[steering-discuss] SC call recording from CW 16 online
Hello, the SC call recording from calendar week 16 is online at http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/TDF/Steering_Committee_Meetings#Minutes_2011-04-21 Florian -- Florian Effenberger flo...@documentfoundation.org Steering Committee and Founding Member of The Document Foundation Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108 Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to steering-discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/steering-discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [steering-discuss] SC call recording from CW 16 online
On Fri, 2011-04-22 at 13:28 +0200, Florian Effenberger wrote: Hello, the SC call recording from calendar week 16 is online at http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/TDF/Steering_Committee_Meetings#Minutes_2011-04-21 Hello Florian Thanks for seeing to this for everyones benefit. There seems to be a problem with the last two meeting recordings however, each after download is 16.01 K in size. Neither is recognized by any player I possess. I would appreciate it if you wouldn't mind checking that, when you have a chance. Best wishes, Drew -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to steering-discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/steering-discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [steering-discuss] SC call recording from CW 16 online
Hi, drew wrote on 2011-04-22 13.52: Thanks for seeing to this for everyones benefit. There seems to be a problem with the last two meeting recordings however, each after download is 16.01 K in size. Neither is recognized by any player I possess. I would appreciate it if you wouldn't mind checking that, when you have a chance. which ones do you mean, can you send me the links? Florian -- Florian Effenberger flo...@documentfoundation.org Steering Committee and Founding Member of The Document Foundation Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108 Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to steering-discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/steering-discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [steering-discuss] SC call recording from CW 16 online
? drew wrote on 2011-04-22 14.12: :=-/ Never mind -- Florian Effenberger flo...@documentfoundation.org Steering Committee and Founding Member of The Document Foundation Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108 Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to steering-discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/steering-discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [steering-discuss] SC call recording from CW 16 online
Hi, drew wrote on 2011-04-22 15.10: Meaning - the files download just fine, if one actually downloads the files, versus right clicking on the link and downloading the secondary wiki page for each instead. ah, indeed - you need to go to that File: page, then you get the real link to download. ;) Florian -- Florian Effenberger flo...@documentfoundation.org Steering Committee and Founding Member of The Document Foundation Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108 Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to steering-discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/steering-discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Auto Reply: Re: [tdf-discuss] A couple of bugs
Hi, I am out of office till 27th April, 2011 Call me if it is an urgent issue. (Mob: +91 9886 46 3370) Ciao and regards TG -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Auto Reply: Auto Reply: Re: [tdf-discuss] A couple of bugs
Hi, I am out of office till 27th April, 2011 Call me if it is an urgent issue. (Mob: +91 9886 46 3370) Ciao and regards TG -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] using information from OOo lists for LibO marketing? (was: Fwd: [users] Licensing Details)
Thanks, Bernhard, for a reasoned and reasonable reply. For those who don't want to read all the comments, including my replies, I'll reply to the original message on the OOo list, as Drew and Andy suggested, with a reference to the Oracle announcement, as Bernhard suggests. //James On Apr 22, 2011, at 04:35 , Bernhard Dippold wrote: Hi James, all, snip About this main question: I don't know the sender, but in most cases of such mails people are not aware of sending their full address and contact details to an public mailing list when they write a mail from their office. If you cite such people you probably do them a favor if you cut this information in your reply. In this case I feel a bit different, as the sender is senior manager of an IT company. So my take is: Yes - the footer doesn't hinder you to reply to his request. I agree. snip He asked a question on the OpenOffice.org users list, not LibreOffice. Right. So if James replies, he should answer his question on the license of OpenOffice.org. What Drew and Andy don't want to support, is subversive LibreOffice marketing against OpenOffice.org. Even if the rest of the community didn't follow us by now, we don't think that OpenOffice.org is a competitor we have to fight against by all possible