb 25, 2013, at 4:55 PM, Andre Fischer  wrote:

> Am 21.02.2013 16:26, schrieb Regina Henschel:
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Xin Li schrieb:
>> [..]
>>> So I create a light-weight gray proposal based on the option we discussed
>>> before.I use a light grey on the side bar and use a gradient for the
>>> section title.
>>> 
>>> And I also align the same light grey to slide thumbnail panel background in
>>> Presentation. Because the content area on the center should have the
>>> highest priority, the rest elements should have lower priorities, and items
>>> with the same priority should be treated with the same way.
>>> 
>>> I have added the latest design(option10) to AOO UX wiki page. Please see
>>> the latest design by the link:
>>> http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_Panel_-_User_Interface_Design_Proposals#Task_Pane_Content_Panel_-_UX_Design_propoals
>>>  
>>> 
>>> Welcome to share your thoughts and ideas. Thanks.
>>> 
>> 
>> Can you make a little change and draw the color gradient of the subtitles 
>> the other way round: light color at the top edge and darker color at the 
>> bottom edge? And put the pictures side by side to allow to compare them?
> 
> I don´t think that would work.  The current orientation of the gradient is 
> chosen so that the title bar blends into the panel so that the user can 
> recognize both to belong together.  Inverting the gradient would work only 
> when we make the background of the panel dark.
> 
KG01 - exactly, the goal is to differentiate the section titles from each other 
while reinforcing the association between section header and it's content. Who 
said design was easy :) other solutions could be explored if the gradient is 
not ideal. 

>> 
>> Background for the request: When ever I see such gradient in an UI, it 
>> assumes, that the light comes from left-top, so that the top and the left 
>> parts of the elements are lighter then the right and bottom parts.
> 
> AOO is not a physics simulation.
> 
> -Andre
> 

Re: Branding Refresh For AOO 4.0 [Closing in 72hrs]

[Kevin Grignon]

My pleasure. 

On Feb 25, 2013, at 4:26 AM, Samer Mansour  wrote:

> Kevin Grignon if you have spare time and experience in the area of design
> language and messaging your help would be really appreciated as I have
> limited experience in this area.  If you have a cwiki account, I don't mind
> if you alter the pages I've worked on.
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Apache+OpenOffice+4.0+Brand+Refresh+Project
> 
> Andrea I'll try to populate the wiki better so that it leads into each
> design area and add more contact information and submission help so
> volunteers know how to subscribe to the marketing mailing list and post
> their proposals to the cwiki. Then we can blog saying we need designers for
> ideas and to help implement.
> 
> This is going to take me a few days, I'm really busy in the next day or so.
> 
> Samer
> 
> On Sun, Feb 24, 2013 at 3:51 AM, Andrea Pescetti wrote:
> 
>> On 23/02/2013 Rob Weir wrote:
>> 
>>> My advice:  continue pushing the effort forward, but avoid the
>>> perception of exclusion that comes by specifying a hard deadline,
>>> especially a sudden one.  The progress of AOO 4.0 will create its own
>>> practical deadline.
>>> 
>> 
>> And my advice (in addition to agreeing with Rob on this): get exposure.
>> 
>> The text in
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/**confluence/display/OOOUSERS/**
>> Apache+OpenOffice+4.0+Brand+**Refresh+Project<https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Apache+OpenOffice+4.0+Brand+Refresh+Project>
>> can be copied almost verbatim to a blog post that can generate awareness,
>> traffic and involvement, and perhaps a few unusable submissions, but also a
>> few good ones.
>> 
>> Choosing a new logo is an occasion to get more attention on one hand, and
>> a duty to inform current users on the other hand: we are changing a
>> well-known brand and this need proper communication.
>> 
>> I've already written this, but it would be good to add to
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/**confluence/display/OOOUSERS/**
>> Apache+OpenOffice+4.0+Brand+**Refresh+Project<https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Apache+OpenOffice+4.0+Brand+Refresh+Project>(and
>>  to the possible blog post) some contact information, possibly the
>> marketing or dev list. If you tweak the text so that it can be used as a
>> blog post, I can take care of posting it to http://blogs.apache.org/OOo/
>> 
>> Regards,
>>  Andrea.
>> 

Re: Branding Refresh For AOO 4.0 [Closing in 72hrs]

[Kevin Grignon]

Sorry for top post. Great discussion. 

I'm glad to see some traction here. 

I will submit some designs  options for consideration. Please provide a proper 
window of opportunity. 

I feel this initiative is great, and if we focus on what as well as how, we can 
move forward.

I suggest we focus on the criteria for success, from a design language and 
messaging perspective. 

Earlier in this release, I have floated some ideas, as have others, and lacking 
a discussion on design criteria, the feedback was not generative, which places 
momentum and designer interest at risk. 

Can we please add the messaging goals to the marketing initiative page. These 
are available in the 4.0 exploration pages. 

Regards,
Kevin


On Feb 24, 2013, at 6:03 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:

> On Sat, Feb 23, 2013 at 12:36 PM, Samer Mansour  wrote:
>> Hey Everyone,
>> 
>> Let me first admit I felt Saturday (72 hrs) was short, but at the same time
>> necessary. I expected someone would have said "Wait I volunteer to make a
>> proposal but I just don't have enough time in the next few days."
>> 
>> On date and rush:
>> The date that floated for design assets to be ready for consumption is
>> April 4th, 2013 which is 40 days from this writing.  We all would like to
>> have the refresh integrated into the RCs, where applicable.  What I've seen
>> produced in the last two months has been more than the previous 10 months
>> and is amazing work. If we pick something and just do it, I think we can
>> make the 04/04 target.  Our volunteers are very eager to start.
>> 
> 
> I'd just start moving toward the target.  If there is consensus by
> that date, then great,  If there is not, then great.  If a new
> proposal comes in at the last minute and there is consensus to take
> it, then great.  If a last minute proposal comes in and there is not
> consensus to take it, then fine.  There is no need for a hard deadline
> on submissions.  Suggesting a hard deadline just triggers the kind of
> anguish that you are seeing now.
> 
> 
>> On Voting:
>> I asked for comments into the wiki's so that everyone can proposes ideas
>> even if they are not artistically inclined.  I'm relatively new to the
>> community so I'm not sure what warrants a vote or how a change like in this
>> particular situation is incorporated into the product, its not code to be
>> checked in per say, but it is an asset.
>> 
> 
> There are different approaches.  If we had a grand contest, like Flex
> did, and received 50 proposals, then some sort of voting procedure
> would the practical approach to determine the most popular choice.
> Not necessarily the best choice by any objective criterion, but the
> most popular approach.
> 
> But nothing forces us to follow that approach.  It would be equally
> valid (from a community perspective) to work with the handful of
> proposals that we've received over the past 10 months or so, and work
> toward a consensus among those, or among variations on those.
> 
> Of course, the usual caveats apply.   "Design by committee" has some
> of the same downsides as having a vote by a group of non-experts.
> 
>> On Flex:
>> Our community's make up is a little different. We have everyday students
>> and diverse work industries using our product. Flex's community by nature
>> is more exposed to designers.  I would be horrified to find flex's
>> community had anything less than an amazing site.  Having said that I would
>> totally be okay with approaching the flex community and asking humbly that
>> we could use some help of theirs. Also I think their designer nature
>> contributed to why they may have had 50 proposals :D
>> 
>> Moving Forward:
>> I know this will be a very opinionated activity.  I invite anyone who is
>> passionate about this activity to join the marketing team to help us do the
>> work and complete the assets.
>> I need a shed and they give me a purple one, I'm going to have to trust
>> them. It is easier for me to take the opinion of someone if they did the
>> work.
>> 
> 
> My advice:  continue pushing the effort forward, but avoid the
> perception of exclusion that comes by specifying a hard deadline,
> especially a sudden one.  The progress of AOO 4.0 will create its own
> practical deadline.
> 
> 
>> Integration of the team:
>> I've already seen activity that leads me to believe I'm taking the right
>> path.  Robin proposed a full design and someone suggested the script font
>> was a little off.  Robin agreed, the output now is something +2 agree
>> with.  If more input is given, my good faith says it will converge to a
>> high percentage of the community's desires, but not necessarily everyone's.
>> 
> 
> The trick is for community members to recognize the dangers of
> bikeshedding and know when to withhold their good-intentioned
> feedback.  That is really the only way.  If we all input our slight
> tweaks then we will circle around forever, and lose integrity of the
> design in the process.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> -Rob
> 
>> Samer Mansour

Re: Sidebar color scheme survey

[Kevin Grignon]

On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 9:11 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:

> On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 7:20 PM, Kevin Grignon 
> wrote:
> > KG 01
> >
> > On Feb 8, 2013, at 6:17 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:
> >
> >> On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 4:01 PM, Andrea Pescetti 
> wrote:
> >>> On 29/01/2013 Andre Fischer wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> I would like to ask you to either look at the mockups at [1] or try
> the
> >>>> developer builds [2] and tell me what color scheme you like best.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> We have two votes for A2 at
> >>>
> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/openoffice-progetto-it/201301.mbox/browser
> >>> to which I'll add mine too. So make it +3 for proposal A2 as listed at
> >>>
> http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_Panel_-_User_Interface_Design_Proposals#Task_Pane_Content_Panel_-_UX_Design_propoals
> >>>
> >>
> >> A bunch of responses on Facebook as well:
> >>
> >> https://www.facebook.com/ApacheOO/posts/490670047645797
> >>
> >> I asked for a preference and "why", so the comments are interesting as
> well.
> >>
> >> -Rob
> >
> > Can someone summarize the sentiment on facebook for those of us who
> cannot access such social media sites.
> >
>
> Sorry.  It is easy to forget that Facebook is not accessible
> everywhere.  Here is a copy/paste:
>
>
> Tomáš Kebert B2. Gradient would look inconsistent on different
> platforms, emboss looks oldschool, and so does the dark gray
> background of titles.
>
> Tomáš Kebert On a different note, I think something like "apply these
> setting on the style used" would come in handy added to such panel.
>
> Martin Schröder i'd vote for proposal 2, but i don't like either of
> a,b,c. i think b is the most clearly variant, but the groups of
> buttons should be separated differently (i don't know how...)
>
> Shaun Michael Coates Proposal 3 - My eyes easily distinguished content
> panels with this option.
>
> Proposal B - The simple lines as a spliter looks the cleanest.
>
> Rob Lewellyn Proposal 3. Nicest contrast!
>
> Luis Elizondo B3 is my favorite. B2 it's nice too.
>
> Michael Cohen B3 is my pick! It's easy to read and it's separates the
> buttons nicely.
>
> Matthew Nelson B3 BINGO!
>
> Mindaugas Baranauskas A3
>
> Francesco Esposito even the toolbar at the top of the same color
> (gray), the pale blue of Windows is horrible
>
> Francesco Esposito A2 or B2
>
> Raffaello Palandri A1
>
> Osvaldo Meloni VERY DIFFICUL diria Tevez !
>
> Ariel Shushan B3 - easiest to read
>
> Gonzalo Varela B1 for me. Classy, easy on eyes and clear to read, I
> avoid bright backgrunds in apps that you spend a lot of time workin on
> it. Keep it simple please.
>
> Cátia Gonçalves B2
>
>
> Rob,

Thanks for sharing.

