Re: Being Positive
On Wednesday, 14 February 2018 at 01:19:55 UTC, psychoticRabbit wrote: On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 16:04:11 UTC, Abdulhaq wrote: Psychotic rabbit disturbed by programming related video. In other news don't poke the rabbit. To keep positive mind you should try to increase your followers rate in instagram. Try this out https://zen-promo.com/view_likes_on_instagram Decent tool to help you with.
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 16:04:11 UTC, Abdulhaq wrote: Psychotic rabbit disturbed by programming related video. In other news don't poke the rabbit.
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 18:25:25 UTC, 9il wrote: Do we follow main initial promise to be better / to replace C/C++? The last one question is the most important. Instead of targeting a real market for as, which is C/C++, we are building a "trendy" language to compete with Python/Java/Go/Rust. Trends are changing but C/C++ market are waiting us! That is probably true. Also in the convenience department any small language will have problems reaching a high valuation... Rust seems to be able to pick up some of the C market though.
Re: Being Positive
On 2/12/18 10:46 PM, jmh530 wrote: On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 03:15:44 UTC, bachmeier wrote: I don't see a negative trend. [snip] I don't know if there's a negative trend or not, but every 2 or 3 months there's inevitably a thread about things D needs to add or improve that tends to devolve into complaints about the language. One thing that has happened visibly starting around December 2017 is that most activity has moved onto github. I can barely keep up with the action going on in there. This is good on many levels, among which obviously there's progress being made. Also, on github it's much easier to keep things on track because the implicit goal is to reach a binary conclusion pull/not, whereas in idle forum discussion the implicit incentive is to keep discussion going. -- Andrei
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 07:35:19 UTC, Dukc wrote: On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: Sorry if I'm hurting someone's sentiment, but is it just me who is seeing so much negative trend in the D forum about D itself? Well, programmers are engineers, and engineers tend to focus on things that need improvement. We aren't constantly effusive and positive because we care. We care and we see the cracks in the plaster and know that we, all of us, can do better; can BE better. Often all in different ways that others don't agree with. And that's fine. That said, there's a difference between constructive and destructive negativity. It pays to recognise the difference and not indulge the latter. -Wyatt
Re: Being Positive
On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: Sorry if I'm hurting someone's sentiment, but is it just me who is seeing so much negative trend in the D forum about D itself? The reason is (as I see it) is very simple. People have/had a lot of expectations about the language, its future and invest/invested a lot of their time/money to the language. But D is a community driven language and sometime we can have question like that: - - - - - Do we have strong business driven goals? (Go) Do we have strong theory driven goals? (Rust) Do we follow main initial promise to be better / to replace C/C++? The last one question is the most important. Instead of targeting a real market for as, which is C/C++, we are building a "trendy" language to compete with Python/Java/Go/Rust. Trends are changing but C/C++ market are waiting us! - - - - - Community is moving. I see it during 8-9 years. The problem is direction and speed. So, if you see next time a negative emotions from someone just remember that possibly this person likes the language and wants it to be better then it is. Best, Ilya
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 17:03:26 UTC, flamencofantasy wrote: On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 02:29:46 UTC, Seb wrote: On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: [...] Yeah, I think it's a different community. I'm not sure why this is the case, maybe because Rust doesn't promise to be a great language and people suffer enough from fighting their compiler all day, that they have no energy left for trolling? [...] Never heard of Steve Klabnik but browsing through his blog I came across this; http://words.steveklabnik.com/the-expressive-c-17-coding-challenge-in-rust and here is the original C++ challenge; https://www.fluentcpp.com/2017/10/23/results-expressive-cpp17-coding-challenge/ I wonder what the some code would like like in D. Previous discussions on this: https://forum.dlang.org/post/or0o85$tvc$1...@digitalmars.com
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 02:29:46 UTC, Seb wrote: On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: [...] Yeah, I think it's a different community. I'm not sure why this is the case, maybe because Rust doesn't promise to be a great language and people suffer enough from fighting their compiler all day, that they have no energy left for trolling? [...] Never heard of Steve Klabnik but browsing through his blog I came across this; http://words.steveklabnik.com/the-expressive-c-17-coding-challenge-in-rust and here is the original C++ challenge; https://www.fluentcpp.com/2017/10/23/results-expressive-cpp17-coding-challenge/ I wonder what the some code would like like in D.