means. I'm not sure that using information on a public list to suggest that there might be alternatives to the option he is suggesting on the public list can be classed as by all possible means. In my eyes it is allowed to inform about LibreOffice while replying to the question on OOo license, perhaps linking to the Oracle announcement from last Friday: As there might be major modification in OpenOffice.org community and product structure, he should keep an eye on what's going on in the near future. If this announcement would cause him uncertainty about OOo's future, it might be reasonable to have a look at LibreOffice. That was exactly my thought, although not specified in my comments. He could be going from one closed alternative to another when an open system is available. We should not compete against each other - especially in a situation where none of us know, what will happen to the OOo community. Perhaps we get a chance to re-unite: Then competitive marketing might be an issue that adds negative feelings we should avoid. If this became the case, I would suggest that it was because Oracle dropped OOo, in which case OOo is joining LibO not some kind of merge. Competitive marketing is not the way to go for LibreOffice: Italo Vignoli, our marketing spokesperson, mentioned this point in several mails on various lists: We stand *for* our community and our product and not *against* others. This is the strongest argument and the one I needed. To forward such a message here was wrong I have to say BS here. The information is already public, and likely to be seen by many/most on the LibO discuss list. I agree, but this doesn't mean that this topic is wrong on our discuss list. You might have asked your question without copying the OP mail - and have chosen a more descriptive subject ;-) Matter of opinion - see above. But this is not the way I think is the official position of the LibreOffice community. Even if they decided not to follow our way by one or another reason, these are the people we worked with for several years - and we liked working together. Florian was very sad that he had to resign from his OOo Marketing Lead post - and so did the former OOo Community Council members here in the SC as well as many others. Not valid reasons. Tolerance is important - for different opinions as well as for working in two communities. But that's just my personal opinion... [...] If James truly believes it is appropriate to respond to a query of this nature, made on the OpenOffice.org mailing list, with a recommendation to use a different application then he should (must) be willing to do so in the open, on that mailing list. It's just a gut feeling, but this seems to be more honest than a private mail. A mail to the users list will have to be phrased in a way telling just the facts about LibreOffice without doing any harm to OOo. A private mail could be considered as bad marketing for us, because LibreOffice stands for openness and transparency. I agree. snip In my eyes this is totally different: While Microsoft tried to turn the EU position back to proprietary licensed software lock-in, you got notice of someone willing to switch from Microsoft to OSS software. And as OpenOffice.org is not (or not only) our competitor, their mailing lists are not just an arbitrary public list. I disagree. It's good for us, if companies help others to switch from MS to OOo, because - there is too less infrastructure (with professional support) and documentation on migrating to LibreOffice. - as we will prove to be better than
Auto Reply: Re: [tdf-discuss] using information from OOo lists for LibO marketing? (was: Fwd: [users] Licensing Details)
Hi, I am out of office till 27th April, 2011 Call me if it is an urgent issue. (Mob: +91 9886 46 3370) Ciao and regards TG -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: Auto Reply: Re: [tdf-discuss] using information from OOo lists for LibO marketing? (was: Fwd: [users] Licensing Details)
Now _that_ was an interesting input! On Apr 22, 2011, at 09:53 , tehmurasp.ghy...@oracle.com wrote: -!! Hi, I am out of office till 27th April, 2011 Call me if it is an urgent issue. (Mob: +91 9886 46 3370) Ciao and regards TG -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] using information from OOo lists for LibO marketing? (was: Fwd: [users] Licensing Details)
OK, it feels like I've created the never-ending story here. After thinking about possible comments over breakfast, I've come to the conclusion that there is no way I can write the intended message on the OOo list without breaching Bernhard's desire not to rile former colleagues. They must be feeling unsecure enough after Oracle's press release. So I've decided, regretfully, that there's nothing I can do. However, one thing I do think is extremely interesting is that no-one has yet answered the OPs message on the list, notwithstanding that it has been up for 16 hours. This kind of simple question usually gets a number of swift replies within a matter of an hour or so, particularly from people who want to take part in the community but perhaps don't think they have the technical competence to contribute in that way. So perhaps the community over on OOo is feeling a little bruised and deserted after Oracle's announcement. //James -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: Auto Reply: Auto Reply: Re: [tdf-discuss] A couple of bugs