Two comments align with some earlier comments in this thread:

1) use a grey background to keep the focus on the document
2) use of gradient should be used to provide contrast where required

Kevin



>
> > Thanks,
> > Kevin
> >
> >
> >
> >>
> >>> Regards,
> >>>  Andrea.
>

Re: [bikeshed] I like blue titles.

[Kevin Grignon]

If I understand correctly, the goal is to emphasize the message and links to 
drive action. 

Robs suggestion to create a compelling graphic makes sense. 

Beyond font colour, we can use more info design and visual design to call 
attention to the message. 

Regards,
Kevin


On Feb 2, 2013, at 7:16 AM, Dave Fisher  wrote:

> 
> On Feb 1, 2013, at 3:04 PM, Pedro Giffuni wrote:
> 
>> Thank you Dave!
>> 
>> It's still perfectly visible without being too scandalous. I like it.
>> 
>> Now for a new bikeshed ... I would use "Volunteers wanted", instead of 
>> "Volunteers needed" ;).
> 
> Semantics are important!
> 
>> 
>> Just kidding ...  :).
> 
> It's not a bikeshed it is a good point! Done!
> 
> Regards,
> Dave
> 
>> 
>> Pedro.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> Da: Dave Fisher 
>>> A: dev@openoffice.apache.org 
>>> Inviato: Venerdì 1 Febbraio 2013 17:49
>>> Oggetto: Re: [bikeshed] I like blue titles.
>>> 
>>> On Feb 1, 2013, at 1:56 PM, Tanja Meece wrote:
>>> 
 Red immediately sends up a warning flag in my mind and that of other user's
 I'm sure.
>>> 
>>> That was the original intent.
>>> 
 There has to be some way to change the color.
>>> 
>>> There is and it is done! It is now the same blue as the rest of the header 
>>> text.
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> Dave
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 
 TMCM
 
 On Feb 1, 2013 9:43 AM, "Pedro Giffuni"  wrote:
> 
> 
>> 
>> Da: Dave Fisher
> ...
 Can we change the red title in the website ("Call for Volunteers",
 as of lately) to dark blue?
 
 The reasons:
 
 - The tone of red chosen looks like it was made to fit at the last
 moment. It has no aesthetic coherence with the rest of the website.
>> 
>> It was chosen quickly and I was thinking it would be for unusual events.
>> 
>> 
> Firstly, I hope I am doing this properly, if not I apologize in
 advance.
> 
> I agree. I believe that a red sends the wrong signals. It sends up
 more of a warning flag, rather than an invitation for volunteers.
> 
> The first time I saw it I thought I'd done something wrong.
> 
> I recall it started when we were about to release 3.4 and the blog went
> down so we just had to release on the website.
> 
>> Now it appears to be a common element which is OK.
>> 
> 
> It is being changed everytime there's something to communicate:
> Like if we break (yet) another download milestone.
> 
> The red chair is becoming part of the furniture.
> 
>> 
 
 - It makes us look desperate (or so seem to think some bloggers).
 
>>> 
>>> The concern should be "what works?" Not "what some bloggers think".
>>> Breaking out from the visual clutter of the page is important. We want
>>> to stand out, not blend in and be overlooked. IMHO.
>> 
>> I like blue if it will always be there
>> 
> 
> I suspect we will have it forever :(.
> 
>>> 
>>> Oh course there are other ways of standing out, like with a banner
>>> graphic. That could give us a more professional image while still
>>> standing out.
>> 
>> What ever can be done...
>> 
> 
> Again, just chose a color for the bikeshed that seems average
> among the proposals ;).
> 
> Pedro.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
> 

Re: Sidebar color scheme survey

[Kevin Grignon]

KG 01

On Feb 8, 2013, at 6:17 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:

> On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 4:01 PM, Andrea Pescetti  wrote:
>> On 29/01/2013 Andre Fischer wrote:
>>> 
>>> I would like to ask you to either look at the mockups at [1] or try the
>>> developer builds [2] and tell me what color scheme you like best.
>> 
>> 
>> We have two votes for A2 at
>> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/openoffice-progetto-it/201301.mbox/browser
>> to which I'll add mine too. So make it +3 for proposal A2 as listed at
>> http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_Panel_-_User_Interface_Design_Proposals#Task_Pane_Content_Panel_-_UX_Design_propoals
>> 
> 
> A bunch of responses on Facebook as well:
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/ApacheOO/posts/490670047645797
> 
> I asked for a preference and "why", so the comments are interesting as well.
> 
> -Rob

Can someone summarize the sentiment on facebook for those of us who cannot 
access such social media sites. 

Thanks,
Kevin



> 
>> Regards,
>>  Andrea.

Re: Sidebar color scheme survey

[Kevin Grignon]

Andre,

This is looking really great. 

Re: colour
An initial goal for the sidebar is to compliment, but not compete with of 
distract users from the canvas. In an effort to minimize UI noise and help keep 
the focus on the editor canvas - the work - I recommend we adopt a hybrid of 
proposal 1 & 3: a grey background with suitable contrast for the title 
sections, a darker grey. 

Another option might be to use a gradient for the section title. Darker to 
lighter, top to bottom. This would frame the header, reinforce the 
expand/collapse affordable And reinforce the info architecture. More 
importantly, if the gradient resolved to the background colour, it would 
eliminate the line between the header text and the content. This will 
strengthen the association between the section title and content and mitigate 
the Lego effect. I can prep a sketch to illustrate my point. 

Re: control styles
Again, noise reduction and consistency would be best. Flat backgrounds are 
consistent with other toolbars and reduce non-actionable pixels. I recommend we 
implement Proposal B.  

Again, great job. 

I'm looking forward to exploring new and exciting uses for the sidebar 
framework. 

Best regards,
Kevin



On Jan 29, 2013, at 11:41 PM, Andre Fischer  wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> Development of the sidebar is progressing well.  It already looks a lot like 
> the mockups posted by Xin Li on December 18th [1].  I have concentrated on 
> the underlying framework, so there is only one partially migrated panel so 
> far.  Nevertheless the framework is now flexible enough to think about the 
> default color scheme to use. There are developer builds [2] and an extension 
> that allow live evaluation of the nine different color schemes from [1].
> 
> I would like to ask you to either look at the mockups at [1] or try the 
> developer builds [2] and tell me what color scheme you like best.
> 
> General information about the sidebar, the current state of development and 
> how to help can be found in the wiki [3].
> 
> Thanks in advance for you help,
> Andre
> 
> 
> [1] 
> http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_Panel_-_User_Interface_Design_Proposals#Task_Pane_Content_Panel_-_UX_Design_propoals
> [2] http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Sidebar#Developer_Builds
> [3] http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Sidebar
> 
> PS: I remember Rob having asked the same question on our Facebook site but 
> can not find the email anymore.  I also remember that the feedback was 
> somewhat inconclusive.  Does anybody know the details?
> 

Re: OpenOffice thin client edition - why not?

[Kevin Grignon]

Hello All,

I see a shift in how people capture and manage content. 

We need to make it easy for people to get ideas into the tools, help them 
organize the content, make it look the way they want and share the content. 

Managing files is not an enjoyable part of this story. 

Evernote's approach is gaining market share. 

We need something that is positioned between web editors and thick clients. 
Something where the assets are managed by the tools. 

Just a thought. 

Kevin



On Jan 18, 2013, at 2:59 PM, Fernando Cassia  wrote:

> On Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 4:35 AM, Juergen Schmidt  
> wrote:
>> having a solution for this kind of devices would be of course nice.
> 
> I´m not thinking cloud as in "Google´s cloud" but more like "my PC as
> server and any thin-client device on my home as client".
> 
> In fact, I think the RDP or VNC protocol are enough. In other words,
> as engineers say, let´s keep it according to the "K.I.S.S. principle".
> ;)
> 
> By googling around I was able to find VNC clients for iPads, Android
> devices etc... so with VNC it´d be ´good enough´ and working on a
> local LAN, it´d have no bandwidth issues associated with residential
> broadband connections´ limited upstream and the like...
> 
> Just my $0.02 of course
> FC
> 
> 
> -- 
> During times of Universal Deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary 
> act
> Durante épocas de Engaño Universal, decir la verdad se convierte en un
> Acto Revolucionario
> - George Orwell

Re: [PROPOSAL] New Apache OpenOffice 4 logo proposals...

[Kevin Grignon]

Michael,

Great work. Design is very iterative. Keep pushing!

Using the design explorations is a great way to stimulate a conversation which 
can help us better understand the requirements. Perhaps we could harvest the 
criteria for success in the thread and capture in the wiki  

Then we can make the design review process less subjective by having people 
review design explorations relative to stated goals. 

Also, the mailing list is tough place to review designs, can you post the 
design explorations to the AOO UX wiki?  

Regards,
Kevin


On Dec 23, 2012, at 10:56 AM, Michael Acevedo  wrote:

> I think I've come up with something that is simplistic on the eye but
> beautiful an lively.
> 
> Still working on it but stay tuned.
> 
> 
> On Sat, Dec 22, 2012 at 10:43 PM, Michael Acevedo  wrote:
> 
>> RGB,
>> 
>> I see the ring as something different. The blue to me represents the open
>> blue sky, and the ring around it as a frame to an opening of an open world.
>> 
>> 
>> On Sat, Dec 22, 2012 at 8:16 AM, RGB ES  wrote:
>> 
>>> 2012/12/22 janI 
>>> 
 I am no designer, but I have tried to make a suggestion to better
>>> explain
 what I mean.
 