Re: Being Positive
On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: Sorry if I'm hurting someone's sentiment, but is it just me who is seeing so much negative trend in the D forum about D itself? I don't remember seeing so much negative about Rust on rust forum and so on. Do you think it will help in reminding people not to post any negative things? It shouldn't become strict moderation, but at the same time, I really don't like seeing so much negative trend. I would even go to the extent and suggest to email Walter/Andrei in person (even if they don't agree) to vent your frustration with D, but please don't post it on the forum. Several structural reasons for negativity (I'll be negative myself saying all that): - It's an internet forum - and an addictive one - so each message has a bit of social standing at stake. Strong talk is thus mechanically encouraged, makes you appear strong and knowledgeable, like a big meeting room. It's common for internet forums to devolve into negativity. - Because we don't ban people from the forums, some individuals that don't use D and have zero skin in the game come here to spread negativity at every occasion. If you delve into the smaller D communitites they aren't especially negative, on the contrary. The forums are not the D community at large, it's an addictive subset of it. If the forums were _worse_ to use, we wouldn't have this problem.
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 11:36:35 UTC, psychoticRabbit wrote: On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 08:08:28 UTC, bauss wrote: On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 01:32:29 UTC, psychoticRabbit wrote: Personally, I found that youtube video (Life is better with Rust's community automation - YouTube) rather disturbing. Psychotic rabbit disturbed by programming related video. In other news
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 03:40:52 UTC, Jonathan M Davis
wrote:
{snip} I suspect that part of it is that a lot of folks seem to
come to D looking for the perfect language after having be
frustrated by another language like C++, and while D is a lot
closer to that for many folks than other languages are, it
still has plenty of flaws, and we want those flaws fixed so
that it can become the perfect language. Obviously, that's not
going to happen. No language is perfect, but the vocal portion
of the D community does have a tendency to want to push for
everything that's arguably wrong with D to be fixed, and that
can result in a lot of negativity, but it can also result in
things getting fixed (though that requires actually doing
something about it rather than just complaining).
I think what would help here is a D wiki page (maybe
could be expanded) that
lists perceived flaws in the language, together with an
explanation whether or not it's really considered a flaw, and if
it is, why it's not being fixed. Those not-being-fixed reasons
are the real crux of the issue, I think:
* If the reason is lack of manpower or expertise in the area,
then complaints about the flaw can be responded with, "see [that
wiki page], can you pitch in?".
* If the reason is that by fixing the issue it would cause
problems {x}, {y}, and {z}, then the person raising the complaint
learns something about language design.
* If the reason is the language design team's personal
preference on the matter, and the tradeoffs are listed, then
users learn what the tradeoffs are and have to live with it.
* If the reason for not fixing the issue is hesitation to break
backward compatibility, then this may be an issue that D
leadership wants to hear feedback on.
But I think pointing people to that wiki page and laying it out
like that may diffuse a lot of arguments.
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 14:17:00 UTC, Steven Schveighoffer wrote: On 2/12/18 11:29 PM, Nick Sabalausky (Abscissa) wrote: A bunch of stuff I 100% agree with. Me too. So refreshing to read. Mike
Re: Being Positive
On 2/12/18 11:29 PM, Nick Sabalausky (Abscissa) wrote: A bunch of stuff I 100% agree with. Thanks. Let's keep the negativity coming, and we'll all be better for it ;) Problems don't get fixed if you ignore them or pretend they don't exist. It's part of a healthy debate. If you don't like the negativity, or you feel it's just trolling, ignore it. -Steve
Re: Being Positive
On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: Sorry if I'm hurting someone's sentiment, but is it just me who is seeing so much negative trend in the D forum about D itself? Here's an example from 2013, just a few months after I started using D. Andrei posted that Facebook had started using D in production. Someone thought the best possible response was to post this: When you will look at claim that some language (lets take for example C# or Java) "supports feature X", that really means that the feature is supported. In D this for sure means that the feature is either broken or misdesigned (shared libraries, routine code breakages, obsolete ms32 object format, AA arrays, shared, const postblits, odd template crosstalk bugs, type system holes, segfaulting lambdas, unstable stdlib, absent of third-party libraries). Untill this stuff is fixed this is a huge barrier irrespective of whether D is used in Facebook or not.