We need to ban these out of Office messages. They are a big distraction for everyone. Can we have a filter on mailing list which bans any message subject with words like Auto Reply Thank You Best Regards Varun Mittal http://www.varunmittal.info/ Phone: *+65-94450420* Google https://www.google.com/profiles/varunmittal87 Facebookhttp://www.facebook.com/mittal.varun LinkedIn http://www.linkedin.com/in/varunmittal87 Twitterhttp://twitter.com/varunmittal19 Uncertainty is the only Certainty of LIFE On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 3:09 PM, tehmurasp.ghy...@oracle.com wrote: Hi, I am out of office till 27th April, 2011 Call me if it is an urgent issue. (Mob: +91 9886 46 3370) Ciao and regards TG -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Auto Reply: Re: Auto Reply: Auto Reply: Re: [tdf-discuss] A couple of bugs
Hi, I am out of office till 27th April, 2011 Call me if it is an urgent issue. (Mob: +91 9886 46 3370) Ciao and regards TG -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: Auto Reply: Auto Reply: Re: [tdf-discuss] A couple of bugs
Hi, Varun Mittal wrote on 2011-04-22 11.24: We need to ban these out of Office messages. They are a big distraction for everyone. Can we have a filter on mailing list which bans any message subject with words like Auto Reply hm... can you forward the message with full heders to me? Thanks for the pointer! Florian -- Florian Effenberger flo...@documentfoundation.org Steering Committee and Founding Member of The Document Foundation Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108 Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Auto Reply: Re: Auto Reply: Auto Reply: Re: [tdf-discuss] A couple of bugs
Hi, I am out of office till 27th April, 2011 Call me if it is an urgent issue. (Mob: +91 9886 46 3370) Ciao and regards TG -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
[tdf-discuss] Competition in the EU regarding pre-installed Windows
FFII and the AFUL (two free-software associations) have started a crowd-sourcing effort to provide information to the European Commission Competition agency about the lack of choice for the consumers when it comes to computers and compulsory pre-installed Windows. Original press-releases: http://press.ffii.org/Press%20releases/Share%20your%20operating%20system%20bundling%20tales%20with%20the%20EU http://aful.org/communiques/share-your-operating-system-bundling-tales-with-the-eu Here is my take to simplify the message, http://simos.info/blog/archives/1198 How is this relevant to LibreOffice? The source of the problem is the bundling of Microsoft Windows to the new computers. The manufacturers get discounts for the licenses if they support only Windows, if they promote only Windows on their websites and ads, and so on. If this relationship weakens, we may see a chance for LibreOffice on new computers, or Linux computers that obviously have LibreOffice. tl;dr: Visit http://ec.europa.eu/competition/forms/consumer_form_en.html to report cases where you could not buy a computer without Windows, while you had not need for Windows. Simos -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Auto Reply: [tdf-discuss] Competition in the EU regarding pre-installed Windows
Hi, I am out of office till 27th April, 2011 Call me if it is an urgent issue. (Mob: +91 9886 46 3370) Ciao and regards TG -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
[tdf-discuss] Competition in the EU regarding pre-installed Windows
Hi, I am out of office till 27th April, 2011 I now added a filter for Auto Reply: in the subject for discuss@. Will implement this for other lists later on. Florian -- Florian Effenberger flo...@documentfoundation.org Steering Committee and Founding Member of The Document Foundation Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108 Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] Competition in the EU regarding pre-installed Windows
2011/4/22 Simos Xenitellis simos.li...@googlemail.com FFII and the AFUL (two free-software associations) have started a crowd-sourcing effort to provide information to the European Commission Competition agency about the lack of choice for the consumers when it comes to computers and compulsory pre-installed Windows. Original press-releases: http://press.ffii.org/Press%20releases/Share%20your%20operating%20system%20bundling%20tales%20with%20the%20EU http://aful.org/communiques/share-your-operating-system-bundling-tales-with-the-eu Here is my take to simplify the message, http://simos.info/blog/archives/1198 How is this relevant to LibreOffice? The source of the problem is the bundling of Microsoft Windows to the new computers. The manufacturers get discounts for the licenses if they support only Windows, if they promote only Windows on their websites and ads, and so on. If this relationship weakens, we may see a chance for LibreOffice on new computers, or Linux computers that obviously have LibreOffice. tl;dr: Visit http://ec.europa.eu/competition/forms/consumer_form_en.html to report cases where you could not buy a computer without Windows, while you had not need for Windows. Simos «If this relationship weakens, we may see a chance for LibreOffice on new computers, or Linux computers that obviously have LibreOffice.» 'tis a consummation. Devoutly to be wished. But somehow I find it difficult to envisage either Joaquín Almunia eller Alexander Italianer going that far Henri -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] Competition in the EU regarding pre-installed Windows