 The current proposals all have squares / circles etc. and apart from the
 original similarity with windows8 that has a special signal value.
 
 A surface (square/circle etc) especially with a border, signal:
  - limitation or positive a product that fullfills a single purpose
  - closeness or positive a product the specialize in one function
 
 AOO is in my mind much more, we are open at levels where normal products
 can only dream to go:
 - AOO is used in nearly every corner of the earth.
 - AOO is open for translation to no matter how small a language group
 - AOO is open for developers who want to hack their own specialized
 versions
 - AOO is open for repackaging supplying the core of a wider extented
 product.
 I could go on.
 
 I think it is important that our logo signals this freedom and openess
 after all we are OPEN office.
 
>>> 
>>> +1. The ring around the orb give the idea of boundaries, limits, and we
>>> are
>>> trying to go beyond every limit ;)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 
 I know my design is not professional, it is NOT meant to be so please
>>> dont
 judge it on that. It is simply a "thought out of the box", and
>>> hopefully it
 can trigger some ideas.
 
 You can see my "proposal" here:
 http://people.apache.org/~jani/aoo.png
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I like the idea. No sure if it fits well on a page header,
>>> but definitely is a good idea for announcements, t-shirts and a lot of
>>> other situations where a big logo is needed.
>>> 
>>> Regards
>>> Ricardo
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 
 
 Have a nice christmas, whereever you are in the world.
 Jan I.
 
 
 On 21 December 2012 20:56, Michael Acevedo  wrote:
 
> Thanks for the links with logos Armin, I will examine them shortly...
> 
> Have a good afternoon...
> 
> On Fri, Dec 21, 2012 at 1:23 PM, Armin Le Grand <
>>> armin.le.gr...@me.com
>> wrote:
> 
>>Hi Michael,
>> 
>> this (
>>> https://svn.apache.org/repos/**asf/openoffice/ooo-site/trunk/**
>> content/images/AOO_logos/<
> 
 
>>> https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/openoffice/ooo-site/trunk/content/images/AOO_logos/
>> )
>> might help, these are the checked-in logos. You can access it with a
>> browser. Look at the SVG directory there; I am not sure if the
>>> complete
>> gulls will be extractable; I fear they are 'cut', but maybe
>>> repaired by
>> using the other wing.
>> 
>> Looking forward to your suggestions :)
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>>Armin
>> 
>> 
>> On 21.12.2012 17:48, Michael Acevedo wrote:
>> 
>>> Hello Armin,
>>> 
>>> I was tempted to make a rounded corner marquee for the current logo
 but
>>> desisted of the idea after the vereditct of the Apple v. Samsung
>>> case
>>> where
>>> they were able to sue Samsung on using rounded corners for apps on
 their
>>> flavor of android. Still I find the rounded corners tempting and is
>>> actually reflected on the second logo that appeared on the last
>>> jpeg
> file
>>> I
>>> sent yesterday.
>>> 
>>> All of these are good suggestions and I am now thinking of
>>> something
 on
>>> updating the orb, maybe keeping the basic shape of the logo which
>>> is a
>>> circle. I am rambbling here but I might be able to come up with
> something
>>> tangible during the next few hours.
>>> 
>>> Now the only thing I would need to find is an EPS or PSD
>>> high-res version of the AOO gulls. Where can I find that?
>>> 
>>> Thanks for the suggestions.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Friday, December 21, 2012, Armin Le Grand wrote:
>>> 
>>>  Hi Michael,
 
 thanks f

Re: [proposal] Adopt palette to Symphony palette partially

[Kevin Grignon]

On Dec 20, 2012, at 6:06 PM, Armin Le Grand  wrote:

>Hi Kevin,
> 
> On 20.12.2012 12:01, Kevin Grignon wrote:
> snip
>> 
>> Armin,
>> 
>> Great enhancement. In fact this is in the UX backlog.
> 
> Yes, it is, but we need to discuss it and someone has to do it ;-)
> 

Let's use some mockups to make it real. This will help the discussion and drive 
an owner. 

Kevin


>> 
>> Regards,
>> Kevin
>>  
>> 
> 
> Sincerely,
>Armin
> --
> ALG

Re: [PROPOSAL] New Apache OpenOffice 4 logo proposals...

[Kevin Grignon]

Micheal,

Thanks for sharing the mock ups. 

I also like to orb, with the flying documents (aka gulls). 

While I understand that many products use a similar palette and the square 
document elements to reinforce the office tools, I find the use of both square 
and round elements together can feel busy. 

Let's keep pushing the design. 

Also, with regards to the font, is this an open source font. They was talk of 
moving to an open source font. I've experimented with some, but have no clear 
front runner yet. 

Say, would you be open to posting these on the AOO UX wiki. 

Regards,
Kevin

On Dec 20, 2012, at 5:56 PM, Armin Le Grand  wrote:

>Hi Michael,
> 
> I like to continue to use the orb (I think the orb with gulls is simple and 
> optimal, the biggest logos in the world are round and simple ;.))
> 
> One point I especially like on the existing orb is that the gull is sticking 
> out of the orb, somewhat 'freeing' itself. Ths represents 'Open'Office for me 
> graphically. Thus, I do not like the orb to be surrounded by a metal looking 
> ring (better just use the orb's blue with e.g. rounded edges and let the 
> light play and do the rest). The ring cuts off the gull and somewhat 
> 'emprisones' it from my POV.
> 
> We also have more than 4 apps (at lest we sould not limit us to that in the 
> logo, maybe new modules show up one day), so I see it critical to try to 
> represent the single apps in the logo. It is already difficult enough to 
> represent a single app (in the app's default logo) in a way that is intuitive 
> enough to make the user identify which app this document is for with a single 
> look at it.
> 
> Just my 2ct...
> 
> Sincerely,
>Armin
> 
> On 20.12.2012 02:33, Michael Acevedo wrote:
>> Greetings to the AOO Team!
>> 
>> Hello, after a few months of inactivity I've decided to get back in touch
>> with the AOO community. First, congratulations to the AOO team on
>> a successful graduation into a top-level Apache project from the Apache
>> Incubator.
>> 
>> Now the reason on why I am writing this email is to formally submit a logo
>> proposal for the next version of the Apache OpenOffice 4.X logo.
>> Previously, I submitted an initial logo on the Apache OpenOffice Google+
>> community but I went back to the drawing board and created a second version
>> of the logo that both pays respect to the previous Apache OpenOffice orb,
>> but modernizes the look of the overall logo by adding 4 colored squares
>> that represent the four corners of our office suite (Writer, Calc, Impress,
>> and Base) and utilizing a streamlined font.
>> 
>> Without further introductions, below I present my official submission for
>> the Apache OpenOffice 4.X logo.
>> 
>> This first logo, is the proposed official logo for the project that would
>> be used for our webpage and some other materials.
>> 
>> https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-lETVSrwcgJc/UNJpH6G1sxI/ABg/JnpNrXdRgUo/s653/AOO%25204%2520LOGO%2520v2-5%2520Small%2520copy.jpg
>> 
>> There's a secondary logo, which is basically the same logo but changes the
>> proportion of the OpenOffice orb making it better suited for the splash
>> screen that appears at the launch of the application.
>> 
>> https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-uy8gU24uBZw/UNJpH8UiKiI/ABk/xfXTQjO8iQg/s912/AOO%25204%2520LOGO%2520v2-2.png
>> 
>> Hope you guys like it and Happy holidays!
>> 
> 

Re: [proposal] Adopt palette to Symphony palette partially

[Kevin Grignon]

On Dec 20, 2012, at 5:45 PM, Armin Le Grand  wrote:

>Hi List,
> 
> Talking about palettes is always difficult - at the end, it's a question of 
> taste. Nonetheless, we need a palette which is by default installed with the 
> office. You all know the current one (for years ;-)) which I think is far 
> from optimal. Thus, I analyzed the current one and want to share my findings. 
> From that, I want to propose a change for our next release. Also probably not 
> optimal, but optimal in this field depends on the user's eye and cannot be 
> met by a single palette anyways.
> 
> Talking about palettes is also difficult since you need to 'see' something - 
> pictures say more than words. To make that easier, I have prepared some data. 
> Please look at
> 
> A Impress document containing two slides 
> (http://people.apache.org/~alg/Palette/palette.odp)
> The two slides as png's for convenience 
> (http://people.apache.org/~alg/Palette/palette.png, 
> http://people.apache.org/~alg/Palette/palette2.png)
> 
> The following thext refers to figures there, so please take a look to see 
> what the text is about (...if you want to continue reading ;-))
> 
> The current (old?) AOO Palette, It's made up of five groups (from my 
> perspective):
> 
> (a) The 16 VGA colors: These come originally from the times where only 16 
> colors were possible and are in hex color notation exactly all eight 
> combinations of red/green/blue on or off, plus these in half intensity. It 
> *had* technical reasons, but these colors do not have any special meaning for 
> the user today (well, for the programmer). Anyways, they are a result of old 
> technical limitations. I think they are ugly and lead to ugly results when 
> using them directly (but that's my impression).
> 
> (b) The 'Main' Colors: 56 colors which try to build up to eight 
> gradient-stepped ranges, e.g. orange. These ranges are *not* equidistantly 
> spread, but somewhat wild/random (see e.g. the reds). I do not know where 
> they historically come from, but I guess they were done by a deveoper at 
> these days. There are some nice colors among them, but not too many. I always 
> search for useful colors there
> 
> (c) The Pale colors: These seem to be younger than the others, may have to do 
> historically with the StarOffice 5.2 color theme, but I'm not sure. Not too 
> bad, not too good a selection. A group of seven colors which form a nice kind 
> of 'schema' and make your presentation look 'acceptable' when using them 
> together.
> 
> (d) The Chart colors: 12 colors used in the new chart module written some 
> years ago. AFAIK these were added at that time especially to support the user 
> having colors at hand corresponding to the default chart colors. Nice. Useful.
> 
> (e) 'Nice' Colors: A sub-group from (b). One is fix, it's the mentioned 'Blue 
> 9' which is currently the default color for objects and has to be in the 
> palette. I personally like (and often use) 'Blue Gray'. These are a question 
> of taste, I would reccomend the named ones, but we need to collect 'your' 
> favorites here. Keep in mind to keep this number low (probably 4-5) and do 
> not forget that the color you like were not choosen freely, but *because* you 
> were limited to the offered ones, so it might be a compromize you are just 
> used to.
> 
> Quite a mix. I compared it with Syphony's palette and there completely new 
> colors are used. One interesting aspect are the white/gray/black ones: In our 
> current palette these are divided between (a) (black, white and two grays) 
> and (b) (the rest, gray 80% .. gray 20%). This is of course because the first 
> four grays are technically in the old VGA palette. I more than once were mad 
> about finding the correct gray in our palette, because of the bad positioning 
> in it. Symphony has all needed grays in one draw as first entries in the 
> palette (what I would expect nowadays).
> 
> Thus, I propose:
> - Basically use Symphony palette
> - Preserve some nice olors from our old palette, but not more than 4 or 5. 
> The default color needs to be preserved (blue 9). I propose to only keep 
> 'Blue Gray', but let's see which other colors are favorites here...
> - Add the Pale colors
> - Add the Chart colors
> 
> The result is 'hand crafted' in the docs linked above, please have a look :-)
> 
> Another aspect of the new palette is that it copies from Symphony the use of 
> '12-er groups' which look nice when you order the palette in a way that 12 
> colors are in a row, please see the picture. This could be a part of our 
> sidepane in progress.
> 
> One more hint: This palette offers defaults to the user after AOO is newly 
> installed, not more (and not less). It can be changed by the user anytime. 
> Colors can be added/deleted by the user. This has no technical limitations in 
> the sense that changing the palette may influence existing ODF's or other 
> written files. E.g. the chart colors are there to not have to look for them, 
>