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 09:46:14 UTC, Dave Jones wrote: Arguing, friction, grumbling, it's all a symptom of Ds open volunteer based development process IMO. It's also how democracy works. Walk into any parliament session, in any democracy, and you will see arguing, friction and grumbling. You won't however, see that in authoritarian countries.
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 08:08:28 UTC, bauss wrote: On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 01:32:29 UTC, psychoticRabbit wrote: It is a human right..to complain ;-) Not to be that guy, but technically you have no rights in an online community. You have privileges. You may have the privilege of participating in an online community, sure. But expressing something 'negative' would fall under the right to freedom of thought, opinion, an expression (Article 19 of Universal Declaration of Human Rights). It takes a very special kind of community to recognise that the community does not come at the expense of the rights of the individual. It also takes a very special kind of person to know that the individual does not come at the expense of the rights of the community. Many communities, and individuals, continue to struggle with this philosophy - preferring one over the other. That is the real cause of conflict, not the expression of negativity. Personally, I found that youtube video (Life is better with Rust's community automation - YouTube) rather disturbing.
Re: Being Positive
On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: Sorry if I'm hurting someone's sentiment, but is it just me who is seeing so much negative trend in the D forum about D itself? I don't remember seeing so much negative about Rust on rust forum and so on. Do you think it will help in reminding people not to post any negative things? It shouldn't become strict moderation, but at the same time, I really don't like seeing so much negative trend. I would even go to the extent and suggest to email Walter/Andrei in person (even if they don't agree) to vent your frustration with D, but please don't post it on the forum. I think the thing is that the main D newsgroup has always felt like a bunch of people arguing over how to make D better, and that's kind of what it's always been, new ideas and directions are discussed in here by the main devs. Do Go and Rust have similar user groups, or do they do all that kind of stuff behind closed doors and then dictate from the top of a tower? Arguing, friction, grumbling, it's all a symptom of Ds open volunteer based development process IMO.
Re: Being Positive
On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: Sorry if I'm hurting someone's sentiment, but is it just me who is seeing so much negative trend in the D forum about D itself? That's because people love D so much they want it to become better.
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 07:47:39 UTC, JN wrote: "There are only two kinds of languages: the ones people complain about and the ones nobody uses." Wasn't that from Bjarne Stroustrup?
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 01:32:29 UTC, psychoticRabbit wrote: It is a human right..to complain ;-) Not to be that guy, but technically you have no rights in an online community. You have privileges.
Re: Being Positive
On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: Sorry if I'm hurting someone's sentiment, but is it just me who is seeing so much negative trend in the D forum about D itself? I don't remember seeing so much negative about Rust on rust forum and so on. Do you think it will help in reminding people not to post any negative things? It shouldn't become strict moderation, but at the same time, I really don't like seeing so much negative trend. I would even go to the extent and suggest to email Walter/Andrei in person (even if they don't agree) to vent your frustration with D, but please don't post it on the forum. "There are only two kinds of languages: the ones people complain about and the ones nobody uses."
Re: Being Positive
On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: Sorry if I'm hurting someone's sentiment, but is it just me who is seeing so much negative trend in the D forum about D itself? Well, programmers are engineers, and engineers tend to focus on things that need improvement. That has the downside that the attitude might stealthily get negative. That is likely to be the base reason. Too positive an attitude in a wrong woy would stall the development. That does not mean negativity is desirable, just that it's sometimes hard to say what's constructive criticism and what's complaining. I don't remember seeing so much negative about Rust on rust forum and so on. I don't feel the general attitude to be negative, I think many people are very positive here: Andrei, Ali and H.S.Teoh are excellent examples. And those who sound negative at times are being constructive. It's true there are rant posts that fail to keep a good attitude, but I think they are usually from "outside" people. Regular D users are almost always reasonably nice.
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 05:34:01 UTC, psychoticRabbit wrote: btw. Mozilla has long had an unusual interest in people specifically from the Oregon State University. https://blog.mozilla.org/firefox/browser-built-with-love-sweat-volunteers/ Emily Dunham (the one in that youtube video, is also a graduate of that university - hired by Mozilla on 2015). Oregon is also considered to be "The First Scientology City". now I don't want to be too much of conspiracist..but... It was also interesting to listen to Emily as she effectively endorsed, praised, and encouraged, the Rust communities 'moderation attack squad' (timepoint: 9:34), and pointing out how seriously 'the moderators team' need to take their duties (timepoint: 8:55). Attack squads are in integral component within scientology too - although the actions of these squads are justified based on the so called 'Fair Game Policy' (instead of 'Code of Conduct'): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_Game_(Scientology) ... and so...the plot thickens..