On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 2:03 PM, M Henri Day mhenri...@gmail.com wrote: 2011/4/22 Simos Xenitellis simos.li...@googlemail.com FFII and the AFUL (two free-software associations) have started a crowd-sourcing effort to provide information to the European Commission Competition agency about the lack of choice for the consumers when it comes to computers and compulsory pre-installed Windows. Original press-releases: http://press.ffii.org/Press%20releases/Share%20your%20operating%20system%20bundling%20tales%20with%20the%20EU http://aful.org/communiques/share-your-operating-system-bundling-tales-with-the-eu Here is my take to simplify the message, http://simos.info/blog/archives/1198 How is this relevant to LibreOffice? The source of the problem is the bundling of Microsoft Windows to the new computers. The manufacturers get discounts for the licenses if they support only Windows, if they promote only Windows on their websites and ads, and so on. If this relationship weakens, we may see a chance for LibreOffice on new computers, or Linux computers that obviously have LibreOffice. tl;dr: Visit http://ec.europa.eu/competition/forms/consumer_form_en.html to report cases where you could not buy a computer without Windows, while you had not need for Windows. Simos «If this relationship weakens, we may see a chance for LibreOffice on new computers, or Linux computers that obviously have LibreOffice.» 'tis a consummation. Devoutly to be wished. But somehow I find it difficult to envisage either Joaquín Almunia eller Alexander Italianer going that far I do not understand the comment. What we do is report to the EU the cases we know, where we were forced to buy a computer with pre-installed Windows, although we did not need Windows (either we use Linux or we already had a Windows license). It's up to the Competition agency of the European Commission to take appropriate action. That's their job. Our job, and the initiative from the FFII and AFUL, is to report cases to the EC Competition agency. Simos -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] using information from OOo lists for LibO marketing? (was: Fwd: [users] Licensing Details)
On Fri, 2011-04-22 at 10:52 +0200, James Wilde wrote: snip I've come to the conclusion that there is no way I can write the intended message on the OOo list without breaching Bernhard's desire not to rile former colleagues. snip However, one thing I do think is extremely interesting is that no-one has yet answered the OPs message on the list, Hi James, If I may - you intention for being connected to both projects I take it, is to support both projects, yes? Then why not simply respond to him on the OpenOffice.org mail list and answer his question as asked - from the OpenOffice.org perspective? Thanks Drew -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] using information from OOo lists for LibO marketing? (was: Fwd: [users] Licensing Details)
On Apr 22, 2011, at 13:55 , drew wrote: On Fri, 2011-04-22 at 10:52 +0200, James Wilde wrote: snip I've come to the conclusion that there is no way I can write the intended message on the OOo list without breaching Bernhard's desire not to rile former colleagues. snip However, one thing I do think is extremely interesting is that no-one has yet answered the OPs message on the list, Hi James, If I may - you intention for being connected to both projects I take it, is to support both projects, yes? Actually, no, Drew. I was a firm believer in OOo at one time, especially when I was using linux for my workstation. I became a bit dubious when Oracle bought it, but continued using it. I joined LibO when it started, but didn't convert to using LibO until there was a stable version out. It's just lethargy that's stopped me from quitting the OOo lists. Also, until recently, when the threads started to diverge, there was a good deal of useful stuff in the OOo user list. You will remember furthermore that there was a low signal to noise ratio in the LibO lists at the beginning. ;) Then why not simply respond to him on the OpenOffice.org mail list and answer his question as asked - from the OpenOffice.org perspective? I no longer have any interest in supporting OOo now that there is a genuinely non-commercial alternative. The reason I originally thought it would be a good idea to contact the OP was not at all to do with any thought of competition between different ODT offerings. It was that the bigger the user base for the product I use (and now support in a modest way with a bit of moderation) the better the chances of financial support which will allow LibO developers to keep on providing me with a fantastic piece of software. That was also why I jumped in on the side of those who wanted to actually do something about the EU choosing Office without a cost-benefit analysis, but there again, there appeared to be a lack of enthusiasm from those who carry weight. //James -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] Competition in the EU regarding pre-installed Windows