Re: [proposal]: Enhance visualisation of Handles

[Kevin Grignon]

"come over to my desk"

Luxury :)



On Dec 14, 2012, at 4:32 PM, Armin Le Grand  wrote:

> On 14.12.2012 10:19, Andre Fischer wrote:
>> On 14.12.2012 10:08, Armin Le Grand wrote:
>>>Hi Andre,
>>> 
>>> On 14.12.2012 09:00, Andre Fischer wrote:
>>>> On 13.12.2012 11:09, Armin Le Grand wrote:
>>>>>Hi Kevin,
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 13.12.2012 11:03, Kevin Grignon wrote:
>>>>>> Armin,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Could you share a screen cap?
>>>>> 
>>>>> I could, but it will be much easier and more valuable when you wait for 
>>>>> the next buildbot builds and install a AOO develop version. Only there 
>>>>> will you be able to change everything yourself. I will not be able to 
>>>>> take into account things like black/colored backgrounds, system color 
>>>>> settings, HighContrast and others.
>>>> 
>>>> I am also interested in a screenshot.  It would save me time and trouble 
>>>> not to have to wait for the next build, locate it, download it and install 
>>>> it.  And I could watch it in the morning on my IPad.
>>> 
>>> Have you tried http://people.apache.org/~alg/ and the files there already? 
>>> There I provided some screenshots, as described in the discussion.
>> 
>> Thanks, I did not see these before.  Which of them shows the new markers?
> 
> It's desribed in the task to this issue 
> (https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=121463). Sorry, I realized 
> that I described these files *only* in the task.
> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> These screenshots are a lot of work, since with a normal one you can show 
>>> only *one* selected object, so it's a lot of hand-crafted work.
>> 
>> I know, I made some for the sidebar.  But if you/I make screenshots then it 
>> saves other people a lot of time.
> 
> Yes, That's why I did do them ;-)
> 
>> 
>>> The main disadvantage is that they can sow only cases of which I was 
>>> thinking, as I tried to describe above. You will have a pretty recent AOO 
>>> version soon anyways, as I know ;-). 
>> 
>> No, I probably won't.  I am currently working mostly on the sidebar branch.
> 
> You may come over to my desk and play with my version if you don't find the 
> time to install a fresh nightly build...
> 
>> 
>>> There is time for discussion and changes until the next release, no need to 
>>> hurry.
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -Andre
>>>> 
>>> Sincerely,
>>>Armin
>>> -- 
>>> ALG
>> 
> --
> ALG

Re: [UX]Comments visibility

[Kevin Grignon]

KG01 - see comments inline 

On Dec 15, 2012, at 11:31 PM, Andrea Pescetti  wrote:

> On 08/12/2012 RGB ES wrote:
>> Some users, mostly when reading an existing document, tend do disable the
>> view of comments with View → Comments. The problem with this option is that
>> comments disappear *completely*, which increase the risk of deleting a note
>> by accident.
> 
KG01 - The system should avoid deleting hidden elements. Should the system try 
to delete content which includes a hidden comment, we should inform the user of 
the consequence of the action, and provide a way to quickly review the comment, 
in context, and give them options on how to proceed. Options could include 1) 
delete content and comment, 2) delete content and push comment to cursor 
location 3) or cancel action. 

> I agree this can be a usability problem.
> 
>> So I think there are two point that can be considered:
>> 1- Set by default the option of viewing note anchors even when "view
>> comments" is disabled.
> 
KG01 - View option for common objects could be simplified. With some task pane 
toolbar view options (clipart gallery, navigator, etc) moving to sidebar task 
pane, we could push a high frequency view options command (dropdown) to the 
main toolbar. Where one click on/off could control view options, such as 
comments. 

> This makes sense, but then we would have to add an option at least in Tools - 
> Options - Writer - View to hide comment anchors too (and it would have to be 
> active only if "Comments" in unset... not very friendly).
> 
>> 2- Make note anchor show a tooltip with the note content, the same way
>> footnote anchors show footnote content when hover over it, but of course
>> only when "view comment" is disable.
> 
KG01 - we could explore user friendly action tool bars as a way to reveal 
comments. 

> This would work, but the user wouldn't get rid of comments completely. He 
> would still see the anchor and I don't know how annoying this would be.
> 
KG01 - I'll add this to the ux backlog. This is an area where we should sketch 
out some concepts, then socialize for feedback. 

> Definitely a good question for UX!

KG - Yup. Keep 'em coming :)

> 
> Regards,
>  Andrea.

Re: Stickers AOO

[Kevin Grignon]

Perhaps we could align with 4.0
Release? 

On Dec 14, 2012, at 4:13 AM, Albino Biasutti Neto  wrote:

> Hi
> 
> 2012/12/10 Kay Schenk :
>> yes, something "new". The color scheme is not right for what we have now,
>> nor is the name...volunteer artists?
> 
> Volunteers to designers? :-)
> 
> Stickers for *notes is very good.
> 
>  Albino

Re: [proposal]: Enhance visualisation of Handles

[Kevin Grignon]

Armin,

Could you share a screen cap?

Any chance of including rotation, shear and skew?

Kevin



On Dec 13, 2012, at 5:53 PM, Armin Le Grand  wrote:

>Hi List,
> 
> On 11.12.2012 14:15, Armin Le Grand wrote:
>>Hi List,
>> 
>> I took the time and started to look technically and bitmap'ally at the 
>> handles and how to make them some nicer, but also more useful (aka slightly 
>> transparent). For deeper information, please see the task 
>> (https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=121463) I have opened for it.
>> 
>> I know handles and how they look is a question of taste; I tried to 
>> carefully alter them and did not take away any existiong options (two sets, 
>> two sizes to choose from, plus HighContrast). To take a look, follow the 
>> link to find the things I changed and the bitmaps in the files referenced 
>> there.
>> 
>> P.S.: I actually used Draw and it's 3D engine to create the handles before 
>> scaling them down in a bitmap program, it's all in there :-)
>> 
>> -- 
>> ALG
> 
> I have comitted this now, mainly that all get the chance to have a look and 
> play around with it. Please do not hesitate when you see negative effects or 
> something that needs to be re-evaluated. Comitting it does not mean it's the 
> end of the story :-)
> 
> For the worst case, svn *is* a time machine. I (still) hope that the handles 
> which are more pleasing to the eye find mostly everyones liking. I was very 
> careful, the change is moderate.
> 
> Just take a look first ;-)
> 
> Sincerely,
>Armin
> 
> --
> ALG

Re: wiki.open office Volunteer Application

[Kevin Grignon]

Doreen, 

Great timing, we've just captured a list of areas that could use some design 
support. 

Check out our ux design opportunity backlog for areas that could use some help. 
Pick an item and share your design explorations on how to improve the product. 
See examples in the wiki. When you have posted some mockups to the wiki, email 
the community, share the link and review the proposed design. Once you feel the 
design is ready for implementation, formally propose the enhancement in the 
community. 

Small or big, all ideas are welcome - no wrong answers. Let's use designs to 
make ideas real and drive change. 

Contact Xin Li or me for more information. 

Best regards,
Kevin




On Dec 13, 2012, at 10:23 AM, Xin Li  wrote:

> Welcome to join us, Doreen. I'm very glad to see new design major volunteer
> to join Apache Open Office. Wish you have fun in our community. Thanks!
> 
> 2012/12/13 Andrew Douglas Pitonyak 
> 
>> On 12/12/2012 12:37 AM, 陶然 wrote:
>> 
>>> Hello,
>>> I'm a collage student ,and my major is industry design.I'm very interested
>>> in wiki open office,so I send you this letter to wonder that may I be a
>>> member of volunteers?
>>> I will be very Appreciate if you agree my joining !
>>> 
>>> Best regards,
>>> Doreen
>>> 
>>> Also, if you intend to edit content on the WIKI, respond to this email
>> (be sure to include the mailing list) and indicate the username to use for
>> your account.
>> 
>> Note that you only require an account if you will edit WIKI content.
>> 
>> --
>> Andrew Pitonyak
>> My Macro Document: 
>> http://www.pitonyak.org/**AndrewMacro.odt
>> Info:  http://www.pitonyak.org/oo.php
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Best regards,
> Xin Li   李欣
> UX designer

Re: Sidebar

[Kevin Grignon]

On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 3:48 PM, Andre Fischer  wrote:

> On 04.12.2012 03:32, Dali Liu wrote:
>
>> Hi Andre,
>> I am planning to merger a extension to sidebar model,  I would like to
>> verify the implementation of the sidebar.
>> Will I start from here:
>> http://wiki.openoffice.org/**wiki/Framework/Article/Tool_**Panels
>> ?
>>
> Hi Dali Liu,
>
> The sidebar is not yet finished.  Actually we just started designing the
> API.
> Eventually we will probably use the functionality described in the "Tool
> Panels" wiki page, but there will be some additional interfaces and
> configuration entries.  At the end of this week I can probably say more.
>
> -Andre
>
>
>
>> 2012/12/3 Andre Fischer 
>>
>>  On 02.12.2012 19:11, Andrea Pescetti wrote:
>>>
>>>  On 30/11/2012 Andre Fischer wrote:

  I will be working on the implementation of the
> sidebar. In the hope of motivating others (you) to join me, I have
> created a wiki page that gives a first and rough outline of the work
> that has to be done and the API and code that already exists and
> (hopefully) can be reused or adapted:
> http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Sidebar
> 
> >
>
>  Thanks Andre, it seems that tasks are still very broad, so I guess
 that
 this call is mainly aimed at existing or full-time developers, but if
 you
 identify small self-contained tasks where new developers could be
 involved
 please advertise them, since they might be useful in a future call for
 developers or for FOSDEM.