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 03:15:44 UTC, bachmeier wrote: I don't see a negative trend. It's always been negative around here, and I've never understood why. It's the best language I've used by a significant margin. D is the inverse of the Lisp community, which believes the Common Lisp Hyperspec was delivered on stone tablets. Funny. Maybe it is a self-organising engineering culture that has evolved. We have a mixture of critical people here and the occasional nutcase. You see that in most popular FOSS projects, but D is pretty extreme. The harmful part of all theses messages, apart from disgusting the more sensitive among us, is that I find people (say at this FOSDEM - btw great talk Kai) telling me that D is immature. These people read these threads. So they don't even try D. Being positive helps recruit people into trying things out on their own. I would not call it social engineering per se, but ultimately you want people to come in the door and try stuff. Only then will merit pay off. I start to wonder if we just shut off and remove the forum history would actually improve the takeup of D. I wonder if project leaders would stop posting it would actually improve the takeup of D. Maybe we should just try that for a year. Someone I knew would (in the days of paper) move his inbox into the trash. He would say: if it is really important it will come back. A clean slate makes the day fresh. My proposal: remove the forum and history completely and for a year only produce blogs. We still have github, bugzilla, DIPs etc. Plenty ways to express yourself and contribute. Project leaders stop posting so they can focus on the technical side of things. I've even raised the issue myself. Everyone complains about Walter and Andrei and the lack of tools and so on, but I see a lot of progress. I don't really care about who isn't using D or why. For many years I saw the same thing in the Linux community yet year after year I had a computer that just worked. Yes. Remember the days everyone was using Windows and just a few of us were using Linux. I do not think D will be *that* successful, but it has enough momentum to keep going. It is a solid investment in my book.
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 05:10:29 UTC, psychoticRabbit wrote: On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 04:29:44 UTC, Nick Sabalausky (Abscissa) wrote: Rust has pretty much gone on record as deliberately using social engineering to squelch all disagreement by way of drumming out any and all dissenters: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIageYT0Vgg a "friend of the tree".. timepoint = 13:15 seems like Rust community are incorporating psychological manipulation techniques..similar to what scientology does. btw. Mozilla has long had an unusual interest in people specifically from the Oregon State University. https://blog.mozilla.org/firefox/browser-built-with-love-sweat-volunteers/ Emily Dunham (the one in that youtube video, is also a graduate of that university - hired by Mozilla on 2015). Oregon is also considered to be "The First Scientology City". now I don't want to be too much of conspiracist..but...
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 04:29:44 UTC, Nick Sabalausky (Abscissa) wrote: Rust has pretty much gone on record as deliberately using social engineering to squelch all disagreement by way of drumming out any and all dissenters: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIageYT0Vgg a "friend of the tree".. timepoint = 13:15 seems like Rust community are incorporating psychological manipulation techniques..similar to what scientology does.
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 04:29:44 UTC, Nick Sabalausky (Abscissa) wrote: Rust has pretty much gone on record as deliberately using social engineering to squelch all disagreement by way of drumming out any and all dissenters: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIageYT0Vgg Hey..that was interesting. 1/3 of them there, just cause they're interested in the community side and couldn't care less what language it is. Here at D, we don't give a stuff about the community, we just want a language to solve our problems - and we don't all have the same problems. Ok..that's a little overstated...community is nice too... but problems that need to be solved are more important. Lets ensure we promoting D to those that want to solve problems.
Re: Being Positive
On 02/12/2018 06:54 PM, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: Sorry if I'm hurting someone's sentiment, but is it just me who is seeing so much negative trend in the D forum about D itself? 1. Can't fix a problem without first identifying a problem. 2. "We're all entitled to our opinions" does NOT come with the qualification "...but only if it's a happy glowing positive opinion that sprouts rainbows and makes the rabbits and lions sing together in blissful harmony." I don't remember seeing so much negative about Rust on rust forum and so on. Rust has pretty much gone on record as deliberately using social engineering to squelch all disagreement by way of drumming out any and all dissenters: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIageYT0Vgg We don't do Orwellian here. Do you think it will help in reminding people not to post any negative things? No. God no. Again, that's straight out of the 1984 playbook. (Or maybe it's more Brave New World - don't know, don't care, it's sick and disturbing either way.)
