Re: [digitalradio] ALE in Emergency HF use (Re: Another look at ALE)
Hi Paul, I look forward to those details, please test both LE and SE predicated on your CPU, here for my systems running Linux, it would have to be LE as none those boxes have enough horsepower for SE. /s/ Steve, N2CKH/AAR2EY At 08:06 PM 3/15/2006, you wrote: >doc wrote: > > 2. Difficulty of full-featured use with commonly > > available HF transceivers. (I don't recall if ALE > > software will function on anything but the proprietary > > MS version of windows. If so that leaves millions of > > Apple and Linux users out of the picture.) > >MARS-ALE appears to be running under Fedora Core 3 with >Crossover Office 4.1 (wine with the necessary tools to >install M$ Office products). I haven't finished building >the CI-V interface to my rig, so I'm not certain that >the RS-232 stuff is working yet for rig control, but >I can watch the soundings from stations, so what is >potentially the hard part -- the soundcard receive >interface -- is working. > >Hopefully I'll have the CI-V and PTT circuits built up >soon and will see how it works on transmit - and wnen >everything is known good, I'll be filling Steve in on >the details so others can do the same. > >Unlike most guys with Linux boxes, I don't have >a Windows box, too. If I'm going to run stuff on the >radio, it's either got to be Linux or something that >will run under wine/crossover. > >73, > >Paul Schmidt / K9PS (and obviously a few other callsigns!) Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to Telnet://cluster.dynalias.org Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ DigiPol: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Digipol (band plan policy discussion) Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [digitalradio] ALE in Emergency HF use (Re: Another look at ALE)
doc wrote: > 2. Difficulty of full-featured use with commonly > available HF transceivers. (I don't recall if ALE > software will function on anything but the proprietary > MS version of windows. If so that leaves millions of > Apple and Linux users out of the picture.) MARS-ALE appears to be running under Fedora Core 3 with Crossover Office 4.1 (wine with the necessary tools to install M$ Office products). I haven't finished building the CI-V interface to my rig, so I'm not certain that the RS-232 stuff is working yet for rig control, but I can watch the soundings from stations, so what is potentially the hard part -- the soundcard receive interface -- is working. Hopefully I'll have the CI-V and PTT circuits built up soon and will see how it works on transmit - and wnen everything is known good, I'll be filling Steve in on the details so others can do the same. Unlike most guys with Linux boxes, I don't have a Windows box, too. If I'm going to run stuff on the radio, it's either got to be Linux or something that will run under wine/crossover. 73, Paul Schmidt / K9PS (and obviously a few other callsigns!) Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to Telnet://cluster.dynalias.org Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ DigiPol: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Digipol (band plan policy discussion) Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[digitalradio] ALE in Emergency HF use (Re: Another look at ALE)
>< > 1. Tiny installed base outside of government and > professional emergency response agencies and responders > and a few volunteer emergency response groups. Hi Doc, Every system starts small and expands. Things are changing. Especially here in California, there are a lot more hams who have ALE now. We also have an ALE-based HF system for the California OES. More of the hams involved with various federal, state, and county emergency HF-ALE systems are using the ham ALE network to get more experience and practical on-the-air familiarity with the use of it. > 2. ...millions of > Apple and Linux users out of the picture.) There may be millions of Apple or Linux users, but over 90% of hams have a Windows computer, and the cost of Windows computers is low enough that many hams or emergency organizations could easily dedicate an old computer and transceiver to be an emergency ALE system. > 3. Difficulty of use with commonly owned antennas. > (Broadband HF antennas are rare... SGC and LDG autotuners are commonplace. Also, the system can work regardless of broadband or Autotuned antennas... practically speaking, yes, the base station "anchors" in the network really need broadband scanning techniques, but the mobiles and portables don't. You can easily use single band manual selection and depend upon the channel scanning of others. > 4. Cost of hardware with embedded ALE. That is changing this year. IC-F7000 and VX-1700 are examples. They are in the same price range as ham rigs. > 5. Multiple competing digital modes. I don't think that is an issue at all, since ALE isn't really in competition with other digital modes. Once we link up on ALE we just switch over to any mode we like. Some of us have been using PSK31 and PSK63 (at 1000Hz audio freq) for keyboarding after an ALE link. I think ALE's biggest weaknesses for hams right now are: 1. Misunderstanding in the ham community of what ALE is. 2. False perception of what is necessary to use it. 3. PCALE software setup difficulty, complexity, and learning curve. Bonnie KQ6XA Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to Telnet://cluster.dynalias.org Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ DigiPol: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Digipol (band plan policy discussion) Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [digitalradio] ALE in Emergency HF use (Re: Another look at ALE)