  Good idea, I will do that.  I just wanted to make sure that nobody
>>> feels
>>> not invited.
>>>
>>> By the way, I have activated the existing but unfinished sidebar
>>> implementation that was discontinued shortly before OpenOffice came to
>>> Apache.  You can find developer builds for Linux, Mac and Windows.
>>>  Please
>>> see the "Status" section on 
>>> http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Sidebar
>>> 
>>> >(**near the top).  There you can also see screenshots of that sidebar
>>> implementation.
>>>
>>> Please do not use these developer snapshots for anything other than
>>> analysis of the sidebar.  There appear to be some serious bugs. They are
>>> meant as living demos of an unfinished feature.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Andre
>>>
>>>
>>>  Regards,
Andrea.


>>>
> Andrea,

Thanks for sharing this initial snapshot. While it appears that we can
inherit some code, it also appears that there is some more work to be done.

With regards to the user interface design, as seen in wiki, thanks for
sharing the screenshots from Linus, Mac and Windows. Here are some initial
thoughts:

- The Linux and Mac implementation presents flat sidebar tab button, which
aligns with our current design direction, which is good. We would need to
adjust this design slightly to address an information design issue.
Currently, the sidebar tab buttons are included in the content pane. In
other words, the tab buttons appear to be associated with the active pane
as they are all together in the same pane (area with white background). I'd
prefer us to make the content pane and the sidebar tab buttons distinct, as
seen in our current design direction. The contrast and clustering helps
reinforce the association, and allows us to omit any tab bevels.

- I don't have access to the Linus and Mac builds. To better appreciate and
understand the relationship of the sidebar to the whole workspace, could I
ask you to update your screencaps to show the entire workspace (reduce
window size is fine). I want to understand how Linus and Mac illustrate a
selected command button. I want to ensure that our flat design, with button
highlighting to indicate selection will scale and be consistent on all
platforms.

- The Windows UI includes a form of tab bevel, which in comparison to our
flat sidebar tab button UI design direction, appears to be heavy, and only
adds visual noise and view weight. This screen shot reinforces my interest
in implementing our flat approach.

All for now, keep sharing - this is great.

Please post the higher context screen shots if possible.

In the interim, I will continue to work on the detailed UI spec for the
sidebar UI and interaction.

Best regards,
Kevin

Re: Gallery extension from Symphony ressources

[Kevin Grignon]

Agreed. Homepage elements are web 1.0. Let's remove them. 

Kevin

On Dec 1, 2012, at 5:12 AM, "Marcus (OOo)"  wrote:

> Am 11/30/2012 01:50 PM, schrieb Armin Le Grand:
>> Hi List,
>> 
>> to keep you up-to date (also in #121407#):
>> 
>> I have the first working version. Added themes are:
>> 
>> arrows (merged with existing)
>> bullets
>> computers
>> diagrams
>> education
>> environment
>> finance
>> gallery_sound
>> gallery_system
>> people
>> sounds
>> symbols
>> transportation
>> txtshapes
>> 
>> Install set sizes (Windows):
>> original: 122 MB (128.229.180 bytes)
>> modified: 142 MB (149.436.536 bytes)
>> 
>> Thus, it costs currently ca. 20 MB. I am right now using pngcrush to
>> reduce all contained *.png's old and new ones. Lets see what we can do.
>> It will get smaller. I also check if the ressources are available as
>> vector format (this would be optimal), but it does not look good up to
>> now. Let's see, I will report on reduced sizes when achieved...
>> 
>> Suggested from Kevin: remove theme 'rulers'. Comments on that?
> 
> Maybe they look really like from the past century. It's always somewhat a 
> kind of taste. But then we should also look at the "Homepage" theme.
> 
> When reducing the pictures in themes or deleting some completely would give 
> some additional reducing.
> 
> Marcus
> 

[UX] Design Exploration - Dockable Task Pane User Interface Design

[Kevin Grignon]

Hello All,

I've been exploring user interface design for the dockable task panes. I've
prepared a mockup that illustrates the task pane headers, section headers
and tab interaction.

See:
http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Docked_Task_Pane_Container_-_Pane_Header_User_Interface_Design

Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki page.

Thanks,
Kevin

Re: [UX] Feedback wanted - Share your task pane experiences

[Kevin Grignon]

On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 6:33 PM, RGB ES  wrote:

> 2012/11/29 Kevin Grignon 
>
> > Hello All,
> >
> > In support of the AOO .next release, I have been exploring the UI design
> > for incorporating the Lotus Symphony sidebar in AOO. This sidebar will
> > provide a persistent pane to display contextual properties and addition
> > content, including gallery, navigator, and presentation actions.
> >
> > Beyond the UI, I am also trying to understand how we might update and
> > enhancement the content of each pane. I need your help.
> >
> > Please share any feedback, thoughts or opportunities for improvement
> > related to your current experience with task panes in either OpenOffice
> > 3.4.1 or Lotus Symphony 3.0.1.
> >
> > Regina has sent along some great feedback and some items we need to
> > address. What say the rest of you?
> >
> > Thoughts?
> >
> > Regards,
> > Kevin
> >
>
>
> I use Writer most of the time and never tried Symphony. I have the
> Navigator and the Stylist docked, one on top of the other to the right side
> of Writer's window. Most of the time I use the stylists just to apply
> character styles and to know which character style is applied on the cursor
> position: right now, there is no other way to do that than using the
> Stylist. (for paragraph styles, I use the "next style" on the style
> definition and keyboard shortcuts to apply the first style on the
> sequence).
>
> A tabbed interface for the dockers will be a good addition. Also, a sort of
> "style picker" will be good: a place to see on one glance which paragraph,
> character and page style are applied that also allows a "quick apply" like
> the applied paragraph style box we have on the Formatting toolbar right
> now. The style information is scattered on all the corners of Writer
> interface and that's not comfortable.
>
> Regards
> Ricardo
>


Ricardo,

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

Stacking the panes provides some nice flexibility. We should look to
support stacked panes for the tabbed panes as well.

As for styles pane content, it appears that there is work to do make the
pane content and commands more useful. We should continue to explore this
topic.

Regards,
Kevin

Re: [UX] Desoign Exploration - Dockable Task Pane Content Design

[Kevin Grignon]

KG01 - see comments inline

On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 6:02 PM, Xin Li  wrote:

> I noticed that there are two "position and size" for different object, is
> that means we should have different content design for different object
> type?
>
> 2012/11/26 Kevin Grignon 
>
> > On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 at 7:10 AM, Manuel del Valle 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > >
> > > > NOTE: I really like the "style only" way. In fact, I would love to
> see
> > an
> > > > alternative Writer UI were direct formatting is completely forbidden.
> > > > Direct formatting is a bad habit that always cause headaches. But
> > that's
> > > > just me ;)
> > > >
> > > > Regards
> > > > Ricardo
> > > >
> > >
> > > +1
> > >
> > > I couldn't agree with you more, Ricardo. Perhaps users wouldn't be
> > > accustomed to it at the beginning, but eventually it becomes a win-win
> > > situation.
> > > In my (small) experience, most non-techie users (which are, by the
> way, a
> > > vast majority) don't even know styles and, even when you try to
> introduce
> > > it to them, or even when they actually do know them, they can't get
> used
> > to
> > > it. They see it as some sort of a "problem" instead of a (very) useful
> > tool.
> > > And so, in order to convince them, we end up writing articles like this
> > > one:
> > >
> > > http://openoffice.blogs.com/openoffice/2005/12/why_should_you_.html
> > >
> > > Even when it's quite aged, not much has changed since then regarding
> > > Styles' UX.
> > >
> > > It would be a good idea to try to make it more obvious for users that,
> > > whenever they write a Title (or anything else), they should "tell" OO
> > that
> > > those words put toghether are meant to be a "Title" (or a subtitle,
> > or...).
> > > Perhaps presenting it as some kind of "tagging" procedure would be a
> good
> > > idea, since users are very used to it as most web "giants" (Facebook,
> G+,
> > > GMail, etc) already feature them. And actually showing that tag (some
> > > transparency over the text, perhaps?) would probably help as well.
> > >
> > > That said, perhaps forbidding direct formatting might be a little too
> > > much. But maybe we could explore the idea of presenting it more clearly
> > as
> > > the "second choice". Help users understand that, when direct
> formatting,
> > > they are actually overriding an already predefined style (e.g.:
> "default
> > > text").
> > > IMHO, the way we group tools toghether in a brand new Task pane could
> > > actually help that purpose. Among other things, of course, but all
> those
> > > would be a bit off-topic ;-)
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > > Manuel
> > >
> >
> >
> > Hello All,
> >
> > I've further refined my proposal for the minimum viable content in
> support
> > of the task pane design exploration.
> >
> > See:
> >
> >
> http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_-_Information_Design#Must_Have
> >
> > Please keep the great comments, as see above, coming. Ideally, we should
> be
> > open to enhancing the task panes and property views for the minimum
> > vialble, aka "must have" content as we implement this first phase of the
> > task pane capability. Insight taken from our review comments will help
> > drive such enhancements.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Kevin
> >
>
> KG01 - yes, different objects will have different properties and available
> actions
>
> --
> Best regards,
> Xin Li   李欣
> UX designer
>