2011/4/22 Simos Xenitellis simos.li...@googlemail.com On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 2:03 PM, M Henri Day mhenri...@gmail.com wrote: 2011/4/22 Simos Xenitellis simos.li...@googlemail.com FFII and the AFUL (two free-software associations) have started a crowd-sourcing effort to provide information to the European Commission Competition agency about the lack of choice for the consumers when it comes to computers and compulsory pre-installed Windows. Original press-releases: http://press.ffii.org/Press%20releases/Share%20your%20operating%20system%20bundling%20tales%20with%20the%20EU http://aful.org/communiques/share-your-operating-system-bundling-tales-with-the-eu Here is my take to simplify the message, http://simos.info/blog/archives/1198 How is this relevant to LibreOffice? The source of the problem is the bundling of Microsoft Windows to the new computers. The manufacturers get discounts for the licenses if they support only Windows, if they promote only Windows on their websites and ads, and so on. If this relationship weakens, we may see a chance for LibreOffice on new computers, or Linux computers that obviously have LibreOffice. tl;dr: Visit http://ec.europa.eu/competition/forms/consumer_form_en.html to report cases where you could not buy a computer without Windows, while you had not need for Windows. Simos «If this relationship weakens, we may see a chance for LibreOffice on new computers, or Linux computers that obviously have LibreOffice.» 'tis a consummation. Devoutly to be wished. But somehow I find it difficult to envisage either Joaquín Almunia eller Alexander Italianer going that far I do not understand the comment. What we do is report to the EU the cases we know, where we were forced to buy a computer with pre-installed Windows, although we did not need Windows (either we use Linux or we already had a Windows license). It's up to the Competition agency of the European Commission to take appropriate action. That's their job. Our job, and the initiative from the FFII and AFUL, is to report cases to the EC Competition agency. Simos Just pointing out, Simos, that I don't share what seems to be your confidence in the ability - or for that matter, the intention - of the Competition Agency to do what we both agree is its job Henri -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: Live online testing of LibreOffice (WebLive) as: Re: [tdf-discuss] Request for Libre Office on Spoon
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 04/20/2011 02:31 PM, M Henri Day wrote: 2011/4/20 Fabián Rodríguez magic...@member.fsf.org On 04/20/2011 05:13 AM, M Henri Day wrote: [...] Nothing for us Linux users ? Henri I believe this should work for any browser with Java support: http://www.edubuntu.org/weblive/app/lowriter Make sure you change the URL for the app name, and also make sure you specify Ubuntu or Edubuntu 11.04 from the possible choices. I haven't had time to test this BTW. Cheers, -- LibreOffice questions ? Des questions sur LibreOffice ? Preguntas acerca de LibreOffice ? Ask LibreOffice: http://libreoffice.shapado.com/ ~ Fabián Rodríguez http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/User:MagicFab Thanks for the link, Fabian ! I realise you haven't tested it yet, but get the impression that it only runs Writer ? Anyone here who has tested who might be able to say whether that impression is correct ?... Henri Hi Henri, I had some time last night to test this and it really works well. Sometimes the servers hosting weblive may be rebuilt during which time the demo apps are not available, other than that it makes for a great demo. You can try substituting lowriter in the above URL for any Ubuntu binary, here are the LibreOffice related ones you can try: lobase localc lodraw lofromtemplate loimpress lomath loweb lowriter Which would mean going to these to test each individually: http://www.edubuntu.org/weblive/app/lobase http://www.edubuntu.org/weblive/app/localc http://www.edubuntu.org/weblive/app/lodraw http://www.edubuntu.org/weblive/app/lofromtemplate http://www.edubuntu.org/weblive/app/loimpress http://www.edubuntu.org/weblive/app/lomath http://www.edubuntu.org/weblive/app/loweb http://www.edubuntu.org/weblive/app/lowriter Or just launch a full Ubuntu desktop to get access to all of it (make sure you choose 11.04): http://www.edubuntu.org/weblive Cheers, Fabian - -- LibreOffice questions ? Des questions sur LibreOffice ? Preguntas acerca de LibreOffice ? Ask LibreOffice: http://libreoffice.shapado.com/ ~ Fabián Rodríguez http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/User:MagicFab -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: PGP/Mime available upon request Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk2xh48ACgkQfUcTXFrypNX97ACfT+oznR9VcKG8IzX7RkJ5hYRl EXYAn2a7LWuW4UD5ai6OBxfgTdWujUV8 =DW7h -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] Competition in the EU regarding pre-installed Windows