Hi Doc, The following is in response to your antenna comments. At about $150USD, either of the two antenna designs in the article below, especially the random wire, will work great from a typical 1/2 acre lot, the doublet will require an ATU with most rigs, the random wire mostly will not: http://www.n2ckh.com/MARS_ALE_FORUM/AAR2EY_NVIS_ANTENNA.pdf Lastly, with the newest rigs and external computer interfaced antenna switches and ATU's, multiple antenna types can be brought into play, this scenario has just been addressed in the MARS-ALE software, for instance, at frequencies below 4Mhz, I have my ATU enabled (new LDG AT200PC RS-232 controlled unit) to bring the random wire VSWR down. At my low 2Mhz channels I have that channel configured to select my 160m resonant antenna (internal AT200PC and external DTS-4 ant switch in my case). I can not however state at this time when you will see such support provided in PC-ALE, however all good things come in time. /s/ Steve, N2CKH/AAR2EY www.n2ckh.com >3. Difficulty of use with commonly owned antennas. >(Broadband HF antennas are rare and most are either >terribly lossy or barely efficient, limiting range >and low-signal effectiveness.) Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to Telnet://cluster.dynalias.org Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ DigiPol: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Digipol (band plan policy discussion) Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [digitalradio] ALE in Emergency HF use (Re: Another look at ALE)
> Really, when you get down to it, the biggest strong points of ALE is
> the standard itself, since it is becoming nearly ubiquitous built in
> to government and commercial transceivers. There are so many EOC,
> SHARES, NGO organizations, and government HF stations now that have
> ALE built in to their transceivers... in an emergency, the ability to
> inter-operate using available HF equipment is a big advantage.
As I look at ALE in the mix of digital modes, especially
from a redundancy perspective, the great weaknesses are:
1. Tiny installed base outside of government and
professional emergency response agencies and responders
and a few volunteer emergency response groups. (Reasons,
beyond lack of interest, may be found in the
following categories.)
2. Difficulty of full-featured use with commonly
available HF transceivers. (I don't recall if ALE
software will function on anything but the proprietary
MS version of windows. If so that leaves millions of
Apple and Linux users out of the picture.)
3. Difficulty of use with commonly owned antennas.
(Broadband HF antennas are rare and most are either
terribly lossy or barely efficient, limiting range
and low-signal effectiveness.)
4. Cost of hardware with embedded ALE.
5. Multiple competing digital modes.
Bonnie and a few others have invested the thousands
of dollars and thousands of hours to develop fine
ALE resources, that is a good thing but is not a
model we can expect huge numbers of Hams to emulate.
For redundancy, because disasters don't care about
the location of pre-staged gear, we need emergency
response modes to be commonly available and easy to
operate.
Good work has been done out there but we still have
a ways to go.
IMHO, YMMV ...
--
~~
Thanks! & 73, doc kd4e
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\ # http://bibleseven.com
KD4E =
West Central Florida
~~~
Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to Telnet://cluster.dynalias.org
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[digitalradio] ALE in Emergency HF use (Re: Another look at ALE)
>< > There has been some discussion about what mode does what > and what is needed/desired. > ... > We have had a little discussion on what the problems were > during Katrina with digital communications. > ...An automatic call ability, such as SELCALL, would be very > nice to have. > ... > I believe that the type of operations I was involved in, and > will be again this hurricane season, are useful in passing > many if not most types of > traffic on HF. Hi Walt, While Alan KM4BA was setting up stations for Red Cross in the "Katrina Zone" in Mississippi, several of us in the amateur ALE net maintained contact with him many times every day. Alan used 100W mobile ALE with PCALE in a laptop through FT897 and ATU. He used a status reporting function that is part of the new ham ALE Geo Position Reporting (ALE-GPR) standard, and it was linked to his GPS to give his location (similar to APRS). We were able to call back and forth just about any time of the day or night, get his GPR automatically, link with him every day on voice... even during the solar storms that happened in the second week, sometimes with great signals for short time periods on frequencies such as 21MHz or 24MHz, which was not predicted by any charts or even the ionosonde maps. Sometimes, during the solar disturbances, I was able to link with Alan easier from here in California than were the stations closer to him. Really, when you get down to it, the biggest strong points of ALE is the standard itself, since it is becoming nearly ubiquitous built in to government and commercial transceivers. There are so many EOC, SHARES, NGO organizations, and government HF stations now that have ALE built in to their transceivers... in an emergency, the ability to inter-operate using available HF equipment is a big advantage. By the way, the feature of ALE we use often, is the AMD short messaging system (Automatic Message Delivery), which is accessed from the front panel of embedded-ALE transceivers. After making the initial link contact via ALE, we "negotiate" via the AMD what modes are available to both sides of the QSO. It is easy then to go to voice or some keyboarding mode, or do an ARQ file exchange. Bonnie KQ6XA Bonnie KQ6XA Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to Telnet://cluster.dynalias.org Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ DigiPol: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Digipol (band plan policy discussion) Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/digitalradio/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