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 02:29:46 UTC, Seb wrote: On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: Sorry if I'm hurting someone's sentiment, but is it just me who is seeing so much negative trend in the D forum about D itself? I don't remember seeing so much negative about Rust on rust forum and so on. Yeah, I think it's a different community. I'm not sure why this is the case... it's as you say...it's a different community. Those communities that believe the community is more important than the individual, are the very communities that like to shutdown any negativity about that community. It happens at the levels of countries (North Korea, Russia, Syria, Iran, and so many others). It happens at the level of organisations too (corporate and non-corporate), and even at the social community level. I think the D community is a very different social community, where individuals feel free to 'assert' themselves. That is a good thing in my opinion. So negativity is a sign of healthy community (i.e. one that doesn't try to exert itself over the individual). Now I don't equate that negativity with bullying or such things, i.e. actions that set out to do harm to others. That cannot be tolerated in any community. But negativity is not harmful, except in those communities that want to exert their power over the individual. This is essentially why negativity does not bother me. It's all a matter of perspective.
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, 13 February 2018 at 03:15:44 UTC, bachmeier wrote: I don't see a negative trend. [snip] I don't know if there's a negative trend or not, but every 2 or 3 months there's inevitably a thread about things D needs to add or improve that tends to devolve into complaints about the language.
Re: Being Positive
On Tuesday, February 13, 2018 03:15:44 bachmeier via Digitalmars-d wrote: > I don't see a negative trend. It's always been negative around > here, and I've never understood why. It's the best language I've > used by a significant margin. D is the inverse of the Lisp > community, which believes the Common Lisp Hyperspec was delivered > on stone tablets. I recall at least one conversation at a previous dconf about how it seemed like users of other languages like Go tended to get really ticked at you if you said anything bad about their language, whereas the D folks tended to trash their own language. One suggestion was that it was a good sign, because it showed that we felt secure enough about the language to be willing to complain about it rather than feeling that we had to defend its every flaw. I suspect that part of it is that a lot of folks seem to come to D looking for the perfect language after having be frustrated by another language like C++, and while D is a lot closer to that for many folks than other languages are, it still has plenty of flaws, and we want those flaws fixed so that it can become the perfect language. Obviously, that's not going to happen. No language is perfect, but the vocal portion of the D community does have a tendency to want to push for everything that's arguably wrong with D to be fixed, and that can result in a lot of negativity, but it can also result in things getting fixed (though that requires actually doing something about it rather than just complaining). Sometimes, many of us do seem to lose sight of the fact that even though D isn't always where we want it to be, it's far closer than the languages that we came from, and it's awesome even if it's not necessarily as awesome as it theoretically could be. - Jonathan M Davis
Re: Being Positive
On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: Sorry if I'm hurting someone's sentiment, but is it just me who is seeing so much negative trend in the D forum about D itself? I don't remember seeing so much negative about Rust on rust forum and so on. Do you think it will help in reminding people not to post any negative things? It shouldn't become strict moderation, but at the same time, I really don't like seeing so much negative trend. I would even go to the extent and suggest to email Walter/Andrei in person (even if they don't agree) to vent your frustration with D, but please don't post it on the forum. Everyone knows the current state of D and this can be improved with more volunteers. Even a small topic like some xyz library is not up to the mark is being dragged towards argument and negativity about D instead of realizing that the issue needs to be reported to the respective library author. The community is small when compared to other languages, so it is essential to keep the positive vibe to attract larger mass (to reach the critical mass at first hand). We need great minds from across various industries and experiences to strengthen ourselves. So please promote D with what it can offer at the moment instead of spreading negative sentiment of how it can do certain things with some missing crazy syntax sugar, etc. We know such things are being/can be worked upon. D is a wonderful programming language and let's share awesome things we do with it. I don't see a negative trend. It's always been negative around here, and I've never understood why. It's the best language I've used by a significant margin. D is the inverse of the Lisp community, which believes the Common Lisp Hyperspec was delivered on stone tablets. I've even raised the issue myself. Everyone complains about Walter and Andrei and the lack of tools and so on, but I see a lot of progress. I don't really care about who isn't using D or why. For many years I saw the same thing in the Linux community yet year after year I had a computer that just worked.