Re: [UX] Desoign Exploration - Dockable Task Pane Content Design

[Kevin Grignon]

On Wed, Nov 28, 2012 at 1:21 PM, Lei Wang  wrote:

> Hi Regina,
>
> From your screen shot,  the Symphony you used is not a real Symphony. It is
> just a Symphony CPP version (Symphony Main Edit area + CPP
> menu/toolbar...). You can download a Symphony release version to have a try
> for its UI.(http://www-03.ibm.com/software/lotus/symphony/home.nsf/home)
>
> On Wed, Nov 28, 2012 at 12:23 AM, Regina Henschel
> wrote:
>
> > Hi Kevin,
> >
> > Kevin Grignon schrieb:
> >
> >  Hello All,
> >>
> >> I've been exploring the information design (content) for the dockable
> task
> >> pane. I've analyzed the current content in both LS and AOO, and captured
> >> some thoughts on future design direction.
> >> See:
> >> http://wiki.openoffice.org/**wiki/AOO_UX_Design_**
> >> Exploration_-_Task_Pane_**Content_-_Information_Design<
> http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_-_Information_Design
> >
> >>
> >> Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki
> >> page.
> >>
> >
> > Because "new page" is currently disabled in the Wiki and I need some
> > pictures to explain the problems, I have put it into a file
> > http://people.apache.org/~**regina/**ProblemsWithSymphonyTaskPane.**odt<
> http://people.apache.org/~regina/ProblemsWithSymphonyTaskPane.odt>
> > Feel free to use the content in the Wiki, when it is available again.
> >
> > The document is about some problems in the current implementation of such
> > dockable task pane in Symphony. You will see, that I'm not very happy
> with
> > it. I know, that I'm not an average user, but it shows, that a simple
> copy
> > of that feature will not satisfy all people.
> >
> > Kind regards
> > Regina
> >
> >
>


Regina,

Thanks for taking time to review the UI and ask "why?. Often the UI is
assumed to be correct because that is what is implemented. We should always
ask "Why is this here, why is it like this?"

Regarding your key concern over layout and space, we should ensure that the
default size accommodates the content within the sidebar container. The AOO
task panes must fit within the AOO workspace and will have slightly
different dimensions. In fact, in my design explorations, I have based the
container on the existing sidebar (ex: Impress Slides pane) in AOO today.
For the dockable task pane, we will add tabs and section headers to this
baseline design.

As for the remaining comments regarding Style commands, we should continue
to push on the content and available actions for this pane. More broadly,
we should be open to reviewing the content for each pane as we implement
this feature.

I'm updating the dockable task pane designs this week. Check out the AOO UX
wiki for the various design explorations:
http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_4.0_Dockable_Task_Pane_%28Task_Bar%29_Design_Exploration

Best regards,
Kevin

Re: [UX] Survey Tool

[Kevin Grignon]

Rob,

Yes, the survey tool is up and running.

I've created some re-usable modules. The effort has stalled, as I've been
focused on UI design.

It is on my list, and your reminder is well taken. It is time to get the
research effort up and running.

Regards,
Kevin


On Wed, Nov 28, 2012 at 5:05 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:

> So what every happened to the survey ideas?
>
> Do we have a LimeSurvey server that we can use for project surveys, UX or
> other?
>
> -Rob
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 28, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Kevin Grignon
>  wrote:
> > Graham,
> >
> > I've created my account and it works great.
> >
> > I tested the creation of re-usable questons groups via export/import.
> Next
> > I'll test the logic. I think this is going to work our great.
> >
> > I'll start to populated the question groups soon, and we can look to
> > publish our first survey very soon.
> >
> > I've also addressed my social network access issue, so I can help promote
> > the surveys, once active, via our social media channels.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Kevin
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Aug 28, 2012 at 4:27 PM, Kevin Grignon <
> kevingrignon...@gmail.com>wrote:
> >
> >> KG02 - see comments inline
> >>
> >> On Aug 28, 2012, at 7:29 AM, Graham Lauder 
> wrote:
> >>
> >> >> KG01 - see comments inline
> >> >>
> >> >> On Aug 18, 2012, at 9:34 AM, Graham Lauder  wrote:
> >> >>>>> On 16/08/2012 Rob Weir wrote:
> >> >>>>>> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 12:47 AM, Kevin Grignon wrote:
> >> >>>>>>> I've been looking at various survey tools and would like to
> >> recommend
> >> >>>>>>> that we deploy the open source survey tool, *LimeSurvey.*
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> Perfect. It is a good tool and it is in continuity with what the
> >> >>>>> project used to use, see my old e-mail at
> >> >>>>>
> >> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-ooo-dev/201206.mbox/
> >> >>>>> %3 C4 feecc9a.3020...@apache.org%3E
> >> >>
> >> >> KG01 - Great news. Most gracious.
> >> >>
> >> >>>>>> 1) A volunteer hosts the survey outside of Apache at their
> existing
> >> >>>>>> domain name
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>> 2) A volunteer hosts the survey outside of Apache and some pays
> $15
> >> or
> >> >>>>>> so to get a better domain name for it, like www.oosurvey.net
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>> 3) A volunteer hosts the survey outside of Apache but we redirect
> >> the
> >> >>>>>> subdomain "survey.openoffice.org" to point to the external
> server
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> As I wrote in the same e-mail, Graham had written he had a working
> >> >>>>> LimeSurvey installation that he could make available to the
> project:
> >> >>>>> http://s.apache.org/wZ . So I'd try with that first, and I'd
> >> probably
> >> >>>>> prefer option 3 to keep all services under one namespace.
> >> >>
> >> >> KG01 - yes, a natural language oriented name such as
> >> >> "survey.openoffice.org" would be great.
> >> >>
> >> >>>>> Regards,
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>  Andrea.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> Just having long loud discussions with the host at the moment
> because
> >> >>>> the site is broken, looks like an update has gone bad.  As soon as
> >> it's
> >> >>>> sorted we can be in to it.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> We should probably still do the survey design on the wiki however.
> >> >>
> >> >> KG01 - Indeed, I have been capturing the survey questions on the
> wiki. I
> >> >> will also start to build the survey groups (question collections) in
> >> >> LimeSurvey to be ready to import into our hosted instance, when
> >> available.
> >> >>
> >> >>>> Cheers
> >> >>>> G
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Good grief, server meltdown and they're talking about 72 hours
> before
> >> >>> it's up again.
> >> >>
> >> >> KG01 - No worries, as long as we can get cracking by the end of the
> >> week.
> >> >>
> >> >> KG01 - Please share server details and user credentials when
> available.
> >> >
> >> > Hi Kevin,
> >> >
> >> > You should have had an email with access details and password for
> admin
> >> rights
> >> > by now.  Let's have at it.
> >> >
> >> KG02 - Graham, indeed thanks do much for getting this up and running.
> I've
> >> added it to my list for this week. Again, thanks for your generosity on
> the
> >> activity.
> >>
> >> > Cheers
> >> > GL
> >>
>

Re: Gallery extension from Symphony ressources

[Kevin Grignon]

On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 9:36 AM, Shenfeng Liu  wrote:

> 2012/11/27 Marcus (OOo) 
>
> > Am 11/26/2012 02:44 PM, schrieb Armin Le Grand:
> >
> >  Hi List,
> >>
> >> I took a closer look at Symphony's checked in ressources concerning the
> >> gallery. There are quite some nice and useful additional themes there we
> >> (and our users) should benefit from. Thus, I propose (and volunteer :-)
> >> to integrate these to the trunk. Please have a look at a current
> >> Symphony version or look at the provides symphony sourcecode to get an
> >> impression (it's in main/extras/source/gallery). The added themes are:
> >>
> >> arrows
> >> bullets
> >> computers
> >> diagrams
> >> education
> >> environment
> >> finance
> >> gallery_sound
> >> gallery_system
> >> people
> >> sounds
> >> symbols
> >> transportation
> >> txtshapes
> >>
> >> The currently existing themes in trunk are:
> >>
> >> bullets
> >> gallery_sound
> >> gallery_system
> >> htmpexpo
> >> rulers
> >> sounds
> >> ww-back
> >> www-graf
> >>
> >> Where bullets, gallery_sound, gallery_system and sounds are double. I
> >> propose to just merge the contents. (gallery_sound and gallery_system
> >> are hidden, internal themes). For info: ww-back and www-graf are also
> >> hidden themes which are used in Writer's www export.
> >>
> >> I think these themes are useful for a wide variety of users and I will
> >> try to just merge them smoothly to have these available.
> >>
> >> All contents are in png format (not yet svg) with transparencies and
> >> offer quite some useful stuff. We should have them in that format for
> >> now, conversion to SVG is not realistic due to many contained gradients.
> >> For adding future themes I propose to use svg, but for now we should use
> >> what we have. Same is true for evtl. later add online data access for
> >> the gallery for clipart libraries (which support svg). But one step
> >> after the other...
> >>
> >> I'm currently inverstigating on the issue (wrote #121407# for it, see
> >> there) and will report how much size it would add to download packages.
> >>
> >> Suggestions welcome!
> >>
> >
> > Yeah, great idea. :-)
> >
> > +1. Let's add those themes in! Thanks, Armin!
>
> - Shenfeng (Simon)
>
> Marcus
> >
>


Armin,

>From a content perspective, we should review the content and drop any dated
items. Rulers, for example, are page separators from web 1.0.