On 2011-04-22 6:16 AM, Florian Effenberger wrote: I now added a filter for Auto Reply: in the subject for discuss@. Will implement this for other lists later on. Actually, you shouldn't filter these, you should PERMANENTLY BAN these users of broken auto-responders from list participation. Also, please add 'out of office' to the search term list... -- Best regards, Charles -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] Competition in the EU regarding pre-installed Windows
Strongly agree with you Charles +1 On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 11:41 PM, Charles Marcus cmar...@media-brokers.comwrote: On 2011-04-22 6:16 AM, Florian Effenberger wrote: I now added a filter for Auto Reply: in the subject for discuss@. Will implement this for other lists later on. Actually, you shouldn't filter these, you should PERMANENTLY BAN these users of broken auto-responders from list participation. Also, please add 'out of office' to the search term list... -- Best regards, Charles -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] Competition in the EU regarding pre-installed Windows
On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 3:36 PM, M Henri Day mhenri...@gmail.com wrote: 2011/4/22 Simos Xenitellis simos.li...@googlemail.com On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 2:03 PM, M Henri Day mhenri...@gmail.com wrote: 2011/4/22 Simos Xenitellis simos.li...@googlemail.com FFII and the AFUL (two free-software associations) have started a crowd-sourcing effort to provide information to the European Commission Competition agency about the lack of choice for the consumers when it comes to computers and compulsory pre-installed Windows. Original press-releases: http://press.ffii.org/Press%20releases/Share%20your%20operating%20system%20bundling%20tales%20with%20the%20EU http://aful.org/communiques/share-your-operating-system-bundling-tales-with-the-eu Here is my take to simplify the message, http://simos.info/blog/archives/1198 How is this relevant to LibreOffice? The source of the problem is the bundling of Microsoft Windows to the new computers. The manufacturers get discounts for the licenses if they support only Windows, if they promote only Windows on their websites and ads, and so on. If this relationship weakens, we may see a chance for LibreOffice on new computers, or Linux computers that obviously have LibreOffice. tl;dr: Visit http://ec.europa.eu/competition/forms/consumer_form_en.html to report cases where you could not buy a computer without Windows, while you had not need for Windows. Simos «If this relationship weakens, we may see a chance for LibreOffice on new computers, or Linux computers that obviously have LibreOffice.» 'tis a consummation. Devoutly to be wished. But somehow I find it difficult to envisage either Joaquín Almunia eller Alexander Italianer going that far I do not understand the comment. What we do is report to the EU the cases we know, where we were forced to buy a computer with pre-installed Windows, although we did not need Windows (either we use Linux or we already had a Windows license). It's up to the Competition agency of the European Commission to take appropriate action. That's their job. Our job, and the initiative from the FFII and AFUL, is to report cases to the EC Competition agency. Simos Just pointing out, Simos, that I don't share what seems to be your confidence in the ability - or for that matter, the intention - of the Competition Agency to do what we both agree is its job Well, you have to substantiate this claim, otherwise it appears that you are trying (unintentionally) to derail this discussion. We know that government agencies might be slow to react, but the way you are phrasing your view is that the Competition agency will simply not examine and discard any report. Simos -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] Competition in the EU regarding pre-installed Windows
2011/4/22 Simos Xenitellis simos.li...@googlemail.com On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 3:36 PM, M Henri Day mhenri...@gmail.com wrote: 2011/4/22 Simos Xenitellis simos.li...@googlemail.com On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 2:03 PM, M Henri Day mhenri...@gmail.com wrote: 2011/4/22 Simos Xenitellis simos.li...@googlemail.com FFII and the AFUL (two free-software associations) have started a crowd-sourcing effort to provide information to the European Commission Competition agency about the lack of choice for the consumers when it comes to computers and compulsory pre-installed Windows. Original press-releases: http://press.ffii.org/Press%20releases/Share%20your%20operating%20system%20bundling%20tales%20with%20the%20EU http://aful.org/communiques/share-your-operating-system-bundling-tales-with-the-eu Here is my take to simplify the message, http://simos.info/blog/archives/1198 How is this relevant to LibreOffice? The source of the problem is the bundling of Microsoft Windows to the new computers. The manufacturers get discounts for the licenses if they support only Windows, if they promote only Windows on their websites and ads, and so on. If this relationship weakens, we may see a chance for LibreOffice on new computers, or Linux computers that obviously have LibreOffice. tl;dr: Visit http://ec.europa.eu/competition/forms/consumer_form_en.html to report cases where you could not buy a computer without Windows, while you had not need for Windows. Simos «If this relationship weakens, we may see a chance for LibreOffice on new computers, or Linux computers that obviously have LibreOffice.» 