Re: Being Positive
On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: Sorry if I'm hurting someone's sentiment, but is it just me who is seeing so much negative trend in the D forum about D itself? I don't remember seeing so much negative about Rust on rust forum and so on. Yeah, I think it's a different community. I'm not sure why this is the case, maybe because Rust doesn't promise to be a great language and people suffer enough from fighting their compiler all day, that they have no energy left for trolling? All joking set apart - Rust has a few very active fanboys (like Steve Klabnik) who have a very loud, positive voice and push the crowd. Maybe they also have better moderation and processes. For example, for D people don't like submitting Bugs on Bugzilla and rather post on the NG. I don't know the reason for this except for maybe that they don't want to create a Bugzilla account. We should simply encourage everyone more actively to open issues instead of making threads over threads of the same issue. Do you think it will help in reminding people not to post any negative things? There's also a technical solution to this: Hackernews-like up/down voting. See e.g. https://github.com/CyberShadow/DFeed/issues/84 It shouldn't become strict moderation, but at the same time, I really don't like seeing so much negative trend. Yeah, it leaves a very bad impression even though D is great and some people can simply never have enough. I would even go to the extent and suggest to email Walter/Andrei in person (even if they don't agree) to vent your frustration with D, but please don't post it on the forum. http://screamintothevoid.com/ We need great minds from across various industries and experiences to strengthen ourselves. So please promote D with what it can offer at the moment instead of spreading negative sentiment of how it can do certain things with some missing crazy syntax sugar, etc. We know such things are being/can be worked upon. Thanks a lot for this post!! Don't let yourself get frustrated by the bad mood of some people in this NG. The real actions and discussions happen on GitHub or Slack which have a very positive "vibe". It's just a rather "exclusive" society on GitHub at the moment... D is a wonderful programming language and let's share awesome things we do with it. Yes, I absolutely agree. Please, let's spread the word!
Re: Being Positive
On Monday, 12 February 2018 at 23:54:29 UTC, Arun Chandrasekaran wrote: Do you think it will help in reminding people not to post any negative things? No. Everyone knows the current state of D and this can be improved with more volunteers. Even a small topic like some xyz library is not up to the mark is being dragged towards argument and negativity about D instead of realizing that the issue needs to be reported to the respective library author. It is a human right..to complain ;-) You want to take away our human rights?? It won't happen ;-) ...doing so on the forum is no big deal as far as I am concerned ... and if the complaint is important enough, the right people tend to here sooner or later. If not, their work gets discredited or people improve upon it. and btw. Complaints aren't always legitimate complaints. People mostly see what they wan't to see. We need great minds from across various industries and experiences to strengthen ourselves. So please promote D with what it can offer at the moment instead of spreading negative sentiment of how it can do certain things with some missing crazy syntax sugar, etc. We know such things are being/can be worked upon. D is a wonderful programming language and let's share awesome things we do with it. I think *very* differently, that is, I believe people should *NOT* be limited to expressing only the nice fluffy stuff we all like to hear. You need to handle that negativity also, and not stop others from expressing it. Negative emotions are as legitimate as positive emotions, and it a human right to express both.
Being Positive
Sorry if I'm hurting someone's sentiment, but is it just me who is seeing so much negative trend in the D forum about D itself? I don't remember seeing so much negative about Rust on rust forum and so on. Do you think it will help in reminding people not to post any negative things? It shouldn't become strict moderation, but at the same time, I really don't like seeing so much negative trend. I would even go to the extent and suggest to email Walter/Andrei in person (even if they don't agree) to vent your frustration with D, but please don't post it on the forum. Everyone knows the current state of D and this can be improved with more volunteers. Even a small topic like some xyz library is not up to the mark is being dragged towards argument and negativity about D instead of realizing that the issue needs to be reported to the respective library author. The community is small when compared to other languages, so it is essential to keep the positive vibe to attract larger mass (to reach the critical mass at first hand). We need great minds from across various industries and experiences to strengthen ourselves. So please promote D with what it can offer at the moment instead of spreading negative sentiment of how it can do certain things with some missing crazy syntax sugar, etc. We know such things are being/can be worked upon. D is a wonderful programming language and let's share awesome things we do with it.