Regards,
Kevin

Re: [UX] Desoign Exploration - Dockable Task Pane Content Design

[Kevin Grignon]

On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 at 7:10 AM, Manuel del Valle  wrote:

> >
> > NOTE: I really like the "style only" way. In fact, I would love to see an
> > alternative Writer UI were direct formatting is completely forbidden.
> > Direct formatting is a bad habit that always cause headaches. But that's
> > just me ;)
> >
> > Regards
> > Ricardo
> >
>
> +1
>
> I couldn't agree with you more, Ricardo. Perhaps users wouldn't be
> accustomed to it at the beginning, but eventually it becomes a win-win
> situation.
> In my (small) experience, most non-techie users (which are, by the way, a
> vast majority) don't even know styles and, even when you try to introduce
> it to them, or even when they actually do know them, they can't get used to
> it. They see it as some sort of a "problem" instead of a (very) useful tool.
> And so, in order to convince them, we end up writing articles like this
> one:
>
> http://openoffice.blogs.com/openoffice/2005/12/why_should_you_.html
>
> Even when it's quite aged, not much has changed since then regarding
> Styles' UX.
>
> It would be a good idea to try to make it more obvious for users that,
> whenever they write a Title (or anything else), they should "tell" OO that
> those words put toghether are meant to be a "Title" (or a subtitle, or...).
> Perhaps presenting it as some kind of "tagging" procedure would be a good
> idea, since users are very used to it as most web "giants" (Facebook, G+,
> GMail, etc) already feature them. And actually showing that tag (some
> transparency over the text, perhaps?) would probably help as well.
>
> That said, perhaps forbidding direct formatting might be a little too
> much. But maybe we could explore the idea of presenting it more clearly as
> the "second choice". Help users understand that, when direct formatting,
> they are actually overriding an already predefined style (e.g.: "default
> text").
> IMHO, the way we group tools toghether in a brand new Task pane could
> actually help that purpose. Among other things, of course, but all those
> would be a bit off-topic ;-)
>
> Regards,
>
> Manuel
>


Hello All,

I've further refined my proposal for the minimum viable content in support
of the task pane design exploration.

See:
http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_-_Information_Design#Must_Have

Please keep the great comments, as see above, coming. Ideally, we should be
open to enhancing the task panes and property views for the minimum
vialble, aka "must have" content as we implement this first phase of the
task pane capability. Insight taken from our review comments will help
drive such enhancements.

Best regards,
Kevin

Re: Hello

[Kevin Grignon]

Emanuel,

Also check out the UX wiki, we could use your skills :)

We maintain a backlog of things that could be address, then we explore
design solutions. We socialize the designs with the community, get feedback
and then try to drive the designs into the products.

See our wiki for more information:
http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Apache_OpenOffice_User_Experience

Regards,
Kevin



On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 8:25 AM, Kay Schenk  wrote:

>
>
> On 11/20/2012 04:08 PM, Emanuel Avalos wrote:
>
>> Hello i'm Emanuel Avalos, from mexico, 22years old.
>> My abilities are:
>>
>> Java
>> Android
>> UI designer
>> HTML5, CSS.
>> PHP
>>
>> I am interested in learning more about application development, and
>> interact with a large community.
>>
>
> Hello Emanuel and thanks for joining us. There are a lot of ways you can
> participate in Apache OpenOffice.
>
> If you haven't already done so, please take a look at:
>
> -- New Contributor Orientation --
>
> http://incubator.apache.org/**openofficeorg/orientation/**index.html
>
> and
>
> -- Get Involved --
>
> http://incubator.apache.org/**openofficeorg/get-involved.**html
>
> which will lead you to the "Help Wanted" section.
>
> for more specific ways to help.
>
> Given your background, you could certainly help with either of the
> websites. And, you may want to check outstanding bugs that may pertain to
> your interest in "java".
>
> https://issues.apache.org/ooo/**buglist.cgi?quicksearch=java
>
> Apache OpenOffice is mostly written in C++ but java is used for the
> "wizards" and external database connectivity with jdbc.
>
> See:
>
> http://www.openoffice.org/**download/common/java.html
>
> Thanks again for your interest.
>
>
>
>
>>
> --
> --**--**
> 
> MzK
>
> “How wrong is it for a woman to expect the man to build the world
>  she wants, rather than to create it herself?”
> -- Anais Nin
>

Re: Help with Design and Marketing Projects (OpenOffice)

[Kevin Grignon]

On Nov 23, 2012, at 11:44 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:

> On Thu, Nov 22, 2012 at 5:11 PM, Milosh Vujnovic
>  wrote:
>> Hi there,
>> 
>> I'm interested in providing help with projects related to Web Design
>> (landing pages, complete websites...), Internet Marketing or HTML/CSS.
>> I'm a freelancer with 8 years of expirience actively working in the field,
>> and looking forward to have a chance to work on project as large and highly
>> popular like OpenOffice.
>> 
>> For example, projects like:
>> "*Improve the look of the our website(s)*, especially the defaultlanding
>> page .  Skills needed:
>> graphic design, web design, goods taste, possible svn.  Skills gained:
>> Markdown syntax, Apache CMS."
>> "*Help market Apache OpenOffice*by developing artwork or other marketing
>> materials."
>> 
>> Could you please let me know if you have followup information on projects
>> like this and how can I get started?
>> 
> 
> Hello Milosh,
> 
> Thanks for writing.  We're currently starting a new recruitment
> activity for volunteers interested in Marketing.  So your timing is
> perfect.  We're undergoing a brand refresh for our next major release
> -- Apache OpenOffice 4.0 -- and this will impact the visual signature
> of the product and the website.  Discussions are still early, so this
> is a good time to get involved.   (Timeframe for 4.0 is probably
> March/April 2013)   We're talking about holding a contest, conducting
> a user survey, etc.
> 
> If you want to get involved in this part of the project, you'll want
> to join our marketing mailing list.  More information on our marketing
> activities, and how to join this list can be found here:
> http://incubator.apache.org/openofficeorg/orientation/intro-marketing.html
> 
> I hope to talk more with you on the marketing list soon!
> 
> Regards,
> 
> -Rob
> 
>> Thanks!
>> Milosh


Branding is tied to the UI. Your design skills would be a great asset for UX as 
well. 

Kevin

Re: [UX] Desoign Exploration - Dockable Task Pane Content Design

[Kevin Grignon]

On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 2:19 PM, Kevin Grignon wrote:

>
> On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 9:28 PM, RGB ES  wrote:
>
>> 2012/11/15 Kevin Grignon 
>>
>> > Hello All,
>> >
>> > I've been exploring the information design (content) for the dockable
>> task
>> > pane. I've analyzed the current content in both LS and AOO, and captured
>> > some thoughts on future design direction.
>> > See:
>> >
>> >
>> http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_-_Information_Design
>> >
>> > Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki
>> > page.
>> > Thanks,
>> > Kevin
>> >
>>
>> Good ideas, indeed! Just a small point about the proposal: you are
>> separating direct formatting (Content properties) from styles (Style list)
>> which is a good idea, but we must keep in mind that there is no "direct
>> formatting" for pages on Writer: the menu you get when you go to Format →
>> Page does *not* do direct formatting, it just edit the current page style.
>>
>> IMO, the options are:
>>
>> - to not include page information on the content properties docker
>>
>> - to just show a static info panel giving the option to edit the
>> corresponding page style or to apply one of the styles from a list.
>>
>> Maybe (thinking aloud in real time) instead of a "page" section it would
>> be
>> more interesting to show a "breaks" section, where you can insert and
>> manage page breaks with change of page styles and reset of page
>> numbering... or maybe put all this on its own panel. The possibility to
>> edit the page style should be limited to the style list panel.
>>
>> Regards
>> Ricardo
>>
>
>
> Ricardo,
>
> Thanks for the input.
>
> I've posted your comments to the wiki discussion.
>
> I'll explore the page properties vs. style options.
>
> Regards,
> Kevin
>
>
> Ricardo,

While Lotus Symphony presents page properties in the contextual task pane,
they are related to the 'Page Styles'. Evoking the 'More' option command in
page properties section header evokes the Page Styles document.

So, are the page properties actually stored as styles, or just called
styles?

I can't imaging someone looking to change the page styles to change the
page orientation. Curious.

Thoughts?

Kevin

Re: [UX] Desoign Exploration - Dockable Task Pane Content Design

[Kevin Grignon]

On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 9:28 PM, RGB ES  wrote:

> 2012/11/15 Kevin Grignon 
>
> > Hello All,
> >
> > I've been exploring the information design (content) for the dockable
> task
> > pane. I've analyzed the current content in both LS and AOO, and captured
> > some thoughts on future design direction.
> > See:
> >
> >
> http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_-_Information_Design
> >
> > Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki
> > page.
> > Thanks,
> > Kevin
> >
>
> Good ideas, indeed! Just a small point about the proposal: you are
> separating direct formatting (Content properties) from styles (Style list)
> which is a good idea, but we must keep in mind that there is no "direct
> formatting" for pages on Writer: the menu you get when you go to Format →
> Page does *not* do direct formatting, it just edit the current page style.
>
> IMO, the options are:
>
> - to not include page information on the content properties docker
>
> - to just show a static info panel giving the option to edit the
> corresponding page style or to apply one of the styles from a list.
>
> Maybe (thinking aloud in real time) instead of a "page" section it would be
> more interesting to show a "breaks" section, where you can insert and
> manage page breaks with change of page styles and reset of page
> numbering... or maybe put all this on its own panel. The possibility to
> edit the page style should be limited to the style list panel.
>
> Regards
> Ricardo
>


Ricardo,

Thanks for the input.

I've posted your comments to the wiki discussion.

I'll explore the page properties vs. style options.

Regards,
Kevin

Re: [PROPOSAL] Initiate a Contest for Branding of 4.0

[Kevin Grignon]

KG01 - see comments

On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 4:05 PM, Graham Lauder  wrote:

> On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 6:03 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:
>
> > On Tue, Oct 30, 2012 at 1:17 PM, Graham Lauder 
> > wrote:
> > > 5 days is about up and we have no -1so I've started a page for creating
> > of
> > > the proposed RFP on the confluence wiki here:
> > >
> > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Brand+Contest+RFP
> > >
> >
> > Question:  Is it worth (maybe before or as part of the "Aim" section)
> > saying a few brief words about what the current branding is, its
> > history and why we are rebranding now?
> >
>
> Yes, that will be part of the preamble to the RFP.  I'll be getting to that
> this weekend, I'm on a contract at the moment and as is usual they are
> trying to squeeze 52 weeks into twelve!  :)
>
> Cheers
> G
>
>
> >
> >
> > > Discussion on the marketing list?
> > >
> > > I'm travelling for the next two days, connection may be intemittent
> > >
> > > Cheers
> > > GL
> >
>



KG01:

Graham,

Can we please update the proposal to indicate that the contest is open to
the general public and members of the AOO community. There is an assumption
that our existing community are not capable, or interested in contributing.
This is not the case.