'tis a consummation. Devoutly to be wished. But somehow I find it difficult to envisage either Joaquín Almunia eller Alexander Italianer going that far I do not understand the comment. What we do is report to the EU the cases we know, where we were forced to buy a computer with pre-installed Windows, although we did not need Windows (either we use Linux or we already had a Windows license). It's up to the Competition agency of the European Commission to take appropriate action. That's their job. Our job, and the initiative from the FFII and AFUL, is to report cases to the EC Competition agency. Simos Just pointing out, Simos, that I don't share what seems to be your confidence in the ability - or for that matter, the intention - of the Competition Agency to do what we both agree is its job Well, you have to substantiate this claim, otherwise it appears that you are trying (unintentionally) to derail this discussion. We know that government agencies might be slow to react, but the way you are phrasing your view is that the Competition agency will simply not examine and discard any report. Simos «[D]erailing» strikes me as a bit harsh, Simos - and surely views as to the possible success of a suggested measure are relevant to this discussion ? Just what is that you suggest I substantiate - my lack of confidence in the ability or intentions of the EC Competition Agency (especially now that Neelie Kroes has been assigned other duties) ? Without personal knowledge of the commissioner and the agency head concerned - which, presumably, you lack as much as I - the only manner in which our differing views on the matter can be tested is by waiting to see whether, in fact, the Competition Agency does move to address the problem of the quasi monopoly held by Windows in desktop OSs. I very much hope that you are right and that I am wrong, but my experience with the EU Commission and the agencies it governs is that pessimism is usually warranted. In any event, just so that you know where I stand on this matter, I reproduce here a comment I published in the Reg on 20100106 : Here in Sweden, computer users who are not unusually computer savvy have no effective choice of operating system - in the event they haven't heard of Mac - none of the major electronic outlets selling computers to the general public ever mention that there are, in fact, alternatives to Windows OS. Smaller shops devoted to a more technically literate clientèle where one can purchase computers without an OS or have one installed according to one's needs do indeed exist, but generally speaking, users in this country are faced with a monopoly and are forced to pay the inevitable monopoly tax that accompanies one. It was heartening to see the European Commission take on Microsoft over the issue of bundling Internet Explorer with Windows OS, but it must be admitted that by the time the agreement with Microsoft forcing the company to make users aware that a choice of browser was indeed possible was reached, Firefox had already broken open the bundle. I'd very much like to see the European Commission require purveyors of computers in Europe to inform customers that a plethora of operating
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Re: Forums... again
On 4/17/11 10:42 PM, Michelle Konzack wrote: I do not use thos crapy forums, because I have to search to long for it. It is NON reliabel and slow. Do not belive I want to give a searchengine any infos about me, because I need help with a stupid program. Just wanted to briefly point out that your participation on these libreoffice mailing lists ARE being indexed by search engines http://www.google.com/search?q=michelle+konzack+libreoffice -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] European Commitee enter talks with MS licences, Please make your action today against it.
Hi *, On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 5:40 AM, Jon Hamkins hamk...@alumni.caltech.edu wrote: On 04/06/2011 04:54 AM, toki wrote: There are roughly one billion words in the English language. You could have a LibO spell checker that contains each of those words. Actually, there are only about one million English words in English, and that's including the 500,000 or so scientific words. http://hypertextbook.com/facts/2001/JohnnyLing.shtml Note that a spell checker doesn't just need to list the words, but needs to know all forms of the words (plural form, genitive form, different times,) And of course rarely it is also wiser to not accept a word if it is likely that it was not the intended one (but then this overlaps with the functionality of a grammar checker) ciao Christian -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