When do you expect to run this contest? I have completed some concepts and
I want to share with community. Shall I wait for your content? or just
start posting via UX site? On one hand, I want the contest to attract
designers to OpenOffice, on the other hand, I want to promote my design
concepts now.

Thoughts?

Regards,
Kevin

Re: Helping

[Kevin Grignon]

KG01 - See comments inline.

On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 9:33 AM, Ian C  wrote:

> Hi David,
>
> welcome aboard. Getting involved kind of depends on you and what you
> want to do. Development, testing, documentation, internationalisation,
> web site?
>

KG01 - plus user interface design, interaction design and visual design


>
> Have you seen https://incubator.apache.org/openofficeorg/get-involved.html
> ? That should act as a good starting point.
>
> There is a new
> http://incubator.apache.org/openofficeorg/orientation/index.html
> which is being put together too.
>
> Sing out for more help when you check it. There are many more here who
> know much more than I.
>
> On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 7:07 AM, David Sive 
> wrote:
> > Hi
> >
> > I am interested in getting involved, please can you email me information
> on how I can help ?
> >
> > Best Wishes
> > David
>
>
>
> --
> Cheers,
>
> Ian C
>

Re: Templates

[Kevin Grignon]

Kori,

We'd love your feedback on the templates. Does it meet your needs, anything
missing?

Regards,
Kevin

On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 6:25 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:

> Hi Kori,
>
> Our templates website is here:  http://templates.openoffice.org/
>
> If you type "recipe" in the search box you'll see a few templates that
> might help.
>
> Regards,
>
> -Rob
>
> On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 3:04 PM, Kori Haight  wrote:
> > I was wondering if you guys had a template for making a cookbook yet. If
> > you do where can I find it? if not about how long until you get a
> template
> > out for it?
>

Re: [UX] Desoign Exploration - Dockable Task Pane Content Design

[Kevin Grignon]

Simon,

Indeed, I think we should keep it simple for the initial implementation.

Contextual properties is a must have. I'll prep some interaction design
mockups.

Regards,
Kevin

On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 5:32 PM, Shenfeng Liu  wrote:

> Kevin,
>   The proposal is very good!
>   I suggest we start from the Content Properties and ClipArt, and add more
> release by release.
>
> - Shenfeng (Simon)
>
>
> 2012/11/15 Kevin Grignon 
>
> > Hello All,
> >
> > I've been exploring the information design (content) for the dockable
> task
> > pane. I've analyzed the current content in both LS and AOO, and captured
> > some thoughts on future design direction.
> > See:
> >
> >
> http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_-_Information_Design
> >
> > Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki
> > page.
> > Thanks,
> > Kevin
> >
>

[UX] Desoign Exploration - Dockable Task Pane Content Design

[Kevin Grignon]

Hello All,

I've been exploring the information design (content) for the dockable task
pane. I've analyzed the current content in both LS and AOO, and captured
some thoughts on future design direction.
See:
http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_-_Information_Design

Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki page.
Thanks,
Kevin

Re: Draft Blog Post: You Can Help Us Improve OpenOffice by Helping Us Test

[Kevin Grignon]

On Nov 7, 2012, at 9:31 PM, Rob Weir  wrote:

> On Tue, Nov 6, 2012 at 10:15 PM, Kevin Grignon
>  wrote:
>> Rob,
>> 
>> Beyond functional test and unit testing, can we perform some system
>> testing, based on core usage scenarios?
>> 
> 
> 
> How we divide things is somewhat arbitrary but I think this kind of
> scenario testing is most typically a product design function.  For
> example, you could the some of the same kind of testing with a paper
> prototype.
> 
> But one idea, if you want to push the UX/design side of this forward
> is to follow the model we're doing with QA and Localization:
> 
> 1) Ask yourself, if in 1 week you could have 5 new UX volunteers, of
> various skill levels, what could they do *now*?
> 
> 2) Prepare one or more pages on the website or wiki that list things
> they could get involved in.
> 
> 3) Since most would be new to Apache you probably also wold want to
> connect this into the Orientation work:
> http://incubator.apache.org/openofficeorg/orientation/
> 
> 4) Maybe it is time for a UX-specific mailing list?
> 
> 5) Prepare a blog post that we can promote a UX Call for Volunteers
> 
> Key observation:  when we do a call for volunteers, people will
> volunteer in a staggered pattern, some on day one, some on day 2, some
> a week later, some two weeks later, etc.  You will go crazy if you
> have explain the same basic things on the list, over and over again.
> So getting the common questions that everyone will have onto the
> website is key.  That is the purpose of orientation.
> 
> I'm hoping we can take this general approach and refine it based on
> experience with QA and L10N then apply it more broadly to other areas
> of the project, including UX, Market, Dev, Website, etc.
> 
> -Rob
> 
> 

Good stuff. Thanks for sharing. This aligns with my initial thoughts and 
provides some great recommendations to move forward. 



> 
>> This is a great way to get more non-technical people involved. Validating
>> the system's ability to realize our core usage scenarios is really
>> important.
>> 
>> This also means we need to crank up the survey effort, where I was working
>> on deploying a top task validation survey. Ultimately, we need to capture
>> our core usage scenarios in a single, trusted source for all stakeholders
>> to reference moving forward.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Kevin
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Wed, Nov 7, 2012 at 6:31 AM, Kay Schenk  wrote:
>> 
>>> On Tue, Nov 6, 2012 at 8:32 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:
>>> 
>>>> 
>>> https://blogs.apache.org/preview/OOo/?previewEntry=you_can_help_us_improve
>>>> 
>>>> If anyone has other ideas for the list of reasons to help with QA, let me
>>>> know.
>>>> 
>>>> But in general it looks like we're ready to start a major recruitment
>>>> effort for QA.  We can probably do something similar for localization
>>>> soon as well.
>>>> 
>>>> -Rob
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> oK, this is good. My one comment would be to link to *some page* on "Apache
>>> OpenOffice 4.0" that contains information on what this release will
>>> provide.  I would think the more volunteers felt it was worthwhile, the
>>> more likely they would be to help with QA.
>>> 
>>> Looking forward to the final draft.
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>> 
>>> MzK
>>> 
>>> "Anyone who considers protocol unimportant has never
>>> dealt  with a cat."
>>>-- Robert Heinlein
>>> 

Re: Draft Blog Post: You Can Help Us Improve OpenOffice by Helping Us Test

[Kevin Grignon]

Rob,

Beyond functional test and unit testing, can we perform some system
testing, based on core usage scenarios?

This is a great way to get more non-technical people involved. Validating
the system's ability to realize our core usage scenarios is really
important.

This also means we need to crank up the survey effort, where I was working
on deploying a top task validation survey. Ultimately, we need to capture
our core usage scenarios in a single, trusted source for all stakeholders
to reference moving forward.

Regards,
Kevin



On Wed, Nov 7, 2012 at 6:31 AM, Kay Schenk  wrote:

> On Tue, Nov 6, 2012 at 8:32 AM, Rob Weir  wrote:
>
> >
> https://blogs.apache.org/preview/OOo/?previewEntry=you_can_help_us_improve
> >
> > If anyone has other ideas for the list of reasons to help with QA, let me
> > know.
> >
> > But in general it looks like we're ready to start a major recruitment
> > effort for QA.  We can probably do something similar for localization
> > soon as well.
> >
> > -Rob
> >
>
> oK, this is good. My one comment would be to link to *some page* on "Apache
> OpenOffice 4.0" that contains information on what this release will
> provide.  I would think the more volunteers felt it was worthwhile, the
> more likely they would be to help with QA.
>
> Looking forward to the final draft.
>
> --
>
> 
> MzK
>
> "Anyone who considers protocol unimportant has never
>  dealt  with a cat."
> -- Robert Heinlein
>

[UX] - Design Exploration - Dockable Task Pane (Sidebar) - Stacked Content Containers

[Kevin Grignon]

Hello All,

I've been exploring design alternatives for stacking content containers in
the docked task pane.

See:
http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Docked_Task_Pane_Containers_-_Stacked_Container_User_Interface_Design

Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki page.

Thanks,
Kevin

Re: [UX] - Design Exploration - Dockable Task Pane (Sidebar) - Tab User Interface Design

[Kevin Grignon]

On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 4:11 PM, Andre Fischer  wrote:

> On 01.11.2012 17:02, RGB ES wrote:
>
>> 2012/11/1 Andre Fischer 
>>
>>  On 01.11.2012 09:59, Kevin Grignon wrote:
>>>
>>>  Hello All,
>>>>
>>>> I've been exploring design alternatives for adding navigation tabs to
>>>> the
>>>> docked task pane.
>>>>
>>>> See:
>>>> http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_**<http://wiki.openoffice.org/**wiki/AOO_UX_Design_**>
>>>> Exploration_-_Docked_Task_Pane_Container_-_Tab_User_
>>>> Interface_Design<http://wiki.**openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_**
>>>> Design_Exploration_-_Docked_**Task_Pane_Container_-_Tab_**
>>>> User_Interface_Design<http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Docked_Task_Pane_Container_-_Tab_User_Interface_Design>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  We should keep in mind that there are not only UX changes involved
>>> here.
>>>   I see three areas to work on:
>>>
>>> 1. UX.  Look and feel.  Kevin has made the first step in this area.
>>>
>>> 2. Programming framework.  There is already a UNO API for plugable
>>> sidebar
>>> controls in general.  There is a C++ framework for the side bar used in
>>> Impress.  These different approaches should be unified and extended to be
>>> usable by all AOO applications and by extension developers.
>>>
>>> 3. Sidebar content.  At the moment I only know the sidebar in AOO Impress
>>> (implemented a large part of it myself) and the Symphony sidebar.
>>>
>>>  You can dock the stylist, the navigator, the gallery and the old
>> "fontwork
>> tool" to have a sort of sidebar on all AOO components.
>>
>
> I know.  And it will be a challenge, at least on the technical level, to
> join all the different features that we have to today, that can contribute
> the new side bar.
>
>  -Andre
>
>
>
>> Regards
>> Ricardo
>>
>>
>>  I think that we want the sidebar for AOO Writer and Calc, too, and have
>>> to
>>> think about what to put into it.  Here we can learn and copy a lot from
>>> Symphony.
>>>
>>> -Andre
>>>
>>>
>

In my next iteration, I define the content area. Then we can see how the
tabs are rendered with content.

Regards,
Kevin